Bradley’s Buzz: Is there tension between Cox and Wren?
Esteemed former colleague Gordon Edes writes on Yahoo! Sports that a rift may have developed between Bobby Cox and Frank Wren. From Edes’ report:
“Another situation that bears watching is in Atlanta, where manager Bobby Cox has been hedging about whether he will be back. According to a major league source, the relationship between Cox and GM Frank Wren deteriorated during the spring to the point that Cox packed his bag and climbed into his car to drive home from spring training until dissuaded from doing so by one of his coaches.
“Cox was unhappy at the way the John Smoltz issue had been handled, the source said, and because he had not been kept up to speed on other personnel decisions. The relationship appears to have been patched up, although the parting with Tom Glavine was another strained episode, and the expectation is that Cox will be back because he’s excited that the Braves have another core of young talent developing. Stay tuned.”
Reached by phone Tuesday night, Wren described the report as “inaccurate.” But it’s fair to say that the relationship between Cox and Wren hasn’t been as seamless — to use a John Schuerholz word — as the one between Cox and Wren’s predecessor as GM. Cox and Schuerholz talked almost daily, even in the offseason, and rarely disagreed on anything.
That said, Cox was complimentary of Wren’s rebuilding work over the winter. “He’s done everything, really,” Cox said then, and this, it should be noted, came after Smoltz signed with Boston. But it also must be noted that even Schuerholz was so distressed by the way the Braves cut ties with Glavine that he offered an apology on behalf of the organization.
Asked Tuesday if he wanted Cox to remain the Braves’ manager, Wren said: “Sure, absolutely.” And this: “We’ll sit down and talk, and we’ll have an announcement at the appropriate time.”
Update: Bobby Cox responds to the Yahoo! report.
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159 comments Add your comment
AUG24
September 22nd, 2009
8:37 pm
It is time for Cox to go. Wren has done a good job of rebuilding the pitching staff. The decisions on Glavine and Smoltz weren’t handled properly but they seem to be the best “business decisions.” Tommy Hanson took Glavine’s spot in the rotation, so no argument there. I love John Smoltz but Boston saw enough. Greg Maddux didn’t whine when the Braves didn’t offer him a contract.
Jurrjens4NLCY {Knoble.MLBlogs.com}
September 22nd, 2009
8:42 pm
Thanks for stirring the pot Bradley, you can crawl back under your hole now…
The Grinch
September 22nd, 2009
8:42 pm
Let’s hope the announcement will happen right after the post season that Cox kept us out of, and it will involve the hiring of a new manager not named Terry Pendleton. I DO hope Cox stays on in some capacity; he’s a fine fellow and I don’t want to see him unceremoniously sent packing. Just for god’s sake keep the lineup card and in game decision making out of his control. Maybe he could replace Chip Carey in the booth and we’d really be in business.
Jurrjens4NLCY {Knoble.MLBlogs.com}
September 22nd, 2009
8:43 pm
Lol. Just kidding, It just popped into my head, I’m sorry…
Black pot
September 22nd, 2009
8:44 pm
Keep stirring … .keep stirring
QuickQuestion_Maggie
September 22nd, 2009
8:45 pm
…and NOBODY from the esteemed Atlanta reporting corp noticed that…or bothered to report that? The manager is in his car ready to go to Adairsville, – and that’s not newsworthy? Hmmmmmmm…..
Gov Clinton Tyree
September 22nd, 2009
8:46 pm
Wow. Mark, how credible is Gordon Edes? Why haven’t we heard anything about this prior to now?
I think Wren is a far better talent evaluator than he is a PR or relationship person, but this is surprising. Quite frankly, I think Frank may have a better reason to be upset with Bobby than Bobby with Frank, since a team with this kind of pitching ought to be in the playoffs.
No, he wasn’t smooth in dealing with Glavine or Smoltz, but honestly, does anyone think maybe the players’ personalities had anything to do with the rift? Wren made the tough decisions.
Might be time to make one with Bobby. Doubt he will; doubt he could even if he wanted to. Still, this is surprising.
The Grinch
September 22nd, 2009
8:46 pm
Btw, Mark; I’m impressed with your intestinal fortitude lately. Atlanta was (and still is) the softest media town in the entire country, but you’ve been the first to come out and say what everyone else in the state has been screaming forever: Cox and Willie Martinez need to go. Willie, however, does NOT need ceremony, nor the offer to stay on in some capacity. Just a swift kick in the #$% onto a one way bus.
Mark Bradley
September 22nd, 2009
8:48 pm
I wouldn’t call someone an esteemed former colleague if I didn’t have high regard for that person. Gordon Edes is a real pro who has worked at the L.A. Times, the Boston Globe, the National — and the AJC.
AUG24
September 22nd, 2009
8:50 pm
Frank Wren has a little Thomas Dimitroff in him. They both remove “the emotion” when they make decisions. The one big mistake that Wren made was giving Chipper that 42 million extension. He won’t last two more years as an everyday player. Maybe, Chipper will take a salary cut to help sign his buddy “La Roche.” That will be interesting.
AUG24
September 22nd, 2009
8:51 pm
Mark, do you think the Braves will resign LaRoche?
Mark Bradley
September 22nd, 2009
8:54 pm
And Governor, I’d contend that the Smoltz and Glavine situations were different. Smoltz chose to sign with another team. The Braves seemed in a hurry to cut Glavine when I’m not sure they had to be. They met with him before a game and announced he’d been cut an hour later. Even if the decision was correct — and it was — they could have taken a bit more time and care.
Herschel Talker
September 22nd, 2009
8:55 pm
Let’s hope there’s some tension. Then maybe Wren will FIRE BOOBY!!!
buckhead benny
September 22nd, 2009
8:56 pm
This has been Bobby Cox’s worst year and it is time for him to go- He is incapable of managing without his emotions and has become too much of a players coach. He got away with it when 3 hall of fame pitchers had his back- he could get away with it- He can’t anymore- It is too much of a chess match dictatated on shrewd moves such as Frank Wren-
Everything Frank Wren has done in my opinion has been masterful- Cutting Smoltz and Glavine- Masterful- Replaced with Vasquez, Lowe, Kamacoochi, and Hanson- then Adam Laroche, Nate Mclouth, even trading Francouer for Church- This is a much better team because of him not Bobby-
We would only be one game out if Bobby would have let Hanson pitch the 9th and Hanson would be rookie of the year- That was an easy decision- hanson hadn’t even reached 100 pitches and was totally dominant-
This is where Bobby messed up and we would have clinched the division- 1.Playing Jordan Shafer almost every ball game for a half a season when it was clear he was a lost puppy in the majors- Why not just give away 4 outs every single game (any body that could at least work the count) = 3 extra wins
2. Kelly Johnson- for whatever reason it was apparent to everyone after a quarter of the season if not early that Kelley was too easy an out for opponents and you had better options backing him up with Martin Prado and Omar infante- This decision should have been made much sooner= 4 extra wins with a better bat at the beginning of the lineup that can take pitches and get on base-
3. Jeff Francouer- I understand trying to show confidence in Jeff so maybe he would get back on track- he should have platooned him at least with Matt Diaz- =3 extra wins
Since the above have been switched out this has been a much better lineup and I personally don’t believe Bobby Cox had anything to do with it- I believe Jeff Francouer, Kelly Johnson, and even Jordan Shafer would still be in your starting lineup if not for Frank Wren.
My point is this- its not a popularity contest and if Bobby had the balls and would have done it sooner the Braves would be sitting in the playoffs. their only 5 games out with the number 3 pitching staff in baseball it could have been done if he would have addressed arguably the 3 easiest outs in all of baseball at the time- francouer, kelley johnson, and jordan shafer along with your pitcher the opposing team had 4 easy outs every single game- You can only afford one easy out a game in addition to your pitcher MAX-
Bobby got away with it when you have Maddux, Smoltz, and Glavine giving up 1-2 runs every game- He won’t be able to it again-
Tim and Jim
September 22nd, 2009
8:56 pm
MR WREN please bring back Garrett Anderson for next year, he has done a good job for us this year.
AUG24
September 22nd, 2009
8:59 pm
I totally agree with Buckhead Benny. Well, said.
