Tamper with this: LeBron might well win a title as a Hawk
Picture him in a white shirt. (AJC photo by Jason Getz)
Since Michael Gearon Jr. has spent $25,000 to raise the issue, we’d be derelict in our duties if we didn’t follow up for free. Let’s say the Hawks do pursue LeBron James. (I know — Atlanta is never mentioned as an LBJ landing zone. But let’s pretend.) Would he find a team here that could win him that slippery NBA title?
Shockingly enough, he just might.
Ric Bucher of ESPN the Magazine offered the best insight on why LeBron and the Cavs haven’t won it all. Wrote Bucher:
The team has been constructed on the presumption that he is Michael Jordan, a scorer and finisher, rather than Magic Johnson, a playmaker who needed a go-to closer alongside him to win titles. “They tried to make him Michael,” says one league executive. “He’s not.”
Remember when LeBron was playing high school ball for St. Vincent-St. Mary? The belief then was that he would be an NBA point guard, not the league’s leading scorer. He wound up being the league’s leading scorer for two reasons: First, because he’s so good he can do as he pleases, and second, because few of his teammates can make a play on their own.
LeBron averaged 29.7 points in 2009-2010. The next-best Cavs — Mo Williams and Antawn Jamison, and the latter was there only 25 games — averaged 15.8 points. Shaquille O’Neal averaged 12 (but played only 53 games). Nobody else was in double figures.
Let’s do this: If you take LeBron away from the Cavs and Joe Johnson from the Hawks, which team would be better? The Hawks, I submit, by about 15 victories over an 82-game schedule. The Hawks would still have finishers in the prime of their careers — Jamal Crawford, Josh Smith, Al Horford. Heck, Even Marvin Williams is a career double-figure scorer.
Now let’s try this: Take Joe away and plug LeBron into the Hawks’ starting five. (And if the Hawks are to have any chance of landing James, they’d have to let Johnson leave. They can’t afford both. They’re not far enough under the salary cap.) Here’d be your lineup:
PG, Mike Bibby or Jeff Teague; SG, Jamal Crawford; SF, LBJ; PF, Josh Smith; C, Al Horford. Bench: Marvin Williams, Zaza Pachulia, et cetera. Or you could keep Crawford as your sixth man, let LeBron play the 2-guard and let Marvin remain the small forward. Either way, that’s at worst — at worst — a 60-win team.
I’m not sure LeBron can expect to sign with many clubs and win 60 games in Year 1. The Bulls? They’ve got Derrick Rose and Joakim Noah, but they might have to shed Luol Deng and Kirk Hinrich in a sign-and-trade for James. And there’s no guarantee James and Rose, both of whom need the ball all the time, can co-exist, and Noah is more a rebounder/defender who scores occasionally than a polished big man on the order of his former Gator comrade. (Noah averaged 10.7 points last season.)
The Knicks? They’re starting over. The Nets? Just lost 70 games. The Clippers? Get real. The Heat? The King isn’t going to share a throne with D-Wade. Even if LeBron returns to Cleveland, he’ll surely find a new team — one without Shaq, who it’s believed drove a wedge between LeBron and coach Mike Brown, since canned, and also without Zydrunas Ilgauskas and Delonte West.
Maybe you laughed when you heard the Hawks — the Hawks, of all teams — had been fined for tampering with the biggest free agent ever. But maybe you shouldn’t have. I’m not saying LeBron is going to sign here — it’d be the longest of long shots if he did. What I am saying is that he should take a look. He might like what he sees.
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176 comments Add your comment
Rufus1
May 28th, 2010
2:21 pm
HawkBibby..I don’t understand
We have 47mil guarenteed for next years..If we buyot Bibby 5.5mil and Jamal 10.8mil=16.3mil..reducing our cap to about 31mil. That is about 26mil under the cap…What am I missing?
Mr. Phil
May 28th, 2010
2:40 pm
I think some of you are missing the point Bradley was making.
