Why the Atlanta stadium debate remains alive: Location, location, location
The latest Journal-Constitution poll now measures opposition to a new, $1 billion version of the Georgia Dome – and a new home for the Atlanta Falcons, its chief tenant – at 72 percent of all Georgians.
That level of unpopularity shouldn’t shock you. But you might be surprised by the fact that, despite an approval rating only slightly better than that of Congress, the issue will be very much alive when the Legislature opens this week.
State lawmakers will be asked to approve $300 million in public funding, through a hotel-motel tax on visitors to Atlanta. Mayor Kasim Reed remains confident of success. Gov. Nathan Deal and House Speaker David Ralston are less so, but neither has closed the door on the project.
Such a situation is sure to breed cynicism. Politicians doing the bidding of billionaire Falcons-owner Arthur Blank, one jaded voice in your head is saying. Another directs your attention to the much-vaunted friendship between the mayor of Atlanta and the governor.
But the real reason why talk of a new stadium isn’t dead on arrival goes back more than 40 years, to a time when Reed was still in grade school and Deal was a wet-behind-the-ears lawyer. Since 1971, the state of Georgia has been the quiet underwriter of Atlanta’s convention and tourism industry.
Four decades of construction – first the Georgia World Congress Center, with two major expansions, then the Georgia Dome — have made the state one of the largest and most important real estate investors in the downtown area.
In 2011, when Occupy Atlanta was in the market for a spot to set up its tents, protestors settled on a tiny bit of city green space rather than spacious, 21-acre Centennial Olympic Park – even though the latter had a system of fountains well-suited for outdoor showers. Why? Because Olympic Park is state-owned ground, and state troopers do not fool around.
The College Football Hall of Fame will open next year on one side of Olympic Park. The state is putting up $15 million of a total $66.5 million private-public package, for a parking lot and other amenities.
All of this gives the state Capitol – whether it likes it or not — an enormous stake in downtown Atlanta’s success.
These days, to approve public monies to benefit a private sports team is a risky political venture. One could even call the measure tone deaf. But from a business point of view, it makes a deal of sense – the protection of long-held capital investments.
“The World Congress Center and the Georgia Dome have, over time, turned Atlanta into the fourth-largest convention city in the nation,” said state Rep. Calvin Smyre, D-Columbus. “State investments have made Atlanta a destination city.”
It was Smyre who, as House floor leader for Gov. Joe Frank Harris, carried the 1986 legislation to permit the construction and financing of the Georgia Dome. Even that iteration of the Falcons’ home, which wasn’t finished until six years later, sparked public suspicion.
In the state Senate, the governor’s floor leader was a certain Roy Barnes of Mableton. Who refused to touch the Dome legislation, because he planned to run for governor.
Barnes lost the 1990 race. The winner was Zell Miller, who backed the construction of the Georgia Dome, and has endorsed its replacement. (Full disclosure: Miller is on retainer with McKenna, Long & Aldridge, the legal and governmental affairs firm in Atlanta that represents Blank in stadium negotiations.)
According to Smyre, the tone of the current debate over a Falcons’ home is more civilized than the one that occurred in 1986. Then-owner Rankin Smith’s threats to move the team to Jacksonville were loud and public, the Columbus lawmaker remembered.
This time, the Falcons have been party to no such blackmail. The painting of dire images has been left instead to the team’s landlord, the Georgia World Congress Authority.
State Rep. Mike Dudgeon, R-Johns Creek, who has emerged as one of the leading opponents of the new stadium, said GWCA officials have spent the last few weeks acquainting lawmakers with the following scenario:
If the Legislature fails to approve a new stadium, Blank – freed from his Georgia Dome lease in 2017 – could decide to build an open-air stadium closer to a suburban fan base. The cost, minus the retractable roof, would be about the same as Blank is now willing to put into the current deal.
A spokeswoman for the GWCA confirmed that the authority has hosted seminars for lawmakers in which it has been emphasized that, without the Falcons as a tenant, the Georgia Dome would immediately become a white elephant. The Dome, which now turns a hefty profit, would lose between $1.5 million and $2 million each year, lawmakers have been told.
