Southern Baptists, Obama and illegal immigration
A Customs and Border Patrol agent patrols along the international border in Nogales, Ariz. AP
For the next 13 days, all stops are off when it comes to debating the issue of illegal immigration.
The Obama administration’s court challenge to the Arizona law that gives its peace officers the authority to stop and impound undocumented residents is already serving as a stick to a wasp nest in Georgia’s race for governor.
Former congressman Nathan Deal’s first TV ad of the primary season on Wednesday focused on illegal immigration and a promise that Georgia would soon have an Arizona-style law.
On the answering machines of tens of thousands of GOP voters, former secretary of state Karen Handel left a message of endorsement from Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer. Expect to see Brewer at Handel’s side before the July 20 vote.
The climate doesn’t brook dissent. Democrats have been uniformly silent on the Arizona issue.
So it comes as something of a surprise to learn that one of the most prominent voices pushing a bipartisan deal on immigration — and urging more cautious rhetoric when discussing it — belongs to an institution of the solid Southern right.
Richard Land is president of the Southern Baptist Convention’s public policy arm, the Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission. It is through his Nashville offices that the nation’s largest Protestant denomination engages Washington on topics such as abortion and embryonic stem cell research. The SBC is against both.
But last week, when President Barack Obama gave his speech demanding action on immigration reform, Land was among those invited to sit in the audience. Because he had been among a group of conservative evangelical leaders who asked Obama to deliver it.
“I met with the president’s people about 10 days prior to that and urged them — for him to give a major speech on the issue,” Land said Sunday, after he’d delivered three sermons in Flowery Branch. “I said, ‘He needs to give a speech like the race speech he gave —which makes it clear that he understands both sides.’”
Afterwards, Land praised the president’s speech as a good start, likening it to an “initial proposal” of marriage.
“We need to call upon our congressmen and senators to behave like statesmen. Politicians think about the next election. Statesmen think about the next generation,” Land said.
And the Arizona law? “To me, it’s a symptom. It’s a cry for help from a state that feels the federal government has let it down and is not doing its job,” he said.
Land and his Baptist brethren were among those who supported the Ted Kennedy-John McCain compromise on immigration reform that exploded in 2007, damaging every Republican close to it — including U.S. Sens. Saxby Chambliss and Johnny Isakson.
Land’s position remains much the same. Among active Southern Baptists, he said, “there’s clearly a consensus behind comprehensive immigration reform that secures the border first — and then lays out a compassionate, just pathway to earning citizenship or legal status.”
Obtaining that legal status would take about 10 years. “That’s not amnesty. What Jimmy Carter gave those who avoided service during the Vietnam war — that’s amnesty,” Land said.
While on the stump, in search of applause, it has become common for politicians to boast that they would load every illegal immigrant onto a yellow bus pointed for the Mexican border.
Land says the forced deportation of millions of people crosses another border — one that separates the humane from the inhumane. The punishment doesn’t suit the crime.
“We bear some responsibility for the fact that we haven’t enforced our own laws for the last 24 years,” he said. “And we’ve had these two conflicting signs up at the border — ‘No trespassing’ and ‘Help wanted.’”
Neither Obama nor Land is likely to get his way. With November at stake, the prospect of Democrats and Republicans tackling anything as volatile as immigration reform is beyond the politics of the possible.
Yet Land and like-minded Southern Baptists are significant on two counts. First, they provide a moral measuring stick that is often missing in red-meat politics.
Southern Baptists have also, in the past, served as a harbinger of the Republican party’s future. The denomination’s purging of moderates in the ’80s and ’90s served as a warm-up for a similar fight for conservative purity in the GOP that continues today.
Land says he’s been told that the Southern Baptist position on immigration threatens to shatter the conservative coalition that powers the Republican party.
“It may split the old one,” Land said. “It won’t split new one. If the conservative coalition is going to be a governing coalition, it’s going to have to include a majority of Hispanics. And you don’t get a majority of Hispanics by engaging in anti-Hispanic immigration rhetoric.”
There’s also the bothersome matter of history. The public policy chief noted that Southern Baptists ignored interior voices who urged the denomination to support African-Americans and the Civil Rights movement in the 1960s.
Had Baptists listened, he said, “we wouldn’t have had to have gone back and apologize to them.
“And I don’t want to come back here 15 years from now and apologize to Hispanics. It’s a kingdom issue,” Land said.
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85 comments Add your comment
Yankee in Gooberville
July 7th, 2010
6:49 pm
Ugh, these Republicans are vile miserable creatures with poisoned black hearts aren’t they?
Deal, immigration law is exclusively the responsibility of the federal gov’t. Don’t like it? Try changing the constitution.
Just like all these miserable GOP’ers running for insurance commish, they have absolutely no ability to challenge or not implement the federal healthcare law. They *have* to do it or else GA will pay and pay dearly. But they’ll score their political points with their know-nothing base and hey, it’s not their money so why not?
And Land my boy, 15 years you’ll be apologizing to the gays and lesbians and then the hispanics. Count on it you soulless SOB. You wouldn’t know a christian tenant if it hit you in your fat head.
Debbie Ferris
July 7th, 2010
6:51 pm
To bad the native americans didn’t have the forsight to fight illegal immigration.
Bad Karma
July 7th, 2010
6:51 pm
So, what becomes of the individuals and companies that have encouraged illegal immigration into the US? That have promoted cheap labor and have been a factor in sending manufacturing overseas. Hey, I am all for stopping illegal immigration into the US, totally support Arizona in what they are doing, but we need to clean our side of the street too, to make this work.
Orange09
July 7th, 2010
6:57 pm
I just wish Georgia would grow a set and enact an Arizona type law which in reality is the same as the existing Federal law. The Feds have sat on their hands for years and have not enforced the existing law. If they had, maybe the US would not be in this mess. If they can’t come here legally, don’t come at all. The heck with comprehensive immigration. Enforcement only!
john
July 7th, 2010
7:03 pm
I don’t see anything wrong with Arizona trying to protect its people and interests. The federal goverment has taken the interests of the international community over ours for awhile. I hope the fed loses in its lawsuit. I also hope that the fed takes a stronger position with Israel. What benefit does Israel give to the United States? Answer is none. Israel needs to step up to the plate and justify what our tax dollars pay for over there.
