Is the ACC doomed? Hardly, and here are the reasons why
OK, so it isn't football, but it's still an off-tackle dive play. (AJC photo by Johnny Crawford)
Let’s be clear: The ACC has work to do. But that’s not nearly the same as being doomed, which is how some have characterized the conference after the double hit of Florida State’s (apparently overstated) flirtation with the Big 12 and the announcement of the SEC/Big 12 New Year’s Day bowl. As a public service, we attempt to distinguish flaming hyperbole from colder reality.
The ACC needs to tie itself to a big new bowl. This part is true. Indeed, this is essential. The chance of the champions from the SEC and the Big 12 being omitted from the presumptive four-team BCS playoff is small; the chance of an ACC titlist not making the final cut is rather larger. (No ACC team has played for the BCS title since Florida State in 2000, which was so long ago that Mark Richt was the Seminoles’ offensive coordinator.)
To be considered viable, the ACC cannot have its champ landing in, say, the Champs Sports Bowl. Nobody knows how the postseason matrix will look two years down the road — will existing bowls become part of the BCS tournament? — but the ACC can’t wait. It must find itself a worthy partner. That partner need not be the Big East, the least of the Big Six football leagues. Better for the ACC to forge an alliance with the runner-up from the Big Ten or the Pac-12 or even the SEC than to be doomed to a decade of playing Cincinnati. (Pie-in-the-sky scenario: The ACC aligns itself, bowl-wise, with Notre Dame.)
Florida State is already gone. Not true. Not even close. This whole kerfuffle resulted from Andy Haggard telling Warchant.com that the Board of Trustees “would be in favor of seeing what the Big 12 has to offer.” But ESPN obtained a memo written by FSU president Eric Barron that outlined the pros and cons of such a move, and the cons outnumbered the pros 7-4. Not least: “The faculty are adamantly opposed to joining a league that is academically weaker.”
The Big 12 needs Florida State more than FSU needs the Big 12. Even after adding West Virginia and TCU, the Big 12 is up to only 10 members. Any school considering Big 12 relocation must grasp that the Big 12 exists to prop up Texas. From Barron’s memo: “Colorado, Missouri, Nebraska and Texas A&M left the Big 12 at least in part because the Big 12 is not an equal-share conference. Texas has considerably more resource avenues and gains a larger share (and I say this as a former dean of the University of Texas at Austin).”
Florida State joined the ACC in 1991 for two reasons: Better academics and a clearer path to the football national championship. All that has changed is that Florida State hasn’t lately held up its football end. Were the Seminoles still going 12-0 or 11-1, they’d be in the BCS title mix. Rightly or wrongly, the Seminoles are still seen as the ACC’s football factory. In the Big 12, they’d stand third behind Texas and Oklahoma. Would that be an upgrade?
ACC commissioner John Swofford should again don his poacher’s hat. As unseemly as this sounds, it’s a pragmatic truth. The league will expand to 14 teams when Syracuse and Pittsburgh arrive, and it needs to grow more — and only in part because of football.
Swofford’s theft of Syracuse and Pittsburgh from the Big East changed the balance of basketball power. The ACC reclaimed first place in that derby, and for as much money as football generates we cannot forget that basketball is itself an attractive commodity. Simple math: The football season lasts roughly four months; the basketball season runs from mid-November to early April, which is closer to five months. And basketball teams play 30-some games, as opposed to 12 or 13, making for many more programming opportunities.
Swofford should go hard at UConn and Louisville, schools that graced the past two Final Fours and play competitive football. (Kansas would be a target if it hadn’t pledged to forfeit Big 12 TV money if it leaves.) Those two would stretch the ACC map and would make this the basketball league to end all basketball leagues. Marketing slogan: “You might not want to coach here, but you’ll darn sure watch our games!”
Such a course might seem counter-intuitive, but better for the ACC to play to its strength than a perceived weakness. Realistically, what available schools would burnish the ACC’s football image? (Notre Dame, maybe?) That doesn’t mean the league can’t survive: Not if its champ is given a chance to play for the BCS title when a chance is warranted; not if its champ is assured a profitable bowl home if it doesn’t make the four-team playoff, and not if good football is paired with great basketball.
One thing more: This isn’t the first time we’ve wondered if the ACC is bound for oblivion. But a check of history shows that the conference hasn’t lost a member since 1971, when Frank McGuire tired of his South Carolina Gamecocks getting beat in the ACC tournament. This league isn’t as bold and brassy as the SEC, but in its understated way it hangs tough. It’s not going away just yet.
By Mark Bradley
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401 comments Add your comment
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
7:48 pm
I didn’t even mention the University of Illinois. Very large enrollment, very much in the Chicago media footprint.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
7:52 pm
Posters commenting on the minimal impact that travel would have on Clemson or FSU being in the Big 12 (or Tech being in the Big 10, for that matter) forget that there are more sports than football, and the travel expenses for basketball, baseball, softball, track and field, swimming, and whatever else is left would be a significant burden. There would probably only be 4 to 6 travel dates for football every year, but there could be as many as 100 for all the other sports.
