What to do about one-and-done? Go back to none-and-done
Will these Kentucky Wildcats be the first and second picks of the 2012 NBA draft? Probably. (AJC photo by Curtis Compton)
It’s a lousy rule. John Calipari says so. Even David Stern, whose rule it is, says so. It’s such a lousy rule that everybody insists it needs to be changed. Question is, to what?
The NCAA title was just taken by Kentucky, which is coached by Calipari, who has come to specialize in one-and-done players. (He has had at least one in each of the past four seasons and could have three this time.) Mark Emmert, the NCAA president, told USA Today last month that he had no quarrel with Calipari’s recruiting of one-and-done players, saying the coach was “operating inside the rules.” But this rule isn’t the NCAA’s.
The NBA implemented the rule in 2005 because the image-conscious league was tiring of seeing its scouts trolling for draftees in high school gyms. From 2001 through 2004, three of the players taken No. 1 overall were high schoolers. It wasn’t that such guys weren’t ready to play professionally — LeBron James and Dwight Howard did OK — as the unseemliness of it all. Did a billion-dollar enterprise want to make a practice of sinking millions into teenage talent?
This halting compromise was hatched: To be NBA-eligible, a player had to be at least 19 and one year out of high school. Stern, who’s the NBA commissioner, took pains this week to note that his league never said a player had to go to college, but that has been the effect.
Players who would otherwise have done a LeBron were forced to bide their time, and the best players have made that time the briefest possible. Greg Oden, Kevin Durant, Derrick Rose, Kevin Love, Derrick Favors: All were one-and-done. In 2010 Kentucky had four players leave after one season. This year he won it all with a team that could see freshmen Anthony Davis and Michael Kidd-Gilchrist drafted first and second overall.
Some have cast Kentucky’s crown as validation of the one-and-done method, but such a coronation has long been inevitable. Ohio State lost in the 2007 final with three freshmen who would never play another collegiate game. Memphis lost in the 2008 final with Rose. (Calipari coached that team, too.) That it finally happened hasn’t changed anything. It has only brought the issue under greater focus.
Has one-and-done cheapened the college game? Absolutely. Institutions of higher learning have come to be seen as way stations. That’s not how the NCAA would choose to have it: For institutions of higher learning, seeing a few guys go directly to the pros beat the heck out of these cameo collegiate appearances.
To single out Kentucky is disingenuous. Every big-time program would take the players Calipari signs. The No. 1 NBA draftee in 2011 was Kyrie Irving, who worked 11 games for Duke before leaving; this year another Blue Devil — Austin Rivers, son of Doc — is bolting after one season. Kentucky and Calipari just happen to recruit better than anyone else, and if you recruit at the highest level you’re signing those most apt to be one-and-done.
The catch: If you sign one-and-dones, you have to keep signing more every year, and that’s not easy even if you’re Kentucky. After claiming his championship, Calipari said he hoped the NBA changed its eligibility rule within the week — so Davis and Kidd-Gilchrist would be back.
Stern said this week he’d prefer a two-and-done rule. Mark Cuban, who owns the Dallas Mavericks, is plumping for three-and-done. Some prefer the baseball way: A player can sign with a pro team if drafted out of high school, but if he chooses to play in college he can’t be drafted again until after his junior season. Me, I don’t like any of those suggestions.
We know from LeBron and Dwight and Kobe Bryant and Kevin Garnett that some guys are ready to join the NBA straight out of high school. To force such players to wait even longer before taking their talents to the professional level would be unfair and probably illegal. Bruce Springsteen didn’t have to spend three years in the Rutgers marching band before turning pro; why should someone who happens to be skilled in another performing art?
The best course would be to repeal the NBA’s rule and replace it with no rule, to return to the days where high schoolers could be drafted (and collegians could leave at any time). The NBA would never agree, especially not with a tightened salary cap: With fewer dollars to spend, teams want to invest in more, as opposed to less, proven products. To which I say: Too bad.
For better or worse, the NBA sits atop the basketball food chain. The NBA’s preference has served to diminish its chief feeder system. There was nothing unfair about high schoolers jumping to the pros; the pros just didn’t like it. Again, too bad. None-and-done isn’t ideal, but it trumps one-and-done.
By Mark Bradley
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110 comments Add your comment
jjm
April 6th, 2012
5:08 pm
What’s up mark how’s the weather treating you
Skeezix
April 6th, 2012
5:19 pm
I’m with you Mark. A change is needed. I prefer something like the baseball rule or go back to what we had before the 19 year old rule.
Mark Bradley
April 6th, 2012
5:33 pm
I’m fine, jjm. Thanks for asking.
David Granger
April 6th, 2012
5:37 pm
I have to agree with you, Mark. If you change “One-and-Done”, you either go back to “None-and-Done” or else bump it up to “Two-and-Through”.
The only drawback to kids going straight from high school to the pros is that an awful lot of kids overestimate their ability to play in the NBA. Some will never have that ability, and some might after a couple of years of play at a strong Division-1 program. But ultimately it should be up to the kid himself.
For kids that go into just about anything else, we don’t require them to postone their entry for a year. Kids can skip high school and…if they have the ability…become computer programmers, web developers, run their own businesses, develop real estate, become writers, act on Broadway and in TV/Film. And some of them fail, too. But for some reason, we act as if athletes are too stupid to make their own choices and have to live with the results.
Doug
April 6th, 2012
5:46 pm
The NCAA could take control of this issue if they would. The current policy of one-year athletic scholarships should be changed to 5-year (4-year with graduation) contracts that bind both parties for the duration. If a kid doesn’t want to play under those rules, no one is forcing him. What this does most is binds the institution for player’s entire college costs. If he gets injured flunks out school, whatever, he is bound. And so is the institution. The current limits on the number of scholarships would probably have to be raised, but one and done or anything other than graduate and done would be over. This would honor the NCAA definition of players as student-athletes.
