5 questions about the Braves, a couple involving Soriano
Maybe it's just me, but I think they're going to miss this guy. (AJC photo by Bob Andres)
1. Why pay the same money to an older reliever who hasn’t had a save since undergoing Tommy John surgery in 2008? Billy Wagner is 38 and will make $7 million next season. Rafael Soriano will turn 30 this week and, after agreeing to re-up for a a year after being dealt to Tampa Bay, will earn $7 million in 2009. Soriano had 27 saves last season; Wagner had none. I don’t get this one at all.
2. Why offer arbitration to Soriano, whom they had no intention of keeping, and not offer it to Adam LaRoche, whom they need? I know there are issues of draft-pick compensation and, as ever, money — the Braves don’t want to pay LaRoche what his market value stands to be — but I don’t get this, either. The Braves want LaRoche to stick around for less money and bridge the gap to Freddie Freeman, whom they hope will be ready in 2011. But what if Ol’ Rochy gets a better (read: longer) deal someplace else? Who’s the first baseman then — Martin Prado? And who plays second base if Prado scoots over? (Not Kelly Johnson. He just got non-tendered.)
3. Why the utter desperation to trade Derek Lowe? No, he didn’t have the greatest of seasons, but he did win 15 games. Does one lesser season invalidate everything the Braves believed about Lowe 11 months ago? I understand the Braves need a big bat in the worst way, but is Lowe the only trade lever the Braves have? And doesn’t the appearance of being keen to unload a big-salaried guy serve to diminish the big-salaried guy’s value even more?
4. Doesn’t dumping Ryan Church prove Frank Wren messed up the Jeff Francoeur trade? That transaction wasn’t so much a swap as a divestiture. The Braves needed to cut the cord with Francoeur, who’d become an outsize presence — he didn’t produce much but was the most-discussed man on the roster. Imagine if Matt Diaz had replaced Francoeur as the starter in right field: That would have been the hot-button topic for weeks. When Diaz supplanted Church in right field, nobody said two words. The Braves didn’t really need a player in return; they just needed Francoeur to go somewhere else.
5. Does Wren have the worst instincts in the history of humankind? You know how it’s said that, when in doubt on a multiple-choice test, your first guess is apt to be correct? The Braves’ general manager gives lie to that. Last offseason he tried like crazy to land Jake Peavy, who won only nine games and worked 101 2/3 innings in 2009; tried to sign Rafael Furcal, who hit .269, and tried to sign Ken Griffey Jr., who hit .214. Well, the Braves were better off with Javier Vazquez, Yunel Escobar and Garret Anderson than any of the above. A year from now, we might well be saying, “You know, they should’ve just kept the closer they had.”
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238 comments Add your comment
Jason
December 14th, 2009
11:00 am
Frank Wren is a joke, and the Braves become more of a joke every year. Honestly, I NEVER understand the moves the Braves make. Billy Wagner over Soriano??? Huh??? The only reason that free agent players ever consider playing in Atlanta is Bobby Cox, after this year, there will be NO reason for free agents to come to Atlanta. They have become a poorly run organization!
Biff Pocoroba
December 14th, 2009
11:00 am
If LaRoche takes off, TWO big bats will be needed to make this team competitive. I don’t see TWO big bats out there. Frank Wren is a real genius !
Bobby Cox
December 14th, 2009
11:06 am
Greg Norton can play firstbase. Norty is a real gamer. We can plug Prado in right; and bring Kelly back to play second. I like this lineup. Duh.
Don
December 14th, 2009
11:21 am
Speaking of questions about the Braves. How many times have you seen Bobby Cox do/fail to do things that violate even the most simple fundamentals of WINNING, things that no manager would do at any level of baseball. HOW many times HAVE YOU SEED BOBBY COX:
(1) Keep a player in the regular line up on and on and on after it is obvious to any knowledgable fan that he cannot produce.
(2) Keep a player at a set spot in the top part of the batting order when he is in a terrrible prolonged slump.
(3) Fail to move players up and down in the batting order based on who is hot and who is not.
(4) Keep on using a relief pitcher over and over and over when it is obvious that he is not going to be effective.
(5) Keep on using a Pinch Hitter over and over and over when it obvious that he is not going to produce.
(6) Keep a player on the bench when it is obvious that he is far, far better than on of the regulars who he likes and is playing.
