The Hot Button: Where would Tech finish in the SEC?
There's a difference between ACC speed and SEC speed. (AJC photo by Curtis Compton)
It’s clear – to me, if not to C.J. Spiller and Dabo Swinney — that Georgia Tech is the class of the ACC. But the ACC is often described as the least of the six BCS leagues, and another conference in the neighborhood is regarded as the best. So now, today’s question:
Where would Tech rank in the SEC?
My first inclination is to say the Jackets would finish wherever Mike Slive’s refs got together and decided they should be, but that’s my little joke. Getting serious, I’d say …
Second in the East behind Florida. Third in the West behind Alabama and LSU. Fourth overall.
That wailing you hear are the cries arising from the confluence of North Avenue and Techwood Drive, but hear me out. As good as Tech is — and it is very good — there’s still a difference between the personnel of a top-shelf SEC team and of everyone else. (Ask Jim Tressel.) This doesn’t mean Tech couldn’t up and beat Florida or Alabama or LSU on a given Saturday; it simply means that, on most given Saturdays, talent would prevail.
We’ve seen the difference between the SEC and the ACC three times in this city in the past 15 months. Alabama beat Clemson in the 2008 Chick-fil-A Kickoff Classic and then whipped Virginia Tech in the 2009 installment. LSU beat Tech 38-3 on Dec. 31, 2008. Three games on a neutral field, three emphatic SEC victories. Anyone who says there isn’t an imbalance between leagues, at least at their respective summits, isn’t dealing in reality.
On the other hand, SEC zealots are wrong to suggest the Jackets would finish far up the track in that famous league. Tech is better than Ole Miss, better than Auburn, better than South Carolina, better than Arkansas … yes, better than Georgia. To be placed below Florida and Alabama is no great failing, for those are two of the three best teams in the land, and to be deemed less gifted than LSU is no demerit, given that the Tigers have lost only to the Gators and the Tide.
Loading ...(And yes, I have noticed that Tech beat both Mississippi State and Vandy by one more point than did the mighty Gators. Whatever that means.)
Since you asked, I don’t think it’s a question of Paul Johnson’s offense not working in the SEC. It’s an issue instead of the SEC’s Big Three having superior defensive manpower. Nobody else in the ACC has the speed to keep up with Dwyer and Nesbitt and Roddy Jones; certain teams in the SEC do.
OK, there’s my take. Feel free to call me an idiot — pretty much everybody does — but know this: I do speak from observation. I’ve seen Tech and Florida and LSU in person both this season and last, and I saw Alabama in the imposing flesh twice in 2008. And I’m not trying to denigrate the Jackets, who might well be the nation’s fifth-best team. (After Florida, Texas, Alabama and LSU. Though I’m not suggesting LSU, with its two losses, should be ranked ahead of Tech in the polls.) I’m just telling you how I see it.
You’re now free to express yourselves on this weighty matter. Why do I feel you won’t need prompting?
And now, because fair’s fair: Where would Georgia rank in the ACC?
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901 comments Add your comment
OrlG8r
November 11th, 2009
7:06 am
I’d like to know where you think UGA would be if they were in the ACC?
Scott V.
November 11th, 2009
7:06 am
Mark,
I’m glad to see you’re buying into the SEC brand that ESPN has spent billions marketing. The truth is, LSU, Alabama, and Florida are not that good this year. The main reason why everybody thinks they are is because they are in the SEC and started off so high. Florida and Alabama could both easily have a loss right now, and LSU could feasably have 4. Washington came within a quarter of knocking them off and LSU came through with a defensive touchdown. Washington has a losing record. Lowly Mississippi State knocks off LSU if their quarterback sees the pitch man everybody else in the country saw wide open. Florida failed to score on a Vanderbilt team that Tech’s offense took to school (a top 35 defense at the time actually).
