SI.com wonders: Does Matt Ryan still have room to grow?
Matty Ice asks Harry D.: "Do I look mature to you?" (AJC photo by Curtis Compton)
After Sunday’s nervous victory over Minnesota, Falcons coach Mike Smith spoke of Matt Ryan — who’d had his best game of the season — and the “maturation process.” Which sounded a bit odd, given that we around here have, fairly or not, never considered Ryan anything less than mature. He was a starter from Game 1 of Year 1, and he’s 26 now. Speaking of which …
Jim Trotter of SI.com offers a look at four NFL quarterbacks — all of whom were drafted in Round 1 in 2008 or 2009, all of whom had almost immediate success, none of whom are having a noteworthy statistical season in 2011. The four: Mark Sanchez of the Jets, Joe Flacco of the Raves, Josh Freeman of the Bucs … and Matt Ryan.
Trotter makes the case that, because more collegiate quarterbacks are playing in pro-style offenses, more quarterback draftees enter the NFL ready to play from Game 1 of Year 1. But he also writes:
It also could mean that QBs are coming into the league with less room to improve than they did a decade ago, when offenses were more ground-oriented. If true, could fans and some owners be setting themselves up for frustration and disappointment if the players fail to reach elite status before their first contracts expire?
Confronted with this argument, Falcons GM Thomas Dimitroff — who drafted Ryan with the third overall pick in 2008 — told Trotter this: “It never came up in conversation that maybe [Ryan] had maxed out because of the system he had been under. But it’s interesting that you would think that way. Maybe there is something to it.”
Toward the end of Trotter’s story we hear from Dimitroff again, and this time he addresses a point yours truly has been batting around, sort of, since the end of Ryan’s second season: That Matty Ice could be closer to Eli Manning than to brother Peyton — a very good quarterback but not quite a great one. Said Dimitroff:
There are some very valid levels below that elite [quarterback] level that can allow organizations to be successful and make runs at Super Bowls. Everyone needs to understand that. Owners and team builders and head coaches need to realize that you can win with very good quarterbacks. They don’t have to necessarily be the elite quarterback of the league to be successful as a team.
Is this a concession from TD the GM, or just a reflection of reality? (The latter, I’d say.) But I advise you to real the article for yourself. And thanks to reader Steve Young of Alpharetta – who’s not, I’m assuming, the Steve Young who succeeded Joe Montana in San Fran — for bringing it to my attention.
By Mark Bradley
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
268 comments Add your comment
JSS
December 2nd, 2011
11:33 pm
And what does that have to do with 4 tacklers not being able to bring down Marshawn Lynch in the 1st quarter last night? Please explain to all of us great and omniscient Charlie how a team that is 2nd in the league passes dropped is suddenly suppose to be anything but mediorce even when Michael Vick has not been on the field? But in the bizarro world of “Charlie,” of course, that means he’s the problem? How many leads have they blown this year Massa Charlie, please that us how they must have been Vick’s fault? When you’re unable to get even the 1st inkling of safety play then just like the Falcons anytime they seen a team that actually isolates Moore, Sanders, or DeCoud, you can smell the toast burning!
And the person who is “denial” happens to be “you.” You fudge numbers when you know that you’re not going to get the point across, that means unless you blatantly lie… Here’s the latest Charlie “lie.” “Their 100 Mil QB has 11 TD, 11 picks, and 2 fumbles, and 1000 yards passing” Since when has 2193 yards turned in to 1,000 yards Charles? Is that some of that Blackwater or Enron math? Why lie Charles?
JSS
December 2nd, 2011
11:35 pm
Bradley, please check your filter…
So Charles, when did 2,193 yards become “1000 yards?”
JSS
December 2nd, 2011
11:39 pm
@ Michael M…
You do realize that Karen Carpenter looked in the mirror and saw an overweight person as she starved herself to death? Sad that you’d pick that song because it is an anthem for the delusional who don’t see the real world for their own delusions…
JSS
December 2nd, 2011
11:41 pm
Poor Charles, he spends his life picking fights about Vick as like Nero, the rest of Rome was on fire…
P B Orr
December 2nd, 2011
11:51 pm
JSS, check out the Eagles.
