Good touch, bad touch: How to explain TSA pat-downs to kids?

Absolutely not. No. No way. Nope.

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There will be no TSA groping of my children. Ever.

We will not be flying until this policy is officially ended.

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Why should anyone have to be patted down?

I understand security. I knew several 9/11 victims’ families. I know the risk and the threat.

But, if we keep taking security up and up and up (from shoes off to coats off to pat downs to full body scanners), we’re letting the terrorists win by instilling fear in our country and taking our liberties away. By no means am I suggesting to remove all security, but to remember that there’s a risk in any medium, but that doesn’t mean we should be subjected to an increasingly intrusive search. Where does it stop? Sign me up for a full body scan or x-ray or what have you, but I draw the line at touching– especially when it involves children. Let them be scanned and unaware (but tell the parents).

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[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by srdjan basaric, AJCMOMania, TSAagent, infotectravel1, ajcparenting and others. ajcparenting said: AJC's Momania blog: Good touch, bad touch: How to explain TSA pat downs to kids? http://bit.ly/d4F8ad [...]

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There is NO WAY me or my kids are going to be put through this ridiculous invasion of privacy. It’s simple, I just won’t fly until they stop this knee-jerk policy that doesn’t solve anything. Trains, busses, cars and boats are all viable alternatives. I’ll trade a little bit of time to avoid this throwback to the middle ages!

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We’re not explaining it because it’s simply not going to happen. I’m not going to explain that this kind of touching is okay because it’s absolutely not.

We’re driving 17-23 hours to see my parents instead of flying as there are scanners on both ends – and our destination airport is SAN. We fly at least 6 round trips a year but we’ll either have to be more creative with airports or stop flying altogether if this is not changed. We recently picked up an annual pass for national parks, seeing we’ll drive close to 10-15 of them during our trip. Trying to see the bright side here…

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Please call 911 and report all TSA child molesters.
In school the government has taught our children that NO ONE should EVER touch them in areas that their bathing suit covers.

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If you sent your child through the machine, nobody will have to touch them. Enough said. Everyone needs to think for once. Sheesh.

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@Andy Richter: yes, because irradiating children – whose bodies are especially sensitive to radiation – is a brilliant alternative. To say nothing of a stranger taking an essentially nude photo of them.

The idea that these kids need this procedure explained to them is ludicrous. Any parent who subjects their children to either one of these procedures is off their rocker. I don’t care where they have to go in such a hurry – it is insane.

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I don’t know — how DO you explain to a child that “Gee, every person around you is a potential terrorist who would take great joy in blowing you to smithereens while you are flying, so because there are so many 5 year old terrorists in the world walking around with bombs, YOU have to let a perfect stranger feel you all over to make sure you aren’t a bad person. But don’t worry, the chances of a bad person being on our flight are pretty low, since there are SOO many terrorists flying to Cleveland . . . meanwhile, don’t trust ANYONE, because everyone is a bad person.”

Or, my version:

“This is an example of what happens when governmetn runs amuck, and overreacts by slamming the barn door shut after the horse has run away.”

Profiling, anyone? I mean, yeah, there are so many WASP 30 year old women carrying 3 year old bombers . . .

But the TSA chief is starting to back off on the intrusive searches. As with many frequent travelers, I’ve learned to dress appropriately before going through security — jewelry, no belts, slip-off shoes or sandals, etc. The thing that has made me the maddest about airlines charging for a bag these days is that it makes security lines SOO much longer because everyone is cramming steamer trunks into the overhead compartments. If I were the baggage handler union, I’d be suing the flight attendants union for job encroachment! Usually, if I wanted to bring my favorite lotions and shampoo, I’d just check the luggage and not worry about security. Not anymore . . .

My daugher was on the TSA “hit list” for several years — or, someone with her name was. I would always bring her passport with me when we flew, because checking her in usually took an extra 15 minutes while they went to research her, Yeah, that 10 year old wearing a Backstreet Boys t-shirt and a Walkman looked pretty damn dangerous to me, too . . . I finally had to call my congressman and get her off the list. It took almost six months. Sheesh!

I have very little patience with encroachment on civil liberties such as freedom of movement. Yes, I know I can move in other ways. But gee, there was a car bomb in Times Square — did that mean that anyone buying a CAR now is a suspected terrorist? There is a fine line between safety and intrusiveness — and the TSA has crossed it. Innocent until proven guilty is the law of the land, everywhere except TSA, where you are guilty until proven innocent.

I don’t feel safe, warm and happy after going thru security. I feel PISSED.

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One last thing: I had to laugh outloud when one of the pilots who objected to the intrusive searches pointed out, quite reasonably — “Hey, we don’t NEED a bomb, we can steer the darn plane anywhere we want to,.”

