Natalie Munroe: Should teachers blog, even anonymously, about their students?
CNN and all the cable stations were abuzz about the teacher in Pennsylvania that has been suspended, and may be fired, for blogging about her students.
Natalie Munroe, a 30-year-old teacher at Central Bucks East High School in Doyleston, Pa., didn’t identify her students in the blog, but she did say some mean comments about them. For example:
According to the New York Daily News:
“In her blog, which has since been removed, Munroe referred to her students as ‘out of control,’ ‘rude, lazy, disengaged whiners,’ and called one ‘a complete and utter jerk in all ways.’”
“ ‘There’s no other way to say this, I hate your kid,’ she wrote in one post. ‘Although academically okay your child has no other redeeming qualities,’ she said in another.”…
“I don’t think I did anything wrong,” she told ABC News. “I’m sorry that it was taken out of context but I stand by what I said.” …
“In one tongue-in-cheek post she offered fellow teachers alternative ways to describe students on report cards, such as ‘rat-like,’ ‘dresses like a streetwalker,’ and ‘frightfully dim.’ Of one student, she cruelly joked that ‘the trash company is hiring. ’ ”
“Munroe’s attorney Steve Rovner argues she did nothing wrong, even if she offended people. ‘There’s no Internet policy at her school district. She was free to write and she free to express herself; it was like a personal diary,’ he told ABC.”
Munroe said only seven friends, her husband and herself were “followers” of the blog and that 60 of the total 84 blogs she wrote had absolutely nothing to do with work or her students. Her blog is back up and had 420 followers as of last night.
From an explanation on Munroe’s new blog:
“See, what I’d done was written a casual blog. I talked about everything–such exciting topics as our trip to Sesame Place, my favorite (and least favorite) restaurants, my work experiences, the diaper genie. I had 9 followers–2 of whom were my husband and myself, the other 7 were friends. When I started it, my goal was to write 1-3 times a week, though I didn’t usually have time to do it that much. I ended up writing 84 blogs between 8/9/09 and 11/25/10. (I remember that, at one point, my track of blogging was about equal with my gym-going, but my gym-going eventually surpassed my blog track. I went there religiously at least 3 times a week until my morning sickness started…) I slowed down at the end, writing only about 10 blogs between June and November. I was too busy with being pregnant, teaching a new curriculum, and being harassed at school to write anything between November and February.
“When I wrote, I kept things as anonymous as possible; I know there are crazies out there and I didn’t want anyone trying to track me down. I blogged as “Natalie M” and had no location information or email address or anything listed or accessible. Nor did I ever mention where I worked or the names of students. Yet, there’s this perception that I was trying to lambaste everyone in the school without heed. That’s bollocks.”
“What bothers me so much about this situation is that what I wrote is being taken out of context. Of my 84 blogs, 60 of them had absolutely nothing to do with school or work. Of the 24 that mentioned it, only some of them were actually focused on it–others may have mentioned it in passing, like if I was listing things that annoyed me that day and wrote without any elaboration that students were annoying that day.”
There is a whole lot more on her site and it gives much more insight into her mindset and her purpose. Reading her side of the story did soften my opinion some. However I still have thoughts and questions:
- You hear all the time about teachers getting in trouble for photos they show on Facebook or things they write on Facebook. Facebook is much more private (just your “friends”) than an open blog. I’m unclear why she thought this would be a good idea or even OK even without naming the students and even if it was only a few times.
- Maybe the teacher didn’t realize with Wordpress and Blogspot, you can set it so search engines can’t find it. It won’t show up unless someone has the exact URL. Two summers ago when we were trying to keep everyone updated on my brother’s medical condition, I created a Blogspot blog and made it private. I sent the link to family and friends and they bookmarked it. They were the only ones that could see it. But would that make it OK? Would that make it better if a teacher was writing about her students on a private, non-search engine, blog?
- I am wondering how the students came across it? It’s unlikely that search engines would have picked it up even if not marked private. You have to have a ton of hits for your blog to pull up on Google and Yahoo so if she only had nine followers, I’m not sure how anyone else found it. Hmmmm.
- As someone who blogs for a living about her children and our family life, I have definitely had to learn what is OK to post publicly and what is not. And I have gotten into trouble with friends for including things that even though were anonymous they felt were still private and out of bounds. They felt identified even if they weren’t by name. Even though the teacher didn’t identify the students, are mean comments about them still out of bounds?
