Watching the Falcons stadium debate, the Braves pursue something different
The Atlanta Braves would like to see this sprawl of parking lots north of Turner Field become a mixed-use neighborhood on par with Atlantic Station. Hyosub Shin, hshin@ajc.com
For the much-needed attention she paid to the city’s infrastructure, Shirley Franklin became known as Atlanta’s sewer mayor.
Kasim Reed may have something flashier in mind as a legacy. If things go his way, by the time he’s finished, Reed may be known as the stadium mayor.
You already know that Reed is a major force behind Arthur Blank’s effort to build a new, $1 billion-plus home for his Atlanta Falcons. The Georgia World Congress Center Authority would hold the title. A state-approved hotel-motel tax would pay for at least $300 million of the structure – perhaps more, if the Legislature and governor can be persuaded.
This winter, the Falcons project could require the mayor of Atlanta, a former state senator, to return as a full-time resident of the Capitol. While he’s there, Reed may also give some attention to yet another stadium deal in the works.
This one is so fresh that it’s not out of diapers and thus has no dollar figure attached. Conceivably, it could have more of an economic impact on downtown Atlanta than replacing the 20-year-old Georgia Dome, without the taxpayer heartburn.
Through the city’s development authority, Invest Atlanta, Reed is attempting to put together a private-public partnership to develop the vast, vacant stretch between the state Capitol and Turner Field into a live-work-play area on par with Atlantic Station.
Substantive talks are underway, with the 2016 expiration of the Atlanta Braves’ lease on Turner Field in mind. The Braves have never been entirely happy there.
“As we sit here in 2012, this isn’t where we would have this stadium today,” began Mike Plant, the Braves’ executive vice president of business operations. “I’m not saying it’s a bad place, but it doesn’t match up with where the majority of our fans come from.”
Historians will remember that, ‘way back in ’88, the Braves gave some thought to a new stadium in Gwinnett County – for the major league team, not its AAA club.
A converted 1996 Olympic stadium kept the team downtown – where they are likely to remain, given the current climate. “The appetite for taxpayer-funded stadiums is not – in 2012 – probably too high,” Plant said.
In other words, as with tens of thousands of homeowners in metro Atlanta, circumstances have locked the Braves into place. Which leaves the baseball team and its owners no choice but to build a better neighborhood.
“Now we have to create an environment like San Diego, Denver, Cincinnati, Colorado,” Plant said. “They’ve taken challenged areas and used sports arenas for really improving, stimulating some real solid development.”
Plant said the team first approached the mayor of Atlanta two years ago. In August, the city’s development authority sought to take the temperature of real estate investors. A half-dozen have responded.
The Braves envision a partnership that includes themselves, the city, a number of private investors, and the Atlanta-Fulton County Recreation Authority, which owns Turner Field and the 55 vacant acres now devoted to parking – and nothing else.
External features would include residential and retail properties and perhaps even a people-mover to help fans to the MARTA rail line that’s eight-tenths of a mile away. The Braves intend to use cash earned from their investment in the neighborhood to pay for improvements within Turner Field.
“See all those blue seats out there?” said Plant, pointing out of his stadium office window to 55,000 posterior-placement platforms. “That’s a potential $15 million project. We break about 500 of them a year now. They’re rated for 15 years, and we’re going to make it to 20.”
The seats are made in Australia, the remnant of an Olympic trade deal. “We’ve got to replace every seat in this place,” he said.
Brian McGowan, president and CEO of Invest Atlanta, is the shepherd of the Turner Field project. He, too, is highly cognizant of the political climate. The area is a TAD – a tax allocation district. But McGowan said any expenditure of public money would be incidental.
That’s why real estate firms have been sounded out on the project. “We wanted to ‘ping’ the private sector to see how they felt about this. The government can have the grandest of plans for things like this, but if it doesn’t stand the private sector, private capital test, then it’s not going to work,” McGowan said.
(James Hughes Jr., an Emory law professor and chairman of the recreation authority, also said it was unlikely that his board’s bonding capacity would be tapped.)
