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City & State or ZIP Tonight, this weekend, May 5th...
City & State or ZIP
City & State or ZIP Tonight, this weekend, May 5th...
City & State or ZIP

Bonnie & Clyde

I was having a friendly debate with my friend Mark about loyalty in dating relationships. I don’t think it exists.  As humans, we are self-preserving, self-serving people.  Loyalty extends about as far as it can until we decide that our own needs are more important than someone else’s.

He disagreed and said that loyalty is one of the things that people should be willing to prove in dating to lead to a relationship.  Mark and I  joked about how Bonnie & Clyde were known as the most loyal couple in history.

In some twisted way, the fact that she not only stuck by Clyde and covered for him, she  also joined in his crime sprees of robbery and murder. Are women expected to break the law to prove loyalty to their man, though!?

Do you think that loyalty is a realistic expectation in dating? Is it important to you when you are getting to know someone?

How do you know when someone is loyal to you? Is it something you can really prove or a feeling you give?

Do you think that couples have to “keep” their mate loyal?  What kind of person is more likely to be loyal? Is that the kind of character trait you can suss out in dating?

302 comments Add your comment

Stan

November 5th, 2009
8:40 am

I think loyalty in dating exists only so long as both people are after the same goal. Bonnie was loyal to Clyde because she not only loved him, but also saw the best way to making money, for them, was to steal it. Same goal.

Dan -fighting for (inner) peace

November 5th, 2009
8:50 am

Don’t forget ‘Micky and Mallory’….

I think that loyalty is important. To my mind it’s gotta be me and my lady together against the world. In that sense, the trust that we share to get those goals accomplished is based on the loyalty that has been proven (starts with the little everyday isht too).

As far as “keeping” someone loyal, I don’t think you can. Loyalty, like respect and trust are decision based reactions – they have to be freely given.

My2 cents

@my2: sorry about the copyright infringement

Kym

November 5th, 2009
9:03 am

Good Morning All,

Wisey I kind of agree with you. Loyalty is earned, not automatic. If I am dating someone and it is a serious dating relationship. Not just two people who are kicking it for the heck of it. Then in a serious dating relationship, one would still have to earn the loyalty of another. Loyalty is not blind devotion to a person or their ideas. It is SUPPORT, for that special someone come rain or come shine,even if you don’t agree.

Like if your mate took up stock car racing..okay that stuff is not safe, you express your concerns about their safe, but you show up to the track anyway, to cheer them on.

Professor

November 5th, 2009
9:09 am

This whole loyalty thing is a bunch of crap to me. I think we are loyal when it is conducive to us (what Dan said) same goals. Now in dating I will speculate that if it is not favorable to us we are out. As for marriage I want to say that is probably different and there is more loyalty. Naw, because how many married folks you know talk about their spouses behind their backs etc? How many couples you know work separately instead of together?

Loyalty is one of those things that is coming to an end regardless of where you look: politicians crossing party lines, employees no longer remaining at companies until they retire etc. Having that faithfulness and allegiance is no longer as popular as it used to be.

Dan -fighting for (inner) peace

November 5th, 2009
9:18 am

@Professor

I would like to disagree with you.

I, for one, would not like to think that loyalty in relationships is not on the decline (aside from the divorce rates). I would hope that people realize that loyalty and trust are essential in a relationship.

I take your point about the politics and business, but that’s a different kind of loyalty (professional loyalty has been eroded since the 80’s), one that has changed as the economic drivers have.

But personal loyalty should be the glue that builds and unites us.

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
9:25 am

IMO a certain about of loyalty is necessary in a dating relationship in order to take it to the next level. I believe certain traits take on different levels of service depending on the nature of the relationship therefore the trait itself has to be present and active to get you to the next step.

Let me explain that a little better. There are certain things that I look for in a man and there are certain things that I know are imperative and I expect in a husband. While I did not expect my man to fully act as a husband before he actually became one, I did look for traces of those traits in him to be active to a certain degree. As with loyalty like we are talking about today. Had he never portrayed the act of loyalty while we were dating I would not have wanted to have a relationship with him. And I definitely would not have wanted to have him for a husband.

So yes it is a realistic expectation, however there are degrees.