Finally, the LSU game was an aberration last year. Most SEC schools we face would not have a month to prepare for our option attack. They would have the same time Vandy and Miss. State had…who both sport SEC speed defenses and got blasted. Georgia had two weeks last year and got blasted. And are you really going to go there with the Clemson Alabama game? Clemson proved to be a mediocre team and Alabama went into the SEC championship game as the #1 team in the land. Not exactly a balanced matchup. And this year Alabama is tops in the nation and Virginia Tech is probably the third best team in the ACC and we’re comparing. How I wish there were a way we could play an SEC team in a bowl this year…
snapshot
November 11th, 2009
7:07 am
If CPJ builds a good defense to go with his offense Tech would finish at the top of the SEC. No question about it.
AZ Jacket
November 11th, 2009
7:09 am
Big time?? Not, no hotdogs, no cokes, just 9-1. Rather have 51,000 fans watching a winning team than 90,000 fans watching a looser. Leg humpers like you are typical. You have nothing to brag about in that team so all you can do is trash other programs.
SuperB
November 11th, 2009
7:11 am
Yeah, that OT win over Wake Forest on their home field convinces me that Georgia Tech would beat all of those SEC teams. (That must have convinced Mark Bradley as well.)
mtraininjax
November 11th, 2009
7:15 am
Good article Mark, good year to put Tech back into SEC, perhaps you could return the favor and rank UGA in the ACC, it might be the only good news UGA fans get all year long.
I agree that FL, AL, LSU, then Tech. FL, AL, LSU have had GT’esque games where they win by holding the ball last. I could rank Tech anywhere in the Top 4, should Tech repeat this season with similar success next year.
Finally someone has challenged VT, and exposed their young team. For so many years, they steamrolled through the ACC, and now we see that coaching is a large part of success.
GThor
November 11th, 2009
7:15 am
This is a reasonable assessment of where Tech would be in the SEC, but the ACC is not the least of the 6 BCS leagues. The Big East is. NC State, who is winless in the ACC, beat the 2nd best Big East team Pitt for their only loss this year. UNC beat UConn at UConn. ACC is better than the Big East hands down.
No Dog In This Fight
November 11th, 2009
7:16 am
It’s about the two Ds — depth and defense. Tech would finish fourth, or lower, because their defense would give up too many points. And over the course of a season playing SEC teams, Tech’s starters would get very tired.
But these deficiencies would be corrected very quickly if Tech joined the SEC. The increased exposure and the lax academic standards would allow Tech to recruit the same marginal students who populate the SEC rosters.
Tech has an amazing scheme and is a fun team to watch, but they aren’t exactly blowing teams away. They have won several key games in the second half once the shallower teams’ defenses have tired. That would be a much more iffy strategy against the top of the SEC.
Golden Hand
November 11th, 2009
7:18 am
Seems reasonable. Paul Johnson is only in Year Two of making Tech a contender with the Floridas and Alabamas. He’s always going to have to use a bit of smoke and mirrors to make up for Tech’s inherent recruiting disadvantages (so did Bobby Dodd), but once Tech actually has 85 scholarship players, and depth on both lines, I can see them doing it with the coaching advantage they have. I’ll take fourth in the SEC when you have only three scholarship seniors. If all the stud juniors come back, though, they’re probably going to be better than post-Tebow Florida next year.
SuperB
November 11th, 2009
7:18 am
Scott V: GT “blasted” Georgia last year? What was the score? (I hope you are as arrogant on (Georgia) game day this year as you are now.)
As for Mr. UT, placing the Vols third in your SEC slate is a joke. When the circus leaves town in a couple of years, you will be left with the remnants of Lane Kiffin. He can sell, but his timid “keep it close” strategy in the Florida game convinced a lot of people he was not a championship-caliber coach.
VOL Fan
November 11th, 2009
7:19 am
“This doesn’t mean Tech couldn’t up and beat Florida or Alabama or LSU on a given Saturday; it simply means that, on most given Saturdays, talent would prevail.”
Nuff said. Tech has had a decent season but that doesn’t make them a force to be reckoned with over night (sorry Ramblin Wrecks: beating a lowly Vandy team doesn’t garner you respect that easily) Put up a few championships-conference AND national- have a few MORE decent (emphasis on “decent”) seasons and the SEC *might* respect your franchise.
