At least the Braves have experience in win-or-blow-it games
Here's how it turned out last season. For reference purposes. (AJC photo by Curtis Compton)
Looking on the bright side — and even finding a bright side takes concentrated effort — there’s this: If any team in the history of baseball knows how to win the 162nd game of a season behind Tim Hudson after losing two to the Phillies and entering Game No. 162 tied for the wild card after blowing a massive lead … well, the Braves are that team. Because they did it last season.
And that’s it. That’s all I’ve got. Rating the collapses, this season’s is much worse than last’s. The 2010 Braves ran out of everyday players; the 2011 Braves have run low on starting pitchers. Last year’s team had a hard time scoring for a pretty good reason; this team has a hard time scoring for no good reason.
Last year’s Braves lost a seven-game division lead because the Phillies got hot and got healthy (and got Roy Oswalt) and blew past them. This team has lost an 8 1/2-game wild-card lead to St. Louis, which was hot but is only 3-3 over the past six days and needed 23 players, eight of them pitchers, to override a five-run deficit against the 100-loss Astros on Tuesday.
So: Here we go again. One more game on the schedule, one game to assure these Braves of playing at least one more game after this.
Loading ...About the Cardinals: You’d have to think Chris Carpenter will win at Minute Maid Park tonight, but you’d have thought Carpenter would have beaten the Cubs on Friday and he could not. Carpenter was pulled after 93 pitchers for a pinch-hitter in a 1-1 game; the Cardinals yielded Alfonso Soriano’s winning three-run homer the next inning.
That Redbird loss pushed the Braves’ lead back to three games with five to play. They haven’t held it. Now they could face elimination if they don’t win tonight, but the way this stumbling chase is going they might lose to Philly and still get to play in St. Louis on Thursday. Indeed, for an hour or so Tuesday night it appeared the Braves — who trailed 7-0 — might take the wild card without actually winning another game. But the Cardinals rallied from 5-0 and 6-5 deficits, and here we are. Again.
Tim Hudson in the 162nd game. A team could do worse. For example: Derek Lowe in the 161st game — that was worse.
By Mark Bradley
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355 comments Add your comment
Sonny Clusters
September 28th, 2011
10:00 am
What’s the record for hops to second base? Ten? Heyward may hold that record. When we was playing ball and hit the ball to second, the second baseman better be watching or he could lose his head. Hitting hoppers is not even as good as hitting choppers. Choppers can be lost in the lights. We saw a first this season and that was when Chipper lost that grounder in the lights . . . now somebody told us that wasn’t a grounder but Chip Caray probably has that person all confused because he calls a grounder like this . . . “THERE’S A DRIVE! Of course, Chip Caray calls everything a DRIVE. We was thinking of throwing out the Chips like we do at home when they get stale and soggy.
motor
September 28th, 2011
10:01 am
Uggla,McCann,Prado,Gonzales cant hit under pressure.
J-Hey in deep suc.
The Bench has been miserable.
We cannot buy ANY below .300 hitters no matter what. Cause when they get here their average always goes down. Trade the pitching for a bat or two. We cant survive the East onslaught if we cant hit and score runs.
Uggs,McCann,Prado,JHey,Chipper,Freddie are gonna be .260 hitters AT BEST.
THIS HAS GOTTA STOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Cant win without .300+ hitters. Aint gonna happen.
rpidge
September 28th, 2011
10:02 am
In addition to not playing the correct guys on any given night, the Braves’ upper management has failed miserably on judging talent when it comes to making a trade or failing to make a trade. I agree that professional athletes are extremely overpaid which leads to two options, pay-up to compete or go cheap and become a whipping post for the other teams.
GoldenRods nemesis
September 28th, 2011
10:05 am
GoldeRod how do you own something that your irrelevant in? Dawgs will always rule and own this state even when tech is undefeted.. so go somewhere with the foolishness… please. Onto relevant topics braves win cardinals lose you heard it hear first!!
Sonny Clusters
September 28th, 2011
10:05 am
Nobody whose name has “Chip” in it should be back next season. Throw out the Chips. Bring Henry Grady in to play third. Congressman Lewis can call the games. “Fweddie Fweeman at bat.” This could prove interesting and be a big improvement.