Unlike the Falcons deal, a public-private partnership to develop the Turner Field project shouldn’t require a great deal of involvement from the occupants of the state Capitol, McGowan said.
But there may be one fly in that ointment. When the Legislature convenes in January, Republican lawmakers will begin their efforts to reduce Fulton County government to a mere shell. Turner Field, owned by the city-county recreation authority, could find itself involved in a tug-of-war. That’s not a welcome thought for the Braves.
“I’m going to rely on the fact that people on both sides of the aisle recognize the importance of this team not just because of what we do on the field, but because of our economic numbers as well,” said the Braves’ Plant. “We’re a viable business that drives a lot of activity and a lot of revenue.”
That number, he underlined, is $104 million a year. And could be much more.
Postscript:There are those of you out there who will note that the Atlanta-Fulton County Recreation Authority doesn’t seem to be at the center of these talks. One word explains that: Fanplex.
- By Jim Galloway, Political Insider
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171 comments Add your comment
755
November 14th, 2012
10:01 pm
SOUNDS LIKE WHITE FOLKS AFRAID TO BE AROUND BLACK FOLKS. GO OBAMA
Put_It_In Cobb
November 14th, 2012
10:01 pm
Put it in Cobb County some where between all of KSU’s growth this is the county area where things are moving, If you put it where the fans live maybe you’ll get good weeknight attendance instead of downtown where no one lives and no one wants to be at night.
JD
November 14th, 2012
10:02 pm
South of Atlanta!
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
10:02 pm
Atlanta is stupid – stop with the stupid new stadiums! I don’t want a Super Bowl here and will not go. The dumb stadiums should never have been built downtown- all the paying fans are up North. But everyone was screaming racism – keep them downtown where we can employ ‘our people’. Well, this is Atlanta, the politicians got what they asked for – now use the stupid stadiums we’ve got and shut up already!!!
patman
November 14th, 2012
10:12 pm
doraville’s abandoned gm plant problem solved
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
10:12 pm
Now – you want to talk about our stupid airport? Exact same problem and exact same racism claims keep us from building a second one up North where most of the travelers come from daily. It’s never going to change, stop the whining, this is Atlanta and this is the way it will always be with our mayors and city politicians. We might as well put Marion Berry in charge or Ray Negin – it’s a chocolate city – deal with it. Take MARTA – it’s smarter – hah, bring your gun.
BigGTMike
November 14th, 2012
10:14 pm
It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with travel logistics.
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
10:15 pm
Arthur Blank, if you want a new stadium, build it with your own money. If you don’t like it, move your stinkin’ team to LA!
Old Atlantan
November 14th, 2012
10:17 pm
Surprised the Gulch was not mentioned in this nonsense
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
10:18 pm
BigMike – this ain’t a UPS commercial
sldkfjslk
November 14th, 2012
10:19 pm
I live in Northeast Dekalb and it takes a mere 25 minutes to get home from the parking lot at most. If y’all made the choice to move to north bumble@#$% then that’s on you. Turner field is easy to get to and from. It’s our lame “fans” who complain about everything and never show up that’s the problem.
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
10:20 pm
I think the Gulch is one of the safest, friendliest tailgating areas I know – just short of Harlem.
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
10:22 pm
Sldk – that’s the spirit – be happy with what we’ve got. She may not be pretty but she’s mine.
Southern Boy
November 14th, 2012
10:24 pm
They don’t need a new stadium. They just need to raze a few of the buildings along Georgia Avenue, and get a Marta extension built, and all will be well.
bigdawgga111
November 14th, 2012
10:24 pm
first of all im from south ga,ive traveld four hrs to see the braves 6 times in the last 6 yrs,i will continue to go once a yr. but i dont think anyone can honestly argue that the area surrounding the stadium isant a DUMP!!!!!!!!!!!!!! white,black, its a sess-pool, and to be clear there are sess-pools for neighborhoods with white people living in them as well. if you truly love the team you want them to be in the best location possible to generate revenue so that the team can spend more money to put a winning product on the field. there is no question there needs to either be development or relocation in this situation.but my solution is to sell the braves to marc cuban and let him build a jerry jones palace for the braves wherever he wants as long as its in ga.as far as the falcons and taxpayer dollars,the ga govt is gonna spend the money either way,and for you people who say we have enough problems already we shouldnt be spending money on a stadium,you act like the money is gonna find its way tou you somehow,you elected them now let them spend it.