Immigration Solution
July 7th, 2010
7:12 pm
I’ve got the perfect idea for immigration enforcement that should appease both sides and solve the problem with illegal immigration. However, since it is such common sense I know it will never be acted upon.
Fixing the immigration problem is quite simple. It draws on ideas on all sides of the immigration debate including guest workers, penalizing employers, securing the border, and outright stopping illegal immigration.
We determine the amount of “guest workers” that we feel the economy needs. I don’t care if this is one million, five million, ten million or more. After this number is determined, we forward applications to all of our diplomatic locations worldwide. To participate in the program, you are REQUIRED to apply in your home country, undergo a criminal history check, and pay an application fee to cover the costs of processing all the paperwork. Once you are approved, you may enter the United States and work for a set number of years. During this time, there will be an available path to citizenship. It will not be easy but you can become a citizen. If you fail to become a citizen after a set amount of time (maybe 10 years), you go back home to your country.
Once this guest worker program is in place, you announce that everyone has a set period of time to leave the country and apply. After that “amnesty” period, if you are caught in this country illegally, you will forever forfeit your right to citizenship and visas and be deported immediately. You also announce that after the amnesty period, companies employing illegal immigrants will be fined thousands of dollars per violation.
These procedures will encourage illegal immigrants to become legal. The process will pay for itself through the fees charged. More importantly, it is compassionate because it allows people to become legal. However, it also requires them to leave the country and do it legally. It also ensures that all workers will be paying income taxes, subject to healthcare provisions, and more importantly not being a drain on already finite resources.
I believe this is literally the perfect immigration plan that is fair to all and still compassionate for those who believe we should just overlook illegal immigration. Since there is an amnesty period, parents with citizen children could return to their home country one at a time and apply. Therefore, no families would be destroyed (a common argument against enforcement).
Andre
July 7th, 2010
7:24 pm
Debbie Ferris I so agree with you.
Charich1
July 7th, 2010
7:28 pm
Debbie Ferris you are so right.Maybe conservative have a fear of going the way of the Indian.There is so much hate and fear in that party.If it was up to conservatives women still could not vote and Jim Crow would be alive and well.
Mike
July 7th, 2010
7:32 pm
Arizona! Many states are waiting your legal outcome. If you can make the new law work watch other states jump on the band wagon. Our medical system, and well as many of our other social programs are for US citzens that pay state and federal taxes. Our schools don’t need to teach english as a “second” language – its the language of this country.
mike
July 7th, 2010
7:47 pm
Sort of sad to see a group of people who originally stole and murdered their way into this country (ask the Native Americans on the east coast and the Spanish on the west coast) become so angry at folks who were here in the first place. According to them all these people are drug dealers and etc. If you know your US History it is not hard to figure out how Arizona and the rest of this country got into the predicament it is presently in. And it was not done by those folks with the darker skin people. One perfect example of whom I am talking about would be those GOP men at last week’s Supreme Court nominee hearing. All those white haired men of the south made me feel like I was watching a very bad time in this nation’s history except they are here in the present. What’s really sad is these morons feel they are expressing the true American way when they wake up each morning. God please help this country!
FACTS
July 7th, 2010
7:56 pm
Funny that NOT ONE PERSON ASKED JAN BREWER, WITH WHICH money$$$$$ SHE WANTS TO ENFORCE THIS LAW, THAT WILL REQUIRE MORE POLICE OFFICERS??
HOW MANY NEW POLICEMEN / WOMEN HAS SHE HIRED? NONE!!!!!
HOW MANY NEW IMMIGRATION JUDGES SHES HIRED TO PROCESS THE THOUSANDS OF UNDOCUMENTED? NONE!!!!!
HOW MANY JAILS HAS SHE BUILT TO HOLD THE UNDOCUMENTED AND WITH WHAT WILL SHE PAY FOR?? NONE!!!
THERE IS NO MONEY FOR THIS LAW ITS ALL POLITICS, WAKE UP YOU FOLLIES.
David Granger
July 7th, 2010
8:08 pm
To my good friend, Yankee in Gooberville re: your 6:49 note.
In 1995 the federal government (under Clinton) created a program called the Immigration and Nationality Act’s Section 287(g). It authorizes state law enforcement officers to enforce federal immigration law. I guess now the DOJ is going to go into court and argue: “WHAT? You thought we actually MEANT that?”
But thanks to that, the enforcement of immigration law is NOT exclusively the responsibility of the federal government. The current administration may WISH it were…but Arizona is within its rights.
But you can’t blame the DOJ for trying. There’s always a chance they’ll luck into a real liberal judge who’ll just put the law aside no matter what. It’s worked for the Dems before (and the Republicans, too, in a couple of instances.)
I think the best way to enforce immigration law is just to make it a FELONY to hire an illegal immigrant…and let the state enforce that. And for every illegal immigrant hired, the employer serves another year in prison…plus the state gets a hundred thousand dollars for the state treasury. Problem would be solved in a couple of months.
Mike
July 7th, 2010
8:15 pm
Davd Granger…your said it so well! If I could award you a pulizer I would. There indeed are those that have little knownledge but profess to be the wisest of them all. Your are the Man! Thank you!
Chuy Dawg
July 7th, 2010
8:19 pm
Sorry to give you some bad news but this issue is well beyond repairable. This country has ignored this issue for the longest time simply due to greed. Greed has practically eaten this country up.
Its funny to see Repubs stir this up whenever they need to rally their base. Honestly, it works to a certain extent. Who is the Godfather of the original “Amnesty?” Go ahead and spin it every which way you want!
Illi. Immi. has always been a problem, but we don’t need to make the mistake of thinking that by supporting Repubs will fix the problem. They are just as guilty as the Socialist guys on the other side.
Sally
July 7th, 2010
8:22 pm
We don’t need immigration reform, all we need is to enforce our current laws. Secure our borders and remove all illegal aliens. It can get done if the politicians are looking for the best interest of our country not for their vote. Governor Brewer has more balls then most of the current politicians, how sad. I live in the border city of El Paso and it is becoming like Mexico. When you do business in El Paso most everyone addresses you in Spanish.
Hell, we had a young lady that was fired from her job because she didn’t speak Spanish, what a bunch of crap!!!! She got reinstated after her mother was on the news complaining.
Chuy Dawg
July 7th, 2010
8:24 pm
Question for everybody on here, anybody can answer. I want to see who’s brave enough to answer my questions honestly.