Cemeeli

November 5th, 2009
9:25 am

…hey there…

…all I wanna say is; Bonnie n Clyde came and made that ‘ride or die’ thing fly!…some would say they’re the Godfather of ride or die…back in their time most folks outlawed them…but they kept pulling capers….

…the epitome of loyal….

mytw♥cents... WWMy2D?

November 5th, 2009
9:32 am

I don’t think there’s much another person can do to directly affect your level of loyalty. It’s ultimately a free-will choice that won’t be instantaneous for most. However, my willingness to be loyal can be indirectly affected by the amount of Consistency, Vision and Leadership skills he shows. Tried to explain this to a dude the other day – it’s not really being disloyal if your girl gets to a point where she’s asking about your other options when a.) She’s more gung ho about your abilities than you are b.) You’ve never expressed a Plan B and c.) You’re clearly not putting in enough work. And this is in reference to his big dream. 5+ years later, any shared goals they have are on the backburner.

No worries, DAN. Send $10 & its yours thru Friday…

Cemeeli

November 5th, 2009
9:32 am

…today it’s hard as HECK to be down from somma these negros!

@ WiseD – Your topic got me in that mode…i gotta pull out a few of those old movies and watch.

Dream_n

November 5th, 2009
9:36 am

GM ALL

I don’t know why when I think of loyal I think of a dog and his owner… maybe it’s me..

I like the term trust…And when it comes to trust YES there has to be an extreme amount of trust in a relationship. I want to trust that my MATE has my back and my best interest at heart and vice versa.

I think trust is very important. I should be able to go to my mate and tell him anything. We should be able to confide in eachother. That level of trust comes over time and situations that cause you to portray that quality.

Rell - da rake

November 5th, 2009
9:38 am

Loyalty…you either are born with it or not…even folks that think they are loyal will have there loyalty tested at some point….

M. (pronounced M dot)

November 5th, 2009
9:39 am

Good morning blog.

@Do you think that loyalty is a realistic expectation in dating? Is it important to you when you are getting to know someone?

I think the loyalty in dating is really scarce. My brother always says “never trust a woman as far as you can throw them which usually aint far”. That is true mainly because in dating, there is no real obligation for accountability. You may be the flavor of the week for a while but understand if a better situation i.e., another guy comes along they can easily jump ship. This goes for men to. If his relationship is not too bad to leave but not great enough to stay, he can and will leave if a better situation comes along. I know people are going to say what if you want to build something with someone and what about being content? That’s all up to the maturirty of the person, but in dating, people can get bored also so the loyalty can be there temporarilly.

MsM

November 5th, 2009
9:39 am

Want the same thing = ride or die.

Dan -fighting for (inner) peace

November 5th, 2009
9:39 am

@My2

Somma of us keep saying it over and over again, so to put it more succintly:

Some of these cats don’t have a plan (A or B). They’re just in the world.

I’m guilty of it myself. With a general outline, I proceed about my business. While my “plan” has room for adjustments, some cats are swinging vine-to-vine as they appear.

THE INFAMOUS DK

November 5th, 2009
9:41 am

Ahhh Yeah Bonnie and Clyde, Bobby and Whitney.. Thats whats up right there..

Cemeeli

November 5th, 2009
9:42 am

Dan Natural Born Killers was wild. I think they made a video game spin off that.

Dan -fighting for (inner) peace

November 5th, 2009
9:43 am

@M-Dot

Those situations you speak of are numerous indeed.

But contentment is finding what works for you. If short-terming ain’t what you want, don’t deal. If the “3-month and out” works for you, go all for it.

Contentment isn’t a condition that is actively created, contentment just is.

Which is why adaptability is sooo important these day.

@Dream

Think of loyalty as trust in action.

abc

November 5th, 2009
9:45 am

Loyalty can be defined as putting their interests ahead of your own. That’s a hard thing for Americans to do. Note several stories the past couple of weeks about how Americans stand by and witness violent crime, not becoming involved in order to protect themselves — that’s a glaring example of not being willing to put someone else’s interests ahead of your own.

So, what does it take to motivate you to put someone else’s interests first? That’ll vary per person. It doesn’t just apply to dating either; it could be any situation.