72 Million Dollar Bust
December 3rd, 2011
1:11 am
@ Mr. Charlie
1,000 yards – really?
You have lost all credibility for that big lie. Do you have to make an argument with blatant lies?
That’s how the wolves got Little Bo Peep.
The bottom line is, Vick could retire today and still have more playoff wins than Ryan, so if Vick sucks, then what does that make Ryan?
It’s really sad how Atlanta Falcons fans embrace mediore performance.
Boo Brees
December 3rd, 2011
1:53 am
Enter your comments here
BlahBlahBlah
December 3rd, 2011
7:00 am
Matt Ryan #10 in QB rating this year.
Michael Vick #21 in QB rating this year. And although he has 500 rushing yards, he hasn’t scored any rushing TD’s. And now for the 2nd year in a row he’s going to miss at least 3 games.
If Ryan’s a $72 million bust, Vick’s a $100 million bust.
JSS
December 3rd, 2011
7:04 am
@ P.B. Orr…
I answered that whopper of a lie that Charles put out there, maybe Mark Bradley will release it from the AJC Blog filter if he checks back on the this mess… Charles has a Vick fixation…
Elite or Not?
December 3rd, 2011
7:24 am
Ryan and the offense are good enough for us to win a super bowl now if the D is solid but not good enough to carry us with the likes of Chris Owens playing corner – no NFL QB is. Our D must be top 10 and must be better on 3rd down. If it is we can do that, we can do anything.
Gatorman
December 3rd, 2011
8:06 am
Flacco has continually been up and down in his career, but he had been successful in some big games. Sanchez never impressed me in college nor in the pros, good defenses constantly confuse him. I like Josh Freeman’s tenacity, but he’ll need 1-2 more years to get the experience needed to be good QB. Matt Ryan still needs a good receiver that can get open deep to take the pressure off the mid range throws. It seems that speed is the only thing the Falcons draft, but outstanding receivers snap off tight routes and leave good defensive backs guessing on what they are doing. So far the Falcons don’t have that type of receiver. I don’t think Ryan can take this team to the highest level unless they have a shut down defense and a coordinator that can run that defense. Finally, we are glad we have a perennial playoff team that will surprise us with their existing personnel, but no championships.
ATLER (Ramblin Wreck)
December 3rd, 2011
8:39 am
72 Million Dollar Bust
December 2nd, 2011
9:44 pm
That’s what I’ve been saying for a long time when it comes to Atlanta fans. We looks for Mr Nice guys in Atlanta. I want a QB the can win the big games , not the Mr nice guy who hugs babies and signs autographs.
ATLER (Ramblin Wreck)
December 3rd, 2011
8:45 am
(Gatorman) the receivers are NOT the problem. If you go and look at film of this year alone, you see receivers wide open and Ryan not seeing them open. This has happen on several occasions. I think we have one of the best receiving corps in the NFL.
72 Million Dollar Bust
December 3rd, 2011
9:12 am
BlahBlahBlah
December 3rd, 2011
7:00 am
Matt Ryan #10 in QB rating this year.
Michael Vick #21 in QB rating this year. And although he has 500 rushing yards, he hasn’t scored any rushing TD’s. And now for the 2nd year in a row he’s going to miss at least 3 games.
If Ryan’s a $72 million bust, Vick’s a $100 million bust
—-
Okay they are both bust if it makes you come to reality that Ryan is a bust.
One difference – Vick is the last Falcons qb to win a playoff game.
Enjoy.
cannot make this up
December 3rd, 2011
9:14 am
better question, does wes durham’s backside have room to grow?
one word..treadmill for the dogtards ..two words tread mill
Sam
December 3rd, 2011
9:16 am
Amazing video of a high school senior from Columbia TN who kicks the ball dead straight 75-80 yards in the air. He was successful on 54 of 54 attempts this season….100%. Now he needs a college team. Wants to go to Georgia Tech!
Watch for yourself…it is unreal!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_JKwgwFY3g
72 Million Dollar Bust
December 3rd, 2011
9:16 am
Falcons have a Top 5 running back, Top 10 receivers & a hall of famer at tight end, yet no playoff wins.