It is this number – and the possibility that two generations of other state investments could also be put at risk – that has kept the debate over a new stadium in downtown Atlanta alive.
Philosophically, there is no doubt that many of the Republicans who rule the Capitol – even as they cheer tax incentives for auto factories or biotech plants elsewhere — are uncomfortable with the state’s stake in downtown Atlanta real estate, and what might be required to safeguard it.
But they’re also tasked with being responsible stewards of all state assets. And that’s the dilemma they’ll begin chewing over on Monday.
- By Jim Galloway, Political Insider
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173 comments Add your comment
Fred
January 12th, 2013
1:27 pm
@JamVet – Nope, unlike some I never claim to be the arbiter of definitions. Most people know that dictionaries change over time as the way words get used change. That is why new words are added and old words get deleted as their usage dies out. Like I said (even though my fingers were not working so well) read a political science text and have your horizons broadened. Republic and democracy can both be covered by a broader definition of democracy vs dictatorship or oligarchy but as a definition of the type of government of the US republic is the proper term and is distinctly different than democracy. I’ve heard it said that some New England town hall styles of government are the closest we come to a true democracy but I can’t personally vouch for that. Tell us again when it was that you personally voted on a law or budget? Didn’t think so. You voted for someone to represent you, hence a republic.
The only incontrovertible proof I have seen is your lack of understanding of our type of government. GOP? What has that got to do with it? Democrat or Republican has nothing to do with the *style* of our government. Those choices have everything to do with how you think our government should be *run* but nothing to do with the underlying style of our government.
Aquagirl
January 12th, 2013
1:30 pm
Fred, I’m bookmarking your posts in case I develop insomnia.
Wilbur
January 12th, 2013
1:33 pm
Most of the people in Georgia think public financing of a football stadium for the falcons is a terrible idea. Other than the Falcons, the principal proponent of the new stadium is Atlanta’s mayor, Reed. This is not republicans funding their projects, it’s about democrats trying to whine their way through even more of our money in a risky venture.
There are several locations further north that would be profitable and reasonable alternatives to a downtown stadium. The sooner we move the sports to the fan base the better off Atlanta will be.
Grasshopper
January 12th, 2013
1:43 pm
Very interesting explanation of the state’s stake in keeping the Falcons happy and downtown Jim.
So many liberals are unhappy about this proposal because it benefits a private company and individual. Yet they crow about Obama supposedly saving GM – theoretically a private company as well.
123
January 12th, 2013
1:51 pm
Fred
In which post did Jamvet call the US a “true” democracy? Seems those were your words. He posted a defintion. You post the word “true”
Let’s make this easy for you;
Is the US “republic” form of a government a
1. Type of a military junta
2. Type of monarchy
3. Type of democracy
DannyX
January 12th, 2013
1:55 pm
“Other than the Falcons, the principal proponent of the new stadium is Atlanta’s mayor, Reed.”
Great joke Wilbur! Everyone knows Gov Deal is the head cheerleader for a new stadium. The Georgia Dome is a state building. Fact is Deal and Reed are bff’s.
“There are several locations further north that would be profitable and reasonable alternatives to a downtown stadium.”
Please answer a few questions Wilbur.
1- Please name theses locations.
2- How are the very expensive infrastructure improvements going to be paid for at your northern location. Atlanta is willing to kick in $200 million. Sales tax? Good luck with that!
3- How do you expect the northern stadium to make a profit off of 10 games a year, especially since the Falcons are going to want to keep all of the income?
3- Where do you get the money for the road improvements that will be needed in order to keep the locations you are about to name from becoming another Atlanta Speedway traffic mess?
Aquagirl
January 12th, 2013
1:55 pm
Other than the Falcons, the principal proponent of the new stadium is Atlanta’s mayor, Reed.
Reed is providing political cover. The GWCA Jim mentions is run by a board, appointed by Nathan Deal. It’s made up of people like Tricia Pridemore, who is so flamingly Democrat she ran for GA GOP Chair, with Nathan Deal’s backing. That board, along with the Republican-dominated legislature, are the ones who can say yes or no.
Please go back to your suburb and hold your breath until someone builds you a stadium. That’ll keep you quiet for a long, long time.