1)He is saying that fining Gearon for his comments is ridiculous because the Hawks aren’t seriously in the running for Lebron.
2)If Lebron is really interested in winning a championship, then he should consider the Hawks and take less money. Therby, the fact we can’t afford to offer a max deal to Mr. James wouldn’t matter.
I swear, sarcasm truly does not translate into written word.
Mr. Phil
May 28th, 2010
2:42 pm
Rufus1
You are missing Cap holds. When you buyout players, their salary against the cap is replaced with a cap hold for the salary of a comparable(based on years of service) player.
Mr. Phil
May 28th, 2010
2:46 pm
@Rufus1
Basically, in the scenario you just described the final result (including cap holds for the released players, cap holds for draft picks, and cap holds for Randolph Morriss, Childress, and the like) I believe would be a cap figure of about 12 to 14 mil available (if I am calculating JJ’s cap figure which is the counted as the Max amount he can sign for). This will still leave of us far short of what it would take to get LeBron. More moves would have to be made.
BrittishAnger
May 28th, 2010
2:47 pm
I would only support the idea because the Atlanta Hawks would have a better season attendance record than any other sports team in the city, relative to season length of course….and in all honesty this team needs support from the fans to really go forward the way they could and should….if OKC can put forward a decent crowd to watch a basketball team, we should be able to as well….
MyView
May 28th, 2010
2:51 pm
People always talk about New York like its the greatest place on earth, but I very rarely hear people leave Atl and move to NY. But we all know Atl is flooded with NY transplants. So that “Atl is not NY or Chi” remark does not make much sense. Even if you talk about the teams recent success, Chi has won nothing w/o Jordan, and NY has not won a title in my lifetime.
LeBron would make Atl better than NY and Chi combined on the court. We all know its a better place to live. NO CONTEST….
niremetal
May 28th, 2010
2:59 pm
OMFG, talk to Cunningham or someone who knows ANYTHING about cap rules before you make a post as retarded as this one, Bradley.
athdog
May 28th, 2010
3:08 pm
Why would the Hawks value keeping Joe over making an honest run at LBJ? LeBron might be the one player in the league who could make good enough to overcome a starting five including Marvin. Replace marvin with LeBron and add Jamal, now that’s intriguing.
Daniel
May 28th, 2010
3:16 pm
Nire- I don’t know which is more disturbing? Mark’s lack of cap rule knowledge or the fact that you actually wrote OMFG. Are you getting soft up in Philly? or are you trying out for the next season of The Hills?
ryan
May 28th, 2010
3:23 pm
I have to agree with Mark like LeBron would win in New York or Chi town the ATL is an hip hop town with Usher and T.I. and Luda James has had party’s here and Hawks have made it to the 2nd round the Cavs have not Bulls have not. The Hawks could land Avery Johnson could be a big splash and if we trade Josh Smith for Amare Stoudamire that could lure James.
Rufus1
May 28th, 2010
3:57 pm
Mr. Phil…Thank You..The NBA is Complex.
Would we have 12-14mil after we sign JJ in that scenario or before?
Couldn’t we renounce the rights to Childress and Morris?
I would like to know this info, so I am the the “blog guy” putting forth ridiculous trade proposals.
honest_abe
May 28th, 2010
4:10 pm
daniel: too funny
no way in hell lebron comes to atl. period. fun to think about but never going to happen.
everybody’s got all these great ideas on how to get new players. i’m just sitting here trying to figure out how to get new owners!
MitchC
May 28th, 2010
4:20 pm
Mark, I see your point, but I dont think it will happen.
It would just seem to me that Lebron would want to go to a more.. marquee place. If it can’t be NY because the Knicks are terrible, or LA because they have more cap room, or Miami because Wade and him couldnt share the stage, then my bet is he remains in Cleveland.
I also dont know if Hawk ownership would take the gamble not offer JJ a contract, if we weren’t sure we could or would sign Lebron. If you take JJ away from the Hawks, and fail to sign Lebron, then this team takes a step backwards.