Thus proving that, in the case of the TSA, common sense isn’t that common . . .

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Watch the videos all over the web, read the stories all over the web, see the pictures all over the web. Don’t go visit grandma this year, or for the sake of your children, drive or take a bus or train.
Chilren under 12 are being subjected to the pat down. Children are being held steady while the TSA gropes them, and in some cases removes their clothing.
Children over 12 do not need their newly budding pubescent bodies groped and manhandled by STRANGERS in the airport.
Please please please think before putting your children through this.
Consider the looks on their faces when a stranger touches them in ways they have always been told are bad touches, and would be bad touches coming from anyone else at all.
And please look up examples of the images those scanners produce. They are so clear you can see parts of the human anatomy that people would get arrested for exposing in public. Do you really want images like that, of your children, seen by ANYONE?
What are you willing to put your children through “in the name of safety”?
Men, women (even pregnant ones), children of all ages, cancer survivors, people with disabilities… no one is safe from the humiliation and assaults from the TSA.
Protect yourself and your children, DO NOT FLY until the scanners are removed and policies are changed

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AN EVEN BETTER THAN PERFECT REASON FOR A BOYCOTT OF AIR TRAVEL.

Perfect the imaging technology so that flesh isn’t visible & dangerous items are still detected or stop these violations of the Constitution.

There is no excuse for this addition. Check people at border gateway airports & leave interior alone.

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This has to stop. Kids under 12 are exempt from sexually abusive pat downs. TSA forgot that 13-17 year olds are still minors, so kids in this age group will be molested and scarred for the rest of their lives. Pistole and Obama should both have their kids “patted down” by TSA screeners then once their private areas are touched this madness will end immediately.

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I need to get me a job with TSA. hopefully they won’t run a background check.

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TWG…my comment is gone

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Agreed with Annie: there will be NO GROPING of my children EVER. I will not fly till they change this. Period.

I am NOT gonna start amending the rules that I have teaching them their whole lives: No one touches any area that would be covered by a swimsuit. Only exceptions are mom, dad, or doctor. End of story. And overweight, underpaid, undertrained, uneducated TSA agent with a power trip does not make the cut.

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@ I am…or Delta could just fly the broken planes and see what happens…maybe the folks on the plane from NYC to Moscow would have preferred that yesterday. Do you fly every other day?
I flew about once a week, from September 8 until November 7 and this never happened to me during that time period.

That issue would actually be one for the airlines not TSA or our government.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-11-22/moscow-bound-delta-plane-lands-at-jfk-after-engine-shutdown.html

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What Annie Norton said…No way, no how. My daughter turns 13 the day after Christmas, so I guess our flying days are over.

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“If you sent your child through the machine, nobody will have to touch them.”

Andy – That is NOT true. The article states that if they see something on the machine, the child will then be subject to a FULL patdown, regardless of age (not just the modified ones that they get for opting out). So it makes more sense to go ahead and opt your child out, so they can get a modified patdown (whatever that is). Otherwise, you get your child microwaved and then there’s STILL a chance they could get a FULL patdown afterwards! How STUPID!

Like most parents, I’ve been teaching my 3 year old about good touch/bad touch. And it’s a difficult concept for them to grasp. You have to keep repeating the lesson. I’ve drilled it into her that only 2 people can touch her private area – me and the doctor. Period. End of story. So now, what? I have to add “government employee with rubber gloves” to that? This gets very slippery. My daughter gets upset when we talk about this; she’s a very inquisitive child. “Who would touch me there, mommy? Why?”

Look folks, I’m a veteran. I served in the middle east after 9/11. My husband serves and has been to Iraq twice and is preparing to head to Afghanistan for a year. I get it. 9/11 still continues to impact my family in a very, very direct way.

But I’m drawing the line. And I’m drawing it here.

We cancelled our flight plans for Christmas. We will either stay put, or drive.

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First of all, you or your child will have to set off the metal detector before being subjected to either the pat down or the scanner – so, why all the consternation about something that may not even be done to you or your child? I have been patted down, scanned and waned for the past 12 years – ever since my first knee replacement surgery. And I will continue to be “handled” since I have these artificial joints to carry me around for the rest of my life.

I was one of the first to be “groped” (as many of you are calling it) a couple of weeks ago when the new process started and the scanner was broken at the Atlanta airport. Nobody grabbed me inappropriately or fondled anything – most of you are making rash judgments and do not understand the process AT ALL – seems like many have taken TWG’s phobias to heart and are afraid of everything that MIGHT happen…

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I think it is scary if you don’t explain it to your child. I don’t think that you need to get into weapon types and bad people!
I think that these procedures keep us safe. Yes, they are intrusive but it’s better than being blown up. There are terrorists in our world. TSA isn’t doing this for fun.
Susan Manning
parentusacity.com

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Will they *pat* down Muslim women?