How many of you guys knowingly have done business with Illegals?
I mean anything; landscapers,painters, restaurants, etc.
Lets see how many brave souls are out there.
Chuy Dawg
July 7th, 2010
8:27 pm
Soon to be headline
Gov. Jan Brewer announces her candidacy for US President.
Plain and simple truth
July 7th, 2010
8:44 pm
Jan Brewer has said that most of the undocumented immigrants in her state are ‘drug mules.’
And Karen Handle endorses her?
Can’t tell whether that’s racist or just extremely stupid…or both.
Can we build a wall in this state to keep the republicans out?
Hooray fro Gov Brewer
July 7th, 2010
8:47 pm
Our meely mouthed do nothing Presidnet talks immigration enforcement but does nothing about it. Gov Brewer shows leadership by picking up Obama’s dropped responsibilities. Once again Barry proves to be all hat and no cattle.
Plain and simple truth
July 7th, 2010
8:48 pm
Chuy Dawg – I work with them every chance I get. One undocumented worker is more productive than ten of the typical lazy white meth-head trash that wants you to pay them for just showing up.
Chuy Dawg
July 7th, 2010
8:54 pm
Plain and simple truth– I appreciate your answer and your honesty. I’m sure some people will have a problem with your answer but thanks man.
Jason
July 7th, 2010
9:24 pm
Individual states can’t decide on issues like amnesty but they can decide on their own employment law. For too long we’ve told businesses not to hire illegals while giving them a wink and showing crossed fingers. If we make it painful to companies that hire illegals, they’ll stop doing it. If we make it socially unacceptable to hire illegals for do yard work and clean our houses, the illegals will stop coming.
But we won’t. Our business community is greedy and most everyone who wants to hire domestic help is too greedy. We want the cheap labor but wish the people who provide it would disappear when their shift is over.
We’ve seen the enemy and he is us.
The question now is, should we really decide to get serious about controlling illegal immigration instead of only giving it lip service during election cycles, what can we do about the demand side of the equation? We’re never going to be able to stop the supply side… our border is just too large and there are simply too many ways to sneak in. Demand must be dried up but that means getting serious about punishing the citizens and businesses of our country who create the demand rather than going after the laborer who it is easy to hate.
Red
July 7th, 2010
9:35 pm
Deport every American who has hired an illegal. Seize the assets of every business who has hired an illegal. So many get on their high horse about enforcing the laws but only refer to deporting those here illegally. What about the flag waving patriotic Americans committing crimes on this same issue? You want rule of law? Show me punishment of those Americans as well.
grizzybear
July 7th, 2010
9:46 pm
the sbc is not the only humane voice on this subject as the article makes it seem. there are other predominant voices on this subject. i know the baptists are good at recruiting hispanic members to there congregations, illegal or not!
GeorgiaConservative
July 7th, 2010
10:05 pm
David Granger: While your solution is a viable one, there’s one major problem. No mechanism exists for the employer to verify who is illegal and who is not. If there were, we could already be enforcing the law.
Currently an employer must submit a potential employee’s SSN to verify eligibility. Almost without fail, the worker has a valid SSN. Are many of these individuals illegal and using a fake ID? Sure, but the broken system evidently can’t detect such. Surely there are dozens if not hundreds of people out there using the same SSN, but the system cannot detect such.
It would be patently unfair to imprison an employer who uses the only system he has, but that is broken.
Dr.Phil
July 7th, 2010
10:39 pm
Send all the law breakers back to Mexico! Obama is a radical leftist who is trying to destroy the United States! Obama will not enforce the laws nor roll up his sleeves and get envolved with the Gulf oil problem! I bet if the oil problem was on Lake Michigan then he and Rev.Wright, the racist would be raving! Guess the Black Panthers are just community organizers too!!
el diablo
July 7th, 2010
10:43 pm
All this rhetoric about securing our borders is clearly a cleansing mechanism for all of those people, mainly whites, who hate seeing brown faces within their neighborhoods, schools, ball games and shopping malls. Few are brave enough to admit it or roughly acknowledge this sentiment. What white Americans want is the country, or their neighborhoods, to go back to “the good old days” when there were no Mexicans in sight. Surprise!! It’s never, EVER, going back to the BAD OLD DAYS. We are here to stay, that’s because we’ve never been gone. Slowly, more and more brown faces are earning college degrees, becoming entrepeneurs, and in the way of immigrants of old, struggling to earn a living. We like it here and are not going back to Mexico, whether we came legally or ilegally. I don’t expect today’s whites to understand or change their views. Hopefully their children will. Those same children that will one day be ashamed to admit that their parents were intolerant, insensitive and cruel to other human beings who did not look like them.
Juan
July 7th, 2010
10:46 pm
Most on the people against immigration reform are in essence good people, they have seen crimes that some illegals have done, how some of them choose to live, etc, etc. Problem is, all the good people against immigration do not know all the facts behind this issue, they just believe everything they hear on talk radio.
Not all illegal immigrants are criminals, “altough you might think just by being here they’re all criminals, To me, someone that breaks his back picking tomatos, doing landscape or washing dishes to provide for their families is not the same as someone selling dope in a corner.
The flow of immigration is an issue that has benefited Mexico and USA for a long time, both governments have turned a blind eye ‘ cause it has been benefitial for both countries, but when the economy is not doing good it’s so easy to blame the illegals. There are several solutions to this problem if only our politicians could get together and work on it, but I guess trying to solve the issue doesn’t get many votes. Even the comments by “immigration solution” sound smart, there you have someone on this blog that proposes a smart solution to the issue, how come we don’t hear this kind of ideas from the GOP leaders in GA.
cs
July 7th, 2010
10:53 pm
No more money in tithes or offerings in the collection plate coming from me until Land is booted and apologizes. I have already stopped at the plate and started donating God’s cut to individuals in need.
BurningAtlanta
July 7th, 2010
10:55 pm
I’m so tired of hearing the myths, rhetoric, ignorance and propaganda from the Boo-Hoo Brigade I could scream. First, take your thumbs out of your mouths, put some dry sheets on your beds and grow up. You want sympathy, compassion and understanding? Call your mother, your therapist or Dial-A-Whiner.