Ben
April 6th, 2012
5:47 pm
How about this? Everytime a player enters the NBA draft after just one year in school, that school loses a scholarship. That’ll put the onus on the coaches to recruit players who want to go to college, not ones that just want an NBA development league and pretty coeds.
Beast from the East
April 6th, 2012
5:49 pm
I’d prefer that all professional sports require a college degree. That will never happen, so I guess I’ll have to agree with Mark Cuban.
Beast from the East
April 6th, 2012
5:52 pm
Ben,
How can you punish a school for an athlete deciding to turn pro? How is that the school’s decision?
If an MIT student decides to go to work for Microsoft after his freshman year, should MIT be fined?
doc
April 6th, 2012
6:11 pm
heh heh, mark that is a terrible solution but the ncaa can change it if they want. why not go real old school ncaa and say freshman are ineligible because they need the year to adjust and make their grades. we forget the ncaa is using kids for gazillions and not giving a dime back to these kids while proffering that the education they get is more than enough of a pay back.
yeah ncaa, go old school and make all freshman ineligible even in football and really work to educate these kids rather than use them. that is why the ncaa are kind of mute on this one as they could control it and play to their proposed principal to combine education and sports. they cant get too “high falutin” without sounding like billy payne did talking about how others need to lead their lives and how the game of golf was deteriorating when over half of the potential golfers couldnt get to be a member and that is true for a lot of clubs and true an attitude for many males playing gold as though it is an entitlement to play and it hangs below the waist.
me, good junk in the trunk looks good standing over a golf ball.
let em play. be a real sexist. yup, also hold em back ncaa and let them get an education then start to play.
Petrino
April 6th, 2012
6:18 pm
Basketball, what-ever.
Now, women’s volleyball. That’s a sport.
Sonny Clusters
April 6th, 2012
6:24 pm
We was done before our time. We was ready to sign with Clemson and then one of us decided to play professional baseball and the other one decided second shift was looking better and better and we just signed on there instead of at Clemson. There’s no regrets except for not getting a tractor on the Clemson Graduates Get-a-Tractor and Landscaper’s Easy Payment Plan. We regret that but we understand you have to graduate Clemson to qualify and we opted for second shift so we was eliminated before we got started good.
Najeh Davenpoop
April 6th, 2012
6:36 pm
If they make it two and done or worse, there will probably just be more players going to Europe out of high school (like Brandon Jennings) or the D-League out of high school (like Latavious Williams).
Until they start paying the players, anything that hurts the NCAA is fine with me. Get rid of the age limit.
bulldogbubba
April 6th, 2012
6:38 pm
We always thought a Clusters was never done!! Coach always said to follow Clusters to the goal line.Of course if Clusters had that tractor he could cut the grass at the “Orange Jungle”.Glad your not in Kansas City.All Hail To Clusters!!!
BILLDAWG
April 6th, 2012
6:43 pm
The current system is a farce as far ast NCAA and “Student Athlete” goes. I would like to see the transcripts of these one-and-done student athletes!
Solution: Admit no student to a university to play sports unless that student passes all academic requirements of the university for non-athletes.
bulldogbubba
April 6th, 2012
6:45 pm
This just in- Chipper to replace Ann Curry on the “Today Show” in September.Details are sketchy but he is expected to recieve 20 million a year.Matt Lauer has requested to become a Buck Commander if Ryan Seacrest signs on also.More details to come!
Bob in SF
April 6th, 2012
6:46 pm
IMHO opinion the the D-league needs to be expanded and made a true minor league that reflects the philosophy of each team so players that are drafted out of high school have somewhere to develop besides the end of a NBA bench.
Legend of Len Barker
April 6th, 2012
7:03 pm
If the NCAA is really serious about valuing academics, they’d bring back the freshman rule.
Oh wait. The NCAA doesn’t really care about academic excellence. They were just scared they’d miss out completely on money-making athletes.
Oh wait. The NBA is fine with it because it’s a free minor league and an extra filter. Lessens their chances of drafting the next Kwame Brown.
Delbert D.
April 6th, 2012
7:12 pm
Mark, I’ve made it clear on several blogs that I abhor the corruption of a beautiful game. I am very glad to read your comments.
Chris
April 6th, 2012
7:13 pm
Mark, for the thousandth time…..you’re an idiot.
They should at the very least have the same rule as college baseball, or even better they should have the same rule as college football.
Over 95% of these kids are not ready for the pro’s after highschool, or even after one year of college. They should have to go to a college for at least 3 years, and then they can make the decision. It would imporve college basketball drastically, and would make it much more entertaining. It works for other sports, and there is no reason why it couldn’t work with college basketball.
TS
April 6th, 2012
7:14 pm
I agree that it is condescending and obnoxious for the NBA to decree that its teams can’t draft the players they want, and for it to prohibit the most talented 18-year-olds from making a living, but the NBA is a private enterprise that can make any rule it wants (more or less). If you’re a player and don’t like the NBA rule, do something else with your life. If you’re a fan and don’t like the NBA rule, take your dollars elsewhere.
The NCAA, if it had any academic integrity, would do something about the system that lets a one-and-done skate through without even paying lip service to maintaining academic eligibility. But that’s obviously not going to happen.
All of that to say I agree with Bradley. The old way was better, but David Stern is a putz.
JSS
April 6th, 2012
7:28 pm
Silliness, this could be solved by the D-League like the European model. The problem is that too many of you (ACC, SEC, and other false prophet conferences) don’t want to see your golden teams render obsolete like the Ivy League football has become. Mark Cuban half touched on it when he ranted on it (the silly 3 year commitment solution) earlier this week. End this silliness, 1. make the cheap behind NBA fully fund and utilize the D-League as a true minor league, 2. create an alliance with the Chinese, European, and D-Leagues to transfer players and support league stability and end raiding. 3. the court has spoken on hardship, it is only a matter of time before some player files suit again and the NBA has to make another accommodation on the age issue. You can’t put that genie back in the bottle! and 4. end the NCAA D-1 monopoly of post high school talent; but I will say this make a kid choose, enter the D-League draft and give them 1-3 years to earn a NBA spot. If you don’t win a spot on a NBA roster, you can’t enter the league until your junior-senior class reaches the eligibility period. Like minor league baseball, I think you’ll be surprised the number of players who choose college. It will also weed out the players who generally have no business on a college campus!