bigdawgga111
November 14th, 2012
10:28 pm
and tree rollins, you should take the gun you travel with on marta and shoot yourself in the face,
you sound like an idiot.
gy6
November 14th, 2012
10:30 pm
or, you could improve the baseball for the same money. Typical dem shuck and jive.
Hi Angus
November 14th, 2012
10:32 pm
Hi Angus- Jim here. Ready to tee it up next week in the Candler Turkey Day Classic?
Katie
November 14th, 2012
10:35 pm
Move the stadium to the ‘burbs!? They are the ATLANTA Braves. Not the Marietta Braves, the Roswell Braves, or the Lawrenceville Braves. The stadium belongs in ATLANTA.
Najeh Davenpoop
November 14th, 2012
10:36 pm
The first ten comments are all you need to know about why moving the Braves to some suburb is foolish.
“Move the Braves Stadium to Cobb or at least north of the connector.”
“Move it up north to Alpharetta/Roswell.”
“On behalf of the citizens of Coweta County, we are inviting the Braves to move here.”
Guess what — if you move the stadium to any one of those suburbs, the commute to the game becomes longer for anyone living in any of the other suburbs.
As an example, where I used to live in Gwinnett, Turner Field is a shorter drive than any of those places. Turner is typically 25-30 minutes. Alpharetta is at least 30, and Cobb and Coweta are considerably longer.
Turner Field and every other business that wants to attract a lot of people is properly located within the city, or at least inside the perimeter. That is where you minimize the average commute for all the suburbanites and allow the residents of the city to make it to the game easily. Ask the Gwinnett Braves how their attendance is doing out in the boondocks.
I admit that Turner’s location within the city kinda sucks, but a redevelopment project in that sprawling parking area is a great idea and a much better use of tax dollars than a new Falcons stadium.
lbc
November 14th, 2012
10:38 pm
Since the Georgia Dome is 20 years old and obviously a piece of crap that needs to be replaced by the time it turns 25, doesn’t that mean that we need to start thinking about replacing Turner Field in about 10 years since it’s already 16 years old?
This con job that the NFL and the Falcons are pulling on this state is disgusting. And I’m a huge sports fan.
lbc
November 14th, 2012
10:42 pm
Remember, if a Marta extension was built to the stadium, the lawmakers wouldn’t continue to get the kickbacks from the parking revenue. That little deal would be off. Are you sure we want that?
kevinofconyers
November 14th, 2012
10:43 pm
Nicholas- if you think the Braves are profitable without us “suburbanites” you’re way off. I didn’t say move it to Rockdale- I said stay central to all of metro ATL. smh.
drew
November 14th, 2012
10:43 pm
Gone are the days of actually remaining in a stadium for years (Cubs, Red Sox)….I suggest all sports teams build their NEW AND IMPROVED stadiums out of Lego’s….when they get tired of it they can just build something new.
Delbert D.
November 14th, 2012
10:46 pm
With the advent of high definition, sports are better on TV. Another couple of decades, the players will be digital creations.
Angus
November 14th, 2012
10:52 pm
Hi Angus – I think you’re talking about a different Angus. I have played Candler quite a few times and I am playing an annual thing next weekend – but not at Candler.
Roger Goodell
November 14th, 2012
10:52 pm
Is it too soon to start brainstorming about replacing the replacement stadium? The replacement stadium will be obsolete by 2035 and I just want to get it on the radar.
Also, please don’t take away our league’s tax-exempt, non-profit status.
Angus
November 14th, 2012
10:54 pm
Back to the subject at hand: of those actually discussing the subject at hand, there seems to be a good majority that believe transit is the key – and I agree. I’m not sure how you sell that location without it.