Gov Clinton Tyree
September 22nd, 2009
9:02 pm
Point taken on Glavine and Smoltz, Mark. Actually, I think the mistake with Glavine was signing him at all. With Smoltz, I hang that one on the player. He wasn’t worth more than $2.5m guaranteed and Wren made the offer he should have within the bounds of fiscal responsibility. But I still love him and am glad he figured it out with the Cards.
The Red Sox seem to be having some problems getting guys to perform up there. You’d think somebody up there would have figured out Smoltz was tipping his pitches. He was throwing 93 and his splitter was splitting and his slider was sliding…Lugo isn’t the turd he appeared to be…maybe they could have used a bat like LaRoche’s…
Any chance Jason Bay doesn’t resign with them?
it's time
September 22nd, 2009
9:02 pm
Bobby Cox has been a great manager over the years, but it is time for a new direction. With all the starting pitching they have this year, they have under achieved. And don’t get me going on Cox’s use of that great pinch hitter Greg (no hit) Norton…………
Realist
September 22nd, 2009
9:05 pm
In a fight between frank wren and bobby cox, I’ll root for more flooding.
JASon
September 22nd, 2009
9:08 pm
It is a D-I-S-G-R-A-C-E that this team is not in the playoffs, and Bobby is primarily the one to blame. Wren, on the other hand, did a brilliant job this season.
JTH
September 22nd, 2009
9:09 pm
“No, he wasn’t smooth in dealing with Glavine or Smoltz, but honestly, does anyone think maybe the players’ personalities had anything to do with the rift? Wren made the tough decisions.”
That’s right on the money. Glavine and Smoltz are the super competitive bulldog types in everything they do, and Wren is a cool, rational business first decision maker. Fire and Ice. It was bound to get ugly with hurt feelings all around. Especially Cox’s with his loyal to fault personality.
In the end though it will all work out. The Braves rotation for next year will once again be one of the best in baseball. I’d rather have Hanson and Jair than Smoltz and Glavine at this point in time.
If the Braves get a big bat or two and a better bench they can be serious contenders next season.
Gov Clinton Tyree
September 22nd, 2009
9:11 pm
JTH, if the Braves get One Big Bat, they can take it to the house.
This is a damn good team, just ran out of time. Couldn’t outrun that first half.
RC35
September 22nd, 2009
9:13 pm
When we look at the Braves, we’re sort of like the old story of the blind men feeling the elephant–we all start at different places. Someone mentioned Greg Maddux “not whining”. Remember that Greg got arbitration–and $14 million for his last year as a Brave, as I recall. Then, he signed a lucrative contract elsewhere and continued to pitch until last year. Smoltz and Glavine were both treated with contempt unbecoming the Atlanta legends they had been. Smoltz was offered a subpar contract for someone of his status and it boggles the mind to think how much better off we could have been with him in the bullpen instead of Soriano. I know he had a rough stretch with the Sox, but most of the runs scored against him came after the 4th inning–something a one-or two-inning reliever wouldn’t face. Glavine did everything he was asked to do, going through rehab and the whole bit, then was dropped unceremoniously like a .150 pinch-hitter. No–they KEPT the .150 pinch-hitter–I keep forgetting!
Baseball is both a sport and a business, but from the fan side, emotion is an inescapable component of the big picture. Mr. Wren seems to keep himself aloof from any relationship with the fans and never seems to evince any sense of sympathy with our feelings for the team or individual players. No one could make everybody happy, but he could at least make a few public statements to fans acknowledging our existence, or respond to signed letters such as the one I wrote him in April. At the moment, I’d recommend him for the Marie Antoinette “Let Them Eat Cake” Award for being out of touch with his clientele.
I am glad that the Atlanta sports writers are suddenly willing to discuss the future of the manager and front office. It needs to be in the public square for commentary, and I appreciate the opportunity to weigh in.
NRBQ
September 22nd, 2009
9:13 pm
Bobby’s leaving?
This has been my hope since his catastrophic mismanagement of the ‘91 World Series.
Long-suffering? That’s me.
buckhead benny
September 22nd, 2009
9:13 pm
Another pt- Frank Wren should be GM of the year in my opinion he has took a horrible pitching staff and made some incredibly unpopular moves and they have equaled not only short term success for the Braves (3rd lowest era in the majors is not an easy accomplishment in one year) and retooled First base, Second Base, Left Field, Center Field, and Right Field.
His worst decision in my opinion has been signing Dereck Lowe and even that isn’t bad- and we didn’t give up any of our farm system to do it-
I know everyone loves Bobby and including me, but 4 years of not making the playoffs just because you don’t want to retire and hang out with your wife every day. Don’t hold us hostage to this bulls–t.
If anybody really thinks that when Bobby put in his lineup and at the top you had j shaffer- .200
kelley johnson- .205. j. francouer, .245- and your pitcher? how do you expect to win games with a lineup like that- Everyone knows that are starting pitchers should have more wins- Blame Bobby for playing his favorites every game and worried that Jeff Francouer would cried his eyes out if he was benched-
brent a.
September 22nd, 2009
9:15 pm
Not sure how Bradley is “stirring the pot”. Edes wrote the article in question, not Bradley.
Bradley, OTOH, went to Wren and asked him about the report and got a response.
Really vicious stuff, here, on the part of Bradley.
BeachBum
September 22nd, 2009
9:16 pm
Cox needs to hang it up and head to the golf course. He gets thrown out of every other game and his teams lack a bunch of things that managers should teach. Hire a younger manager who knows the current game. 1 title in 20 years is not going to cut it.
Herschel Talker
September 22nd, 2009
9:17 pm
MB – excellent points on Smoltz and Glavine. Nevertheless, in the end they were the right decisions (despite the manner in which the Glavine one was done, which could have obviously been better). This is more example of Cox’s loyalty to his players. It’s admirable in the cases of Glavine and Smoltz, gamers who were here a long time. But he carries his loyalty shenanigans too far with everyone else, and it has cost the team dearly. That is why Booby has to go.
Gov Clinton Tyree
September 22nd, 2009
9:19 pm
brent, what I don’t like is that we’ve got beat writers and I would think that if Bobby packed his car and was ready to leave until somebody (Chino? Eddie? Hub?) talked him out of it, SOMETHING should have come out before September. And in the AJC, not from a national guy. That’s a little harsh, but that’s how I see it.
TB
September 22nd, 2009
9:24 pm
Mark, you rattle off those newspaper names like they’re something to be proud of….
JTH
September 22nd, 2009
9:27 pm
Give MB a bigger spoon.
Bobby’s managing this year was bad, even for him and I’d agree that he’s the reason we didnt make the playoffs. The first half wait and see with certain guys. Then the just awful bullpen decisions, and Norton. Bam! Zoom!
kenneth
September 22nd, 2009
9:37 pm
Glavine was done and it was time for Smoltz to go. I bet Cox will be upset if Wren doesn’t re-sign Greg Norton too! If he packed up and left spring training they should have let him go. The organization isn’t going to fall apart if he leaves. All these so called professionals ( Glavine, Smoltz, now Cox, and sometimes even Chipper) who make millions of dollars and whine about everything that doesn’t go their way.
Anybody that plays Norton as much as Cox does and runs players off who have a pulse and don’t do things the Braves way, shouldn’t be complaining about personnel moves.
Reid Adair
September 22nd, 2009
9:45 pm
Does anyone honestly think it isn’t at least possible, if not likely, that this is true? Frank Wren put together a pitching staff that was great for 2009, but will not be in tact for 2010 (I think more than one of this year’s starters will be gone). I won’t even start with the “offense” options that Wren gave Cox.
I am not surprised that Wren denied any issues with Cox when asked. Wren has lied to the public and the fans before; this is nothing new for him.
It won’t surprise me a bit if Cox calls it quits after 2009, and it will disappoint me that he has too much class to express his disdain for Wren when he does walk away.
Sonny Clusters
September 22nd, 2009
9:47 pm
If he’d crunk that car and drove off the Braves might be in the playoffs. We was never sure why somebody’d want to be GM and not be able to hire his own manager.