DannyX
January 12th, 2013
1:58 pm
I hear Gov Deal wants the name of the new stadium to be the ‘Socialist Dome’.
MiltonMan
January 12th, 2013
2:12 pm
Reed = idiot. First the clown bashed everyone for not supporting his TSPLOST push & now the clown wants a stadium??? Hey elephant ears how about focusing on education in your city which is still pathetic?
Fred
January 12th, 2013
2:18 pm
@Aquagirl – Glad I can be of assistance to you.
DannyX
January 12th, 2013
2:20 pm
“Reed = idiot. First the clown bashed everyone for not supporting his TSPLOST push & now the clown wants a stadium???”
Like I said Reed + Deal = Bff’s
Port pork, new stadium, TSPLOST, they make a wonderful couple.
liberalefty
January 12th, 2013
2:30 pm
EVERYBODY with an ounce of commonsense knows the stadium is a done deal.
Kris
January 12th, 2013
3:10 pm
liberalefty…Your right just a little more $$$ spread around and Atlanta can super size this SHADY reed, deal.
What is the actual cost to the taxpaying citizens , I have read up $500,000…1/2 billion…That would educate a bunch of children and provide SRO in schools…Just saying..
All the legislators that vote for this boondoggle should be recalled ….Byte NATE 2014
honested
January 12th, 2013
3:19 pm
fred,
No matter how many people work there or what part of China the products come from, they are still hardware stores that went from meeting public need to driving artificial demand, and you didn’t address the blind and unbending support for g.w. bush, the hands down, undisputed worst President in history.
Therefore, I ask again, why on earth is our State Government so interested in bending over for this man’s whim and assuming we are all cool with sharing the bill?
For the record, I have lived here all my life and have never, ever attended a professional football game.
I really don’t care if the entire NFL evaporates tomorrow.
yuzeyurbrane
January 12th, 2013
3:43 pm
honested, I am in agreement with you on the merits of taxpayers subsidizing a new stadium but there is no need to denigrate the business accomplishments of Arthur Blank nor the considerable amount of philanthropy he quietly dispenses. By the way, I may be wrong but it has always been my understanding that Blank is a Democrat; it is his former partner, Bernie Marcus, who generously supported W and helped pay for the infamous Swiftboat ads.
yuzeyurbrane
January 12th, 2013
3:50 pm
As to Reed’s role, it is old-fashioned politics. He wants a big construction project which for a few years will add a lot of jobs and cash for his constituents. By a “few years”, I mean long enough to run for reelection on it.
missing fact
January 12th, 2013
3:51 pm
No one has mentioned that the economics requires a 25% increase in ticket prices in addition to psl”s… also consider the 1/2 billion covered by us is a low ball estimate…smart money would expect a 3/4 billion hit.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
January 12th, 2013
3:51 pm
jamvet couldn’t care less about the definition of the word democracy, he was just looking for something to apply his lunatic RepubliRant to. A new stadium in the middle of a lib hell hole didn’t pass muster.
I would rather lose $2 million a year for 250 years on the Georgia Dome rather than spend $500 million on a new stadium
January 12th, 2013
4:13 pm
“GWCA officials have spent the last few weeks acquainting lawmakers with the following scenario:
If the Legislature fails to approve a new stadium, Blank – freed from his Georgia Dome lease in 2017 – could decide to build an open-air stadium closer to a suburban fan base. The cost, minus the retractable roof, would be about the same as Blank is now willing to put into the current deal.
A spokeswoman for the GWCA confirmed that the authority has hosted seminars for lawmakers in which it has been emphasized that, without the Falcons as a tenant, the Georgia Dome would immediately become a white elephant. The Dome, which now turns a hefty profit, would lose between $1.5 million and $2 million each year, lawmakers have been told.”
Sooo…what happens to the Dome if the proposed new stadium *does* get built? Won’t it start losing $1.5 to $2 million each year, just the same?
Also – I agree with the previous poster who stated that, mathwise, it would be better for Atlanta to lose $2 million a year for 250 years on a ‘money-losing’ Georgia Dome rather than shell out $500 billion now to build a shiny new stadium for Arthur Blank.
