After 26 NFL starts, how does Ryan compare to Vick?
Matt Ryan hasn’t had the sunniest of sophomore seasons. His team is 5-5. He threw 10 interceptions in a five-game span. His team has lost four of its past five. But with all the dissection we’ve done, here’s one thing we haven’t tried: We haven’t yet compared/contrasted the Falcons’ newest franchise quarterback with their previous franchise quarterback. Here goes:
• After 26 regular-season starts, Ryan is 16-10. After 26 regular-season starts, Michael Vick was 16-9-1. (Note: Owing to his apprenticeship behind Chris Chandler in 2001 and his broken leg in 2003, Vick needed four seasons to make 26 starts.)
• Ryan’s passer rating in his second season as a pro is 80.0. Vick’s passer rating in his second season as a pro was 81.6. Ryan’s career passer rating is 84.3. Vick’s career passer rating is 75.6.
• Ryan’s completion percentage in his second NFL season is 59.3. Vick’s completion percentage in his second NFL season was 54.9. Ryan’s career completion percentage is 60.3. Vick’s career completion percentage is 53.7.
• Ryan has thrown 12 interceptions through 10 games of his second NFL season. Vick threw eight in his second NFL season. Ryan has thrown 16 touchdown passes in those same 10 games. Vick threw 16 touchdown passes in 15 games in his second NFL season.
• Ryan has fumbled three times in his second NFL season, his team losing two. Vick fumbled nine times in his second NFL season, his team losing six.
• Ryan has accounted for 2,324 yards (passing and rushing) through 10 games of his second NFL season — an average of 232.4 yards per game. Vick accounted for 3,713 yards in his second NFL season — an average of 247.5 per game.
• Ryan’s team lost his first playoff start, which came in Phoenix in his first NFL season. Vick’s team won his first playoff start, which came in Green Bay in his second NFL season.
Loading ...Even though the styles were dissimilar, there’s not a lot of difference between the raw numbers at this point in the two careers. But it’s worth noting that we’re rating Ryan at a personal low — though he did have a big second half in Giants Stadium on Sunday — and Vick after 26 NFL starts was among the most feared players in the league.
That 26th start came in Week 5 of the 2004 regular season. The Falcons would finish 11-5 and beat the Rams in a playoff game and reach the NFC title game. But that was the end of Vick as a winning quarterback. He was 15-15 over his final 30 games as a Falcon, and his last NFL start came Dec. 31, 2006. This year he has accounted for 67 yards, more than half of them coming on one run against the Bears on Sunday night.
We can compare/contrast Ryan to Vick as young players, and you can make the case that Vick was slightly better. (Though not as a rookie; he started only two games in 2001.) But we cannot compare the Ryan of 2009 to the Vick of 2009 because there’s no comparison. One is the starting quarterback. The other is a backup.
Note: I’m posting this now, but I’m not opening it for comments just yet. I’m flying back from Newark, and I know from the hour I spent over dinner with D. Orlando Ledbetter last night how quickly matters can deteriorate on here. So I want to be able to monitor the comments. If you’d like to leave one, check back early in the afternoon. In the interim, feel free to vote in our poll.
In-flight update: Delta flight 2011 has wireless available — a free trial! — and I will open this for commenting. Since I’m at 30,000 feet, I’ve got nowhere to go. But let’s keep it clean, shall we?
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706 comments Add your comment
JEWELL ROLLEN
November 23rd, 2009
2:17 pm
WHAT’S THE POINT? WE ALL KNOW THAT MATT IS STUDENT OF GAME. STUDIES FILM, WORKS AT HIS GAME. AND THAT MV7 RELIED STRICTLY ON HIS GOD GIVEN ABILITY….WHICH WAS VERY CONSIDERABLE. LET’S HAVE THIS DISCUSSION WHEN MATT IS A 3 TIME PRO BOWL QB!
Matt "Choke" Ryan
November 23rd, 2009
2:17 pm
The CHOKE should try out for place kicking.
He is over his head
Mark Bradley
November 23rd, 2009
2:17 pm
Convert Michael Jenkins to cornerback? He is good at knocking down passes in the end zone.
Sorry. That’s a repeat from yesterday. But I like it too much.
