Boy Scouts may soon give sponsors authority to allow gay leaders, members: Do you agree?
The Boy Scouts of America may soon give local sponsors the authority to decide whether to allow gays as scouts and leaders.
From The Associated Press via The Washington Post:
…Under the change now being discussed, the different religious and civic groups that sponsor Scout units would be able to decide for themselves how to address the issue — either maintaining an exclusion of gays, as is now required of all units, or opening up their membership.
Gay-rights activists were elated at the prospect of change, sensing another milestone to go along with recent advances for same-sex marriage and the end of the ban on gays serving openly in the military.
However, Southern Baptist leaders — who consider homosexuality a sin — were furious about the possible change and said its approval might encourage Southern Baptist churches to support other boys’ organizations instead of the BSA.
Monday’s announcement of the possible change comes after years of protests over the no-gays policy — including petition campaigns that have prompted some corporations to suspend donations to the Boy Scouts.
Under the proposed change, said BSA spokesman Deron Smith, “the Boy Scouts would not, under any circumstances, dictate a position to units, members, or parents.”
Smith said the change could be announced as early as next week, after BSA’s national board concludes a regularly scheduled meeting on Feb. 6. The meeting will be closed to the public.
The BSA, which celebrated its 100th anniversary in 2010, has long excluded both gays and atheists. Smith said a change in the policy toward atheists was not being considered, and that the BSA continued to view “Duty to God” as one of its basic principles.
Protests over the no-gays policy gained momentum in 2000, when the U.S. Supreme Court upheld the BSA’s right to exclude gays. Scout units lost sponsorships by public schools and other entities that adhered to nondiscrimination policies, and several local Scout councils made public their displeasure with the policy.
More recently, pressure surfaced on the Scouts’ own national executive board. Two high-powered members — Ernst & Young CEO James Turley and AT&T CEO Randall Stephenson — indicated they would try to work from within to change the membership policy, which stood in contrast to their own companies’ non-discrimination policies.
Amid petition campaigns, shipping giant UPS Inc. and drug-manufacturer Merck announced that they were halting donations from their charitable foundations to the Boy Scouts as long as the no-gays policy was in force.
Also, local Scout officials drew widespread criticism in recent months for ousting Jennifer Tyrrell, a lesbian mom, as a den leader of her son’s Cub Scout pack in Ohio and for refusing to approve an Eagle Scout application by Ryan Andresen, a California teen who came out as gay last fall.
Tyrrell said she’s thrilled for parents and their children who’ve been excluded from scouting and “for those who are in Scouts and hiding who they are.”…
Read more on The Washington Post.
So what do you think: Should the Boy Scouts allow sponsors to decide if gays should be allowed as members or leaders? Should the group just decide overall for everyone? Other thoughts? (Please try to keep it civil.)
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150 comments Add your comment
Obama Is Wrong
January 29th, 2013
4:24 pm
DB,
Ahh, the gay won’t turn you into a homosexual argument. I’m not a doctor, psychologist, or anything approaching someone who understands what does/does not make someone gay. To me, it doesn’t matter. God has told us that it is abdominable in his eyes so why should it matter whether it can be transmitted or not? It is wrong. I don’t have to know any more than that, not why it is wrong, or when is became wrong, or if it will ever not be wrong. That is for the Father, not me, to decide. As a Christian it is simply enough to separate ourselves from it to the best we can. Just like I won’t associate with a prostitute unless it is to try and help her to see the immorality of her ways. Some will listen, others won’t.
Captain Hammer
January 29th, 2013
4:30 pm
@Obama Is Wrong
Yes, never ask questions, just blindly follow. It works out so well for Lemmings.
Loyalscout
January 29th, 2013
4:37 pm
Parent – You don’t get it. If the BSA wants to exclude anyone, it is their right. Who do you think should force them to include everyone that you wish, the government?
Try to remember that we live in a free country and it is not the place of the government to make sure that no one is excluded from anything.
People with the same beliefs are free to associate with others who share the same beliefs. Didn’t we form this country to escape a government (Great Britain) that was persecuting us and telling us what to believe.
Scrivener
January 29th, 2013
4:40 pm
So many of the posters here are not engaging in a meaningful discussion but are calling people names because they don’t agree with the gay lifestyle. Scouting is a God-centered activity. If that offends people, so be it. It also seems that some people have to bring their sexuality into everything they do, and that’s very sad.