- In journalism, there is a standard to be sued for libel that you have prove that someone is identifiable. Now if that teacher has five classes of 30 students a day then probably no one is identifiable if she didn’t use their names. However, I think writing nasty things about her students hurts her credibility and the parents’ confidence in her as a teacher.
- It just occurred to me: Is this the reverse of college students rating and commenting on their professors online? (And as we know people are much more vicious when it is anonymous.) Michael doesn’t think this is not comparable at all: that the students pay a college to be taught where this lady is being paid to teach the kids. Hmm.. have to think on that some more.
So what do you think: Do teachers have a right to vent? Do they have a right to write a journal or diary? Is it OK to do that online on a public blog? How did you feel about her explanation versus what was being pulled by different media outlets? What should happen to this teacher?
– By Theresa Walsh Giarrusso, ajcMomania
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310 comments Add your comment
robinhood1952
February 20th, 2011
9:48 am
What these people are really mad about is that the truth hurts. They know their kids are disrespectful jerks.
Howie
February 20th, 2011
10:01 am
I have a lot of friends who are teachers and what I hear from them is that as a teacher you are not allowed or permitted to tell the truth about a student but rather you are encouraged to be “Politically Correct!” If more teachers would simply treat the classroom as a business and not a day care center the problem would be solved. “Got a troublemaker?” Turn them in. Get rid of them. Write them up as uncontrollable and unable to be educated. Let their parents put them in a private school where they have to pay big bucks for their childs education. THEN they will become concerned..Now we’re talking money..That is the best tool to get a parents attention. Teachers are teachers..They are not psychologists and should not have to suck up to any kid just to keep their jobs..
james
February 20th, 2011
10:02 am
Teachers should vent, and be allowed to vent without fear of prosecution. it gives others an insight on their feelings and about what they are seeing from their (somewhat exclusive) point of view. if interested one can get a feel of the mindset of just one of the professionals entrusted with educating our young.
james
February 20th, 2011
10:10 am
if you can identify yourself or your child from an unflattering,anonymous comment, maybe it is time for either a little self-examination, or a little “get over it”.
corissa
February 20th, 2011
10:31 am
She should be able to say whatever she want to say, how does she voice her opinon. We have opinions and to fire her because of it is ridiculous……
janett
February 20th, 2011
10:39 am
You are right “worry” if you think this teacher is so awful you go teach a day! I would be interested to know how many of these people who are downing what this teachr did have every even been in their childs classroom , been to a PTO meeting or a school board meeting. If you ever have you could see how a teacher could be pushed to this point.
Whether what she did was right or wrong doesnt excuse you from your responsibility to deal with your brat! There is none so blind as he who will not see!
pr8184
February 20th, 2011
10:55 am
The law atates that unless you can prove that what was written is incorrect and causes an adverse impact, it falls into the “get over it” category. I have worked with children for 30 years and prefer them to adults. Unfortunately, the adults have now messed up the children. We are now raising children who are unmotivated,rude, disrespectful, think everyone will love them like their Mama does, and rules are for everyone else. They complete school and have no idea what to do next. They don’t seem to be motivated to find work and are happy to live in their parents’ basement. Parents will call for job information for them instead of making their child do it. I know this is not all children, but it is scary how many are. We have to do a better job of teaching them to think for themselves and be accountable for tehir actions.
Old Physics Teacher
February 20th, 2011
11:08 am
Absolutely she should be fired!
Of course, I also believe any parent who allows their children to say ONE bad thing on Facebook, or myteachersstinks.com should be placed in stocks in front of the county courthouse WITH or without THEIR CHILD (someone is responsible – either the parent for not teaching respect, or the child for the act, or both – for the weekend – with rotten tomatoes placed in a basket beside their heads for people to throw at them. There should be consequences for bad decisions.
If you’re not willing to be consistent on disciplining bad parenting, you have no right to discipline a teacher for blowing off steam. Move on; move on. There’s noting to see here.
socrates
February 20th, 2011
11:10 am
Of course she can -why would anyone think there is the slightest question that she can’t vent her feelings -especially without identifying the students -whats next monitoring personal verbal conversations between teachers to make sure they don’t offend anyone?
OH
February 20th, 2011
11:13 am
Why should she be fired for speaking the truth. She didn’t name one single child, she merely gave her opinion of how evil and bratty some of these kids truly are. Most of these parents want to stay in the dark about their so called “little angels” – nothing angelic about them let me tell you. It truly is a zoo in many of these schools.