OldTimer
January 12th, 2013
4:44 pm
Take Atlanta out of Georgia and what do you have?
Alabama.
If that’s what you want that’s what you will get.
Kris
January 12th, 2013
4:44 pm
Dannyx “”"”Like I said Reed + Deal = Bff’s Port pork, new stadium, TSPLOST, they make a wonderful couple.”"”
I say Ride them out on a rail reeds trolly.. Another quality porl laden Shady reed deal.
Recend the Delta fuel tax…let Blank pay for it
nathan's political arsonist
January 12th, 2013
4:53 pm
@ rafe, you immediately rant at “left wing bloggers”, when this issue will be decided by the supermajority gop idiots your kind elected
Just Saying..
January 12th, 2013
4:59 pm
Only Rafe could make the actions of his Republican stalwarts into a object lesson for the evil left…
bob from account temps
January 12th, 2013
5:10 pm
even if the gwcc loses $2mil a year without the falcons, it will be 150 yrs before it equals what the basic investment will be.
jaypat
January 12th, 2013
5:39 pm
“Full disclosure: Miller is on retainer with McKenna, Long & Aldridge, the legal and governmental affairs firm in Atlanta that represents Blank in stadium negotiations/”
That’s very interesting. Zell sorta forgot to mention that little detail in the laudatory piece he recently wrote on the proposed stadium.
I think the name for this type of activity by the politicians and media types and associated tycoons is _crony capitalism_.
td
January 12th, 2013
5:47 pm
JamVet
January 12th, 2013
12:14 pm
Did you actually read and understand the definition you posted?
“1. government by the people; a form of government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised directly by them or by their elected agents under a free electoral system.”
The supreme power is not vested in the people in our country. The supreme power is vested in the Constitution and the rule of law. If the supreme power was vested in the people then want ever the majority wanted would be the law. If the majority wanted to reconstitute slavery or say that women could no longer vote then that would be the law of the land if the people had supreme power.
Think about that one for a minute.
yuzeyurbrane
January 12th, 2013
5:50 pm
Zell lives as the saying goes “comfortably” on his corporate board fees. I think it all started about the time he pulled a 180 degree turn into rabid rightwinger.
The Stadium authority assumes that no one else will rent the Dome if Blank has taken his marbles to play elsewhere. Guess what, that is bs. Most revenues come from conventions which are happy with Dome, Phillips Arena, GWCC complex and close proximity of downtown hotels and restaurants. Few even need a stadium. For the few that do, Blank will have to offer them a real sweet deal to use a suburban facility. Ain’t gonna happen. GWCC are not only arrogant in their refusal to even take their case to the public but are liars, too.
jaypat
January 12th, 2013
6:00 pm
Re the proceeds from the “hotel-motel” tax (the source of the $300-350 million public money): If the state legislature passed the law, can’t they also change it to suit present needs?
It seems to me that the money would be better spent upgrading the infrastructure in the area than building a new stadium to replace the perfectly good one we now have. That’s a 365-day-a-year exposure instead of 20 to 30 events a year.
Reggie
January 12th, 2013
6:15 pm
I am a taxpayer and an educator. I support building a new stadium downtown and I live on the southside (Henry County) of the city. Many loyal fans live on the southside, eastside, and westside. Not everyone live on the overcrowded northside. And no, it is not always safer on the northside. The media just report any mishaps from intown and other areas where it is not Angelo-Saxon majority. Build your new playground downtown Mr. Blank and I will continue to support the Falcons.
Kris
January 12th, 2013
6:43 pm
“”"Gov. Nathan Deal and House Speaker David Ralston are less so, but neither has closed the door on the project”"”Such a situation is sure to breed cynicism. Politicians doing the bidding of billionaire “”
“”
The doors are open s0 when the unmarked $$ envelops $$ are dropped off they will see them..
I know this make sense, but any way. To me Money would be better spent updating the GA dome…It can be done ask Error Davis he spent millions and millions updating (technology. remodeling buildings etc, updating the University system…..
