The Hot Button: Where would Tech finish in the SEC?
There's a difference between ACC speed and SEC speed. (AJC photo by Curtis Compton)
It’s clear – to me, if not to C.J. Spiller and Dabo Swinney — that Georgia Tech is the class of the ACC. But the ACC is often described as the least of the six BCS leagues, and another conference in the neighborhood is regarded as the best. So now, today’s question:
Where would Tech rank in the SEC?
My first inclination is to say the Jackets would finish wherever Mike Slive’s refs got together and decided they should be, but that’s my little joke. Getting serious, I’d say …
Second in the East behind Florida. Third in the West behind Alabama and LSU. Fourth overall.
That wailing you hear are the cries arising from the confluence of North Avenue and Techwood Drive, but hear me out. As good as Tech is — and it is very good — there’s still a difference between the personnel of a top-shelf SEC team and of everyone else. (Ask Jim Tressel.) This doesn’t mean Tech couldn’t up and beat Florida or Alabama or LSU on a given Saturday; it simply means that, on most given Saturdays, talent would prevail.
We’ve seen the difference between the SEC and the ACC three times in this city in the past 15 months. Alabama beat Clemson in the 2008 Chick-fil-A Kickoff Classic and then whipped Virginia Tech in the 2009 installment. LSU beat Tech 38-3 on Dec. 31, 2008. Three games on a neutral field, three emphatic SEC victories. Anyone who says there isn’t an imbalance between leagues, at least at their respective summits, isn’t dealing in reality.
On the other hand, SEC zealots are wrong to suggest the Jackets would finish far up the track in that famous league. Tech is better than Ole Miss, better than Auburn, better than South Carolina, better than Arkansas … yes, better than Georgia. To be placed below Florida and Alabama is no great failing, for those are two of the three best teams in the land, and to be deemed less gifted than LSU is no demerit, given that the Tigers have lost only to the Gators and the Tide.
Loading ...(And yes, I have noticed that Tech beat both Mississippi State and Vandy by one more point than did the mighty Gators. Whatever that means.)
Since you asked, I don’t think it’s a question of Paul Johnson’s offense not working in the SEC. It’s an issue instead of the SEC’s Big Three having superior defensive manpower. Nobody else in the ACC has the speed to keep up with Dwyer and Nesbitt and Roddy Jones; certain teams in the SEC do.
OK, there’s my take. Feel free to call me an idiot — pretty much everybody does — but know this: I do speak from observation. I’ve seen Tech and Florida and LSU in person both this season and last, and I saw Alabama in the imposing flesh twice in 2008. And I’m not trying to denigrate the Jackets, who might well be the nation’s fifth-best team. (After Florida, Texas, Alabama and LSU. Though I’m not suggesting LSU, with its two losses, should be ranked ahead of Tech in the polls.) I’m just telling you how I see it.
You’re now free to express yourselves on this weighty matter. Why do I feel you won’t need prompting?
And now, because fair’s fair: Where would Georgia rank in the ACC?
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901 comments Add your comment
Pi$$onaDawg
November 11th, 2009
11:58 am
Crimson you do know BAMA finally agreed to play Tech in a few years right? The Vols still wil not play Tech. Tech Did play Auburn when Auburn was a top 5 team and we beat them Home and Away with Reggie Ball no less. HAHAHAH. I would like to play the gamecocks. Columbia is a nice town and a good trip. Ole Miss moved the game with a few more years away. What can TECH do to make a SEC team play us?
TELL me Crimson what can TECH do other than win our games and meet a better brand of SEC in a Bowl?
Crimson why didn’t you guys move the TECH game to next year when you found a spot for Ga. State HAHAHAHAHA you go you big bad Bama boy.