(7) Fail to have his hitters work the count and put pressure on a Pitcher at a turning point in the game when it is obvious that the pitcher is out of sinc/ lost his release point etc.
(8) Allow hitters to swing at the next pitch when a pitcher is wild, walking/ hitting men – and get the pither out of trouble instead of putting more pressure on him.
(9) Fail to make the opposing starting pitcher throw a lot of pitches when the team has a weak bullpen.
(10) Overwork his bullpen to the point that it becomes ineffective.
(11) Make no adjustments in his lineup and in his batting order based on the past success or lack of success that hitters have had against a given pitcher.
(12) Make no effort whatsoever to teach, emphasize, demand that his hitters be patient, get good pitches to hit, work the count.
(13) Put no pressure on the opposing pitcher when he is in trouble or at possible key turning points in the game.
Mark Bradley
December 14th, 2009
11:23 am
You know, I think Norty is more a practicer than a gamer. But I’m often wrong.
Brian
December 14th, 2009
11:27 am
Jason, considering that Wagner is superior to Soriano in every single statistical category, I don’t understand why anyone would want Soriano over Wagner. Wagner strikes out more batters, gives up fewer hits and few home runs, has a lower ERA and a lower WHIP, and has about 350 more saves than Soriano. Soriano has walked slightly fewer batters in his career (2.8 per 9, compared to Wagner’s 3.0), but that’s it. And Soriano has a higher salary with TB, and would have had an even higher one with Atlanta.
What is your reason to preferring Soriano?
Braves73
December 14th, 2009
11:36 am
Mark, it’s hard to argue with Wren’s decisions considering the work he did last off season. He was widely critized for almost every move he made, but at the end of the day he did make the ball club better.
In regards to the bullpen decisions that have been made, I am split on the signings/releases. You have to keep in mind the Braves traditionally don’t spend big $$$ on relievers/closers. I realize they are paying the same if not more for a one year/two year rental, but they must feel they have upgraded for the short term.
Let’s give Wren the benefit of the doubt and see how this off season plays out.
Jesus
December 14th, 2009
11:37 am
I think exactly like Kenneth so I am just going to post his again:
Kenneth
December 14th, 2009
7:10 am
1. Hindsight is 20/20 Mark. The Braves and everybody else thought Soriano would not agree to arbitration. (still was the right move to offer)
2. You are right about keeping Laroche (can’t believe I agree with MB for once)
3. Which pitcher are they supposed to trade? Lowe makes the most sense because of his high salary.
4. You didn’t offer any alternative to what Wren did in trading for Church. What was he supposed to do? Francouer needed to go and it wasn’t like there was much of a market or they wouldn’t have traded him to someone in their division.
5. That’s a little harsh isn’t it. Could anyone predict that Peavy was going to have that kind of year? ‘
It wasn’t who made some bad trades that have come back to haunt this team. Those 5 players for eixera and the one with St. Louis: Wainwright for J.D. Drew…………………
(MB cheer up, we have a great team that was in contention until the last week of the season last year and that is going to be a contender again, stop seen the glass half empty)
Brian
December 14th, 2009
11:41 am
Don, how many managers besides Cox have you seen that have done the following?
1. Win over 2400 games? You’ve probably seen LaRussa, probably not old enough to know Mack or McGraw.
2. Be at least 450 games over .500 in their career? Again, probably not old enough to know McGraw or McCarthy.
3. Win 14 consecutive division titles? Pretty sure you haven’t seen anyone else there.
4. Make 15 postseason appearances? Torre’s the only other.
5. Win five pennants? There’s only four in your lifetime, or maybe only three if you’re actually 15 years old, which sometimes I do suspect.
6. Win a World Series? Less than 10 percent of the managers in MLB history have done so.
7. Maintain an average finish of 2.4? Only 9 managers with over 1000 games have done better.
8. Have players repeatedly say something like: “I can’t pass up the opportunity to play for him” or “It’s an honor to play for him”. Ever heard that one about Dusty Baker or Charlie Manuel or Gardenhire?
Sporty Black
December 14th, 2009
11:42 am
Mark you have some valid points, I think most of the opposition to your article is due to commenting with the heart and not the mind.
1. Should of kept Soriano. 10 yrs younger, very good reliever (not perfect), and WANTED to be a Brave. Even Rivera was not perfect in saves. Braves need more runs per game, period.
2. Keep LaRoche. Very good LEFT-HANDED POWER hitter. Very good defensive player. Good locker room guy. There is still reservation on the comments he made about fans a few years back; LaRoche only spoke the truth.