EJtheDJ
November 23rd, 2009
2:18 pm
It’s purely argumentative comparing the past to the present since pros and cons (even stats) can be obviously and legitimately be argued ad nauseum. Bottom line, professional football is the ultimate team sport with only one stat that counts: Super Bowl championships. Since neither quarterback has achieved that goal, past or present, any argument or validation of either quarterback will ever produce a result other than what it was or what it is.
Tee Tee
November 23rd, 2009
2:18 pm
MV7 can lose 2 steps and a hop and he’s STILL faster than EVERY QB in the league and many RB’s. The man just spent the last 2 years in prison. When he’s leading the Panthers or 49ers in 2010, THAT will tell the story. C’Mon Son, put your hate on pause until then!
Amit
November 23rd, 2009
2:19 pm
Let us make this simple. If the Falcons get a winning record this year, Matt Ryan is better than Vick and all the quarterbacks who came before him. If not, then the football gods really do hate the city of Atlanta.
HEY "CHOKE" DOUCHEBAG
November 23rd, 2009
2:20 pm
“played”
Chris Chandler.
November 23rd, 2009
2:21 pm
Why are you guys fighting over either one, I’m the only one that has EVER taken ATL to a Super Bowl! Where is the love baby>
Real American
November 23rd, 2009
2:21 pm
Mark Bradley, please tell us who was the starting running back and the wide receivers in 2002? Its been asked and no one can remember who they were. How many yards did the starting RB get in 2002? Who played on the offensive line that was drafted in the first round? Anybody?
jon
November 23rd, 2009
2:22 pm
Mr. Rollen, pro bowls don’t mean sh…….
Matt "Choke" Ryan
November 23rd, 2009
2:22 pm
3 GUARANTEES IN LIFE:
- Death
- Taxes
- Matt Ryan CHOKING
“DUMP THE CHUMP”
Go Dawgs
November 23rd, 2009
2:23 pm
Matthew Stafford has more heart than Matty-Ice will EVER have!!
Chris Miller
November 23rd, 2009
2:25 pm
Neither of them had as good a curly mullet as I did. Now Jeff George, he had good hair and a great attitude.
Lakeisha Twanisha
November 23rd, 2009
2:25 pm
Ryan – paid way too much money without playing a game and proving himself. Nothing left to work for.
Vick – criminal, reminds us of one of those idiots who won the lottery and blew it all. Who on the current Falcons roster knew all about Vick’s dog fighting parties and attended while not offering any guidance? Which current and former Falcons bet large sums of money on these fights while their franchise player was breaking the law?
Choke's Girlfriend
November 23rd, 2009
2:25 pm
Choke, I’m leaving you for Mark Bradley!
FreddieBrown
November 23rd, 2009
2:26 pm
Im glad that Mark Bradley decided to have this article. The reason is because many vick supporters and vick fans have been using these blog venues to compare ryan to vick anyway. Now there is an article which gives you the green light to do what you have been doing anyway, ever since Vick signed on with Philly. Great!
Tim
November 23rd, 2009
2:26 pm
Hey Choke,
You’re a Canadian aren’t you?
Manny
November 23rd, 2009
2:26 pm
Mark,
This was some good information. The stats are very similar…
Here’s the deal that you gotta think about: Imagine Matt Ryan being on that team that Vick was on. Now, imagine Vick in the 2009 Falcons.
Me? Vick WAS the team when he was playing here. Matt Ryan is a part of a team. That is all.
Chris Miller
November 23rd, 2009
2:27 pm
To go dawgs,
Matt Stafford didnt give a rats you know what about UGA. He came in and just bided his time until the NFL came calling. Which game did he win for us last year with his heart. Was it FLorida or Alabama, I cant remember.
Choke's Girlfriend
November 23rd, 2009
2:27 pm
I’m really a man choke!
Bill Cook
November 23rd, 2009
2:27 pm
One difference is that we now have a field general… a real leader. With Vick we had a great athelete with a strong but not very accurate arm. I am not happy with where we are right now but I am excited about the future of this team with Ryan at the helm. After 33 years a sa season ticket holder I would love to see back to back winning seasons. The 2nd half of the schedule lends itself in our favor… If MJ will hold on to the ball and if our kicker re-discovers his skill.