Paul in NH
April 6th, 2012
8:00 pm
The whole concept that athletes need to go to college before playing professionally is ridiculous. Leo Messi, Thierry Henry, Ruud van Nistelrooy, Andres Iniesta and many more were all playing professionally at a high level before their 18th birthday.
Nahila
April 6th, 2012
8:06 pm
There is no easy answer here but there are thousands of high school players with NBA dreams and one handful of those might make the leap to the NBA after their Senior High School year. To me that represents much worse odds than winning the lotteries. There has to be a method chosen where a highly selected group of high school graduates can qualify for NBA tryouts held regionally around the USA where these very skilled players can be reviewed and selected and designated as elgible for the NBA draft which should be moved so that it occurs in the Spring each year and those players chosen by the draft would determine their fate like the high school and college baseball players. They can then decide whether to sign a contact or accept a college offer and then use something like the baseball rule that they would not be elgible for the NBA draft until the end of their Sophomore or Junior years.
Paul in NH
April 6th, 2012
8:08 pm
Forcing kids to go to college if they want to play a sport professionally is ridiculous. Leo Messi, Thierry Henry, Andres Iniesta, David Beckham and lots more all played professionally at the highest level before their 18th birthday and they all seem to have done OK.
Of course, forcing high level athletes to be unpaid labor for university athletic associations is very lucrative for the university.
Douglas
April 6th, 2012
8:32 pm
I think they need to do what baseball has done: let the NBA create a developmental league (didn’t they used to have one — maybe they still do) and let those players who do not want to go to college start there if they cannot make a current pro team. I’m tired of players who can barely make it into college cheapening and “representing” the college I attended. Most of the ones who leave early are not true student-athletes — they are just athletes waiting to go to the Pros. ESPN keeps saying that the quality of play in college has diminished because these players go to the pros and attendance is down — the reason I don’t go is because I want to see a real student-athlete playing sports for the college I love and with a passion to get an education. It would be interesting to see how many pro basketball players actually have degrees. There is nothing wrong with not having a degree and getting paid to play basketball — but let’s stop calling some of these guys “student-athletes” — really?
Jim 70
April 6th, 2012
8:52 pm
Kids leave early to make money, and the earlier they get to the NBA, the sooner they can become a free agent and get the big money. So change that rule – if a kid stays 4 years in college, he is a free agent in 3 years, but every year he comes out early it adds 2 years to the free agent deal.
This gives the NBA team time to work with a younger draftee, remember kwame brown.
So basically if a kid comes out a year early as compared to a panther who stas the extra year, the early out kid has to wait a physical year longer to be a free agent, but he does get paid an extra year.
So it is either money today but a longer wait for the fee agency money, or stay in school. But otherwise, who cares, a kid out of high school is no different than a one-and-done who probably either doesn’t go to class or takes basket-weaving, no disrespect to my wife who makes baskets!
Najeh Davenpoop
April 6th, 2012
8:56 pm
” Admit no student to a university to play sports unless that student passes all academic requirements of the university for non-athletes.”
Co-sign.
Yawn.....
April 6th, 2012
9:05 pm
NBA????
who effin cares…..bunch of thugs in droopy pajamas
Bobby Latrine-Oh
April 6th, 2012
10:04 pm
First…I can’t get enough Bobby Petrino jokes. You gotta post another Latrine-Oh column. Please oh please oh please! How about we do a collaborative column and collect everyone’s best one liners?
I can’t stop imagining his stupid fake grinning plastic face suddenly flashing to a look of horror as he runs over a greasy discarded KFC bucket on his scooter. Suddenly, he and Blondie are getting face planted on the road and tumbling head over heels into a ditch. His neck brace is priceless. It’s COMEDY GOLD.
Bobby Latrine-Oh
April 6th, 2012
10:10 pm
Now…on the actual topic. I’m for the 3 year rule like the NFL has. I can’t imagine why the NCAA hasn’t lobbied hard to keep it that way too. That’s huge $$$ out of their coffers promoting stars that the NBA is taking before they’re ready.
Think about all the guys that have left early at 18 or 19 and how many of them were TRULY ready to be stars before their 3rd year in the league. There are probably less than 10 of them. Even Kobe Bryant and Kevin Garnett took 3 years to really get going. The guys that leave school as juniors and seniors who are stars, become stars relatively quickly. Look at Chris Paul and Tim Duncan, for instance. They were stars in year one. The only difference is that they aren’t getting paid. Well guess what? Neither was Maurice Clarrett or Mike Johnson and we see how that went in the NFL. Suck it up.
No one has the RIGHT to work at 18 if they aren’t qualified for the job. If the NBA really wanted to, they could just say 3 years past your last high school game. Period. That’s like me being a pretentious petulant 18 year old kid thinking he’s smart enough to come out of high school and work in a law firm. I would get laughed out of the building. The real problem is that the NBA wants to have their cake and eat it too. They want the money promoting stars, but they want them to be developed before they get there and not have draft busts. By the way, there is a HUGE HUGE number of draft busts that came out early that no one ever talks about. The success rate coming out early is actually about half as good….but no one ever talks about that. For instance, how good might Daequan Cook or Sebastian Telfair be now if they had actually learned the game under Coach K or Roy Williams? Probably a lot better.
Big D
April 6th, 2012
10:14 pm
We are talking about bouncy ball not something where a child can get hurt by adults. The bouncy ball people should be allowed to turn pro the same as baseball or ping pong or track and field or anyone of other junior sports.. The bouncy ball sport may require physical maturity for some to develop the necessary skills to effectively compete at a professional level but that should not be subject to the NCAA, Newspapers or anyone else. I think the bouncy ball people have it right. They are merely less dishonest in pretending their learning institution’s main purpose is to educate instead of earn money through their sports teams. BTW is bouncy ball season over yet?