3. Lowe is a solid # 3-4 pitcher at this stage in his career. Note: the Braves supported him with runs, it wasn’t that Lowe was dominant. I’d rather keep Kawakami who is just as good but cheaper and go get a BIG bat.
4. Yes, wrong move. Church was known to be absolutely worthless. Francour was billed to be the savior of the Braves and still had trade value. Should of traded for a decent draft pick or minor league player.
5. Don’t know about the “worst instincts.” Wren’s job is also to generate ticket sales and merchandise revenue. Griffy would of done just that. The Braves have not had a true lead-off hitter since……Furcal. Hindsight is 20/20, but I can’t fault Wren on trying for those two.
Terry
December 14th, 2009
11:44 am
Some of the remarks on here make no sense.
We had to offer Soriano arbitration with the hope he would reject it and we would at least get a first round pick out of it. The fact that he accepted wasn’t a major setback. We were able to trade him for Chavez who has a good mid 90’s fastball, slider and changeup. Has 1 year of MLB experience, which means we have him for a couple of years before he even hits arbitration, and we don’t have to wait 3 or 4 years for him to be ready to play.
Let him sit behind Saito & Wagner and learn and he might have the stuff to be a TRUE closer.
So far as Franceour, we traded him for a box of rocks, and didn’t need the rocks anymore. The fact that Franceour should have been batting 9th and was somehow always in the 5-7 hole falls on Bobby’s shoulders. Church was never going to be the long term replacement.
Why are you even asking which starter should be traded ? The answer is Derek Lowe without question. Vazquez was better, cheaper, and would like to stay here. As soon as we find a taker for Lowe I’m sure we will look to re sign Vazquez and we have a stellar starting 5 for several years.
Vazquez, Jurrjens, Hudson, Hanson, Kawakami …. I like our chances most nights.
Dropping Lowes salary gives us more money to pick up a bat, even if all we get for Lowe is a prospect.
People are on here bashing Wren over moves that for the most part have been the right moves given the constraints placed on him. If you want to complain about how much money we have to spend blame Liberty Media, if you want to complain about Bobby Cox you can blame Cox and Terry McGuirk.
Let’s see what Wren does when Bobby finally does retire. If he even has a say in who we hire.
I think he did a GREAT job in rebuilding our pitching staff last year, now lets see what he does to bring in some offense without gutting the minors like Shuerholtz did.
Joshhh...
December 14th, 2009
11:48 am
Wow thanks for just piling on questions Mark…
You did no good by writing this article, all you did was stir up the emotions of already tender fans…
Did you really want to keep Soriano? A guy who definitely didn’t play with everything he had in every situation last year & who asked to be traded?
You think he’d play like a winner if he asked to be traded?
Frenchy is gone so get over it, my goodness Francoeur couldn’t do anything in the past 3 seasons there was no reason to keep him. Some times someone needs to make the hard decisions.
Oh and by the way you never know what Furcal, Peavy, or Griffey would’ve done in Atlanta. Have you not heard of “change of scenery?”
The only things that I couple possibly agree with you on this is keeping Derek Lowe (although we need a money bat) and keeping LaRoche.
But for the most part, I think you let your emotions get the best of you when you wrote this one…
Don
December 14th, 2009
11:53 am
Point is, his great Pitching staff that was so far, far superior to the other teams overcame his management procedures and lack thereof and enabled him to win over the long 162 game schedule. Even this pitching that was one of the best staffs in baseball history did not enable his management to win in the short series against the best teams. As you pointed out, he won ONE WS – and that was in only 14 opportunities (and even that required Glavine to pitch a shutout). This is the true measure of his management skills. (And please, don’t say that the Post Season is a flip of a coin – Even if this were true, a coin flip does not come up in your favor once in 14 times). He is a player who basically lets the players do what they want (as long as they keep their nose clean) and gives them little instruction or demands – thus having a team that has a good team spirit – and enabled him to win with a pitching staff that overcame his management procedures.
Mark Bradley
December 14th, 2009
11:53 am
I agree — and I’ve written many times — that Wren did great work rebuilding the rotation. And I give him great credit for his Plan B’s. I’m just wondering why his Plan A’s don’t seem to work very well.
