With Texas in the Series, we reconsider the Teixeira trade
Two of the five most important players on a big-league team are the shortstop and the closer. The Texas Rangers, gracing the World Series for the first time in their existence, have young All-Stars at both spots. They came courtesy of the Atlanta Braves.
July 31, 2007: The Braves sent five prospects to Texas for first baseman Mark Teixeira and reliever Ron Mahay. They won that night — Teixeira hadn’t yet arrived — to draw within 3 1/2 games of the Mets in the National League East. They would get no closer, finishing in third place, five games behind the division-winning Phillies.
July 29, 2008: Knowing Teixeira, who would become a free agent at season’s end, wouldn’t re-up with them, the Braves traded him to the Angels for first baseman Casey Kotchman and minor-league pitcher Steve Marek. The Braves were in fourth place, 7 1/2 games out of first. Teixeira played 157 games as a Brave, hitting .295 with 134 RBIs and 37 homers. As a Brave, he spent one day — April 6, 2008 — in first place.
The first Teixeira trade has been characterized as the worst in Braves’ history, which it wasn’t — the Len Barker and J.D. Drew moves were worse — and has been credited with energizing the entire Rangers’ organization in a way one deal seldom does. And as Braves general manager Frank Wren settles back to watch the Fall Classic, does he think to himself: “Boy, we could’ve used Elvis Andrus [the All-Star shortstop] and Neftali Feliz [the All-Star closer]?”
Said Wren: “Whenever there are guys who were in your organization, you always wonder, ‘What if?’ But you have those same ‘what-if?’ thoughts before you make any trade.”
Wren did not consummate the first Teixeira trade. That was the last major transaction made by John Schuerholz, now the team president. But Wren was Schuerholz’s deputy in July 2007 — he would become GM in October of that year — and was, like most everyone around the Braves back then, in agreement that landing an All-Star first baseman who’d played at Georgia Tech was worth the cost.
Wren again: “We’ve just seen how precious getting into the postseason really is, and there’s always a thought that you’re willing to take a risk if there’s a chance of that happening.”
The first Teixeira trade did not bankrupt the Braves’ farm system. The organization has since turned out Tommy Hanson, who finished third in the 2009 rookie of the year voting, and Jason Heyward, who will probably win the 2010 award. And the two major prospects the Braves sent to Texas — Andrus and catcher Jarrod Saltalamacchia — played positions that seemed well stocked.
The Braves had Brian McCann catching ahead of Saltalamacchia, and they had a young shortstop named Yunel Escobar who’d just made his major-league debut. “Actually,” Wren said, “we had both [Edgar] Renteria and Escobar ahead of Andrus.”
Literally and figuratively, Saltalamacchia was the biggest name among Braves’ prospect, and more than three years later his career still hasn’t taken wing. He was the Opening Day catcher for Texas this April and drove in the winning run with a walk-off single; it was his final RBI as a Ranger. He got hurt, developed problems throwing the ball back to the pitcher, languished in the minors and was traded to Boston on (that day again) July 31.
Neftali Feliz after closing out the Yankees. (AP photo)
As for the other parts of the package: Matt Harrison, a left-handed pitcher, was a member of the Rangers’ starting rotation the past three seasons but was demoted to the bullpen this summer and wasn’t on the Texas roster for either the Division Series or the ALCS; Beau Jones, another lefthander, hasn’t risen above Class AA.
So essentially the deal can be boiled down to Andrus and Feliz for 157 games’ worth of Teixeira. The Braves liked Andrus but thought Escobar would be the greater run-producer. Given that the Braves tired of Escobar’s moods and traded him to Toronto for the 33-year-old Alex Gonzalez in July … yes, it would have been nice to have had a younger option still in the chain.
And if Feliz had been a Brave, Wren mightn’t have spent $6.75 million on Billy Wagner, and perhaps that money could have been better spent buying another outfielder. But Wren notes: “At the time of the trade, Feliz was in Danville [meaning rookie ball].” Meaning: There was no guarantee he’d be this good.
The Braves saw an opening in July 2007 and made a move. It didn’t work, and they moved on. And for what it’s worth, the 2010 Braves did finish with a better record than did the Rangers.