Big D
April 6th, 2012
10:20 pm
” Admit no student to a university to play sports unless that student passes all academic requirements of the university for non-athletes.”
The above would end football in the SEC.
ernisTbass
April 6th, 2012
10:32 pm
one and done was my rule when I was younger and dating on a regular basis, I like to think it was my choice but as I got older and seen a lot of my one timers married to doctors and such maybe it was their choice and figured me out early, being non commital and all, but thinking back that far can be tricky sometimes. Now I’m one n done on my good days but I still have my memories, I think.
Hillbilly D
April 6th, 2012
10:33 pm
I like the way baseball works. They pay for their own minor leagues. A guy coming out of high school can go to college or he can go to work, playing baseball, it’s up to him. Of course, the NCAA won’t like that idea because they’re afraid it would cost them money.
An interesting thing is what happened when Shawon Dunston, Jr was signed by the Chicago Cubs organization, last year. He wanted to go to Vanderbilt but he was offered a lot of money by the Cubs. His father, former MLB player Shawon Dunston told him, “You’re 19 years old and somebody wants to give you $1 million. Take it, you’ll have the money and you can go to college later”. His Dad had a point. Getting 7 figures at 18 or 19 can give you a leg up in life, if you’re smart enough to take advantage of it. If you aren’t you have nobody to blame but yourself.
GT1971
April 6th, 2012
10:58 pm
Set up a minor league basketball association similar to what MLB has. The CBA existed for many years but was not a true developmental league; few advanced from the CBA to the NBA.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continental_Basketball_Association
Give the high school basketball athlete the choice to (1) play within the NCAA, (2) play in the minor league basketball association, or (3) play in the NBA if drafted.
dawg fan man
April 6th, 2012
11:21 pm
My idea…. if drafted straight out of high school, must play in d-league one year…. or they can go to college for two years.
ToeMeetsLeather
April 6th, 2012
11:30 pm
Mark, you probably need to start calling it “1/2 and done”. Do you really think any of these kids are doing school work their second semester. This whole system is making a mockery of the term “student athlete”. I just hope my team(GaTech), and new coach, take a different approach in putting a competitive team on the court.
JSS
April 6th, 2012
11:57 pm
Silly, the reason the NBA does not use the NFL rule is because two appeal courts have told them they are not allowed to do so! Haywood established the parameters of hardships. When Hershel Walker sued to get into the NFL Draft, the courts defined the physical maturity exception into the equation which created that exception and codified the “3 year rule.” Go read the Clarett opinion, it is right there in black and white. Major League baseball has great leeway because of their anti-trust exemption. They worked out the enter and play three seasons clause with the Amateur baseball, NJCAA, NCAA and MLB. There is no comparison!
When 50-50 NBA prospects tip toward school, successful seasons are made – CBSSports.com | Football News Pro
April 7th, 2012
2:11 am
[...] Atlanta Journal Constitution (blog) [...]
What to do about one-and-dones? Go back to none-and-dones … | Money Day Dreams
April 7th, 2012
6:06 am
[...] What to do about one-and-dones? Go back to none-and-dones … This entry was posted in Uncategorized and tagged bron, calipari, championship, cuban, gilchrist, kentucky, ncaa, state, year by admin. Bookmark the permalink. [...]
Don
April 7th, 2012
7:47 am
How does the NFL get away with 3 and done?
Drexel Gal
April 7th, 2012
8:05 am
Face it: Some players are unable or unwilling (more likely) to make an academic commitment. Therefore, the NBA (and NFL) should adopt a DIFFERENT model from MLB and have minor league farm systems. That is not likely to happen, either, since both leagues use colleges as a free development league.
randy
April 7th, 2012
8:06 am
Why can’t they just treat basketball like like baseball. If the kid drafted out of high school wants to go pro he can, but if he goes to college, he has to be there at least 3 years.
Bob the Blogger
April 7th, 2012
8:07 am
Several posters have already hit on the answer: turn the development league (D-league) into a true minor league modeled after baseball’s minor league. 18 year olds could either sign for a bonus and go pro, or go to college. I’d bet many of you had college classes that had college athletes in them. You’d see them the first day or two of class, and that was it! The whole college athlete thing has been a charade for decades.
Paddy
April 7th, 2012
8:20 am
I like the baeball editon of the rule. Also if you turn 21 before your jr year you could also be drafted.
Coach Hoops
April 7th, 2012
8:32 am
The answer is simple. Make the minimum age for the NBA 20 years old(2 years after HS). Then offer a kid the choice to be drafted in the D-League for 2 year contracts if they dont want to attend college. This would make the D-League a “true” development league.
You say potato, Mark Bradley says poe-ta-toe. | Get The Picture
April 7th, 2012
8:38 am
[...] was prepared to write one of those “stopped clock right twice-a-day” posts about Mark Bradley’s column on doing away with the NBA’s one-and-done rule, when his logic got in the way. Stern said [...]
TommyP
April 7th, 2012
9:01 am
Mark: I don’t understand how you wouldn’t want the MLB model. It still allows the superstars to go straight out of high school but makes the others hone their craft in college for 3 years.
The kids who need to go straight out of high school WIN.
The kids who aren’t quite ready stay in school for 3 years and WIN.
College basketball WINS.
NBA WINS.
Perfect rule for all involved.
eddy
April 7th, 2012
9:09 am
Chasing the money…..for 99%, it is “fool’s gold” ’cause after they wash out of the NBA (even if they make it) after 4-5 years, they’ll be broke ( look at the stats), no education that will enable them to get a decent job and so on it will go. It really is tragic to have this much money flow through immature hands along with all of hangers-ons when they could be set for life. 4 years of college might help some but if they aren’t academically prepared to go to college, then they’ll flunk out anyway. No easy decision as to what should be done ’cause you cannot alter culture easily.