Don
December 14th, 2009
12:02 pm
Yes, everyone knows that Bobby Cox is under contract for 2010 and that it is not going to change. But the point is – that it COULD be very simple to change this – pay him off and release him – and nothing (no trade for players, no signing of players) would help the team nearly as much as this. Frank Wren has the worst job in baseball – the RESPONSIBILITY to build a winner – without the AUTHORITY to fire Bobby Cox. I realize that to talk about this is to beat a dead horse. But it is so useless to talk about possible trades and possible signings when this is the most significant problem — to worry about repairing small holes in the sales when there is a huge hole in the bottom of the boat.
Brian
December 14th, 2009
12:03 pm
We’ll never know for sure, obviously, but I am almost certain there would have never been the great pitching staff you’re referring to without Bobby Cox. Glavine, Justice, and Gant were developed under his watch, he traded for Smoltz, drafted Chipper Jones. You think Maddux would have ever been a Brave if Cox hadn’t dragged the Braves from worst to first in 1991 and 1992? Do you really think Cox being there did not have a positive effect on their performance that made them one of the best pitching staffs in history?
Ultimately the players win and lose the games. Managers manage personalities always, and sometimes games as well. But if you’re looking for a manager that has done more than Bobby Cox, then I think you’re going to be waiting a while.
Jim H.
December 14th, 2009
12:06 pm
Mark, you could just read DOBs columns and get the answers to your questions, but anyway….
1.) Wagner is a much more established closer and has been much more consistent throughout his career. 38 isnt that old for a closer, especially one who stays fit, which I believe Wagner does. TJ surgery is routine these days, and he already proved he could still pitch. There were I believe also some questions about Soriano’s work ethic that came into play.
2.) LaRoche has always been a poor early season hitter (usually doesnt get it together until after the all star break) and the Braves didn’t think he is worth the money he would get in arbitration……a full seasons pay for a half season of good production.
3.) Its all about getting his Lowe’s salary off the payroll. Its not about his abilities. They need that money for other uses. We ain’t the Yankees. If we were I’m sure they would keep him.
4.) Can’t say I disagree with you about that one. They dumped Frenchy for not much in return. I still look for him to cool off with the Mets though.
5.) He rebuilt the Braves pitching staff from very medicre to very good in one offseason (with a limited payroll). He’ll work on the offense this off season. He has retained our top prospects. I think he’s doing a good job.
3.
Braves Fan Since "80
December 14th, 2009
12:12 pm
I just watched baseball since my playing days ended in high school so I try not to play manager and general manager….I think most people just sit back and spout off about the impossible….. like trade Kelly Johson and Greeg Norton a big hitting first baseman….but you have hit the point on this……… Why would not have Wren said we will have the best 7, 8, and 9th innings and after June we can trade a stopper to fill needs….he acted desparate…. How will you get a fair shake looking to dump a pitcher and cash….Laroche, Kelly Johnson, Francouer and Soriano will have great years and Wagner and Saito will be mediocre. We will get a washed up outfielder/first baseman.
Chipper , no help….We are putting together a team that could have won last year….the phillies are getting better… the braves are hoping……
John Tucker
December 14th, 2009
12:18 pm
One last thing, bradley.
Laroche is notorious for not hitting his weight in April, May and June and coming on strong the last half, whichb he did again last year.
Braves need consistent offense. No more streaky hitters who feast on weak pitching or are streaky. Let’s get an every day hitter like Nady or Adrian Gonzalez to play first for the Braves.
Fischerking04
December 14th, 2009
12:18 pm
Hmm, this entire piece is completely negative.
Brian
December 14th, 2009
12:21 pm
Let’s face it…the Phillies are going to be the favorites to win the NL East no matter who the Braves pick up this offseason. Doesn’t mean it’s a guarantee, but let’s also see how we look compared to Colorado and San Francisco, both of whom narrowly outlasted the Braves for the wild card last year. So far neither of them has shown any marked improvement. In the Rockies’ case, they’re losing a 15-game winner from last year in Marquis. The Giants seem to be in on a lot of names, but still haven’t improved their anemic offense.
Ricky Ricardo
December 14th, 2009
12:23 pm
Mark, you got some ’splainin’ to do!!
Ed
December 14th, 2009
12:27 pm
DO NOT TRADE VAZQUEZ, OUR BEST PITCHER.
larocheisabeast
December 14th, 2009
12:33 pm
has anyone else noticed that every single article mark bradley writes is always hindsight, without exception? he never fails to point out the negative aspect of every possible situation involving the braves management of their franchise, AFTER it has already happened. congratulations mark, on monday morning, arm-chair quarterbacking. you are the best.