Pro-illegals HATE facts. So, a few clues for the clueless who can only resort to lies, tear mongering and calls of “racist” at anyone or thing that opposes illegal aliens. BTW, what race is an illegal alien?
This is 2010, this is the United States of America and no one has any right to break in this country. Illegals, by their mere presence, have proven a total contempt for our laws, our borders and this nation. Because Canadians or Australians killed or displaced natives that gives me a right to ignore their borders? Because Rome displaced some ancient relative that gives me the right to set up residence in Italy. Idiots. And the USA still allows more legal immigration than any other country, by far. But to sheet-soakers, it’s never enough.
“Oh, they’re splitting-up families. Waaaa.” Many illegals leave their families behind for years. Others, in the knowledge they are subject to arrest and deportation at any time, ignore that fact and start families, here. And I’m supposed to feel sorry for them when they get caught? Ahh, no. And that cry-baby tune that goes, “But they don’t even remember their home country and don’t speak the language.” Excuse me? Didn’t stop them from coming, did it? BTW, America families are split-up all the time because of the stupid and/or criminal acts of their parents. Don’t believe me? Get caught with a load of drugs and go to prison for a while. And if you can’t find someone to step in as legal guardian then your kid/kids go to foster care.
“We need Guest worker programs.” Excuse me? You’re an idiot. There are many worker visa programs including the H2-A for Ag workers and it doesn’t even have a cap on it. Farmers don’t like it because it’s cumbersome and expensive. They’d rather hire illegals off the back of a bus.
“Oh, it’s those mean-spirited republicans.” Moron. The last amnesty attempt was pushed by many dems and republicans including Bush, McCain, Graham, Lott, etc.. and it failed because of the republicans that opposed it and 15 dem senators that crossed over. This issue crosses party lines, a lot.
The “One Time” amnesty of 1986 was a total failure simply because of a lack of enforcement. And some people are so stupid they want to repeat that mistake? “YessirreeBob, we’re REALLY going to get serious about enforcement, this time. We REALLY mean it, this time.” (choke) The government RARELY, almost never, follows through on any promise they make. Ahh, where’s the “Fence.” Even Obama and Hillary voted for almost 700 miles of double wall fencing, where is it?
People from all over the world crash our borders, especially our southern border. Even though apprehensions are way down it’s estimated that over a million still get in. We can’t seal it but we can do much better.
There is NOTHING to prevent The Appeaser in Chief from acting strongly, right now, to secure that border. There is NOTHING to prevent that advocate of Comprehensive Surrender from seriously targeting the employers, right now. Our “enforcement, even though it’s been steeped way up on he border, and even though they claim more actions against employers, is still an anemic joke.
Secure the border and enforce the laws. What’s radical, racist or extremist about that?
superDawg
July 7th, 2010
11:58 pm
obama when you sue Arizona you will get the law suit of your life BOY.The American people are fed up with your BS and the left wing agenda will be coming to an end soon.VOTE REPUBLICAN!and lets take America back.
superDawg
July 8th, 2010
12:00 am
NUFF SAID!
tom H
July 8th, 2010
12:02 am
Once upon a time, back in the nineties, there was enforcement of our immigration laws. Back then agents would stop by our manufacturing plant and check out hispanic workers. Also raids would be made on the south georgia vegetable and vidalia onion farms. When these raids or checks were performed all the hispanic workers would suddenly disappear. The farmers then called their senator and complained that they couldn’t get their crops harvested in the short window available before spoilage occured.
When this happened that famous GOP senator Coverdale, a powerhouse in the republican controlled senate threatned the immigration service with a funds cut off if this enforcement action continued. From that incident forward there was never another raid or check-out of a farm work crew. We never again had an agent come by and check our personnel records. How many republicans remember this or will even acknowledge it? I regard Senator Coverdale as the father of illegal immigration.
superDawg
July 8th, 2010
12:02 am
OH AND YANKEE in Gooberville I-95 will get you home.
Robert E
July 8th, 2010
12:24 am
Christianity doesn’t have any business involved in political issues, presume to speak for GOD and take Biblical verses out of context to support a political agenda. Jesus said his kingdom was in Heaven and did NOT attempt to change law or demonstrate against the majority but to help prepare those for Heaven. Changing law is a political activity and religious organizations that become involved should have their tax exempt status revoked.
Internal Revenue Code Section 501(c)(3) provides for the exemption from federal income tax of organizations organized and operated exclusively for charitable or educational purposes, no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting to influence legislation
Dick
July 8th, 2010
6:31 am
I am a southern Baptist and Mr. Land DOES NOT speak on my behalf. I am not anti mexican. I am anti living in america not paying your share, receiving free health care , receiving welfare, food sgtamps and medicaid while not being entitled to it, against just because born in a country you become a citizen of that country. That Mr Land is what I am fed up with.
Ga Values
July 8th, 2010
6:35 am
Deal will say anything to get elected, just remember along with Maxine Waters & Jesse Jackson, Jr. he was selected as 1 of the 15 most corrupt in Washington and that is really saying something about his character.
**Rep. Nathan Deal (R-GA)**
Rep. Vern Buchanan (R-FL)
Sen. Roland Burris (D-IL)
Rep. Ken Calvert (R-CA)
Sen. John Ensign (R-NV)
Rep. Jesse Jackson, Jr. (D-IL)
Rep. Jerry Lewis (R-CA)
Sen. Mitch McConnell (R-KY)
Rep. Alan B. Mollohan (D-WV)
Rep. John P. Murtha (D-PA)
Rep. Charles B. Rangel (D-NY)
Rep. Laura Richardson (D-CA)
Rep. Pete Visclosky (D-IN)
Rep. Maxine Waters (D-CA)
Rep. Don Young (R-AK)
OldSnarkey
July 8th, 2010
7:06 am
Superdawg, you go guy. The ‘yankee in gooberville’ is about 2 sandwiches short of a picnic but he can’t seem to understand it. Yankee, uneducated, doehead, we don’t need to change the constitution, we just need to enforce it.
OldSnarkey
July 8th, 2010
7:25 am
cs, you don’t seem to grasp the concept of the tithe. The bible did NOT say to give the tithe to your favorite charity but instead it said the tenth belongs to the lord. Do you really think you can or even will donate to people in need better than an organization can. Don’t be mislead by your own sense of Piety. The Tithe is an act of obedience and worship of God as He instructs us in the Bible. Perhaps you only want to hear what you want and not the truth! Just sayin…..
