Southern Baptist leader: Jesus wouldn’t like health care panels
On C-SPAN this morning, Richard Land, president of that arm of the Southern Baptist Convention that concerns itself with national issue, was asked by a caller to justify his opposition to President Barack Obama’s health care overhaul.
Said Land:
”I don’t think Jesus would support the rationing panels that are in place for Obamacare. I’m getting letters every day – every day – from people who are already being rationed care since the new head of Medicare came in. They’re being told if they have terminal conditions, they can’t get treatment for other diseases.
“Even Mr. Obama said that perhaps it wasn’t the best allocation of resources to give his grandmother, who was dying of cancer, a hip replacement. So I guess she can hobble around in terrible pain with a bad hip while she was dying of cancer. I don’t think that’s very Christian, ma’am.”
The president’s grandmother, Madelyn Dunham, died of cancer at age 86 in 2008, two days before her grandson’s election victory. Following her diagnosis, she had a hip replaced. Months later, in a New York Times magazine article, Obama wondered out loud whether high-cost operations for the terminally ill could be justified as “sustainable” public policy:
”I don’t know how much that hip replacement cost. I would have paid out of pocket for that hip replacement just because she’s my grandmother. Whether, sort of in the aggregate, society making those decisions to give my grandmother, or everybody else’s aging grandparents or parents, a hip replacement when they’re terminally ill is a sustainable model, is a very difficult question. If somebody told me that my grandmother couldn’t have a hip replacement and she had to lie there in misery in the waning days of her life — that would be pretty upsetting.”
The problem, the president continued, is that not everyone can pay for a hip replacement out-of-pocket:
“… So that’s where I think you just get into some very difficult moral issues. But that’s also a huge driver of cost, right?
“I mean, the chronically ill and those toward the end of their lives are accounting for potentially 80 percent of the total health care bill out here.”
***
On the same topic, Attorney General Sam Olens said Monday that Republicans need to have their ducks in a row if and when the U.S. Supreme Court issues its ruling on the new health care law. From the Augusta Chronicle:
“Let’s assume we win the case. The Republican Party better have a bill that’s immediately filed to improve health care in this country or it will be detrimental in the November election.”
***
The Athens Banner-Herald reports that prominent Democrats, including Mayor Nancy Denson, are funneling money to Regina Quick, who’s mounting a GOP primary challenge to state Rep. Doug McKillip.
McKillip, a former Democrat, sponsored this year’s aggressive anti-abortion bill, which shortens the period during which a woman can seek to end her pregnancy. From the newspaper:
Denson gave Quick $500 on Feb. 22, according a campaign finance disclosure filed last week with the Georgia Government Transparency and Campaign Finance Commission….
McKillip angered Democrats by switching parties in 2010 and other elected officials by pushing a controversial Athens-Clarke Commission redistricting plan.Republican former mayor and Athens Area Chamber of Commerce President Doc Eldridge, who has publicly feuded with McKillip over redistricting, and Democratic former state Sen. Doug Haines also contributed to Quick’s campaign, as did a number of her fellow lawyers and some Republican activists.
During the same C-SPAN session, Land also suggested that likely GOP presidential nominee Mitt Romney could name U.S. Sen. Marco Rubio as his running mate, as a means of “pivoting” on the illegal immigration issue — and proposing a comprehensive reform package.
***
The New York Times this morning dissects the false Internet rumor about an indictment that, 10 days ago, sent South Carolina’s governor scrambling:
It took only two minutes. An unfounded report on a little-known blog claiming that Gov. Nikki R. Haley was about to be indicted rocketed from South Carolina political circles into national circulation, along the way becoming the latest lesson in the perils of an instantaneous news culture.
The item’s rapid journey from hearsay to mainstream journalism, largely via Twitter, forced Ms. Haley to rush to defend herself against a false rumor. And it left news organizations facing a new round of questions about accountability and standards in the fast and loose “retweets do not imply endorsement” ethos of today’s political journalism.
***
The AJC’s Politifact Georgia this morning takes a look at state Agriculture Commissioner Gary Black’s defense of “lean, finely textured beef” – pejoratively known as “pink slime.”