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244 comments Add your comment
gcs
October 27th, 2010
4:58 pm
I think Schuerholz was naively trying to recapture the magic they had with the Fred McGriff trade. Wren was just a yes-man back then. Do you think he is going to stand up and object with a promotion coming his way?
As for Tex, he had good stats but does anyone remember a single Braves game in which he had a big hit? He would hit a solo HR in a 8-1 game and then make the highlight reel. He NEVER came through for the Braves. I say good riddance.
I hope this is a wake-up call to Wren & company: NO MORE RENT-A-PLAYERS!
P.S. Re-sign Hinske!
.
Blue Fox
October 27th, 2010
4:59 pm
Braves should have placed Salty at first base instead of trading for an obvious “one year and done” Tex, would have solved both problems.
Jim
October 27th, 2010
5:08 pm
The trade SUCKED and never made any sense. Teixeira NEVER made a contribution to the Braves. He does not get BIG hits and wiffs in the clutch!!! Scheurholz is VERY overrated as a GM. Bobby Cox brought in the talent and he had Turner’s money and did VERY LITTLE with it
Born2Buzz
October 27th, 2010
5:08 pm
Oh god, do we have to revisit this thing. Worst…Trade….Ever.
Yes, worse than the Len Barker trade.
Rupert
October 27th, 2010
5:12 pm
never trade prospects. never ever ever. Right folks? geez.
David Granger
October 27th, 2010
5:12 pm
Don’t really know about the trade, Mark. But one thing I can’t help but remember:
You wrote a column right after we traded Jason Schmidt for Denny Neagle (didn’t Neagle beat us with a fine game the night before?)
The only reason the Reds were willing to get rid of Neagle was because…at the end of the season…they wouldn’t be able to pay him the fair market rate for a pitcher of his quality. And you wrote that, no matter how much we Braves fans liked getting him, it was terribly unfair and one of the biggest things wrong with baseball. And you were right. Now the shoe’s on the other foot, and we’re being run by a corporation that…though they try and field a competitive team…still keep a close watch on the bottom line.
It was fun being one of the few teams who could compete aggressively for top-line talent. But what goes around, etc.
Sloan
October 27th, 2010
5:17 pm
The NLDS was for rookie of the year. Buster Posey won it hands down over J-Hey.
Out From Left Field
October 27th, 2010
5:25 pm
I was listening to 680 this afternoon and they had a sports talk radio guy from Dallas on. He said he didn’t get the feeling that Cliff Lee wouldn’t base his decision on where he would play next year based on money. All I could think of was the Teixeira trade. Wasn’t that what we were all hoping then? He had gone to GT, liked Atlanta, liked playing for Bobby Cox, etc.? Made no difference, I bet the same is true for Lee.
I do agree that the Len Barker trade was probably the worse trade for the Braves.
Tomahawk
October 27th, 2010
5:32 pm
“So essentially the deal can be boiled down to Andrus and Feliz for 157 games’ worth of Teixeira.”
Ummmm there’s no way that’s accurate. All five prospects were trade bait, especially Salty at the time… and if i remember correctly Boston had a surplus of young pitching at the time and interest in Salty, so no the deal can’t be boiled down to just Andrus and Feliz, because there was also lost opportunity cost in regards to the rest of the prospects.
Mindriot
October 27th, 2010
5:41 pm
Nothing to reconsider. I hated the trade when it happened and I obviously hate it now. I hated the Yunel trade as well. But hey, I hope Wren enjoys watching Gonzalez hack away next year to the tune of a .280 OBP and not get to 20-30 balls that Yunel would have. At least he’ll tell some good jokes in the clubhouse.
Earl Williams, rookie of the year
October 27th, 2010
5:52 pm
Okay, enough already! Three years past and this year we started the climb back to division respectability. Fredi should only improve the club, if given the tools.
Forward! Move On! Get Over It! Let’s talk about spring!
Frumpy
October 27th, 2010
5:58 pm
Trades are always looked back at and disected. But at the time, we thought we were a good chance for the playoffs and needed another big bat. Texeria was the biggest bat out there and we landed him. Unfortunatly we didnt play that well and didnt make the playoffs. But the trade was the right idea.
As has been pointed out, Salty was always behind McCann, Andrus was behind both renteria and escobar. Feliz was a rookie ball pitcher.