And Cammi – I totally agree with you – the color of one’s skin has nothing to do with a school being referred to as a zoo. Some of the little monkeys need to be trained in a real zoo – with honest to God real animal trainers / tamers. Some of these spoiled little brats feel as though people are obligated to take their crap. I have seen better behavior / home training from kids coming out of a project or inner city neighborhood than some of these suburban brats could ever even possess. That lady should sue the parents for having to teach those kids – she should NOT be FIRED!!! She should not have even been reprimanded – apparently she was on her own personal time. I think all teachers should get on board and blog – PLEASE BLOG. Some of us parents want to know what our kids are doing – some of us take care NOT to spare the rod even…..
Roger49
February 20th, 2011
11:16 am
It is not appropriate that an adult in such a responsible position engage in the same rudeness she rails about. She has a right to state that some of these kids do not put forth sufficient effort, are rude and crude and undisciplined, there is lack of parental support, etc. but she needs to express herself in such ways as to disagree without being disagreeable. Shaun Hannity has dibs on that. The school board is cowardly to suspend her.
Devonna
February 20th, 2011
11:24 am
So all these parents are mad because someone called their children out for what they really are? Well, I for one agree with the teacher. I have been out of high school for about 10 years now but even back then there were kids who were exactly as this teacher described. To be honest there are more teens now that act that way than when I was in school. What I want to know is why are the parents mad? They don’t even know if it is their child in particular that this teacher is talking about……unless the parents know that what she is saying is true! In that case the parents need to be held accountable. After all they are the ones that are supposed to raise their child to be a productive member of society, not just another low life criminal, welfare recipient, or someone that feels they don’t have to be nice or provide good customer service when they do have a job. Frankly, I am getting tired of having to deal with those same type of people on a daily basis.I won’t name names but they know who they are, I’m sure a lot of people have run into the same characters that I have and have had the same thoughts that I have had about them…..”How in the world do they still have a job?” and “I would like to knock their teeth down their throat for talking to me like that!” and “I will not shop here again because of the lack of employees with brains, service, and personality.” and “Your parents should have spanked you more because if they did you would know how to act around other human beings.” Enough said.
allyanaz
February 20th, 2011
11:38 am
No, she should not be fired. Her only crime was not to say it to the students’ and parents’ faces. What she said is 100% on target.
Light
February 20th, 2011
11:47 am
What is “professionalism” and “appropriate behavior”? It’s relative as far I can see. I have worked in what should be professional environments. To the external world, great lengths are taken to make everything appear perfect and “professional.” But internally, the leaders gossip, lie, steal, demean and disrespect staff, themselves, and customers. I guess the point is, I’ve read some people say what the teacher did was unprofessional, in poor taste, lacked discretion. But I’m sure she just verbalized what she experiences and hears from other teachers and administrators every day. They talk to one another and they know what the teacher wrote was true. And she only made a few posts but in general her blog was solely not about her students. So why is this an issue, really? Book authors do this same thing all the time; where do you think they get their material???? Had she named names or the blog was solely about the brats, I believe she would have crossed the line. But I think this is being blown way out of proportion considering all the facts. Some parent is just mad because they know they are a bad parent and did not teach their children manners and they just happen to have influence to make the teachers life hell. And some administrator wants to throw the teacher under the bus so it appears that s/he is not in agreement with the teachers venting but secretly agrees and wishes s/he had the courage to do a blog. With that said, if you are going to write or something that may become public, be prepared to stand behind it.
Marissa Hardwick
February 20th, 2011
11:51 am
This teacher should be fired. She should not be a teacher. Juvenile needs a privacy, also what she did was envading the student privacy. She should report to the Juvenile court all the incident about the student instead she post it for everybody to see. She need to loose the job as a teacher. Or else call the parents and talk to them. Like I said Juvenile needs the privacy this is something you don’t post on Face book. Anybody that post on face book must watch what we put there. You cannot put anything there that requires privacy. Bad teacher that’s for sure. She doesn’t have no respect for her own self maybe she want ss to be famous so she did what she did. They have rules from school on how you take care of this ungovernable kids issues. That’s what the principal for to contact the parents and the parents cannot control the kid go to the Juvenile Court, there are so many help the parents can get but they have to report the issues.
FarmerRob
February 20th, 2011
12:11 pm
As I understand it she did not specifically name any individual kid. SO there is NO reason she should even be suspended much less fired. Although if they fire her for this she should immediately file a suit in civil court and show them what punishment really looks like.