ASanePerson
January 12th, 2013
7:07 pm
To be perfectly honest, I do not care where the stadium is built as long as it is built with 100% private money. No one has explained how a new stadium would benefit not only the citizens of Atlanta but the citizens of the State who will ultimately also be responsible. As of this date, the current Dome has not benefitted residents of the surrounding area. In fact, the area directly across the street is in worse condition than it was prior to building the Dome. Even more troubling is the fact THE MAJORITY OF CITIZENS CANNOT AFFORD A TICKET TO A FALCON GAME OR SUPER BOWL IF IT IS PLAYED AT THE CURRENT OR FUTURE DOME.
The economy is in the condition it is because BIG BUSINESS made foolish investments. They overbuilt and sold housing to people they knew would not be able to afford it in the long run. All the time they stuffed their pockets just as they are doing know. Ask yourself this, you want to remodel your kitchen, do you ask the person across the street to pay for it.
Let Arthur Blank and Reed come up with private money and use the Hotel Motel Tax to fix the roads in the city which taxpayers ride on.
Cherokee
January 12th, 2013
7:42 pm
“The supreme power is not vested in the people in our country. The supreme power is vested in the Constitution and the rule of law”
Nonsense of course for a couple reasons.
First, the people can change the Constitution if they so choose.
Secondly, it’s really bizarre when an anti gay poster such as yourself condemns direct democracy – since that’s how the gay marriage bans have been implemented in 30 something states.
I guess ‘democracy’ is okay when you take away rights of a disliked class of people, right, td?
JamVet
January 12th, 2013
7:54 pm
To 123’s point, Fred’s “explanation” is pure pablum.
Sophist allusions to “political science texts” that would get laughed out of a ninth grade Civics class.
The man actually thinks he is more relevant and more believable than the dictionary!!!
THIS is the magnitude of insanity that dominates the dysfunctional Republican party.
And Aesop the lapdog? That kid embarrasses himself daily at Wingfield’s and is little more than an AJC whack-a-troll!
Michael
January 12th, 2013
7:56 pm
Gerald you idiot, you just said that if we do not build a new stadium then the Georgia Dome will be torn down and we will have no indoor facility to attract indoor events. And presumably, Arthur Blank’s open air stadium in the suburbs also would not draw indoor events. What color liquor are you drinking?
honested
January 12th, 2013
7:57 pm
yuzeyurbrane,
If I am wrong, I stand corrected, however, I was pointing out that I find nothing about mr. blank’s character or philanthropy to make him specifically qualified to ‘expect’ the Citizens to pay a penny for his risky, pointless and unnecessary new palace.
Pick any city around the country that has succumbed to the nonsense of financing such a venue and show evidence that demonstrates the citizenry (especially those who paid but have no interest in sports) gained benefit.
At the same time, a cursory examination demonstrates that in ALL cases the citizens got the short end of the deal, while the NFL owners maintain their anti-trust exemption so they are free to conspire with one another to extort from the next group of unwitting citizens in turn.
Iluvnutella
January 12th, 2013
8:01 pm
Would love a new stadium, but in Doraville at old GM plant or out in Henry or Gwinnett, Yessir Kusseem….ON YOUR WATCH!
td
January 12th, 2013
8:09 pm
Cherokee
January 12th, 2013
7:42 pm
“The supreme power is not vested in the people in our country. The supreme power is vested in the Constitution and the rule of law”
Nonsense of course for a couple reasons.
First, the people can change the Constitution if they so choose.
You certainly can and it is written out exactly how to do in in what? The Constitution. Fact or fiction: Can we change the Constitution with 51% of the vote.
“Secondly, it’s really bizarre when an anti gay poster such as yourself condemns direct democracy – since that’s how the gay marriage bans have been implemented in 30 something states”
When have I ever said i was anti-gay? Just because a person believes that marriage should be between and man and a woman that does not make the person anti-gay. Left wing demonetization technique.
Since marriage is a right reserved to the state and does not infringe on Federally protected rights or Constitutional protections then it can be left up to the people to decide.
BigGTMike
January 12th, 2013
8:14 pm
The hotel tax isn’t going away. Blank is basically funding GWCC upgrades for the public while also increasing the value of his team. Win/Win.
