Would you pay $60 million to keep Uggla? The Braves might
New manager Fredi Gonzalez asks Dan Uggla for a loan. (AJC photo by Brant Sanderlin)
Dan Uggla brings a reliable bat to a team lacking reliable bats. But he’s a lousy fielder — the 2010 Braves weren’t very good at catching the ball, either — and he turns 31 in March. So now I ask: Is this the guy you want to re-up for $60 million over five seasons?
Nick Cafardo, the fine baseball writer for the Boston Globe, just Tweeted that “Atlanta sources tell me Dan Uggla closing in on a five-year, $60-$61 million extension.” If this is true, I say …
That’s almost Chipper Jones money. For a guy who demonstrably isn’t Chipper Jones.
You can argue that Uggla is a better hitter at 30 than Chipper is at 38 — and Uggla isn’t coming off knee surgery — but still: Twelve million a year for a guy who has driven in 100 runs once in his career and who has never hit .300 and who’s surely going to have to find a new position soon? That’s a lot of money.
If you’re a fan, you wouldn’t mind such an outlay. If you’re a fan, you’re tired of the one-and-dones — J.D. Drew, Mark Teixeira — breezing through town en route to a massive contract elsewhere. And you’d hate to have given away the All-Stat utilitarian Omar Infante and the live young arm of Mike Dunn for another rental. (And besides, it isn’t your money. It’s Liberty Media’s.)
Me, I’m not sure Uggla is a cornerstone player. I think he’s good man to have on a team, but I don’t see him as a man capable of carrying said team. On the one hand, it’d be nice to see the Braves willing to invest so much money again. On the other, I’m not certain this is the man in whom so much should be invested.
You are, as ever, free to disagree. And I know you will.
By Mark Bradley
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241 comments Add your comment
P Rose
December 17th, 2010
1:23 pm
HELL yes. Uggla was the best slugger out there, and the Braves desperately needed a slugger, and they got one. He is The Man. He’s from Tennessee, he grew up a Braves fan, he wants to be here and he’s happy. Wren should get this deal done NOW.
Headley Lamar
December 17th, 2010
2:09 pm
Chipper Jones is worth every penny the Braves have ever paid him.
You see dummies baseball is a business. The Braves are out to make money.
Whatever they have paid Chipper over the years he has made that back for the team and then some.
lalalalalala
December 17th, 2010
2:54 pm
I’d take McClouth over Werth becuase he’s cheaper (at least following the logic on this blog)
coach13
December 17th, 2010
2:59 pm
12 mil a year to a guy who hits 30 HR and 100 RBI a year?!?!? Uhhhhh yeah!!!!
stupup74
December 17th, 2010
3:06 pm
Stupid, stupid, stupid. The braves are 2 years from getting out from under Lowe’s and Chipper’s contracts. You got Prado. Keep him at 2b and use this money to find some OF help.
vermont 39
December 17th, 2010
3:09 pm
look at it another way…Chipper is getting Uggla money…not such a bad deal now!!!
coach13
December 17th, 2010
3:09 pm
Headley- he hasn’t hit 30 HR since the 04 season and has only driven in 100 RBI once since 03. With his 14 mil a year we could sign a quality player who is going to produce and help this team win.
coach13
December 17th, 2010
3:12 pm
stupup74- why not sign him long term and move Prado to 3rd? Then you still use all that money to go get a big bat in the OF? You aren’t going to get 30/100 very often for that price. THe Nationals just paid 4 mil more than that for Werth. Their numbers are pretty comparable.
Brave New World
December 17th, 2010
3:31 pm
Christopher Chance:December 17th, 2010 12:57 pm
Brave New World……..In the past two years, Derek Lowe has ZERO complete games in 67 games started, averaging 5 2/3 innings per start..with an ERA of 4.33 Cliff Lee has 13 complete games in 62 starts the past two years….averaging almost 7 1/3 innings per start…with an ERA of 3.20.
Cliff Lee SAVES a team’s bullpen.
I’d take Lee at $24 mil over Lowe at $15 mil.(Sorry, Chris old boy, the Phillies got there before you did.)