My bet: Lebron doesn’t come here, and the Hawks may end up overpaying to keep JJ, in an attempt to remain “Title competetive”, whatever that means.
MitchC
May 28th, 2010
4:21 pm
My last post should have said no cap room for LA not more, sorry.
NUNNA YO BIZNEZZ
May 28th, 2010
5:25 pm
1st off..
if king james did sign with ATL,jsmoove,is a heck of a finisher and could not leave,period!!
most of u know my feelings towards smoove,i like him but he is immature..if he got a player like lebron to come aboard he would change everything,including his lifestyle(im only kidding on dat part),but he along with marvin,horford,and crawdaddy!! whoa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
and forget bibby,teague would have to be the back up to james,PERIOD!!!!
bibbs is a nice player who’s time is not slipped away,but it has slipped away if u team him up with this current hawks roster and how they would have to play with a lebron james..
Draft a defensive minded shot blocking center who can do some low post scoring and get the junk points and double digit rebounds and build a bench that still includes joe smith,and bring back flip murray to play the 2 behind crawford and we’d be set..but its the bench and it has to include the return of OTHELLO HUNTER!! AND THE DRAFTING OF JAMES DILLARD AND DUKE CREWS!!
WE’D BE IN THERE!!!1
BravesAreDone
May 28th, 2010
5:36 pm
We can always dream…but this is Atlanta, so it won’t happen.
dex
May 28th, 2010
6:12 pm
so if the UCONN men’s basketball program is placed on probation and stripped of their national title, guess who would be national champs of 04? G E O R G I A T E C H hahaha, guess all you dogpoops who were adamant with your comments in Barnhart’s blog about USC being stripped of their’s and Auburn should be national champs. Well how bout that?
niremetal
May 28th, 2010
6:15 pm
Daniel,
Sorry – what I wanted to say would have been moderated out and probably offend anyone who misunderstands the 4th commandment.
bj rufino
May 28th, 2010
6:42 pm
come on Lebron join the party here in Atlanta.
newkid
May 28th, 2010
6:47 pm
Could easily happen if LBJ could be convinced that his best chance for the O’Brien rests with playing alongside Horford, JJ, and someone like B.Haywood. A Smoove/Marvin for LBJ sign-and-trade would likely make more sense for Cleveland than anything else likely to be available (if LBJ is determined to leave Ohio). Signing Haywood to play the 5 with a back end loaded contract (i.e., beginning with the mid-level) would likely be much to his liking if he knew he’d play on a front line with Al and LBJ. You have Childress who’d likely jump at the chance to join Crawford, Joe Smith, Bibby, and Zaza on the 2nd unit if he knew he had JJ, LBJ, Horford, and Haywood all in the 1st unit. Add Outlaw, pick #24, and someone else at vet’s minimum, and all this could likely be done for $76M – $78M. Yes this is above next year’s projected LC, but not outlandish compared to the top 8 salaried sides this past season.
Balance, depth, and June men’s pro basketball in Atlanta.
Ted Striker
May 28th, 2010
6:49 pm
I like the discussion (and how you led in with the $25K fine), however no way would LBJ come to a team with a reputation of having a dysfunctional ownership group.
p.s. Wonder what your/my fines would be if you/me were owners? I like Cuban and I like Gearon Jr.’s comments.
Mr. Logic
May 28th, 2010
6:51 pm
Bradley is on to something BIG…really BIG. It does make since in a lot of ways for Lebron to sign with the Hawks. For some reason you guys still don’t get it, how many times do people have to say it, CLEVELAND HAS NO RIGHTS TO LEBRON NOW. They can only hope that when he leaves (which he will) he doesn’t leave them with nothing – which he won’t because he is from Cleveland. He could never go back home knowing he abandoned the hometown franchise and left them with nothing. A sigh/trade is the best way for all parties involved, because after all, Lebron could get all his cash and still go to a decent team. LEBRON is in control of this trade, not the Cavs. (Joe Johnson has a little input, but he will be convinced with the max contract dollars)
After looking at all the franchises using the criteria of;
1) Who will Cleveland fill lucky to receive and can use to help keep the team afloat, until another miracle happens,
2) Do you have a max salaried player(s) we can exchange, and
3) Is there anything left for Lebron to work with when he gets there so that he won’t have to go to weak team. (which I think is a priority for him)
Looking at that list of teams, there is the HAWKS and only one other. DAMN, DOUBLE DAMN.