Alabama Jack
November 11th, 2009
7:20 am
Wasn’t it Bear Bryant who said the true measure of coaching was if you could take yours and beat his’in and then take his’in and beat yours.
Put them in any order you want but is there is any school in the country that wouldn’t take Saban, Miles, Myer or Johnson? Maybe Brian Kelly when he has a track record, but for my money right now the aformentioned are the top four coaches in the nation.
#1DAWGAFAN
November 11th, 2009
7:22 am
Tech barely beat Vandy and Miss St. Vandy put up 31 points on you. You would probably be an at best 9th place in the SEC (that is if you beat UGA).
Doug the Jacket
November 11th, 2009
7:25 am
CPJ is in his second year. GT will be better than any SEC team in year 4.
kepah17
November 11th, 2009
7:29 am
I think you nailed it
Duh
November 11th, 2009
7:34 am
There are quite a few nuts replying to this blog. MB made some valid points I’ve been making around my office all season. The only difference is I’d put UT ahead of Tech too. Seriously. Too many football fans in general do not respect defense one bit. They look at exciting offensive plays and big points to base all their opinions. They think a low scoring game means the teams are “down”. Why don’t they consider a high scoring game between teams like Tech vs Vandy or Tech vs MSU a sign of 2 teams who can’t defend jack squat?
Matchups are everything in sports. I think Tech would be 5th behind UF, AU, LSU (who beat Tech with a weaker team within in the past year), and UT (defense is too good to let Tech get off). That said, does anyone really think Tech’s defense can stop Arkansas? I mean look at Tech’s defensive performances against FSU, Miami, and even Wake Forest and tell me they can keep the Razorbacks in check. And to be honest, I wouldn’t be so sure about the rivalry game 11/28. Sure, Tech won 45-42 last year but isn’t that a toss up in a shootout? Had Tech won that game Florida-style like 45-17 then I’d agree that they are light years better than UGA but they are not.
Hunting Dawg
November 11th, 2009
7:34 am
I actually think that Tech could give LSU a run for their money this year and possibly be the 3rd best team in the SEC. No doubt that they are superior to the Dawgs, and it kills me to say that, due to coaching. I still believe that Georgia has more talented players.
In any event, this is all speculation and till the powers that be rid themselves of the BCS format and adopt a playoff system, we will never truly know how all teams rank versus one another.
Go Dawgs!!!!!
THWGT
BigStinger
November 11th, 2009
7:36 am
Lighten up, Mark. You know that the order is this:
1. (tie) UGA
1. (tie) UF
3. Bama.
4. LSU
5. Miami
UGA is just not playing with their heads this year, but they are the best along with UF. The rest, really, are just fighting for 3rd place. Miami is clearly better than GA Tech, and truly, VPI would go 5th, since the nerds cheated to win that one. Beamer showed the All Cupcake Conference the evidence, so there’s no doubt.
Appreciate you trying to spread the love around, but sometimes the truth is the truth. Tell it.
Cosmo
November 11th, 2009
7:38 am
#1 DAWGAFAN: Barely beat Vandy and Miss St? Gave up points? Yes. Beat them worse than Florida did? Also Yes. Will hang 50 on UGA? Likely. Are you people even paying attention? Apparently No.
sugarpikegang
November 11th, 2009
7:39 am
There is still a lot of football yet to be played. Though UGA may be less of a team crazier things have happened on Saturday after Thanksgiving to place UGA atop the Jackets. From an alumnus of Tech, UGA will play a tough game against Tech…
…And isn’t Duke 3-1 in the ACC at this point. Before we finish the season three (or four) games early, why not just let the season play out. Polls are given too much credence too soon.
Required Reading | Hard Knox Sports
November 11th, 2009
7:40 am
[...] Where would Tech finish in SEC? [AJC] [...]