I come from a family that is loaded with top notch teachers–and I assure you she did not say anything different that most teachers feel or say at one time or another. It can be a very frustrating profession with knuckleheaded kids who think it is uncool to pay attention in class or make good grades; parents don’t care enough to show up for parent teach conferences or PTA; and school administrators and school boards who spend more time ducking for cover (aka covering their own behinds) than they do seeing to the actual education and discipline of their charges.
Truth
February 20th, 2011
12:13 pm
The Truth is most students aren’t the problem. As with anything a few can spoil the bunch. Parents need to understand that Teachers are not your Babysitters, You’re the parent do your job!!!!!!!!!!!! Stop with the IT’S NOT MY CHILD, cause it is. If you did half of the job instead of worrying what is popular,Coddling them, and coming up with excuses. Your child might get something out of life. Instead we tend to always want to blame someone eles. It is hard being a parent, but you decide that you wanted the JOB, So do it!!!! To All the great Teachers that forced me to try harder, go further. Thank you. Cause I know I was an handfull.
therese
February 20th, 2011
12:26 pm
I think she needs to find a more appropriate place to vent. Venting about her students in a public way is inappropriate this includes blogs. The fact that she doesn’t understand boundaries is evident in the fact that she handles her feelings in this way. It was obviously public enough for people to find out about it.
A good teacher will vent to the appropriate people and would keep it private. I would not want her teaching my kids, not because she vents, but because she has no boundaries or sense of appropriate ways to handle her feelings. Also, as annoying as her students may be to her they still deserve the respect of being held accountable directly by their teacher and not “vented about” on a blog the way you would expect an immature middle school child to do. You don’t have to call people rats – there are many other ways to handle this that will have positive effects and outcomes- that is what teachers are supposed to do. She should leave teaching until she is mature enough to handle the many feelings that come up when teaching children.
dd
February 20th, 2011
12:29 pm
Hey, if she gets others to think and use their brain, isn’t that a good thing?
This country needs to get it’s thumb out of it’s mouth.
Tallcarl
February 20th, 2011
12:33 pm
Yes, if this is still America then she has a right to blog. Two things jump out at me from the beginning. You were bias and even implied that you had softened you feeling some. But the fact you called some of the statements mean showed your own judgemental bias. It is not mean if it is the truth, some students are just as she described. The second thing that seems obvious is you have not spent any time teaching maybe not even as a substitute. Two years was enough for me in a public school. I love to teach but I dislike being a babysitter or warden.
al dingle
February 20th, 2011
12:39 pm
I don’t need to say anything – freedom writers Jefferson or Monroe aticle said it all – Amen brother -
Gordon Dowis
February 20th, 2011
12:48 pm
As a retired high school teacher from Paulding, Ga. East Paulding H/S, after teaching 10-12th grade students in the Technology field of Automotive, a place where students are dumped because they have no clue what they want to do for the rest of their lives, and the system is set to let them dowm after they left the door after grad. I totally agree with ever word she said. And further more, challange ever parent to go sit unanounced in their childs room a few times, or, sit in the hallway if you DARE !! But they won’t, but they will complain about whats NOT being taught at home to their children. Now look in the mirow MON and DAD. I tried to call you several times, but your phone is disconnected, I called you at work, but you quit your job. I sent letters home, but what happen to the mail before you got home? I sent you email, but your account is closed. Good parent skills there. Now your child is acting just like you.
The kids today are rude, talk back, do not follow the rules, do any work, tear up equipment, steal shop supplies, sleep in class or come in under the influence of something, the girls change cloths at school to look like tramps. Now these are your kids that will be in jail, or in the ground before they reach 25.
Face the truth parents, start being a parent first.We only got what you made, and left for us to try and do something with cause you can not handle them.
doc
February 20th, 2011
12:50 pm
As a retired physician, I frequently have come across some fairly toxic patients. If I were to blog about their behavior without identifying them or their medical conditions would that be endorsed as acceptable? Even if our society is full of people that are disrespectful and have frankly appalling behavior, it is still the teacher’s and all of our responsibility to not stoop to name calling, even if neither person is readily identifiable.
Gordon Dowis
February 20th, 2011
12:52 pm
Amen, no teacher today will last 5 years because of thier hands being tied. Bring back the paddle, yardstick, or boat paddle. Then when they get home, dad should be a dad abd spank the tar out of them again!