If we didnt make the trade, people would have been complaining that we didnt try and get a big bat.
NEW CARS
October 27th, 2010
5:58 pm
I agree on the Jermaine Dye deal, but the other deal that always killed me was giving up Klesko and Bret Boone for a year of Reggie Sanders and quilvio veras. Klesko and Boone (although my understanding was that he wasn’t a great clubhouse guy) had 10 more good years and Sanders and Veras may have had one. I know Klesko wasn’t great in LF, but Big Cat left a couple of years after that and we have only had 1 first baseman better than Klesko in the last 10 years and he’s the one everyone complains about (TEX).
richham
October 27th, 2010
6:03 pm
Another case of the Braves allowing talent to sit wasted in the minor leagues. I mean it’s amazing that the Marlins can continue to be bottom dwellers in attendance and money spent, yet they always field a competitive team with the young talent they have.
It’s time the Braves used some of that talent to fill in some of the money gaps. Freeman could have played this year in the bigs, maybe a year early but so what. It would have saved them 2 million on Glaus as a patchwork first baseman and another 3 or 4 million having to trade for Lee. We definitely need a left fielder, but if your going to throw McClouth back out there, you should at least throw Shaefer back out there too and see if he can swim. That wrist injury really hurt him, but he did have some talent. It makes a whole lot more sense to go full tilt for a left fielder instead of continually adding patchwork old guys to stink it up.
At the very least you put money where it is desperately needed, let some of the young players play, and then you have a third option of buying a bat at the trade deadline. Wren made some nice moves last year, but he also made some stupid moves. The Braves don’t have the luxury anymore of missing on key pieces while paying them a ton of money. Let the kids play and earn their stripes for a change.
Paul in RDU
October 27th, 2010
6:24 pm
turkdawg -
A closer is not one of the 5 most important players on a baseball team??? Really??
The reason that the Yankees won all of those titles in the late 90’s and the Braves didn’t is that the Yankees had Mariano Riviera and the Braves had one closer after another.
Freddie G
October 27th, 2010
6:26 pm
Jermaine Dye for Keith Lockhart and Michael Tucker as well as David Justice and Marquis Grissom for Lofton and Embury were worse trades than this one, and was also made by JS.
I did not mind moving Salty and Andrus because of McCain and Escobar who were both young stars, but I hated the trade for Tex, because we were not going to resign him, and most of all the team we had in 2007 was not going to win anything even if they were selecting three Wildcard Teams.
The JD Drew trade was another terrible trade made by JS, I think his ego was bigger than the state of Georgia, and so he just wanted to be in the conversation and look smart. Sometimes it is good to keep what you have if the right trade is not there. An example of this is the trade by Wren this year, they fall in the same category, the team we had at the break was playing great and he destroyed what we had. I likened it to the trade of Dominique for Danny Manning while the Hawks were in 1st place, and it was never the same team afterwards, relinquishing the lead and bowing out in the first round of the playoffs, and Manning gone at the end of the season.
Dr. Phil
October 27th, 2010
6:29 pm
Wren may not be the worst GM in baseball history, but he is certainly among the worst. Glaus, McOut, and Ankeil exemplify Wren’s mentality.
Navigator
October 27th, 2010
6:53 pm
Pay attention now: Wren was the top assistance Schuerholz, and yes he was in the middle of all of the recent trades even before he took over. He even said he didn’t think the players were that good that was traded, so yes he admitted it was a mistake. Since he became GM the bad trades continue, especially Escobar (moods crap, he was tired of Cox).
champ
October 27th, 2010
6:53 pm
i dont care as long as i never see conrad playing infield in a braves uniform again,ever!
WeBurn
October 27th, 2010
6:54 pm
The point of the Dye trade was to strengthen the bench. Do you remember the 1996 World Series? At the time, it was considered that our bench had blown the series. I remember a camera shot of Terry Pendleton ( yup, THAT Terry Pendleton) trying to practice in the hallway and at a batting cage, and he ended up not getting a hit in the Series, iirc. Lockhart, at the time, was the best pinch-hitter in the game, and Tucker ended up starting a lot of games for us.
kirkinga
October 27th, 2010
7:44 pm
I agree with earlier comments that the David Justice and Marquis Grissom for Lofton and Embree, as well as the Jermaine Dye trade were worse than the JD Drew trade.