Techmom
January 29th, 2013
5:00 pm
@Loyalscout – The government isn’t forcing the BSA to reconsider this policy; public opinion, member protests, board members and dwindling support have brought the BSA back around to examining whether this policy is a good one or not.
Ann
January 29th, 2013
5:05 pm
@ Jake-SPJTWB – Come on, man! There is absolutely no evidence that homosexuals try to “recruit” or “convert” heterosexual boys to become homosexual. That is just absurd. Most homosexuals no it can be a difficult road. There is no logical reason why anyone would try to influence a child’s sexual preference.
Furthermore, since the Boy Scouts covered up, for many years, heterosexual leaders who were pedophiles (who were upstanding, Christian, church going persons), your points don’t make much sense. The belief that you are protecting your child by avoiding homosexual Scout leaders, teachers, etc. leads to a totally false sense of security.
Ann
January 29th, 2013
5:13 pm
As a Christian, heterosexual Mom of a young boy, I have avoided joining the Boy Scouts because of this issue. We were weighing the decision when the news came out about the refusal to give Ryan Andresen his hard-earned Eagle Scout badge, even though his Scoutmaster supported him getting the badge and knew of his sexuality and had assured him he would be able to get it. What does this say to a young person – work hard and achieve much in your teenage years, spend time helping the community, etc. (instead of getting into trouble with alcohol, drugs, etc.) and then withholding that badge. That was just horrible. (That action by the Boy Scout organization higher-ups does not match up with what I was taught about the principles of how to treat others and the lessons of Jesus Christ). I was encouraged to hear that dozens and dozens of Eagle Scouts offered their badges to Ryan.
My father was a Scoutmaster and my brother was an Eagle Scout. And, I have wished we could participate. With this change, perhaps we will one day. This change is a step in the right direction.
Ann
January 29th, 2013
5:18 pm
@ Loyalscout – The government did not force this change. There are plenty of Scout participants and leaders that support this change, including many heterosexuals. In fact, many have become embararssed about the bigotry. This is evidence by the dozens and dozens of Scouts giving their Eagle badge to Ryan, who was denied his. Kids like Ryan are not bringing their “sexuality” into anything. They are simply trying to be a Scout and reach the pinnacle of Eagle, just like many others have done.
Yes, the Scouts or other groups have the right to exclude; they see the writing on the wall, that it will lead to the extinction of their organization as society and humanity evolves.
Scrivener
January 29th, 2013
5:27 pm
I wasn’t aware of Ryan Andresen, so I Googled and found out what happened. This young man chose to make a calculated political move and “come out” despite knowing that this was against Scouting rules. He created this distraction knowingly and with a specific purpose. Why did he do what he did if not to further his own agenda. Actions have consequences, and in the business world I would not hire someone like him, knowing he will apply his own rules and ignore the ones he doesn’t care for. He may be a hard worker, but he doesn’t adhere to what he signs up for.
Ann
January 29th, 2013
5:28 pm
@ Obama is Wrong – Fate has a way of coming around to bite you. With 10% of the population gay, there is a strong chance you will have a child or grandchild one day who is gay. I hope that doesn’t happen, though, as you will “separate yourself” from that person and deny he or she the love they deserve. I am a Southern Christian heterosexual and I hope I never cross paths with you. You are one of those die-hard extremists and we are all wasting our time trying to convince you of the error in your ways. It is pointless. Sexual orientation is a physiological fact of life for some. People are born with varying levels of chromosomes and hormones. People created by God. You must believe also that God makes mistakes, then?
Ann
January 29th, 2013
5:35 pm
@ Scrivener – So, you would prefer your son or daughter to hide and not speak out about being bullied or mistreated? That kind of silence is what led to years of abuse by people like Sandusky. I would support any teen who speaks out from their heart about abuse, bullying, or neglect. I hope when my son is a teen, he will speak out about bullying and injustice. If people didn’t stand up for what is right, we would have had many more years of death under leaders like Hitler. Instead, you suggest people hide and keep quiet, lie and be dishonest. What a lesson to teach your children!