The Orlando Magic. (..they go on vacation after tonight)
The Magic is the only other team that can offer Lebron and the Cavs what they want.
A package deal of V.Carter/R.Lewis for instance. DAMN
The Cavs will get two better players than the Hawks can reasonably offer like J.Johnson/M.Williams, without damaging the core product, AND… most importantly for Lebron, the Magic will still be good enough to win a championship, maybe two, or three. DAMN
Almost got Lebron.
Blast
May 28th, 2010
7:24 pm
Oh… So nice to dream, ATL….
TIWAS
May 28th, 2010
7:28 pm
Mark,
Enjoyed the comments and insight.
If this haven’t been mentioned, I haven’t read all the comments, but I heard a commentator on ESPN Radio this afternoon talking about the taxes in New York. There is a luxury tax in New York state that is is 39% for the wealthiest residents, and its been but into a bill by one of their state representatives to raise it another 11%. It seems many New York baseball players are moving their residences to Florida because there is no state tax. This he says is going play a part in LeBron’s decision not to go to the Knicks.
With your insight Atlanta would seem a good possiblilty to consider.
Good Luck to the Hawks with the coach search and draft.
PD
May 28th, 2010
8:52 pm
Good stuff Mark
jlewis
May 28th, 2010
9:01 pm
LOL, ok Bradley, with Lebron the Hawks win 68-69 games with a 2 guard that cant guard anyone, a low b-ball IQ power forward, a soft small forward, no bench, and still no center? This is spoken like a blogger and someone that knows nothing about basketball.
MannyT
May 28th, 2010
9:38 pm
So many holes in the Bradley-Gearon-James plan that I won’t even start to go into them.
Given that disclaimer, sure I’ll play reality used to be a friend of mine aka LeBron wants to come here.
You can keep Joe & LeBron b/c you only get LBJ through sign & trade (not enough direct cap space even if Joe is publicly teleported to an alien planet on live TV.)
You have Bird rights for Joe. He’d stay to play with LBJ.
ASG will make more money on next local TV & radio contracts.
Gearon et al would pay luxury tax b/c LBJ sells tickets.
Signing LBJ probably even gets you enough investor interest to buy out Belkin and put the cheap owner thing to rest.
The most visible down sides would be the poor guys that get sent away in the sign & trade. They would have to be the guys after LBJ in Cleveland…and none would be as good for the fan base.
WWSD (What will Sund do?)
Mr. Logic
May 28th, 2010
10:41 pm
How do you get a comment on here
Mr. Logic
May 28th, 2010
10:44 pm
Bradley is on to something BIG…really BIG. It does make since in a lot of ways for Lebron to sign with the Hawks. For some reason you guys still don’t get it, how many times do people have to say it, CLEVELAND HAS NO RIGHTS TO LEBRON NOW. They can only hope that when he leaves (which he will) he doesn’t leave them with nothing – which he won’t because he is from Cleveland. He could never go back home knowing he abandoned the hometown franchise and left them with nothing. A sigh/trade is the best way for all parties involved, because after all, Lebron could get all his cash and still go to a decent team. LEBRON is in control of this trade, not the Cavs. (Joe Johnson has a little input, but he will be convinced with the max contract dollars)
Sleepy
May 28th, 2010
10:45 pm
Stop toying with my emotions Mark Bradley .
