Fredi Gonzalez, the only real choice? Not so fast (UPDATE)
UPDATE: The Braves have scheduled “a major announcement” for 2:15 p.m. today after Bobby Cox’s already scheduled valedictory at Turner Field. Sounds like Fredi will be introduced today, as opposed to tomorrow.
The last time the Braves held managerial news conferences on consecutive days — one to bid farewell, the next to say hello — it didn’t work out so well. They fired Joe Torre in the press lounge of the old stadium in October 1984, and the next day we were back to greet …
Eddie Haas.
Who lasted 121 games.
Yes, there’s a huge difference this time. Fredi Gonzalez has been a big-league manager; Haas never had. (And, after being canned by the Braves, never would again.) But the Braves back then were so certain Haas, who’d been their Class AAA manager, would be the man to improve on what Torre had started that I developed a kneejerk response to kneejerk promotions. I’m leery of Perfect Choice successions because they so rarely turn out to be.
Everyone in baseball was so convinced the Braves would anoint Gonzalez as Cox’s successor that it had to be either the worst-kept secret or the best-constructed ruse in the history of the world. Turns out it wasn’t the latter. And clearly the Braves have their reasons: He did meritorious work here before leaving to manage the Florida Marlins, who might just be unmanageable. That said …
He never quite lifted the Marlins to the playoffs — got them over .500 in both 2008 and 2009, though — and this year’s team was thought to be (at least by owner Jeffrey Loria) of playoff caliber. And that’s why Gonzalez was fired after 70 games. And before you say, “Well, Loria wouldn’t know a baseball from the back end of a buffalo … ” let’s consider that Loria did hoist the World Series trophy in 2003 after changing managers in midseason.
But my quibbling about Gonzalez has less to do with his Florida days than with his background: The Braves are essentially hiring from within, and after having the same manager from June 22, 1990 to Oct. 11, 2010, this was their chance to look outside and tap someone who wasn’t immersed in The Braves’ Way Of Doing Things. Other clubs are much heavier into statistical analysis. (Terry Pendleton, the hitting coach, was actually surprised earlier this season when I mentioned that his club led the league in on-base percentage.)
The Braves’ Way worked largely because players loved playing for Bobby Cox. I’m not sure they’ll love playing for Gonzalez quite so much. That’s not a knock on the new man. It’s simply to say that there is — or was; got to get used to using the past tense — only one No. 6.
Please understand: Fredi Gonzalez is not Eddie Haas, who was overmatched from Day 1. Fredi Gonzalez is a solid hire made for logical reasons — the Braves know him and like his way of doing business. But I was hoping for someone who wasn’t a Cox acolyte. I was hoping for someone like Jose Oquendo, who’s the third-base coach in St. Louis and who has apprenticed under Tony La Russa. And, apart from their love of stray animals, Cox and La Russa have as much in common as chalk and cheese.
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396 comments Add your comment
jimmya
October 13th, 2010
2:00 pm
think there should be a balance of talent braves have NO OFFENCE
jimmya
October 13th, 2010
2:01 pm
wren spent it all on lowe and k k
jimmya
October 13th, 2010
2:03 pm
with that said look at all the arms we have in the minors and no hitting better look at out scouts is what im saying
jimmya
October 13th, 2010
2:04 pm
yes i know about freeman and haywood
Born2Buzz
October 13th, 2010
2:04 pm
Fredi’s success will be determined by the players he can put on the field. The pitching staff will be strong again, even without Wagner. But unless the fielding and hitting are improved the Braves will be out of the playoffs again. The team basically has 3 solid position players (McCann, Heyward and Prado) and then bubkis.
jimmya
October 13th, 2010
2:06 pm
right on BUZZZZZZZZ
Scott
October 13th, 2010
2:09 pm
Fredi bring Uggla over here to play LF and bat clean-up.
Omar CF
Prado 2
Heyward RF
Uggla LF
McCann C
Chipper 3
Freeman 1
Gozalez SS
Pitcher
Keith
October 13th, 2010
2:09 pm
Official now. Freddi, the Braves manager.
Keith
October 13th, 2010
2:10 pm
Mispelled…..Fredi.
