Saint Bobby finally has wings clipped
Oh, this is a shock: Florida State officials are totally embarrassing themselves over yet another scandal involving their football program. It’s the same old drill around Tallahassee. It involves doing whatever it takes to protect the likeable Saint Bobby, no matter how silly you look.
This time, those Florida State officials say it is unfair for the NCAA to unleash penalties that will strip away 10 victories from Bobby Bowden in his quest to become college football’s all-time winningest coach at the Division 1-A level.
Those Florida State officials are contemplating an appeal.
Puhleeze.
According to an NCAA investigation, a slew of Bowden’s players were among the 61 Florida State athletes in 10 sports who cheated on an online test from the fall of 2006 through the summer of 2007. That’s right, 61! The cheating involved staffers in the Florida State athletics department providing athletes with answers to the test and typing their papers.
Come to think of it, those Florida State officials are right. Bowden shouldn’t have been stripped 10 games. It should have been more than that for negligence.
Hopefully, NCAA officials won’t do the wrong thing and become like all of those other suckers through the years. You’ve seen the drill. Any time Florida State football players get into trouble, Bowden strings together a few one-liners and dadgums, and everything is forgiven through a lot of chuckling.
Remember Free Shoes University?
Once, there was Bowden’s long silence after safety Derrick Gibson was arrested and charged with soliciting an undercover policewoman for sex. You also had crazy stuff involving Peter Warrick, Laveranues Coles and others.
Most famously, you had Sebastian Janikowski, always a controversy waiting to happen as a placekicker. He was associated with everything from barroom fights to charges of trying to bribe a police officer to a cheating scandal around one of his final exams.
Anyway, before a Sugar Bowl involving Janikowski’s Seminoles, Bowden boldly said that any of his players violating curfew would not play. Janikowski violated curfew, but he played.
The reason? Bowden tossed out a few dadgums before saying of the Poland native, “We have a Warsaw rule that if he’s breathing and alive, he will kick off in the game.”
Everybody laughed. A few months later, Janikowski was arrested and charged by Florida State police for possessing a date-rape drug. That laughter stopped for a while, but it kept returning through the years around Bowden, a prolific coach but a pitiful cop for the Seminoles.
So it’s time for somebody to save Bowden from himself, which somebody (the NCAA) is trying to do — if Florida State officials just get out of the way.
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126 comments Add your comment
SomewhereinGA
March 11th, 2009
11:55 am
Terence, They have only gotten the tip of the iceberg there. We have a friend of the family who played with members of our family in all sports growing up. He is now a full scholorship athlete at FSU and laughs when talking with our family, bragging that he has never taken a test while there, nor has he ever written a paper there. He has counselors who do that job for him believe it or not. The academic atmosphere at FSU is a joke and has been for a loooong time. Folks who had the inside scoop on this have known this for years! And NO, he was not one of the 61 caught.
ValdostaMike
March 11th, 2009
12:00 pm
Terrance, imagine how Jimbo Fisher feels? On the other hand, JoePa has to feeling pretty good right now.
quicknole
March 11th, 2009
12:17 pm
Well if this is the case then how can Mark Richt be held in such high esteem. Surely if you believe this then the assistants and former assistants are/were part of the problem also. Do some research Terrance and get some more facts. While your at it, look into USC, Tennessee and all the other Div.1 schools see what you find. (Hint, if you don’t look, you won’t find anything).
D-Man
March 11th, 2009
12:20 pm
If this is all true..it is hard to believe Coach Mark Richt calls this guy a mentor…
JGray
March 11th, 2009
12:21 pm
I cannot believe I agree with Terrance! I am marking this date on my calendar!
MinnesotaJacket
March 11th, 2009
12:22 pm
seriously anyone who sits here and thinks that other programs aren’t guilty is lying to themselves.
gatorsam
March 11th, 2009
12:25 pm
Bobby Bowden claims to be a Christian, as I do. Something needs to be said: he is the biggest hyprocrite I have ever seen. using “dadgummits” instead of curse words doen’t get it done. To Bowden, it has always been about winning no matter what the offense of the player. If the player can help St. Bobby get another win, the player gets a free ride.
I would be embarassed to hang around and be a figurehead coach and take down a great program (built by great assistants) just for the sake of being called the winningest coach in college football. If he loved FSU more than he loved himself, he would have gracefully retired while at the top, not mired in mediocrity and conflict. Keep shining his boots, Jimbo.
ALLEN ROBERTS
March 11th, 2009
12:26 pm
Georgia tech was caught with far fewer involved and vacated victories, lost scholarships,etc, so does FSU think it is above everyone else. Looks like Free Shoes University is also Florida Saints Untouchable as well.
HootieSnitch
March 11th, 2009
12:26 pm
There’s another “likeable” coach over in Athens from the same coaching tree as Terry Bowden,Tommy Bowden, and Jeff Bowden.
Throwing stones
March 11th, 2009
12:27 pm
You mention 4 former players total in your blog Mr. Moore. How about the DUIs on Georgia’s football team every year. How about Georgia Tech and there lack of a compliance office allowing players to become ineligible without letting them know or not checking up on O’Leary’s resume?
Careful before you jump on the pound Florida State bandwagon before reading the whole truth. The reason why they are appealing the vacation of these wins is there is precendent. Oklahoma was allowed to keep its wins from the Rhett Bomar scandal. You remember right? He was getting paid thousands but working only a few hours at a local car dealership.
How about we investigate Georgia Tech and the boosters that were giving Tony Hollings Simon Mall gifts cards during his run? Have you looked into Jumaine Jones at Georgia arriving with a brand new Expedition with 19 inch rims saying only that it was a graduation present?
Bryan G.
March 11th, 2009
12:46 pm
Hell has frozen over. I think I agree with Terrance. FSU has continually played fast and loose with the rules and at some point someone has to be accountable.