- By Jim Galloway, Political Insider
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172 comments Add your comment
Bernie
April 10th, 2012
12:30 pm
Jesus would say to the Southern Baptist Leader ” I Never knew YOU”. So how could you possibly know or even possibly quote me on ANY Subject!
td
April 10th, 2012
12:35 pm
Attention: Georgia has grown 6 million people in forty years! Where is everybody coming from? Majority republican districts up north! There is a great deal of greatness up north (Hence, New York City)!!! It is a whole different world! Needless to say many northerners are not familiar with the culture of the South. They are good people who vote republican! The following link is the reason why everybody came down here! Spread the good word!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNMjiELp47E
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
12:36 pm
@Tax Payer – Sooner or later, there will be a new constitutional convention in this country, and when there is, I intend to do everything in my power to help create a hard resistant block, like slavery was for the South, that will insist that they will only support ratification if all of the Libertarian dirt (replace that with something the filter won’t accept) bags and Republican demons get an extra 10% taxes, written into the constitution.
honested
April 10th, 2012
12:36 pm
tax payer,
So what is the ‘Oil Depletion Allowance’ for?
td
April 10th, 2012
12:37 pm
I see the vile religious hating left is out in full force today. It is a good thing that your kind represents less then 10% of this nation because it means your opinions do not count and are meaningless. I will say a special prayer that God will convict your souls to come and find out Lord and Savior.
Becky
April 10th, 2012
12:38 pm
The good news is the republican party now consists of old white men. 50 and up, they won’t live forever and with some luck will die with their mistresses using viagra.
The ultimate way to go!
honested
April 10th, 2012
12:39 pm
Bernie,
It the whole jeebus thing was real, it would be nice if he followed up his speech to land with a little marionette dance over an open fire.
Bernie
April 10th, 2012
12:39 pm
I wonder what Jesus would say about Southern Baptists and their flock supporting A Mormon clergyman like Mitt Romney for President over a true Christian? Would he not say, “I have given you a true christian as a leader, why would you go and follow in the ways of a FALSE TEACHER?
Becky
April 10th, 2012
12:39 pm
td-SHE and I were talking just this morning and funny thing-your name never came up.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
12:39 pm
@TD2 @TD1 – Good! We won’t let them back in when Georgia secedes. And look at how awesome the legislature is today!
At some point, 40 years ago, maybe they did get some sense…and held it for about 20 years, then the dixie crats followed by the Republicans became just plain stupid and incapable of doing anything…so all the gains from the 80’s and 90’s are falling apart.
Hooray! Let it rot I say.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
12:40 pm
@TD1 – I don’t hate religion. I just hate demons.
Demons in Christian suits.
Dan the man
April 10th, 2012
12:40 pm
td
April 10th, 2012
12:35 pm
Td, I wonder why those Tom Murphy videos do not have a higher view count! He is a legend!!!
Is It Fair?
April 10th, 2012
12:41 pm
In today’s edition of The Wall Street Journal, the editorial page contained a lead opinion entitled, “Obama’s Revenue Soup.” In the article it noted: “As President Obama told Charlie Gibson of ABC News in 2008 (04/16/2008), whether or not a higher capital-gains tax raises more revenue is irrelevant to him. He wants a higher rate as a matter of ‘fairness.’” (*)
Check it out for yourself:
http://www.taxfoundation.org/blog/show/23137.html
(The actual video for this session with Charlie has been “temporarily removed”…(???hmmmm, I wonder why?)
(*) For the uninitiated, “fairness” has morphed into the 2012 American lexicon as a euphemism for “redistribution of wealth, ala Barack Hussein Obama.”
Bernie
April 10th, 2012
12:42 pm
honested @ 12:39 pm – Not to worry my friend the fire is already warming up for you, watching you dance will be truly an eye opener for you.
honested
April 10th, 2012
12:42 pm
td,
When you are going through your daily ritual of talking to yourself, please don’t waste your breath bringing my name up.
td
April 10th, 2012
12:44 pm
Dan the man
April 10th, 2012
12:40 pm
Dan the man! Greetings my friend! Those videos were posted to youtube recently by the University of West Georgia. They also do not show up when you type his name. Instead, one gets redirected to a musician’s homepage. Try typing in Tom Murphy and Georgia. I am hoping we can make Georgia a prosperous and healthy community again with the help of the more affluent northerners that have moved down here. Every walk of life must participate in politics so that society can achieve its goals!!
GaBlue
April 10th, 2012
12:45 pm
Hypocrisy is a two way street
April 10th, 2012
12:13 pm
All these folks on thisw blog criticizing Preacher Richard Landfor telling what he thinks Jesus’ attitude would be on rationing health care and then giving their own opinions about what position Jesus would take? What a bunch of hypocrites!