MitchC
December 17th, 2010
3:35 pm
Christopher, I agree with you, but.. unfortunately, we signed Lowe to that deal.. and now.. we just have to take what we can get.
Lowe has been a very lucky pitcher the last two years. The Braves score runs when he’s on the mound. He won 15 games last year with a 4.67 ERA, and another 16 this year with a 4.00 ERA. Poor Tommy Hanson had a 3,33 ERA, and was sub 500 at 10-11.
Anyhow, not to get sidetracked. Back to the point of Mark’s article. Unfortunately, the Braves are not a top level payroll team which will attract free agents like Maddux anymore. It’s all about.. not to quote Cuba Gooding in Jerry Maguire, but.. “Show me the money”. Yes, Cliff Lee took “less” from the Phillies to join what might be one of the best rotations ever assembled, but.. that is rare nowadays.
I don’t know what choice the Braves really had in this matter. We are trying to rebuild into a playoff team, after four years of mediocrity. Somewhere, you have to show that this cheapskate ownership is going to spend money.
Maybe it’s the riverboat gambler in me, but.. I say this was probably the best the Braves could do. We need a power hitter who wont bolt from us after one year like Tex did, with Chipper on the decline, and on the way out, and Mccann and J Hey our only power threats. Sometimes, you have to make choices in baseball. The Braves are doing that.
Honestly, we wont be able to assemble a really potent lineup, until Chipper retires. I respect all he has done for the Braves, but. we can take his 10 to 15 mil, when he does hang it up, and put it into a younger, more productive hitter.
The 2011 Braves should be better than 2010, if all are healthy. We arent Philly, but, as I said before, we are about the next best team in the NL.
ShaunC
December 17th, 2010
4:06 pm
Jason Heyward can be that guy. This is just another cog in the wheel.
UKUGA
December 17th, 2010
4:18 pm
Of course it’s reasonable.
It’s still less than Chipper Jones money, and Chipper is playing for a “discount.”
In 2015, the final year of this deal, $12 million won’t be the $13 million Chipper Jones made in 2009. Think about it . . .
Heyward is cheap.
Freeman is cheap
Hanson is cheap.
Jurrjens is cheap.
Chipper and McLouth are in the final year of their respective contracts.
McCann is signed.
This is the guy to sign. He’s in the fold. He wants to be a Brave. He could probably get more elsewhere.
Show me an alternative, rather than simply criticizing the signing.
Warren Spahn
December 17th, 2010
4:19 pm
Chipper has done a lot for the Braves through the years. However, Henry Aaron did much more. I don’t hear anyone wanting to bring Henry back to play rightfield. Chipper, like Henry, has his productive days behind him. The team would benefit if Chipper would retire.
8dogman
December 17th, 2010
6:43 pm
I will tell you what I think about paying Uggla 12 million dollars a year. I think it is dumb. I don’t think any baseball player is worth that kind of money. The players and their agents are nothing but money hungry rogues trying to get all they can bilk out of the owners and the price to see a game has gone through the roof. The Phillies seem to have unlimited funds these days and other stupid teams are getting into the act making these already enormous salaries go through the roof. I would like to get back to the good old days when players actually earned their salaries from year to year. If you had a good year you got a raise. Players have no loyalty these days. They are just in baseball for all they can bilk out of owners no matter who the owner is. I use to love watching baseball but now I very rarely watch a game since the players no longer want to play for the fun of it. They are just trying to get rich and that stinks! The owners could break the back of these agents and money hungry overpaid players if they just refuse to sign any free agents and I wish they had the nerve and guts to do it but the Yankees, Red Sox and Phillies won’t let than happen with their unlimited resources.
8dogman
December 17th, 2010
6:50 pm
I totally agree with Warren Spahn @4:19. Chipper has been a good player but his best days are behind him. We need more players like Hank Aaron who earned him pay every year not these bums we have playing now just to get rich and owners dumb enough to give them all this money.
It's over
December 17th, 2010
10:59 pm
Spending 12 million a year on a spotty hitter with no glove is ridiculous. I think when you strive for mediocrity instead of locking up solid ball players, you get mediocre results. There were studs out there for the picking. The Phillies got better overnight by picking up Lee, thereby taking a big load off of their bullpen, and their hitters will be energized and will not repeat their collective slumps after numerous injuries from last year. They will not miss Werth, who was a disaster with runners in scoring position. I think the Braves have a h*ll of a hill to climb.