JASon
October 13th, 2010
2:14 pm
Mark, your article takes a major turn in the final paragraph- an interesting turn. I, for one, would have loved to read an article about why a “Cox Acolyte” would not have been appropriate for this team. Its hard to hide where you are going in that final paragraph, if you weren’t trying so hard to hide your true opinion in the first place.
jimmya
October 13th, 2010
2:18 pm
mark doing great job giving us a topic keep it up
Naboo the Enigma
October 13th, 2010
2:20 pm
Is Gonzo still an Atlanta Brave? That dude along with Mclouth, Ankiel, Melky, AND Terry Pendleton all need pink slips ASAP
Klesko Fan
October 13th, 2010
2:23 pm
Well Mark since you brought up his name …. what about a “insider/outsider” hire (or rehire?) of one Joe Torre? Only way to replace a Legend is with another Legend! And Joe has Braves-stink all over his career!
jimmya
October 13th, 2010
2:24 pm
joe dont want to work with wren
jimmya
October 13th, 2010
2:25 pm
i dont blame him either
Daniel
October 13th, 2010
2:25 pm
Frank just said we are getting a new hitting coach!!!!!! YES!!!!!
Najeh Davenpoop
October 13th, 2010
2:26 pm
Not sure I agree with the idea that the Braves should just go in a different direction for the sake of doing so, but it’s interesting to see a local columnist argue that the Braves should depart from the tried and true Bobby Cox way.
Robert
October 13th, 2010
2:27 pm
Maybe Gonzalez will sit the SS Gonzalez who failed to run out the ground ball and made multiple errors in Game 5. We know Bobby Cox wouldn’t do it.
Mechabradzilla
October 13th, 2010
2:27 pm
1.2 Freddy’s Coming For You…3, 4 Better Gets some Bats, 5, 6…..Pendleton’s a hack, 7, 8 Better increase those stats!, 9, 10–CONRAD’S BACK AGAIN!!!!!
A Nightmare At Turner Field 9: The Error Man
Innocent Bystander
October 13th, 2010
2:29 pm
New hitting coach!
Chris Chambliss
October 13th, 2010
2:29 pm
Hubbard got screwed. TP now 1b coach.Braves looking for a hitting coach.
lee R.
October 13th, 2010
2:30 pm
Be forever grateful that we don’t “turn to” sportswriters to make decisions like this one. We have more inforned (and unbiased) persons to turn to.
Freddie G
October 13th, 2010
2:31 pm
During Bobby’s press conference which just concluded, someone asked Bobby about the press conference when Lou Pinella stepped down in Chacago, with all the press that was present, and whether he thought he could have worked in that Environment. His response was that he thought he could because he gets along well with the media. He went on to state that the media here is very kind to him and to any Football Coach etc.
He also say that in some of those Cities you lose a few games and they are ready to run you out of town if you allow them. It confirms what several folks on these blogs have been saying for years that the Media here was too easy on Coaches, they always go after the players, but were reluctant to ask tough questions of the Manager of the Braves and the Fottball Coaches. I guess everyone wants to secure their invitations to the Golf Tournaments and other events.
MoeHoward
October 13th, 2010
2:33 pm
Terry is NOT pissed off that he was passed over for the Braves Managerial spot. Terry could care less about trying to win a popularity contest. I’ll go on record and make this claim: Anybody who hires TERRY PENDLETON will get a manager who is going to win a world series. Terry is one of the hardest hitting instructors in the majors. The Braves ability to make the post-season is a direct result of the hard work put in by TP. Pendleton should have been announced as the new manager of the Braves. He wasnt because there is still discrimination in every walk of life including major league baseball. I dont care if Terry ever gets another job. Terry helped bring the Braves back from the dead when they went WORST to FIRST. Terry was leading the way back then in ‘1991. He still is today because he leads by example. Terry is a true professional and will never get the credit that he deserves for making the Braves into a winner once again. TP you are a valuable commodity to the Braves and an integral part of their ballclub.
James
October 13th, 2010
2:40 pm
I agree Mark Jose Oquendo would have been a great hire but Fredi is a solid hire I’m sure he’ll do a good job.
Braves Country
October 13th, 2010
2:41 pm
Terry Pendleton has a job with the Braves…..he doesn’t need another job!