Ted M
September 28th, 2011
10:06 am
When the Braves first called up Constanza, we looked great putting pressure on pitchers every which way and winning.
Fredi took him out and we have sucked ever since. Fredi should’ve shakin up the lineup.
He made all the wrong moves. Even though there may have been a rational for some of them he still made the wrong moves. You can only conclude he doesn’t have a “feel” for his team.
GoldenRods nemesis
September 28th, 2011
10:09 am
GoldenRod how do you own something your irrelevant in? DAWGS will always rule and run this state (even with caleb king and ealey at RB HAHAHA) Braves win tonight cardinals lose you heard it here first!!! GO DAWGS, Braves, and Falcons!!!
Joseph F. McNulty
September 28th, 2011
10:09 am
Here is how dire it is. In the past 5 losses, the Braves have scored a total of 5 runs! No wonder they lost 4 or 5. Now Huddy is pitching, which is good, but he really needs to throw a shutout for the Braves to have a chance to win, which is not so good. Did Frank Wren have any inkling how bad offensively this club would be? If the Braves do not open the checkbook and sign Prince Fielder, then we will all know that being a “fan” is just a charade in which our money is transferred to a management, which has no real interest in winning. After this debacle, there have to be some new faces next year. When the Phillies signed both lights-out pitchers Cliff Lee and Roy Oswalt, and the Braves were content to go with Derek Lowe and Mike Minor, it was clear what was going on. The club desperately needed a bat, so the mountain labored and brought forth a mouse, Michael Bourn, a fine player, but not the headline thumper they needed. The days of trading for Fred McGriff are long gone . . . alas. They may win tonight — Hudson may “gut” it out — but even that will just delay the inevitable.
GaryinBham
September 28th, 2011
10:10 am
No baseball fan wants to see the season end early. Heck with all this, “put us out of our misery.” I’ll take a playoff in StL. I’ll keep watching until it’s over. Sure I’m frustrated. Go for it, guys. Put Georgie in, heck, play Teheran at shortstop if he can swing and connect. Leave it out there and see what happens. No cap tipping, no holding back. Be like Huddy, all of you, for one night and see what happens–get mad when you get taken out, hope they hit it to you, let’s GO!
PTC DAWG
September 28th, 2011
10:12 am
The Braves have quit, so why should I care?
As to Goldenrod…LMAO.
Matt
September 28th, 2011
10:13 am
I don’t know if this is really the case or not, but I suspect Constanza stopped receiving playing time when the Braves brass realized that he could supplant Heyward and his marketability. Heyward is still a big money-maker for them, so there’s no way they were going to watch some other guy play right field, even if the other guy is better.
Sideline Dude
September 28th, 2011
10:16 am
Fade on. Let’s let this dead horse go & get baseball season behind us. The NHL, that other endless sport, is waiting.
pat
September 28th, 2011
10:17 am
Well, for what its worth, go braves. Maybe blowing a 10.5 game lead is just the kind of spark this team needs.
Barry
September 28th, 2011
10:20 am
Wow this team has completely fallen on their faces and they still keep eating dirt. I have never seen a team completely collapse so badly as these Braves have. Has this whole team completely forgot how to hit? Is it time for yet another hitting coach? I am just dumb founded at this teams inability to hit a baseball now. They can’t even muster a fly ball to the outfield for a sacrifice fly. I DO NOT think this team will make the playoffs…I don’t. Even if they do are we honestly expecting them to be competitive??? Seriously. This team hasn’t been competitive for like 3 weeks. This team needs real major league ball players. I’m almost ready to jump on the “trade Heyward” bandwagon. This guy has sucked all year. What in the world has happened to guys like McCan and Freeman? Even if this Braves team somehow makes the playoffs…who’s gonna pitch? Hudson is the only real starter we have. Lowe should NEVER be handed the ball again. I would start Minor and Delgado over Lowe and Beachy. I feel bad for Bobby Cox having to watch this. Hey Braves…way to dishonor his legacy by totally sucking the last month this season and losing everything you worked hard for!