I only hope that Mark Richt does a better job if there is ever a big UGA scandal. Yes, we get a few arrests every year (as does just about every other big school), but we have yet to have a Free Shoes University or problem like Janikowski.
steve
March 11th, 2009
12:52 pm
Bobby Bowden is too far removed from all the stuff that goes on down there. But that is the problem. In this day and age, you cannot have football coaches who are not willing to be involved with every aspect of the athlete’s college life. I do not think for a minute that Bobby Bowden has ever directly been involved with the various football scandals FSU has had over the years. However, I also do not believe he has been diligent enough to try to keep these scandals from happening in the first place. I like Bobby Bowden, but he should have retired 10 years ago. FSU is out of control and it is going to take a new sheriff and deputy (Athletic Director and Coach) to get it back.
Heresay
March 11th, 2009
12:53 pm
Apples don’t fall too far from the tree. Birds of a feather flock together.Once bit lest forget. He who plays with fire will be burned. Or as one of my favorites would go FROM THE IMMORTAL FRED G.SANFORD:
“He who playeth with the sword shall get stucketh”
maybe vs did
March 11th, 2009
12:54 pm
UGA,GT,UT,UK,UA,AU,USC may be, may be in the same boat. We don’t know. What we DO know if that FSU cheats, period. This is proof. Now, let’s get it over with, and go on to proving what the others do.
BTW, the admin at FSU knows that if St Bowden forfeits wins, it’ll be that much longer before he leaves. Believe me, that’s the last thing they want.
And yes, Richt has had problems with wayward players, they have been summaarily dealt with, and no doubt cost us as well.
MinTallahassee
March 11th, 2009
12:57 pm
Terence – Finally, a columnist with the spine to call-out Bobby. Hopefully the NCAA will also show some spine and deny FSU’s appeal. This penalty is most appropriate as it hurts the identity of the football program which is so intertwined with Bowden’s legacy. Typically the NCAA and the schools gladly stick-it to student athletes by reducing available scholarships, and to fans by damaging the competitiveness of future teams.
SomewhereinGA
March 11th, 2009
1:04 pm
GatorSam…had to reply to your post….our friend also says that Dadgummit is the biggest cusser at practice he has ever heard…to quote him, every other word is GD or MF. He told me he had never heard GD so many times in his life as when Dadgummit was cussing at practice. Another fallacy about St. Bobby…and that little tidbit has been confirmed by other ‘Noles as well as our friend FWIW.
not Factual
March 11th, 2009
1:09 pm
First of all T-money if you did your research and not try to put in your own words you would see the aid that gave the answers did not report to the football officials nor did they answer to the Athletic Department, and the investigation by both FSU and the NCAA proved that no coaches had any knowledge that this was going on and when brought to light they players were punished. One thing you fail to mention is that FSU self-reported this to the NCAA, go look up USC and Reggie Bush and the money he was getting. How about you look at the arrest sheets from major colleges. Yes problems exist everywhere but you want to try and bash one guy, good for you on poor research and narrow-minded thinking.
matt
March 11th, 2009
1:12 pm
For those of you trying to compare some duis and underage drinking to FSU’s rep need to stop. You are trying to compare grown men in a leadership role who are making a pre-determined decision to do whatever it takes to keep their athletes in school and on the field so they can win to 18,19 year old kids getting drunk in a bar. How many of you got drunk and did something stupid??? It’s apples and oranges people!!!
Eric
March 11th, 2009
1:13 pm
Most self professed Christians I know are hypocrites….football coaches are the least of the exceptions. Mark Richt is a Bobby Bowden waiting to happen. At least Saban doesn’t preach the Gospel, his hypocrisy lies elsewhere.
Reply to GatorSam
March 11th, 2009
1:18 pm
GatorSam – do you realize how ignorant of a statement that is? Bobby has changed more lives and allowed more athletes and coaches to become Christians than any other coach in college history. The Fellowship of Christian Athletes gives out an honor every year to the person who demonstrates Christian morals on the field. The award is titled “the Bobby Bowden Award”. He led Mark Richt to Jesus Christ and did the same for a TON of others – I’ve heard players tear up when talking about what an amazing man and father figure Bowden is and how he’s changed their lives. He’s had arguably the biggest Christian impact on players of anyone in college football history.
As good of a coach as Bowden is, he is that much BETTER as a person. Wish you could say the same for Urban Meyer or Steve Spurrier.
Quality Needed at AJC
March 11th, 2009
1:21 pm
once again Moore only reporting on part of the story. Some things never change…
ACC
March 11th, 2009
1:22 pm
Bowdens been a crook the whole time at FSU, he preaches rightenous, but his players are in more trouble than Miami or UGA. Its about time he get caught, and give it 2 more years and they’ll catch Richt and UGA, didn’t he come from FSU, acorn dosent fall far from the tree. Thats why UGA hired Richt, knew he was like Bowden and UGA loves crooked coaches-Butts, Dooley Harrick and Goff. Thats why UGA cannot get a clean coach to coach them, got to do something illegal as Munson stated once” Dont raise the academics, then we’ll be like Vanderbilt”.
GoSEC
March 11th, 2009
1:27 pm
Got to agree with you Moore, only a few more years and ole UGA will get caught. Richt came from FSU so as they say, when in Rome, do as the Romans do, and a limb dosent fall far from the tree.
buck stops somewhere
March 11th, 2009
1:28 pm
The next comment that comes from a follower of a university that has been penalized for cheating and doesn’t start pointing at other institutions as a cause and effect excuse will be the first. I think the phrase “accepting responsibility” never occurs to anyone anymore…
Mac
March 11th, 2009
1:32 pm
Joe Paterno is a jack@$$. I hope Bowden winds up his career with more wins.
gdg73
March 11th, 2009
1:34 pm
You in the media boosted him up to “Saint Status”, so stop it with your crying. He got fat (with victories) while utilizing the wealth of talent found in the state and the occassional blue chipper from Texas, Louisisana, Miss., and Georgia. When the talent started going elsewhere, the program suffered because his coaching ability, or lack thereof, was exposed. I’ve seen some of the practices at FSU. If he is not in the tower far removed from the field, he is riding around in a golf cart with his grandkids. Also, I doubt if he even knows his player’s names. I saw on his weekly TV show a couple of years back he kept calling Geno Hayes (#10) Derrick Brooks. This program has been on the skids every since the Darling kid died doing those mat drills back in 2000. And if anybody thinks Jimbo Fisher is any better, they are kidding themselves. The AD needs to clean house and bring in someone like Jon Gruden.