MSC OFF
December 14th, 2009
12:34 pm
Mark – I agree with everything but trading LOWE. I think it’s a good idead to shed the payroll and cut their losses. I don’t understand why they didn’t offer Soriano a multi year deal and lock him up. Having a quality closer has been there demise since A. Pena! I have no confidence that they are going to get one BIG Bat, when truth is they need 2 at the very least. Discouraging is the word and another year missing the playoffs is on its way!
Mekons
December 14th, 2009
12:34 pm
A year from now, we might well be saying, “You know, they should’ve just kept the closer they had.”
Except there was no way we could retain either Soriano or Gonzo. Both were asking for a long-term, high-dollar contract. The only reason Soriano accepted arbitration was that we already had Wagner and therefore weren’t going to negotiate with him. When we offered arbitration, we gave him a guaranteed year and he is free now to seek an extension with Tampa Bay or get free agency again next year.
There was no way he was going to close for us this year. If we hadn’t signed Wagner, we would have been left with nothing. I don’t know about you, but the idea of a Medlen/Moylan combo as closer gave me the cold sweats.
Wagner may not have had saves last year, primarily because he was pitching the 8th in Boston, but he looked as good as ever. He might have even picked up a couple of MPH.
As for Lowe, I don’t know what to do with him. It’s not that I want him traded, but there’s simply one too many starters lurking around. We will probably have to accept a mediocre prospect or two and eat some of his salary. But consider that last year, we were looking at a rotation of JJ and nothing else. There was no guarantee that Hanson was going to pan out (although without the signings, he would have started the season in Atlanta), Hudson was out for most of the year, Smoltz was injured and as it turned out, barely adequate as a starter, etc.
Wren was brilliant in picking up Javy, KK, and Lowe. The only problem was that our offense was horrid during the first half. Once we subtracted Frenchy and got playing time for Prado, and swapped out Kotchman for LaRoche, everything improved dramatically.
As for LaRoche, he wants several years and a lot of money. And probably a no-trade clause. Obviously, we have Freeman coming along, and we can find a decent bat to stick at 1B for a year. We’ll lose defense, but I don’t think we want to invest $25 million or more for Adam’s defense and second half. If we could get him for a year, I’d love to see him back, but I don’t think that’s possible.
Datominator
December 14th, 2009
12:37 pm
O sure, with the benefit of hindsight you can say how lucky we were we didn’t land some of those guys he tried to get – Griffey, Furcal, et al. But these same yokels talking about how terrible Wren was for trying to get these guys were the same ones screaming last year about how terrible he was for NOT getting these guys. There have been Wren haters from day one, and nothing he does will change that – if the Braves win the World Series this year they’ll be talking about how they did so DESPITE Wren – the guy can’t win.
Reid Adair
December 14th, 2009
12:40 pm
I fail to understand what is being accomplished by signing Billy Wagner and Takashi Saito to replace Rafael Soriano and Mike Gonzalez – unless it’s strictly a money situation.
I am not convinced that these two new additions are an improvement over the individuals they are replacing.
Then again, this is Frank Wren that we are talking about.
ed simmons
December 14th, 2009
12:44 pm
Should have kept Jeff and got a new hitting coach.
Vol_In_Ohio
December 14th, 2009
12:53 pm
I guess if we had kept Soriano and not signed Wagner we would be be two draft picks ahead of where we are now. Both will perform well at the start – it will be all about the injuries and how the Pirates/Rays reliever does I guess.
I wonder if Furcal would have done a lot better if he had played in Atlanta vs. LA. That might have been part of Wren’s thinking. I can’t explain going after Griffey – he would have been subpar anywhere. I’m pretty sure we’d all like to have Peavy on the 2010 roster.
Art Vandalay
December 14th, 2009
12:57 pm
Potential line up
McClouth-CF
Martin Prado-2B
Chipper Jones-3B
Brian McCann-C
Adam LaRoche/Xavier Nady/Someone else-1B
Yunel Escobar-SS
Mike Cameron/Jason Heyward-RF
Matt Diaz-LF
No matter how you want to analyze that ALL the potential answers at the question positions are better than what they started with last year. PLUS the new players will at best be the 5th and 7th hitters 1-4 is set in stone and Matt Diaz and Yunel Escobar will be somewhere between 6-8, Xavier Nady, Nick Swisher, Mike Cameron, Jason Heyward who ever the RF may be will have to be a 7th hitter most likely any one of those is more than serviceable in that spot.