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Susan: NO, they are NOT keeping us safe. All this is doing is giving us a fall sense of security. Next time, the terrorists will just shove an explosive in their butts. So what’s next? Cavity searches??? NO!!

We have to draw the line here! We have NO freedoms worth protecting if we are giving up our dignity and privacy.

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I am glad my daughter got married in Puerto Rico LAST Christmas, because I would not have been happy about this.

Folks, I am afraid we “asked” for this. We have ceded so many of our rights over the last 20 years or so, it’s hard to stop a train moving downhill with few whimpers. (secret courts, no-knock warrants, monitoring of our phone/email conversations, waterboarding, holding people without charges, and on and on). It is hard to un-ring the bell.

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Easy- the safety of them is not known…PLUS as graphic as these images are, what stops the TSA from taking cell phone pics? They are equipped with ethernet connection (WHY???), and I am sure there is probably a usb port on there for them to d/l to flash drive. If she is on her period, is she going to get singled out because a dumb TSA agent can’t figure out the different between a pad and/or tampon and a concealed explosive device?

Just bring in the friggin’ bomb/drug sniffing dogs. Again I say…since EVERYONE is not subjected to the same screening process; security is not guaranteed AT ALL, and it is too easy to circumvent. If everyone is so gung ho to give up their rights, this is indeed a scary world we live in. This is not the country I fought for and defended when I was in the service. Ughh, disgusting.

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According to the local news and the TSA last night, at Hartsfield you’ll only get the “extra” scanning if you don’t clear the regular x-ray machines. I know this is in conflict with what the article says, but it’s what I heard on 11 Alive at 11:30 last night. If you refuse the scan -then you get the pat down. So have your kid scanned IF he or she doesn’t clear the x-ray. If you or your kids don’t set off the regular x-ray -no problem. Here’s a good idea -make sure they don’t have metal on them. It’s not that hard to do with little kids. Also, be very clear about the “pictures” the scanners take. The only people who would be able to get off on these are those turned on by strangely alien-looking, hairless, white, blob-shaped people. Not that pervs with this exact fetish don’t exist somewhere, but chances are it’s a pretty niche group and they’re not working as TSA officers.

@runningman and others -while it would be GREAT to be able to do security like Israel, it is simply not possible in a nation this size with this much air traffic. Israel’s airport is slightly behind the Cincinnati/Kentucky airport in numbers of travelers per year. When you fly out of Israel, you are interviewed for 20-30 minutes by a HIGHLY TRAINED (and somewhat intelligent) security officer. They ask you all sorts of questions -some quite strange (to you) -because they know what can and will set off certain “signals” in subversive people. They won’t hesitate to hold you, make you miss your flight, etc. while they up the interview process to the next level. That’s all fantastic, except it would completely shut down air travel in the USA. Can you imagine this process at Hartsfield or O’Hare for EVERY SINGLE PERSON? Plus, you have to have security officers who are intelligent and well-trained. That means higher paid officers and thousands more of them. It also means that you can’t have our current level of TSA officer who chose between airport security or working the drive through window at Burger King. What I would love to hear is what Israel would do for security if they had as many air travelers as we do. How would they go about running effective screening?

I just find all the hysteria QUITE ironic, since the most out-of-sorts folks are the SAME people who were so gung-ho for the Patriot Act to be instituted. Guess what folks -that little piece of legislation opened the gateway for this kind of BS. Most of you are also the same people who would freak out and be foaming at the mouth about “lax” security measures if a plane got blown to bits or crashed into another building. No, I don’t like it -although the scanners really don’t bother me at all. Look at some REAL pictures of what the person looking sees -I don’t see a problem. You’re receiving so much daily radiation from your microwaves and cell phones that to flip out because you think these scanners are going to give you cancer is pathetic.

As far as my kids (or myself) and pat downs -if someone refuses the scanner or obviously has something in their crotch that shows up on it -then sorry, they NEED to be patted down -intimately! If you refuse -I think that should be your right, but you don’t get to fly. If you refuse the scan -that’s a BIG red flag. For all they know you have the barrel of a pistol stuck somewhere VERY interesting and the handle in the crotch of your underwear. As far as children go -they should be able to do a regular pat-down and be fine with it. YOU can tell your kids that in order for everyone to fly safely and no bad guys to bring anything on the plane, that the officer is going to touch them down the sides of their bodies and the insides of their arms and legs. Tell them it’s okay because you are right there, but if anyone ever touches them like that when you’re not around -it’s NOT okay! I do draw the line at the breast cupping and genital groping for kids (although I do think diapers should be checked with a “look” like you would check for pee or poop -just pull the front and back of the diaper out an have a peek),and it should only be done by same-gender officers. All of you SHOULD realize though that there are boys in Al Quada camps who are 12 and 14. Suicide bombers obviously don’t care if they kill children. The 9-11 terrorists obviously weren’t concerned about killing any kids in buildings or on planes. Once someone’s brain crosses into the “terrorist” category -they will send their kid on a flight with a bomb strapped to them. They simply DO NOT CARE. We can’t give free passes to children, old people and pregnant women. Google “Hindawi Affair” for a good reason why! Also -2 weeks ago the Asian guy who disguised himself as an old white man breezed through security with no problems.