Poorbrave
September 22nd, 2009
9:47 pm
Bobbys excited that the Braves have a core of young Talent developing…………….may stay?
That’e one of the reasons Bobby needs to go home. There will always be young talent in system. Bobby don’t need to screw them up. For the love of the Lord please retire BC. Enough is enough.
Man why didn’t they let him leave in Spring training and we would have done better this year.
Frank let him leave or move him upstairs but let his a@@ be gone. I pray.
Kevrock/Smarty Jones
September 22nd, 2009
9:48 pm
At first I thought some of Wren’s moves were terrible BUT it turned out he knew more than all of us. His moves were excellent as the team had showed. Now for Bobby Cox it’s been over 10 years since we should have moved him upstairs. Seriously, Bozo the clown could have won with Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz and Avery (before he blew his arm out). The Braves are really just REGULAR SEASON Dynasty. Our division was a joke for 7 years. When you get used to losing in the playoffs it is time to get a brimstone manager to light some fires. Leyland would have won us 2 more World Series. Folks it’s just the facts. Now for the Gordon Edes. He is a EXCELLENT scribe for baseball. He is a legit source and one day might make the hall in the writer section.
Poorbrave
September 22nd, 2009
9:52 pm
Frank Wren should be GM of the Year!
Now hire your own manager and finish the job.
Colossas
September 22nd, 2009
9:52 pm
The Braves beat writers writing anything remotely negative! PULLEEESE!
willie
September 22nd, 2009
9:53 pm
I am very glad to hear that Cox was not happy with the way Smoltz and Glavine were treated. It’s not that the Braves should have brought them back, it is the way they handled both cases. Very cold. I didn’t like it at all, and glad to hear Cox didn’t either.
Sonny Clusters
September 22nd, 2009
9:55 pm
We did a little free lancing at the Globe and we can tell you it’s a pretty good rag. That said, even the Weekly Reader would report the manager getting in his car to go home. Frank Wren should not be saddled with a nose picking manager. Frank wears expensive suits and no one wants to get a booger on a nice suit. Let’s hope Bobby will heed the discontent from the new homeboy upstairs and move his act to the puppy farm.
Used to care
September 22nd, 2009
10:02 pm
That is a true story about spring training.
Used to care
September 22nd, 2009
10:03 pm
Unless it’s not.
CJ Dawg
September 22nd, 2009
10:05 pm
Cox could stick his finger in his ear and pull out more class than Wren has in his whole life. I stick with BC all the way.
Stoph
September 22nd, 2009
10:05 pm
Wren is an A-hole. He’s botched the dealings with future HOF Glavine and Smoltz. He’s too cocky for the likes of Atlanta and the Braves. If he screws up the deal with – yet another future HOF – Cox, I say we run his butt out of town and let him go join up with Dancing with the “not so famous” stars.
Dr. Phil
September 22nd, 2009
10:06 pm
Frank Wren has a little Mike Adams in him, however the trade for Roache was a good one.
Sonny Clusters
September 22nd, 2009
10:07 pm
We was noticing that Matt Diaz runs pretty hard to first base. Doesn’t anybody holler, “easy” to him? We was thinking when an infielder bobbles a ball the runner might be safe if he’s running all out. When we was playing ball Coach would always tell us to run through the base and watch the base coach. Reading this story about Bobby getting in his car to come home from spring training takes a little away from the lucky underpants story. We was waiting to hear some more about Brian McCann getting hurt. Did he see lightning bugs like Chipper?
NO MORE BOBBY
September 22nd, 2009
10:08 pm
Sounds like Wren is going to give Bobby one more year and nothing else. Can we go ahead and just offer the nothing else now?
Ocee
September 22nd, 2009
10:10 pm
Enter your comments here
Frank Wren may be a good baseball man, but I question his professionalism. Smoltz and Glavine didn’t deserve to be treated the way they were by Frank Wren. Mr. Wren sure didn’t show professionalism at the state baseball playoffs last year.
Capitol Avenue Cal
September 22nd, 2009
10:10 pm
I have to agree with CJ Dawg…until someone proves differently, Bobby’s the man.
njbraves
September 22nd, 2009
10:16 pm
Posts, claiming Bobby is the reason this team isn’t going to the playoffs, are laughable. I guess it has nothing to do with all the games the offense didn’t show up for. Some of the people on here are too dumb for their own good.
torre
September 22nd, 2009
10:18 pm
Enter your comments here
Fire the coach who talked him into staying!
White Blood Cells
September 22nd, 2009
10:23 pm
Mark,
Regarding your 8:54 post. I kind of disagree. They were giving Glavine as much time as they could to prove he could still pitch. Glavine was delayed an additional 2 weeks when he injured himself swinging a bat. The organization simply could not pay him an additional 1 million dollars to continue his rehab. I’m sure during the meeting this was explained and they probably offered him a nice celebration which I bet he declined.
Rob
September 22nd, 2009
10:25 pm
Goodbye Bobby!
Yes he’s won a bunch of games but can’t coach when it counts. Torre or LaRussa would have hand a handful of World Champion rings instead of only one.
Philthy
September 22nd, 2009
10:26 pm
As a life long Braves fan, I have to admit, I’d like to see Bobby retire. But hear me out; It’s not that I dont like him. Bobby is (at least partially) responsible for the legacy of Atlanta baseball. The recent years have provided a changing of the gaurd for the organization. With Wren stepping in and Schuerholz stepping down, it was only a matter of time before other “Big” changed would be made (either by force or decision) I believe with the core of young players that Atlanta currently employs, keeping a manager that we know for a fact wont be coaching much longer is only a mistake. It’s my Band-Aid theory; The faster it’s done, the quicker the pain subsides. I believe the sooner Bobby steps down and a new manager is hired, the sooner every fan can start to truly beleive in a winning team. Sure would be nice to hang another 14 straight division banners around the house that Cox built.
Bill Heller
September 22nd, 2009
10:29 pm
Bobby Cox doesn’t have anything to prove – and Frank Wren does.
CLIFF
September 22nd, 2009
10:30 pm
It is past time for a managerial change.Maybe Tony Larussa.I hear he might be available
PMC
September 22nd, 2009
10:44 pm
It is difficult to progress when one foot is squarely in the past while the other attempts to move forward.
Mitch C
September 22nd, 2009
10:49 pm
Mark, while I know I’ve been posting on here that I feel this should be Bobby’s last year, I’m beginning to think that the “Dump Bobby” kick is getting a little too much, for all of us.
Lest us not forget, that whether Bobby decides to retire, or is not offered a contract for 2010, our new manager, whoever he is, will not win fourteen straight division titles, over 2000 games, and Manager of the Year multiple times. I do think that the Braves definitely underachieved this year, and should have won the wild card, but it seems to me that the writers and fans bantering on here, should be reserved for a team that should have won the division, and ended up losing 100 games. This team was picked to finish second, or third, behind the Phillies, and maybe, the Metsm had they stayed healthy. As it will turn out, we will likely finish in the mid to high 80s for wins, and nearly fifteen games better than last year.
I know this is a sports blog, and that we’re all going to debate this ad nasueam, 100 ways to Sunday, but, maybe, just maybe, after over twenty years at the helm, fourteen straight division titles, more than 2000 wins, etc, does Bobby deserve for us to let him finish out the season as best he can, before we write every day musing whether he’s not going to have a job next year?
If you think I’m wrong, tell me, Mark, but I’m just wondering if we’re all spinning this a little too much, considering that if Bobby does leave, it is not like any average manager departing, considering his accomplishments, and just maybe, we should wait, until something actually does happen, and he is gone, if thats the case, to spin it round and round.
Frank Schilling
September 22nd, 2009
10:50 pm
Enter your comments here
I think both Bobby and Chipper will both be back for one more year – then retire together. The Braves look too good next year for either of them to go and don’t see the Cox getting fired; Scheuerholtz won’t let it happen.
Deacons10
September 22nd, 2009
10:51 pm
Wren is ajackass who has gotten lucky with some of the moves he has made. I agree that it is time for Bobby to move on but he has earned another year. Braves will finish with around 90 wins which is excellent. Losing in April with Johnson, and Schaefer is not why they are 5 back today. How about getting swept at home by the Reds?