Najeh Davenpoop
November 23rd, 2009
2:27 pm
“Roddy and Jenkins were here with Vick and neither of them did anything…in fact Roddy has made 2 pro bowls (One with Ryan) since Vick left, so that should tell you about his talents as a QB. ”
WRs typically take 2-3 years to develop. Marvin Harrison and Terrell Owens, for example, didn’t have a 1000 yard season until their third years. If you are going to blame Vick for White’s struggles, you have to give him credit for Warrick Dunn and Alge Crumpler’s career seasons as well, since both players fell off the map after Vick left.
Oh yeah, and Vick looked pretty fast on his 34-yard run yesterday… even if he has lost a little speed I think it’s safe to say he’s still the league’s fastest QB.
Matt "Choke" Ryan
November 23rd, 2009
2:28 pm
Real American
November 23rd, 2009
2:21 pm
Mark Bradley, please tell us who was the starting running back and the wide receivers in 2002? Its been asked and no one can remember who they were. How many yards did the starting RB get in 2002? Who played on the offensive line that was drafted in the first round? Anybody?
“He will ignore you” unless you ask him something like “What did the CHOKE have for lunch”
HEY "CHOKE" DOUCHEBAG
November 23rd, 2009
2:28 pm
You have no answer because you’ve never even played a down of football other than on your play station you PUNK DOUCHE.
Go cut and paste some stats from another website…
HEY "CHOKE" DOUCHEBAG
November 23rd, 2009
2:29 pm
and I think we all know you “CHOKED” on some tube steak at lunch you PUNK DOUCHE
Matt "Choke" Ryan
November 23rd, 2009
2:30 pm
Choke’s Girlfriend
November 23rd, 2009
2:25 pm
Choke, I’m leaving you for Mark Bradley!
“I knew I couldn’t trust that trick”
Falcons Fan
November 23rd, 2009
2:31 pm
Real American,
We had no pro bowlers in 07′. Matt Ryan joining the team helped make Roddy a probowl wr. Yes I know the offensive line sucked in 02′, but many of the players on it today were around when Vick was here yet he still never was able to play as a pocket passer. Vick had a few good years and then started sucking. Remember when he flipped off the fans? Remember when he would “get injured” at the end of games in 06? Vick did nothing except give us a good year and then disappoint us.
Najeh Davenpoop
November 23rd, 2009
2:31 pm
“I know that the defense we had with Michael Vick was much better than today!”
Are you f*cking serious? Talk to me when the current defense gives up 4 rushing TDs to Derrick Blaylock or gives up 100 yards and 2 TDs to Samkon Gado. The Falcons defense when Vick was here allowed unknown opponents to have career days. The current defense has its problems but there is simply no comparison.
Matt "Choke" Ryan
November 23rd, 2009
2:32 pm
Tim
November 23rd, 2009
2:26 pm
Hey Choke,
You’re a Canadian aren’t you?
“Que? Se habla Espanol?
Chokie Chokerton
November 23rd, 2009
2:32 pm
Choke
Why no love for Flacco anymore? You trumpeted that until the Ravens tanked.
You are nothing more than a passive aggressive coward.
When did Vick throw his last 4th quarter TD? Tell us big man.
That’s what I thought.
Mark Bradley
November 23rd, 2009
2:32 pm
Warrick Dunn and T.J. Duckett were the backs — Dunn started — on the 2002 Falcons. Dunn rushed for 927 yards, Duckett for 507. Vick rushed for 777.
Finneran was the leading receiver with 56 catches. Dunn had 50. Alge Crumpler had 36. Shawn Jefferson — the other starting wideout — had 27.
Here’s the page at Pro Football Reference on the 2002 Falcons.
Chuckie D
November 23rd, 2009
2:34 pm
Also,
It should be noted that Matt Ryan has not been involved in dog fighting or being a “Baby’s Daddy’ that I’m aware of or at least it has not been reported~~~
Also, Mr. Blank, please stay in your luxurious box instead of getting face time along the sidelines at the end of the game. You have nothing to add to the game except to sign the checks!
LYNN CAIN
November 23rd, 2009
2:35 pm
I have been a Falcons fan for years, and I have to chime in;
Mark, when looking at completion rates and passer ratings was any consideration given to those multiple, countless, wide open passes thrown by Vick to Roddy White, Micheal Jenkins (just like yesterday), and Alge Crumpler that were clearly great throws, and in the end became drops. Vick never had any dependable receivers, well maybe Finnernan, but he has speed limitations. I would love to see the ratings after you compare the drop passes of each quaterback, not passes defended, DROPS BY RECEIVERs. I would think Vick would pull ahead even more in overall numbers.