RCB
April 7th, 2012
9:15 am
When a college like Kentucky converts to a “one and done” system (ie we do not give a whit about seniority so we go with freshman every year- so there are five highschool players the coach can say will start if they come- and can leave when they are done) and the college says we don’t give a whit about our reputation (ie Kentucky could tell the coach to get 2 , or 3,or 4 year commitments), or coulld at least complain about having been transformed into a one year recruiting station for the NBA instead of bragging about the best one and done program, I do not have much time for a graduate of this “fine institution” blaming the NBA.
IlliniBrave
April 7th, 2012
9:19 am
More reason why basketball sucks. Attendance at NBA games is down, the brand is losing value, and even March Madness was just not as fun this year.
Steve
April 7th, 2012
9:26 am
I with you Mark. If I’m good enough to play on the pro level then allow me that option. I’ve often found it interesting that the sports dominated by whites (i.e. baseball, hockey, etc.) do not have the age limit while those dominated by blacks (i.e. football, basketball) have the limit.
Hey “Yawn” we realize the that “thug” is racist slang for black. It’s okay buddy you’re already safely behind a keyboard. You can tell us how you really feel.
Michigan4555
April 7th, 2012
9:38 am
If athletes want to learn a profession other than sports, then college is for them. If not, let them go to the pros and not take scholarships away from people who want to work at obtaining a degree and hopefully a better occupation.
My mother(40 yr. ago.) talked about athletes going into some kind of minor league after high school and earn money, then going on to the pros. If the intent is to just play sports, then college is not needed.
RileyHamilton
April 7th, 2012
10:04 am
I’d much rather watch the NBA than college basketball…yuck…the game has zero integrity and there are only about 10 teams with shot of winning each year (Conn, Kent, NC, Duke, Flo, etc.).
JSS
April 7th, 2012
10:13 am
” Attendance at NBA games is down, the brand is losing value”
Propaganda… There are 9 teams struggling with attendance (including the Hawks). Revenues are up over last season, TV viewership was up through February compared to last season.
Try reading Helene Elliot instead of conjecturing false information about the state of the NBA. Moreover, all of the teams struggling with attendance have a direct correlation between alienated fan base and ownership. When Phoenix, Sacramento, Indiana, and Washington can’t draw at home (with their history of fan support), there are deeper problems that are not basketball related!
Oh yeah, “March Madness” was unwatchable because college basketball is mostly a very boring game infused with coaches with no idea of coaching (over coaching yes)!
VCGA
April 7th, 2012
10:27 am
First of all we’re dealing with 18, 19, 20 year olds who still haven’t had their brain fully develop so trying to tell them anything is a lost cause but if they sign with a school it’s for 4 years, the NBA should have to honor that contract (they make their players honor theirs) and before a player signs with a school he must go through a series that outlines all the things he potentially gives up (free education, player development etc.) If he chooses then to go to the NBA or take a chance that he will go then he’s at least been shown the opportunities and also the downfall of his decision. It might help colleges with those recruits that sign early and then change their mind at the last hour. The colleges too must be accountable that if they offer and the kid signs he’s SIGNED (not the Saban rule).
Tech Fan
April 7th, 2012
10:52 am
Bradley, got to disagree with ya here. The baseball model is perfect. If a kid ain college material after one ofr two years, there is the developmental league and loads of overseas competition. As someone who paid for and earned a degree, I KNOW most of the Basketball players (male not female) have really no business on a college campus other than to play hoops. Yeah…..I said that.
2HLLWGA
April 7th, 2012
11:38 am
Understanding that the NBA is going to do nothing, I think the NCAA needs to act. They should allow student athletes to leave early, but penalize the athletic department two paid scholarships for each year until that student athlete would have finished their eligibility. So the current rule is thirteen scholarships in basketball. If a student athlete leaves after their freshman year, that athletic department is penalized two paid scholarships for the next three years. Leaving for academic reasons also counts against the athletic department. Only transferring to another college exempts the penalty.
In addition, to promote the idea of student athlete, whenever a student athlete’s stats are shown on the scoreboard, the scoreboard must also mention the student athletes major and gpa.
After watching what Dennis Scott, Kenny Anderson, Stephon Marbury and Lorenzo Charles did after finishing their time is horrible and the schools should take a little more pride and help their student athletes be more than a bus driver or a gym manager.
SoCal Jacket
April 7th, 2012
11:59 am
The college baseball rules should be implemented – The pros would once again have to spend dollars to scout HS players and the players/students can decide to go pro out of HS – forfeiting their college eligibility, or go to college and be ineligible for the draft until completion of their junior year. Of course, the player should also be able to simply sit-out – not sign with a college – improve their skills and register for he draft again the footing year – nothing is forcing him to go the college route.
I think that practically any student athlete who’s asked years later about their fondest memories, will mention their playing days in college as the best days of their lives … No one is being harmed by Implementing the college baseball system for basketball.
murfdawg
April 7th, 2012
12:04 pm
In the words of Hawkeye Pierce “Here is some sham-poo, we couldn’t find any real poo!” College basketball is SHAM-POO and NBA is REAL-POO. How many kids are you talking about anyway? As usual, the NCAA(national communist against athletics) has the tail wagging the dog. Maybe we should start supporting Ivy League sports.
Tokyo jacket
April 7th, 2012
12:05 pm
Mark, gotta agree with TommyP. I was going to write the exact same thing. Everyone’s a winner with the 0/3 rule.
Let's Go
April 7th, 2012
12:14 pm
I don’t see the NBA going to a 2 and done or rule like Baseball because then it would open the doors for kids to go to Europe and play and the possibility that they enjoy the money over there and don’t come back. The problem with the one and done rule is that these kids only have to enroll in school for 2 semesters and basically only have to go for one and since it’s during the season they only have to take 2 classes. The only rule the NCAA could enforce would be taking away future scholarships for players that leave after 1 year or come up with rule that you can only have so many scholarship players on the team at one time and a players scholarship stays with you for 3 years, even if they leave or flunk out early.
