Schools vs. parents: Who decides what’s for lunch?
We often talk about helping kids eat better and what role schools and parents should play in that process. Well the internet is buzzing about a public school in Chicago where the principal said kids had to buy the school lunch, assuming it would be healthier than anything they brought from home.
I’ve read multiple versions of the story and here are some facts and quotes that strike me as the most interesting:
1. The no-sack lunch rule has been in place for six years so why is everyone just noticing it now? Where has the uproar been for six years?
2. Another Chicago school handles it a different way – they just take junk food away from the kids and return it at the end of the day. (I think this would be an administrative nightmare for the teachers or lunchroom ladies. Can you imagine returning the food: “No! That’s my Twinkie!”)
3. This point was made in The Chicago Tribune story:
“This is such a fundamental infringement on parental responsibility,” said J. Justin Wilson, a senior researcher at the Washington-based Center for Consumer Freedom, which is partially funded by the food industry.
“Would the school balk if the parent wanted to prepare a healthier meal?” Wilson said. “This is the perfect illustration of how the government’s one-size-fits-all mandate on nutrition fails time and time again. Some parents may want to pack a gluten-free meal for a child, and others may have no problem with a child enjoying soda.”
3. Also from The Chicago Tribune:
“For many CPS parents, the idea of forbidding home-packed lunches would be unthinkable. If their children do not qualify for free or reduced-price meals, such a policy would require them to pay $2.25 a day for food they don’t necessarily like.”
“We don’t spend anywhere close to that on my son’s daily intake of a sandwich (lovingly cut into the shape of a Star Wars ship), Goldfish crackers and milk,” education policy professor Diane Whitmore Schanzenbach wrote in an email. Her son attends Nettelhorst Elementary School in Lakeview. “Not only would mandatory school lunches worsen the dietary quality of most kids’ lunches at Nettelhorst, but it would also cost more out of pocket to most parents! There is no chance the parents would stand for that.”
4. From AOL on just how healthy school lunches really are:
“But Susan Rubin, a nutritionist and founder of the Better School Food program, said lunches offered by large food providers like Chartwells Thompson are not necessarily more nutritious. …”
“It’s rare that I see a school, especially a public school, that actually serves food that’s good,” she told AOL News in a phone interview today. ‘I get physically sick just looking at it, because it makes me sick that kids are eating this processed crap.’ “
At our new school, I thought they were going to be much stricter about what parents could send in for snacks and lunches. Their publications say it’s supposed to whole grain and non-sugar. I was glad they were setting the bar high, but when I visit the cafeteria I don’t see that many people sticking to it.
I do think that our new school serves far less sweets at school parties. I can’t decide if it’s because this community is pretty health focused. (The school is right next to the Y and everyone works out. All the ladies are in shape!) Or if it’s because the parties are just smaller and more focused on activity rather than food here. Walsh’s winter holiday party was held outdoors and consisted of playing running games. The kids had a great time and there wasn’t a sugar cookie in sight. Rose’s party had literally one cookie for each kid and that was it. In Gwinnett the school parties were far more elaborate and the food usually included several sweets.
So what do you make of the Chicago controversy? Can a public school tell parents they can’t send in lunch? What would you do if your school made this rule?
How does your school handle junk food? If they bring it, it’s theirs? Do they request only healthy snacks? What about school parties?
– Theresa Walsh Giarrusso, ajc.com Momania
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153 comments Add your comment
justmy2cents
April 12th, 2011
11:06 am
@ ughh
Well darn, guess I am going to have to go back to school too. I don’t know what a runun sentence is….run-on, yes. :o)
Dan
April 12th, 2011
11:07 am
Ga Born, good point on the pictures I saw one on yahoo the other day, I suppose it would be represent good journalism to actually put a representative photo there.
Sally
April 12th, 2011
11:09 am
Why am I not surprised that this is in Chicago. Home to our President. Who clearly believes that the government should be dictating much of our lives.
Bill King
April 12th, 2011
11:11 am
Lunch Menu in Forsyth County for Spring (actully looks pretty healthy) But let me and my kid make a choice.
http://www.forsyth.k12.ga.us/129410616211242937/lib/129410616211242937/ElementaryMenu-Spring2011.pdf
Maybe, the lunchroom workers in the picture should eat what they are serving.