Cyndy
February 20th, 2011
1:14 pm
Unfortunately for her, this teacher will pay the price whether or not she is officially sanctioned. Her attitude shows. We all know it is difficult to work with children and their parents. It always has been. I have worked in the public school system in different capacities, including human resources, for years. One thing I have learned stands out disgustingly: many teachers either think or come to think that it is all about them. The schools are supposed to be there to educate children, which means that it is supposed to be about the students, who should be taught to respect their teachers. There are some wonderfully and positively impactful teachers out there. Sad to say, however, these teachers have to work extra hard and make a deliberate effort to stay away from the influences of the rotten apples who concentrate on the negative and constantly gossip among themselves in order to find ways to justify their selfishness and hostility. We all have faults – students, parents AND teachers because we are human. Do your job and deal with it, or get out and YOU quit whining, teachers! You all have some of the biggest job jerks out there, yet you complain constantly. Find something else to do if it’s that bad. After 27 years of also being on the other side of it (four children in public school) I’ve seen it from all angles. Many of you put on your phoney face for the parents while you spew your venom in the teacher’s lounge and talk about your students and their parents like they are the enemy. They pay your salary. Act like it.
Don
February 20th, 2011
1:21 pm
Someone needs to tell these kids about their behaviors. Their butts need to wake up and get with the program or they will be living in a Third World country which they created !!
Hmmmmmmmm
February 20th, 2011
1:32 pm
Typical…. This should be a NO news and NO problem for a teacher…. If somethin happens to this teacher, it will essentially be because she has NO backing from her boss…… I have found that most principals are noodle necks and they shake in their boots everytime some parent whines about their spoiled brat child…. It’s really quite sickening….
Hartman Eager
February 20th, 2011
1:35 pm
I’m a retired teacher with 34 years experience. We teachers, most of whom liked and cared about our students, would gripe about them among ourselves. Sometimes those gripes were pretty nasty. But the mean stuff was kept to ourselves. A teacher’s job is to forge a bridge of trust and mutual support of students with parents. To let a parent know that I think little Johnny or Susie is an selfish, slovenly, unmannered brat puts the teacher at odds with both kid and parents. It makes no difference if all of this happens to be true. My advise to teachers is to do your griping privately among yourselves, keep it among yourselves and stay away from the printed word.
Prez Obozo the real CLOWN!
February 20th, 2011
1:53 pm
This lady HAS the right to freedom of speech! I sure can’t blame her either, trying to teach the kids who want to learn but has the class disrupted by a bunch of hoodlums who should be kicked out. Remember the true story movie “Lean on Me”. Joe Clark did what should be done – kick out the animals & save the good kids! GOOD parents of good kids should be allowed to sue these sorry, worthless parents who raise these savages & disrupt the class for ‘Interfering with a childs education! Can’t wait to hear the politically correct respond back! Politically correct people are backside kissing cowards who are afraid to have their own opinion!
Ronnie Reagan
February 20th, 2011
2:27 pm
Teachers should get hazardous duty pay & “tote” a piece dealing with todays modern day scholars!
Prez Obozo the real CLOWN!
February 20th, 2011
3:20 pm
I can tell from reading the broken English where Marissa bees coming from! Quit being lazy & Do YOUR job & raise a child & not a animal! Get him some pants that FIT wit yo EBT entitlement card so he can look professional & not like a prison t-h-u-g!. He is NOT going to be an NBA/NFL star – SISTER!
Shannon
February 20th, 2011
3:37 pm
I read through many of the responses and am irritated.
1) For those who believe political affiliation is related to one’s opinion, and specifically that liberals want to censor Ms. Monroe’s venting on a private blog–I’m as liberal as they come, and I think this matter is utterly ridiculous.
2) For those who argue that she should’ve known the consequences… Consider this much. She did *not* use her own name. She did *not* name the school or community. She did *not* name students. She had *nine* followers.
Obviously someone (probably one of those nine followers) was angry with her and decided to out her blog to administrators. Ms. Monroe then didn’t lie. If she had, this would’ve been a nonstory–but as she has demonstrated, she is a truth-teller. She stands by her words. And it’s interesting, as many have pointed out, that nobody is questioning the content.
2b) Anyone catch the flack that Anderson Cooper got for calling the Egyptian leaders “liars”? Fascinating, because one of the columns I read taking him to task for it also pointed out that everything he said they lied about… they really lied about. It’s time for us as a nation to start speaking and hearing the truth again.