Scrivener
January 29th, 2013
5:37 pm
God does make what we perceive as mistakes. I’m sure He doesn’t perceive them as mistakes. Many of us have crosses to bear. I know I do. We are all imperfect in some ways. And BTW, I don’t know where you came up with the 10 percent figure. The only statistics I have ever seen put it at 2 to 3 percent. And if you are a Christian, you can’t pick and choose which of God’s laws you agree with and which ones you don’t.
Scrivener
January 29th, 2013
5:40 pm
Coming out as gay and standing up against bullying are two distinct things, as you know, Ann. My son is a defender of people who are bullied. He also has a gay friend who he would defend if necessary. They are friends even though this boy knows my son doesn’t approve of his lifestyle.
Ann
January 29th, 2013
5:55 pm
@ Scrivener – You actually follow all the laws outlined in the Bible? I am certain you are “picking and choosing” what parts of the Bible that you personally believe. The Bible was written by humans, inspired by God, in a time period and culture far different from today. Ironically, that half the people who say this type of thing are actually divorced from a spouse.
What you are saying is that a teenager who may be struggling with their sexual identity or bullying and who may be hesitant to talk to their parent cannot confide or discuss it with their Scoutmaster? How can they report bullying to their Scoutmaster without revealing why they are being bullied?
Ann
January 29th, 2013
6:07 pm
@ Scrivener – Percentages are reported ranging from 2,3, 4 percent and up to 10 percent. It is difficult to get exact numbers of the gay population, as most of these studies are telephone surveys, which are not very valid, as a lot of people “hang up” and you are only measuring those willing to talk on the phone to a survey taker (people who are not busy, lonely people who will talk to anyone). This is not exactly a true random sampling.
So, if the percentage is as low as you say 2 or 3 %, that is quite rare. And, of those, they are certainly not all interested in being a Scout or a Scout leader. So, the chance that your child would even encounter a gay scout leader or member must be really, very rare then. It must be, like, one in a thousand odds are something. So, why the worry?
Scrivener
January 29th, 2013
6:09 pm
Yes, I do try to obey the laws in the Bible. I don’t always succeed, but I do try daily. No, I don’t think a Scout struggling with his gayness should discuss it with his Scoutmaster. There are tons of other people he could discuss it with. If a child can’t find someone, he could always ask the Scoutmaster to help him to find someone to counsel him with personal issues. If a child is being bullied, he needs to address it with the adults in charge. If it’s at school, he needs to talk to his school counselor. If it’s happening in Scouting, then he should report the bullying to the Scout leaders, but that doesn’t mean he needs to “come out” in order to report the bullying.
Scrivener
January 29th, 2013
6:10 pm
Why the worry, Ann? Because predators find situations where they can find victims. Scouting is a perfect situation for an abuser, as has been demonstrated by past history.
Ann
January 29th, 2013
6:22 pm
@ Scrivener – The way for Scouting to prevent predators is simply to have a rule/policy that children are not ever alone with only one adult and encourage children to speak up when they are mistreated. Teaching children they can report bullying, but must keep something secret in the conversation will not help prevent abuse of any kind (in fact, it fosters the opposite, makes the mistreatment appear shameful). Why would you expect a child to grasp what is okay to discuss and what is not? As, if it is shameful to discuss something with a trusted elder?
Scouting, as evidenced by the past, was not able to prevent predators when they excluded homosexuals. The majority of pedophiles are heterosexual. They desire power. It is not about sex, but power. This is true for pedophiles and rapists. Boys are targeted more than girls, because boys are more often than girls vulnerable and troubled, and less likely to speak up and report what is happening (because they have been taught that it is something to be ashamed of).
The Scouting organization needs to implement safety policies similar to other organizations – kids not alone with one adult, no child behind a closed door with only one adult, etc. This applies to any gender, sexual preference, etc.
Scrivener
January 29th, 2013
6:34 pm
Ann, you clearly know little about Scouting. It is virtually impossible to implement to one-adult rule you’re advocating. There are way too many hikes, camp-outs, bathroom trips and other situations where people are separated for myriad reasons. Your comments about reporting bullying make no sense. I’m sorry, they just don’t. There are plenty of people a Scout could and would counsel with about their sexuality without involving a Scouting leader. Involving the Scouting official would put them in an unfair position unnecessarily.