Why is this quarterback not under heat like in other cities that care about playoff success?
How much more money does Blank needs to blow on making a mediocre qb look dynamic?
Nativebird
December 3rd, 2011
9:35 am
Gee minitly; The true question is: “Is there more room to grow for the HEAD COACH and GM?” This QB has only won more games as a Falcon QB in first 3.5 years than any other. And in year 4, as someone who has seen EVERY home professional game Ryan has played, he has definitely met and exceeded the eye test in proficiency, footwork, pocket awareness, delivering the ball quickly, and has decidedly more “zip” on his throws than ever before. Matt has ONE and only one deficiency that all of the other “elite” QB’s in league don’t have: MIKE MULARKEY. Think about it: Rogers:McCarthy, Breez:Payton, Brady: Weiss/McDaniels, etc. etc. Mularkey’s offensive scheme is like a lead weight to the talent and tools that the Falcon O has. Face it; honestly, He’s not in the same league with these elite OC’s. Proof: Most of Atlanta’s offensive success clearly has come running the No-Huddle: when RYAN is actually choosing which play’s to run. Net, net: the QUARTERBACK is the last problem this Atlanta Falcons team has, and the head coach AND the GM apparently don’t seem to understand it….THAT’S A PROBLEM.
Delbert D.
December 3rd, 2011
9:44 am
That NY Times web article on Rodgers is worth reading. It’s about QB development, learning to read the defense to find holes, rather than looking at receivers. It’s how Aaron Rodgers developed, spending his 1st 3 years on the practice squad, but it should be applicable to any QB early in his career.
SG
December 3rd, 2011
9:46 am
MR2 definitely came out of a program that had him in gear for the pros, but as others have posted, the surrounding talent ultimately contribute to the stats. That said, Ryan hasn’t come close to peaking – because his field-general sense, (which I think is as solid as his athletic ability), while already far superior to the other QBs mentioned in the article, still is maturing. And that’s the one trait that all the elites have always possessed regardless of the team and the scheme.
He’s a quiet one, but he is a born leader. And we haven’t seen his best yet.
Delbert D.
December 3rd, 2011
9:48 am
I forgot to mention this. It emphasizes the system around Rodgers, coaching and stability. It makes the point that Alex Smith never really developed as a pro until the staff people did.
SG
December 3rd, 2011
9:48 am
@Nativebird Agreed.
DePlane
December 3rd, 2011
9:52 am
MR2. Three and half years of steady progression. 3.5 years of winning. 3.5 years reading NFL defenses and learning to utilize the NFL talent around him. Being scrutinized, ridiculed, insulted and criticized to kingdom come.
His reaction? Handling all things with forethought, calmness and dignity. Putting his time in the film room soaking up the knowledge. Transforming knowledge to play on the field. Dealing with CMS and MM putting chains on him. He is an utltimate competitor. He is a leader. He is a role model. He is a team mate his fellow players are proud to follow and buy-in to his leadership.
This guy gets sold short by the media. SI Wonders? Pfsssst. Compare Brees 1st 4 yrs to Ryan and you will find them pretty close except that Ryan is Winner those 1st 4 yrs!
Aaron Rodgers is the anomaly. 4k yds his 1st season as a FT starter…but he was also behind Favre for three years! Brees is in his 11th yr!
The immediate comparisons are unfair. Give Ryan time folks!!!! 3.5 yrs so far! If anyone is paying attention to the fact that he is progressively getting better and better this season at running the offense on his own they will see there is a metamorphisis taking place.
Brady, Brees, Manning, these guys have all been around a long time. The jury is still out on whether Ryan will join the elite. He is just now being given the opportunity to run the offense on a more consistent basis and the weapons to take advantage of. But I believe he will succeed if Smith and company will let him.