Reality Time
March 11th, 2009
1:34 pm
Mark Richt has not coached at FSU for 8 seasons. Why all the bloggers are trying to rope him into this recent FSU problem is beyond me. Irresponsible college athletes drinking happens at every campus, with the possible exception of Utah, and it is not limited to athletes. Unfortunately it is part of campus life. However having staffers prep answers and prepare papers is an entirely different story. I believe that blew up in Georgia’s face with the basketball program and I guarantee they looked at all their athletic programs at that time. Criticize Richt if you want, but have some basis other than you don’t like his outspoken religious beliefs.
Gary
March 11th, 2009
1:42 pm
I’m tired of the AJC and others on this blog who no nothing about FSU academics or football to imply that FSU is different from other programs. Yes, when you deal with 19-year-old college students away from home for the first time you inevitably will have some get into trouble. You also will have many players in a competitive program who have trouble keeping up academically. But FSU is not a joke school. Look at the not 1 but 2 Rhodes scholars to come out of FSU athletics in the last few years. Certainly cheating should not be tolerated and those involved disciplined or fired, but to paint the brush over the entire school and football program is pretty lazy journalism. Coach Bowden is responsible for the program as Head Coach, but can’t be expected to hold every player’s hand. Overall, I think he has been pretty consistent at suspending players who get into trouble, regardless of whether they start. If you have any doubt whether the dadgum coach is the real deal or not, get your butt down here to Tallahassee and find out for yourself.
reply to gdg73
March 11th, 2009
1:45 pm
actually, FSU started it’s downhill slide when they were dumb enough to hire Jeff Bowden as the offensive coordinator
Had nothing to do with lack of talent and talent leaving the state. It all had to do with not being able to properly evaluate talent and then develope the talent when it showed up.
As far as coaching, you don’t know much about college coaching and how it works. The head coach, unless a position coach as well, does very little “coaching” at all.
My only question is...
March 11th, 2009
1:46 pm
Why have you not jumped off a bridge yet Terry?
AD at FSU
March 11th, 2009
1:53 pm
What some people don’t know, because the full story is not being reported here, is that the AD that was in charge when this happened has since been removed.
But again, Terrance being the 50% reporter that he is kindly left that out of his report. He also left out the other approx 10 people that were let go that directly reported to the former AD.
Ryan
March 11th, 2009
1:54 pm
I played at Florida State and I am currently a pastor. I sat under coach Bowden for 5 years (I red-shirted) and whomever the “friend of a friend” is from the other posts is either sorely mistaken or just trying to defame Coach Bowden. The man said about 3 “cuss words” in the 5 years I was there and each time it happened it was in a half time speech and after it was said you could have heard a pin drop. It is simply incorrect to say that “Dadgummit is the biggest cusser at practice he has ever heard…to quote him, every other word is GD or MF. He told me he had never heard GD so many times in his life as when Dadgummit was cussing at practice,” is just incorrect. But, I doubt many of you actually believed this quote anyway.
About him being a hypocrite… The message of Jesus Christ is not a message of perfection; it is a message of necessary forgiveness because we are so imperfect. While I understand the frustration many people have because the church does some stupid things and because prominent Christian people do stupid things; it goes to validate the claims of Jesus that we are broken, selfish people who need a savior, as opposed to making everyone out to be hypocrites.
What happened at F.S.U. was wrong. It was more laziness than anything else, but wrong none the less. The issue is not weather or not F.S.U. should be penalized, but if vacating wins is appropriate. It is bigger than Coach Bowden. It involves the track team winning the National Championship, and being stripped of it as well. There is also a great deal of precedence to support F.S.U. Consider Florida and the Tank Black scandal where guys like Fred Taylor and Javon Kearse were getting paid. Or, Reggie Bush and USC. Or, speeding tickets at Alabama. etc. This isn’t to say that because other schools mess up none should be punished. It is to say that some level of consistency is to be expected.
Finally, F.S.U. self reported. They weren’t protecting any image when they hired an outside investigator to uncover the mess. They weren’t protecting any record when they suspended all those players for the bowl game (which they lost) and they first three games of the following season. Etc. It is not unreasonable for F.S.U. to appeal, nor is it just because it it Bobby Bowden (although he is a big motivator).
Gator Fans
March 11th, 2009
1:56 pm
Gators act as if they have so much room to talk with what goes on at UF. I LOVE IT.
They are just glad the lime light is not pointed in their direction for once.
Bill Mc.
March 11th, 2009
2:00 pm
Am I missing something here? We give these kids scholarships(which by the way means a free education that would cost you and I a hundred thousand dollars or more)and all they have to do is stay eligible and pass their classes. Then we allow them to take classes that have online tests and don’t expect them to cheat? If their athletic skills are that important to the school and the coach, they should be walked to each class, tutored and forced to study. I guess I missed the memo on the online testing. When did it replace basket weaving as a sure fire way to get an A? If you don’t at least hold the coach somewhat responsible then who do you hold responsible? If I tell my neighbor to watch my 18 year old son while I’m gone and they both go out wreck my new Porsche, who’s responsible? Answer: all of us bear some responsibility, but I’m the moron that left him with the keys. lol
Green Tea
March 11th, 2009
2:00 pm
Great post Ryan
Oh-the-horror
March 11th, 2009
2:02 pm
The on-line cheating doesn’t sound much different than what goes on at UGA all the time – particularly near the end of the semester or the end of summer classes (doesn’t it seem funny how those guys who are having to take summer classes suddenly find a way to pass the course). I also bet that this takes place at most other major colleges, particularly the SEC – where it’s win at all costs. But I am only relating my experiences with “players” at Georgia. There are a lot of “cheats”, both in and out of the classroom.