HBTD
November 11th, 2009
11:59 am
Pi$$onadawg. Of course you (as a fan) would like to play an SEC schedule. Duh!! It is the most competative and exciting brand of football in the country hands down. That’s what everyone’s be saying for the past several years (except for tech). Unfortunately for you and your tech bretheren, you get a steady dose of WF, Duke, Va and UNC when you’re not playing a D2 like Gardner Webb or Jax. State. It’s no wonder your school can only fill up about half the “crackerbox” with this kind of schedule. I understand your frustration and depression with that schedule, but unfortunatey for the tech fan, that’s what ya’ll are stuck with. I hear Bama is on the schedule in 2012 and of course UGA every other year, so that should give ya’ll some hope of being able to see a quality team come to town.
wiley
November 11th, 2009
11:59 am
I have a friend who smoke weed with current UGA players last summer…lets not get in this argument. Your dumb to think college students wouldnt…im sure you did in college.
dogone
November 11th, 2009
11:59 am
dawgs 32 and 12 against tech since 1965
why
November 11th, 2009
11:59 am
Mark, why do you cherry pick the 3 games in Atlanta? Compile the ACC vs. SEC head to head record for all games in 2008 and 2009.
Comparing 2 leagues of 24 teams by looking at 3 games? Why do I waste my time even reading these articles.
GT Nuke
November 11th, 2009
12:00 pm
A freind of mine at work put this comparison together, so I don’t want to take credit for it. but I think he does a good job of making the case for this year anyway.
If Tech played Georgia’s schedule it would result in the following (according to Sagarin’s predictor):
@ Ok St – 4 pt W
USCe – 14 pt W
@ Ark – 3 pt W
Ariz St – 16 pt W
LSU – 6 pt W
@ Tenn – 1 pt W
@ Vandy – 25 pt W (as seen this year)
Florida – 7 pt L
Tenn Tech – 45 pt W
Auburn – 12 pt W
Kentucky – 14 pt W
Georgia – 14 pt W (as you will see in a few weeks)
So Tech would be 7-1 and would finish 11-1 in the regular season if playing Georgia’s schedule.
By comparison, if Georgia played Tech’s schedule:
Jacksonville St – 11 pt W
Clemson – 6 pt L
@Miami – 10 pt L
UNC – 4 pt W
@Miss St – 4 pt L
@FSU – 5 pt L
VPI – 10 pt L
@UVA – 1 pt L
@Vandy – 9 pt W
Wake – 6 pt W
@Duke – 2 pt W
@Tech – 14 pt L
So Georgia would currently be 3-6 and would finish 5-7
tech rules
November 11th, 2009
12:01 pm
mark richt can’t even compete with tech!!!!!!!!!!!!!
friend at work..and gtnukedork
November 11th, 2009
12:03 pm
i think georgia beat vandy by 24…moron
BankerDawg
November 11th, 2009
12:03 pm
Perhaps it’s just blog hate, but I don’t understand the Nesbitt doubters that have surfaced.
If he finishes out the year at this pace, he will most likely be a dark horse Heisman candidate to begin next year.
Great kid. Seems to be a born leader. I can’t imagine what he’ll look like next year after another year in this system.
GOOOOOOOOOO DAWGS! SIC ‘EM!
Johnny Weissmuller
November 11th, 2009
12:03 pm
dogone
Dawgs are 0-1 against GT since Paul Johnson
Soon to be 0-2
Pi$$onaDawg
November 11th, 2009
12:04 pm
Crimson I think BAMA has Tech for a Home and Home in the coming years so then you can say whay you will then. Bama could have moved Tech to next year but Bama chose to take on the Powerhouse Ga. State Panthers in their first season. Crimson you do know Old Miss moved the games with Tech a few more years out in stead of next year. Auburn did a Home & Home and lost both when they were a top5 team and beat you HAHAHAHA.
HBTD
November 11th, 2009
12:05 pm
TT. In case you missed it, Mark Richt won 7 consecutive games against tech before suffering his first loss last year. Are all tech fans as clueless as you? I thought ya’ll were supposed to be a well educated lot.
GT_Paula
November 11th, 2009
12:05 pm
Tech would be .500 or better with every team except Alabama and Florida, and maybe win its division in a good year.
This week: Auburn 31, UGA 20. Just another UGA beatdown in a season of beatdowns.
dogone: re
November 11th, 2009
12:06 pm
dawgs are 31 and 13 against tech since 1965, not 32 and 12
Crimson nation
November 11th, 2009
12:06 pm
Wiley,
Then we may actually agree on something. My only point is that everyone schedules their fair share of scrubs and there are 3 ways of doing it. Ole Miss plays 4 pansies. That’s one way.