Curt
September 28th, 2011
10:20 am
Last night I wanted to see some amount of emotion from the Braves, something to show that they cared about getting out and losing. Perhaps someone to break a bat over their knee…something, anything. Finally in his last AB, Chipper slammed his bat on the ground. Too little, too late.
When he was hired, many of us thought Freddie might be different from Bobby in his approach to the game. We were hoping for more small ball which can be a catalyst for getting a team going and at the least putting the other team on their heels. Freddie did show he was different from Cox in that he has no clue in how to set a line up. It is common to make small, calculated changes to a line up early in the season in order to find that right mix. Freddie has gone to the extreme in changing the batting order. What this does is cause players to become uncomfortable and comfort is one of the primary keys to success at the plate.
Freddie also does not seem to know when to leave a pitcher in and when to relace them.
I watcher Freddie last night and he seemed to not care when his pitchers were giving up runs. Seems to me that if winning were that important, he would have replaced Lowe afther the first inning or at least after he gave up a second run.
Freddie does not go out and play but he still has a huge impact on weather the teams wins.
I think the Braves need to re-think their choice in manager
pat
September 28th, 2011
10:21 am
It is puzzling what happens to hitters when they get to Atlanta, good hitters can’t hit here and it just doesn’t make sense. It’s it coaching? Is it the locker room? Is it the ball park? Maybe if we changed it to Hank Aaron stadium like it should be, we could start getting some meaningful baseball.
fla dawg
September 28th, 2011
10:25 am
will all of you idiots stop screaming that we need to let Lowe “go”.
we owe him 15 million dollars for next year. if you release him then you still have to pay him and that is a big drain on the payroll. the only way that he is tradeable is for the braves to still be paying a large portion of his salary even though he won’t be here.
Marvin Mangrum
September 28th, 2011
10:26 am
Been a Braves fan since the 50s, something like 56 and 57 started it, but I am saying this and I will not comment again cause it is useless, but whoever told whoever to play Heyward instead of Contanza ought to be fired. Who ever allowed it to happen, ought to be fired. Whoever else who allowed it to happen ought to be fired. See, I never read it in the paper cause for some reason you folks think not being thrown out of the clubhouse is more important than the truth. Somebody ordered the man not to be played, that person should be fired and openly be shamed. For just that reason alone someone needs to go. And another, Mc Cann has been hurt since he pulled his back muscle, it is not healed, do you suppose that might have anything to do with him hitting 180 since the break? I mean you are the writer, you go in the clubhouse after every game, you can not tell the man is hurt? And Chipper, what can you say> He can hit but he can not run! Do not think about it it is stupid to even ponder. And Derek Lowe. Good grief! Can we call him pitiful, it is a shame I have not read that cause he is truly pitiful. But you know what? The pitiful thing is that some moron puts him out there every five days! To lose. Oh, and not 1 to nil, a lot to nearly nil. Almost every time! When they got Bourne then had Contanza in there, they were exciting. The last 30 days, only their relatives could watch.
Leading Off: What a Finish - NYTimes.com
September 28th, 2011
10:27 am
[...] flop against Philadelphia, it has begun to feel like “Bull Durham” in reverse. The Atlanta Journal-Constitution’s Mark Bradley mined the situation for a bright spot and decided that at least the Braves have been here before, [...]
gtjacket81
September 28th, 2011
10:29 am
The only WS win was in 1995 which which was a strike shortened year. The season did not start on time and fewer regular season games were played. I always contended that the Braves were a regular season team and ran out gas or strategy in the playoffs. Possibly if the full season and playoffs had been played, they might not have even won the one WS.
I fully support the Braves but I expect and am ready for it to be over tonight
BEEFENSE
September 28th, 2011
10:30 am
Get out of town LOWE and take the “next Willie Mays” with you–you and HEYWARD make bubonic plague look attractive.
Freddi Dumboy
September 28th, 2011
10:31 am
I thought Lowe could do it. Oh darn!
Brad in KY
September 28th, 2011
10:33 am
@Mark Bradley: Even if the Braves make the playoffs they don’t have a very good chance of winning the World Series because they don’t have many players who’ve won the World Series before. All you have to do is count the number of rings in the clubhouse to know this is true.