Sid
December 3rd, 2011
9:58 am
If you know music, really trully know it, then you know it’s all been done before. Maybe phrased differently, maybe syncopated differently, but there are only so many notes. Like music writers are quite the same. Trotter’s premise is not new or is it even news. I wouldn’t ask anyone but Ryan if he was “maxed out” (excuse me while I snicker). “Seven and a Half Minutes to Destiny”, yeah, Joe Montana was maxed out. Eli Manning, a Super Bowl winning QB on ONE pass to Destiny, caught not by Burress but Tyree, and not a pass but a wing and a prayer. But by God give me one of those for Matt Ryan and a Super Bowl victory and I’ll agree about these maxed out QB’s, well, not really. Mr. Trotter, what else do you want to write about that’s already been written about.
DePlane
December 3rd, 2011
10:00 am
I’m not worried about the offense ability to win if they execute. The D is our achilles heel especially now with Grimes and Hayden out. Owens and Franks have their opportunity and now is the time if they are ever going to show and perform. Our season hinges on them and how long the others will be out. We already know AR and DB will exploit these weaknesses and I’d be surprised if HOU doesn’t test them early with Yates to Johnson.
ATLER (Ramblin Wreck)
December 3rd, 2011
10:03 am
People need to stop getting so butt hurt when others criticize Matty. To be honest, I think the back up Chris Redmond is a better QB then Matt Ryan. Ryan knows it too, that’s why he’s quick to get back on the field when he’s hurt. He’s no fool.
Mr Charlie
December 3rd, 2011
10:47 am
Chris Redmon did have an opportunity last year, he failed. He also did not show much during the offseason. Chris Redmon is pretty lucky to be employed in the NFL, and I would bet he would agree. Back up Matty Ice is a pretty sweet gig.
stephen
December 3rd, 2011
10:50 am
I think its obvious Ryan has more upside. If you look at the “elite” players, all took four to six years from being drafted to put up huge numbers and get to into this category. I assume that is what we are basing this article off of, stats which do not tell the true story of Matt Ryan’s season in 2011. You cant be sacked 13 times in the first three games and get off to a quick start. If you look at where Ryan is headed into the Houston game he is on pace for over 4000 yds passing, 30+ tds and 13-16 ints. That’s a hell of a season considering Ryan is still in a run first offense and in a Mike Mullarky scheme. Right now Ryan ranks as the 6th rated QB in ESPN’s QBR (which I am a fan of) rating scale. That’s damn good after the less than impressive, stat wise, start to the season. That is “elite” (I hate this category by the way). This could put Ryan into his second Pro Bowl, possible third playoff run, and a ton of wins for his franchise. Matt Ryan has had a better START to his career than any of the other “elites” playing and in the past as a whole.
As time moves on the Falcons will keep adding pieces (hopefully tight end and center/left tackle) and Mullarky will be forced to keep loosening the leash on Ryan with no huddle and adjusting plays at the line. Remember Manning did not become the general on the field that he was until his sixth or seventh season. Also, I have to keep in mind when articles like this come out, these writers are not watching Falcons games week in and week out from the first whistle to the last. I think if they did, you would not see Ryan mentioned in this article. The kid is too smart, too accurate, too competitive, and frankly too good to not keep improving.
Ryan is about to hit what I call the golden years for a QB in this league, age 26-31. To put in perspective Rodgers was in his fifth or sixth season when he won his Superbowl. Lets talk about this again after the 2013 season.
Love your articles M. Bradley. You write honestly and objectively with the right amount of opinion. Keep up the good work.
ATLER (Ramblin Wreck)
December 3rd, 2011
11:01 am
Their the same to me Mr. Charlie.
Mr Charlie
December 3rd, 2011
11:03 am
I think playing QB in the NFL is like being a batter, or pitcher in MLB. You see guys come in and look like they are going to be starts, but once the adjustments start being made, they figure out your weakness. It is a chess game, and you have to continually adjust. Out of Sanchez, Flacco and Ryan, I like Ryans chances to most. Over the past few games, he is playing as good as I have ever seen him play.
lulz
December 3rd, 2011
11:06 am
Mark- write your own article….seems like all you ever do is report about other articles….hit the pavement..find the story…..If i wanna know what SI thinks-I’ll read SI.
lulz
December 3rd, 2011
11:11 am
72 million dollar mistake
Id rather not win a playoff game for 20 years than be associated with Michael Vick…..the guy is a disgrace……
Mr Charlie
December 3rd, 2011
11:13 am
Actually, Redmons career stats do not look all that bad. 21 TDs, 13 Picks. But he is 4-8 as a starter, and 1-5 as a Falcons starter. Redmon had his chance in 07, he did not seize the opportunity. Notice nobody tries to sign Redmon? He’s happy to be employed.