Yes Wrenn put together a solid team but think about where we would be if he had gotten Furcal, or if San Diego had agreed to trade Peavey for Escobar and a host of others. The Braves overpaid for Lowe and Kawakami and now they have a big decision to make beacuse I don’t think either are tradeable without the Braves eating a considerable amount of their remaining salaries (won’t happen), which means to get a decent OF Bat PLUS resiging LaRoach (Braves are absoltuely stupid if they don’t do this even though he doesn’t start hitting until mid-June) and either Gonzo or Soriano, you probably have to trade Huddy and possibly even Vazquez to free enough money assuming the team payroll remains at $97 million for 2010. Remember that Diaz, Chipper and McCann will get raises as well, not to mention the other arbitration players.
Sunshine
September 22nd, 2009
10:52 pm
Can someone please fire the donk?! We cant get rid of this guy!
Meanwhile...a fly in the ointment
September 22nd, 2009
10:53 pm
Mark we appreciate the scoop from your esteemed colleague, especially as it seems to put you and/or the AJC in a bit of a pickle.
Hate to be a fly in the ointment here, but I can imagine some AJC critics saying you guys sat on this story.
I don’t see that myself, but it does beg the question, how did the AJC reporters not have their ear on the ground on this one?
Has this tension, or more to the point, this story been alluded to previously in the AJC? I’m not saying it’s on par with, for example, a San Francisco reporter not noticing that Barry Bonds didn’t get along with some of his teammates, but it does seem to indicate a gap in the AJC’s coverage analogous to putting Klesko in right, and say Terry Forster in center.
Well maybe not quite that bad, but certainly you can see why the readers would wonder about this.
Bravedawg
September 22nd, 2009
10:56 pm
Mark – what was the apology Schuerholz gave to Glavine on behalf of the organization? I never heard/saw anything about that and I follow the Braves closely. Did I miss something?
Reid Adair
September 22nd, 2009
11:04 pm
Bravedawg, it happened not long after the announcement that they were releasing Glavine.
http://blogs.ajc.com/furman-bisher-blog/2009/06/05/glavine-deserved-better-from-braves/
FEAR
September 22nd, 2009
11:04 pm
Like some other people on here. Why was a story about Cox almost leaving during sprin training brought up by a national reporter and on top of that almost 6 months later? Other than MB, (been kicking some ass lately) the ajc sports writers seem to still be writing for their high school rag. Cox needs to go. Not after 2010 or 2011. NOW! The game has passed him. Even the most casual observer can see that. Wren wants towin the big one and he knows that with Bonehead Cox that isn’t going to happen.
zzzzzzzzz
September 22nd, 2009
11:08 pm
First, bloggers…hit the back space button and you won’t have ‘enter your comment here’ at the beginning of your post. Secondly, nice job, Mark. Edes worked in Athens at the National, serving pizza? Really? Seriously, Bobby is a HOF er, no doubt. He’s won too many games to be otherwise. But any manager who goes 4 years without getting his guys into the postseason is a candidate to be relieved. Bobby gets more time because of his accomplishments here, but not four years worth. I truly believe that his handling of the bullpen this year cannot be defended. I also believe his handling of Shafer, KJ and Norton cannot be defended. He obviously saw talent in Frenchy (hitting 280 now, for the season, by the way) and gave him every opportunity but just couldn’t get it out of him, so I’ll give him a pass for French. The rest, though? Sorry, four years is too long.
Darren Holmes
September 22nd, 2009
11:09 pm
Mark…
Can you finally tell us what you know of what went down in 2002, specifically why, in your view, Glavine was justified in leaving? I know it’s not on point here, but some of us are quite curious.
Father of 5
September 22nd, 2009
11:09 pm
When the Braves fire Wren, I’ll start taking my family to games again. The guy sold his soul this year to put together the “masterful” pitching staff — and the team never got into contention for the playoffs. His poor decisions outlined above have hit him at the box office, and Wren needs to own up.
Every other team realized that Lowe was a solid #3 starter, but Wren paid him like an ace — and the Braves still owe him $45M over the NEXT THREE YEARS. Guaranteed. And times are tight. Even the Mets wouldn’t pay that. Wren mortgaged the future and hamstrung the team for years to come. Sure, Vasquez had a career year, but he is still a .500 pitcher. He ain’t Cliff Lee — or even Pedro Martinez. Vasquez makes $12M and he cost us good prospects to get him. Where did that get us?
Bobby is absolutely right to disagree with Wren’s moves — anything left would be a sign of senility setting in. Only one of those guys is going to the HOF, and my loyalty (and confidence in baseball matters) is with that guy.
Cox Supporter, BRAVES Supporter
September 22nd, 2009
11:11 pm
Burn in Hell, Wren !
Jack
September 22nd, 2009
11:14 pm
For more than a decade, Bobby Cox was unquestioned as among the best managers in baseball. The Braves continued winning even after they started reducing payroll, but now those cuts have caught up to the Braves. You seemed to realize Cox’s exceptional success a few weeks ago when you said that he was a good manager but not a right manager — an argument containing remarkably stretched and contradictory logic for a professional writer.
Mark Bradley, it’s as though you have a vendetta against Bobby Cox. Alternatively, you have a serious lack of creativity in column and blog topics. Either your professional integrity or ability is in question after the relentless assault for no apparent reason.
DP
September 22nd, 2009
11:20 pm
Frank Wren has made some good moves but he has made a bad one or two and got lucky that a few bad offers he made weren’t accepted. He overpaid for Derek Lowe, 4 years & $60 million for a 36 year old who has never been a #1 pitcher. The chances of moving Lowe and the last 3 years of his contract are about nil. He got extremely lucky that A.J. Burnett, Griffey Jr. and Furcal turned down offers as all would have been bad deals.
FEAR
September 22nd, 2009
11:23 pm
Cox defenders always say that you can’t blame bobby when the bullpen gives up runs, or when the offense doesn’t deliver etc. Well the same can be said for when the Braves were on top. Bobby cox wasn’t the sole reason we won 14 in a row. People talk like he was.
Base
September 22nd, 2009
11:30 pm
Wren is a corporate man so he is cutthroat nno surprise he is hard to work for.
Mark Bradley
September 22nd, 2009
11:34 pm
My view was that the Braves succeeded in making Glavine mad enough to leave. Whether he was justified in his anger, I can’t say. But to me he was Mr. Brave in a way Maddux and even Smoltz were not, and his leaving served notice that the era of good feeling had come to an end.
Hillbilly Deluxe
September 22nd, 2009
11:40 pm
My guess is that when Bobby Cox goes, whenever that is, it’ll be like Glavine and Smoltz, kicking and screaming. I don’t think he’ll ever walk away on his own.
Joe
September 22nd, 2009
11:43 pm
Bobby Cox isn’t the problem it’s the braves payroll issues face it they don’t have the money to spend like say Phila or NY Mets. If the Mets didn’t have so many injuries this year the braves would be in 3rd place right now behind the philies and mets. Once the braves start spending money on offense they are going to struggle they have good pitching but they need to get some hitters to give them some offense.
Mitch C
September 22nd, 2009
11:48 pm
Mark, I’m sure you’ve heard about John Scherholtz’s book, Built to Win, in which he states that the Braves did in fact make Glavine a 10 million a year, two or three year offer. (I dont recall whether it was two or three years). Glavine left because the Mets gave him more years.
At the time Glavine left, I was furious with him, because he was leaving a team that at the time had won eleven straight division titles, to go to a team that had finished in last place in 2002. I’ll admit I gained satisfaction watching him struggle in New York, while the Braves won the division without him from 2003 to 2005. I was thrilled when he returned to Atlanta in 2008. I only wish his pitching had been better in his homecoming.
I do agree with you that the team deterioriated after he left, in spite of the three division titles afterwards. Glavine was a guy you would have hoped would have been a Brave for life, and it didnt happen. Hopefully, whatever happens with Bobby, 2009 will be the beginning of an ascendance for this team, after three years of deterioration.