Arkie
October 13th, 2010
2:41 pm
I agree with CC. Our Braves were the most fundamentally flawed team in baseball. Above average pitching, below average in – speed, defense, offense and all the things that win ball games – moving runners over, bunting, hitting to the opposite field, etc. Good luck FG, you will need more than that.
Brave New World
October 13th, 2010
2:43 pm
Fredi was the absolute right choice and will be a great Braves manager.
Braves #17 Fan
October 13th, 2010
2:44 pm
Congrats Fredi… From Crash and his dad from the old ECB days.
Moe Don't Know
October 13th, 2010
2:45 pm
Thank you! Hopefully this means TP is moving OUT of my neighborhood!
CD
October 13th, 2010
2:46 pm
Your right – we don’t need a Cox Acolyte. After all, Bobby could not be that good. He only kept the job for 25 years. Never got promoted.
Personally, I would prefer a Bobby Cox Clone.
Texas Frenchy
October 13th, 2010
2:47 pm
The right choice with Fredi, he can relate to the many latin players that no comprende like lazy azz Alex G., make Chipper the batting coach & use that money to get Carl Crawford, he wants out of TB & has power & speed, put Prado @ 3rd & Omar @ 2nd & leave them there, then all we need is to find a REAL CF! I gotta go get ready for Yankees series!!!
Bobby Valentine
October 13th, 2010
2:49 pm
I am tan, and rested, and available.
m
October 13th, 2010
2:49 pm
Thank god and greyhound that bobby cox isn’t here!
reckingball
October 13th, 2010
2:51 pm
Has any of these people trashing Alec Gonzalez actually played baseball, at any level of the game.
thickfreakness
October 13th, 2010
2:55 pm
so when do we acquire Uggla to play 3rd base?
KaliDogg
October 13th, 2010
2:56 pm
Couple of things for people to argue about (after all, it’s sports, right — part of the fun):
A. Bobby’s players loved playing for him. True. One aspect of that mutual love affair was Bobby’s unwillingness to make a change, whether in the course of a game, of the course of a season. Or, to push his players beyond their on-paper abilities (called, variously, coaching up or motivating or any number of descriptions for the ability to rise to another level) — the critical lacking element in the Braves overall sterling record (a little known fact, which might have changed later, but at one time, both Greg Maddux and Tom Glavine had at-or-under .500 records in playoff games — and this was in the midst of the Braves’ decade-plus run through the division). Whether it’s sticking with pitchers, or — in the most recent case — infielders, almost in a purposeful defiance of logic (the Bobby Knows Best syndrome), or in other areas, it’s a facet of the Bobby era, another side to the “players love him” aspect of his reign, that goes overlooked. Great managers with great lineups win championships. Some even do it without great players. Bobby’s been in both positions and not only have his great players played poorly at crucial times, his other players have seldom, if ever, raised their games when the crunch came (playoffs — where it counts).
(b) The Braves hitting and run production will not change, no matter who the hitting “instructor” (a misnomer in their case, IMO) might be, until the Atlanta Braves learn the strike zone. [Brian McCann and Mr. Infante are not included here -- in fact, maybe Brian should be the team's catcher/hitting instructor.]
myra
October 13th, 2010
2:56 pm
Wow. Snit stays. Tp moves out to field..
Hubbard kicked out.
chino bye bye.
Se habla espanol?
Dave in Buford
October 13th, 2010
2:56 pm
reckingball: No … and most of them have trouble spelling it.
Freddie G
October 13th, 2010
2:58 pm
Freddi and Frank should try and hire some scounts from the Marlins, they always seems to be having top prospects throughout their system or have traded for players who have made significant contributions to their success.
The Braves have some young talent at the Major League and Minor League Level, but one must admire the Job done by the Marlins in constantly gutting their team, winning two Championships, and competing every year.
BravesAllTheWay
October 13th, 2010
3:03 pm
Mark,
With so many players having options for 2011 or free agent status, at what point will we probably start hearing about if they are staying or being released/traded? Will that happen in the winter or do you expect some/all of them to come to spring training first?
myra
October 13th, 2010
3:03 pm
the Marlins/Braves are the AAA minor leagues of all of baseball.
Marlins:Hitters&some pitching
Braves: Holy Grail of young arms.