Trojan
April 7th, 2012
12:49 pm
Another issue is the poor level of play that is caused by talented but undeveloped players coming in the the NBA. Other than being great athletes, most have poorly developed skills.
VaBeachDawg
April 7th, 2012
12:56 pm
Mark, that’s crazy. The issue isn’t whether they have NBA talent at 18, or whether we want NBA scouts trolling around high school gyms, the issue is whether 18 year-old kids are ready for the fast lifestyle of the NBA. They’re not. It’s not always about the basketball.
Bobby You-Know-Who
April 7th, 2012
1:35 pm
If the b__tch hadn’t done that reach-around, I could have made that turn easy. Now I’ve got a face only a mother could love, a neck brace, and a pending divorce, not to mention another job hunt on the horizon.
Oh—the topic. Let ‘em play after their junior year—-in high school. They talk a big game about academics, but that never gets in our way.
brick
April 7th, 2012
1:48 pm
Just let the ones from HS who want to go straight to the NBA all have a big tournament of 1 on 1, top 5 can enter the draft, the rest can go to Europe, developemental league or college. That way it would be up to the kid. If he doesn’t make it should be clear to him his game isn’t good enough. Puts all the decision making on the kids ability, not his ego that says “My game is NBA ready” If he can’t beat a bunch of high school kids then his game isn’t ready.
Sid
April 7th, 2012
1:57 pm
Hell, I thought this was a Falcons story. C’mon you Dirty Birds……………..RISE UP
Liberalefty
April 7th, 2012
2:20 pm
if an 18 year old is old enough to go die for rich corporate america in the middle east…shouldnt he be allowed to make money from rich corporate america if his talent warrants it
Joe 12-Pack
April 7th, 2012
2:34 pm
I prefer the baseball way.
Brother Bill
April 7th, 2012
4:08 pm
Once the athlete reaches age 18, they should be able to work for any employer who would like to hire them. Isn’t it age discrimination to refuse to hire those under 19 years of age?
George Wyatt
April 7th, 2012
6:52 pm
The real onus is on the NCAA. Why not change the eligibility rule concerning the draft. Let players enter the draft and come back if they don’t sign with an agent if they aren’t happy where they are drafted. Sort of like baseball players coming out of high school. They get drafted and then decide. Bet you can’t guess why basketball is different? And football requires three years out of high school. Why doesn’t everyone clamor for change there? Hmmmm.
Bobby Petrino to His Wife
April 7th, 2012
8:09 pm
I was driving along all by myself when I had to stop at a red light, then she just came out of nowhere and jumped on the back of my bike.
Honest honey. Honest.
sting_em
April 7th, 2012
8:47 pm
If you go to college, you have to use three years of illegibility or two + a red-shirt. If you go into the NBA draft our of high school and get drafted, you have the choice of signing and going to the NBA or tell the NBA not yet and go to college. MLB has a good model. Also, have a minor league basketball where teams can keep talent in their organization and develop young players.
gt4ever
April 7th, 2012
8:58 pm
Oh the hypocrisy of it all……
How in the hell,or why in HELL would you limit someones ability to make a LIVING! If the kid has skill then let him play. I don’t care how old he is…. Good Grief…..
JSS
April 7th, 2012
11:52 pm
Sid
April 7th, 2012
1:57 pm
“Hell, I thought this was a Falcons story. C’mon you Dirty Birds……………..RISE UP”
Because you have eternal losing on the brain!
jack
April 8th, 2012
3:42 am
I agree with the one and done or the two and done. For the none and done, there are many greedy agent going around trying to persuade young high school player and their parent that they can make it. With the rule, in a way, the college and the coach can better advice them on whether they are ready. I’m just not too sure that behind every Kobe or LeBron, there are how many school kids that cannot make it in the draft or in the league.
Kville
April 8th, 2012
6:04 am
Mark what is your issue with the baseball rule? You say you don’t like it but give no reason for pushing back on the rule. I like a modified version that says like baseball you can submit your name for the draft. If you are drafted and have a college scholly in hand, you can make the choice like a HS baseball player. However, once you decide that is it. If you go to college, you must stay three years and then can re-enter the draft. If you go pro, you can’t re-enter the college ranks.
What about this process doesn’t allow a kid to make money at the pro level? Plus with only two rounds in the NBA draft it will make NBA teams think long and hard about picking a kid. With between 500 and 600 HS kids signing scholarships each year, you are talking about 5 or 6 or right at 1% of the kids that would be impacted by the change. So you don’t like the rule for 1%, come on Mark.
A three and one rule creates more stability at the college ranks and it ensures that the level of talent coming to the NBA especially the JRs would be better suited for the game than what we are seeing.
So everybody wins what’s the issue?
yodaddybrother
April 8th, 2012
8:44 am
“Bruce Springsteen didn’t have to spend three years in the Rutgers marching band before turning pro; why should someone who happens to be skilled in another performing art?”"
In football you can’t just jump to the league because that’s the rule implemented by the NFL. It’s no different for baseball either. Yes they may get drafted out of high school but they will not play in the MLB immediately, they will go to some minor league team for 3 or 4 year to actually learn how to play baseball.
As for the NBA, they need better scouts in my opinion. Basketball is the easiest sport to spot talent. These kids declare for the NBA and the only thing they can do is jump. They can’t hit an open jumper, horrible free throw shooting, no back to the basket game, bad footwork etc.
I saw the Bobcats last night and that team is full of lottery picks but I didn’t see one good player on that 12 man roster. Biyombo, Kemba Walker, Gerald Henderson, Tyrus Thomas, DJ Augustin, Maggete…all lottery picks because some scouts don’t know how to evaluate talent.
It seems to me that the best model is the NFL…after 3 years you can leave. That makes college exponentially a better product and it gives scouts time to actually evaluate players in different game situations.
There was no problem when Patrick Ewing was at Georgetown for 4 years or Tim Duncan at Wake Forest or Ty Lawson at UNC. Players don’t lose their talent.