Now, if you disagree with me on this, then please tell me why you keep saying this about the Falcons (that they won’t win the Super Bowl because they don’t have enough players that have won the Super Bowl).
Business Man
September 28th, 2011
10:33 am
@DC33: Thanks for the answer.
Tom A. Hawk Losers
September 28th, 2011
10:34 am
You know what’s more pathetic than all the miserable cry-babies on this blog? Those of you who live in Hot-lanta and don’t support your team by going to the games.
Tonight, the Braves are playing in what amounts to the Game Of The Year.
I just checked StubHub – YOU CAN STILL BUY TICKETS FOR TONIGHTS GAME FOR ONE FRIGGIN’ DOLLAR!!!!! One lousy buck! The most important game of the year — and a lot of you Blog Heads could be there for less than the cost of a Big Mac.
Last night’s game drew only 38,000 – capacity is over 50,000. (And many of the “fans” attending were Phillies’ fans!) For the year, Atlanta averaged LESS than 30,000 – about 59% of capacity, for a team that was leading WC all season.
Meanwhile, the Braves are playing the Phillies who have 217 consecutive sell-outs (including 13 playoff games) and this year averaged 45,400 – which is 104.4% of capacity. Even for a no-nothing regular season game at the Bank (Citizen’s Bank Park, Standing Room Only tickets usually cost more than $50 or more!
Small wonder the Braves struggle with that kind of “fan” support.
Get off your blogger butts tonight and support your team!
Tom A. Hawk Losers
September 28th, 2011
10:37 am
Braves have no shot tonight.
MitchC
September 28th, 2011
10:37 am
I dont thjink my last post went up, so i’ll do it again.
Mark, as much as I want to believe, I just cant with this team anymore. Blowing such a big lead is inexcusable.
I think one of two things will happen. Either the Braves will lose tonight, the Cards will win, and it will be over, or both the Braves and Cards will lose, and then the Braves will lose the playoff tomorrow.,
Oh, and Phillies troll, just remember. After tonight everyone is 0-0. Your team is guaranteed nothing. Someone might just come along and knock them right out of the playoffs. Yiur name really should be “Phillies, Classless of the NL”:
JJ
September 28th, 2011
10:38 am
If I’m not mistaken, Hudson got shelled in the 162nd game last year, and the Braves had to hold on to win.
JJ
September 28th, 2011
10:41 am
MB Wrote: The 6-0 lead was in Game 4 of the 1996 World Series. The Yankees won Game 3 by the count of 5-2.
You should know Mark. After the first two games of that series you proclaimed the Braves to be a dynasty. You put the jinx on the franchise. Work your magic and remove it.
Fire Frank Wren and Fredi Gonzalez and Brian Snitker
September 28th, 2011
10:42 am
I’ve been saying for three years now that Frank Wren is completely incompetent. He has made poor personnel decision after poor personnel decision. This season is a culmination of that.
But, to make matterw worse, He’s now hired an incompetent manager. Fredi Gonzalez has made poor game decision after poor game decision this season and should be run out of town. And take Brian Snitker with you. Fredi has ridden O’Flaherty, Venters, and Kimbrel until their arms have fallen off, short-sightedly killing the Braves’ post-season chances.
Monday night, however, was an example of how Fredi has killed this team game-by-game. Down 4 to 2 in the 8th, Michael Bourn, who the Braves acquired for his speed, drew a walk with 1 out against right-hander Brad Lidge. Lidge hardly ever throws to 1st. Anyone with any sense would have had Bourn take a good lead and steal 2nd on the 1st or 2nd pitch to get into scoring position with Prado and Chipper coming up. “Anyone with any sense”–not Fredi. Fredi keeps Bourn at 1st. Prado slaps a slow roller to right on a 1-2 count that would have easily scored Bourn had he been at 2nd to make it a 4-3 ballgame. Not Fredi. Fredi and Snitker compound their error by holding Bourn up at 2nd! The fastest guy on the team can’t go 1st to 3rd on a slow roller to RF?