Bama plays one team that is elite in its conference and is usually 1st or 2nd(VT and Penn St) fit this bill and then plays 3 cupcakes. That’s a 2nd way.
Georgia and Tech both take the 3rd route. Neither plays an elite team that usually finished in the top 3 in its conference. But both play 2 decent middle tier teams from bcs conferences. Vandy is horrendous this year but MSU is an okay team despite their record. Plus Tech plays Georgia so I give them credit for playing 2 decent bcs conference names and 2 cupcakes in Vandy and Jax State.
The dawgs I actually think have one of the toughest schedules if not the toughest. They play one cupcake Tenn Tech and 3 decent middle tier teams in Arizona State, Okla state, and Tech. But things change in a year and Tech qualifies this year as an elite team within its conference and OK state may not be elite but they are certainly a solid 7-9 win team every year and ASU is also a decent program.
This to me is the 3rd route. Play 2 decent teams and 2 cupcakes. Tech has this schedule this year and Georgia just happened to have a year where they play one really good team in Tech, 2 decent teams, and one cupcake.
Most teams when you get down and look at it play one decent but not great team like a Okay state or ASU and play 3 cupcakes. To me this is the worst way to schedule but unfortunately there are a lot of teams both in the acc and sec who schedule this way. We should at least be able to agree on that.
A_GaSou_Eagle
November 11th, 2009
12:07 pm
To Ben Derover:
Yo, Athens just called me during class and said they are missing the village idiot. You should wake up from that ditch you passed out in and find your way back home.
To jdawg14:
What you obviously don’t understand (from your last comment) is that the term “2nd rate” appeals to more than winning football games. Yeah UGA has won a lot in recent seasons. They have also tried to steal the phrase “Criminoles” from Florida St. What kind of mindset does the coach instill on the players when they decide that they arent going to court just because they dont want to? Lack of discipline, lack of respect, arrest history, etc… is what makes UGA 2nd rate to GT as far as I can remember. Maybe UGA can invest in an NCAA football coach at the end of the year and fire this pop icon they have now.
facts straight
November 11th, 2009
12:07 pm
Dogone, yeah get your facts straight, lmao, give us jackets some credit!
GT_Paula
November 11th, 2009
12:07 pm
Georgia Tech 48, Duke 17. Count on it.
hilariously funny
November 11th, 2009
12:09 pm
its absolutely hilarious to listen to tech fans defend with one year a lifetime of beatings at the hands of the DAWGSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!
UGAIsSoLastYear
November 11th, 2009
12:10 pm
Alabama did not smash VT. And the GT-LSU game is not an indicator. We had beaten UGA in Athens. That was our bowl game. Playing in a meaningless game after that meant nothing. Play LSU in the regular season, year in and year out, and Johnson would win more than Miles – you can take that to the bank. Just as he will versus Richt. For those UGA fans that STILL don’t see this or recognize this, you are not really smart college football fans.
Benjamin
November 11th, 2009
12:10 pm
I would take Tech over LSU, so I’ll put them at the three spot. (I think Florida or Bama would take ‘em.)
Great blog piece, Mark.
UGAIsSoLastYear
November 11th, 2009
12:11 pm
It’s not about 1 year mr hilarious. It’s about a coach. And we have a winner! He is only beginning. Open your eyes poor boy.
Crimson nation
November 11th, 2009
12:13 pm
Pi$$onadawg,
We play Penn State next year which lately has been a top 1 or 2 team in its conference. To play Tech which is now an elite team within its conference and Penn State along with Florida who we pick up regular season next year along with our regular sec schedule is quite a lot to ask for. Who would want that schedule? Also, we granted Georgia State the game as a favor in the same way that Georgia plays Georgia Southern or Tech plays Jax state. It gives those lesser schools exposure in building their program and much more importantly gives them badly needed cash to build their program.