Birmingham Jacket
April 8th, 2012
9:14 am
Please stop writing about stupid basketball. It’s a loser sport, and no one cares.
Pay for Play
April 8th, 2012
9:57 am
the players should get paid, at least $1,500 per month—they make millions for the university and get nothing except a basic scholarship. The system run by white people takes advantage of the players—most are african-american. I’m tired of this.
GFJacket
April 8th, 2012
10:22 am
Simple solution – - if you sign a player to a scholarship, you owe him/her a degree. If he leaves early and goes to the NBA/MLB/NFL/whatever and comes back after a career you are required to pay for his/her costs until he/she gets a degree. They have to do the work, but the athletic department has to foot the bill. If they do stupid things and get kicked out, all obligations end. However, if they flunk out, they can reapply just like any student, and if they get back in, you still pay their fees.
These will count against the total you are allowed to have on scholarship. This is an incentive to the Athletic Departments to get their “student-athletes” to finish their studies.
until the nba management and
April 8th, 2012
11:47 am
the players union grow 2 sets… there is nothing that can be done.
teen players and their agents would challenge any rule they come up with in court.
anything that needs to happen needs to come from the ncaa. time to put the student back in student athlete.
sorry birmingham jacket
April 8th, 2012
11:54 am
but the world doesnt revolve around YOU. get a life sheesh.
i heard that that patrino's gf
April 8th, 2012
11:56 am
wore red panties. didnt they just dismiss the uga red panty chick or was that a dude?
coincidence? i think not.
they could also bar all nba
April 8th, 2012
11:59 am
scouts and agents from campus. they do that to donors who create ncaa violations why not nba officials?
GT
April 8th, 2012
12:05 pm
Could not agree with you more. The NBA is not for everybody nor is college. Never in the history have two less compatible golds been compromised by each other. Where you and most people stop you logic is where there is a far larger purpose served by college than is reached by the entertainment business. Newspapers use to have that character too. The mere submission of a college to the weak moral character of a Calipari compromises the university far more than what is done with the freaks that are displayed at some fairground. A man or woman that can not qualify for a college education should not be allowed to enter for one year or four years, let the chips fall where they may. Stop making education so common.
Tech Man
April 8th, 2012
1:00 pm
Who cares. the NBA has so many teams and players, it’s like the minor leagues compared to the days of Jordan, Bird, Dr. J., and the rest. All the NBA looks like now is a bunch of thugs from the hood who can play basketball. Personally, I never watch the NBA-not even the championship games. I also can’t stand to try to watch the last 3 minutes of a game that last an hour.
Ron Jirsa
April 8th, 2012
3:54 pm
Mark Fox will be None and Done next year! Book it!
maypal
April 8th, 2012
4:18 pm
all these one and done thugs couldn’t even get admitted to the university under regular rules—they take scholarships from real students and leave before even finishing 1 year of classes—a total joke.
JSS
April 8th, 2012
4:33 pm
“I also can’t stand to try to watch the last 3 minutes of a game that last an hour.”
Somebody has the NBA confused with college basketball!
Bill
April 8th, 2012
5:40 pm
Mark–The stand pat Braves may find themselves at top of league—Mets sweep Braves in first three games of season. No-way this group will win wild card..bet on it.
frank
April 8th, 2012
6:12 pm
I would rather them go back to the let them go to the NBA right out of high school instead if going for 1 year of college cause if they are a bust then they are a bust it’s on them.
hey gt i agree with you
April 8th, 2012
7:11 pm
if they cant qualify like all the other students than dont them in. plain and simple. however…..
your going to have a bunch of phewitt’s whining and crying that tightening the entrance requirments is down right racist while he is encouraging athletes to one and done.
phewitt is just another sleeze bag using the system for his own gain. he is too poor of a coach to be an nba coach or even a semi pro coach so he does what he can at the college level to make sure he has a job.
82grad
April 8th, 2012
7:46 pm
Goobers, colleges (D1) are being used by the NBA and NFL to supply them with new talent without admin. expenses. TV networks make too much money also, so no changes will be made. The college baseball model would destroy the cash cows known as D1 football and basketball.
phillip
April 8th, 2012
8:05 pm
Damn good column Mark.
CC Almond
April 8th, 2012
8:33 pm
It is all about money. My solution would require that any player going pro after his first year in college pay 25% of his 1st year salary to the college he played for that one year. After 2 years in college a player would pay 18.75% of his first year salary. After 3 years in college a player would pay 12.5%. Must be 19 years old and the pro’s should not be allowed to pay a minimum salary the first year and a larger base for the next year. There would need to be a floor in the salary to prevent this from happening.
Fan of the Game
April 8th, 2012
9:39 pm
Why shouldn’t all sports be the same. They can go pro after high school, go D1 and have to stay three years or go juco and leave after 2 years. If it is good enough for baseball why not the others.
uga76
April 8th, 2012
11:15 pm
the comments about making all athletes meet the same entrance requirements for all NCAA sports are right on the money – if the Jesse Jackson’s and Al Sharpton’s want to play the race card, my question would be – Are you basically saying that athletes of every shape, size, and race are incapable of learning and meeting college entrance examinations? To imply that they can’t learn is racist if you ask me!
if this were the policy and the future “student athletes” knew it, they might stop sleeping through their classes, and if the high schools country wide would adopt reasonable academic requirements for students to participate in extracurricular activities including sports, band, drama, glee club …….. we might see a seismic shift in what is going on in schools. For example, if you want to play you must show up every day, on time, and at least make a legitimate B in all of your courses – otherwise you are not going to play and this should be pushed out to local youth leagues as well. If you are not passing, you are not playing. Oh, and the schools should make it very clear that if you want to play at some schools then a C is not going to cut it.
make the professional leagues develop and run their own damn development programs and quit using the colleges. Yes it will change the look of college athletics, but if everyone is one a level playing field if won’t matter. college kids are not supposed to be as skilled as people who get paid to go to work every day to develop themselves to play a game.