I’m not gung-ho for this kind of security. I’m more of a libertarian than anything and do not like government invading my private space, BUT when I buy a plane ticket and get on a plane, I’m basically saying that I will submit to the rules and regulations of the TSA and the airline I’m flying. I think terrorists will blow up a plane if they really want to blow up a plane, but some of the “lesser-thinking” of them can be caught and disaster prevented by extremely tight airport security -and part of that means they need to know if you’re hiding anything on your “person.”

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@ from Neal Boortz today…last week he said this:

THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE AIRLINES

I mentioned this is my previous post, which was deleted and not yet restored by TWG.

Neal Boortz is both a pilot and an attorney, so he may just know more about this that many others.

FACT our government is trying to control us in more ways than one.

Did anyone see the guest Rabbi on Glenn Beck last week? I do not usually watch the show but the discussion by the Rabbi on stones and bricks for the Tower of Babel was absolutely fascinating. He was showing how history repeats itself and that our government is trying to make us all into little bricks, so that we all look alike and think alike. We are no longer going to be stones…shaped differently and with different strengths to contribute to society. I was more than intrigued. I learned a lot and it was fascinating.

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I have a 4yo daughter and a 2yo daughter. I work for an airline but there will be no flying for us as a family until this policy is banned. And that’s sad because my oldest likes to fly. She enjoys going to the airport and looking out at the planes and getting a window seat. But no way will I allow them to go through a scanner without me and heck no, some random person (TSA or not) is going to pat them down.

I would imagine you’d have crying babies all day at the security check point. For those that feel this is okay, there should probably be a seperate line for parents, especially at Hartsfield.

I on the other hand would probably go through the scanner. I’ve never had a full body pat down and I don’t want one quite frankly. I haven’t committed a crime ever and don’t plan to. I value my life and freedom too much to do so.

Although I’m not for this new policy, I do understand the measures. You want to be sure that passengers are safe. That our country is safe. But government allows these people to come here and start a life. I’m a married, American born woman with two children. I work. I pay my taxes. I’ve never harmed a soul and have no intention. I don’t deal with people who do so (not to my knowledge anyway).

Does it frighten me that people here might want to cause not just myself, but my children harm? Yes. It pisses me off more so because I don’t care who you worship. I don’t care how you worship. I don’t care if you worship. It’s your life. I worship God. And he’s a loving God. And any god that says you must kill, isn’t a real god.

I think about all these countries that don’t just allow Americans to visit. They have all these rules and regulations. Well, where are our rules and regulations? Why must we suffer? It’s gotten so bad that we can’t even trust our own.

TSA has a job to do but I think they need to find a better way. I’m not for the scanner because you don’t know the long term effects of such a thing. And it just seems like we woke up one day and here they are. And we have the ‘either/or’ option. That’s a big change and you’re having humans do these pat downs which could still lead to human error.

Ugh. Good think my aunt only lives in Texas. I think we’ll take a road trip for the next visit. Seems like quality family time will be a good thing for us.

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@GTFOH…

as an airline employee….

Is this the airline’s fault?

Will you have a job if all other families all decide to boycott the airlines? Say 10,000 families nationally with 3 per family?

Have you lost your mind….quality family time and road trips of 10-15 hours do not belong in the same sentence IMHO. Maybe you live in Memphis and the trip is shorter….LOL. Glad mine are in college and can share driving with us.

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Stuff like this illustrates how successful the terrorists have been, and continue to be. They don’t have to do a thing to inspire terror; just let the government do it for them. They’ve shown Americans to be the biggest bunch of sissies and chickens ever — and more than willing to give up the oft-trumpeted freedoms and privacies in a heartbeat.

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@ JATL…I was in the Orlando airport about 5 years ago and having a chat with the lady next to me, as she was an English professor. We were at the gate and waiting for the plane. The sniffing dog came down the terminal and made a beeline to my carry on suitcase. The lady next to me scooted over ( probably did not want to be associated with me) and the gentleman with the leash stood their patiently. I DID NOT have anything illegal in my bag but I did have dog hair from my labrador as he always checked on my suitcase when I was getting ready to leave and while I packed. The man smiled when I told him I had a lab at home and then left with the dog, after seeing there was no problem.