Joe
September 22nd, 2009
11:48 pm
I got a good idea the next Braves coach should be Mike Maddux and Greg Maddux should be the pitching coach. Bring Dave Justice in to be the hitting coach and Brian Jordan can be the bench coach.
Sunshine
September 22nd, 2009
11:49 pm
What has Bobby done for me lately? The one WS is cute, but even the Florida Marlins have won more in a shorter time frame than the years Bobby has been coaching. FIRE BOOBY NOW!
unbelievable
September 22nd, 2009
11:52 pm
its time to get past this whole JS, Cox, Mddux, Smoltz, Glavine era. We have a exciting bunch to watch now if Wren can keep most of it intact and its time to have someone new in the dugout managing this group (Fredi G maybe?)
unbelievable
September 22nd, 2009
11:52 pm
Herbie congrats, you’re an idiot
Sunshine
September 22nd, 2009
11:59 pm
F bomb Herbie, I would love to go roof for G Braves, but im not sure what roof is?
Coach (2010 or Bust)
September 23rd, 2009
12:07 am
Hell, I knew abut this months ago.
Lets just say I have a “Friend” who works for a large Georgia newspaper in a “sports capacity” who told me about the less than congenial relationship between Frank Wren and Bobby Cox. One major disagreement between the two of them was and still is: Yunel Escobar. Cox wanted to trade the young SS and almost got his wish this past off season.
Blake W.
September 23rd, 2009
12:12 am
I think it is hilarious that some of the people on this blog lavish praise on the team that Frank Wren put together in the offseason and blame Bobby Cox for starting the season with Jordan Schafer in centerfield and Jeff Francouer in right field?!? Is it just me or was it Frank Wren who wanted to add starting pitching and a power hitting outfielder?!? When he finally followed through…Bobby Cox has managed the team to a great second half record.
It is ridiculous and I question if alot of the people on this site are Braves fans if we are going to side with Frank Wren who has been dismissed from prior jobs because of his inability to get along with others (i.e. another Hall of Famer Cal Ripken) instead of the guy who has committed most of his career to creating a ballclub that the city of Atlanta can be proud of.
Bobby Cox has single handedly built this franchise and the idea that he should leave so that Frank Wren doesn’t have to be insecure because he is not the most accomplished man in the room is not worthy of this franchise.
Bobby Cox built this franchise before Frank Wren walked into the lap of luxury and if Bobby wants to be, he should be there when Frank Wren’s act wears thin and he is kicked to the curb.
itpdude
September 23rd, 2009
12:24 am
The info may be good, but one thing is for sure: Yahoo writers suck.
unbelievable
September 23rd, 2009
12:46 am
Blake, so what your saying is a great 2nd half record and a 4th straight yr being out of the playoffs is okay by you because Bobby used to be a great manager? Im sorry, but I think real braves fans want to get back to the playoffs and understand that it starts with a mangerial change. Wren just gave Bobby the best SP staff in baseball and it wasnt enough.
When did it become Wren’s fault that Bobby continued to play KJ over Prado while he was hitting .215, or Frenchy over Diaz when he was hitting below .250, or letting Schafer go out and strike out 75 times in the first two months.
Is it Wren’s fault that Bobby continues playing for one run and giving away outs late in the games with all of his excessive bunting. Im guessing you think that its Wren’s fault that we have 3 relievers in the top 5 of most appearances this season. Im guessing it Wren that calls to the pen to get Moylan Gonzo and Soriano up and throwing when we have 6 and 7 run leads also, then tells Bobby that they are unavailable to pitch in close games because theyve been overused. Im sorry but Im a real fan and 2nd or 3rd place in the division and an very slim shot at a wild card race isnt good enough for me
Wayn-o
September 23rd, 2009
12:50 am
FREDI GONZALEZ steal him from the marlins!
unbelievable
September 23rd, 2009
12:50 am
and one last thing, please remember that its Bobby who always has his say in everything and that we continued making one bad trade after another with slim playoff hopes. All those 3 for 1 and 4 for 1 deals wiped out our farm system.
Saying that Wren walked into luxury is just laughable. We had no position prospects being close to ready at the start of this season and when he took over our starting rotation was Jurrjens, Campillo, Morton, Reyes, and Carlyle. Wren, not Bobby, went out and made this team competitive.
Oregon Brave
September 23rd, 2009
1:26 am
This story makes me wonder what REALLY happened with the Furcal non signing.
TeeBerry
September 23rd, 2009
1:47 am
This really gets to me. Who in the Tara-on-fire blazes is going to do a better job than Bobby Cox??? He IS Braves baseball. For crying out loud! Do you losers remember what the Braves were BEFORE Bobby came to Atlanta??? They were just like you——losers. Bobby Cox made them contenders AND champions. With good talent and work-in-progress talent.
Michael
September 23rd, 2009
1:56 am
If nothing else, that photo shows why baseball managers and other coaches should stop wearing uniforms. Unless Bobby Cox is going to shag fly balls in center field, he should take the lead of his full-figured NFL brothers and wear coach clothes. Did Bill Parcells ever wear an oversized jersey with a big 58 on his chest and call in plays through a helmet? No, because it would’ve looked stupid.
reality
September 23rd, 2009
1:58 am
Hopefully Bobby Cox will be back next year and Wren will go away. Far, far away.
Tim
September 23rd, 2009
2:25 am
Please come home Terrence Moore. I’d rather read your annual column on why the Braves don’t have enough black players than Bradley’s dribble, which by the way, he gets off the radio.
Coach (2010 or Bust)
September 23rd, 2009
2:32 am
Bobby Cox was and still is the most overrated manager in ML history. Coming up short in fourteen of fifteen playoff appearances isn’t a crap shoot, it’s a trend. A terrible one.
Frank Wren is a DONKEY. He has personally disrespected three Hall of Fame players in Cal Ripken Jr., John Smoltz and Tom Glavine, the treatment of Glavine being truly repugnant.
I would part ways with the both of them if I had a say in the matter.
Tim is a moron
September 23rd, 2009
3:32 am
It’s drivel, not dribble. Now go read a book.
C from Marietta
September 23rd, 2009
3:53 am
Atlanta fans are the biggest whinners around. Terrible sportstown indeed.
London Calling
September 23rd, 2009
4:52 am
This story is bull. If there was any truth in it, it would have come out long ago. Just more raw meat for your new-found Cox-hating friends, Mark.
sad brotha
September 23rd, 2009
5:00 am
COMPLETELY OFF THE MARK… MARK! Terry McGuirk is the cog of the woes! He is CLUELESS and is in charge! I grant he is smart enough to distance himself, and that is his M.O. Get rid of him… Put John S. in his place and get ready for another more successful run! His salary and taking of air hurts the Braves.
Smooth
September 23rd, 2009
6:26 am
I have just added Bradley to one my don’t read articles. The man makes up what he don’t know.
Steve
September 23rd, 2009
6:42 am
I feel Frank Wren and Bobby Cox have done a good job. They need to resign LaRouch and too improve there outfield with more speed or power.
bowman
September 23rd, 2009
6:44 am
Mr. Bandwagon strikes again. Bradley jumps on bandwagons quicker than any AJC sportswriters but when he decides to get off and bury someone, he is ruthless. Bradley has decided that Cox should go, and he won’t stop writing along that scenario until it comes true (which he hopes will make him look like he’s a sage). He’ll soon give us another “5 reasons” blog to prove his point. (Is it always “5 reasons” because that as high as Bradley can count, or because he thinks his readers can concentrate any further.) Give it a rest, Bradley, Wren told you the he wants Cox back.
bowman
– -
“Art will always be Art.” – Goethe
jackets13
September 23rd, 2009
7:05 am
My thing is, who would you hire to replace Bobby? Terry Pendelton?
hop
September 23rd, 2009
7:13 am
bobby has been a winner at every stop from atlanta,toronto,back to atlanta.
many of the players who have signed with the braves is because of bobby cox and that includes the current staff of outstanding pitchers.
letting bobby go is not the answer but will make the braves far less attractive to players because of his reputation of being fair-minded manager who treats each person with dignity.
so let the merry-go-around begin in atlanta, as it has with many other major league teams, atlanta fans have been very spoiled with one of the greatest managers of all time.who made atlanta a very “special” place to play for many years.