Dr. Rounds
November 14th, 2012
11:16 pm
I go to Fenway Park 3-4 times per year, and Wrigley Field about every other year. Love going there. Get a hotel on the subway lines, they drop you off at the stadium and great neighborhoods to hang out in before and after the games. Never rent a car. Have no interest in driving to Turner Field nor taking MARTA and walking a mile crossing busy streets in 90 degree heat. Move the stadium into a better part of downtown/Midtown close to MARTA and I will start going to some games. I don’t like the idea of moving it into the suburbs like the Rangers stadium. All the great stadiums now are close or in downtown — San Francisco, Seattle, San Diego, Detroit, Chicago Cubs, Washington Nationals, Yankees, St. Louis, Arizona, and Colorado. Even Cleveland, Cincinnati, and Milwaukee aren’t bad.
Kris
November 14th, 2012
11:18 pm
Problem Solved…Atlanta keeps reed and shady.
Peacefully grant the City of Atlanta leave to withdraw from the State of Georgia and remain part of the United States
The City of Atlanta continues to suffer deprivations of economic, civil, religious, and political freedoms imposed upon it by Georgians (who are hostile to Atlanta).
In the event that Georgia is successful in its effort to secede from the Union, we the people of Atlanta wish to remain in the United States. We love our country. We are dedicated to it. And we are committed to preserving its rights and liberties in accordance with the original ideas and beliefs of our founding fathers.
We would also like to annex Athens, Georgia, Decatur, Georgia and the parts of Macon, Georgia made famous by the Allman Brothers.
Created: Nov 13, 2012
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
11:19 pm
We don’t need any new stadium – the ones we have are fine! We do need a new Braves and Hawks team – as in playa’s!
The Hammer
November 14th, 2012
11:22 pm
In order to make transit work, and I mean REALLY work, you have to eliminate transfers. People hate transfers. So, there would have to be a line that went from North Springs to Five Points (like there is now), with a turn to the east, through the Ga State station, then down south, on or under Capitol Ave/Hank Aaron Dr. That would require some major work, and is cost prohibitive. Quite frankly, there’s no real way to get transit to REALLY work. The next best alternatives are to either make people transfer to a streetcar at Five Points, and follow some route similar to the current bus shuttle, or, save a lot in construction costs, and make people transfer once at Five Points to go east to Ga State, then transfer again to go down Capitol Ave/Hank Aaron Dr. Compare this to the Red Line in Chicago, which has the Addison Street stop directly next to Wrigley Field. The equivalent in Atlanta would have been building the stadium directly adjacent to Lindbergh Center station, which would have been a great idea.
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
11:23 pm
Kris, I grant you the rights to the City of Atlanta and the buffoons that have run it for years. You can keep the assets there and we’ll build a moat around it to keep you in and us out.
Kris
November 14th, 2012
11:26 pm
Tree….No thanks…
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
11:28 pm
Hey Hammer, and if there was a Cheetah on the moon, we’d all go there together and have drinks!
The fact is we have stadiums now – if teams are compelling, we’ll go there to watch them regardless of the stinky location our politicians chose – and vice versa.
Mike Lum
November 14th, 2012
11:31 pm
Hey tmc: the product inside Turner Field won 94 games this season…one of the best records in baseball. They did it with a payroll half that of several teams, like the last-place Phillies or the choking Yankees. The Braves had another great season despite having to totally rework thier starting rotation due to injury and ineffectiveness.
Now the Braves are proposing solutions to the delapidated neighborhood they’ve been forced to play in, and are willing to pony up a good chunk of the resources…instead of leaving for greener pastures. And this is on top of the several inner city baseball leagues they’ve been funding for years. Sounds like the Braves are better Atlanta citizens than most.
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
11:37 pm
The Braves fans showed their appreciation for this ‘great’ Braves team with their bottles and glasses during the playoff game – that was their ‘toast’ to the great teams of the last few years. And if we’re so poor, why do we waste $12M on Brian McCann when we’re not sure if he can even play any more?? That’s your geniuses at work – and meanwhile we need a new stadium so the fans will go to the games – jeesh!