Offensive Line; need I say more; I dont know how many times I have seen defensive linemen in the backfield before Vick could even take a two step drop. How many times have I seen Vick save the day by using his feet while the rest of the offense stood and watched?
Coaching; Mr. Blank’s greatest mistake was firing Dan Reeves, Reeves Offense was suited for Vick’s talents, power running game with a vertical pass game, and so was Patrinos unfortunetly we never got to see Vick in that Offense. The Mora/Knapp offense was terrible; think about thier inability to modifiy thier game plan at halftime or from quarter to quarter, Knapp was not capable of doing that (See Seattle), they just hoped that Vick would make a great play. The current Offense Coordinator at least has the ability to alter his game plan ( and understand what the defense is trying to do) that is a convenience that Vick never had under Mora. The West Coast Offense was never suited for VICK.
Don’t get me wrong I love Matt Ryan, but I always felt that even when things were going bad for the Falcons during a game, and if it were close we always had a chance with Vick, he could take over a game by himself, but Ryan needs help. Please lets be honest everyone, Ryan’s arm is not very strong (Redmonds arm is stronger & the third stringer, and the guy they cut), and there are several throws he cant make, so he makes up for it by being a coach on the field.
Sometimes you just need to have an Aarron Rodgers type of arm to win a game, NOT COACHING.
Mark for you to say that Vick had just as much talent around him as Ryan, come on now; can you really compare an aging Dunn to Turner, or an overated Duckett to Turner, and Norwood. Can you compare Crumpler to Tony Gonzales even an old Gonzales? After his second year did Crumpler even practice? The Vick threat made them all better, and all overated. Where are Crumpler, Duckett, Dunn now? Gonzales is just as old or older than these players. I bet Vick would love to have Roddy White, now that he has learned how to catch the ball, probably not Jenkins he is worse than a moody teenage girl, you never know what to expect
If Vick ever gets the chance to start somewhere, in a good offense (not west coast) with a good offense line, a good coach (not Mora/Knapp) who can change a game plan with the flow of the game, I think we will all be surprised; doesn’t really matter if Vick has lost a step or not, he still faster than any Quarterback in the NFL, and his arm is as strong as ….. well name someone, anyone!
Real American
November 23rd, 2009
2:35 pm
Well “Choke”, I’m gonna keep asking because its a relevant question. Also, earlier somebody had the nerve to say the playbook was simplified for Vick……..well maybe that’s because he had to learn a whole new offense contrary to THIS:
Atlanta’s pass-protection terminology and blocking schemes are the same as Ryan had as a BC senior, so right away he knew such technical elements as whether the tight end or the running back would pick up a stray blitzer. That allows him to immediately identify his hot receiver.
http://www.cardinalsportal.com/news/young-man-s-game-.php?act=print
Very few media outlets let it be known that Mularkey used the same offense that Ryan played in at Boston College…they want everybody to think Ryan is some sort of football “savant”. Naw, he’s no genius, he got to play in the same offense he already HAD played in.
Matt "Choke" Ryan
November 23rd, 2009
2:35 pm
HEY “CHOKE” DOUCHEBAG
November 23rd, 2009
2:28 pm
You have no answer because you’ve never even played a down of football other than on your play station you PUNK DOUCHE.
Go cut and paste some stats from another website
“Hold on a second, I need to restart my playstation”
“DUMP THE CHUMP”
Kevin
November 23rd, 2009
2:36 pm
Comparein Mark Bradley to Terrance Moore ….well One left AJC cause he was forced out the other trys bring up old woinds fron a dog fighter man….in other words Matt Ryan is far better then Micheal(sick)Vick.
Sporty Black
November 23rd, 2009
2:37 pm
When Vick went to jail, the holes that he covered with his athleticism became very apparent. The Falcons could not win without Vick, period. So the Falcons adressed those holes with acquisitions of Turner, Gonzalez, Dahl, Clabo, & Baker. Not to mention the upgrade of the defense in Abraham, Biermann, Lofton, Peterson, etc.
Given all the new tools, Ryan numbers still are NOT better than what Vicks were. The most important numbers are playoff wins: Vick 2-1 Ryan 0-1. Sorry, Ryan is an ordinary player and can not take over a game like Vick did.