Terminator
September 23rd, 2009
7:20 am
Enter your comments here
Bluetooner and Terminator on the message boards are in love with each other.
Squanto
September 23rd, 2009
7:21 am
damn coaches;
Dave
September 23rd, 2009
7:29 am
I think this is why Cox needs to go he wanted to keep both 43 year old Smoltz and Glavine he didn’t know when it was time to move on..
Dr. Warren
September 23rd, 2009
7:32 am
Why the hell did we ever give up Mark DeRosa?
All I'm Saying Is...
September 23rd, 2009
7:43 am
Note that Frank Wren said “inaccurate” and he did not say “Not true” or “Didn’t happen”. What that means is what happened in spring training happened even if a comma or preposition was out of place making it inaccurate.
What does it mean today? Not a darn thing because managers and GMs especially new ones disagree all the time (what BC and JS had was rare).
Whether BC returns or not will be decided by BC, John and Frank and nothing said here or written by MB will have anything to do with it. Why? Because the Braves have a winning record and a better one than last year.
Here what I want to know: Why is Gordon Eade (or whatever his name was) with Yahoo Sports! breaking a news story in September from spring training regarding the Atlanta Braves and not someone from the AJ/C? How many people at the AJ/C write stories about the Braves and none of them have reported this prior to now as either rumor or fact?
FIRE THE AJ/C SPORTS STAFF COVERING THE BRAVES FOR POOR PERFORMANCE!
LET’S GO BRAVES!
RNP
September 23rd, 2009
8:07 am
I am an Atlanta native and have followed the Braves since I was a kid. With many Managers (including Bobby 2x) and can remember when the old Fulton County Stadium had attendance of 1,500. On some of those nights, I think they counted the stadium staff. I don’t know if most of the people were not here or have forgotten that the Braves had a tradition of losing 100+ games a year, not just a couple of times, but for most of the decades of the 70’s, and 80’s. We were not bad; we were the laughing stock of Baseball!!! What do Michael Jackson and the Atlanta Braves have in common, they both have one glove for no apparent reason. This was Atlanta Baseball!!!!!! Now we don’t make the playoffs for 4 years and people want to dump Bobby, I think you are nuts, he doesn’t pitch, hit or field, his job is to get the most out of the hand he is delt. I think he does that as well as when we were going to the NLCS. I still think players want to come here and play for the man, he is one of the most respected men in the game.
People get a clue, lean from The University of Alabama, 10 years after letting a coach who just won games and put them in a position to win, they changed because it was boring and for 10 years they suffered with that choice….
dub
September 23rd, 2009
8:12 am
I total agree with you Buckhead benny,but don’t forget Greg North that was the most easy out player on the bench.You couldn’t have said it better so let’s hope Wren give Bobby the booth.
dub
September 23rd, 2009
8:17 am
why not TP as manager we need some fire on this team it’s to business like.baseball is played to have fun.
UGASlobberknocker
September 23rd, 2009
8:22 am
the 3rd blog in five days that has to do with Cox leaving. Enough already!!!!!!!!!!!
Drunkdawg
September 23rd, 2009
8:22 am
If Bobby Cox wants to manage the Braves next year or next few years, Good and he has earned the right to do it. He has been here a long time through good and bad and he is loyal to the Braves. I wish him the best in whatever he wants to do in the future. Go Braves!
bull-gator
September 23rd, 2009
8:26 am
Next years team…
Manager:
Jim Leyland & staff (try to keep current 1st base coach and bullpen coach)
Lineup:
CF – NcClouth
2B – Prado
LF – Infante
SS – Escobar
C – McCann
1B – LaRoche
RF – Heyward
3B – Jones
Pitching Staff:
Jurrjens
Hanson
Vasquez
Hudson
Medlen
Lowe
Kawakami
Moylan
O’Flaherty
Logan
Gonzalez
Bench:
Ross
Sammons
Diaz
Conrad
Church
Gorecki
Kashi
September 23rd, 2009
8:27 am
STOP CRITICIZING. We need consistant SPEED, POWER and EXCITEMENT in our everyday line-up. Everyone is doing a good job.
ChillyMutt
September 23rd, 2009
8:39 am
Bobby had a great run but his ability to handle a pitching staff has only gotten worse. The Braves shouldn’t accept mediocrity. Time to head in a different managerial direction. The net net of Wren’s off season moves look ‘good’. The Braves have a solid if not excellent starting pitching staff. Think they overpaid for Lowe and the unproven pitcher from Japan baseball, Kawikami. There weren’t a lot of quality free agent position players on the market this year. Sure there was Dunn and Andruw. But Dunn who really thought he could hit for a decent average and he can’t field his position anyway. Andruw showed some life at times but now looking more like his sharp decline the last few years is the trend not an anomaly. Chipper had an amazing year at the plate last year but still the 4 year extension given by Wren was bizarre. He’s 37 years old, frequently injured, lost much of his power and is now where near the defensive 3rd baseman he was earlier in his career.
I know
September 23rd, 2009
8:42 am
This story is completely accurate. I have a friend who works in the Braves organization (not the Atlanta team but another Braves team very close by). He told me the exact same thing back in April. Cox was furious at the way the Smoltz, Furcal, and Griffey situations were handled. He literally packed his bags and quit on the spot. Apparantly, JS had to fly down to Orlando and talk Bobby into staying on several occassions. I know many won’t beleive me but this story is very true.
Jim
September 23rd, 2009
8:42 am
I agree – I think there could be tension between Cox and Wren.
I think Bobby is setting himself up to retire/walk away gracefully if a deal doesn’t get worked out. This way, it wouldn’t seem like he was forced out. Bobby is about as class act as it gets.
Raindog
September 23rd, 2009
8:52 am
No one can blame Bobby Cox for the Braves’ sub-par season. You need talent to win games. This team didn’t have enough.
insidetheteepee
September 23rd, 2009
8:56 am
Something that makes me sick is all you people that thinks BC craps gold nuggets and you would follow him to hades picking them up! This guy got his fame from the Braves players he had and he got ALL the CREDIT!! Greatest man this side of GOD . . . allows his favorites to do as they please and will bat them at the top of the lineup even if they are hitting .200. All it takes to please BC is praise him, he’ll go down swinging for you if you tell him he’s the GREATEST. Baseball be damned, it’s all HAIL TO BC no matter what. Now the GM has got enough guts to shake up the good ‘ol boys and everyone is screaming for his scalp. Where is your loyalty to the team? You’ve got it all on BC and he sucks big time as a baseball manager.
18 Wheels of Love
September 23rd, 2009
8:58 am
Ok, so Bobby was upset that Smoltz and Glavine weren’t on the team. Had Bobby gotten his way, how do you think this year would have played out? It’s natural to want ‘your’ guys on the team so I don’t fault Cox at all. I do, however, give serious extra credit to Wren for holding his ground and doing what was best for the team, not a players legacy.
whatsit o'tussle
September 23rd, 2009
8:59 am
Wren can make all his GM decisions and such but then he needs to shut his hole and let Schuerholz handle the media.
whatsit o'tussle
September 23rd, 2009
9:00 am
also, I think if the Braves had benched Kelly Johnson and sent Francouer packing earlier we’d be going to the playoffs this year.
bugman
September 23rd, 2009
9:01 am
Ass + door + Bobby Cox
Make it so number one!
Mama Cox
September 23rd, 2009
9:03 am
Any good Mama will take up for her boys and I’m a damn good mama. I ought to be, I been doing it long enough.
dave
September 23rd, 2009
9:06 am
Jim Leyland couldn’t win here if he had to. He needs a big fat payroll, somebody to buy him a World Series, just like Joe Torre, who took what would have been Bobby’s 1982 team, and they got progressively worse.
Kevin
September 23rd, 2009
9:16 am
I bet u like chipper retired 5 years ago u mean he complians ow my butt next his nose are his balls…Cox had chance be the team of the century before 2000 hit but as fast u can say….cox beats his wife Yankees became the team of the century. So lets all stand up give Bobby his dews if not for him the yankees the marlins and the philles n blue jays n twins would never won if Larussa are leyland been at helm!