Poorjeff
March 11th, 2009
2:02 pm
Mr. Moore, who are you to cast stones? Your opinion on Coach Bowden is BS. I have known Bobby for many years (going back to his SGC days) and nothing you have reported describes the man I know.
Reply to Gator Sam @ 1:18= is the man I know. Thanks to the one that wrote it. How many have you won to Christ? Bobby is a much better man than a few AJC reporters that write trash and try to destroy a man. If it makes you feel better have at it but maybe you need to clean up your own back yard first.
Puleezze
March 11th, 2009
2:04 pm
SomewhereinGA, Hate to burst your bubble Buddy, but your “friend of the family” is making stuff up — Never taken a test? Never written a paper? Bobby B slinging nothing but MFs and GDs throughout practice? That “friend of the family” has some imagination!!
Bobby’s not a saint and FSU has it’s problems like most places, but just wildly making up stories does no one any good.
GW
March 11th, 2009
2:06 pm
These comments prove a lot of folks are just plain jealous of college coaches. Write a story on Bowden and every coach out there gets accused of something.
Rattler Nation
March 11th, 2009
2:09 pm
Terry, you’re an idiot to think this doesnt happen at every University. Go back to school and real degree b/c your writing skills suck
Terry Cloth
March 11th, 2009
2:10 pm
“Im at UF and 2 years ago I had a class with 8 football players in the class. One is a friend from high scholl and I wont give his name because he is still on the team and will be a senior and I get wasted with him some times, but never during the season. They went to class on the first day only and the 3 times there were test. I asked him how he was gonna pass and he told me they didnt have to go to school because they already had the 3 test to study from and the TA did not take roll anyhow. They told the players not to get a A and miss 10-15 questions on purpose so nobody could say nothing but everyone already knew whats up anyhow. I asked him for a copy of the final but he said no because he could get in trouble. I heard they all got b’s without going to class and taking notes and I got a c and I went to almost every class. Thats not fair and I think most schools let players get answers to test and pass around handouts with the important stuff on it and many players cheat too”
Bill
March 11th, 2009
2:12 pm
Great blog Ryan. Thanks
TM you could take some pointers from Ryan.
Bill Mc.
March 11th, 2009
2:12 pm
I don’t know Mr. Bowden personally so I can’t comment on his character. I do know that you’re reputation can be largely based on the people that work for and under you. If my livelyhood was based on how my players performed on and off the field, I would be keeping a much better eye on them or get somebody I trust to do it for me. Fool me once…
Bill From Tampa
March 11th, 2009
2:14 pm
I’m just guessing here, but Terrence is not a fan FSU or apparently much less of Bobby Bowden. Just a guess mind you.
Tank "UF" Black
March 11th, 2009
2:17 pm
What happened at FSU goes on everywhere. FSU should be reprimanded for turning themselves in. I agree w/ Rattler Nation….Terri Moore looks like he dropped out of high school
K-DAWG
March 11th, 2009
2:20 pm
To ACC, I don’t why your coming down so much on the UGA coaches, first of all Richt has not broken any kind of NCAA rules and best I recall neither did Dooley & Goff, except for tht Jan Kemp fiasco. Also,I doubt if Coach Butts needed to do any type of cheating, he just won games the old fashioned way, but then again you are from the ACC!!!!!!
bossrat
March 11th, 2009
2:25 pm
Who the heck is this Terence guy? And what does he know about FSU? He lumps all the players who have played at FSU as being bad. Well, there are players like: Derrick Brooks, Warrick Dunn, Charlie Ward, Myron Rolle, Casey Weldon, Brad Johnson, Peter Boulware, Chris Weinke, and I can go on and on … all great people.
Coach Bowden is a religious man of great moral and decent character. Obviously, this Terence guy has no clue as to what he writes about, and the AJC is nothing but a rag.
fsu 4 life
March 11th, 2009
2:31 pm
just another dumbass tryin to make some money off a story about a legandary coach that aint true
Reality Time
March 11th, 2009
2:31 pm
I think the most bothersome theme running through these blogs is that instead of individuals admitting there was a problem and appreciation that the problem had been found and was being corrected, to the benefit of both the university and all of its students, they find it more appealing to simply attack other schools, whether warranted or not. Yes, every school has had it problems, and some schools may have “gotten away” with some things, but the objective should not to see what you can slip by the NCAA, but to make your university and its athletics department something to be proud of. I realize that sounds simplistic but it is true. On one of the entries someone spoke of the “Jan Kemp fiasco.” That could not be further from the truth, as hated as she was at the time, Jan Kemp is one of the best things that happened to the University of Georgia and its athletic department. The changes that were made in response to Jan Kemp’s allegations have made Georgia a much more attractive destination for all students, not just student athletes, and by the way, we still field respectable teams in all sports, with the exception of basketball, which is still recovering from the cheating scandal when Herrick was coaching at UGA. FSU will have to go through the same recovery period and hopefully will come out the other side a better university.
To Not Factual
March 11th, 2009
2:31 pm
Thanks for that response. The three employees who invited the student athletes to cheat were not even employees of the athletic department, and as many have said, FSU self reported this violation, and suspended EVERY player that they found had cheated on the on-line course. That cost FSU not only the 2007 Music City Bowl, but far more important, it probably cost them last season’s conference game against Wake Forest. Should FSU be penalized for this incident? Of course. But c’mon AJC, if you’re going to comment at all, at least get your facts straight.
Dr Henry / Augusta
March 11th, 2009
2:39 pm
You nailed it this time Terrence….I had forgotten about FSU (free shoes U.) that being one of Spurrier’s gems….Thanks for allowing me to remember
acc
March 11th, 2009
2:54 pm
to k-dog—-look up 1943, when UGA was penalized $500 ( stiff penalty then ) because of Butts playing ineligible players-his excuse-”we couldnt compete because we didnt have enough players. As for Dooley and Goff, UGA received 2 years probation for illegal recruting. Players that didnt pass their entrance exam. Harrick was a real winner, and if it hadnt been for Jan Kemp seeing the players that had flunked and were ineligible and playing in the news years bowl game, then going back to school, checking and seeing that the grades had been changed, then UGA still be up to it-as Munson said ” got to win at all costs”
RickNole
March 11th, 2009
2:56 pm
Terence Please get a grip. How about you take a look at your darling Notre Dame before you start casting stones.