Dan
April 12th, 2011
11:12 am
I am shocked that a priciple of a public school actually wields this kind of authority.
When is the last time so many from the left and right agree on how inane a certain public action is
Wouldn’t this be a slam dunk court case if someone was to challenge the school?
GeorgiaBorn
April 12th, 2011
11:13 am
Sally, see my earlier post to Tuna. Some of you people are really unbelievable.
GAgirl
April 12th, 2011
11:15 am
There are other types of food allergies besides nut, dairy, wheat, soy, or fish. I have been allergic to carrots since birth. I start going into anaphylaxis shock when I injest any form of carrots. This is related to a birch pollen allergy. Take a moment to read labels and see what carrots are staples in. For example, chicken stock, some ravioli, some brands of rice, and some spaghetti sauces. I did not eat the school lunch because of this issue. I still have issues eating anywhere unless I can ask what the ingredients are.
Personal Responsibility
April 12th, 2011
11:17 am
This scares me along with so much the government is involved in. There is no reason at all for the government (local, state or federal) to have any role in what’s in my child’s lunch box. In the last 50 years the government has inserted itself into so many areas that are really personal areas of responsibility that it’s scary. I don’t think the government should be inolved in religion, public radio or planned parenthood (among many other things) – let alone how I choose to feed my children.
GeorgiaBorn
April 12th, 2011
11:17 am
Dan, I actually Googled this for a while just trying to find a menu of what they are actually serving these kids and couldn’t find anything. I would be interested to find out what a typical lunch menu is for these kids.
And I suspect the reason that so many left and right agree that we shouldn’t be told what to feed our children is because this is not a political discussion although many in here have tried to make it political.
Sharon C
April 12th, 2011
11:20 am
I wouldn’t be surprised if there are some board members with friends or family who are benefitting from the school’s contracts with providers of these “nutritious lunches.” I’m appalled they are taking this “choice” out of the hands of parents. Who are they to decide how my child should eat?
JesusFreak
April 12th, 2011
11:21 am
When I eat lunch with my child, it is reinforced how much better off we are with lunch from home than the disgusting slop they serve. Funny how even the teachers say how bad the food is… Government cannot and will not ever tell me how to raise my child, end of story. There’s a great incentive for homeschooling if ever there was one, along with the myriad reasons stemming from the curriculum that is being forced upon children in some states, it is the homo agenda, glad that isn’t here yet but that’s another topic for another day. BTW, regarding the comments about how the garbage being brought by the free lunch kids should mean that they aren’t entitled to a free lunch makes sense but in this world the parents who are mooching off the govt. are also the ones with the Escalades with spinners and the latest cell phone. They have money for tattoos, alcohol and cigs but need free food handouts. Not making this up, I have had to deal with it on a regular basis and it really stinks for those of us struggling with a job and taxes to support the leeches. Good thing for a much better permanent home, this world is going to the dogs, though really that is a bit of an insult to dogs who have more dignity than that.
The Captain
April 12th, 2011
11:23 am
This has nothing to do with nutrition, and every thing to do with sales. This is what happens when people vote only for candidates that have run their own business. The school in this case is acting exactly as a private school would, it’s attempting to maximize it’s profits. I love all the whining about how a private schools should be the answer to this, when in fact private schools not only could do this, but could institute even more restrictive policies on parents (they could say no child could be dropped of by their parents for example and must take a pay bus there).
But luckily since this is a public school, the parents can vote to remove the school board that has allowed this to happen, where as if this was a private school they would have no recourse. But of course that is what the whining conservatives want, the dislike the idea of democratic oversight of anything.
Dan
April 12th, 2011
11:25 am
GAborn perhaps not directly political, but I suspect not many would take a bet (regardless of their political bent) against the fact that the principle in question is far left.
Carla
April 12th, 2011
11:27 am
@ Gretchen – I understand this statement:
“My kids eat what my paycheck can afford. If I do not send a meal, and do not send money, the government school officials gives my kids a pbj and water, in a brown paper sack. The hypocrisy.”