Steven Lemon
September 23rd, 2009
9:17 am
To the GENIUS who said” Until somebody proves better, Bobby’s the man”. Ummm Tell us all how someone could prove better as long as Bobby’s the man. And the indignant one who said some of us were too dumb for our own good because it is not Bobby’s fault that the “offense didn’t show up”?. Hey, hot shot, the problem is not that the offense doesn’t show up, it’s that Bobby doesn’t know how to USE the offense if it did show up. Strategy from the dugout is almost as important as tactics on the field.
It appears you can TALK baseball, but preliminary evidence indicates you never played it.
rc35
September 23rd, 2009
9:36 am
Several years ago (back in the late 90’s, I think), there was a billboard across I-75 from the Stadium. It had three pictures on it: Gen. Patton, Gen. MacArthur, and Bobby Cox, and said something about great leadership. I remember remarking at the time that, if Patton had been the Braves’ manager, they would have won three World Series and two Super Bowls. Yeah, I know it’s a different sport, but do you think that would have stopped Patton?
roan
September 23rd, 2009
9:46 am
I like Bobby Cox but I do think it is time for some new blood to take over this up and coming team we have here in Atlanta. However, he was more instrumental in the Braves success than folks give him credit.
I guess some people forget that it was Bobby Cox who drafted chipper jones and david justice when he was GM. It was Bobby Cox who traded Doyle Alexander to the Tigers for a minor league pitcher named John Smoltz. I think most folks nationally have this erroneous notion that Shuerholz made all those great moves to make the Braves relevant. All Shuerholz ever did here was sign free agents and make trades. He was damn good at that part of the equation but who did he ever draft that turned out to be great? And don’t say Andruw Jones because he was signed as a free agent for $1500 by one of our international scouts. All those years we needed a closer and just a little more hitting and Shuerholz failed. Folks say Cox rode the back of the magnificent trio all those years, well so did shuerholz. The following players were already here when shuerholz arrived- chipper, david justice, smoltz, glavine. Outside of Maddux that was pretty much the core of our greatest teams during the decade of the 90’s. Shuerholz used TED’S big war chest to sign maddux and he stole Mcgriff from the Padres. Thats the only two great moves he ever made in my opinion. All the free agents that ever signed here did so because they wanted to play for Cox not because they liked shuerholz. All and all I’m just trying to say that Cox had a hell of a lot more to do with the Braves dynasty than folks give him credit.
Keeping It Real
September 23rd, 2009
10:01 am
All Bobby Cox needs is an outfield that can run, hit and catch the ball. He has everything else.
Chris
September 23rd, 2009
10:10 am
Enter your comments here
The Braves have great pitching but pitching cannot win all games. There has been some big blown saves in the bullpen. When Scherholz traded for Tex he gave Tex (as) the heart of our farm system. Imagine having Elvis, Harrison and Salty back on this team how much better they would be now. They Braves do not have any starting lefties. Bobby has done a great job with what he has,, missing a good hitter or two. How would he know Chipper had the worst season in memory. Go Braves
Scott
September 23rd, 2009
10:23 am
I hope Bobby is the Braves manager for as long as he wants to do it.
The Braves have a great future ahead of them with the talent they have both coming up from the minors next year and the talent they already have now.
They have rebuilt in 4 short years after “the streak”, that’s amazing since alot of teams can’t rebuild for decades after they have a good run (Baltimore, Cincy, etc.)
Nobody better to manage them than Bobby.
GO BRAVES !
JMc12203
September 23rd, 2009
10:26 am
BOBBY HAS GOT TO GO. HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN SHOWN THE DOOR 4 OR 5 YEARS AGO.THE BRAVES HAVE SUFFERED THE PAST FEW YEARS UNDER HIS LEADERSHIP. BOBBY NEEDS TO GO WITH A WASHED UP CHIPPER RIGHT BEHIND.
Bob
September 23rd, 2009
10:27 am
Enter your comments here If LaRoche becomes a free agent, how about bring up Freeman or go after Fielder with a trade, they are looking for starting pitching and the Braves have 6 starters.
Matthew
September 23rd, 2009
10:41 am
I can’t fathom the comment about Glavine being Mr. Brave over John Smoltz, not from a fan perspective. Perhaps at the time the axe dropped on Glavine since Smoltz had been the most recent one to leave, but Glavine was the FIRST one to leave for more money. Not to mention that Chipper Jones is by far more Mr. Brave than either of those two.
Jelese
September 23rd, 2009
10:44 am
RNP – thank you! We used to go to Braves games, pay for the cheapest seats, then move down to sit behind Ted Turner because no one was at the park. We couldn’t buy a win, even though we had some great players.
It seems that SUDDENLY the Atlanta sports writers are blasting Bobby. I wonder if we were to follow the trail, would we find a new buddy system between Wren and these writers. It seems too obvious, guys. Perhaps you should back off for at least a couple of columns. And of course, the haters in Atlanta don’t need a reason to blast Bobby – they’ve been doing it for years. Everybody is a manager (except for a few of you who must consider yourself sports writers).
Bobby has made some poor choices this year, I’ll give you that. But, even with the mistakes everyone is pointing out, there is no guarantee we would be in the playoffs. Unfortunately for Bobby, everyone gets to watch his choices. What if someone was watching every minute of your performance on your job?
If you go back and listen to management’s comments, we were not expected to be in the playoffs this year. This was a building year. I would love to get there, but, I’m happy we are this close.
Remember, players are thrilled to come to Atlanta because of Bobby. You have players who take paycuts to stay here. Do you think that happens everywhere? Bobby deserves one more year, with a real team, and it is pretty close to that with the 2nd half lineup. A few tweaks, and we’re there.
Wren is not Schuerholz, and that’s too bad. Schuerholz has class.
Joey
September 23rd, 2009
10:45 am
Followed the braves since the age of 6 years old, currently 32 y.o. Bobby Cox is my manager because when it’s all said and done…..JS won’t allow Cox to be fired and Wren don’t won’t the PR hit in the media because there is no replacement in place at the time. Terry McGuirk is the Chairman and he doesn’t interfere with Wren. I was apart of the Braves Trainee program and I was taught a lot from JS and Cox and had very limited conversation with Wren. Bobby Cox is the BEST IN THE BUSINESS! In the trainee program for future Sports executives I learn from JS that Bobby Cox made him a better GM through the great years in the 90’s because he informed him everyday on what was going on in the club house. Wren doesn’t talk to Cox on a daily basis like JS……SO GIVE COX A ANOTHER YEAR TO BRING IN THAT 2ND WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP…..I WAS A COX BASHER TO UNTIL MY INTERNSHIP WITH THE BRAVES.
webhead
September 23rd, 2009
10:55 am
Roan- You are correct. Bobby Cox deserves a lot more credit than is given by these band of know – it- all idiots. Cox built the team that won the majority of the titles in the early 90’s. Personally, i would like to see him in the GM role again so he could build the farm system back. Wren saddled Cox with Shafer in center . No one to protect Chipper in the line-up. He finally had to start swinging at pitches outside his hitting zone and it messed up his swing. Man, lay off Cox before we’re stuck with TP as the manager.
Toni Morris
September 23rd, 2009
11:28 am
I agree that having Bobby Cox is a draw for players. Used to be, coming to the Braves was something players wanted to do because they knew it was a guarantee to go to the post season. Now that’s not the case. A lot of players that we signed had great money offers elsewhere and the scales were tipped by the fact that they wanted a chance to play for the greatest manager ever to step on a field. If we lose Bobby it will be a long time before we ever attract an “A” list player. I’ve been a Braves fan since they came to Atlanta in 1966 and, like Jelese sat in good seats and paid little money. WE stuck by the Braves through thin and thin and never saw “thick” until the 1990’s. I daresay most of these “fans” that are calling for Bobby to leave, came onto the Braves bandwagon in the 90’s. I think they have no voice until they have been here as long as we diehards have. Keep Bobby!