MitchC
December 18th, 2010
1:27 am
UKUGA, not to burst your bubble, but.. all the guys you are saying will be “cheap”, will be eligible for either artbitration, or free agency, by the time your hypothetical team in 2015 rolls around. All the guys you mentioned are going to either get raises, or be with other teams.
We have to worry about 2011. This was a good deal for us now. Lowe’s contract will be off the books in two more years, so will Hudson’s, even though Huddy didnt cost us an exhorbant amount of money.
The big question for the Braves is Chipper, in terms of talent, production, and money. Can he come back? What will he give us if he comes back, and, if he can’t come back, what can we get if we use the money we paid him.
I think Chipper will play in 2011. After that, I’m not sure. I know all about his contract.. but.. something tells me that if he plays a fair amount of games, say 120-130, and doesnt produce that well, he may hang it up after 11. The good thing now is that Uggla, Mccann, and J Hey are our three most counted on run producers. Chipper can hit 10 to 15 homers, and drive in 70 runs, and that would suffice.
Hopefully, all the pieces will come together.
fieldofdreams
December 18th, 2010
7:34 am
They won’t keep him otherwise, Mark. There are too many teams out there willing to pay him big money. In the post steroid age guys who hit even 25 homers command this kind of money.
MJ
December 18th, 2010
10:01 am
I’m not sure that a 31 year old 2nd baseman can hit at the same power pace for the next 5 years. But desperate people do desperate things. The Braves need power hitting. I’m a huge CJ fan, and hope he can come back healthy to finish an incredible Hall of Fame career. I feel like we traded too much for Uggla as we did a few years ago for Texiera. I hate seeing the best yong shortstop in the game playing alongside the best young closer in Texas, knowing both were Braves, and we gave them up for Tex. Let’s hope it all works out guys. By the way, I know I’m going to get negative comments for saying this, but all you Chipper bashers need to lay off. The guy is dinged up, and yes he has been hurt in years past. But don’t forget who he is, and what he has done for this team. First of all, he’s going into the Hall fo Fame. Second, he is loyal – don’t think he could not have tested freee agency over the years and signed elsewhere for alot of money. Third – he is a team leader, and has set an example of how to play the game for every young player coming up. Lastly – the guy wants to end his career on his terms, not on an injury. If he can come back, give him support and let him finish his career with respect and dignity. He’s given us great play over the years, don’t forget that.
UKUGA
December 18th, 2010
10:33 am
MitchC,
You didn’t burst any bubble, you merely didn’t follow what I was saying.
I was making two separate points. Chipper made $13 million in 2009. Uggla will make $12 million in 2015. That’s a small difference in dollars, but a long period of time. It was to counter Bradley’s point that Uggla makes almost “Chipper Jones” money. Chipper made that money at a “discount”. Uggla turned down similar money from Miami. We got a good deal.
My other point is that we have some players that are going to be cheaper over the next few years, while some other high dollar contracts fall off.
Chipper, McLouth & KK expire in 2011, Lowe expires in 2012. Having Uggla signed into 2015 will not be a huge drag on our payroll, because we are entering a period of increased payroll flexibility.
Will something be done about our young arms? Sure, it is likely that JJ or Hanson is not extended as a Brave. So be it.
But today, we have guys expected to produce heavily in 2011 (Heyward, Freeman, Prado, Hanson, JJ) that are not expensive.
2015 is a long way away. We can afford to do this now, and still have flexibility as we move to 2012 and beyond.
Once Chipper (injuries), McLouth (disappearing act), and KK (failed experiment) come off the books a lot of doors open up for the Braves.
The fact that we pulled off the deal we did for Uggla was pretty amazing, considering what the Braves have had to do to acquire a bat ever since Gary Sheffiled left town.
Joshua
December 18th, 2010
12:27 pm
Let’s see…$12 million per year for a premiere power hitting 2nd baseman…Yea I think that is a no brainer there. Any team in MLB would sign Uggla for that with no questions asked.