Ryan is just not the winner we all want him to be. Even in college, BC (Ryan) did not compete on the national stage as did VT (Vick). BC’s (Ryan’s) only appearance in ACC Championship was a loss to VT. Nod goes to Vick, though I want Ryan to Win.
Tim
November 23rd, 2009
2:37 pm
Choke,
Look it up.
GoTech610
November 23rd, 2009
2:37 pm
For all of you people saying Matt Ryan can’t find a way to win are ignorant.
Matt found a way against the Giants eventhough, Jenkins dropped a wide open TD pass, Elam missed another field goal, and the defense getting burned on a career Eli Manning day.
Matt drove the ball down the field and had the opportunity to win the game. Matt did his part.
The rest of this teams needs to act like they want to win.
Matt "Choke" Ryan
November 23rd, 2009
2:38 pm
Chokie Chokerton
November 23rd, 2009
2:32 pm
Choke
Why no love for Flacco anymore? You trumpeted that until the Ravens tanked.
You are nothing more than a passive aggressive coward.
When did Vick throw his last 4th quarter TD? Tell us big man.
That’s what I thought.
“Que? Se habla Espanol”?
Reg
November 23rd, 2009
2:38 pm
I think the argument is meaningless. Trent Dilfer sports a championship ring because the Ravens defense stopped teams from scoring. All he had to do was manage/scrouge up 14 point per game and it normally resulted in a win. Matt Ryan will do fine once the defense gets better. I know its an old cliche, but defense really does win championships. That what is missing from the Falcon equation: DEFENSE
GoTech610
November 23rd, 2009
2:41 pm
Guys,
it’s his second year. I can only imagine what the these blogs would be doing if he was anything like Favre or Peytons first two seasons. The blogs would need new servers every week because people would be melting down.
The experts on TV and the NFL coaches, like Tony Dungy, are kidding or fools when they say Matt Ryan is going to be a great NFL QB.
With comparison to Vick, yeah he can’t run, but he can throw and he gave us his best on Sunday against the Giants. That last drive was beautiful and Peyton Manning or Brady couldn’t have done better.
Bill
November 23rd, 2009
2:42 pm
Let’s not talk about two seasons. Five years down the road when the Falcons have put together a more complete roster, Ryan will be one of the best quarterbacks in football. Forget about Vick.
Ryan is a student of the game and works hard to improve himself. He’s very smart and knows how to run an offense. At the end of his reign with the Falcons, Vick was going downhill. The League learned how to adjust to his free lance style of play. He also doesn’t have the football savvy of Ryan.
Dre
November 23rd, 2009
2:43 pm
Comparing the two does make for interesting read in this town. But we all should know that a quarterback gets to much credit for wins and losses. If I am correct in this years losses, the offense has scored and average of nealy 20(+) points a game. I beleive the New England and Carolina game are the only games sub 20. This makes it a defensive problem rather than an offensive. Admittingly it has appeared that Ryan has regressed a bit but I also beleive the total offense has. Turner just recently started posting last year numbers, Norwood injuried last 5 games, and Jenkins has dropped more and passes and let’s not forget the number of missed field goals. I’m hoping for a winning season to break that drought. And will be waiting and watching to see what they do during the offseason for the defense.
Lady T
November 23rd, 2009
2:43 pm
All I’m Saying Is…,
You DID that sir….thanks for breaking it down for the former “short bus” students!!
Ryan
November 23rd, 2009
2:44 pm
I think the raw numbers is roughly a tie – Ryan has the completion percentage, while Vick had better yardage – Vick had fewer interceptions, but made up for that with fumbles. Given that I think this has to go to Ryan since (as you pointed out) these are his first two years in the league, and Vick had 4 years to get to 26 games.
San
November 23rd, 2009
2:45 pm
Matt “Choke” Ryan,
I love it…keep em coming!!
Idiot's Opinion
November 23rd, 2009
2:46 pm
I don’t think there would even be a comparison, Vick hands down. The Falcons are a quarterback and a reciever away from being an elite team in the NFL.
HAHAHA what dumba$$.
GoTech610
November 23rd, 2009
2:47 pm
*Are not kidding or fools* I meant NOT kidding
AJC’s Mark Bradley Compares Matt Ryan And Michael Vick | Atlanta Falcons Blog
November 23rd, 2009
2:49 pm
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