Sleepy
May 28th, 2010
10:54 pm
To be honest we lost this battle last summer as this shouldve been ownerships thinking all along .
Last summer we shouldve Overpaid Zaza,Marvin,and BIbby for one year to keep the current team even if we had to go over the LT by a couple of million to do .
Right now we would be in position to release the rights of all 3 and JJ and actually make a true to life pitch for james with over 20+ million in cap room even with no lebron we still could chase wade and the rest as well.
There was absolutely no creativity in the upper management the past 12 months . You wouldve thought that someone would be saying lets go after it all.
Mr. Logic
May 28th, 2010
11:00 pm
After looking at all the franchises using the criteria of;
1) Who will Cleveland fill lucky to receive and can use to help keep the team afloat, until another miracle happens,
2) Do you have a max salaried player(s) we can exchange, and
3) Is there anything left for Lebron to work with when he gets there so that he won’t have to go to weak team. (which I think is a priority for him)
Looking at that list of teams, there is the HAWKS and only one other. Guess WHO?
Mr. Logic
May 28th, 2010
11:17 pm
Guessed yet?
The Orlando Magic. (..they go on vacation after tonight)
Mr. Logic
May 28th, 2010
11:19 pm
The Orlando Magic
The Magic is the only other team that can offer Lebron and the Cavs what they want.
A package deal of V.Carter/R.Lewis for instance.
The Cavs will get two better players than the Hawks can reasonably offer like J.Johnson/M.Williams, without damaging the core product,
AND… most importantly for Lebron,
The Magic will still be good enough to win a championship, maybe two, or three.
We Almost got Lebron.
Wilbo
May 28th, 2010
11:46 pm
LeBron would be a complete fool to throw his career and his talent away with the Hawks and you’re about the same for suggesting it.
Amsterdam Sam
May 29th, 2010
3:01 am
Hey Nick – thank goodness Atlanta isn’t New York or Chicago. In Atlanta people are civil and feel no need to knock other cities to make them feel good about themselves or where we are from. People are people (good and bad) no matter where they come from in America, for the culture is pretty much homogenous and even a moderate IQ should reveal this to you. If you still haven’t realized this, go back to where you came from, crawl in your hole and think about it.
Whopper Dawg
May 29th, 2010
3:28 am
When I read the title of the column, I passed a couple of times. But now, I think you have some good points, Mark. Couple LB with a new coach, and we could do some damage.
Atlanta is an attractive spot for living, just not the rep for supporting teams, but with a winner that changes.
gmoney
May 29th, 2010
8:05 am
Why not Atlanta? Only New York is a better city for him. Hell we hosted an Olympic Games for god’s sake.
Edward M
May 29th, 2010
9:41 am
It’s nothing wrong with wishful thinking.
Born2Buzz
May 29th, 2010
11:47 am
HawkKB, it would have to be a sign and trade. The only way to do it. I’m not sure why Cleveland would ever agree to any such thing but, LowCountryBD actually had a reasonable sign and trade suggestion.
tyger
May 29th, 2010
12:16 pm
MARCO LOCO!
GT
May 29th, 2010
12:25 pm
James brings an energy to his game that this team could use. The chemistry would be outstanding and if these guys ever think about a place to live in the future where better?
WTF
May 29th, 2010
1:20 pm
Nick I agree with you..This is ATL and not New York or Chicago. This isn’t even Los angeles or Philadelphia. I’m wondering why would he want to come here. If he chooses to come souththen his best bet would be Miami
Common Sense
May 29th, 2010
1:25 pm
gmoney you are way off. yea we hosted the Olympic games which was the worst one in history and also the only one where the president of the committee didn’t carry the torch..besides the games here was scattered with some events held as far away as Birmingham. I think New york, Chicago, Dallas, Miami, and a few others cities are better cities for him..You just said New York was the only better city..are you serious..LMAO
Eyes Open
May 29th, 2010
1:32 pm
@ MyView
You must not know many people. I know several people who have left Atlanta for New York and I hope to do it some day. New York is filled with people from everywhere. Chicago is the same. I actually been there and know for a fact that there are several people from ATL that lives there. The article is about LBJ and consideringthe hawks. At least the Bulls and New York have had success before but the Hawks haven’t. We need to get a better team and hope that they can win. The support here for the hawks are not good at all. So why you say people don’t go there you are waaay off. NY has so many people and the majority that leaves end up in Florida. If they people are leaving to come here all the time then who moves there..somebody does..And yes in my opinion New York and Chicago are better cities and more exciting. They also are more diverse.
