The Hot Button: Where would Tech finish in the SEC?
There's a difference between ACC speed and SEC speed. (AJC photo by Curtis Compton)
It’s clear – to me, if not to C.J. Spiller and Dabo Swinney — that Georgia Tech is the class of the ACC. But the ACC is often described as the least of the six BCS leagues, and another conference in the neighborhood is regarded as the best. So now, today’s question:
Where would Tech rank in the SEC?
My first inclination is to say the Jackets would finish wherever Mike Slive’s refs got together and decided they should be, but that’s my little joke. Getting serious, I’d say …
Second in the East behind Florida. Third in the West behind Alabama and LSU. Fourth overall.
That wailing you hear are the cries arising from the confluence of North Avenue and Techwood Drive, but hear me out. As good as Tech is — and it is very good — there’s still a difference between the personnel of a top-shelf SEC team and of everyone else. (Ask Jim Tressel.) This doesn’t mean Tech couldn’t up and beat Florida or Alabama or LSU on a given Saturday; it simply means that, on most given Saturdays, talent would prevail.
We’ve seen the difference between the SEC and the ACC three times in this city in the past 15 months. Alabama beat Clemson in the 2008 Chick-fil-A Kickoff Classic and then whipped Virginia Tech in the 2009 installment. LSU beat Tech 38-3 on Dec. 31, 2008. Three games on a neutral field, three emphatic SEC victories. Anyone who says there isn’t an imbalance between leagues, at least at their respective summits, isn’t dealing in reality.
On the other hand, SEC zealots are wrong to suggest the Jackets would finish far up the track in that famous league. Tech is better than Ole Miss, better than Auburn, better than South Carolina, better than Arkansas … yes, better than Georgia. To be placed below Florida and Alabama is no great failing, for those are two of the three best teams in the land, and to be deemed less gifted than LSU is no demerit, given that the Tigers have lost only to the Gators and the Tide.
Loading ...(And yes, I have noticed that Tech beat both Mississippi State and Vandy by one more point than did the mighty Gators. Whatever that means.)
Since you asked, I don’t think it’s a question of Paul Johnson’s offense not working in the SEC. It’s an issue instead of the SEC’s Big Three having superior defensive manpower. Nobody else in the ACC has the speed to keep up with Dwyer and Nesbitt and Roddy Jones; certain teams in the SEC do.
OK, there’s my take. Feel free to call me an idiot — pretty much everybody does — but know this: I do speak from observation. I’ve seen Tech and Florida and LSU in person both this season and last, and I saw Alabama in the imposing flesh twice in 2008. And I’m not trying to denigrate the Jackets, who might well be the nation’s fifth-best team. (After Florida, Texas, Alabama and LSU. Though I’m not suggesting LSU, with its two losses, should be ranked ahead of Tech in the polls.) I’m just telling you how I see it.
You’re now free to express yourselves on this weighty matter. Why do I feel you won’t need prompting?
And now, because fair’s fair: Where would Georgia rank in the ACC?
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901 comments Add your comment
Hal
November 11th, 2009
8:03 am
Sometimes I think you sports writers like to throw articles out there like this sit back and watch some of us go nuts. It’s sort of like going to the Atlanta Aquarium and throwing a chicken in with the piranhas.
Tom
November 11th, 2009
8:04 am
Thru the games of this past weekend, the Sagarin strength of schedule (SoS) rankings…….
1. Washington
2. Washington State
3. UCLA
4. Virginia Tech
5. Florida State
6. Oregon
7. Southern California
8. San Jose State
9. Oregon State
10. Georgia
11. Miami (FL)
12. Georgia Tech
13. Virginia
14. Wake Forest
15. Stanford
Tech '01
November 11th, 2009
8:04 am
To everyone saying we wouldn’t cut it the SEC, we’ve blown out Vandy and Miss St this year, beat Auburn in recent years, beat UGA last year, and probably this year, Ole Miss refused to play us, Auburn turned us down for the Chick-fil-a Kickoff, we have upcoming home and homes with Alabama and South Carolina, so at least we’re trying to show everyone that we can hang.
Plus, if anyone thinks guys like Dwyer, Allen, Nesbitt, Thomas, Morgan, Burnett, Jefferson, Jones, etc. wouldn’t be stars in the SEC or anything conference is crazy. They are all going to the NFL, except Jones, who might be going to the MLB.
willie martinez
November 11th, 2009
8:04 am
AZ, i didnt graduate from uga but i sure like working there.