I guess its just convenient to see “FSU Scandal” headline on ESPN and to make your own conclusion instead of actually doing the research.
Somehow overlooked in all of this is that FSU actually self reported this information and suspended all of the 61 students involved.
I walked on as a freshman at FSU, do you REALLY believe that these coaching staffs know EVERYthing that goes on with its players?? If you do, you have NO idea about how things work in the real world.
Some of you people casting stones are probably the same people that believe that your sons and daughters in college are at home studying on a Sat. night.
Get real, college kids cheat, drink, party, and all other things that 18-21 year olds do. No different at FSU. (Yes Gator Fans, even Tim Teabow) Oh yeah Dawg fans, I dont remember our QB underage drinking and spooning another dude at some redneck race.
Choak at Doak
March 11th, 2009
2:56 pm
Another of Spurrier’s games was losing to FSU. I think Tank Black might have been the hidden gem behind all of his sucksess
Charlie Pell
March 11th, 2009
3:00 pm
How quickly this Gator homer forgets about UF’s past transgressions. Worst part is, I see this guy on t.v…. he’s so fake. F-a-k-e. I’m sure he’s met Bobby too and was “real” with him, i.e. calling him Saint Bobby and other unprofessional insults. It’s primarily why this guy writes for the AJC… a nobody blog that a bone head x-football player could write for.
Anywho, the UF program should of been disbanded after Charlie Pell committed 107 NCAA infractions, i.e. paying players cash, illegal practices, spying on other teams. I mean, the Turds wrote the book on cheating. Hell, the SEC stands for So, Everybody Cheats…
In sum, this guy and all Turds are scum. Dirty Jacksonville scum…
JP
March 11th, 2009
3:00 pm
Everyone should read Ryan’s post.
Richard
March 11th, 2009
3:00 pm
Whoever mentioned that Bobby is an act and that at practice he swears more than anyone has NEVER been to a FSU preactice OR KNOWN ANYONE that has been to a FSU practice. That is a straight up lie. L-I-E.
While as an FSU fan and alumni I am disappointed at what happened I will tell you that from going their and knowing many players I never saw any cheating. I did see waaaaaay more help than normal students get, but then again many of the players frankly needed it more.
They are football players, with a goal of going to the NFL not Harvard. For most school is something they have to do to get to the league. If any of you think FSU is any different than your school of choice you are very naive.
As for the reporter on this story he may need some academic help himself, the NCAA report said NO COACHES had knowlege or any part in this sad affair.
Cheap way to try to make a name for yourself as a reporter, attacking a beloved sport figure.
CS
March 11th, 2009
3:05 pm
Bottom line is that FSU will win it’s appeal with the NCAA and nobody will remember this issue by August. Second, 50 years from now people will remember Bobby Bowden for the great man and coach he was, nobody will remember Terence Moore.
gatorsam
March 11th, 2009
3:07 pm
By the way FSU diehards. Look back to the days at UF when Charlie Pell and Galen cheated. What happened? Their wrists were not slapped. The program was penalized very harshly by the NCAA. Many…many…many high school All-Americans and great college prospects reneged on the Gators, and a dynasty was born…guess where. FSU. No one whats to remember that. I have never read about in any sports page anyhwhere. Hey if the Gators get caught cheating, sock it to them, just do the same to “Saints” as you do to the Aint’s.
chris
March 11th, 2009
3:07 pm
Do you all realize FSU turned themselves in for this? The only the the NCAA did was add one more year of losing scholarships and stripping the wins. The rest FSU imposed on the themselves. I am a FSU grad and had classes with Peter Boulware, Tra Thomas and quite a few more. They were in more classes than I was. You bring up Coles, he got kicked off the team, same with Moss, Rock Preston and more. UGA and UF seem to take it as well they didn’t do it on the field. As soon as the school found out what was going on they suspended the players. Much less it takes the NCAA 2 years to come up with their findings for something FSU, again, turned themselves in for? If they hadn’t when would we have heard of this 2012?
How did you get a journalist job
March 11th, 2009
3:08 pm
please terrance, spend 15 minutes with coach bowden and you’ll regret writing this article. he is a great man and a great coach.
Kiffin is a baffoon
March 11th, 2009
3:09 pm
It’s not self-reporting when you have to re-issue your self report to the nCAA THREE times because the first only had TWO football players on it and the second a few more and the 3rd even more.
That’s called covering up for the football program while self-reporting.
The NCAA knew better and thus FSU had to re-issue the report multiple times.
For those bringing up Tank Black, UF self-reported that situation and was commended by the NCAA for how they handled the situation and their transparency in it. Not covering up like FSU did.
FSU fans are so quick to say well “everybody does it” or bash TMoore for his points in the article hwoever if he wrote the exact same thing about the same situation at UF or Miami you hypocrites would prech his words as the gospel.
You people are sad and HUGE hypocrites….
dap01
March 11th, 2009
3:10 pm
Hootie Snitch: With that intellectual conclusion, you need to be a judge or prosecutor.
Otto
March 11th, 2009
3:13 pm
Whatever happened with the USC investigations?
Convicts
March 11th, 2009
3:15 pm
Only a can fan would include the “N” word. There is no need for that here. Act like an adult. Let me guess, you didnt go to Miami did you? Didnt think so….I hqave never actually met a Miami fan that went to school there.
Newest Moore Critic
March 11th, 2009
3:16 pm
Terrence: I have never written a post giving you a hard time. I don’t always agree with what you write but usually enjoy reading your insight. I’ve never bought into others claims that you aren’t truly a journalist or that you never get the facts right. I’ve been willing to give you the benefit of the doubt – UNTIL NOW. This article represents sheer bias and profound laziness. There are so many inaccuracies it wasn’t worthy of being printed. Did you conduct any research? I will now read everything you write with a grain of salt.