3) To those who don’t like Ms. Monroe’s tone… Thank you for never, ever venting about your job or the people in your life. Saints like you make this world a better (if more judgmental) place. Also, I don’t believe you exist.
4) To those who suggest that parents and students aren’t free to say something about teachers, please get off this blog entirely. I don’t use these adjectives lightly, but you’re beyond-hope stupid and completely ill-informed. For starters, inform yourself with ratemyteachers dot com (the K-12 equivalent of ratemyprofessors dot com). There’s your iceberg tip; search from there. You’ll find worse.
5) I’m not a K-12 teacher (although I have been ranked on ratemyprofessors). There’s not enough money in the world for me to put up with that kind of abuse.
Tiger Ochocinco Mellencamp
February 20th, 2011
3:46 pm
@JATL….the point of the molestation account is this…
First, it was completely hypothetical.
The real question I’m asking is that if you’re defending this teachers actions primarily because (a) she didn’t specifically identify or “out” any student and (b) she was merely speaking the truth, then you’ve set the precedent to say those two items are the standards and any topic the teacher blogs about her students is fair game as long as those standards are met.
So in my hypothetical, you should have absolutely no problem if my kid’s teacher who has had 100 students in her four year career at my son’s school were to blog that a child in one of her classes that she doesn’t name specifically had been molested. No big deal, she was speaking the truth and she didn’t identify the kid.
Just answer me this, yes or no….if my hypothetical situation made news, would you defend my kid’s teacher with the vigor that you defend Munroe?
Amanda
February 20th, 2011
4:05 pm
As an educator, I find her blog to be totally inappropriate. It is one thing to write in a journal, at home, for no one else’s eyes. When one chooses to publish those writings, however, it is a different story. I think one of the problems in education is that as teachers, we are quick to blame kids for everything. Yes, there are rough days in the classroom. Yes, students do sometimes act inappropriately. But we, the teachers, are the professionals, and should act as such. Our students are still kids. They are there, in our care, for us to teach and guide. I have found that most often, when students are acting in a poor manner, the problem is with me, not them. It is MY JOB to inspire students to want to learn. It is MY JOB to teach the subject matter in a way that engages their growing brains. When one respects his/her students and recognizes that what happens in the classroom is contingent on many factors, including one’s view of his/her students and situations occurring outside the classroom, it is amazing the results that can be had. Kids and teens today are dealing with a lot more than just going to school. It is my job to make sure my classroom is an environment in which kids feel safe and secure and able to learn. If I ever get to the point at which I find my students “annoying” enough to blog about it–to any length–24 times within a year, then please make sure I seek other employment. I am certainly not going to be effective at helping develop young minds.
Marko
February 20th, 2011
4:47 pm
This entire sensationalized case can be boiled down to just a few things. Everything else is just, as they say, “window dressing.”
The basics are, number 1: She absolutely has the “right” to her opinion and she absolutely has the right to personally communicate her opinions to her family and friends in any regard she sees fit.
Number 2: In this case, she should not be subjected to firing or even a reprimand because she made this blog with a reasonable expectation that it would not be published anywhere. Therefore it is a private opinion that she reasonably believed to be protected personal communications between her and her family and friends. As such it was not for public consumption.
Number 3: The most important question that we have to ask is: How did the private communication become public? Did her friends or family make this communication public or was it a Facebook (or other site’s) security problem that “accidentally” put her intended private communications on the public Internet? This is important because it would show her intent for the communications to be private and therefore not intended to be for public reading.
Last point, number 4: She did not name a single solitary kid. This shows that she was acting in protecting the best interest of her students regardless if they were rotten or not. This shows that this teacher is a professional above all else. She is human too. Teachers especially get a bad rap for not controlling their classrooms, but when they try to control them they are pushed back by legal-fearing, no-backbone-having administration that gives in to the slightest threat. Try standing up for a change you administrators. Stop blaming teachers and start looking in the mirror. You are the pivot point for this entire issue and change has to start with YOU.