JMc12203
September 23rd, 2009
11:53 am
Hey Joey – Bobby had more than ample chances to win a second world series, with ALOT BETTER TALENT than he has now, and could not get it done because he is only a good manager, NOT THE GREAT MANAGER ALL YOU PEOPLE HAVE BEEN LED TO THINK THAT HE IS. BOBBY NEEDS TO GO!!!!
JMc12203
September 23rd, 2009
11:59 am
And to Toni Morris – what hay truck did you fall off of?? Bobby is FAR from the greatest manager to ever step on the field. He is not even the best manager to ever manage the Braves. That goes to Joe Torre who did more with less. If Torre had managed the Braves in the 90’s, Atlanta would have had SEVERAL World Series championships. Do your homework and get a life!!!
Joyce for the BRAVES
September 23rd, 2009
12:00 pm
Enter your comments here:
I feel SORRY for Sports in this day & age! I remeber when it was about the game & NOT^ about the money. Baseball is TOO much CEO with $$$ signs and not about enjoying the game. Take a look at Mr. Wren in the press box while the game is going on–He should be at home. I have yet to see him cheering the TEAM! —I say go watch Football!
Have you ever looked at what goes on in the other teams dugout? I was GLAD when Joe Torrie went! NO Emotions!!!Our guys ALL seem to be having a GOOD time (win or loose) playing the game! Bobby is cheering for each and everyone . I have not missed a game on TV for that reason. YES, I’d like to see more WINS! Yes, I miss Smoltz, but think he is getting what he needed with this change ONE team doen’t have ALL the answers. I think the same is true with Jeff. They both had got a place of do the same thing over & over, so when moving to another team they had th face changes.
I have been a fan of MLB for OVER 50 years. Maybe we need to go back to the days of a pitcher going 9 innings and the World Series ALWAYS being between the NY Dodgers and the Yankees! NO big $$$’s just good Baseball!
I also do not look forward to the games being on ANY of the National Programs as the Sport guys are TOO one sided.
Since Turner has sold the Braves, we do NOT get any notice! Some body needs to be talking more on how hard the Braves play and less about $$’s.
I have YET to hear a player leave and talk about Bobby as a manager! I also, see him teaching young players how to be a GOOD human being with his training. Do has you are told OR sit it out! He has always gone to bat for the players —better he get kicked out than a player!
My thoughts are things were a LOT better before Mr Wren! Maybe you should manage Football They liked to make BIG $$$$’s! and I don’t watch that game!
Bernie
September 23rd, 2009
12:19 pm
Maybe it’s time sincerely for Cox to go. How about Ned Youst athe new manager of the future. I sure hope so and please no Terry Pendleton.
TomTom
September 23rd, 2009
12:47 pm
If TP, the hitting coach? can’t get the hitters to hit (ie JF, KJ etc) what makes you think he can manage the ball team. Give me a break.
Leah
September 23rd, 2009
12:48 pm
Without Bobby Cox we wouldn’t have had that run of 14 division titles. Most of you complain that you’d trade it in for another World Series ring. It’s easier to say that when you have the titles to trade in. When you’re on the outside looking in, like we would be without Cox, you’d take the titles in a heartbeat. I bet the Nationals would take that right now.
Cox is getting older and I think he’s not as good as he used to be. Truth is we aren’t getting the talent we once were able to. Is it because we can’t guarantee postseason play or is because we don’t have the payroll? Perhaps both. But, it doesn’t matter the reason so much as the fact that we don’t have the talent we used to. All good things come to an end. Our streak at the top did. No one stays young forever. We’re rebuilding, slowly. I think it looks better for us than it does for other teams in that process and I believe part of it is because of Cox. Players want to play for him. They try harder. He can get more out of a player than other managers. He’s the one cheering on his team. He’s not just a statue. Players want to play for him not just to be a player under him, but when they’re under him, they want to play FOR him.
Joe Fan
September 23rd, 2009
12:51 pm
Bobby will be saying goodbye. He will go out with a winning team. Yes, the Braves are going to finiah above 500. They are on the right track and Bobby will move into player development. He leaves on a positive note. TP will not be the next manager. Wren wants his own guys in place. It all makes sense.
Bashmenot
September 23rd, 2009
2:17 pm
How does the budget for the staff of managers in the dugout and bullpen compare to other clubs? Wren is the front man to do Bobby in because Schuerholz refused because he knows what Bobby means to the organization. If Wren wants to manage the team, maybe he should apply for a minor league job and see if he can cut it. Where were the Braves before Bobby rebuilt the farm system and before he moved into the dugout? Are the folks bashing Bobby really Braves fans? How many innings of baseball do the bashers watch a week? Bradley you should be ashamed of yourself, you write one or two articles a week for AJC and this is all you can come up with? It is very disappointing to see the unappreciative lot of so called Braves fan bashing Bobby. It is very easy to second guess the moves that do not work, but do any of you bashers ever offer a compliment regarding the work to prepare the players to take the field and deal with all the whining? What if several thousand people watch your work and second guessed everything turn you made!
braves70
September 23rd, 2009
2:45 pm
Put me down for off with all their heads:
Cox for his poor managerial handling of what should have been a playoff team;
Wren for his oafish, beligerant attitude towards all;
and the AJC writers for failing to report this incident before now.
Spikester
September 23rd, 2009
2:47 pm
I hope Bobby stays. Look at the history. He didn’t lose the games this year. The players did. No runs when needed,men left on,pitching off,etc.
Daily Post | Capitol Avenue Club
September 23rd, 2009
3:17 pm
[...] Mark Bradley calls BS on it too: Reached by phone Tuesday night, Wren described the report as “inaccurate.” But it’s fair to [...]
kip carter
September 23rd, 2009
3:28 pm
If Wren is so good how come he didn’t save Bobby from himself by trading or giving away Norton. Think what the season would have been like if Norton had been in Danville all year.
Hooksett
September 23rd, 2009
5:10 pm
Well, the Braves just announced a one-year extension for Cox, with retirement at the end of 2010 of on-field management, but a 5-year consulting contract!
Bill
September 23rd, 2009
5:33 pm
Oh, well, there’s always the 2011 Season. Definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. See: Atlanta Braves/Bobby Cox; B. Obama.
teepeeburning
September 23rd, 2009
6:10 pm
Enter your Bobby love here: Smooch-smooch-smooch
Enter your Bobby boot here: kick his azz out the door pronto!
Enter how many games they win next year here: 79
Doc Holiday
September 23rd, 2009
8:41 pm
Trivia question?
Which airhead manager would play his worst 2B out of 4 possible choice when his team cant win more than 1-2 games the rest of the way???
I suppose you have the answer.
Tim Hudsons face just said it all……….he just said………….KJ………….just suk………..and he did it without moving his lips…………just by staring at KJ.
Ken
September 24th, 2009
12:42 pm
If anyone needs to go, it’s Wren. Team is strapped with two HORRIBLE contracts (Lowe and Kowakami). Lowe’s was at least understandable. The signing of K.K. was horendous, conidering no more pitching was needed.
Wren’s a deceitful moron who should be run out of Atlanta.
Ronald Millsaps
September 24th, 2009
5:10 pm
To anyone who badmouths Mark Bradley for reporting on this story, you’re wrong. Frank Wren has been, in many ways, a punk, and he needs people to call him to task on it.
Okay, Bradley didn’t do that completely, but he definitely exposed a few things that folks need to know.
It sounds like Wren wants to throw his weight around and pad his own ego, which, unfortunately, happens quite a bit, in all kinds of circles (like the time Lenny Wilkens, who’s even sorrier than Bobby Petrino, ran Dominique out of Atlanta and did so in classless fashion).
John Schuerholz isn’t without blame; he could’ve handled the David Justice and Tom Glavine situations much better, and he probably could’ve taken less credit for the 1991 team’s success because he received more than he deserved, but he typically has shown class and distinction. Wren, in his handling of the Smoltz situation and definitely in the Glavine situation, absolutely has not.
Rick
September 26th, 2009
5:38 pm
What is that well known saying, “What have you done for us lately?”. To be blunt Cox should have been canned back in 1996 when he FAILED to repeat as World Series Champion. Winning divisional titles is NOT good enough. Unless a manager wins it all then he is a failure. And Cox has been nothing but a dumb doofus failure since 1996.