GEORGIA97
November 11th, 2009
7:40 am
GTGreg = cry baby walking around with his boo-boo lip stuck out. You got owned by LSU so shut your mouth.
jdl2
November 11th, 2009
7:41 am
Well, the Jackets are 2-9 against the SEC this year so far. Reckon we’ll find out how good we are this year when the dogs come to town in a couple of weeks. Suffice it to say we’re a hello of a lot better off than we were three years ago. Keep it up, BEAT DOOK, THEN sting the dawgz!
EEJacket
November 11th, 2009
7:42 am
PJ would adjust with the pass. Maybe his first year wouldn’t be so hot in this regard, but after a while he’d learn he needs two guys instead of one that he can put the ball in the air to downfield in order to get past “that SEC speed.” Other than that, I don’t particularly see the SEC defenses being quick enough to stop the option. Like I said before, we’d get muscled around at the line, but once he’d be there long enough to recruit to take care of that problem, I think we’d be 2nd after a while and assuming oof doesn’t continue their reign, 1st.
Jim
November 11th, 2009
7:42 am
Tech was an SEC school chose to go away , so What IF doesn’t count for Tech! Just think they could take the whippings every year that other SEC schools take from these guys .. Too Bad Tech , guess you have to live with the ACC
Van Lingo Mungo
November 11th, 2009
7:42 am
Tech doesn’t have enough loud-mouth, bark-but-no-bite, trailer-trash fans to play in the overrated, overhyped SEC
Jake
November 11th, 2009
7:45 am
Tech had their chance. They were a member of the SEC years ago, but felt they had bigger fish to fry.
Southside Drug Rep
November 11th, 2009
7:47 am
It’s a shame we didn’t have this conversation over the PAST TWENTY YEARS! The North Avenue Trade School would have battled Vandy and Kentucky for the basement most of the past fifteen seasons. Welcome to the top ten Jackets. I certainly hope the Dawgs upset you as I sit way up high in 228.
Flush Twice…
It’s a LONG way to North Avenue
richtfan
November 11th, 2009
7:47 am
tech, in their best year, would be an also ran consistently in the SEC. this year they would finish ahead of many teams, but that’s an aberration.
willie martinez
November 11th, 2009
7:50 am
who cares? they will tumble after my guys shut ‘em out!
willie martinez
November 11th, 2009
7:51 am
ok, I’ll be realistic: GA 34 GA Tech 20
Ed77
November 11th, 2009
7:53 am
As an engineer, I admit I think in terms of design optimization. You usually can’t optimize for two criteria simultaneously. I supported our departure from the SEC to the ACC because the SEC was moving ever faster towards optimizing their football programs to win championships and away from training boys to become young men. Call me an idealist if you like but the football factories have made their choice and they can live with it. I understand that Tech has not exactly covered itself in glory in the past few years with our acedemic problems and extracurricular activites of some former players. However, I don’t ever want us to quit trying because of those relatively few failures.
Go Tech
willie martinez
November 11th, 2009
7:53 am
my high school defense will crush tech’s high school offense. 11 men in the box at all times.
willie martinez
November 11th, 2009
7:54 am
ed77, i wouldnt call you an idealist but i would call you a geek.
best, willie
Mulk
November 11th, 2009
7:55 am
If you are going to use Bama verses who they play to judge a conference then the SEC would be dead last. They don’t lose in the SEC often. The SEC might have a good conference but it is highly overated. How or why do you judge a conference instead of a team, anyway.
And, while on the subject, somebody (coaches, Ad’s, news reporters,fan bases, etc.) from the other conferences has got to stop this automatic National Championship assignment handed out to the winner of the SEC. Who said it should be automatic. The National Championship should be about the 2 best teams, and not because they played in the SEC. Furthermore, who said that a one-loss-SEC team deserves to be considered over every other conference winner or even one game loser?
Tech has a good offense and good coach but there are several teams in the ACC that could beat them. And, there is just as many teams in the ACC that could beat Bama and Fla. as there are in the SEC.
Jacketman
November 11th, 2009
7:56 am
#1Dawgafan—–Your team is 5-4, and you want to talk about Tech “barely beat”? Look at your “barely beats”. Just take SC and AZ State…not far at all from 3-6. Just to remind you, 3>2, 2>1, 1>0.