JDW
November 11th, 2009
8:05 am
I think at best they are fourth as MB writes. But I also think if they played Ole Miss, SC, and AR they would lose at least once…as for Georgia we will find out the answer to that soon enough.
Jon Cajun
November 11th, 2009
8:05 am
Good analysis. One thing you did not mention is the stadium/crowd factor. Another way to write the article would be, where would Vandy finish in the ACC since they are the only team with an ACC stadium?
GR82BAG8R
November 11th, 2009
8:05 am
The SEC has more BCS NCs than any other conference. The SEC has never lost a BCS NC title game. Auburn would have won the title if they had been given the chance. Anyone who questions the SEC’s pre-eminence in college football is ignoring the facts.
Georgia Tech’s current system would compete quite well in the SEC, once you get a better defense. Tech has the ability to compete with true scholar-athletes, as the AJC has reported that Tech’s football team has the highest SAT scores of any public university. That means that Tech is somewhat limited in its ability to recruit 4-5 star athletes. Florida does not have that barrier and is able to assemble a stable of elite athletes and coach them (two out of the last three BCS NCs is evidence). Georgia also recruits top notch talent, but doesn’t appear to have the ability to coach them to perform at the next level.
It will be interesting to see how Tech performs once Johnson gets his recruits in place.
willie martinez
November 11th, 2009
8:05 am
tech really hasnt been any good since AL said toe meets leather. and that was a long, long time ago friends.
Jake L
November 11th, 2009
8:06 am
I love how you ignore stats. Like Lsu barely beat Miss st even when getting +4 in the turnover margin. Like how GT beat MISS st by a larger margin than both LSU and FLa and likely Bama this week. Like how GT beat Vandy by a larger margin than Fla. Like vandy’s def holding sec teams to an average of around 22 and GT puts 56 on them.
But that LSU team who’s beaten
La Lafayette
Tulane
Miss st
Vandy
Ga
Wash
Auburn
Wow what big time wins! And Bama is just as bad. There only win is over LSU!! I’m telling you guys you are in for a rude awakening this year. The offenses in the sec are dismal. And it will show in the bowl games. Neither fla nor bama are the top 2 teams in the country. GT and Texas would beat both of them. You’ll see what begins to unfold soon.
Jacketman
November 11th, 2009
8:06 am
AZ Jacket, you are correct Sir…what was I thinking?
I wonder
November 11th, 2009
8:06 am
Do teams in other leagues just not recruit fast players? Or do SEC coaches have some ability to improve their speed so that they can compete with SEC SPEED!!!! Such garbage, unreal. Just stirring the pot aren’t we?
How about you rank where uga would be in the ACC? I say below GT, VT, Miami in the Coastal (on par with UNC) and below Clemson, FSU (with Ponder) in the Atlantic.
mash a bug
November 11th, 2009
8:06 am
omg! you continue to drink the kool-aid! NO DOUBT! ABSOLUTLELY NO DOUBT, TECH would consistently be near or at the bottom of the SEC teams.
Hal
November 11th, 2009
8:06 am
Tom,
Interesting the FSU played BYU and Miami played Oklahoma without Sam B. And Tech played 3 SEC teams.
PT
November 11th, 2009
8:06 am
LOL>Tech does not get it. When Tech loses its superstar QB, WR, and RB to the the NFL(Nesbit as a apecialty player) they will be the same ole Tech. LSU showed last yr what superior athletes with coaching will do to this Offense. Same with Miami. When UGA replaces Willy will be right back in the game. Tech would not be in the top half of the SEC. This year I would say they might be the 3rd best team. Coach PJ is having the luxury of a few great players running his show. Just imagine if Jabo Shaw was running this O. LMAO
Inhale, please?
November 11th, 2009
8:08 am
Bradley – You have stated several time this season that Tech is the “better program” when compared to UGA. But the truth is that every time you and Schultz write your drivel it becomes obvious that the perceived demise of the Georgia program is a bigger story than the so-called rise of Georgia Tech. So, in essence you are disproving your own theory every time you attempt to put Georgia down and build Tech up. You might as well quit while you’re behind!
B Watkins
November 11th, 2009
8:08 am
Did Miami have the speed to keep up with Georgia Tech?