Gary
December 14th, 2009
12:58 pm
Reid Adair its simple: Mike Gonzalez is going to get a 3-4 year deal on the open market for much more than the 2.5-3 million he made last year and oh yeah his agent is Boras so he could possibly net more. Rafael Soriano in his three seasons in Atlanta had one good year. The rest of the time he was ineffective or injured. Billy Wagner is one of the greatest closers of the last 12-15 years. He had a surgery that is now considered routine and returned back from that procedure with stuff that looks better than before he left. Saito is a very good setup man who did wonders when he was with the Dodgers. In Boston he either didn’t fit in with the team or not a fan of the AL, but his numbers were still solid. The Braves gave Wagner and Saito $10 million compared to the nearly (if not more) $20 million that Gonzalez and Soriano would have fetched this season. They are basically keeping the back end of the bullpen production at or slightly above last season’s duo.
For all the talk about Gonzo and Soriano, many forget that both were inconsistent throughout the year. Gonzo was either lights out or making the game a little interesting towards the end. Soriano was very good in the beginning, but got badly streaky come August. I don’t think the Braves are going to regret these moves one bit.
Art Vandalay
December 14th, 2009
1:00 pm
look at how far they have come from
Yunel Escobar
Kelly Johnson
Chipper Jones
Brian McCann
Garrett Anderson
Jeff Francoeur
Jordan Schaffer
Casey Kotchman
Skeezix
December 14th, 2009
1:01 pm
Mark: 1. I am glad we have Wagner; I think he’ll be fine.
2. I wish we had traded Lowe and kept Soriano. A key question for Wren is- why was he surprised when Soriano accepted arbitration? …and what with that 4.5+ ERA reliever he got back in the trade?
3. As I’ve said before, Wren is over his head, has been from the beginning, and should be demoted to equipment manager.
Art Vandalay
December 14th, 2009
1:03 pm
Plus the opening day rotation of
Vazquez,Hudson,Jurrjens,Hanson,Kawakami
Looks much better than last year’s :Lowe,Vazquez,Jurrjens,Kawakami,Glavine
The Big Dawg Has Eaten
December 14th, 2009
1:04 pm
((((( 30-24 )))))
Sid Slides In
December 14th, 2009
1:04 pm
1. You have to get rid of Lowe because you have six starting pitchers and need to cut salary. Of course Vazquez is the more appealing option, but was also our best starter down the stretch last season and younger than Lowe. While getting rid of Kenshin Kawakami would be nice, it does not releive the salary the braves need to so they can acquire a bat… therefor, Lowe is the one they need to move.
2. I like Wagner and think he will be good, but am second guessing getting rid of Soriano. The one that really worries me here is Saito who’s “power arm” is 40 years old and has a 93 mph fastball at best… this is going to bite us.
3. I agree with the Braves not signing LaRoche and personally do not want him back. For the Braves to be productive next season it is imperative they get off to a hot start; and as Laroche’s numbers show, he is one of the worst 1st half players in baseball. He was a great pickup for the 2nd half of last season, but will be nonexistent until June next year (need we all remember the 2005 season).
4. It would be nice to see the braves move chipper to 1st (I love the guy, but he has now turned into a defensive liability… close to the top in errors). Move Prado to 3rd and sign Orlando Hudson. Easier said than done I know, but it gives the Braves a guy that can hit in the leadoff spot (McLouth strikes out waaaaay to much), is a switch hitter, and has speed (something we need a lot more of). He wouldn’t be the power hitter they are looking for, but he can put them in run producing situations and he is only 30. Xavier Nady and Nick Swisher will be reminiscent of Ryan Klesko and Ken Caminiti (.230 with 25 hr and 75 rbi’s… could def help, but you’re looking at over 130 k’s)
KennyP
December 14th, 2009
1:04 pm
My lord, this is the most hateful article i have read in a long time! You are becoming a bitter man, MB. Can we not look at how the Braves did in the second half last season and try to see the glass half full? Wren had alot of critics this time last year and shut them all up by the end of the year, lets give him some slack here.