Good Grief
October 13th, 2010
3:04 pm
By all means is this a good find for the Braves – possibly the most well kept secret in the game of baseball. I’ve had a lot of fans from different teams (Mets & Cubs) say that they wished they had gotten Fredi. That said, Mark…. I understand the idea of trying to debate from a different perspective. However, if all you have to bring to the table is “chalk and cheese” my advice would be not to waste time writing a half-hearted article.
Doesn’t sound like you really did any research. It doesn’t sound like you have a true list of who you thought some other coach candidates could have been that you would have liked to see get the job. No numbers or any reason given whatsoever for you believing Jose Oquendo would have been as better candidate than Coach Gonzalez – other than “chalk and cheese” and that he was under another great coach.
Chipper's ACL
October 13th, 2010
3:07 pm
The Braves style goes beyond Cox, it’s an organizational style that has been developed over numerous years. It has been successful for numerous years and players enjoy it. It’s standing up for the players and treating them as men. Mutual respect. Respect for the game. That’s what Fredi will continue to bring to the Braves. Yes there needs to be some tweeking done to the roster and understanding the changes in the game. Small ball being one example. Cox lived and preached old school baseball. 3 run homer. Use a relief pitcher til his arm falls off. Little emotion in the dug out. Fredi’s from a different era. He understands the game. Regardless of his record in Fla he made a group of young and castoff players winners. He had to use players that weren’t ready for the big leagues. Never had a dominate closer. He still made his teams competitive. It’s funny how most of the bloggers, and even this article, calls for change but everyone wants the same coaching staff kept in place. Everyone wants Roger to remain the pitching coach. What has he really done for the pitchers? Hanson should have dominated this year. He was fair. Can’t hold a runner on. As I stated in an earlier blog for some reason will not work off of the fastball. The kid throws 96 mph. Come on! Little leaguers know you work off of the fastball. A pitching coach works on locations. In and out. Up or down. Not a curve on the first pitch. The team era was sound because of the talent on the team, not McDowell. Sorry but my choice is St. Claire. Dave Collins at first. Fredi needs to create his own style of play, not be forced to keep Bobby’s group. Clean slate. The team will remain in the Braves type of box, it will just be a different shade.
Braves Fan Stuck in Beantown
October 13th, 2010
3:12 pm
My prediction…Chipper will play one more year. Braves will makes the WS. Win or lose, Chip retires and becomes hitting coach. In about 5 years, Chipper will be named Atlanta’s skipper and will last as long as Cox. At that point I will be in my 50s and it will be my son’s concern regarding the future of the Braves.
Freddie G
October 13th, 2010
3:13 pm
I believe Fredi will be a good Manager and the Braves will have great success under his leadership. I am also glad TP has been moved from hitting coach, god knows he got plenty of blame from some idiots on this blog, some of the same folks who blamed Clarence, Merv, and would have blamed Don also if he was here for more than a year.
I am very sorry to see Glen hubbard go, and Chino Managed the only playoff game the Braves won recently but is now out of a job.
I am sorry Fredi was not here a year earlier, if so we would still have Escobar at Shortstop, I just believe he can relate to the young latin player better than his predecessor.
Conditioned Air
October 13th, 2010
3:16 pm
I think TP was the best choice. I used to work for him and did Work on his AC Repair. He always was the a nice Guy. http://www.conditionedairsystems.com/
Multiple Meigs
October 13th, 2010
3:16 pm
whos a hiIting coach? can we get Rudy whatzhizname? Cubs cleaning out house too. how bout Jeters daddy? Hamiltons?
StingerSplash
October 13th, 2010
3:16 pm
Still say Braves should have made a run at Terry Francona. He knows how to put up and deal with distractions, injuries, the media (and I will posit that the media scrutiny and attention is far less on a day to day basis in Atlanta than it is in Boston … which is why maybe Atlanta should have inquired about Francona, to see if he wouldn’t mind life out of the pressure cooker for a while).
Let’s face it — all those great years under Cox, there was one Achilles heel, and it was usually the bullpen. Like Joe Torre, Cox developed a sense for who could and could not trust in key spots and then called on those trust guys time and time again, sometimes to diminishing returns. And leaves with maybe his best bullpen ever and no lineup.
Mr. Turnip-Green Jeans
October 13th, 2010
3:17 pm
Wasn’t Eddie Haas bout ready for the nuthouse when he was fired?