How many of you know anyone who would put your interests ahead of their own? Okay, how many men know anyone like that? I don’t think I’ve ever known anyone who would really set their own interests aside on my behalf. Real loyalty is rare thing, and real loyalty given to men in relationships is far rarer still.

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
9:46 am

I agree that you can’t be made loyal, nor does anything someone do or not do really has a baring on how loyal a person will be. We see every day where folks are in relationships where they are being mistreated yet they still remain loyal to that person.

Loyalty is a trait that you possess. However you make the choice as to who you will and will not be loyal to.

Cemeeli

November 5th, 2009
9:47 am

@ M.

I said it the other day…”Sometimes whe use the right techniques with the wrong person”…

THE INFAMOUS DK

November 5th, 2009
9:48 am

Loyalty.. Ha! Where they do that at?

THE INFAMOUS DK

November 5th, 2009
9:51 am

If you show me loyalty then I will return it.. Otherwise it aint nothing because my brand of loyalty consists of a strict code..

Leggs

November 5th, 2009
9:52 am

Are women expected to break the law to prove loyalty to their man, though!? I sure hope not!

Loyalty is something that is earned. @Rell, I believe everyone’s loyalty is tested at some point!

TMI, but my left ta ta won’t stop itching. It’s like a ping here, a ping there. Any old wives tales on what that may mean (and yes, I washed it).

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
9:53 am

abc I can’t agree with your definition of loyalty. Loyalty is about being devoted, dependable and faithful. As per your definition if both parties put the other’s interest before theirs neither would be actually doing anything at all. They both would be at a standstill.

But loyalty in terms of devotion is sticking with your partner come hell or high water. Loyalty is having their back and being a support system. Loyalty is being true to the one you are with. Putting your word out there and upholding it. That’s loyalty.

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
9:56 am

Leggs it probably means you are still not completely pass pause. A PMS symptom.

Rell - da rake

November 5th, 2009
9:57 am

never trust a woman as far as you can throw them which usually aint far”

- we need to loose this “cut and burn” mentality when dating…we do this by upgrading ourselves thru mind/body/spirit….hell when i hit the gym or go for a stroll…i meet other liked mind people..thats one point of loyalty…shared experiences…think a sports team…those guys are loyal to on another based on there shared experience and goal setting…same thing that was taught to me growing up being the older sibling…also from my time in the corps…we called it e sprit de corps…loyalty is inspired thru action…shared experiences…and goal setting…its not hard we make it hard with that “old school” way of thinking…one of distrust and disrespect for one another…that i dont get

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
10:01 am

Loyalty in situations of “just dating” has to be kept to a minimum.

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
10:03 am

Rell, I agree.

Cemeeli

November 5th, 2009
10:05 am

…i am secretly laughin’ at lil mamma sayin “loyalty is that dog/owner thing”…

omy.

SexyCool - Ride or Die.

November 5th, 2009
10:07 am

Three Words Daily – Diversify your life.

SexyCool - Ride or Die.

November 5th, 2009
10:08 am

Yeah, I’m a Ride or Die kinda chick for my man, with a disclaimer – me not fond of jail. Can do no go to jail kinda ish. I don’t like cigarettes or chicks named Bertha.

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
10:10 am

The thing with loyalty and relationships is there will always be something or someone more. However I really love a statement that abc said on here once. That more will not be more to you when you are loyal to the one you are with.

When you can bump your love interest for next new shiny model that cross your path you are not loyal. When you are loyal to that person, I don’t care how wonderful and spectacular the nu-nu may seem, your loyalty keeps you grounded.

M. (pronounced M dot)

November 5th, 2009
10:11 am

@Rell

“think a sports team…those guys are loyal to on another based on there shared experience and goal setting”

So with the sports analogy, and if everyone is so loyal, why are their trades? Why did Johnny Damon leave the Boston Red Sox to go to the RIVAL Yankees? You know why because a BETTER SITUATION CAME ALONG. And as I said in my posts, the loyalty can be there temporarily, but if a better situation comes around, they will be open to listening….And that’s how it is in dating. Women/Men make excuses for this and call it vulnerability.