A bit unnerving for me but not big deal!

Fond memories of Ole Yellar, who we put down 3 years ago…may he rest in peace! We had him for 13 years!

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Ah, Mother Jane Goose… remember your beloved Boortz and Glenn Beck are simply entertainers, not to be used for content. Since you fly often I’m sure you pick up the New York Times or Wall Street Journal and have read in the last 30 days:

- A bomb was sent from Yemen; the Arabian Peninsula is the next phase in this war as this is the new hotbed of terrorism; the US currently has Predator drones flying above Yemen and they have conducted missile strikes on several occasions. The bomb had a timer on it to explode over the crowded US Eastern corridor.
- Another bomb was sent from Namibia to Germany, simply as a dry run to study security capabilities. Al Queda in the Arabian Peninsula now is testing western security capabilities.
- Germany today closed the Reichstag Dome due to terrorist threats
- Pat downs are here to stay, Mother Jane Goose.
- The next terrorist attack will be a Cyber Attack.

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mom2: The Israelis do a lot of stuff that we are surprised about. I think their advantage is they know that much of the world will step in if they need help, and, everyone knows they mean business. I don’t think we have that reputation, nor that degree of support from the rest of the world.

As to your first point, don’t forget thalydomide. Given to pregnant women for nausea, then found to cause horrible birth defects.

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Photius, what do you imagine a cyber attack to be? The sum total of ‘cyber attacks’ against government targets so far amounts to nothing more than web site redirection or defacement — that’s only possible because of the ineptitude and/or inattention of those tasked with administering the sites themselves. Attacks on infrastructure/power grid etc. have been ineffective due to wide variety of custom software used to operate them. There isn’t any confidentiality, but there isn’t a whole lot of vulnerability, either — at least, not from so-called ‘cyber attack’.

Don’t believe everything you read about it. Keep in mind it’s a bunch of bureaucrats that have no idea what they’re really talking about.

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Eh, now one of my posts has bitten the dust!

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JATL: I’m not going to change my mind and you are not going to change yours. I find this whole procedure morally reprehensible, ethically wrong and unconstitutional. I am not going to pay my hard earned money for a plane ticket only to be treated like a common criminal. TSA finds a better way or believe you me, I’m not the only one that will stop flying.

When enough people are outraged and stop flying, the airlines will turn on the pressure and the procedure will change. And really, we will not be ANY safer OR unsafer than before.

I’m not getting groped and I am not risking my health or privacy on one of those body scans. And that’s how the terrorists have already won. They have ALREADY stripped us of the precious freedoms we have been fighting for.

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@JATL…I am with you on the dog sniffing. Fascinating stuff. I knew it would not be a problem, as the signals given were benign. Just got a kick out of it.

I also concur:
I would venture to guess that the average trained “sniff” dog used in security, search and rescue, police or military operations is far smarter than most TSA agents.

@GTOFH..the airlines employ you, after your comment about dog sniffing…whose elevator has a problem? Hope you work for Air Tran….LOL.

@photius…the Rabbi was the one I was fascinated with and he ( I presume) is not an entertainer.
Ya think?

@lakerat….any comments on the demise of Eastern…you surely know more than I would.

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ABC, Defense Secretary Gates last week speaking at the WSJ’s CEO Council said the threat of Cyber Attacks is “huge”. Simply read about the Stuxnet complex computer worm, likely placed into Iranian nuclear computers to destroy center fuses via the Mossad. Russia successfully waged Cyber War against Estonia and Georgia effectively shutting down all computer transmissions which would effect everything in our lives. As reported in the NYT’s China has been testing United States computer infrastructure systems, mapping our electrical grid, water treatment facilities and air traffic control. China also hacked into Obama’s and McCain’s campaign headquarters in 2008 copying all their information. Now imagine a Cyber Attack on Morgan Stanley or Citi…. Imagine if the attacker simply deleted $4 trillion dollars in daily assets? The Secretary of Defense, Robert Gates, said last week “there is a huge future threat, and a considerable current threat from Cyber Attacks.” Pat downs are here to stay and Cyber Attacks are coming.

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@gonetoofar: that’s just flipping great. I wonder what would happen if *I* made a stink and refused to be touched on religious principles!!!

GD it; they HAVE already won!

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Why don’t you begin by explaining that laws don’t apply to the government or its employees, but only to the citizens, Explain to them that what the TSA is doing to children is just legalized child molestation and legalized sexual assault of adults. It is illegal for adults to do this outside of the screening area and it should be illegal to do what the TSA is doing but that’s how government works are why government is such an evil thing.