Fact is, Ryan has won more games in 3 1/2 seasons than any QB in the history of the league. Ryan is durable, so I expect him to be in the league for another 10-12 years or so. In that time, I would assume he is going to make 6-8 more playoff appearances. In that time, I suspect he will win a game or two.
Mr Charlie
December 3rd, 2011
11:18 am
Sure, we won our last playoff game with Vick, and our last superbowl appearance with Chandler. So what? Ancient history. Actually, I would rather take our chances with Chandler running the team. 11 TD and 13 Turnovers? Those are Joey Harrington numbers, lol. But NOOOO, that NOTHING to do why why the Eagles are the must underachieving team in the history of the NFL.
JSS
December 3rd, 2011
12:04 pm
Keep listening to “Charles” of the world, you end up ultimately as just ignorant and unable to tell the truth…
“The Philadelphia Eagles, led by there defense said all week that they had their head coach Andy Reid’s back. Well after the Eagles 31-14 thrashing by the Seattle Seahawks and the team looking like they just gave up and did not want to play, now have a lot of questions to answer. The Eagles record is now 4-8 and any hope of making the playoffs is over.
This so called promising season has hit a season low for this team. There are a lot of questions that need to be asked and after watching last nights game it will begin with the defensive unit.
Coming into the season there were a lot of questions about the hiring of the Eagles former offensive line coach, Juan Castillo as it new defensive coordinator. He had no experience number one but head coach Andy Reid was so impressed with Juan’s interview that he thought Castillo was the best choice. The team really did not interview any other possible coordinator prospects.
At the time if seemed very strange. Why not find the best possible person available. Was Castillo really the best person out there or were there other reasons why Castillo was interviewed and than got the job.
Thursday nights game against the Seahawks again showed that this team still can not make tackles and still looks totally confused out on the field. There were plenty of missed coverages too. There is no excuse for any of this. The players just look out of position and just clueless and that continued again last night. The Eagles defense was embarrassed by Tavaris Jackson. Jackson made the Eagles defense look silly. The defense made him look like Tom Brady and Tarvaris Jackson is certainly no Tom Brady that is for sure.
The Seahawks running game last night ate up the Eagles defense as well. The Seahawks were led by running back Marshawn Lynch who just ran all over the Eagles. Lynch finished the night with 22 carries and 148 yards and a couple of touchdowns as well.
The Eagles just looked like they were not interested in playing. They should no heart and desire. Lynch broke tackles all night long. The defense had no answer for Lynch.
The system that this defense is running is no doubt not working. This cheerleader approach by Castillo does not work in the NFL. Where is the desire and the sense of being embarrassed from the defense. They are lacking pride and heart as well. This is how you cover the back of your head coach? Really come on now.
Let us see how it would be if you came out and said that you don’t have his back. The play last night of the defense of the Eagles totally should tell all fans that the team does not want to play for its head coach and that it has totally given up on him and the season.
Each and every player on this defensive unit of the Eagles needs to look at themselves. The performance Thursday night by the defense is totally unacceptable and has been all season long.
The blame starts with the head coach Andy Reid and goes down to defensive coordinator Castillo. Last nights performance is the final straw. Both Andy and Juan have to realize that the team and the defense do not want to play for either one of these two.”
Source: George Remally, Phillysports24×7
There is an old parable, “If you’re going to lie, then tell a good lie…” A bad lie, one that just distorts the possibility of gaining some actual good is just sad… When Charlie and his ilk post, it just reads like a terrible melodrama…
The Truth
December 3rd, 2011
12:20 pm
JSS….that’s perfect for the delusional sect of the Falcons fan base that believes Ryan to be an elite QB.