And while you can brag about beating Auburn home and home you must also remember Georgia was still whipping you in those years as well. Or did you forget that?
hilariously funny: re to mr. hilarious
November 11th, 2009
12:14 pm
yeah we have a winner…no way Georgia has any chance this year ..none….zilch..hang it up…..dawgs…..notta chance…go jackets
The RIddler
November 11th, 2009
12:14 pm
RIDDLE ME THIS BATMAN, Why do I keep making proclamations with no proof? One would think students not taking any courses at their institution of choice would be a hot item for media outlets.
A_GaSou_Eagle
November 11th, 2009
12:14 pm
hilariously funny:
Actually we defend with 4 times as many Nat’l titles as UGA, A Heisman memorial trophy named after our head coach, when we left the SEC we had more SEC titles than UGA (5 to 4), oh…
and fewer players arrested than UGA. Get some history schoolboy.
Pi$$onaDawg
November 11th, 2009
12:15 pm
If someone has the time can you findout the Tech lifetime record against the SEC and the UGA lifetime record against the SEC? I am just wondering. WAIT lets make Tech and UGA lifetime records against Bama, Florida, Tenn, LSU, and Auburn nobody in the SEC really matters after these teams anyway.
JacketFan
November 11th, 2009
12:15 pm
This big talk is fun and all, but I say save it for Nov. 28th. One thing I’m thankful for is that at least we get to actually play the game rather than hypothesizing “what if” as it pretains to Tech and UGAg.
Dawgs, you have owned us, for certain. One game at a time is all I’m saying. We won last year in a close one. This year, without the talent (e.g. Stafford and Moreno), you pups have no chance. It’s gonna be “All The Way Turnt Up” in The Flats. Joe Cox may even start crying.
Personally, I can’t wait to see Dwyer and Nesbitt put some poor Dawg LB on his back. Oh, and tell your DBs, those crack blocks are BRUTAL!
Go Jackets!
To Hell With Georgia … see you punks on North Avenue.
weneedaplayoff
November 11th, 2009
12:15 pm
When I read the title of the article, I thought it would be a story about Tennessee Tech…
I guess the better question is why none of the BCS conference schools is taking Boise State up on their offer to play. TCU v.Boise for the National Championship this year. Remember that Utah beat the Tide in a more convincing manner than the Gators last year.
Crimson nation
November 11th, 2009
12:16 pm
UGAissolastyear,
We rolled up 500 total yards to VTs 150. The only thing that kept them in the game was Bama miscues, penalties, turnovers, various mistakes. At the end of the game we were knocking on the door at the 12 13 yard line and we just ran out the clock. Had we needed to we could have put up another field goal or td and won by 13 or 17. It was a statistical asskicking session and the facts back it up.
Matt
November 11th, 2009
12:16 pm
It’s funny that such a pointless question generates 5 pages in a little over 2 hours.
Really, who the hell cares? Does it have any bearing on Tech or the SEC teams?
HBTD
November 11th, 2009
12:18 pm
UGAIsSoLastYear.
“GT-LSU game is not an indicator. We had beaten UGA in Athens. That was our bowl game.”
Oh!! That would explain the team rings and “State Champion” t-shirts. Hmmmm. What will you guys come up with next?? I can hardly wait!
GT
November 11th, 2009
12:19 pm
HBTD: Another win against UGA, from the looks of it
Jefferson
November 11th, 2009
12:19 pm
What would Mark Bradley do at the Macon Telegraph would be the correct anology.
CB969
November 11th, 2009
12:20 pm
It’s pretty funny that Techsters are comparing this team to the 1998 team. You may recall that they lost to Boston College and Florida State that season. If those two schools, had been members of the ACC, Georgia Tech would not have won the Conference title.
Suck it Nerd
November 11th, 2009
12:20 pm
I’d put Tech 3rd. I think they would hang with FL and BAMA. They just keep the ball for so much of the game that the opposing team has to make the most of their opportunities.
A_GaSou_Eagle
November 11th, 2009
12:21 pm
HBTD:
State Champ > (is greater than, if you didn’t know) County/City champ.
HBTD
November 11th, 2009
12:21 pm
Pi$$onaDawg.
“If someone has the time can you findout the Tech lifetime record against the SEC and the UGA lifetime record against the SEC? I am just wondering. WAIT lets make Tech and UGA lifetime records against Bama, Florida, Tenn, LSU, and Auburn nobody in the SEC really matters after these teams anyway.”