LakeDawg
May 23rd, 2012
7:56 pm
I was going to say something about this article, but then realized I have no interest in the ACC.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
7:57 pm
@ LakeDawg……and yet you read the article and posted anyway. What does that say about you? Can you say ignorant hypocrite?
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
7:58 pm
Florida State fields a lot of sports. Georgia Tech by comparison does not. The sports that are varsity sports at several ACC schools are club sports at Tech. Georgia Tech can certainly travel to the midwest as easily as to Boston, Syracuse, Pittsburgh and Miami.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
7:59 pm
@ Delbert, I guess you’re right there, but it still isn’t inexpensive to do that.
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
7:59 pm
LakeDawg – Jump right in, there are others here who don’t have much interest in the ACC, either.
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:04 pm
Supersize – The Big 12 has an appropriation for extended travel. That was necessary to get WVU. I doubt that it is much cheaper to get to Charlottesville than to Madison. That’s the capital of Wisconsin, not the one here in Morgan County. I’ve been to all 3 places, by the way.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:07 pm
LOL @ Delbert
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:07 pm
Super – Also, at our age, making one (or 2) road trips to places like Ann Arbor, Chicago, and State College might be worth it.
Beast from the East
May 23rd, 2012
8:08 pm
“Every school in the ACC is in the AAU.”
Supersize,
That’s not true. I’m not sure about every school, but I’m certain the Clown College is not.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:10 pm
Delbert, I wasn’t talking about fan expense in getting to games; I was talking about school expense. Even with appropriations, that many road trips every year ain’t cheap. Not to mention, it takes a lot of class time away, IF that really matters to anybody anymore. But you’re right, I would LOVE to go to a game in Ann Arbor, Columbus, State College, etc.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:14 pm
@ Beast…..you are apparently correct. I thought FSU was a member. But I just checked, and several others are not either…….in addition to FSU, Clemson, Syracuse, Boston College, and NC State are not members. My bad!
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:15 pm
Super – How about we fix up an old school bus? Get some decent Barcaloungers and a fridge in there, split the driving among our mutual friends, and then pass it down to another generation? Heck, I-75 is a straight shot north, and US 41 runs right up to Green Bay!
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:19 pm
NC State also is not, Virginia Tech is not, Boston college is not, Wake forest is not, Pitt is, but Syracuse is not. Who did I leave out?
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:19 pm
According to the most recent US News & World Report college rankings:
Every Big Ten member is in the top 100 national universities except for Nebraska, who tied for 101st. Five of its members are in the top 50 (Northwestern, Michigan, Wisconsin, Illinois, and Penn State).
Every ACC member is in the top 100 except for NC State and Florida State, who tied for 101st as well. Seven of its members are in the top 50 (Duke, Virginia, Wake Forest, North Carolina, Boston College, Georgia Tech, and Miami).
While only six Pac-12 members are in the top 100, five of those (Stanford, Cal Berkeley, USC, UCLA, and Washington) are in the top 50.
many Big Ten, ACC, and Pac-12 schools are among the top 30 public universities. Nine of the eleven Big Ten public universities are in the top 30. Seven of the nine ACC public universities are as well. The top five are Cal Berkeley (Pac-12), UCLA (Pac-12), Virginia (ACC), Michigan (Big Ten), and North Carolina (ACC).
Meanwhile, only Vanderbilt (SEC) and Texas (Big 12) made the top 50 universities. The only SEC/Big 12 public schools that made the top 30 public universities are Texas, Texas A&M, Florida, and Georgia. Both conferences have several sub 100 schools.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:20 pm
Delbert, I think between the two of us, we have it covered now. I forgot to type in VT, and I forgot even to look for Wake
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:21 pm
Delbert, I don’t think you have met some of these guys, but a road trip with UOAD, GT Lee, ole yeller, and 1 4 GT would be a hoot.
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:23 pm
Clemson is not. I guess I had mentally reassigned them to the Big 12 or SEC.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:24 pm
Interesting that in the US News article I pasted from that both Wake, BC, and Miami are in the top 50 colleges in the country, but none of them are AAU members. And I see that although Syracuse is not currently an AAU member, they have been in the past.
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:25 pm
Don’t forget our friend who flies in from Dubai for the games!
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:26 pm
From Dubai ??? Are you referring to the Delta pilot from NC???
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:28 pm
BC and Wake are private schools with religious affiliation, so they don’t have the focus that AAU membership requires. I completely forgot about Miami.
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:29 pm
Yep. Some folks reading the blog probably thought I misspelled “Dublin.”
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:31 pm
yeah, I had forgotten about Miami too. But there ARE private schools with AAU membership
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:32 pm
I think we’ve run everybody else off. Maybe I’ll do something else for awhile and check the AJC blogs tomorrow.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:32 pm
Delbert, the pilot and his wife went to the Sun Bowl. We stay in touch periodically
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:33 pm
OK, Delbert. I’m gone too. Have a good night
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:33 pm
Damn, Mark’s filters are strange. Have a good night, Delbert
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:33 pm
Hmmm…how about we get an old DC-3 and fix it up?