Explain to them how mommy and daddy sat on the sidelines while Bush and his gang of war criminals destroyed the Bill of Rights and the constitution because mommy and daddy were too lazy and too scared to do some investigating of their own on the internet to find out how events like 9-11 are abused by every government in history as vehicles for consolidating power in the hands of government and for destroying the rights of the people. Explain to them how you were too busy to get out and protest the war, the invasions, the Patriot Act and how looking good in the eyes of your friends and neighbors was more important than taking a stand.

Explain to them that we did not get here overnight but that this slow erosion of rights has been going on for decades and decades and that you were too busy with your careers and watching sports to care about what folks up in washinton were doing to their future. I’m sure your kids will understand. Afterall, the government only does things for the good of the citizens right??? Maybe you could also give your kids a history lesson about the 200 million of their own citizens that governments killed during the 20th century alone.

Just boycott air travel until the TSA is gone and sanity is returned. Its the least you could do since you didn’t do anything to try and stop this (oh, and don’t say you voted for Kerry, Gore, or Obama). Its clear how Obama is working out and Gore and Kerry would have been just as bad. If you actually voted Libertarian or for Ron Paul, you definitely get a pass on this one, but then that shows you weren’t just sitting on the sidelines hoping everything would be ok.

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This is a perverse thing that the TSA is doing. It is not okay to touch people in the name of security. The Germans before WWII insisted that their invasion of other companies was for security, or leavenscram, “living space”. When the Germans decided to rid the business districs of the jews it was for protecting the popluation from the “evil devil banker jews”. Security can be used by powers to rid people of their rights, and it is the case here! Wake up people, no more TSA, no more terror by our goverment against ourselves! We did not crash the planes in the buildings, it could happen again, that is life, do not tread on our freedoms to create a “safe” police state. The TSA has gone over the cliff and it seems no one wants to speak up for thier erroronous ways in our goverment. That is very scary, do not accept these security measures at all. It is not right to touch children in such ways, just gross!

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@Seriously: you are being generous assuming they even have GEDs.

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O.K…so you work for Delta? Can you, for the record, state that you do not care if anyone flies at all or that it does not matter than I am a Gold Medallion with your airline.

I fly all the time but obviously those who only fly to Grandma’s know more about this than me.

Anyone care to comment on this:

Economic Impact: Hartsfield-Jackson has a direct economic impact of more than about $32.5 billion for the metro Atlanta area economy.

BOYCOTT FLYING and see if it affects any of your neighbors, friends and family members.

MAKE A STINK at the airport on W and see if you make it to your destination.

I rest my case. Y’all have a good day and please solve this problem quickly :).

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I’ve worked on several planes in several cities and I refuse to fly. Anywhere I go, I go by car, train, or bus. I’m good at what I do and I trust me. Scanner, pat down, or not…I’ll stick with the road.

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I bet if most people opt out of flying for Thanksgiving (the busiest holiday of the year), TSA will be forced to rethink this policy. And yes, everyone is effected.

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The troops in hostile territory can’t use the scanners or touch the known enemy, yet our own citizens are subject to this humiliating searches. Yeah, the Muslims object and the President Obama agrees. Law abiding citizens that are paying taxes are penalized for this. So for those that have the option to fly, tell me how to get from Hawaii, where I live because the Army said so, to “home on the East Coast” without flying? The “find other transportation, flying is an option” opinionated people need to get unselfish & realize not everyone is just like them. When known terrorist & enemies are subject to these “searches” then all will be right with the world.

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“Anyone care to comment on this:

Economic Impact: Hartsfield-Jackson has a direct economic impact of more than about $32.5 billion for the metro Atlanta area economy.

BOYCOTT FLYING and see if it affects any of your neighbors, friends and family members”

Sure, I will. Economic impact is the WHOLE POINT OF A BOYCOTT! No one thinks it won’t make things hard for a lot of people, but the hope is that the temporary hardship will make enough of an impact to convince TSA to change it’s policies. If you are comfortable with “naked” scans and “enhanced” pat-downs, more power to you, but you seem to think people who aren’t should be more concerned with supporting the airlines financially than standing up against policies that they believe violate their rights and their children’s rights to privacy. Personally, I’m not willing to sacrifice my right to privacy, which is what purchasing and using a ticket now seems to require, just to help out Delta and its employees. It’s lousy for them, but being groped is lousy for me! I don’t plan to fly until the rules are changed, but it’s note me hurting them — it’s TSA. I’ll also be writing my Congressman to express my concerns.

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Oh, good Lord. Just go through the scanner. This is the same for kids as for adults. Surely someone has already seen you naked anyway and the kids, depending on age, don’t even have to realize the difference between this scanner and an x-ray. And, surely, it’s better than being groped. Of course, I’m left to wonder where all of this would be if, in fact, profiling were allowed.

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MJG: boycotts affect innocent people all the time. That’s how they work!!! How do you suggest we show our displeasure??? When can’t boycott the govt!