Bill Campbell
July 8th, 2010
7:27 am
All Democrats will be voted out of office soon! Build an electric fence and gather up all those lawbreakers and send them back to Mexico!
Bill
July 8th, 2010
7:29 am
Bad Karma,
How does illegal immigration lead to sending jobs overseas?? If anything, it probably keeps more here.
Sally,
Actually, it was Mexico until we took it away.
Of course we need to control our borders. But we also need a solution that is doable. Deporting 11 million is not it. We clearly need a comprehensive solution. The republicans had 8 years to get this done, and they had the incentive of preventing more terrorism after 9/11. Instead, they decided to grandstand on the issue. On the one hand, they tell horror stories about illegal immigrants, and on the other they serve the corporate interests that hire the illegals.
lin
July 8th, 2010
7:30 am
i watch special on tv other night based on our govt was formed under the laws of the bible. but also think about govt now do not see it used any more. they do not want god involved in any thing. no wonder we got so so so many problems in usa. then now here this problem with mexico people cross over our borders etc. why would usa want close it down when look lot our stuff we buy comes from mexico. all greed of money money money is the big problem. thats major problem. send them back and govt will loose the money.
cbgb
July 8th, 2010
7:52 am
I could care less what the SBC thinks on this or any other issue. Lead, vote or get out of the way.
Peadawg
July 8th, 2010
7:57 am
“immigration law is exclusively the responsibility of the federal gov’t”
And that’s the problem. The gov’t hasn’t done anything about it. So the states are taking it into their own hands.
Lou
July 8th, 2010
8:06 am
Of course the church wants comprehensive immigration reform. The more illegals they can get into the pews the more the money flows in. The bible teaches us to respect lawful government rule. I am not singling out Baptist, I am a Catholic and now only do they protect illegals but set up safe houses and encourage illegals to come to this country because the majority of Latinos are Catholic and their collection plates get fuller when the churches are packed.
random observer
July 8th, 2010
8:10 am
Thank God for the blogosphere! It allows people, including myself, to remain anonymous. Racists, bigots, homophobes, Christians, Muslims, Jews, Atheists, and the list goes on and on…… may rhteoric reign supreme!!!!
Call them "Undocumented Democrats"
July 8th, 2010
8:15 am
Obama and his justice department apparently have too much time on their hands–hence the Arizona lawsuit, investigating BP for criminal prosecution, etc.
It seems they could find some time to prosecute the new black panthers who committed voter intimidation. I’ve heard that’s illegal.
Or, they could–and this is a tough one–focus on improving the economy so businesses have prospect of expanding and hiring people.
Or, he could plug the damn leak so Sasha (or whatever her name is) would receive a good answer from her daddy when she asks him about it when he is shaving. That was his expressed Number One Priority, right?
Failure comes in many forms. This one’s name is Obama.
No Teabagging
July 8th, 2010
8:25 am
Our local politicians will crow about illegal immigration but they will NOT force mass deportation. They will deport a couple of university students and say they got tough on immigration and fulfilled their campaign promise. Their corporate campaign supporters will continue hiring illegals to do their cheap labor.
Flora Bunda
July 8th, 2010
8:30 am
We have so many laws we do not enforce. Try enforcing the speed limit on Metro highways. The average speed is 70mph in 55 mph zones. No one gets ticketed for driving 70 mph. There would be riots if police actually enforced the law and made everyone slow down.
No Fan of Any Team
July 8th, 2010
8:35 am
Yes, I know people that hire illegals for day labor. They tried hiring Americans, but they would not work as hard, did not want to learn new skills, and many times did not show up the next day for work. The ’south of the border folks’ work harder and are reliable. I also learned these guys make many sacrifices to send money back home. Big Surprise… many of them do not want to become American citizens, they just want to work here a few years to send enough money back home to male a difference and then return home to live and work with their families.
Pork Chop
July 8th, 2010
8:35 am
I am way past being sick of hearing the term “undocumented” to describe criminals. Call them what they are: “illegal aliens” who have violated our immigration laws and, and in many cases, placed themselves front and center at the public trough. Some receive Social Security benefits (including health care) and many receive food stamps. All the while, they protest and make demands on their host – the U.S. taxpayer. I defy anyone to show me a nation which has long existed when they failed to control their borders. The crime rate reflected by these illegal aliens should speak for itself.
Red
July 8th, 2010
8:57 am
Still no comments on punishing the Americans who hire illegals or somehow benefit from illegal activity. Amazing how this issue is so one-sided. If you truly are principled about the rule of law, line up all of those Americans aiding and abetting this activity.
jconservative
July 8th, 2010
9:05 am
A couple of thoughts on the issue.
Two really remarkedly true statements from Land at SBC:
1) “We need to call upon our congressmen and senators to behave like statesmen. Politicians think about the next election. Statesmen think about the next generation,”
2) “And we’ve had these two conflicting signs up at the border — ‘No trespassing’ and ‘Help wanted.’”
Re the Arizona law.
Question: What will Arizona do with the illegals it rounds up under the new law?
Answer: Turn them over to the Feds.
Question: What will the Feds do with them?
Answer: Turn them loose, if they are not criminals.
This is why the Arizona law is a “pie in the sky” law. It is good politics but lousy law.
Port O'John
July 8th, 2010
9:07 am
We should amend the inscription on the Statue of Liberty to read:
“Give us your retired living on generous pensions, your wealthy, your white anglo-saxon protestants….”
After all the statue came from the French and we all know they can’t get anything right.
chefdavid
July 8th, 2010
9:17 am
meanwhile in TN they are getting along.
http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2010/jul/08/candidates-criticize-challenge-arizona-immigration/?politicssate
lem
July 8th, 2010
9:18 am
All you goobers who want GA to enact an Arizona style law…we cannot afford the lawsuits. Our economy is in the tank as it is. Let’s wait and see what happens to the Arizona law. Let them pay for the lawsuits and risk the economic repercussions. And as for the Southern Baptists and other right wing Christians, you are about as far from the teachings of Jesus Christ as you can possibly be.