Larry
November 11th, 2009
7:57 am
I think that Teck’s offense can go against any team in the country. The problem is the defense. Until GT can get a top shelf defense, they will have problems being in the top five in the country.
GT Rules State
November 11th, 2009
7:57 am
ok big Willie, so where does that put UGA … pee wee?
Paul
November 11th, 2009
7:58 am
Why was this even written? What’s the point? Do you write articles like this MB about the falcons or braves? Nope. You have no way of knowing any of this and it’s meaningless to write since you don’t. And finally the sec has 3 ranked teams this year. It has refs keeping their top teams at the top. And an LSU team who has beaten not one ranked team. Yep that sure qualifies as a top conference. Retard
GT Rules State
November 11th, 2009
7:59 am
Pee wee Willie … how else does your imagination run? Loser
dgroy
November 11th, 2009
7:59 am
Ah Mark, Mark, Mark, Mark, Mark………To begin with, for the most part excluding Vandy, the SEC recruits football players to play in their football factories and they may, or may not, be real good students but, “They know how to play Football”. On the other hand we have the ACC who recruits Football Players who are, for the most part, “Good, smart Students” who also know how to “Play a little Football”. Now you might ask….”What is your point”? and my point is, “I don’t give a gnat’s a$$ if Georgia Tech could beat every team in the SEC on a regular basis, which, I agree, they can’t but, I would rather they play “With Class” in a Conference “With Class” than to play in the slime heavy SEC
calvin
November 11th, 2009
7:59 am
Unfortunately, sad to say, Tech is not that great. Every game
is a nail biter. Tech can’t dominate anyone. Wake Forest was
a near calamity. Anyone who thinks Duke will be a pushover is
crazy. Duke will pass all day, and Tech has little or no pass
defense. It’s great for Tech to be highly ranked, and for
Georgia to be unranked, but when the actual game is played, they
will be about equal, and Georgia is as likely to win as Tech.
Anyone who thinks Clemson can’t beat Tech is crazy. Clemson
beat Miami in Miami, and scored 27 straight points against Tech
in Atlanta. Tech would be more likely to beat its Orange Bowl
opponent, if it could get that far, than either Duke or Georgia
or Clemson. Tech’s ranking is pretty to see, but all it really
means is DANGER AHEAD. (Go Jackets; beat Dook, UGG, Clempson,
and win the Orange Bowl; then glory in the rankings.)
Tech '01
November 11th, 2009
8:00 am
Mark, I totally agree. I agree that Tech would be the fourth best team in the SEC and is the 5th best team in the nation, which is where I think Tech will end up in the final rankings.
Steve Davis
November 11th, 2009
8:00 am
I still remember the GT team that showed up for the Miami game. Abberation? No…..it’s in GT’s DNA.
willie martinez
November 11th, 2009
8:00 am
go tech
AZ Jacket
November 11th, 2009
8:00 am
I used to pull against UGA every weekend but now that the dawgs suck as a football team and having to listen to all the BS from the leg humpers it might be better if they won a few games just to shut them up. I hope that the UGA bloggers are not graduates of that fine Univeristy because you make some of the most lame brain comments I have ever heard. Yes we have some on the Tech side also and they have never seen the inside of a classroom or attended a game.
Rickety Bobo Willie
November 11th, 2009
8:01 am
Sounds logical Mark. What these fleabag fans don’t realize is last year is exactly that, LAST YEAR! Like the song says, “Yesterday is dead and gone”. Mutts went from pre season #1 last year to completely off the radar this year. Tech is trending up and UGA is, well, not trending UP!
willie martinez
November 11th, 2009
8:02 am
gt, my imagination, just like my defense runs wild.
TECHnician
November 11th, 2009
8:02 am
Mark, What you are not taking into account is that IF Tech were in the SEC, they would have SEC talent.
AZ Jacket
November 11th, 2009
8:03 am
Jacketman, you need to assist the UGA fan with your symbols. > means greater than.