*********************
I don’t accept money for my opinions on what Jesus would think, nor do I collect money for a tax-exempt organization by doing so. Pastor Land sets himself as some sort of authority (isn’t that SPECIAL….), and in so doing, invites criticism. On the other hand, I actually work for a living, pay taxes, and say what I want — without imagining that anyone gives a rat’s patootie what that opinion entails.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
12:45 pm
@Bernie – He’d probably say “D’MaA B’G,iHaNoA, AeNaA K’aD’uO AeSHaD’aR OMaLaAK,eA Sherman D’MaKHaM D’SHiAD,aA?!?! OaED,aK’iYL LK,aA?!?”
honested
April 10th, 2012
12:45 pm
is it fair,
Yes I do wish the President had been quicker on his feet and said “Now Charlie, you know that entire line of BS about reducing rates increases revenues is a full out lie and I won’t even acknowledge it.”
Gibson would have been left speechless and the President would have had a pre-canned video talking point forever.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
12:47 pm
@IsItFair – Well the alternative is just selling you and those like you into slavery since you think taxation is theft.
With the wonders of modern technology, cybernetically installed cortex bombs would be installed in the skulls of all Republicans, causing their heads to actually explode as soon as they mention certain words, like “Patriotism” “I am not a hypocrite”, “Tax is theft”.
They would still have free speech, but the rest of us would have Free Silence finally.
How’s that for framing?
Dear God
April 10th, 2012
12:49 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swy_BXFbnpo&feature=relmfu
Td, I found this one to be the most fascinating!
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
12:53 pm
How do you know a Republican is Demonically possessed?
Their lips move.
Bernie
April 10th, 2012
12:56 pm
Jesus would probably respond to Mr Land with ” Where is your PLAN for Healthcare of the children,the old, the poor and the infirmed? You embark on saying many things attributed to me, but yet you and your followers are not walking in the path that you preach and claim so self righteously. You Sir, and your flock have choosen to support a EXTREMELY Wealthy False Teacher over my SON as your Leader.
“I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.” – Matt
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
12:58 pm
@Bernie – Good one! Better than mine actually.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:07 pm
@TD1 – Oh and 10% of America is Atheist, but only 30% are Demonic Christian. That’s a 2 to 1 ratio for the mob and pitch forks once the ‘moderates’ wake up and realize that the Republicans cannot be reasoned with, cannot be compromised, and Will. Not. Stop. until all of us are serfs or dead.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:09 pm
Wasn’t it a third part that was cast out of the host of heaven?
What was the lowest percentage that supported Bush the Torturer?
Hmmm….about…1/3rd….
td
April 10th, 2012
1:10 pm
Becky
April 10th, 2012
12:38 pm
The even better news is while you 20 something continues to grow, get good jobs and have families will become more conservative as they grow older. If you knew anything about history then you would know that most of those peace niks and anti war protesters of the 60’s grew up and now most of them are voting for GWB, McCain and will be voting for Romney. It is only the real loons that never made a life for themselves or the ones that got rich, without God and are trying to save themselves, are the senior leftest today.
Bernie
April 10th, 2012
1:12 pm
“The Southern Baptist Convention is expected to increase the $7.3 billion fund’s asset base (Pensions & Investments magazine ranks it as one of the nation’s 125 largest relglious organizations.”
I am sure Jesus would not be talking or sharing anything with any Leader that have amassed so much money and wealth, while so many Women and children and the poor suffer like they do in the world.
Maybe, RICHARD LAND was a bit confused and was quoting his many conversations with THE FATHER OF LIES.
td
April 10th, 2012
1:14 pm
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:07 pm
You must be one of those young ones also. Idealism is great when you are young but one day you will come to realize that you can not save the world. When you have children you will realize what it takes to raise a family and you will want to leave them in a better place and realize all the harms of society and you too will become a conservative.
honested
April 10th, 2012
1:16 pm
td,
Your narrow minded homilies are guaranteed to provide a laugh!
Especially for those of us who never gave up, as you appear to have gracelessly done.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:32 pm
@TD1 – I don’t reveal personal details about my identity to demons. That’s as stupid as leaving a lock of your hair or some of your skin near a voodoo caster.
But I will say this. I *WAS* conservative. I looked around and saw the hypocrisy and was literally left for dead. I understand that you can’t reason with conservatives, because they believe they are right.
You can’t reform them, because they are always martyrs in their own mind.
The world will be a better place when, and only when, no one is allowed to deny reality in their ideology, which means that no one is allowed to use their wealth to blind the masses, no one is allowed to lie and get away with it, no one is allowed to claim that society benefits from tax exempt status from organizations that do the work of evil, and no one is allowed to claim that their ancestors weren’t slaving monsters instead of ‘economic victims of the war of northern agression.”