Jason in Gainesville
November 14th, 2012
11:38 pm
How come teams used to play baseball in their stadiums for a hundred years, now we feel compelled to build and tear down stadiums every 20 years?
claudell washington
November 14th, 2012
11:39 pm
Baseball sucks!!…let em move back to Milwaukee
bob
November 14th, 2012
11:43 pm
Yeah, didnt shirley franklin spend over $3 million of tax money on this crap? With the same result, local crackheads infesting the area and bums sleeping nearby?
You want to fix the area do what rudy did in times square, deploy hundreds of police down there to make life uncomfortable for the unsavory elements of life.
Tree Rollins
November 14th, 2012
11:45 pm
Bring back the Monster Trucks and the mountains of mud. Tear down useless MARTA and stop wasting money on it. Get rid of the overpaid and whiney players! And have police escorts walk us to our cars in these nasty stadium areas after the games. And quit selling rot-gut Bud everywhere and bring in some good beer. And ther’s my Gran Torino view of this Atlanta stadium situation!
Kujohn
November 14th, 2012
11:56 pm
Poor TD I think he is up set Mittens lost The election Looks like the moochers won over the redneck Bigots
I wonder if we will ever have an old white republican president again
Prob not. Hahahaha Old white bigots like TD (the new minority)
Kujohn
November 15th, 2012
12:17 am
Enter your comments
Hey TD
How bout all those moochers up north askin for federal money due to super storm Sandy
Why don’t they just suck it up And pull themselves up by their boot straps
Like you would do
People like you make me sick
tmc
November 15th, 2012
12:21 am
Hey Mike Lum-
How many playoff wins has this great team won the last few years? While you’re raggin on the Yankees (and I’m not a NYC fan) just ask yourself that.
And’ while the Braves continue to NOT spend money on a good bench or an additional bat or a catcher who actually produces… Their talking about spending money on the surrounding area for the fan experience?
How bout signing your best player to a long term contract? (Fans have been screaming to reward Prado for a couple years). How bout signing players on the bench who might actually contribute in a crucial situation?
I am a braves fan, but I’m sick and tired of being out spent by the likes of Minnesota, Milwaukee, St. Louis… and being to by the management that we are a “mid-market” team. And then read in the paper that they want to spend money and resources (another word for money) on the area surrounding the stadium.
Sorry, that just pisses me off.
John
November 15th, 2012
12:28 am
Stadium is in a crappy area. I don’t see any way to improve it. Access is terrible. The hood surrounding it is dangerous and unappealing. No train service to it. Why in the world would anyone go down there even if they built bars and restaurants?
Angry Baboon
November 15th, 2012
2:49 am
every person who defends the ghetto types who plague area’s near and around stadiums obviously don’t go to many games. i remember the thrashers and philip’s area..what a great place to see a hockey game..when you walk to your car the packs of “ghetto types” ask you for money and a ride, i had a dude in wheelchair ask me for money while i noticed he had on brand new nike’s. it was lots of fun.
chris
November 15th, 2012
2:51 am
needs to be by Marta rail transit station
Don
November 15th, 2012
3:43 am
The comments on this blog doesn’t surprise. 90% of all comments here are racially
tinged….absolutely pathetic!. I guess if you add a 1/2 wit white person with a 1/2 wit
black person you could equate that with 1 full fledged Atlanta idiot!
It doesn’t matter where you put a stadium because Atlanta will NEVER win Championships
with all the negative energy slung around at each other. If this is the city attitude we don’t
deserve one..
However, if a decision on a stadium is made it should be based on central access where people from north,east, south and west can converge on mass transit. That should be your starting point..
…..
Mr Greenjeans
November 15th, 2012
3:45 am
I am tired of local politicos/weasel barons robbing the people blind. There outta be a twenty year mandatory prison sentence on crooks like this!
HootyGoot
November 15th, 2012
5:00 am
Angus@ 8:10 PM — Not trying to argue, but would really like to know what the homes around the Zoo area would be worth minus property value?