Rafe Hollister
January 12th, 2013
8:14 pm
Speaking of dysfunctional; ,Jamvet!
I was simply trying to point out that if we have this wonderful democracy that you libs love to tout, then why can’t 72% of the people not end this foolish talk of a new stadium, we do not need.
Yes, we can defeat them at the polls, if we had informed voters that could remember something longer than 2 weeks, but that would be after Arthur’s Palace was approved.
Fred is right, a democracy is two wolves and a sheep debating what’s for dinner.
honested
January 12th, 2013
8:18 pm
td,
Now tell us how the ’supreme power’ really rests with the whim of the 2%.
I’m sure you have a great belly laugher for why that is so.
td
January 12th, 2013
8:18 pm
“Since marriage is a right reserved to the state”
Should have read Since marriage law is a right reserved to the state and not an individual.
honested
January 12th, 2013
8:20 pm
rafe,
If the average Georgia voter could pay attention to something besides abortion, prayer in schools or making sure that the local wealthy don’t have to put up with something they don’t like, we might make some progress.
Yet, I can see no real progress since 2003 and at the same time so many of those who vote against their interest think there is something useful about calling themselves republican.
td
January 12th, 2013
8:21 pm
honested
January 12th, 2013
8:18 pm
td,
Now tell us how the ’supreme power’ really rests with the whim of the 2%.
That is what you leftest believe so you tell us how the “evil” rich control everything.
td
January 12th, 2013
8:31 pm
honested
January 12th, 2013
8:20 pm
If you would open your eyes and look then you would see progress. Sonny (I hate defending him because I think he was a RINO) made sure our state stayed fiscally sound during the recession. This state is not burdened by huge debts in the future of pensions that other states have (most blue states). Sonny and Nathan are working hard to transform the economy from the housing industry as the main driver to a more diverse economy and businesses. Just read this paper and look at the 1000 jobs coming in to the call center by GM, caterpillar and Kia. They are also teaming up with the mayor to open the port in Savannah to make us a major shipping port on the East coast.
You keep those blinders on and not look at what is really going on by the Republican leadership.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
January 12th, 2013
8:53 pm
Kyle Wingfield
January 9th, 2013
7:57 pm
Oh, and those who come on here and heckle others about being the reason for the heavier comment moderation should take a long look in the mirror…
JamVet
January 12th, 2013
9:25 pm
Fred is right…
Like Aesop, you are a fool. Without the maturity to admit that he, and you, are dead wrong.
The United States of America is a representative democracy, a constitutional republic, a democratic republic and other real definitions. As used by intelligent people.
BTW, where did this hatred of the word democracy come from? It is only in recent right wing parlance that I have ever even seen anyone who had the temerity to assert such a thing.
Whatever. It is beyond absurd.
123
January 12th, 2013
9:27 pm
Assop
Kyle was talking about you and @@…
Why did you not post your post a few minutes before Kyle said that?
As for the dome
DEAL will pave the way for it to happen, yet Assop will vote for him again and continue is lib diatribes and rants….
This is all PR from Deal. Nothing less, nothing more.
If it wasn’t coming, he could say no, but he won’t do it because he is going to push for it behind the scenes while he sells his sheepish voters how he is weighing out all options, yada, yada, yada
123
January 12th, 2013
9:30 pm
Was the great Ronnie Raygun already having mental problems when he referred to the US as a democracy?
He did it numerous times.
Robert
January 12th, 2013
9:31 pm
AquaGirl,
Have you been to Alpharetta i the past two decades? It has a population of over 50,000, four GA-400 exits, and it’s still in Fulton County. It’s not the “edge” of the metro area. Forsyth County has over 175,000 residents above Fulton.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
January 12th, 2013
9:32 pm
Blah, blah, blah -
The government of the United States of America is the federal government of the constitutional republic of fifty states that constitute the United States, as well as one capitol district, and several other territories. The federal government is composed of three distinct branches: legislative, executive and judicial, which powers are vested by the U.S. Constitution in the Congress, the President, and the federal courts, including the Supreme Court, respectively; the powers and duties of these branches are further defined by acts of Congress, including the creation of executive departments and courts inferior to the Supreme Court.