In short, when every southerner who thinks that the confederacy was ‘cool’ and likes to put the stars and bars on their car, or skin or any other such thing is prevented from reproducing.
Given that we’ve had to put up with you constantly threatening the country for more than 200 years, I’m not holding my breath on that happening any time soon.
td
April 10th, 2012
1:32 pm
honested
April 10th, 2012
1:16 pm
Not giving up but coming to the realization that some people do are not willing or refuse to take responsibility for their own actions. Kind of like dealing with a drug addict. Until the person hits rock bottom and takes responsibility for their actions then you are wasting you time begging them to change.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:33 pm
(and no, I don’t believe in voodoo, unless holding up a mirror in the face of a faithless demonic christian will make them scream and run away….and believe me, I’ve seen it. They think you’re casting a spell on them. Its hilarious. So much for their ‘faith’ in God.)
Centrist
April 10th, 2012
1:36 pm
@ Is It Fair?
We have a sharply progressive income tax system – except when it comes to capital gains. For taxpayers making over a million a year, most of their incomes are not wages, but capital gains. They pay at a LOWER rate than the little people. As an example, corporate executives get qualified stock options (and often have the strike prices lowered to keep them in the money) which are taxed at the much lower capital gains rates.
No this is NOT “fair”. The wealthy (including every U.S. Senator) have purposely given/taken campaign contributions to continue this egregious scheme to “legally” avoid paying at the same marginal tax rates as say a doctor married to an accountant.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:38 pm
@TD1 – Talk of ‘responsibility for their own actions’ is amusing coming from Demons. I think they honestly think they champion self reliance, much like they champion christianity, charity, honesty, decency.
Everyone else, even ‘moderates’ can see them for what they really are of course. If Republicans really cared about self reliance, they would purge their party of law breakers, adulterers, thieves and ghouls.
Why, I remember Christ himself saying, “Blessed are the self reliant, for they shall get there’s and the poor, meek, hungry and humble ain’t gettin nothin.”
Oh wait, that’s the SATANIC bible. Hmm…..
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:39 pm
@Not Centrist – Correct.
Big Hat
April 10th, 2012
1:41 pm
Rich folks get all the health care they want, poor people get sick and die. What’s wrong with that? That’s the way it’s always been because that’s the way it should be.
When Jesus returns, he will become President and CEO of HCA, merge it with HealthSouth, UnitedHealth Group, WellPoint, Kaiser, Aetna, Humana, Cigna, Coventry and BC/BS to make sure that only corporations get healthcare, because corporations are the same as people and have more money.
Remember, when death panels are outlawed, only outlaws will have death panels.
Bernie
April 10th, 2012
1:41 pm
If I were a member of the Southern Baptist Convention, I would be on bended knee this very moment praying for forgiveness for such Blaspheny being spoken by such an arrgorant MAN leading so many without any Faith or direction.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:43 pm
McCarthy had the right idea. I used to hate him but I think we need to revive HUAAC.
“Are you or have you ever been a member of the Republican, Libertarian or Tea Party? Do you know others who have been? Name names!”
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:44 pm
How’s that framin goin ‘moderates’?
Two can play the crazy game. You just don’t recognize it any more because one side are servants of satan and the other side is Barney Fife.
td
April 10th, 2012
1:47 pm
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:32 pm
So in your mind it is evil to want people to take responsibility for their own actions? You think it is good and caring to enable people to continue a cycle of self destruction by not getting an education, by producing children when they can not take care of them and by not willing to do the necessary work to get ahead?
Have you ever been in a DFCS office and looked into the eyes of a generational welfare recipient? I worked in a DFCS office many years ago and to see the hopelessness in the eyes of generational welfare recipient would make you stomach turn. This is pure evil. It literally drives the life out of good people and turns them into slaves of the government. Have you ever looked in the eyes of a child whose parent in a drug addict and has been deprived of the care they deserve? If you have not experienced this then you my friend do not know what you are talking about and your eyes are still shut.
Please go ahead and tell me some more BS about how more government programs are the answer.
Last Lawyer Standing
April 10th, 2012
1:47 pm
As a well past middle-aged Republican, a conserative and a lawyer defending health care providers when sued, I have seen first hand how the unrealistic expectations of families in keeping a dying or brain dead relative alive contributes to the wasting of limited resources. A single relative who is unwilling to remove their brain dead 85 year old mother from life support for more than a year cost all of us over $1 million. Finally, God called her home, her unconscious suffering ended and the family’s guilt was assauged. This is one example of hundreds that one lawyer can cite where hundreds of thousands of dollars were spent for care that was obviously useless and actually cruel to the objective observer.