NikkiFree
May 29th, 2010
1:46 pm
Of course, it’s a huge longshot. Still, I know, if LBJ did come here you might as well start selling tix to the finals. The Hawks have far more pieces to put around LBJ than any other team out there. I know Gearon was fined for his comments. Knew he would be. Still ,I was happy to hear that the Hawks would get him if LBJ wanted to come here. Why not? LBJ even has quite a few relatives who live here. Not to mention, It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to know that Phillips Arena would be sold out every game. We all know how this city loves superstars. WHO WOULD NEED “INVESTORS” ANYMORE?
NikkiFree
May 29th, 2010
1:54 pm
Can I just say I don’t want to see JJ in a Hawks uni again regardless of what LBJ does?!
NikkiFree
May 29th, 2010
2:01 pm
@ Eyes Open:
Well, when you FINALLY leave the ATL, can you please take these transplanted New Yorkers with you? I’m tired of hearing how great their city is yet they LEFT NY to live here. It makes no sense at all.
Paul
May 29th, 2010
2:10 pm
1- To those who keep saying things like, “oh he’ll never come here, ” why even post that? Why not try to spread some media that may get him to think about us? Just because we’ve had a poor history means that we shouldn’t explore the possibility? You see, this is how good teams are good. They aren’t too afraid to explore these possibilities. I know the reality and likelihood of the situation but to sit around and just expect above mediocrity without having the effort and guts to go out there and put our name out (as Gearon did) would invite more mediocrity. I’m glad Gearon said what he did. To me it’s a hope that it’s an indirect communication to Lebron to think about us. We can’t sit around moping about whoa is us, we need to embrace the possibilities, our owners need to be brave when it comes to stars. Basically in a nut shell, just because the chances of lebron coming to our city is low, doesn’t mean we don’t get out there and try and not live in a failed mentality.
2- If we can do a sign and trade of any kind, then why are people on here saying it’s impossible to get Lebron here. Why would Gearon say he’d go over the luxury tax to get Lebron if it is absolutely physically impossible to get Lebron here financially? The truth is, financially we CAN get Lebron. Sure we’d go over the luxury tax, but hell i’m not paying it and Gearon just said he’d go over it, so you can mark that out a reason why we can’t. So that leaves doing a sign and trade. From there you just do the numbers.
3- You can’t look at Cleveland on a possible sign and trade situation and say “oh they’ll never do that.” Last time I checked they aren’t inthe driver’s seat. They essentially have three options (if Lebron doesn’t re-sign there) – a) lose Lebron and get NO compensation b) trade with us or c) tradewith someone else. Sooo if we give them better trade pieces than other teams (even if the percieved basketball value is not that of Lebron), seems to me they got no other options.
Stop being so negative people. The possibilities are out there, even if slim. But just because they are slim doesn’t mean we shouldn’t talk about it, get the word out, try to get some media play about it so it gets to Lebron’s ear, or criticize Gearon about usingit to manipulate fans.
Also lets not forget about Wade. A sign and trade with him would be nice also. As it would be with Chris Bosh (forget that list business, that stuff goes away when it comes to free agency time). But in either case we’d have to figure out a way to keep JJ.
ryan
May 29th, 2010
2:20 pm
IF Lebron goes to New York or Chicago the media will be 10 times as bad as it is now so you have to ask your self would be better to be in the dirty south or face the bad press like Skip from ESPN.