#1 The cheating DID NOT involve staffers in the athletics department. The cheating involved three tutors in the Academic Assistance Department which has absolutely no reporting structure to the Athletic Department. In fact, I believe the AAD reports to the Dean of Students. It is specifically set up that way to avoid any ability by the Athletics Dept to exert pressure on the Academic Depts.
#2 The NCAA itself recognized that the coaches and administration at FSU had no knowledge of the cheating that was going on. They agreed that the coaches did nothing wrong and as soon as the University and the Athletic Dept learned of the problem they immediately self-reported and began investigating.
#3 There was absolutely no intent of covering anything up. The University immediately hired an independent third party to investigate the full details of the matter.
#4 You try to suggest in your article that this is a Football Program problem. You make a weak attempt to clarify that the 61 athletes were in 10 different sports but call it a “slew” in the football program. I didn’t see you mention Leonard Hamilton or the Track & Field Coach. Certainly, just a blatant attempt on your part to attack Bobby Bowden. Just to be clear – 61 athletes, 10 different sports.
#5 Who are the FSU Officials that you quote as saying it would be unfair to strip 10 wins from Bobby Bowden? Name the person. Who was your source quote from? The simple fact is – that wasn’t the quote. The quote is more similar to the fact that the University has agreed to nearly all aspects of the penalties imposed by the NCAA. In fact, most of the penalties that FSU were already self-imposing were simply adopted by the NCAA including probation and scholarship reductions. The one penalty they did not agree with was the vacation of wins from any sport. The disagreement stems from the fact that the athletic programs did not knowingly play any ineligible players. As soon as the potential of any player becoming ineligible was brought to their attention, the athletes were suspended and not allowed to play. The NCAA is stating that as soon as the infraction occurs the player becomes ineligible whether the University knows it or not and therefore, if they play in a game the game must be fofeited. That flies in the face of any precedent ever set by the NCAA. Reggie Bush received a house. At that moment, whether the University knew about it or not, he became ineligible and any game that he played in after the fact should be forfeited. The NCAA hasn’t required that of USC. Why? They’ve made up a new rule for FSU that says it doesn’t matter if you knew or not, they were ineligible and you must vacate those wins. That’s ridiculous. Let’s be clear: The NCAA is settign precedent here at the expense of FSU and it directly contradicts its rulings on similar matters in the past. As soon as FSU knew about the issue they took immediate actions to investigate and rectify. The NCAA even agreed that the coaches did nothing wrong. Requiring a vacation of wins under those circumstances makes no sense. Had FSU had any knowledge that the players were ineligible and still played them – then they should forfeit. But, without that knowledge and with the NCAA saying the coaches did nothing wrong, then the requirement to forfeit wins is ridiculous.
#6 Long silence after Derrick Gibson’s arrest and charge would be called due process and respecting the players right to privacy. Maybe he was also operating under the assumption of innocent until proven guilty.
#7 You act like no other organization in college football gives players second chances. Bowden’s stance has always been to help rehabilitate a player after making a stupid mistake rather than kicking them to the curb taking away the biggest motivator they have to staying in school and being a good citizen.
#8 instead of taking your opinion on Bowden, maybe I’ll listen to the scores of former players and coaches that still call him for advice. Maybe I’ll think about the following when forming my opinions of Bowden:
The College Football Hall of Fame changed its rules a few years back so that it could induct Bobby Bowden while he still was in active coaching. They did it to show how much he means to the sport.
The Fellowship of Christian Athletes delivers a national award each year, and they call it The Bobby Bowden Award.
Just three months ago, the National College Football Awards Association presented Bobby Bowden with its Contributions to College Football Award. According to the organization, it was “presented to recognize the exceptional contributions to college football and a lifetime of achievement and integrity.” Only seven people in the world have received that award – Bobby Bowden is the only active coach on the list.
Yeah, maybe I’ll listen to those opinions instead of a hack that calls himself a journalist. Wow!! I don’t even have your credentials and access yet I was able to conduct this research. Maybe you should try a little research yourself.
JoePa
March 11th, 2009
3:22 pm
Haha. All my players do is drink beer, get in fights, and smoke weed- like normal college kids. Even if FSU wins their appeal, this and all Bobby’s non-division 1 wins will forever taint his record. I’m sitting pretty in Happy Valley!
gatorsam
March 11th, 2009
3:23 pm
In reply to Choke at Doak. How many times hav the Seminoles lost hope of a national title because of their play against the Gator? Sometimes you win. Sometimes you lose. FSU fans never remember the “lose!
jefferson street joe
March 11th, 2009
3:26 pm
Worked several of Coach Bowden’s summer football camps. Never heard Coach Bowden in all the time I have been around him use cuss words. Somebody is telling some big time lies on here. Tell me a university that is not having some problems, some major, with their student athletes. Let those without sin and who live in the glass house cast the first stones…..
Doug Dyson
March 11th, 2009
3:27 pm
Poor old Terence. He just can’t get over Notre Dame not being able to win the most important game of the season back in 1993. That game being the next game against Boston College after ND beat FSU in South Bend when the Noles were number 1. He takes every opportunity he can to bash FSU, even when he doesn’t even bother to get the facts right in his articles. Terence states above that it was staffers in the athletic department that provided answers to tests and typed papers. If Terence had done proper research (like read the NCAA report), he would have found that 6 years ago T. K. Wetherell separated the athletic-academic support department from the athletic department and has them report directly to the academic side of the school. In other words, Bowden has absolutely no say in how his players are tutored or how they register for classes or how their academic progress is monitored. These violations had nothing to do with employees of the athletic department; only emloyees of an academic department. No coaches were implicated as noted in the NCAA’s report.
Wright
March 11th, 2009
3:29 pm
SomewhereinGA – I do not believe that your FSU friend would make statements like that about his own program and that you, as his friend, would publicly repeat those words.
Ryan – Well spoken.