PHILIP HORN
January 29th, 2013
6:42 pm
no gays in boy scouts…i mean really wont we ever get enough of this brow beating and gay praising…i mean they say they cant help it …its in their jeans……well letem keep it in their jeans and not infect some innocent boys…….let them join the girl scouts and that would be a perfect solution…..no gays to mess with the boys and they surely wouldnt bother the girls…….No matter what minority nutjob comes up with an idea, then the whole world has to stop being the majority and become one of the poor mistreated,misunderstood minority……..this has to stop somwhere…….and dont let me hear anybody say he has never been around gays…well yes i have…a very close relative and friend of mine wasgay and he contracted hiv and lived maybe 4 or 5 years…it wasnt pretty for any of his friends and family………come on common sense ,make a pass at the United States again…..see if she can handle it again……
Vast Right Wing Conspiracy (aka "Knuckle-Dragger")
January 29th, 2013
6:47 pm
Enter your comments here
Vast Right Wing Conspiracy (aka "Knuckle-Dragger")
January 29th, 2013
6:51 pm
Going to have to change “Physically strong, mentally awake, and morally straight” if you let the homosexuals and pedophiles in. Who is going to let their son(s) attend the weekly meeting, much less two weeks at Philmont or Northern Tier with a homosexual or pedophile? Answer – nobody but absolute morons.
The Canadian Scouts tried this a number of years ago. They basically do not exist anymore.
Ann
January 29th, 2013
6:52 pm
@ Scrivener – My family growing up was heavily involved in scouting – both Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts. I was in Girl Scouts. My father was a Scoutmaster for many years. My brother was an Eagle Scout. Most kids old enough to be on a camp-out would not need an adult to go into the bathroom with them. Most troops we were involved in had several leaders and volunteer parents on outings. If Scouts want to continue to have volunteer leaders, they need to minimize liability and have standard policies. Yes, there will be an occasional time when you can’t maintain the rule; but, I would think any parent volunteer would want to have more than one parent or leader supervising at all times, for basic safety reasons.
As far as saying all the rules of the Bible should be followed and people should not “pick and choose”, the Bible is filled with outdated laws and rules. Here’s just a few of the laws in the Bible: You can’t eat pig or seafood. Can’t cut your hair or beard in a rounded manner. Can’t have tattoos. Can’t remarry after divorce. If a child curses their mother or father, they are to be killed. A daughter found not to be a virgin must be stoned by the men in the town. Women must not speak in church. You must not work on a Saturday or you shall be put to death. Just a few. To say you don’t “pick and choose” is not being honest about the Bible and how it applies to modern life.
Voter
January 29th, 2013
7:33 pm
@Big Mama -”If you could make a logical argument that did not rely on biblical mythology”
The Bible is not mythology, it’s fact. Sin is sin. We’ll be praying for you.
Obama Is Wrong
January 29th, 2013
8:24 pm
Ann,
You are right about one thing, it is probably good that we never meet. I believe that god calls us to be resolute in our faith and obedience to his word. So called Christians who are more concerned about hurting someone’s feeling or exposing children to immoral behavior do not seem to follow god’s word. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but I wholeheartedly disagree with you and others like you. You call me extreme, but what is extreme about being faithful?
God
January 29th, 2013
8:26 pm
@Voter
The bible is mythology created by idiots who ate too many mushrooms. Burning bush…..REALLY???
God
January 29th, 2013
8:28 pm
@Obama Is Wrong
It’s because of people like you that the church is losing patrons. Please stop pretending that you know me.
God
January 29th, 2013
8:29 pm
Enter your comments here
Ann
January 29th, 2013
8:34 pm
@ Obama is wrong – My Christian beliefs are not about avoiding hurting people’s feelings. The God I worship is a loving God. I focus my displeasure on those who truly do harm to others – physically or through words. A homosexual person who loves someone of the same gender falls under the category of being a loving, human being, in my Christian faith and how I was taught growing up in a Southern Methodist mainstream church. I do not recall Jesus ever saying “Let’s round up the homosexuals and keep them separate from us.” He mingled with all, was gentle and loving in his dealings with all. I follow his example in my daily path.
Observer
January 29th, 2013
9:02 pm
@loyalscout. Your post today at 4:37 p.m. Simple, concise. Enough said. Thank you.