BravesfaninNashville
December 18th, 2010
1:26 pm
MJ……. Totally agree on your points on Chipper. He has been loyal when he could have left for more money than the Braves have paid him. The Braves owe is to him to let him end his career on his terms. His will to play at a high level again could be a great thing for the Braves this summer. I think it helps him too to know that this team could be really good and that he doesn’t have to carry so much of the weight himself. The pitching is sound and the lineup should be pretty balanced . He could hit 2nd or 6th and really not have as much pressure on him as in the past. I’m with you in respecting who he is and what he has meant and will mean to the Braves long after he retires.
BravesfaninNashville
December 18th, 2010
1:34 pm
I like Chipper either as a #2 hitter and a table setter and see him go back to his approach of 2009 when he won his batting title. He turned a lot of good pitchers pitches into opposite field singles and took a lot of walks. He just used his natural hitting ability to put the ball in play and was on base a ton. That would make things great if Heyward, Uggla, and McCann where hitting behind him. They could also use him in the 6th spot with McLouth leading off followed by Prado, Heyward, Uggla, McCann and then Jones. This would leave him in a similar role where he could drive in some runners on base just by making good contact. In effect he would be extending rallies and not having to be the big cog in the rally like he was in the past. It would be the best thing for the team if he can come back healthy enough to play 130 plus games and be the singles, doubles hitter he was in 2009. He’d be a great table setter.
Bill
December 18th, 2010
3:31 pm
We/the fans have been knocking the Braves and Wren for not doing enough to make the Braves better. We need to give them credit for the move to get and sign long term Uggla. With a top line of starting pitching, the Braves need a right handed power hitter to help the offense and thats what they got. I would only question the 5 years, however, thats the way it is in today’s market. Hats off to Wren and the Braves for the move.
Chief pitchanono
December 18th, 2010
4:26 pm
Yes! Yes! Yes! If the braves are gonna compete we have to pay for it sometimes, and with the current stat of the Braves offense, this is a deal they need to get done. This helps for the present and the future. The Lowe and kawakami deals were bad deals, but made out of desperation, because we had no pitching to speak of at the time. We can’t go through this again on offense. Chippers last contract was a bad deal, but it was made to save face with fans and not to have aother ugly, smoltz, glavine situation. Chipper is not a apart of the Braves future, except that he will free up enough money to be able to replace him, while actually improveing the team. Lowe is being paid #1 starter money and is barely needed as fouth or fifth starter. The good news is that his contract is up soon and we have plenty of cheap replacements for him, so he too will free up a chunk of money that can be used to improve the offense. Kawakami and Mclouth (if he continues to stink) will also free up even more money. So the good thing is Wren should have plenty of money next off season to improve the offense and still have great pitching. Geting this deal done with Uggla before he is a free agent will be a good start.
Ross
December 18th, 2010
5:37 pm
Everything is relative. Who has a better chance of hitting 30 home runs, and driving in 100 runs in 2011, Uggla or Chipper? That one wouldn’t even be on the board in Vegas. So the answer is “yes”, he is worth at least what Chipper is going to make next year.
Mfree
December 18th, 2010
11:52 pm
If you don’t pay it, you won’t get him to stay. Simple as that. Doesn’t matter if the fans think he is worth it or not.
BravesfaninNashville
December 19th, 2010
3:44 pm
Hey just a thought……. we can sign Uggla for $60 Million for 5 years and Adrian Beltre is probably going to sign for $70 Million. The Braves could have had BOTH of them for $130 Million. The Nationals just signed Jason Werth for $132 Million. We could have had 50+ Homers 180+RBI and Gold Glove Defense at 3rd base. I know Chipper is not moving to 1b but if he would consider doing that it could help the Braves immensely. This move to me makes a lot more sense than any team paying Jason Werth the money he got. The Nationals WILL regret that contract.