Dawg Nation
November 11th, 2009
8:09 am
There’s absolutely no way that the nerds finish ahead of the Dawgs in the SEC. Even if the Dawgs are terrible and have the worst coaching, the nerds will always be worse. GT would just be another Vandy in the SEC. Our top rated recruiting classes always make us good, our records just doesn’t show it this year. Go DAWGS!
mash a bug
November 11th, 2009
8:10 am
38-3 december 2008. enough said. definitely bottom dwellers
Tech Tony
November 11th, 2009
8:11 am
I think toss-up between 3rd and 4th is about right. But in saying that, that could well make Tech the 3rd, 4th, or 5th best team in the nation because everybody to this point is trailing the SEC’s top 2, Florida and Alabama.
The SEC is not nearly as competitive as it makes itself out to be. Outside its top 3 teams (adding LSU to the top 2), only Tennessee is a better football team on this day than they were on the opening day of the season. Is Georgia better now than the day it beat South Carolina? Clearly not. Is Mississippi better now than it was when it achieved a short lived top 5 ranking? Again, a resounding no. The Gamecocks? They’ve hit their annual slide which doesn’t look like will end any time soon. There are other teams in the league that aren’t bad, but while we can say they are “not bad”, we’re not going to the length of saying they are “good”.
At the top, the SEC has without doubt 3 of the top teams out there, but all things considered, the whole “the SEC is best from top to bottom” myth rings hollow.
UGA
November 11th, 2009
8:11 am
The UGA Bulldogs rule. NUFF SAID!!
AZ Jacket
November 11th, 2009
8:12 am
Look in the dictionary for the meaning of idiot and you will find a picture of ‘PT’. The same dictionary gives the meaning of fear as ‘dawg fan’.
DawgMite
November 11th, 2009
8:13 am
No one wants to read dumb stories about GT. Stick with the relevant team in Georgia, Mark. The dawgs rule!!
Sautee Dawg
November 11th, 2009
8:15 am
Mark
You’ve lost it. Tech a team nobody wants to play right now? No defense!!!!!! Giving up 31 at Vandy and 27 at Wake??? You should have compared them to the Big East where nobody plays defense and you out score your opponent.
Congratulations to Tech this year they’ve really hung in there and have a good record,
Tech hasn’t played in a major bowl since 1966, maybe this year they’ll finally get to play in one.
In the SEC this year Tech would probably fall into 5th or 6th overall.
Reality
November 11th, 2009
8:15 am
I agree with mark Bradley as to where Tech would finish (4th) in the SEC (though I have some doubts as to whether or not they could beat Tennessee at this time in the season.). Definately Florida, Alabama & LSU are better than Tech, but Tech would probably lose to most other SEC teams if the Techies were not 100% that day. Of course that is true in their own conference. But as to anyone thinking that the ACC is the worst of the 6 major conferences they are dead wrong, WAY OFF BASE! The ACC is a pretty good football conference with a lot of parity.
My ranking of the conferences:
1. SEC
2. Big 12
3. (tie) ACC & Pac Ten
5. Big East
6. Big Ten
There is no doubt that the Big Ten is the by far the worst of the 6 major conferences!!!! Actually the Big Ten is probably just a hair better than Conference USA, the WAC and the Mountain West.
Tom
November 11th, 2009
8:16 am
“Georgia fans are passionate, but let’s face it – they’re not the brightest fans. Passionate, but not bright.” – Eric Zeier, November 21, 2001
Good Grief
November 11th, 2009
8:17 am
I agree, 4th or 5th is about right. Also worth mentioning is that in those three ACC/SEC match-ups all three of those games came off of long breaks. A month long break basically in the GT/LSU match up last year and then in the other two games both teams have two seasons (Spring, Summer) to prepare for a game.
Now, I guess we could say in both the Bama/Clemson and Bama/VaTech game that talent stuck out but I’d even go as far to say coaching. I’d like to see what would have happened to LSU had they not had 4 weeks to prepare to face Tech and had only 4 to 5 days. The same goes for Bama…I think if these ACC/SEC games were played on back to back weeks that we would see even better games
WalMartDawg
November 11th, 2009
8:18 am
evrbody n my tralur park knoz da dawgs ar reely da best ov bowth confrensez. They jus don have a gud qb dis yur
jus wat till nex yur yu nats! weel wip ur buts up btween da hegez an mak u lik it!