Kat
January 29th, 2013
9:09 pm
@Voter and @Obama is wrong. When you “separate” yourselves from people, you label it as “free choice.” I label it as “intolerant.” Should women who’ve had abortions not be allowed to be Girl Scout leaders?
Ann
January 29th, 2013
9:44 pm
The Scouts are changing their policy now because they see that the tide has shifted in the U.S. For the first time, more Americans now support gay marriage than those who don’t. And, if you look at the under 30 statistics, it is an even greater percentage. They are facing the realization that bigotry is on the way out. Allowing local chapters to make these decisions will at least give parents choices (a traditional, closed Boy Scout group or an open-minded, progressive Boy Scout group). I think there will be plenty of each in the next few years.
Scrivener
January 29th, 2013
9:46 pm
Ann, you are referring to the Jewish laws of the Old Testament in regard to the purity codes. Those codes don’t apply to Christians and are forgiven by Christ in the New Testament. You and many others put great emphasis on treating others as they would treat you and not judging others, but it is just as important that we are commanded to repent of our sins – to go and sin no more, as Christ said. That’s the part that lots of people want to overlook. You speak of harming others. Encouraging sin is a harmful thing for anyone to do, especially someone who considers themselves a Christian.
RGB
January 29th, 2013
9:50 pm
I remember a while back my comments pertaining to another subject were blocked. They were not profane or vulgar; they were just odds with the hostess of this particular blog.
But it’s OK for someone to have a screen name of “God” and says the burning bush was a myth.
Lesson learned: Blasphemy OK, disagreement with the hostess not OK.
I won’t darken this blog again.
Scrivener
January 29th, 2013
9:50 pm
“bigotry is on the way out” ? More name calling. The world is becoming more secular unfortunately, and people are doing whatever makes them feel good. Go with popular culture if you wish, but as someone else pointed out, on the last day we are all accountable.
Obama Is Wrong
January 29th, 2013
10:09 pm
Ann,
I also believe in a loving god, but in a just and knowing god. I was also raised in a southern Methodist church that taught me there is no discounting or ignoring god’s word.
Kat,
Any woman who committed an abortion is a murderer and should be in prison. Whoops, that is being judgmental? No, that is being truthful. Only non-Christians, secularists, liberals, etc can reason that abortion is anything but murder.
To those of you that call me extremist, judgmental bigot, etc. Those words don’t bother me for I know in my heart I am following the word, the truth and that is all that matters.
Private Property Rights
January 29th, 2013
10:15 pm
The Boy Scouts is a PRIVATE organization. Period. What they choose to do and who they allow in either as a scout or a counselor is THEIR business and nobody else’s. They have a responsibility to insure the safety of others they take temporary charge of (camping, etc.) but nothing else. Parents need to decide for themselves whether the scouts are right for their boys (and girls) and act accordingly. Parents think nothing of turning their children over to the government every single week day of their childhoods while sexual predators occupy positions of authority, violence, gangs, drugs, etc. run rampant and the education (if you want to call it that) is substandard.
Maybe parents should care more about the horrible government prisons they send their kids to every day and worry less about the sexual orientation of the guy leading the scout troop for the few hours they spend in his company.
An interjection
January 29th, 2013
10:16 pm
We can’t all be God. Or can we?
An interjection
January 29th, 2013
10:17 pm
Enter your comments here
Bobo
January 29th, 2013
10:31 pm
Who is really ignorant here? The ‘close-minded’ people who know the scientific journal papers that say that more than 50% of gay men were molested as boys (and the papers do exist….they are surpressed by the mainstream media) or those of you who are proud of the fact that you live a lifestyle that promotes the behavior of lubing up an anus with crisco and jamming something into a rectal canal the wrong way into a pile of feces? Wow, nothing like another man’s sweaty hairy butt. Nothing like helping to spread the AIDS epidemic like wildfire to be proud of…..As if this wasn’t shameful enough, you want your own parades, your own holidays, you want to rest of us to celebrate for you, you want a character on every sitcom, an athlete in every locker room, and you want to police the rest of us and force us to accept your choices or else you’ll vilify us as ‘ignorant’ and ‘hate-filled’ or whatever. You want us all to re-write history and biology and drink your Kool-Aid, but some of us won’t do it and we never will and we will be JUST FINE if we NEVER prescribe to your thinking and we will ALWAYS teach our children that those choices are just not okay. So go ahead and get a tennis ball, barbie doll, baseball bat, sock puppet, whatever stuck up your anus, but don’t expect me to throw a parade for you and don’t expect me to sit by the wayside and pretend its okay if you want to ‘lead’ my kids over the edge of a cliff. Now just wait…..I’ll get the typical response about being ‘homophobic’ and I’ll be mocked because I have some fear that my kids will turn gay or I’ll be told it’s not 1950 anymore…..and guess what? I DON’T CARE. Be gay if you want, but get it out of my face.