They also gave rise to the suspicion with a part of Braves Nation that the Braves organization didn’t care to deal with anything but docile minority players. Back then things like wearing caps backward and gangsta rap held much greater shock value than they do now. Justice was certainly appreciated more after he left than when he was here.
I think that we’re basically talking about a very few trades over nearly a 2 decade period is a good thing when weighed against the successes of the teams over that same period. Let’s face it, even the Len Barker trade doesn’t rise to the level of all time worse trades in baseball or sports.
reckingball
October 27th, 2010
7:48 pm
There are so many stupid comments on this blog.
JCH
October 27th, 2010
7:52 pm
MArk had 37 hrs his last season with Bravs… And What offense do we have now? NAda PAthetic, Anemic… MArk supplied more offense than we ever could have gotten from a Minor league Pitching Prospect
Howie
October 27th, 2010
8:07 pm
IF Braves would have kept Teixeira the trade would have been worth it but since they decided they could not “compete” for him, it was a bad move.
OldTimer
October 27th, 2010
8:10 pm
The Braves worse trade.
11-02-1974 Hank Aaron is traded by the Atlanta Braves to the Milwaukee Brewers for Minor League prospect Roger Alexander and Dave May.
Really?
Philco
October 27th, 2010
8:18 pm
This trade set the organization back 3 years. No one believed that 2007 team was just a Tex away from being a contender!! As unfortunate as it was to given away all that talent for a rent-a-player, then one year later to have given Tex away for a bag of balls!!!!! Had his talent eroded in a year?? Hell no!!! I would trade all of those continous Division Champ banners for a few legitmate World Series contenders. As much fun as it was to watch them win their division for 14 years in a row…think of how much more fun….and proud…it would have been to have won another 2 or 3 titles with better built teams, with the players we traded away….Justice, Wainwright, Elvis, Nefi. The trade for Fred McGriff added to a team we knew was contender, not to team we hoped could “get into” the playoffs.
ryan
October 27th, 2010
8:24 pm
My worst trades for the Braves David Justice and Marquis Gresham for for Kenny Lofton and the JD Drew and Wainwright trades.
johnr
October 27th, 2010
8:41 pm
Never ever trade for a Scott Boras player. You would have thought Schuerholz would have learned his lesson with JD Drew
JASon
October 27th, 2010
8:49 pm
Bobby’s passive, business-as-usual approach to managing is not very condusive to the development of young players. If Neftali and Elvis had come up through the braves organization, lets be honest, they probably wouldn’t have turned into anything.
papadawg
October 27th, 2010
9:04 pm
Why is anyone surprised, the Braves have always made stupid trades like this. I bet all teams just chomp at the bit when the Braves come calling
Dirty Jacket
October 27th, 2010
9:05 pm
These kinds of hind-sight analyses are absurd. When we made the trade, we had the up-and-coming Yunel Escobar, whom Edgar Renteria dubbed as having as much hitting talent as Albert Pujols. We had Mike Gonzo and Rafael Soriano, with Moylan to boot in the pen.
We went after Teixera at a crucial time; we needed a bat and first baseman. At the time, all thought it was the best trade, with knowledge that we just emptied the farm for it. It didn’t work out, no fault of Teixera’s. Had we made the playoffs and gone deep, this article wouldn’t exist. Well, knowing Bradley, it probably would.
You can call the JD Drew trade bad, 6 years later, only because you know how good Wainwright has been. He was NEVER projected to be a Cy Young quality ace by anyone. He was a solid pitching prospect. JD Drew lit it up in Atlanta, actually stayed healthy, and we got to the playoffs.
Typically those questioning trades 3-5 years after the fact don’t know much about the sport, this includes Bradley. Bradley I’m sure would admit that he is simply the “shock-jock” writer of the AJC and he really doesn’t know much about any sport, he just stirs the pot. Which is fine, but hopefully no one actually uses his “articles” as a guide of any sort.
5150 P.O.A.D
October 27th, 2010
9:07 pm
I have a great idea. Why don’t all the UGA and GT fans that like to post on the AJC.com meet at the Atalnta Community Food Bank the Friday after Thanksgiving to help sort food, help the poor, and talk crap the day before the game. It would let all of us meet and drop some of the Behind the Screen hatred.