Monday Morning QB
December 3rd, 2011
12:53 pm
Matt Ryan is avery good QB. He certainly has flaws but so do most players. To say that the Falcons cannot win with Ryan is plan stupid. Ryan is clearly better than some championship qurterbacks and much better than some with playoff wins including Vick. I was a Vick fan until his flaws wrecked the Falcons. I would rather have a smart QB with a weak arm than a moron with no heart. I wonder if Matt Ryan had the same “injury” as Vick he would have missed three games while his team was fighting for their lives? I supect he would have played much Romo did. As Falcon fans we need to support the men that are here and forget about those that are gone.
JSS
December 3rd, 2011
1:04 pm
Oh yeah MMQB? We already have the answer to that point when he (Matt Ryan in 2009) had to sit out with the “turf toe.” Revisionist history is a speciality here…
Monday Morning QB
December 3rd, 2011
1:12 pm
JSS
No one plays with turf toe, most everyone plays with cracked ribs. Ryan missed a couple of games in his career. Vick misses several games almost every season. He also missed two full seasons for fighting dogs.
Mr Charlie
December 3rd, 2011
1:13 pm
Romo/Vick comparison is not fair. Romo can play and take steps to avoid contact. Since Vick is really a running back who cannot run an offense like a traditional QB, he would be totally ineffective if he were to have to sit in the pocket and throw it away of he cannot find the open man. I mean, he would throw it away ever play, lol.
However, I do think he quit against the Falcons. Either you have a concussion, or you do not. They don’t heal in 3 days. That pretty much set the tone for the Eagles 2011 season. Once they saw the “leader” quit, they all just quit. What happened to the Eagles reminds me on 2005 and 2006.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlXxj7Pzaw4
BlahBlahBlah
December 3rd, 2011
1:16 pm
How many playoff wins did Peyton Manning have in his first 4 years in the league?
Mr Charlie
December 3rd, 2011
1:18 pm
Vick 2011, 11 TDs, 13 Turnovers. And Ryan is compared to Joey Harrington? LOL. But, it is not his fault.
Trade School FTW
December 3rd, 2011
1:21 pm
The punk cant pass………but at least he isnt fighting dogs in his spare time.
Trade School FTW
December 3rd, 2011
1:22 pm
BTW MMQB, Mark it down. I say “the Falcons will NEVER win a Super Bowl with flat Matt at the helm.”
JSS
December 3rd, 2011
1:30 pm
You’re crazy, Warrick Dunn and LaDamien Tomilinson played two seasons with same degree of turf toe… But hey, I gave him the benefit of the doubt because I know from personal experience how debilitating it can be… But since you guys want to make it a personal grit issue… Hey bring it on…
Monday Morning QB
December 3rd, 2011
1:31 pm
@ Trade School
The odds are in your favor because there have been less than 40 super bowl winning quarterbacks in the history of the league. Like I said before Ryan is a better player now than some of those quaterbacks but that does not mean he will ever play in a super bowl. Football is the ultimate team game and the Quaterback cannot win or lose it on his own.
Mr Charlie
December 3rd, 2011
1:33 pm
Well, Matty Ice showed me all I needed to see when he missed 2 plays after Svetik stompped his ankle. Actually, that is when Choke gave up. after that play, he was all happy and gushing, but when came back 2 plays later, MR2 even earned Chokes respect.
Mr Charlie
December 3rd, 2011
1:40 pm
There have been 28 superbowl winning QBs.
Monday Morning QB
December 3rd, 2011
1:43 pm
JSS
If Dunn & Tomlinson had the same injury why did theirs take two years to heel? Ryan was not affected over multiple seasons? Anyone can get injured and sometimes you cannot play but Vick seems to have a low threshold for pain. Maybe you’ve seen something different but I don’t know what your looking at?
Monday Morning QB
December 3rd, 2011
1:52 pm
Of the Super Bowl winning Quarterbacks Matt Ryan is clearly better than 11 of them and as good as 2 others.
J. Namath
L. Dawson
B. Greise
K. Stabler
J. Plunkett
J. Theismann
J. McMahon
D. Williams
J. Hosteteler
M. Rypien
C. Dilfer
B. Johnson
E. Manning
It is clear by this list that the Falcons can win a Super Bowl with Matt Ryan. Doesn’t mean they will, but they could.