Chuck
January 29th, 2013
10:59 pm
Jake, Yes the fight for civil rights for blacks and gays are not equal. That is clear. You can marry whomever you want, you can serve openly in the military for many years, you can’t be fired from a job in most states because you are black, you can join the boy scouts, you can flaunt your lifestyle with pictures of your family on your desk at work, you can’t be jailed or killed in many countries because of your lifestyle, you don’t have to face day to day open discrimination because when people see you they know you are black and won’t be able to assume you are not, so won’t openly bash your lifestyle/race directly in your face. Yes, we have different pigmentation and different DNA. Sometimes it’s harder when it’s hidden inside. I appreciate your belief in civil unions, but separate but equal isn’t equal and doesn’t cut it (remember water fountains, buses, cafeterias, segregated schools)?. How about we have people voting on black marriages (or interracial marriages “the downfall of civilization as we knew it”)? Maybe civil unions for them would be just fine? Maybe individual scout troops or sponsors can decide if they want to allow blacks in their troops? It’s a private organization you know. Shouldn’t the majority have their way? Why should government be involved? Why should a minority expect civil rights to be forced upon everyone? Pigmentation makes a difference? Yes, I guess it does. You don’t have to wait years for closeted blacks to come out as acceptable successful role models for society to understand that not all blacks/gays are out to destroy their kids, neighborhoods, just live for self gratification or whatever. Give the scouts free rental use of public spaces, charitable donations, etc. and let them do whatever they want? Would it bother you if you read comments stating if the scouts allow blacks I’m pulling out my kid immediately? Who would want a black or a pedophile or a sinner, for a leader of their kids? Of course the irony of the statements referring to morality issues in the organized religions or the scouts is astounding to read in and of itself. And let’s leave it up to the individual states. You can marry (same race/interracial, same-sex) in some states that won’t be recognized in others (if you want your marriage to be recognized just stay in states that recognize it!) Driving? Just drive in states that recognize your license is valid and stay out of the others! Taxes, benefits, etc? Let’s see, if my spouse lives in California it’s one set of rules, if in Georgia another, on the Federal level another still? Thankfully we are getting equal treatment. It’s long past due. You should be thankful your civil rights came earlier than ours.
As for Bobo’s comments I can’t wait till he flys into SFO Harvey Milk International and sees a real parade and celebration. I guess he thinks MLK holiday should be abolished as well as any MLK parades. Why celebrate diversity, equality, and progress if we can promote ignorance and hatred instead? Here’s to an even brighter future for us all coming very soon!
Techmom
January 29th, 2013
11:13 pm
@Ann – BSA has a very good Youth Protection Policy in place now. Anyone can take it and YOU MUST take it to become a registered leader AND it expires every two year so you have to continue to take it. Rule #1 is No 1-on-1 contact, there must always be at least two leaders present and adults are not allowed into tents, bathrooms or other sleeping quarters of Scouts unless it’s an emergency. There’s also a portion of training for youth that talks about what is inappropriate and how they should report anything that happens to their leader and parent immediately.
I do believe BSA members and leaders let boys down who were abused in the past by not reporting issues to the police but when most of the abuse occurred it was during a time when abuse was a hush-hush thing in our society that people felt better not talking about. It was not right but it was a different time (just as allowing gay people into BSA was not something people even thought about 10 years ago). It was not the right thing to do and there’s nothing that says abuse will never occur again, but I do believe the BSA has made strides in the right direction to protect the youth of today and the future.
In case anyone is truly interested, anyone can take the Youth Protection Training online on this site: myscouting.scouting.org.
FarTrain
January 29th, 2013
11:46 pm
The Boy Scouts have been around for many, many years but this could very well be the beginning of the end. With all that’s going on, it could also mean the end of this country in just a short time.