Dirty Jacket
October 27th, 2010
9:12 pm
“Why is anyone surprised, the Braves have always made stupid trades like this. I bet all teams just chomp at the bit when the Braves come calling”
Are you being serious? Please tell me how Tim Hudson came to the Braves…crickets. Look it up.
Fred McGriff to the Braves….who was involved in the trade?
How about Mike Gonzalez?
Rafael Soriano?
Gary Sheffield came via trade, tell me who the Braves gave up that they regretted giving up?
Dirty Jacket
October 27th, 2010
9:16 pm
“Bobby’s passive, business-as-usual approach to managing is not very condusive to the development of young players. If Neftali and Elvis had come up through the braves organization, lets be honest, they probably wouldn’t have turned into anything.”
Good point; this was the problem the Braves faced with Brian McCann, Jeff Francoeur (solid 3 yrs), Jason Heyward, Jair Jurjenns, Peter Moylan, Adam LaRoche, Yunel Escobar, Andruw Jones, Chipper Jones, Ryan Klesko, Rafael Furcal, Martin Prado, Kelly Johnson…..etc……
JCH
October 27th, 2010
9:17 pm
Braves made how many playoffs since MArk was traded??? and Yankees Won lt years World Series…. Theres No Question Braves Gave up Gold in MArk and Got Zip in return.
hucker
October 27th, 2010
9:22 pm
McLough trade might be right up there — although not much given up.If the slider isn’t thrown to Sanchez in the ninth of game 3, Braves had excellent chance of winning that series. Phillies were in flux and Braves had real good chance against them. Escobar was the top prospect then ahead of Andrus — can’t yell about that. Feliz was in A ball and Santa (can’t thrown the ball back to pitcher) lamacha probably will be an adequate catcher at Red Sox AAA team.
kral
October 27th, 2010
9:29 pm
YOU KNOW WHAT, This is really sad for the Phillie’s and Yankee’s fans because if they were in the BCS system thet would be playing for a World Championship right now….
kral
October 27th, 2010
9:31 pm
yes I screwed up they
Brave 1
October 27th, 2010
9:31 pm
Short term thinking – just like the Drew trade. Was happy to see JS move up. He seemed to get lazy as the years went on. He was more of a senior management guy verses down in the trenches anyway. Don’t get me wrong; all should recognize that he came in and ‘fixed’ many things about the Braves; pitching, defense, worst field in baseball to one of the best, worst defense in baseball to one of the best. But like many in here; I thought his trades became ‘worst and worst’ as time went on.
kral
October 27th, 2010
9:33 pm
Got to get back to the WS and keep up with the Hawks…Both are great so far…
Legend of Len Barker
October 27th, 2010
9:43 pm
@Bradley: “The first Teixeira trade has been characterized as the worst in Braves’ history, which it wasn’t — the Len Barker and J.D. Drew moves were worse…”
You rang?
As of right now Gregor Blanco, et. al. for Ankiel and Farnsworth was bad, no matter how badly Blanco does in Kansas City. Farnsworth had very little in the tank and Ankiel was an abomination.
Vols1
October 27th, 2010
9:48 pm
There were so many bad trades by Schuerholz that it is hard to say which was worse. In addition to all of the terrible moves listed in the blog, don’t forget Jason Schmidt for Denny Neagle, Kevin Millwood for Johnny Estrada, and David Justice for Kenny Lofton. The farm system covered a lot of sins as did the three Hall of Fame pitchers who carried the Braves for a decade.
The Abs Man
October 27th, 2010
9:55 pm
Ted M
Gonzo stinks and he’s a non-hustle guy just like Escobar
Amen to Ted M.
I contend a HORRIBLE trade was chubby lil shortstop Alex Gonzalez for Yunel Escobar. And that disaster will haunt us all 2011…..
Yes, Yunnel acted too often like a punk.
BUT–Escobar has more range and defensive ability in the last drop he shakes off at night than our current lil chubby moodster.
During the Giants-Braves series, Tom Verducci made a point of saying that shortstop trade was 100% made by and for Bobby Cox.
And with groundball-pitchers as Lowe and Hudson, we now have an average defender at short. At best.
The Abs Man
October 27th, 2010
10:05 pm
The Yunel Escobar for Alex-G deal was last July, and will show even more in 2011 to be a fetid trade.