And give it a rest already with the “people like me” routine. Everyone knows you are well loved in all 50 states, run a multi million dollar company and have two of the most promising minds of this generation as children. We get it already. Good grief.

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“Innocent people will be affected when the anger about TSA is actually anger towards our government.”

Innocent people are being affected now by the invasive searches. No one is saying the airlines will solve the problem (nor are we setting out to punish them), but we do believe that speaking up and taking action can convince the government to adjust its policies (hopefully sooner rather than later). Maybe it will work, maybe it won’t, but one thing is certain — going along with policies that we believe are overly intrusive and saying/doing nothing will guarantee they stay in place. If you’re comfortable with the policies, then great, keep flying, but I find it odd that you think those who aren’t should just subject themselves and their children to it anyway for the sake of the airlines and related businesses rather than stay home or choose a mode of transportation that doesn’t require them to undergo something they find invasive.

Don’t worry too much about the Coke and peanuts, though — I’ll still be buying those and using napkins on the train. :)

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Bottom line…you aren’t going to violate me or my children so I don’t have to and I won’t explain to them. And this new radiation scanner or whatever it is, you’re not going to put me or my child through that. Screw your thoughts and what you feel is okay and your dogs, the agents, and the TSA adminstration and the government. I’ll be damned. If you don’t feel violated something is wrong with you. There’s a way to deal with all this but I definitely disagree with the current method/policy.

People who have been raped/molested shouldn’t be forced to have to walk through that scanner. And essentially, you are being forced to do so. People say it’s safe…then prove it. 10-20 years from now, a lawsuit will be filed because of this very argument we are all having today.

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@Seriously -yep, I have a 2 and 4 year old. If we were going to fly anywhere soon, we would go through the scanners. I have a microwave in my house and a cell phone and we have about 4 laptops at home along with the television, etc. I’m FAR more concerned with radiation on a daily basis from those than the scanner. If I were a pilot or flight attendant or someone who flies so much that the scanners and the radiation they give off might honestly affect me -then yeah, maybe I would be uncomfortable with them, but at this point I’m not.

Like Grant and Andy Richter said -if you go through the scanner -you won’t be patted down unless they see something pretty inexplicable there (like a foreign object shoved down in your pants or hidden in your bra). Sure, boycott the airlines. Since the poll last week indicated that 80% of Americans were just fine with all of this, then I think you’re wasting your time. I’m betting at least half of you who posted here today wouldn’t be upset at all about any of this if the media hadn’t been fanning the flames and screaming about it for 2 weeks now. If you think THIS security screening change is heralding an erosion of our civil liberties and rights -then you’ve had your head in the sand for so long you should probably leave it there. It’s just the latest in a long list of erosions. I’ll ask again -how many of you thought the Patriot Act was a good idea? Yeah -if you’re honest -plenty of you did, and now, here we are. I’m actually interested in Florida’s private security firm idea and how it works. Could be the way to go!

As far as Muslim women being exempt – that’s not true. The TSA released a statement that everyone, regardless of religion or anything else, would have to have the same type of pat down if they objected to the screening. So, I’m sure many of you already feel safer -if Muslim women can’t fly, then that lets out a lot of terroristic-looking people who scare you on planes. See -there’s always a silver lining for you!

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I will not put myself or my child through the strip search/naked body scanner. If my son and I fly next year, he will be 8 years old. We will have a discussion before leaving the house during which time I will tell him that if he is touched by these government-sponsored rapists, that he is to scream and scream and scream at the top of his lungs and kick and punch and bite and that he is not to stop even if I tell him to do so. I will make damn fricking sure that EVERYBODY around will know what they are doing to him. I will be screaming as well and no matter what the rapists say, I will not make him stop screaming and fighting.

This is rape, plain and simple. And for those who think rape is a sex crime, let me set you straight. It is a crime of power – with sex as the ultimate weapon against the victim. The government is telling us that we have no choice but to submit to the electronic strip search or be sexually assaulted. In some cases there are no body scanners and people are being pulled aside for this assault. In other cases, even when people clear the body scanners they are still pulled aside and sexually assaulted. If we refuse, we are screamed at, publically humiliated, handcuffed to chairs, threatened with jail, arrested and jailed, detained indefinitely, made to miss our flights. All of this so they can look at and touch our bodies??????? BULL – it is RAPE! My son and I will fight and scream and make a spectacle!

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jatl-you are not in any way important. Just so you know. Your posts are bombastic and repetitive, your insults apply more to yourself than to those you condemn. Just take it down a notch. Nobody cares. It’s a blog, for goodness sake. Your life must be a wretched thing, causing you to spend so much energy on something so insignificant.