When my child, who is now a Senior, was in Elementary School, I normally loaded her account for the month; however, on one occasion I inadvertently forgot to reload her account. To my surprise, they fed her peanut butter and jelly served on a little waffle type something and gave her milk! The teacher, along with the administration, allowed her to go hungry that entire day without even an attempt to contact me or my husband. So, I agree that this is a HYPOCRISY … if the system is really interested in children eating properly they would not feed them crap such as this; and they take extra steps in contacting parents when situations such as the one I shared happens!
Dan
April 12th, 2011
11:30 am
Captain, you have it all wrong, while you are correct a private school could do this if they chose, they would not because they would lose customers and when they lose customers they no longer get paid. When a parent removes their child from a public school they still must pay and it takes a large public movement to hold a school board accountable and even then it is a political process. Which is why it is important to have people with real world experience in charge
JB
April 12th, 2011
11:30 am
This is a terrible infringement on the rights of (so-called) free Americans. While some parents should do a better job providing nutritional food to their kids, a school lunch is going to do little improvement. Is the lunchroom going to start going home with each kid to monitor all the other unsatisfactory parenting behaviors as well? As a teacher, who eats in the lunchroom at least twice each week, I find it hard to believe the lunchroom meals are, so-called, “healthier”. While they may served a more “balanced” nutritional meal, (1 meat, 2vegetables, fruit, and milk) there is no way it is healthier. The quality of the food is not the same standard of wholesome foods that parents can provide from the grocery store. Healthly and balanced are not the same. Besides, if I want to let my child have a “Little Debbie,” then that’s my business anyway.
KGray
April 12th, 2011
11:31 am
Some of the posting on here are total ignorance. I can’t believe the comments that have been posted, regarding sending junk food for your children to eat instead of a healthy meal. That’s why your fat A** kids are obese and have health problems. My husband is a pediatrician an he tells me about how the parents allow their children to eat whatever they choose. Our obesity rate is at epedemic proportions and you people and sounding like Sarah Palin who has the brain of a 2 year old when it comes to comprehension and correctness. I agree that bag lunches should be eliminated from our school lunches with the exception of those who suffer from food allergies. Some children only eat health meals when they are in school; because, their parents are too lazy to cook and want to fast food them to death. Please, people this has nothing to do with the governmnet trying to tell you what to do, this is a matter of saying our childrens lives and health.
The Captain
April 12th, 2011
11:31 am
@Dan I bet they are a right winger who is just doing what’s best for “sales”, and “maximizing the schools profits” and are just putting a PR spin on it.
Dan
April 12th, 2011
11:32 am
ga born the actual link above to the chicago trib at least suggests it is real picture of a lunch at that school a pile a sloppy “enchiladas’ and a milk carton. either way it is not very informative
Dan
April 12th, 2011
11:33 am
Captain schools don’t make profits they simple tax and spend, liberal doctrine 101
a_mom
April 12th, 2011
11:37 am
If any of you have frequented your child’s cafeteria to have lunch with them, you’d know that the food they serve is not very healthy. I go roughly every 2 weeks to take turns having lunch with my children and it’s what I call carnival food every single time – corn dogs, pizza, burrito, hot dog, hamburger, chicken nuggets, etc. And it doesn’t even taste very good. If they’re requiring kids to buy lunch, then it must be because they’re making some share of the profit from the sales.
When I was in school, I remember having things like sliced turkey with gravy, red beans and rice, meat loaf, etc. along with vegetables and a cookie or pudding for dessert. It was more like the kind of food your mom might serve at home. The stuff today is like what you’d get at a fast food restaurant (but not as tasty).
Big Daddy
April 12th, 2011
11:37 am
No government should be telling parents what to pack their kids for lunch. That’s the parents’ responsibility. And any parents that subjugates themselves to the State on issues like these are lambs to the slaughter. Wake up, Sheeple! Take responsibility for your own actions and give our government overlords a big F-U.
The Captain
April 12th, 2011
11:40 am
@Dan then you need to educate yourself on how school lunches are made, sold, and who pays for, and makes money off what. But it’s typical that most conservatives really do not know anything about how institutions are run economically.