ChillyMutt
December 14th, 2009
1:06 pm
Frank Wren has shown the unique ability to consistently choose the wrong direction at any baseball crossroad. Lowes huge contract, Chipper’s extension, leaving Schafer in the majors WAY too long … Glavine, Smoltz – not that they should have been retained but the way in which they were let go. The Furcal debacle….Francour …. the Kelly John experiment…..
Art Vandalay
December 14th, 2009
1:09 pm
There really is not a power hitter available that fits the Braves needs, I like the Orlando Hudson idea. You have Orlando Hudson, Nate McClouth for speed and steals. Hudson, Escobar, Prado, Diaz can all deliver the timely hits for RBIs and Chipper and McCann and possibly Heyward while not 40 HR guys can provide the pop when needed.
Kentavo
December 14th, 2009
1:11 pm
J. Chavez led Buccos in appearances last year – he will be Cox’s mule to wear out with 80-plus appearances this year.
Can’t you just wait when Wagner is trotted out in a blow-out game “to get some work?”
NortonHearsA..Whoosh
December 14th, 2009
1:13 pm
If you can trade a $15 salary like Lowe’s (maybe the Braves wil have to chip in $2-3mil) for an emerging star like second baseman Jose Lopez with the Mariners or a player in his prime like LF Juan Rivera, then you make that move. Then fill in the pieces with short term free agents or a two year offer to LaRoche or N. Johnson, If you acquire Lopez, move Prado to first, sign a FA left fielder, and platoon Heyward/Diaz in RF. If you acquire Rivera, add LaRoche for a heavy 2 year deal and stay with same platoon.
tyger
December 14th, 2009
1:13 pm
If you aint talkin Barry Bonds, you aint talkin bout sht!
Glynn
December 14th, 2009
1:14 pm
Bring back LaRoche!
This is a no brainer, we need a bat, we need a first basemen. I hope Freddie Freemen is a great player, but lets not count on that too much. LaRoche could start for 3 years and Freemen would still only be 22 (maybe 23, im not sure).
njbraves
December 14th, 2009
1:19 pm
Bradley….You’re lost. Leave the baseball talk to DOB, because you are clueless.
GermanBravesFan
December 14th, 2009
1:23 pm
Are Don and Robert twins? Gets kinda tiring to read their rants about how bad Bobby Cox is. Without him, the Braves STILL would not be worth talking about – like they were before 1991!
Frank Robinson (Rockmart)
December 14th, 2009
1:28 pm
1. Because the older reliever’s career track record for injuries and performance is much better than Soriano’s. 2009 is a very small sample size.
2. Because Soriano was one of the top 3 relievers on the market, and not many expected him to accept arbitration. Laroche is not exactly on the top of everyone’s chart of top hitting free agents. If he accepts arbitration Wren has less flexibility for roster construction. Laroche can still sign with the Braves, but Wren now has more leverage in salary negotiation.
3. I think if there were “utter desperation” to trade him, he’d be gone. Looks like Wren is waiting out the market to bring his or Vazquez’ value even higher.
4. Not necessarily. Let’s give it more than two months to see how Francouer pans out. Also, what exactly would one have expected Wren to get for him? We were lucky to get more than a bag of balls for “The Natural”.
5. Does Wren have bad instints because he walked away from the 3 that you mentioned? Your question confuses me. Seems to me he did one hell of a job overhauling the roster last year, and I like (but don’t love) the moves he’s made so far.
This “article” is poorly thought out, and unnecessarily paints a negative picture of one of the better executives in the game over the past two seasons.
timthebrave
December 14th, 2009
1:32 pm
The best move he has made is not resigning Norton. That’s a 2-3 game upgrade right there.
BraveMan
December 14th, 2009
1:32 pm
My issue with Wren is that he talks about player negotiations, signings, trades, etc. through the media then looks stupid when things do not work out. Not as credible nor respected like Cox, Kasten and Schuerholz have been over the years in player acquisitions!!
WE NEED OFFENSE – PITCHING IS FINE – SPEND THE COIN ON OFFENSE!!
Stumpknocker
December 14th, 2009
1:33 pm
Some of you Cox lovers on here remind me of Dawg fans. Your quick to quote history to strengthen your point of view. But not taking into account the historian is running out of gas. Cox has, over the past couple of years, been responsible for (directly or indirectly) blowing huge leads in games that the Braves should have won easily. That figure comes to roughly 10 games per season. Losing games in such a fashion is demoralizing to the team effort and should be kept to a bare minimum. Had the Braves won the majority of those “blown games”, they would have made the post season.