Manuel
July 8th, 2010
9:24 am
I remember my Grandfather once telling me never to trust a Priest or Politician because those two professions were wholly responsible for 99% of all wars and human misery.. Land is an example of those the DOJ should be going after. Maybe if Holder weren’t so busy trying to figure out how to selectively apply the laws of this Nation, he would be doing just that and his job. I don’t believe that anyone should pay attention to the laws of this nation when President Obama and Eric Holder only respect those laws that serve their purpose and ignore all others. This President has a lot of nerve insinuating that all who disagree with his policies are racists, when he is showing himself to be one of the biggest racists in the history of Presidents. I.e., dismissing charges of voter intimidation against two very hateful and racist members of the new Black Panthers. I would bet a year’s wages that if those doing the intimidation had wore white sheets, they’d be beaten to a pulp & awaiting dozens of local, state, and Federal charges by now. Eric Holder & Barrack Obama are just plain wrong on this issue. Likewise, Suing Arizona for doing exactly what he swore and oath to do which is to protect the citizens of this Nation at all cost is the stuff that the last Civil War between the states was made of. Maybe that’s exactly what Obama & his Cronies want. Just how long can this nation, or any nation for that matter, survive or protect the quality of life for its citizens without effective immigration controls? And just what does Obama and AJ Holder think this sort of Racism will buy them, or anyone trying to live in peace here in the long run? Racism, Hate, and Contempt have proven only to create even more Racism, Hate, and Contempt from those discriminated against towards the groups doing the discriminating.
deegee
July 8th, 2010
9:26 am
HAHAHAHA, Chuy Dawg. I have personal experience with a restaurant that opened a couple of years ago with a largely hispanic(illegal) staff. The owner got spooked and slowly fired the hispanics. He replaced them with anglos. Over time the low-skilled anglos proved themselves to be what most low-skilled anglos are. The owner has had problems with theft, drugs, poor job performance, unexcused absences and high turnover. The restaurant is now pretty much half hispanic and half anglo.
If you support small business then you should support immigration reform. Small business owners are your neighbors, friends, church members, etc. They aren’t criminals. Small business owners should be able to LEGALLY hire the best person for the job.
free man
July 8th, 2010
9:37 am
I stopped reading when the words “baptist” and “moral measuring stick” were used in the same sentence.
Organized religion of all “faiths” has in total caused more human suffering in this world than it has prevented. Zealots are dangerous no matter the form.
casual observer
July 8th, 2010
9:50 am
Norcross, GA – The police in Norcross were connected to a federal data base and able to check the immigration status of ALL traffic stops – no racial profiling and no different than making a computer check for outstanding warrants. At the onset of the program there was a significant Hispanic population in the Norcross area.
After a short time the Hispanic population of Norcross dramatically declined and along with that came a decline in criminal activity. You may draw from that what you wish.
Apparently no deportation is required if the states and the feds will simply enforce the current immigration law.
As for the farmers and other businesses who complain about a shortage of “cheap” labor – become a responsible citizen and use the American work force.
As for illegal immigration forcing corporations to send jobs overseas, that is simply wrong. The Internal Revenue Code is primarily responsible for sending jobs overseas. The US has the 2nd highest corporate tax rate of the industrialized nations. There is nothing anti-American about corporate officers being good stewards of the company money. In fact, the Board of Directors and officers are open to a law suit for frivolous spending.
AND, before some nimrod argues the corporate rate is not high enough – Corporations do not pay income tax. The consumer of their goods and services pay the tax through higher prices and the corporation simply collects from the consumer and passes the money on to the IRS.
Pliny Elder
July 8th, 2010
9:53 am
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNptFKhwYuA&feature=player_embedded
casual observer
July 8th, 2010
9:59 am
Free man,
“Organized religion of all “faiths” has in total caused more human suffering in this world than it has prevented. Zealots are dangerous no matter the form.”
That comment is ignorant and mis-informed. Organized religion is present and in the forefront providing assistance after every disaster.
Christian groups were among the first on the scene in Thailand (a predominantly Muslim country) after the tsunami and in Haiti after the earth quake. Groups of Christian doctors traveled at their own expense to Thailand and Haiti, and at personal risk, to assist anyone in need as they traveled throughout the countries to provide assistance.
Uninformed, baseless comments such as yours, Free Man, tell us much more about YOU than provide any enlightenment on the topic at hand.
BP101
July 8th, 2010
9:59 am
I really wish the national and local media would check their work before publishing.
For the record there is no such agency as Customs and Border Patrol (stated in the picture caption) the correct agency title is Customs and Border Protection.
The Agent pictured is a U.S. Border Patrol Agent not a Customs and Border Patrol agent. There is no such thing. The officers who work at the Ports of Entry are Customs and Border Protection Officers.
Please do not refer to us as Border Guards; we are either Agents or Officers not guards.
seriously
July 8th, 2010
10:00 am
What a wise and appropriate position, Mr. Land. Way to go! I can’t blame anyone for wanting to come to the greatest country on earth. And if there isn’t a legal way to get here, I hope I’d ignore some gabacha law myself.
Red
July 8th, 2010
10:05 am
free man – I love the pinning of suffering on organized religion. I refer you to a man named Josef Stalin who killed at least 30 million of his own people, imprisoned millions more, and caused untold suffering to many more millions across the globe during his reign. He is one example of the opposite of your claim. Instead of pinning this on organized religion, let’s just say ideology. Because those of NO faith right now have a greater death and suffering toll than that of organized religion.
Captain Midnight
July 8th, 2010
10:47 am
HAHAHAHA, deegree. I have personal experience with a restaurant that opened a couple of years ago with a largely hispanic(illegal) staff. The owner got spooked and slowly fired the hispanics. He replaced them with negros. Over time the low-skilled negros proved themselves to be what most low-skilled negros are. The owner has had problems with theft, drugs, poor job performance, unexcused absences and high turnover. The restaurant is now pretty much half hispanic and half negro.
OldSnarkey
July 8th, 2010
11:06 am
lem, your post just goes to show how ignorant you are!!!
Southern Republican Focus on Immigration Intensifies | Progressive Fix
July 8th, 2010
12:34 pm
[...] whose primary is on July 20, immigration is indeed a big issue in the gubernatorial contest, as reported by the Atlanta Journal-Constitution’s Jim Galloway: For the next 13 days, all stops are off [...]
F.Bartonie
July 8th, 2010
1:19 pm
Are we the United States or not? The short sighted leaders of most of our states is totally irresponsible.