GeorgiaBorn
April 12th, 2011
11:43 am
Amen KGray! I have friends whose oldest daughter is 10 years old. She weighs more than my wife. Both parents are obese and the only time their daughter has anything close to a healthy meal is when she is at school. Most other times it’s fast food, cookies, cakes, pies and sodas. This poor little girl is about 60lbs overweight at 10 years old. She is doomed for a life of health problems and ridicule. My heart breaks for her.
Maybe just maybe this principal’s policy is to help children? I can’t speak for her reasoning but if the kids at this school get one good meal a day, then I support it even though most parents probably make wise choices for their children.
Old Time Educator
April 12th, 2011
11:44 am
I wonder more about the Constitutional rights of the students. If I choose to keep a Kosher kitchen, and that’s how I choose to bring up my children, there is no principal in this nation that has a right to go against my religious rights and insist that my kids eat non-Kosher. I doubt very seriously that this cafeteria separates the meat from the dairy, uses different utensils for each, that it’s been blessed by a Rabbi, etc. I know other cultures/religions have dietery requirements as well. So, I can’t help wondering how they handle this.
OTE
RamblinRed
April 12th, 2011
11:46 am
This sounds like a rank overreach of authority.
My son has a gluten free diet – I can’t get that type of food at school.
We had to hire a lawyer this year to insure that our child got the appropriate accomodations for him that are necessary for him to succeed in public school. The school system din’t take us seriously until we hired a lawyer to deal with their intrasigence.
You just can’t trust school systems anymore. They are run like mini dictatorships.
tracey
April 12th, 2011
11:49 am
i dont’ think is an attempt to take parents rights away, so much as it is an attempt to make money.
JR
April 12th, 2011
11:50 am
Our schools are frequently incompetent in their primary responsibility of educating our children. What makes anyone think they know best how to feed them. How about we leave this one to the parents?
a_mom
April 12th, 2011
11:51 am
@Georgia Born 11:17am – I just looked up our elementary lunch menu & here are the entrees for the week (I won’t list all the side dishes):
Monday: French Toast with syrup & sausage OR Hamburger
Tuesday: Crispadors with cheese sauce OR Quesadilla
Wednesday: Popcorn chicken OR BBQ
Thursday: Whole grain pizza OR Ravioli
Friday: Turkey corn dog bites OR Fish sticks
Looking at next week’s menu, I see mini sliders, pizza, chicken nuggets, tacos… and on it goes. That’s why I call it carnival food. It’s all fast food type stuff. I don’t have any problem with my kids eating fast foods occasionally or going to a carnival… but this is their DAILY offering at the cafeteria.
JonesyGal
April 12th, 2011
11:58 am
This is INSANE. The argument that the school lunches are healthier makes absolutely no sense. And, to those in the comment section blaming this on liberals … I am as far left as it gets and this is absolutely insane. I don’t get how you can try to say this is a liberal vs conservative issue. This is just plain moronic no matter which side of the fence a person sits on.
ID-10-T Error
April 12th, 2011
11:59 am
This happened in Chicago. Why is it front page news in Atlanta? Just pissing people off to see more papers?
Kat
April 12th, 2011
12:00 pm
@a_mom, exactly! What the hell is a crispador? LOL
pam
April 12th, 2011
12:05 pm
I raised 5 kids on brown bag lunches, could not afford to pay for school lunches and did not qualify for free lunch program. My kids had a balanced lunch, consisting of a sandwich, fruit and a snack. Typically did purchase milk at school. I don’t think schools or the government have a right to dictate how parents spend their money and I would certainly be up in arms if I was “required” to pay for a school lunch. What happens if you don’t qualify for a free lunch and can’t afford to buy one, do your kids go hungry because they can’t bring a lunch from home? My kids were allowed to purchase a lunch once a week if they wanted to, but they opted for a bag lunch, didn’t like the school lunches. Everyone is about nutrition and well balanced meals, but it is still the parents right to lead their children in the right direction for eating habits. I believe schools and the government are getting way too involved in private citizen’s rights to choose. This is a democracy not communism.
geez
April 12th, 2011
12:05 pm
Why is it that schools today have the rule over the parents how about this they need to MYOB
GeorgiaBorn
April 12th, 2011
12:07 pm
a_mom, that’s crazy! No wonder The Healthy Kids Act is going to give funds to schools that follow the new USDA guidelines for healthier school lunches. Don’t follow the plan, don’t get extra funding. It’s that simple. Nobody is going to make schools serve healthier lunches but those that do get a pat on the back from the Healthy Kids Act. Of course, those on the right will find something wrong with this too.