You know the rest. Chipper grounds into a double play, and the Braves go into the 9th down 4 to 2 rather than 4 to 3, which is a drastic difference. In the 9th, Uggla leads off with a double. Does he score? Of course not. Freeman and McCann strike out before a grounder to 1st ends the game. Now, had the score been 4 to 3, Freeman should have sacrificed Uggla to 3rd–tying run on 3rd with 1 out! Lidge would have to pitch very differently to McCann. If either McCann or Heyward gets a hit–the ball game goes to extras. Instead, the Braves lose 4 to 2. Why?
Because Frank Wren, Fredi Gonzalez, and Brian Snitker are incompetent at their jobs and SHOULD BE FIRED.
Why Is This Man Managing?
September 28th, 2011
10:43 am
Playing Lowe and not playing Constanza; continuing to bat Prado second….or play him at all; leaving pitchers in far too long; waiting for the 3-run homer instead of playing proactive, hustle ball; making dim-witted comments about how he’d rather have these players than anyone else in the league…..Freddi is a fool who is in way over his head. This team will never prosper with him at the helm.
Abnerish
September 28th, 2011
10:43 am
Constanza stopped playing when Constanza stopped getting on base!! Why is it so hard to figure out! Fredi said he was going to ride the hot streak until it was over and that’s what he’s done. The Braves have not lost all these games because Constanza didn’t start. The Braves have lost all of these games because they are playing losing baseball. They aren’t doing what is needed to in order to win that particular game. Whether it be timely hits, holding leads, playing sound fundamental baseball, each game they find a different way to lose.
Dirty Dawg
September 28th, 2011
10:44 am
As disheartening as this ’swoon’ has been, if they ‘can’ make the playoffs, and they want to, then, please, do so…just don’t expect a sell-out for any of the post-season games, except the one, potential, extra game in St. Louis.
Abnerish
September 28th, 2011
10:47 am
If we somehow get a lead tonight, Fredi better be ready to pitch O’Ventbrel as early as the 4th inning. 2 innings from each pitcher if possible. If you are going to lose, lose with your best pitchers out there. No Martinez, no Linebrink, no Medlen, no Vizcaino. Hudson, O’Flaherty, Venters, and Kimbrel. That’s it. Don’t play for tomorrow because there may be no tomorrow.
country boy
September 28th, 2011
10:48 am
I think, as Braves fans, we have to look on the positive side of things. We have had a front row seat to one of the most monumental collapses in baseball history. Not every baseball fan can lay claim to this.
Fire Frank Wren
September 28th, 2011
10:48 am
I used to wear my Brave’s cap…..I don’t anymore.
Why Is This Man Managing?
September 28th, 2011
10:52 am
Constanza was the spark plug this team needed. Stopped playing because he stopped getting on base? Gee, too bad the same standard wasn’t applied to McCann, Prado, Uggla, et. al.
Abnerish
September 28th, 2011
10:52 am
The extra game will be in STL and it will be sold out
Dr. Phil
September 28th, 2011
10:53 am
I don’t want to inflame and already angry Sonny Clusters, but the Braves’ tailspin started when Chipper pulled up on a catchable pop foul against Houston that led to the 19 or so inning disaster.
Ted M
September 28th, 2011
10:53 am
Abnerish – Constanza was hot and had a minor ankle injury and came out and Fredi has only played sporadically ever since.
Ted M
September 28th, 2011
10:53 am
the extra game in St Louis is probably already sold out.
DawgDad
September 28th, 2011
10:54 am
The Braves were a really good team from May through August. They are 9-17 in September, ironically Derek Lowe’s current record, and that is about as bad as it gets for a major league ballclub. All they had to do was win 11 games and go 11-16 for the month; even with Minor, Beachy, and Delgado in the rotation that should have been attainable. No, this collapse is in the hands of the core veterans on the team, Bourn, Prado, Jones, Uggla, McCann, Gonzalez, and Lowe, who have collectively tanked and played like a last-place team. You can say they didn’t get all the help they needed from Heyward and Freeman, or Venters and Kimbrel (hardly an excuse there), but when a club is barely playing .300 ball (winning pct., not BA) and collectively not hitting a lick, that’s on the veterans.