All states should back Arizona on SB1070, not boycott. If all states will join together, on this issue and all issues, the Federal Government will start doing what is required, getting off their butt and enforcing their own laws and earning the over-inflated income. This will also take the power back into the states where it belongs. Let us reduce the Federal Government and increase the State Government, bring the decision makers closer to the people.. Arizona has giver America a chance to come together, as a United States. All of you narrow minded idiots out there pull your heads out of your butt, and start smelling the roses. We are starting to lose one of the best windows of opportunity I have witnessed in my life time. If we let it pass without action we as a nation are doomed, United we stand, divided we fall.
You Asked
July 8th, 2010
1:19 pm
For those of you complaining that we stole parts of Mexico from the Spanish… Where were you when the Spanish were engaged in wholesale genocide of the Toltec? And where where you when the Toltecs were absorbing the culture of the Aztecs? And where were you when the Aztecs were engaged in kidnapping and sacrificing Mayans? And where were you when the Maya were engaged in conquering the Olmec?
Give Eden back to Adam and Eve I say!
Legend of Len Barker
July 8th, 2010
2:43 pm
I find myself agreeing with Land. I’m not for open borders, but the current immigration/citizenship process is a travesty.
An ordinary day laborer has no shot at becoming a legal citizen. Especially if he’s Hispanic.
The 1965 immigration laws – which are currently on the books – were supposed to replace the quota system, but are exactly that: a quota system. If the U.S. already has a large number of citizens from one area, they accept less of the citizenship applications from that area. Considering that 80% of all illegal immigrants originate from North America and only one third of the people accepted for citizenship last year originate from North America, I say it’s a serious issue. Especially since the respective numbers are in the neighborhood of 8.5 million and 300,000 (the last one is from memory, the stats are on the Department of Homeland Security site).
Citizenship is based on desirable skills. While a Hispanic farm laborer and construction worker are indeed doing necessary jobs, they’re going to be considered. Because their skills aren’t unique. However, Albert Pujols quickly became a citizen because … he’s a baseball player. Wandy Rodriguez gave a false name upon arriving in America and wasn’t deported because … he’s a baseball player. Sebastian Janikowski ran afoul of the law often and was only threatened with deportation because … he can kick field goals.
It’s a shame that every American-born slacker gets citizenship because s/he was lucky enough to be born here but the very individuals who are literally willing to die to provide a better life for their families are seen as scumbags.
Goodness Gracious Sakes Alive
July 8th, 2010
4:01 pm
Goodness Gracious Sakes Alive! I have never agreed with Richard Land on anything. Till now. A reasonable, moderate position on the issue of immigration??? He’s never had a reasonable, moderate position on ANYTHING! I left the Southern Baptist Church over people like him.
I don’t really believe in that Second Coming thing, but if I did, I’d say the Apocalypse is nigh!
Will Jones - Atlanta Jeffersonian Exegesis
July 8th, 2010
11:18 pm
Richard Land is a “Judas goat” leading good Baptists astray.
Out of Princeton and Oxford, longtime “Bush Boy” Land is a false Baptist siding with the Roman Catholic Church’s published stratagem for usurping the American People through the promotion of illegal immigration. His loyalty is with the Anti-Christ’s “Fifth Column” false-elite, whose fascist plutocracy will only continue to succeed as long as the eighty percent Middle Class is destroyed as the “stopper” it is in the Old Sectarian Order’s “shoot the moon” to once more “own the world.”
Our Founders received America, the Promised Land, in covenant from the Creator, G-d of the universe.
Vietnam draft-dodger Richard Land is not of G-d. If he were he would have alerted us to George W. Bush’s evil.
As he did not we can know with certainty that he and the 9/11-committing draft-dodging closet-queen George W. Bush are two of a kind: servants of the Anti-Christ.
Seal the border – Remove Rome from our shores – Expropriate the Roman Anti-Christ’s American “Fifth Column” to pay the debt they’ve created to make the People bond slaves – only when the treasonous Roman Catholic Church which has been promoting illegal immigration to take over America is banished and the border secure, can we begin to consider allowing illegals a path to citizenship, through inculcation in the meaning and power of the American Creed’s three mottoes, bequeathed to all who would be true Americans, by the Founders, by G-d.
John
July 9th, 2010
12:03 am
el diablo,
Still can’t get over your own racism, can you? Honestly, yesterday, you spewed enough hatred and bigotry (in another article’s comments) to spawn a war!
Do you not understand that your attitude provides all the fodder any person of any race has to avoid you like the plague?
Please be bothered to grow up and see virtue in others soon. ..And PLEASE get over your spiteful view of history! Fomenting violence along the border or anyplace in the Southwest won’t heal any of your supposed wounds.
John
July 9th, 2010
12:11 am
Mr. Jones (et al):
Please be bothered to overcome your hatred for my Church soon.
If you’re going to claim some form of Christian identity–Baptist apparently?–would you mind re-reading those things that Christ said about learning the Truth and/or compassion for one’s neighbor?
I’m not happy with some of our episcopal attitudes, but since these aren’t precisely the actual teachings of the Church in the first place….
How will we ever have true Christian communion if you view another faith tradition with such spite and contempt?
Will Jones - Atlanta Jeffersonian Exegesis
July 9th, 2010
7:48 am
Rome has many agents in other-named sectarian factions bent on destroying the New Secular Order established in covenant with the Creator, G-d of the universe, by America’s Founders. There is but one G-d.
It is anti-American and against the “King of America,” G-d Almighty, to attempt to impose some sectarian interpretation of the Infinite Power in the Public Common. The People is sovereign, with each Individual is guaranteed the right to his or her own relationship with G-d, or not, by the Constitution.
Understand the Creed’s three mottoes: “Annuit Coeptis” is the only legitimate reference to the Deity in American political discourse.
Richard Land, a “good buddy” and fellow Vietnam draft-dodger of the former Closet-Queen-in-Chief, is not of G-d, regardless of his sectarian affiliation.
Illegal immigration is a published, admitted and proclaimed vehicle by which the Roman Catholic Church’s Old Sectarian Order of king and pope, caesaropapism, is in the process of usurping and repealing the whig, American Revolution, which established Citizen Sovereignty and American Exceptionalism…the ongoing threat to the families of Europe which have used the Roman Catholic Church to enslave the bodies and minds of the masses for thousands of years, and their American “Fifth Column” which provided their finance of Hitler and the Holocaust, the assassinations of John and Martin to send us to die for the pope in Vietnam, and whose Roman Catholics alone, on the Supreme Court, cheated a dry-drunk, draft-dodging closet-queen into the White House (where he “received” his homosexual lover James Guckert/”Jeff Gannon” – documented at the social entrance by the Secret Service’s logbook – 202 times over a two-year period).