MASSDAWG
November 11th, 2009
8:18 am
VERY ACCURATE MARK!!!!
38-3 !!!!!!!!!!!!!hahahahahahahahahaha
Eric
November 11th, 2009
8:20 am
Who cares? It’s irrelevant.
Mr. Attendance
November 11th, 2009
8:20 am
Even as well as Georgia Tech is doing this year they still cannot fill up their cute little stadium. While UGA having a bad year puts 80,000 in the stands even to see the Dawgs play a nobody like Tennessee Tech.
Serious football is played in stadiums in the SEC that are huge and packed out! The ACC on the other hand has serious basketball arenas, but quaint little football stadiums.
willie martinez
November 11th, 2009
8:20 am
and zier is an idiot. cover 2 is all he can say on a broadcast.
GThor
November 11th, 2009
8:22 am
The SEC is the best conference in the land, but the SEC fans who act like playing an ACC schedule is a ‘cupcake’ schedule are poorly informed. There is talent in the ACC which is sometimes marginally coached (like it is over there in Athens). All four of Clemson’s DL will play on Sundays as will a couple of their DBs. Everyone of UNC’s LB run sub 4.5, and they have a couple of future NFL DLs too. It’s not all about VT, Miami and FSU in our conference. And that Wake team you dawgs poo poo? Last year they had the top LB taken in the draft along with a couple of other defensive players. Wake would hang with the South Carolinas, Ole Misses and Arkys of the SEC.
Tampa Wreck
November 11th, 2009
8:22 am
Enter your comments here
Hey Dogtards
November 11th, 2009
8:22 am
You are an idiot. It has nothing to do with “SEC Speed,” whatever that is. Vandy certainly doesn’t have “SEC Speed.” I’d venture a guess that neither does Kentucky, Georgia, South Carolina, Ole Miss, Miss St, Auburn, Arkansas, Tennessee, etc. Unless you are talking about Eric Berry. I think what you may mean by “SEC Speed” is “Florida Speed.” They are the only team in the SEC that plays at another gear on defense that no other team has.
I think a more reliable comparison is the strength of the D-Lines. That’s the primary reason why LSU beat Tech last year – well, that and a missed catch in the end zone, a recovered onside kick, a muffed punt return, and a failed 4th and short on Tech’s own 20. That’s the same reason Clempson “shut down” GT, even though they ceded over 300 yards rushing (I think).
It has nothing to do with cornerback speed or safety speed. Those guys are making tackles at least 3-4 yards downfield. If they are the ones “containing” the option, you are in trouble.
The main difference is the ends. If you have big, quick D-Ends, they can get around Tech’s (intentionally) undersized tackles and force the run to the inside. That’s the only speed you need on the team. The rest is making sure your DTs are big enough to clog the middle to stop Dwyer, and that your middle linebacker has enough of a nose for the ball to stop him when he squirts through.
Again, nothing to do with “SEC Speed” (whatever that is). Has everything to do with a top notch D-Line.
UGA89
November 11th, 2009
8:25 am
Tech would be a top tier team in the SEC, there is no question. Reason being you simply remove the fallacy that the SEC is that much better than the ACC –because it is not. That is nothing more than media hype by ESPN/ABC because of their contract with the SEC.
Moot topic
November 11th, 2009
8:25 am
This is moot and irrelevant like uga because gt DOESN’T play in the SEC. It’s not 1960. I still don’t get why so many of you are fooled this year by these sec teams.
Lsu hasn’t beaten one ranked team.
Bama has beaten one.
Fla hasn’t done so either.
All 3 have played 2 ooc cupcakes and Bama and Fla have 3. The refs though have made sure their lack of any offense keeps them undefeated. Eventually though it will show. And what everyone outside of the sec rose colored glasses has been saying will show. That the sec is not that good this year.
GThor
November 11th, 2009
8:25 am
Mr. Attendance, I’d rather have our fans. I’d rather have 45,000 of our fans than 90,000 ‘tards with mullets and overalls.
Gold Stinger
November 11th, 2009
8:27 am
Mark:
It looks like you have run out of topics (GT is NOT on the SEC and it is not likely to be)…well here is some help:
“Local” – With GT win over the UGA this year, is the rivalry back?
“Records”- With PJ/GT having many first wins this year, which GT/UGA game firsts can be broken?
“Recruiting”- Since the UGA regularly ranks top 10 in recruiting, is coaching worth 30 spots or more for GT which had ranks 40th~50th in recruiting?