Terry Cloth – If you are really a student at UF, you should probably spend more time taking English classes and less time getting wasted.
andrew
March 11th, 2009
3:38 pm
shall we get into history?
warrick: suspended 3 games (lost the heisman because of this)
coles: kicked off the team
randy moss: never played a down of football at fsu because bowden kicked him out!
fred rouse: top rated prospect that got kicked out after freshman year
preston parker: kicked off the team!
get your facts straight and quit conveniently overlooking them to satisfy your column!
Otto
March 11th, 2009
3:39 pm
Terrence is getting flamed here as he should. Another example of bad reporting in modern media. It is sensationalized news like this and the story on how players are reconsidering their choice of schools that damages football programs and costs coaches their jobs. It is a shame the reporters can not be held as accountable as coaches maybe they would have a tutor proof read their articles.
Choke at Doak
March 11th, 2009
3:50 pm
In reply to Gatorsam. 1. 1997 when Jaquez Green burned us bad. 1996 doesnt count b/c yall should have never even played in that game. Those are the only two times I can remember FU standing in the way of us being in the National Cahmpionship game. Miami has ruined many more chances than the Gaytors
Sautee Dawg
March 11th, 2009
4:09 pm
Headcoach at an institution this size don’t have time to grade test papers. If you lined up all the faculty and accademic staff at Fla. St. Bowden probably couldn’t name 2 out of the whole bunch. These headcoaches have so much demand put on their time they are usually the last ones to know what goes on around them. Same at every school. I do think with a story of this magnitude Terrance should have at least gotten a line in there from Bowden himself instead of relying on wire reports. Afterall it not only pertained to football but several sports at FSU.
Real
March 11th, 2009
4:26 pm
Terrence- you are a sad journalist. This article is purely libel. Bowden was not involved at all, yet he is being punished and his name tarnished.
First “The cheating involved staffers in the Florida State athletics department providing athletes with answers to the test and typing their papers.” -Actually it was Academic Support staffers, who did not report to anyone involved in the Athletics Department. The NCAA report also states that “None of the Athletic staff was involved or the punishments would have been more harsh”.
You also fail to say that their were 300 students total involved in this class, 61 of which were NCAA athletes involved in 10 different sports.
The reason that FSU is appealing this action is because NO PLAYERS KNOWINGLY INVOLVED IN THE SCANDAL PLAYED as soon as the incident was reported. FSU made each player sit out for 4 games, including the bowl game versus Kentucky. Again this was a SELF-REPORTED VIOLATION to the NCAA. FSU was being pro-active and followed the guidelines set by the NCAA in handling this matter.
FSU is on probation now, sure. SO IS BAMA and OU!!! We are all able to play on TV and in Bowl games. FSU loses 2 scholarships which tend to go to walk-ons annually.
You certainly have a bias towards FSU and Bowden.
Real
March 11th, 2009
4:31 pm
JoePa- Samford was Div-I back in the day…they aren’t now, but Bowden doesn’t coach them now does he?
Real
March 11th, 2009
4:39 pm
Gatorsam- ever hear of Tank Black…try looking him up before you throw any stones. FSU is the last of the Big 3 to receive any form of probation.
The reason FSU is appealing this ruling is because it sets a nasty precedent that if applied retro-actively could take away National Championships from USC- Reggie Bush was ineligible half his career. Therefore those games should be vacated. UF would lose their ‘96 championship, due to Jaquez Green as well.
The NCAA overturned this ruling against OU, just a couple years ago…why wouldn’t FSU fight to keep a legend’s name from being tarnished when even the NCAA states he, nor anyone else in the Athletics Department had anything to do with this.
carnold
March 11th, 2009
4:50 pm
FSU (like many schools)is very polarizing, you either love them or hate them. You either respect Bowden or you think he’s a crook. It was this way before probation and I can’t see why it would be any different now.
What exactly was the point of this article???
Reads like something out of sports-talk radio or an internet smack board. Certainly not something I’d expect to read in a respected newspaper. Maybe Terrance listens to the Rome show everyday to get his ideas.
SomewhereinGA
March 11th, 2009
4:51 pm
Whatever…believe what you want to….I won’t even get into his recruitment during the “dead period” then…the FSU folks would throw themselves on the floor in denial over that one.
quicknole
March 11th, 2009
5:09 pm
SomewhereinGA- I suppose that what you are privy to here with this information is more credible than the thousands of people who B. Bowden has come in contact with over the years…you obviously have an agenda here spreading such falsehoods so me even trying to debate any of them is pointless. I’m waiting on your next “claim”, could it be “B.Bowden in love triangle”, or “B.Bowden talks to aliens”, or “B.Bowden causes economic depression in U.S.”
You should get a job with the National Enquiror with all your earth shattering revelations.
CS
March 11th, 2009
5:21 pm
Kiffin is a baffoon,
FSU did self report you idiot.
Kiffin is a baffoon
March 11th, 2009
5:33 pm
Well CS why dont you read my post tard. They self reported with ONLY 2 football players being implicated and the NCAA made them submit a new report TWO more times. It’s not self-reporting if you’re still trying to cover up how many football players were involved.
It’s so funny how quickly you delusiNOLES spout stuff as if it’s fact when you don’t even know the facts yourselves.
Kiffin is a baffoon
March 11th, 2009
5:36 pm
What else is so very sad here is all you Noles acting like you are the Victims here when almost 1/3 of your team committed ACADEMIC FRAUD. Who cares what happened to UF in 1984, what does that matter now? Who cares what happened to Reggie Bush. Take a look at your team and the cheating THEY did for the reason articles like this are being written.
RP
March 11th, 2009
5:50 pm
I am certainly amazed by all of this… As stated earlier by others in the comments… FSU was the one brought this to everyone’s attention… This could have been swept under the rug… An institution with less character or integrity would have done that. FSU reported it… penalized themselves – hard. And that should have done it. Also, it has been shown that the coaching staff knew nothing about this situation. Oh and I think the NCAA is still holding a bit of a grudge for FSU standing up to them and winning concerning the Seminole name. I think the NCAA is still carrying a little bit of a grudge.
Finally, it seems this columnist is merely writing his shallow opinion… Terrance, don’t be a hater… makes you look silly.