Escobar has more range and defensive ability in his pinkie than our current lil’ moody chubster.
Yes–Escobar was then an immature punk. No dispute, but I always opined he was salvageable.
A-Gonz pouts just as much and doesn’t hustle at all. and while he has more pop at the plate than Escobar, with groundball-pitchers like Lowe and Hudson heading rotation, we now have an average defender at ss,at best.
That trade, according to Tom Verducci, was made strictly by and for Bobby Cox.
extremus
October 27th, 2010
10:11 pm
While there is the “win some, lose some” aspect to any trade, I think the stakes have become too high for any team to take lightly. The Len Barker, J.D. Drew, and Texiera trades all will live in Braves infamy for obvious reasons, but any time you give up prospects at any level for a “proven” veteran who’s basically a short-term gun-for-hire, you’d better win the World Series that season or be prepared for heads to roll come the offseason, and let alone if those prospects end up becoming star players at the MLB level.
The same thing applies to free agents; by now the price of even a “mid-level” player is becoming prohibitive for many teams to afford. The lessons learned from Mike Hampton and Kenshin Kawakami, among others, should give the Braves pause concerning any future such “opportunities” with regard to how much they’re willing to invest. NOBODY should be paid for a job before it’s finished; baseball players of any caliber should not be exempt from that rule. MLB and every other pro league needs to pay based on production AFTER the season and do away with all of the ridiculous guaranteed contracts that are killing the sports (Stephen Strasburg, Jon Koncak, or Albert Haynesworth, anyone?).
tayoncolt
October 27th, 2010
10:16 pm
My biggest problem with the trade was the way Teixeira left. He played for Tech and all that so we hoped he would want to hang around a little longer to help the Braves back to the playoffs. I know, I know…wishfull thinking in these days of “big paydays” vs team loyalty. I think the future looks good for the Braves…as in trades, though, only time will tell.
woodie
October 27th, 2010
10:18 pm
A painfully painful deal that was wrought…now the aftermath.
nashvillewill
October 27th, 2010
10:21 pm
As a long-time (50 + year) Braves fan, I have a hard time recalling ANY trade where the Braves received value. Pendleton ? Smoltz? I think the majority of roster improvements made outside home-grown were free-agent signings. I’m particularly opposed to trades of young talent for aging stars or one year rent-a-players. At all costs, the Braves hold Infante, Prado, Venters, Kimbrel, Heyward, Hinske, Hudson, Lowe, Hanson, McCann. There’s your nucleus for the next 5 years. Build around these guys and the Braves will be contenders for a long time. Buy a CF or RF and move Heyward to CF. Install Infante in LF.
Trade or let go: Gonzales, Lee, Glaus, Conrad, Diaz, Melky, McClouth, Ankiel, Dunn, any other pitcher that they can get value for other than the nucleus guys. Surely letting go some of these salaries will produce enough to purchase a CF & SS. Build around the rest from within the organization. With a new manager, I am optimistic the Braves can contend next year. Unless they let go some of the nucleus guys.
Go Braves!
Gwinnett Fred
October 27th, 2010
10:21 pm
He3ll, I’m just glad Bradley is blogging baseball and not the Hawks – when Bradley keeps his ass away, they play much better.
Currently up 20 in the 4th!!!!!!!
Gwinnett Fred
October 27th, 2010
10:35 pm
nashvillewill:
Let me jog your memory, your’s seems to failing you:
McGriff-1993 for basically NOTHING
Grissom-1995 for 3 bums that didn’t last 2 years thereafter
Sheffield-2002 for Brian Jordan
Hudson-2004 for 3 minor leaguers that never amounted to anything
Jurrjens-2007 for Renteria
So there’s 5 for you, and since you want to mention being a 50 year Braves fan, I’ll test your memory even further. Remember who we gave up for AL MVP Jeff Burroughs in 1976?? Try 5 mediocre at best players that never amounted to anything, including Adrian Devine, Dave May (who is the anwer to the trivia question “Who did we get for Hank Aaron in 1974) and Carl Morton.
So no, we don’t make a blockbuster lopsided deal every year – no team does – but don’t show your ignorance by saying in the last 50 years we’ve not made ANY trade for value.