Davis
December 19th, 2010
5:58 pm
I am tired of the Braves fans and SO CALLED beat writers that bitch about every move Wren makes. We have a top 3, 2B. If Wren traded for Jesus Christ himself, I think you guys would complain.
stew
December 19th, 2010
6:02 pm
Worth every penny of the sixty million. 30 hrs from one player we haven’t had in a long time and he’s right-handed. We had no chance in the off season against the Giants. We got no homers out of 3B/SS/2B/1B Lee had 3 hrs since joining Braves/RF J-Hey did nothing/CF three stooges/and LF. Catcher was the only position where that was a possibility. Now, if Chip’s healthy and Freddie pans out we have 1B/2B/3B/RF/ and C as possible home run hitters. Uggla gives us a legitimate 3-4-5 hole.
Netherland Brave
December 20th, 2010
3:40 am
I can’t even stand the thought of losing him to the free agent market next year. Please Braves, do what ever it takes.
bvillebaron
December 20th, 2010
12:11 pm
Yes, this is a no brainer. By the way, Uggla is not a “lousy” fielder but an average one unless all of you Infante fans feel that he is a lousy fielding too secondbaseman (Uggla fielding % is .980 and Infante’s as a secondbaseman is .981).
Old Sport
December 20th, 2010
12:42 pm
ALL our current power (if any) comes from the lefty group. You can not win like that…..therefore multiple years for the righty who can hit em’ out and drive em’ in!
jason
December 20th, 2010
12:46 pm
fielding percentage 2010 Uggla 976, Infante 960 and Prado 958 DOB what am I missing here?? Why are we so down on Uggla? He is the best hitter on our team(although I feel Heyward will be soon). 12 million a year is not that bad for a durable slugger
nique
December 20th, 2010
3:21 pm
I’m fine with the Bravos signing him for that much $$$. Look at what Werth is getting. If he hits 30hrs a year and drives in just under 100 RBIs (remember he was on the Marlins all these years), it’s worth it.
ABravesFan
December 20th, 2010
5:14 pm
It’s an okay deal if the 5 year include this coming year (so only 4 more year past this season). Once Uggla moves away from second base, his value drops quite a bit. Best case scenario is 3 or 4 of his prime and 1 okay year at the end there. Personally, I would have wait and see although there is some comfort for both him and us fan to know that he won’t be an one year rental.
RichieRich86
December 20th, 2010
9:09 pm
This is probably the worst article I’ve read. We stole Uggla from the Marlins for a super utlity player who isn’t an everyday player and was going to be coming off the bench again and a young left handed reliever who really didn’t have a role in our bullpen. Then we are going to get him for 5 years for 60mil. For what the Nats paid werth we are getting a major discount. Get a clue Bradley Uggla is the Man!!!
MitchC
December 20th, 2010
10:08 pm
Okay,. UKUGA, I’m sorry I misunderstood your point. I will say that now that I do understand what you are saying, I agree with you.
MitchC
December 20th, 2010
10:15 pm
Okay, I just scanned all the replies here very carefully, including Mr Bradley’s posts. I make this post knowing this question hasn’t been answered, so.. here it is.,
Mark is arguing that 60 mil is an exhorbant amount to pay Uggla for five years. Mark is saying Uggla’s defense isnt worth it, and apparently, his offense doesn’t make up for the defensive liability that Mark is arguing Uggla will be.
Mark, you fail to address one important point: If you think 60 mil is too much to pay Uggla for five years, then.., what move (s) would you make to shore up this offense? We know that Chipper is on the downside, and we need a power hitter to go with JHey and Mccann. Who, persay, can we get who would be a reliable source of power for our lineup? Or… if Mark is saying 12 mil a year is too much for a guy of Uggla’s “ability”, then what, persay, does Bradley think we should have done to shore up our team.
You’re Ftank Wren, Mark. Subtract Uggla from the equation of the Braves. What moves would you have made, if not Uggla for five years?
ChillyMutt
December 21st, 2010
1:58 pm
I feel you Mark B. I was at Game 3 of the NLDS when a poor fielding 2nd baseman tore my heart out.
My friends and I still reference Brooks Conrad when describing anything awful, tragic, …. or a bowel movement.
Mark Bradley
December 21st, 2010
2:11 pm
Game 3 of the NLDS was the worst thing I’ve seen, ChillyMutt, maybe ever.