“Patriotic”- With Navy’s success using PJ system and GT proving that it can score on any team, will the system “spread” in whole or in part?
GO GT !!
MattyB
November 11th, 2009
8:27 am
Mark,
Very well said. I’m a Tech fan, born and bred. But I think this article is just about spot-on. However, I do see the scales tipping ever so slowly and think that GT will begin to command more national respect in the coming years as we step up and play more games against the heavy-hitters of the SEC and show that a well executed, highly technical game plan can surmount sheer brawn.
UGASlobberknocker
November 11th, 2009
8:29 am
The only reason for this column was to stir up the Georgia fans.I wish you would write a real column every now and then. If Tech were in the ACC they would be a bottom feeder most years..they would be another South Carolina at best..good every now and then but bad just as often..except SC has fans that go to the game. of course we all know Tech doesnt.attendance wise Tech would be 11th ahead of only Vandy.
Scott
November 11th, 2009
8:30 am
Reality you are anything but.
Big 12 #2? They are worse than the sec with ranked teams with only 2.
John DUIberry
November 11th, 2009
8:32 am
I think these Jack(off)ets are as good as the ‘85 team, of which I was the kwahtabak.
Here’s to hangin’ fiddy on each defense we got left.
Burp!
Gt4ever
November 11th, 2009
8:33 am
Everybody who is a REAL GT fan needs to email Dan R. We don’t just need to talk about where we would be in the SEC, we need to be back in the league, where we belong! The fact that we chose to leave was the beginning of the end of GT football. We need to do anything we can do to re-enter the SEC. It would make us a national powerhouse, once again. We could recruit with anyone, and we could finally find a way to fill our stadium on Saturday’s. I personally don’t believe we have the talent overall to compete at the level that the top teams in the SEC, as noted in the chicken bowl. That was no aberration, it was a good old fashion beating. It’s still kinda funny to listen to GT fans rationalize that loss, special teams, miscues, or whatever. Duh, that is all part of the game. One thing was not mistaken, we were manhandled, our azzes were beat. Plain and simple!
FBR
November 11th, 2009
8:33 am
Being a Vandy Grad gives me a unique perspective on UGA and Tech. Congrats to Tech for having a very good team this year, but you Tech fans are delusional. You’ve got to realize that you’re not a top tier program like Georgia or Al or TN and everone knows it, and you never will be. Every decade or so you’ll come to the table with a competitive team, sit back and enjoy what you have and quit thinking you’ll always be king of the hill, it just wont happen.
Bryan Black
November 11th, 2009
8:37 am
Did you even see the Clemson vs. Gt game? Clemson spotted them 21 points. Tech went 8 or 9 series without converting a third or fourth down. And SEC like ACC referees determined GT was the class of the ACC and propeeld them to victory much the same as they aided and abetted Florida and Alabama in the SEC. Here’s hoping we get another shot at Tech!
godawg
November 11th, 2009
8:38 am
PUHLEEZE! They were in before but they chickened out and joined the basketball conference. Good riddance to bad rubbish!
GTFAN
November 11th, 2009
8:38 am
Georgia Tech does need to be back in the SEC. That way we could get better recruits, money for the athletic department, and play real football teams each week. The ACC is a joke in football.
3 DAWG KNIGHT
November 11th, 2009
8:42 am
3RD IN SEC East and 3rd in SEC west
GTman
November 11th, 2009
8:42 am
While I think we could win 1 game against any team, I think we would probably lose two out of the three against UF, AL, LSU and I think we would be favored against everybody else in the SEC.
There is no team in the country that could go 3-0 against the teams above and only one team (UF or AL) will win 2 games against the SEC big 3 and the winner of the SEC championship will win by at least 2 TDs against whoever their opponent is in the BCS game.
The SEC (best football conference by far) produces a great champion that is tested and proven once they get through that league. The SEC produces more NFL talent than any other conference, so of course after facing more NFL caliber talent the SEC champ can easily handle their NC opponent.
THWG! We still own the Dawgs!
GThor
November 11th, 2009
8:44 am
Re: whether Tech would beat Tennessee? Depends on what part of the schedule we got them. Early in the season we’d have beat them, but they’re a different team now. They were a botched FG away from beating Bama @ Bama for Pete’s sake! Tennessee could give anyone they played trouble right now.