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I haven’t had to fly in a long time anyway, but I will avoid it all costs until this madness goes away. You know the true terrorists are laughing their heads off. I feel sorry for my brother who has to fly twice a week every week on business.

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How about this for explaining to your kids.

“Nobody is ever allowed to touch you in a way you don’t like, and this includes government officials. No government agency can EVER tell you you don’t have your constitutionally guaranteed rights, and you should NOT tolerate those that try such things. Until our rights are respected, we should not fly as protest.”

There is no explaining sexual molestation to your kids as if its okay. It’s NEVER okay. The only way its okay is if you’ve committed a crime, the ONLY action that can in turn discard your individual rights, due to your harming someone elses rights in some way.

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The last time I flew was to DC in the spring. I expected to be patted down thinking I would set off the metal detector since I had my shoulder replaced a few months earlier. I didn’t set off the detector much to my surprise. I was even given a card to carry with the implant information on it to give to the screeners.

On the other hand, how much of this will blow over in a few months? So many here keep saying they will not fly due to the TSA screening, but …. how many will?

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We should not be opting for either! To be virtually strip searched or molested, gee is that really a choice? It’s time for Americans to WAKE UP, your Fourth Amendment rights are slipping away. Bit by bit, the government puts another link in the chain that will soon strangle any semblance of the country our Founders intended. I can imagine the terrorists smiling at all this – they’ve managed to get our government to participate in stamping out American ideals and liberty to make us live like their people do – in abject submission to tyranny.

Join Opt Out Day in a creative way – wear your bathing suit under your clothes. TSA says we should partner with them – this is an idea that should accomplish our mission and help them accomplish thiers. Get details on how this can help and join us at http://www.facebook.com/#!/pages/I-will-wear-my-bathing-suit-to-the-airport/161575693879561

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I’m not sure why JATL is being piled on. I think she brings a lot of common sense to these discussions. I may not always agree with everything she says, but she provides thoughtful arguments (which is more than I can say for many).

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@SJ -Thank You! GTFOH seems to have taken offense at both my and MJG’s inability to decipher what she is trying to say. The other one is a troll who I ignore and don’t feed. Have a happy Thanksgiving!

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[...] who’ve told their children not to let strangers touch them, now have to tell them that they must endure a TSA pat-down if they want to fly. Consider the recent strip search of a young boy. Fortunately, the TSA appear to be relenting a [...]

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First a tax cheat and now a pervert that’s change you can really believe in.

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i know this was about kids and pat downs..but really kids are not the only issues….for example:
http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/tsa-pat-down-leaves-750644.html

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http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/us-european-officials-scramble-stop-expected-terror-attack/story?id=12208480

guess their strategy is working

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ooops…how would we work if we could not fly…sorry

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There seems to be some misunderstanding that Israel’s screening is racial profiling; it’s not. It’s criminal profiling. The agent asks each and every passenger a few simple questions and monitors the passengers’ responses. Those who give visual cues are pulled aside for further scrutiny.

My father was a US Customs officer for over 30 years. He could tell who was up to something just by looking in their eyes while he was asking the standard battery of questions. That’s what we need to be doing, not irridating or groping innocent people.

The TSA was established in the post-9/11 panic as a knee-jerk reaction. It was ramrodded through Congress as a government jobs program with the inane selling point along the lines of, “if you want to professionalize, you must federalize.” That’s rich: these “professionals” are barely literate goons on a power trip…and so are their bosses.

I’ve written my Congressman to encourage him to look into de-funding the TSA. What they are doing is unconstitutional.

“The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized” – Fourth Amendment

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[...] Article Here [...]

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I flew last month from Atlanta to Detroit and was singled out for a body scan AND wanding (in ATL), apparently because of the sequins on my top. Wearing a different shirt on the way home, I set off both the walk-through and the wand metal detectors in Detroit and was subjected to the pat-down. It was finally determined that the metal in my bra was the culprit. I would be a lot less concerned about these “enhancements” if the detectors could distinguish between a weapon and underwear!

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I can not believe anyone is even thinging it is okay to teach our children this is okay. NO WAY will anyone touch my child. We will NOT be flying until someone uses their brain here.

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I live in a town where they do not have these x-ray machines up and running and so I do let my son fly, but as soon as it gets to the point where we have to be x-rayed or groped to get to the gate there’s no way I would go through it, and no way EVER would I let my son go through it. No x-rays, and no touching. I am a mom of four, and I have been sexually assaulted and I teach my kids that their bodies are their own and nobody, NOBODY gets to touch them there unless mommy is there and I say its ok (as in a doctor).
As for airport check point once you enter you are required to keep going–that’s the stupidest crap I’ve ever heard of. So you get there and you realize that its going to be touchy-feely and you say no, and want to go home instead and they fine you? I’d do a counter sue.

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