I still would like to see the menu being “force fed” the kids in the Chicago school.
shaggy
April 12th, 2011
12:17 pm
Eric the grammar cop @9:55 AM,
In your rant on grammar, you spelled dysfunction – “disfunction”.
That makes you a moron grammar cop. Go back to school.
Carla
April 12th, 2011
12:23 pm
@KGray I think the remarks such as sending kids to school with “snickers, pixie stix and 20 oz coke as a chaser” were purely done “Sarcastically” …. there is no need to attack people’s children as you don’t know if the ones making those statements have overweighted children.
Atlanta Academic
April 12th, 2011
12:26 pm
The United States Department of Agriculture Center for Nutrition Policy and Promotion website provides an online application http://www.mypyramidtracker.gov/ they describe as:
“MyPyramid Tracker is an online dietary and physical activity assessment tool that provides information on your diet quality, physical activity status, related nutrition messages, and links to nutrient and physical activity information. The Food Calories/Energy Balance feature automatically calculates your energy balance by subtracting the energy you expend from physical activity from your food calories/energy intake. Use of this tool helps you better understand your energy balance status and enhances the link between good nutrition and regular physical activity. Keep track of your energy balance history and view it up to one year. MyPyramid Tracker translates the principles of the 2005 Dietary Guidelines for Americans and other nutrition standards developed by the U.S. Departments of Agriculture and Health and Human Services.”
Kat mentioned an analysis of school lunches. This application would be a great starting point. I have used it with success in controlling my own diet.
It is interesting to note that if one eats more leafy greens then one can enjoy more carbs.
Perhaps kids and parents would find it fun to use together in planning whether to buy the school lunch or pack a lunch. I know I did.
The Captain
April 12th, 2011
12:27 pm
@Dan, “Loose customers”, this is what’s wrong with conservatives. They would rather the parents have to pull their child out of a school, interrupt the child’s education, remove the child from their friends, and probably have to drive further, and or pay more, just to attend a different school that let them bring bag lunches. Well in reality, not many parents can or would really do that. While in this case all that needs to be done is to bring this up to the school board through democratic means, and it will be taken care of. But conservatives do not want life to be made simple through democratic means, they demand it be painful through market ones.
And yes, I also read this today about the power of “private” schools have over you kids, and it’s much greater than anything the Gov. has…. ““Most of the websites that are blocked have to do with obscene material, material that is inappropriate,” Falwell said. “It just so happened last week The News & Advance was blocked for a day or two. We’re a private organization and we don’t have to give a reason and we’re not.””
Thats the kind of power conservatives want to give people over your children. The Non-Accountable type of power.
BCSstinks
April 12th, 2011
12:36 pm
Georgiaborn, this is just opinions by many people here that feel it is wrong for even a Principal to say that kids can not bring a lunch from home. It does not matter to me one way or the other what type of school this is because at no point would any person tell me what I could and could not feed my child. As we all know from being in school, the lunches are not the best and the first time a principal tried to tell me or my child they could not eat what they brought I assure you there would be hell to pay. No person has that right I do not care what level they are at..
This is just like saying that because my job has a brand new cafateria that nobody would be allowed to bring there own lunch to work. No matter what anyone says this is all about money for the school period, even if it is in a community that offers a great deal of free lunches. My first thought here is that because of the amount of free lunches they give is why the Principal is pulling this stunt. I assure you that it would not happen with my child…..
GeorgiaBorn
April 12th, 2011
12:39 pm
All good points BCS. Good post.
jarvis
April 12th, 2011
1:02 pm
@Superman, I wasn’t aware that tattooing and molesting were typically seen as raising a child. I was thinking more of clothing, feeding, and sheltering them.
Glad I didn’t grow up in your house.