I was on another blog where baseball fanatics were predicting who would be the top MLB second basemen three years from now. Dan Uggla was not even mentioned in passing.
Mitchell
September 28th, 2011
10:54 am
Mark Bradley
September 28th, 2011
8:47 am
The 6-0 lead was in Game 4 of the 1996 World Series. The Yankees won Game 3 by the count of 5-2.
The Braves never should have lost Game 3. How do you score 16 runs in two games, come home and get 2?
That was where it started. Bullpen blew that game too.
Terrible. Still the biggest Braves choke.
Derek
September 28th, 2011
10:54 am
BRADLEY, thanks for the tidbits! “Carpenter couldn’t beat the Cubs” He allowed only one “1″ run, 2 walks and 5 strikeouts in 7 innings! and was pulled, also the Cards are almost 20 games over .500 and have beaten us 5 – 1 this year! Oh yeah, they are 3-3 over the last six however one loss was in the 9th innning by 1 run and the other was in the 10th by 1 run! How much did we lose over the past six and by how much? Get some sleep instead of writing at 1:45 AM!
chris
September 28th, 2011
10:55 am
too painful to watch…but we are at least at game 162 and have a shot..gotta hope for the best
Popeye3311
September 28th, 2011
10:55 am
I blame the two numb nuts, Fredi and Lance Parrish. How many one run games did we lose this year because we didn’t move the runner over early in the game. How many sacrafice flys didn’t occur? There is no thinking at the plate. The reason the 2010 team survived despite little abilty to hit was they worked counts deep and got into the bullpen. There is none of that. I can’t past how miserably Freddi manages the pitching staff. Why was Christian Martinez brought in the other night as a righty against the teeth of the left handed Phillies order, when he already pitched two days in a row in Washington and got lit up? Where was Medlen, who did well Sunday? Why was Lowe pitching and not Teheran? I’m sure he could have given up 6 runs in 4 innings as well as Lowe, but at least he would have gained experience for the future. (BTW, Vizcaino needs a third pitch or he will fail at this level. See Manny Acosta). Add in the countless times this year that that Freddi left someone in one batter or inning too many (particularly after letting the starter bat only to get lit in the top of the inning). Sparky Anderson changed pitchers when his gut said so, and didn’t bother with the “i gotta trust this guy and be a players manager and let him go”. That’s how Sparky got in the hall. I’m done venting. Thank you. I was just not prepared for the season to end today after going 5 months with the 3rd or 4th best record in baseball.
Albert
September 28th, 2011
10:56 am
Go Cardinals!!!! Dont want to have to listen to that woaa woaa chant every time braves bat
Braves "True Fan" Showing True Colors
September 28th, 2011
10:58 am
The last time that I checked, the Braves are still in it. I don’t care if D-Lowe pitched crappy last night. I don’t care that the Braves gave up 9.5 games in September. The fact remains that they still have a chance to be in the post season. So “True Fans” put on your big people pants, secure those ankle braces, and get back on the bandwagon, there is a game left to be played, maybe another, maybe another, maybe another.
It’s sickening to hear what “great” fans Braves fans are and hear people say, “if you make the playoffs, don’t expect a sell-out.” Why not? They made the playoffs! Being a fan is painful sometimes, unfortunately, this is one of those times. If you are a “true fan” show it! Stick by your team through thick and thin … if you don’t then go jump on the Cardinals, DBacks, Phillies, or Brewers’ bandwagon, the Braves don’t need you.
Ferb
September 28th, 2011
10:58 am
The poll above says a lot about this Braves team and the lack of heart, inspiration, ability to win…but baseball is a funny game. You never know what’s going to happen. Braves could finish their fade tonight with another pitiful performance, or score 14 runs with an Uggla multi-homer game…it’s why baseball is the most frustratingly awesome game in the world.
Oleo in South Ga.
September 28th, 2011
10:59 am
This avalanche started with the loss against Mets the night before Irene hit New York. 3 days off. We lost all momentum and motivation at that time. Haven’t pitched or hit a lick since.