I do not know what the solution is, but if society wishes to continue to provide major medical treatment for people who have no quality of life, or no brain function just because one individual has the power to use these limited resources for their selfish feelings, then we must all must be willing to sacrifice greatly for the the right of the indvidual to make that choice. A choice easily made by the individual who has to pay nothing, as Medicare and Medicad will pay. Hospitals and other providers have to write-off what is not paid and it almost never costs the family a single dime. Perhaps making individuals and families financially responsible for such expenditures would be a good change in public policy. Individual financial responsibility for individual decisions. Of course it will never happen where the biggest entitlement generation is concerned.
td
April 10th, 2012
1:51 pm
Centrist
April 10th, 2012
1:36 pm
Is it not true that most of the money put into investments (that are taxed at 15%) where at one time taxed at a higher rate when it was earned for working?
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:51 pm
@TD1 – No, it is evil to throw a four year old out into the dead of winter and say, “Catch yourself a bear and make a shelter kid.”
Welfare queens are only a legend in your own mind.
Privatizing schools to corporations and the Religion industry (as compared to actual religion) will only create a cycle of ignorance that created you.
I find the number of jobs you’ve done rather large and vast TD. What’s the matter, can’t hold a job?
Government programs are the answer when they’re not neutered by senators from the south. The stimulus didn’t work because of forced compromise, with the south. Social security has problems, because of compromises needed with senators…from the south.
The ACA is insurance garbage instead of single payer…because of senators from the south.
Government programs work in every developed country in the world, especially europe. Yeah, I know you’ll say, “look at their debt programs” to which I reply they were victims of American sabotage from Goldman Sachs and the like…able to do whatever they want in this country thanks to deregulation demanded….BY THE SOUTH.
Aaron Burr V Mexico
April 10th, 2012
1:53 pm
@Last Lawyer Standing – It isn’t entitlements. Its earned benefits.
The individual should indeed have a choice, but that also means a choice of living or dying, and also the choice to work where they want, not live in economic serfdom to ‘rich’ people who break the law or get wealth to which they have not earned.
Bernie
April 10th, 2012
2:02 pm
Surely JESUS would say to Richard Land and his Covention church members, are you willing to give up your 7.3 BILLION U.S. DOLLARS in assets and investments, give it to the poor and needy and come follow me?
After Fits of LAUGHTER and a lot of heming and hawing, we know what that answer will be…..”Are you KIDDING ME?” how am I to get paid? would be his response surely.
As for the members, they will follow him blindly to to depths of PIT, as their leaders have chosen for them so faithfully. Jesus in turn, will say to them all. ” I never knew you”.
Tom
April 10th, 2012
2:02 pm
Jesus would be ticked that he couldn’t get ChickFilA on Sunday.
Aquagirl
April 10th, 2012
2:03 pm
It isn’t entitlements. Its earned benefits.
Call them whatever you want, but if you pay $100,000 in medicare taxes and then consume $1 million worth of care, something’s gotta give.
honested
April 10th, 2012
2:04 pm
last lawyer,…….
We have a point of agreement.
Now how much does it cost to:
Charge everyone to repeatedly repair the damage done by addiction to one sport or another (skiing, running, tennis, football, baseball etc.)?
Charge everyone for the repeated use of emergency facilities for reviving the hopelessly addicted children of the wealthy?
Charge everyone for repairing the ravages of poor nutrition and excess consumption of products not properly defined as ‘food’ for humans.
These are also staggering costs.
Centrist
April 10th, 2012
2:06 pm
td posted “Centrist, is it not true that most of the money put into investments (that are taxed at 15%) where at one time taxed at a higher rate when it was earned for working?”
No. My example of senior management being “granted’ qualified stock options in lieu of salary to avoid income taxes in favor of lower capital gains shows it. It should not matter in future tax years if income is derived from salary or capital gains – it should be taxed at the appropriate INCOME tax rate – at least for millionaire/billionaires (Buffet rule).
The top .02% of incomes (300,000 Americans – one out of every 500 taxpayers) make more than a million a year. They are a fiercely protected class comprised of inherited wealth, successful entrepreneurial corporations, senior Fortune 500 management, Wall Street brokers, politicians, entertainment and sports stars who have set up trusts and corporations to take advantage of this huge loophole.