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:34 pm
Damn, Mark’s filters are screwed up. Have a good one, Delbert
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:34 pm
LOL @ the DC-3
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:35 pm
Is the phrase “good night” blocked? That’s the only difference between the post that made it through and the ones that didn’t
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:35 pm
apparently the English equivalent of “guten nacht” is blocked. How strange is that?
IL Jacket
May 23rd, 2012
8:36 pm
I highly recommend that every college football fan try to get to a game at the Big House and ND Stadium. They are special places in the pantheon of college football.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:37 pm
IL Jacket, I had a GREAT time at South Bend. Of course, it helped that Tech won, but regardless, the atmosphere there was electric…….and surprisingly VERY VERY cordial
Delbert D.
May 23rd, 2012
8:38 pm
Too many parentheses in the 8:19 post of yours, I guess. I tried 7 different ways to get my first one through today. Catch you later…
IL Jacket
May 23rd, 2012
8:41 pm
You’re right, Super. They are very passionate about their football, but not hostile and obnoxious like some other venues. Of course, the Buckeye Nation is fairly well recognized in these parts as the most obnoxious and overbearing fans.
Supersize that order, mutt
May 23rd, 2012
8:44 pm
@ IL Jacket……what surprised me about South Bend was that the traveling ND fans I have seen in Atlanta were among the most obnoxious I have seen anywhere, but the ones there in South Bend were not obnoxious at all. Anyway, I AM outta here. Guten Nacht (that’s in case the filters still don’t like the English version…..LOL)
IL Jacket
May 23rd, 2012
8:51 pm
See you later, Super. Took one year of German at Tech and that is about all I could translate.
Beast from the East
May 23rd, 2012
8:53 pm
Supersize,
I would think UGA would be an AAU in the near future. The HOPE has really helped keep the state’s best and brightest home.
Some people failed math class...
May 23rd, 2012
9:17 pm
TruthHurts
May 23rd, 2012
5:21 pm
The value of the New Years SEC/B12 Bowl game is currently up for bid. Estimates range from $25M-$40M per conference. Split 12 ways on the conservative end, thats approximately $2M in additional TV revenu
———–
The SEC currently has 14 members and the Big XII has 10. Why would it be split 12 ways? “On the conservative end” $25M/24 is just over $1M per team
MightyBT
May 23rd, 2012
9:20 pm
Your penultimate sentence shows you have little insight into South Carolina’s departure from the ACC. And you are aware that McGuire’s Gamecocks won the 1971 basketball tourney, right? Do a little homework into the names Dietzel, Soloman, Grosso and Cameron and you’ll get below the lazy surface to the real drivers. Regardless…..South Carolina is far better off now as a member of the strongest conference in the NCAA, and there is enough evidence that the ACC is taking on water, for you to write an entire article refuting it.
Paul in NH
May 23rd, 2012
9:25 pm
“Its time to split the North Carolina schools into separate divisions.”
I obviously must have missed a realignment of the ACC, because I am pretty sure that UNC and Duke were in the Coastal and NCSU and WF were in the Atlantic
1 4 GT
May 23rd, 2012
9:29 pm
& I90/94 gets you from Chitown to Madison.
Paul in NH
May 23rd, 2012
9:30 pm
cityslicker
May 23rd, 2012
6:53 pm
first the acc needs two devide into north and south divisions making the south the strong football division and the north the strong basketball division thus having the best of both worlds in the big money sports market and also keeping the game geographically close and travelabe for most fans and students. THE NORTH WOULD INCLUDE CUSE, BC, PITT, MARYLAND, VA TECH, VIRGINIA, WAKE, in football VA TECH woud carry the division flag to the conference tittle game in footall. THE SOUTH DIVISION WOULD INCLUDE MIAMI, FSU, GA TECH, CLEMSON, DUKE, NC STATE, UNC
——-
Let me get this straight – the Division with Duke, Carolina and FSU would NOT be the one that is strong in basketball?
Tom
May 23rd, 2012
9:51 pm
Look it’s so damn obvious no one addresses it: no matter who other leagues add the SEC is only inferior to the NFL.
Gamecockrock
May 23rd, 2012
10:00 pm
Mark, good article but the McGuire/USC comment is revisionist history. . Duke and UNC literally ran the Gamecocks off but not before USC won titles in football and basketball in the last few years.
The politics of the NFL debate – ESPN
May 23rd, 2012
10:02 pm
[...] Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog) [...]
Wahoo23
May 23rd, 2012
10:19 pm
Supersize…you are so right about the academic rankings. There is no way that second tier academic schools such as UGA, Florida, Etc would be accepted into the ACC. Duke, UVA, UNC, GaTech, Wake, BC and Miami (all top 50 schools) would vote no to allowing those weaker institutions. Vanderbilt should join the ACC for academics and basketball. Vandy, as the only true academic school in the SEC, is a much better fit for the ACC. In the end, this is why FSU and Clemson will not leave the ACC. The Presidents and faculty at those schools like the academic prestige of being in the same conference as the top 50 universities.