No idea where you’re heading with this one, but you sound desperate for something to try and make a meaningless point.
JacketFan
November 11th, 2009
12:22 pm
CB969 … urm, FSU joined the ACC in 1991. Thanks for playing, we have some lovely parting gifts for you.
Crimson nation
November 11th, 2009
12:23 pm
Pi$$onadawg,
Lifetime Alabama holds a winning head to head record against everyone in the sec and against UGA its 36-25 and against Tech its 28-21. I do know that if you look up each individual team’s record in the acc against the sec every single one of them I think except Tech has a losing record against the Sec.
You can look it up at stassen.com and view a team’s head to head record against other teams and against other conferences. I just looked it up. Only takes a second. Tech has an alltime record of .51 against the sec with a 177-169 record.
One other acc team like FSU might have a winning record against the sec but of the 12 acc teams I do know for a fact that at least 9 or 10 of them have losing records against the sec.
Pi$$onaDawg
November 11th, 2009
12:23 pm
TECH is I can’t beleive this but it is perfect. Tech’s record against Bama, Auburn, Florida, LSU, and Tenn is 115-115-15. Well then I Tech has a 50 50 chance against the Big Bad SEC teams. I will try to find UGA records now.
HBTD
November 11th, 2009
12:24 pm
GT_Paula
November 11th, 2009
12:07 pm
Georgia Tech 48, Duke 17. Count on it.
You really think it will be that close. It is Duke!!
A_GaSou_Eagle
November 11th, 2009
12:24 pm
CB969:
FSU WAS in the ACC that year. Game over. Insert more coins.
GT
November 11th, 2009
12:25 pm
I am the only one wondering where the hell the bama fan came from? Don’t you guys have your own newspapers/rivalries to deal with?
richtsPlugs
November 11th, 2009
12:25 pm
Has anyone checked out UF’s OOC schedule? How bout some cupcakes in the swamp!! How ’bout North Tex, FIU and Chatt for Bama?? – nothing like scheduling your patsies in Week 8,9,10… Stop beating up on the Sun Belt and migrate to the Pac-10 or the ACC.
GT is clearly better than any team in the SEC this year. C’mon MB – where’s your head?? Obviously Sagarin means nothing to you and your SEC popularity contest. GT vs UT for NCG!!
A_GaSou_Eagle
November 11th, 2009
12:25 pm
Crimson Nation:
YOu need to add in the Southern Conference too (predecessor to the SEC) because GT was in that, as well as the SEC before joining the ACC.
A_GaSou_Eagle
November 11th, 2009
12:27 pm
Crimson:
oh yeah and the Southern Intercollegiate Athletic Association which was before the Southern Conference.
Crimson nation
November 11th, 2009
12:27 pm
Gotta go and actually do some work but tonight I’ll look up each acc team’s record vs the sec and post it. Shouldn’t take but 5 minutes or so. I just looked up FSU vs the sec and alltime they are .40 winning % with a 44-66 record. I’ld be very surprised if there is anyone else in the acc that possibly has a winning record against the sec if FSU doesn’t. Possibly clemson given their dominance over S. carolina.
Tech75
November 11th, 2009
12:28 pm
S*** it Nerd – I am a bit less optimistic; I think it would depend on the first few possessions.
If Tech could get a lead, it would be tough to catch; however, the converse is true as well, given our weak D.
I think realistically Tech is somewhere between 7 and 12 in the rankings; just too inconsistent to portray us as a powerhouse yet.
However, if tech played its best game on both offense and defense, simultaneously, I do think we could hang with FL, and AL; TX I would still worry about, just because of the matchups when TX has the ball.
JacketFan
November 11th, 2009
12:28 pm
HBTD – yes, and it’s Duke coached by David Cutcliff and that has a tremendous passer in Thadeus Lewis. They’ll keep it close the first half and then Tech will take over the possession arrow in the 2nd, wear down the defense and score 21+ unanswered …
… the UGAg game will go along the same lines, excepting the part about keeping it close in the first half.
UGA 3 GA Tech 51
Count it!
Go Jackets!
To Hell With Georgia!