Wise Latina on the Right
February 20th, 2011
5:04 pm
http://doylestown.patch.com/articles/cb-east-students-to-rally-today
What do Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Stanford, the U.S. Naval Academy, the U.S. Military Academy, Villanova, University of Pennsylvania, and M.I.T. have in common? They all count Central Bucks East graduates amongst their alumni and current student body. Hardly, the lazy whiners that Natalie Munroe so publicly blogs about. CB East is a top-ranking public high school, a nationally recognzied Blue Ribbon school and it’s students are leaders in the community. The media didn’t bother to do a little research about the demographics of CB East…nor did they inteview the Class President or the student leadership at the campus. Munroe is a sad, unprofessional anomaly amongst the talented, skilled and professional teaching staff at Central Bucs East high school.
Dane Morgan
February 20th, 2011
7:52 pm
She may have a right to say what she wants to say, but she does not have a right to bring the children she is entrusted to educate into it.
If there are discipline problems in her classroom, a blogspot blog in not the place to whine about them and whining is not the appropriate course of action in the first place.
Lee
February 20th, 2011
10:17 pm
Here are some of the things Ms Monroe allegedly said:
1. There’s no other way to say this, I hate your kid.
2. Although academically okay, your child has no other redeeming qualities.
3. Your child is a complete and utter jerk in all ways.
4. I have a student that dresses like a streetwalker.
5. My students are out of control, rude, lazy, disengaged whiners, rat-like, and frightfully dim.
6. I hear the trash company is hiring.
If I were a parent of a child in her class, I would be real interested in knowing which student she professed to “hate”.
No, what she did was petty, immature, spiteful, and definately not “professional.” She has lost all credibility and I see no way that the school can retain her and maintain the confidence of the parents.
I hope that new career in blogging works out for her….
mad_russian
February 21st, 2011
7:43 am
She didn’t name any students and vented her thoughts. Sorry, it’s called freedom of speech and the district is screwed. If students can do it openly, even when naming a person without punishment (recent court decision that set this tone), then she can’t be held accountable for what she wrote. She’s standing by what she said and people can’t deal with it. Lemmings as always that expect to fall in line with what they consider to be correct behavior. Learn your history and understand that this country was shaped by the brigands and troublemakers a lot more than the “proper” citizens.
Charly
February 21st, 2011
9:40 am
I don’t think this teacher can legally be fired for what she said on her blog. However, if my son was in her class, I would have him moved. My guess is that most parents would have their child moved. If most parents had their children moved, the school would not have a choice but to get rid of her or transfer her. Her credibiltiy has been ruined. I think her behavior (as a leader in the classroom) is repulsive and immature and I don’t think that she is in the right profession.
jarvis
February 21st, 2011
9:44 am
mad_russian, maybe it’s you that needs to learn your history. The 1st Amendment gives the right to free speech where the government is involved. Basically, you won’t be prosecuted for it.
Conversely, an employer has the “right” to fire an employee for any reason. it’s called “at will”. So yes, she had the “right” to say whatever she wanted, and her employer had the “right” to fire her for it. Neither will be subject to any sort of government prosecution.
JATL
February 21st, 2011
10:18 am
@Tiger -I went back and found your original post with the molestation example. To me -again -it’s apples and oranges. If ONE child is singled out to the point where everyone knows who it is -then that’s descriptive enough to be problematic (unless the child and her guardians gave permission). Being horribly molested is a deeply personal and intimate issue (and also one where the student used as an example was a victim) that really isn’t comparable to being an a**hole in class. Again, Natalie Munroe’s blog never singled one particular student out that everyone reading the blog would be able to identify, and the students singled out weren’t victims of anything. These kids NEED to be called on the carpet by society! Teens are old enough to know how to act in a classroom and to be held accountable for their behavior. If they’re going to act like animals, then they need to expect to be treated badly in a number of cases. It will be great preparation for them in a few years when their sense of entitlement gets them kicked out of college or fired and mommy and daddy can’t rescue them anymore. Their parents are so horribly remiss, it’s almost laughable to call them parents at all. If there was only one troublemaker in all of her classes and everyone knew who he was and she described him so that it was easy to figure out who she was talking about, then yes -that’s a problem, but she simply vented in a blog about what a bunch of jerks she teaches, and she’s right. If the majority of people could see what high school classes are REALLY like in many, many of our schools, they would be horrified.