Their stratagem – a de facto signed confession of treason and an open invasion for conquest – is available for the patriot or merely curious to read:
http://www.amazon.com/National-Publication-Publishing-Promotion-Conference/dp/1555861997/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1278675850&sr=8-1
Those with knowledge, whose affinity is support for Rome’s “Fifth Column,” like Richard Land, false Baptist, who support amnesty without sealing the border and punishing the Roman Catholic Church for its treason and other abominations, first, are also traitors against America.
Treason against G-d’s Promised Land is treason against G-d.
Face the obvious: if Richard Land were a Man of G-d he would have had nothing to do with the Roman Anti-Christ’s best friend, George W. Bush.
John W.
July 9th, 2010
12:33 pm
I’ve lived on the Mexican border for 10 years now and we don’t see many HELP WANTED signs that is the crux of the problem. These boys need to live and try to find work on the Mexican border to really have an opinion. There we go again making this a race issiue when it is illegal to be in this country illegaly no matter what your nationality is and this is NOT “anti-Hispanic immigration rhetoric”.
Anne
July 9th, 2010
1:00 pm
To Yankee in Gooberville……Delta is ready when you are.
Rural Education
July 9th, 2010
6:28 pm
Reagan gave amnesty to about 3 million illegal immigrants in 1986, I wonder why the Reverend doesn’t mention that. He hits Carter, but not “Saint” Reagan
Will Jones - Atlanta Jeffersonian Exegesis
July 10th, 2010
4:29 am
Reagan’s was a “Roman Catholic” White House. It was during his term that diplomatic relations were established with the Vatican “in the middle of the night,” rejecting the policy established for centuries, and Rome’s “National Pastoral Plan for Hispanic Ministry” was implemented: a published, enumerated stratagem – in Spanish and English – for promoting illegal immigration by Hispanic Roman Catholics to America as an invasion for conquest.
Peter Q. Wolfe
July 11th, 2010
1:37 am
We need to look at the very onset of the history of immigration into this nation to see the problem. The colonization from europeans and then the manifest destiny moving forward to promote the manifest destiny issue at hand today. There is tons of land with not enough adaquate support for financial support for the infrastructure to support such a move between Canada, Mexico and the east to west coasts of our nation not including the air issue with underground problems. Americans of all stripes need to understand dividing up families whether deporting or legalization should be the way to go in a humane way. The fence needs to be put up in a logical and sensible time working with the mexican president as well as the people in Mexico on tougher sanctions if not taken serious.
Dude you guys in America are so anti-catholic when we save you don’t complain in our hospitals and in our catholic private schools. We provide you these services with usually non-profit at hand with parish support to people in need for only tax exemption. We provide health reform with medical doctors and nuns and others to change our inhumane system to a fair and balanced prospective with morals in place to help those in need. The Fourteenth admentth to the U.S Constitution and the 4th admendment of the Bill of Rights are being trashed by the 10th admendment. The plain simple fact is that we need to have more electronic database cross referencing to be a requirement in the next upcoming decades and to enforce existing laws in this nation of ours in a compassionant even handed approach to the issues. Baptist you guys are also evil gluttonous, death penalizing, selfish, illiterate, war mongering, slave owning, racist, biggoted, hypocritical, etc just as much as you claim the catholics of being. Come on man you guys aren’t being serious that you guys are any better than the catholics because they selter the defenseless in a family oriented judo-christian way? Dude they work to have the fruit of their labor cause of the tyranical circumstances in the mexican government and unstable settlement of all illiterate governments of populated supposed devweloped nations including the U.S.A.
Finally, we need comprimise not sniping from either side cause that won’t do any good. Both sides have good points and should be looked at for long term gains not temporary gains and my idea is about duration. Do the vote now today not for November for the American people! Easy right? No, not for Washington, D.C cause they don’t want to work on a devicive issues as device as immigration cause they might lose office if they vote with their conciance rather than their humane souls. Barack Obama has somethings that I disagree with (e.g. abortion support), however, I could say that of any president cause they have a wide platform to appeal to different voters like civil rights to etc that we don’t feel that affect us affect others. On moral grounds, defending children is 1 that and national security which encompasses them with other defenseless people like the elderly, disabled and unabled bodied inputent poor among us. I’m precatholic myself and these comments about a conspireracy are drugged in the head conspireracy theory like if that we’re the true case right, then why did John F. Kennedy get killed? He was pro-American like Robert Kennedy and Ted Kennedy even if you don’t agree with those tax payers who served our nation to a great capacity.
Couldn’t It Wait Until December? | Article VI Blog | John Schroeder
July 12th, 2010
8:46 am
[...] Fascinating Captain. var a2a_config = a2a_config || {}; a2a_config.linkname="Couldn’t It Wait Until December?"; a2a_config.linkurl="http://www.article6blog.com/2010/07/12/couldnt-it-wait-until-december/"; a2a_config.show_title=1; [...]
Wow
July 12th, 2010
4:27 pm
Wow, let’s boycott GA now too!
This will work out perfect. As more and more states come out for law enforcement, those in lefty states (think California) will stay away, and we won’t have to deal with their polluting, politically correct social subversion.
Win/win.
Awesome!
Jcrowl
July 14th, 2010
10:04 pm
So when did our country become a dumping ground for all of the surplus population of the third world? Who decided that we should become an overcrowded third world dump? I just wish that my people, the present day European-Americans who have been the historic American nation since its founding,,would show some of the courage of the Lakota,,Apache, Comanche..who opposed our people and fought for their land..
John Martin
August 29th, 2010
10:06 am
Dear Land You are so wrong!!!!My Great grandmother came from Spain! I think its wrong to reward those that have made a video of cleaning a gun with the American Flag and hate this country!!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you want the drug smugelers to take over here like they did in mexico??They have messed up their country now you want those third grade dropouts to VOTE HERE? My wife use to teach those IN MEXICO. You want to Kill America Just Let These Fifth in col. in this land.Sincerly John Martin