Tsalagiman
April 12th, 2011
1:02 pm
@ Eric:
” . . . but you can’t even spell the words correctly, or put them together in a manner that resembles English. Stop complaining and go back to school, maybe then you can make a little more money, move to a better school district and feed your kids what you want, until then, stop moaning and get a grip on the English language. Really…you are supposed to set the example for your children…not perpetuate a cycle of disfunction.”
It seems you need remedial English. You have a long run-on sentence and a spelling error. Can you find them? Until you can, you should not attempt to misrepresent yourself as scholarly and so much more “refined.”
jarvis
April 12th, 2011
1:24 pm
KGRAY, I don’t give a ratsass what other parents are sending in their kids’ lunches. I have two healthy fit kids, and even if I didn’t, it isn’t the government’s place to tell me what I should be feeding my children.
They are a bunch of elected a-holes. They deserve absolutely no input into what I feed my kid, how many hours of TV my kid watches, how many books I make my kid read, or how often I make them interract with others.
These are ALL things that I get to decide as a parent. I am responsible for rearing good people not the legislative branch of city government.
Glad I don't have kids when this stuff starts up
April 12th, 2011
1:32 pm
I don’t have children, and at this point, am glad I don’t. I remember being in school though and the food being awful. I took my lunch a lot. I have a dairy sensitivity and have never been able to tolerate drinking straight white milk. Whenever I had to eat the school lunches, the teachers would make me drink white milk if chocolate was unavailable. I’d get sick every time. Still do if I drink plain white milk. My husband proudly proclaims that he never ate a school-provided lunch. His mom was and is a better cook and nutrionist than anybody planning and/or cooking school meals.
Sage
April 12th, 2011
1:53 pm
@ The Captain You are making a fool of yourself with hollow arguments about conservatives – but hey, thanks for giving me a good laugh today!
You can’t force kids to eat these new fangled nutrtional government meals, you can try but it won’t happen. I volunteer on occaison during lunch hours at school for teacher’s duty free and I can tell you that much of what served via the cafe line gets tossed! More waste of a parent’s money and our tax dollars.
The kids that are bringing in their lunches are satisfied with much less waste and there is typically nothing horribly outlandish with what they bring. And sorry KGray, I don’t see candy or other crap you and your precious Dr hubby have described.
GeorgiaBorn
April 12th, 2011
2:08 pm
@Jarvis: The last time I checked, school principals are not elected. I think you must have misread the article if you think elected officials put this policy into place.
Once again, for those of you that keep stating that local or city governments have no right to tell parents what their kids can eat, this was a policy put in place by the principal of that school, not a member of a legislative branch or an elected official. I can’t understand why this is so hard to understand.
jarvis
April 12th, 2011
2:23 pm
GeogiaBorn, the policy has been in place at that school for 6 years. You don’t think it is with the Board’s approval?
Denise
April 12th, 2011
2:38 pm
@Pam, you are the person I have been thinking about the whole time I’ve been reading these comments – a person who cannot afford to buy the school lunch but cannot get free lunch. WTH do they expect YOU to do for YOUR kids? Not feed them? There are so many people who will fit in your category but if anyone suggests changing the system regarding free or reduced lunches folks will catch a fit and the conversation will go to “don’t have kids if you can’t afford them” with no regard to the fact that some people are doing the best they can for their kids and are not looking to get over on anyone.
We are a very judgmental people; by “we” I mean people who are not struggling, hand-to-mouth, in NEED of help. People who can say “I can afford the kids I have”. People who are able to get fresh food for their families and don’t have to make the gas money vs. groceries decision. People who say “get a job” when they think about folks on food stamps buying steak while they are eating chicken tenders. (I’m including myself because I find myself, on some issues, getting pissed off because I think folks are trying to get over (some are) and go off on a rant about it.)
Avatar_Jack
April 12th, 2011
3:51 pm
Installing an iron-clad “eat this baked potato or starve” policy isn’t exactly “encouraging healthy choices.” And yes, this policy will certainly have an impact that extends beyond the classroom– area dumpsters are sure to be ravaged shortly after that afternoon bell sounds.
http://scallywagandvagabond.com/2011/04/chicago-school-bans-real-food/