Terence Moore
March 11th, 2009
6:36 pm
Here’s an interesting thought: If the Powers That Be at Florida State really want to get rid of Bobby Bowden for football reasons (in case you haven’t been paying attention, the Seminoles haven’t exactly been the Seminoles in recent years), they could use his current NCAA issues as an excuse.
That isn’t likely, though.
Still, if Bowden resigns out of nowhere or is fired, then …
You know the rest.
carnold
March 11th, 2009
6:44 pm
If Bowden retires now it looks like all he has been doing is trying to beat out Paterno. That may in fact be true (I don’t know, and neither does anyone else here), but I’m sure he wouldn’t want it being this blatantly obvious.
carnold
March 11th, 2009
6:49 pm
“Who cares what happened to UF in 1984, what does that matter now? Who cares what happened to Reggie Bush.”
Who cares about foot locker or Janikowski? Foot Locker was 1993! Academic cheating vs. agents giving away shoes…they have nothing to do with one another at all. We want to talk about the current issue and whether the punishment fits the crime, then fine, let’s have an intelligent discusion.
Terrance is the one who dragged up old nonsense just for the sake of being a opinionated ahole.
j weber
March 11th, 2009
6:55 pm
Terrence, after reading Newest Moore Critic’s post, you need to give a apology to Bobby Bowden and FSU. Gatorsam you need to get over this envy you have for Florida State.
marseilles mutt
March 11th, 2009
7:11 pm
First off, it is the author’s right in this blog, or any other for that matter, to state their opinion- right or wrong-it is just that! Their opinion. Then we -as readers- have the right to either agree or disagree. Many times due to space and time certain ‘facts’ can be either added, deleted, or even distorted. Time seems to be of the essence. Such is the marvel of the cyber-media.
But in fairness, I cannot let all of the criticism of Coach Bowden’s and even Coach Richt’s personal beliefs be allowed a free pass. Forget the article and the your feelings towards TM, FSU, UF, GT, UGA et al, for a second; rather think about what you are saying about the individuals and their professed Christianity.
If I read some of your comments correctly, several of you are calling them out for problems within the athletic and academic communities of their institutions and saying that these things should not occur because of their personally stated beliefs. “If they are Christians, how come there are so many problems?” Did I get that right? Ergo, they have to be hypocrites. Sorry, it doesn’t work that way.
Bobby Bowden, the man, spends many of his Sundays in the pulpits of various churches, and preaches the Christian Doctrine. A doctrine of Jesus Christ who says simply, “I forgive”. Unfortunately for Coach Bowden that doctrine works directly in his favor as a coach working with young men. Young men, many of whom come from backgrounds wherein mistakes are not only common, but the norm. When he does forgive, he is cutting them slack, and everyone howls!
The concept of forgiveness taught by the man known as Jesus Christ is rather foreign to most of us, because most of us, even the professed, practicing Christian, just do not, or cannot, forgive. Sometimes I find it extremely hard, and I am sure you do as well. Rarely is it found- and practiced- in the NCAA coaching arena. Bobby Bowden and Mark Richt both do it up front and proudly and are mocked and called “Saint Bobby” and “The Right Rev Richt”. Then they are roundly criticized for doing so.
Well, last I heard that Man, Jesus Christ, ran with a rather rough crew of sinners himself. I like to think of my church not as a shrine to saints, but a hospital for sinners. It is kind of hard to use a light if you do not have a dark to throw it into, and in that context, I have always felt that the two aforementioned were beacons of a sort, and their personal -operative word is personal- actions have done little to change my opinion. Despite what I may hear or read to the contrary.
There was no intent here for a sermon. I am a former ‘lardassed lineman’- not a Seminole- who loved and played Southern Football,and was lucky enough to letter a time or two. Further, I am old enough to have seen it all, or at least most of it anyway. As a ‘first string’ sinner, and one who is cramming for His ‘final exam’, I would be rather proud to have either Coach Bowden or Coach Richt for a tutor.
Let’s stick to football, okay?
kg
March 11th, 2009
7:46 pm
preston parker
SomewhereinGA
March 11th, 2009
8:38 pm
Quicknole, nah, no agenda…just saying what happened. Sorry if I bothered you, but whatever, but if it’s a lie, then one of his current star players told it. I’m still not going to get into the recruiting of the guy, but it is true…that’s all I will say.
G Man
March 11th, 2009
9:24 pm
Terrance Moore. The Jerry Springer of sports columnists
Ken Stallings
March 11th, 2009
9:27 pm
Amen, Terence! You are one of the few to tell the truth about this corrupted program. The NCAA is often scared to go after the top echelon coaches with the same vigor they go after less successful coaches.
Old Papa Joe
March 11th, 2009
9:38 pm
“Forfiet the wins and show Bobby the rocking chair so I can pass peacefully in my sleep as the winningest coach of all time. I’ve only got one good leg left to stand on for goodness sakes! Uh, what were we talking about again?”
Hilbilly Deluxe
March 11th, 2009
9:54 pm
They got caught so Bowden and FSU should be punished but I doubt if this is really all that rare.
Newest Moore Critic
March 11th, 2009
10:35 pm
Really Terrence? Are you really openly lobbying for FSU to get rid of Bobby? How sad. Make up all the lies you originally wrote about and then openly lobby for FSU to fire Bobby when even the NCAA said he did nothing wrong.
BnB
March 11th, 2009
10:45 pm
Good to see Terrence has finally taken the blinders off about Bowden’s thug enabling style. This has been going on for decades but Bobby is just so, oh, swell and such a good Christian that no matter what he does it doesn’t really matter. Bowden is all about one thing…Bowden.
BNole
March 11th, 2009
11:17 pm
Just like Barrack Obama, every time Terence opens his mouth kaka comes out. Your a racist P.O.S
Bamafan
March 12th, 2009
5:54 am
I wish Coach Bowden would retire and enjoy his family and other friends and fans of FSU. I still
remember wishing he would be the head coach at Alabama back in 80’s. My brother met him many years ago and said he was very nice man!! GOOD LUCK COACH BOWDEN!!