Chuck
January 30th, 2013
2:00 am
Far Train, The country has ended several times. When women got the right to vote, when interracial marriage was legalized, when Christmas trees became holiday bushes, when gays got to serve openly in the military, when same sex marriage was approved, etc. I’m sure we’ll make it through the evolvement of the scouts as well.
Bot
January 30th, 2013
3:12 pm
The BSA should not discriminate against boys, unless any boy is advocating sexual activity prior to marriage (homosexual or heterosexual). With regard to leaders, Father Bernard Groeschel of Westchester County New York, the Catholic Church’s expert on abuse in the Catholic Church, says that 90 percent of the abuse by Catholic priests is done by homosexuals who constitute 10 percent of the Catholic clergy. That means that homosexual priests abuse 81 times as frequently as heterosexual priests. The BSA should retain current policy on adult leaders!
Ann
January 30th, 2013
3:40 pm
@ Bobo – Aren’t you aware that more heterosexuals acquire HIV and AIDS than homosexuals, in the U.S. and worldwide?
Ann
January 30th, 2013
3:59 pm
@ Private Property Rights – You are right that the Boy Scouts are a private organization that can make their own decisions regarding membership. And, apparently, they have done so with this recent change. As there were board members, regional and local members, and Scouts that sought this change from within.
A more important question for me and one that occurred here in Georgia, is the cover-ups and lack of transparency regarding past Scout abusers. That it was a different time period, when things were “hush-hush” is no excuse. Bystanders, witnesses, and those who know abuse is occurring who do not protect children is one of the worst types of sin in my book.
Here in Georgia, how could a Baptist pastor in Athens, who later became the Executive Director of the Georgia Baptist Convention for many years, “not” report to the police repeated abuse by the local boy scout leader, who was also a church member and “upstanding” citizen of Athens? He passed the buck (in a Joe Paterno manner) to others in his church to talk to the accused leader. He knew the abuser kept an apartment for this purpose. Many boys were abused over the years as a result. Is it not the province of pastors to protect children from “known” abusers? That is where the focus should be, not on excluding whole classes of people, as there are a percentage of pedophiles in all groups. Details are at: http://www.ajc.com/news/news/in-scouts-sex-abuse-scandal-dark-secrets-for-a-mod/nSwxL/
Jimbo
January 31st, 2013
4:47 pm
Marriage, family, and babies need to be supported and promoted. Deviating from these promotions is an error. Promoting, by grooming a young boy toward homosexuality, is an attack on families and babies. This Gay scout leader promotion is not about helping anyone, and could poison a child’s development. Let us please be good to pre puberty children. They need to be protected not victimized.
Cheryl Bruette
February 1st, 2013
8:41 pm
I understand how people are against the BSA changing this policy and up until ten years ago I would have been too. I had this same attitude, I don’t want my son spending time with a gay male, they may get tainted. Then I had five close cousins reveal that they were gay and then worked with three male co-workers, my attitude changed.
Let’s look at this as these “gay men” being individuals’ when we do this don’t they deserve to be treated as every other individual? When we let our views effect our speech and communication with the “gays” aren’t we dehumanizing them as humans. A statement I recently read in Ethics in Human Communication, 6th edition states the following;” A technique that dehumanizes, makes a person less than human is unethical.” I believe that we can argue that our statements here and the policy of not allowing “gays” in organizations is dehumanizing them. That is probably something that we haven’t thought of it isn’t it.
The other point that I would like to bring up is a simple one, most “gays” are not predators, just like most straight people are not. The stereotype is that they are or that they will influence another child, it doesn’t work that way. They are individuals with respect for children and people. The homosexuals that I know, are more respectful than most “straight” people.
I think that BSA needs to have policies in place if the do change their policy and the board will need to decide how they can do that ethically. Everyone needs to have their eyes open but understand these are individuals that are normal in every aspect.
Cheryl
Works Cited
Johannesen R., Valde, K, Whedbee, K. Ethics in Human Coummunication, 2006, sixth edition
Common Sense
February 4th, 2013
11:32 am
Wow, before the gays complain, they look at the BiLaws of the Boy Scout organization. It’s not based on hate. If you don’t like the rules, then DON’T JOIN!. Simple as that.