If one of my sons was in one of her classes, I would ask him point blank about his behavior and who exactly was causing all the problems. I would also ask her if my son ever presented a problem to her. I certainly wouldn’t be saying she needed to be suspended or fired for calling out a bunch of brats who deserve it. Bringing up illegal activities, past illegal activities, personal sexual and drug escapades, singling out a student who has been victimized or specifically describing one student to the point of easy identification -none of those are comparable to me to simply calling out bratty, entitled jerks. If, in your hypothetical, she spoke of one student, but no one knew which student it was -I would have no problem with it.
jarvis
February 21st, 2011
11:34 am
@JATL, other than #5 which of these statements “calls a kid to the carpet” in a way that is in any way specific enough to do any good:
1. There’s no other way to say this, I hate your kid.
2. Although academically okay, your child has no other redeeming qualities.
3. Your child is a complete and utter jerk in all ways.
4. I have a student that dresses like a streetwalker.
5. My students are out of control, rude, lazy, disengaged whiners, rat-like, and frightfully dim.
6. I hear the trash company is hiring.
Not to mention that after seeing her interview a few times, she just comes off as a bitch in general so no one is going to take her opinions constructively to begin with.
If I was her employer, I’d dump her.
Concerned parent
February 21st, 2011
11:39 am
I have a sister-in-law who works in the Bartow County school system. She constantly makes negatives statements about her job as a teacher; advising others not to undertake a teaching career and discussing how much more pleasant the school is on teacher work days, when the students aren’t around. She does this on her Facebook page, no less. Does she not know that something you post in a social media site might be viewed by a parent of her students or a prospective employer? This is a college educated woman who thinks she is far more intelligent that the average person. I have some news for her. My first concern is for the students she is tasked to educate on a daily basis. How does this reflect on our educators? I can only hope my children have teachers with better character.
JATL
February 21st, 2011
11:57 am
@jarvis -I am basically saying that she and more teachers need to blog and make known what many of these students are like. Unless you get specific, you can’t do any good with the actual kid, but we’re going to HAVE to do something in our schools -specifically our middle and high schools -that FORCE the parents and students to behave. The reason many charter schools that are successful work is because they FORCE students to behave to the standards that all schools used to have. They also force parents to be involved. If the kid and/or parent(s) don’t play by the rules -they’re gone. When you can’t kick kids out for repeatedly being disruptive fools and you cannot get in touch with their parents (who know as long as you can’t find them, you can’t do very much discipline-wise), there’s a huge problem. That’s where we are now. Most of my former students would be lucky at this point to get a job as garbage collector or ditch digger. The administration of her school, by even questioning this publicly and suspending her, has given all the losers and their parents a giant “win.” As long as we keep coddling and accepting their behavior and parents who never have anything to say until they perceive that someone is questioning their precious baby, you’re going to have crappy schools full of classes where little to nothing is able to be done and a bunch of bratty, entitled morons getting dumped out on society. Munroe’s school should have stood by her, issued a press release stating that her blog was anonymous and her own private business and that quite honestly if any of her students felt singled out, then perhaps they and their parents should closely examine their behavior and attitudes.
JATL
February 21st, 2011
11:59 am
And as far as Ms. Munroe seeming to be a b*tch -well kids need to have some of those as teachers, because they’re certainly going to be putting up with plenty of them in the real world.
jarvis
February 21st, 2011
12:12 pm
JATL, you and I are just not going to agree on this.
If there is one thing middle school aged children have plenty of, it’s the influence of harsh people. I don’t think good natured people are a detriment to the workings of the real world.
My wife teaches small children, but my mother was a middle school teacher (retired), and my sister is a middle school teacher. Sure they get frustrated at times, but that would not excuse them from publically embarassing their employer.
An sure she did it in a way that she thought was anonomous, but obviously she failed in her anonimity since we’re here talking about her (for the 5th day which brings in the questions as to where the hell is TWG for that matter?).
You don’t get to humiliate your employer….not unless you’re briging something unreplacable to the table, and back to my earlier point of hearing her speak, she doesn’t come off as difficult to replace.
Tina
February 21st, 2011
12:21 pm
New Topic PLEASE
ifthereisagod!
February 21st, 2011
1:15 pm
maybe the hack finally got fired!
see
February 21st, 2011
2:16 pm
I am a middle school teacher and *I* was extremely offended by her rant. For those who say that kids have no respect today…well, look at the behavior this teacher is modeling. She claims her students are “whiners” and then proceeds to whine about them. She stupidly claims they are “frightfully dim” in an open forum that anyone can access without thought of how it will effect her job. She states her students show no respect, then uses the most insulting terms to describe them that she can muster this side of profanity. She calls them “irresponsible” and then evades responsibility for her own actions. Apparently, she is just like her students. I’m sure her teachers must have complained about her.