When my son was in 5th grade and playing youth football, an African American dad showed up one afternoon with his son who was probably the best athlete on the team and he had his son announce to the gathered team that he would not be playing anymore that season due to sub par academic performance and that he was sorry for letting the team down. I can’t tell you that the kid straightened out because they moved to another city but something tells me this kid became a good student to get what he wanted.
If you coddle kids like Carver Columbus did with Isaiah Crowell- he admitted that he missed a lot of classes in high school and it was no problem – you get the discipline issues that he obviously brought to Georgia with him.
Overheard a counselor at my son’s high school one day telling a kid that “contrary to what you guys believe, and are being told by friends and family, you are not all going to make it in the NBA, and if you don’t what is your Plan B to support yourself”
College athletics is clearly making the schools a lot of money, but at what price???
Oh … before you naysayers from other schools jump on this with your asinine comments about Georgia fans being whiners and Mark Richt running a thug program, put your mind in gear for a change and live in Realville – the “big time” programs are recruiting the same kids, they are having the same issues, and clearly some schools are just looking the other way or burying the problems. Case in point is the major difference in positive drug test suspension policies. You practically would have to offer the head coach a puff of your “doobie” to get suspended at some of these schools and at some that probably wouldn’t be enough.
thanks for the forum Mark – I needed to vent!
Been a college sports fan since mid 60s but I am about ready to just turn it all off as some of this stuff is just getting out of control.
mehlman rings twice
April 9th, 2012
2:39 am
Did Lexington, KY run out of neighborhood watch persons?
mehlman rings twice
April 9th, 2012
2:48 am
I guess a better question is, Did Lexington, KY run out of neighborhood watch persons with guns? To paraphrase George Zimmerman, “Those rioters are acting funny, they look like they were on drugs or something”.
GT DJ
April 9th, 2012
7:30 am
Surprised you presented no discussion on the merits of “two and done”.
Sideline Dude
April 9th, 2012
9:42 am
Just change the rule (in all sports) to having to wait until your college elligibility is over. Yea, it’s probably illegal because of the ACLU but it solves the problem.
The Man
April 9th, 2012
9:48 am
you’re only talking a few kids a year. The only reason people care is because basketball is a high profile sport. The NCAA is making billions of dollars using these kids for one year. I didn’t see the clamor when Tiger dropped out after two years, or Bill Gates after a couple of years. Allow these kids to maximize their earnings potential and leave it at that. Not worth all the fuss about one and done.
DawginLex
April 9th, 2012
10:23 am
I would agree with going to the 3 year rule like in NCAA baseball.
given that, can you imagine Kentucky’s roster the last 3 years?
Wall and cousins playing with Brandon knight
Knight on the team with Davis, gilchrist etc.
Think about duke’s team over the past 3 years.
College basketball would be a showcase again.
The change needs to be made as it forced academics into the picture in a big way
Blue
April 9th, 2012
10:51 am
Leave it the way it is.
The supremely talented players can move on to the next level, and the former All-Americans who end up being exposed as not-so-talented on the collegiate level will be exposed and forced to reconsider turning pro.
This rule was instituted mainly to protect the NBA owners and GM’s from themselves. Gone are the days of scouts salivating over any 6′9 18 year old that averaged 28 ppg against 5′11 kids that stood no chance of even playing college ball.
People always throw around names like Kevin Garnett, Kobe Bryant, Lebron James, and Dwight Howard, etc.. However, that’s revisionist history. The only one of those guys that consistently produced their rookie year was Lebron. Kevin was raw and fouled out a lot, Kobe was not ready until about year three, Dwight fouled out almost every game, the list goes on. The majority of those guys surely could have used a few more years of seasoning.
And less we forget the countless amount of high school kids who were drafted high, muddied the game before being banished to the end of the bench and being out of the league completely within two years (Darius Miles, Gerald Green anyone?)
I for one think the NBA has a better product if these kids have at least 1 year of college or playing professionally over seas. It’s not a perfect system, but it’s better than the previous rule.
Listen to Me
April 9th, 2012
11:42 am
Either pay the players or let them go to the NBA when they want to.
NCAA Div. I College football and basketball is nothing more than a minor league for the pros.
Pay the players. Quit the false charade.
Americus Jacket
April 9th, 2012
12:10 pm
Glad you’re not my lawyer! Nothing illegal about stating a player has to be 21 or something like that if there is a reason for the rule — and I think it can be proved it is. Many pro sports have minimum age requirements. I would personally choose 21 because of the alcohol in the league. But no, I don’t think it necessarily helps the kids. I think they should be allowed back to college if they don’t get drafted in the first round. That is a NCAA rule.
It would be illegal, though, if they said anyone over 35 cannot play.
AceDawg
April 9th, 2012
12:20 pm
Regulations are often made by “experts” and “leaders” that claim to know what is best for other people. While this is at least not a government regulation, I whole heartedly agree that high school players should be able to go straight to the NBA rather than be restricted by the league to have a year gap. Is going to college for one year with one and done in mind really going to create some sort of better citizen? Give people their freedom to choose the route they wish.
G-Money
April 9th, 2012
6:35 pm
Doesn’t the NHL and MLB offer athletes the opportunity to sign directly out of high school?
Howard
April 10th, 2012
1:58 pm
I could care less what the NBA does. I agree with Ben’s idea. When a college offers a player a scholarship it should be guaranteed for four years (unless student violates a serious rule). If the student leaves before the four years is over that scholarship continues to be counted against the school for the remaining years. Colleges should be allowed to offer maybe one or two more scholarships. This should apply not only to students leaving for the pros but also to those who flunk out and those who are kicked out. Plus, there should be a mandatory kicking of the student out for testing positive a second time on drugs and for any felony conviction and some serious misdemeanors. Under this policy the coaches would be forced to look more carefully at the students character. Let pro sports that do not have minor leagues develop them for those who don’t want to go to college. Then, maybe college will be college again. Some will say that the colleges will not like this because major sports help colleges raise money for the school. I believe people will still be committed to watching their college team play and still contribute to the college.