Leggs

November 5th, 2009
10:13 am

@Raqi ~ you got a point there. It’s a weird feeling!

Anyway, church doors are now closed :arrow: “But loyalty in terms of devotion is sticking with your partner come hell or high water. Loyalty is having their back and being a support system. Loyalty is being true to the one you are with. Putting your word out there and upholding it. That’s loyalty.” It’s a wrap!

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
10:14 am

Loyalty keeps you respectful in the presence of others. I don’t care how much of an arse your s/o made themselves look in the presence of your friends, loyalty makes you stick with them when everyone else bails. Loyalty makes you wait until you get home to call them out on their foolishness. LOL

Dream_n

November 5th, 2009
10:14 am

M.

Are you really comparing a relationship to a foot ball team???????

Rell - da rake

November 5th, 2009
10:16 am

@MDOT..player for every johnny damon and shaq..there are your ac greens, ronnie lotts, mike jordan, larry bird..etc etc…in life everything is relative…you just have to detect the ‘larceny’ in those players and move on….we splitting hairs on this thing and you know where i am coming from….

Hopeless Romantic Diva

November 5th, 2009
10:17 am

Loyalty is essential in ANY relationship where the individuals have proven (and earned) mutual trust, respect, honor….and overall caring.

I have learned to be loyal to those who are loyal to me…life is too short to waste energy on people who do not deserve my loyalty which is the bomb! Granted, I won’t break the law or my principles for you. I’m too aware of “sick relationship” red flags to go down that path with people.

THE INFAMOUS DK

November 5th, 2009
10:18 am

Leggs – It means they needs some fondling and Kissin on..

THE INFAMOUS DK

November 5th, 2009
10:20 am

Hopeless Romantic Diva – Good Post but dont eva eva eva eva use “Is the Bomb” again, I beggeth you..

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
10:20 am

Now as for all this jail, breaking the law nonsense, loyalty makes you do what’s in the best interest of that person. And they will appreciate it and thank you later. Call the cops. Turn them in. Loyalty coupled with love will make you put a stop to their craziness before they end up dead somewhere on a street corner or serving a life sentence. However loyalty will not let you miss those weekend visits to see them in the pen. :lol:

Dan -fighting for (inner) peace

November 5th, 2009
10:20 am

@MDot

Again, business loyalty vs personal.

Johnny Damon (like Farve) are not professionally loyal, none of us should be realistically.

Personal loyalty is another thing entirely. Would Farve or Damon give up the weaknesses of their friends on the “old” team? Doubtful. That would violate the “bro code”.

Distinctly different from me leaving a young lady for the 2.0 version (or vice versa).

Hopeless Romantic Diva

November 5th, 2009
10:21 am

M. (pronouced M dot)

November 5th, 2009
10:21 am

@Dream_n
@Rell – da rake

I agree with you guys. I was just comparing a LOYALTY aspect.

East Point's Own

November 5th, 2009
10:21 am

@Dream_n Trust is the other end of loyalty. The word Loyalty should not be viewed negatively. The person who trusts someone is expecting that the other person provides loyalty by not doing things to cause a loss of trust.

Loyalty is the result of the things done which allow someone else to put trust in you. A successful relationship needs trust and loyalty. If there is only trust and no one is actually doing the work then its just a bunch of empty promises.

http://hispointofview.com

SexyCool - Ride or Die.

November 5th, 2009
10:21 am

Or dying. Not fond of dying – Can do no get me kilt ish either. ~lol~

Leggs

November 5th, 2009
10:23 am

@InfamousD ~ ding, ding, ding. That’s the second right answer. :lol: :lol:

Raqi

November 5th, 2009
10:27 am

Leggs that’s the first right answer, but it would have been inappropriate for me to say it. LOL

M. (pronounced M dot)

November 5th, 2009
10:27 am

@Dan -fighting for (inner) peace

You made a good point about personal loyalty. Question from a “personal loyalty aspect”, why do people cheat? Is it a lack of loyalty or placing self happiness over solutions i.e., working it out?

THE INFAMOUS DK

November 5th, 2009
10:28 am

Well well I got hands and lips made for fondling and kissin on boobs..