5 Norton-free reasons the Braves won’t make the playoffs
Last season he won a batting title. This season he's under .270. (AJC photo by Curtis Compton)
1. Every preseason gamble on position players failed except the platoon in left field. Because the Braves spent the winter redoing the rotation, they took chances with their everyday eight. They hoped, perhaps against hope, that Jordan Schafer was ready and that Jeff Francoeur had recovered from his funk and that Kelly Johnson’s second-half surge in 2008 wasn’t an aberration and that Casey Kotchman could actually drive in some runs. Only one of those men is on the roster today, and the one (Johnson) lost his position to Martin Prado.
2. Chipper Jones began to show his age. He was hitting .335 before the game on June 10, at which point this correspondent proclaimed him “as splendid as he ever was.” He’s hitting .268 now. Moral of story: You never want ol’ MB to write something nice about you.
3. Derek Lowe wasn’t as good as the Braves hoped he’d be. He’s 13-9, which isn’t terrible. But his ERA is 4.34, which marks a career worst as a National League pitcher, and opponents are hitting .294 against him — nearly 50 percentage points higher than they hit last season.
4. Bobby Cox overused his bullpen. Three Braves relievers — Peter Moylan, Eric O’Flaherty and Mike Gonzalez — rank among the league’s top seven in appearances. (And this for a team that has received 84 quality starts, second-most in the majors.) It would be one thing if all this work had resulted in a lockdown bullpen on the order of Hammond-Remlinger-Smoltz, but it hasn’t. The 2002 relief corps blew 11 saves. This one has 20 blown saves. The 20th came last night, as you doubtless know, Rafael Soriano wasting another strong Tommy Hanson start.
5. Nate McLouth didn’t deliver. Of the three major in-season trades Frank Wren made, this had the greatest potential of sparking the entire offense. But McLouth, who has had an iffy hamstring, has played in only 61 games over three-plus months as a Brave, and he’s hitting .263 with an on-base percentage of .351.
And, just for the heck of it: Greg Norton. Regarding the question, “Who’s the worst Brave ever?”, we have a new leader in the clubhouse.
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Guides
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2010 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
397 comments Add your comment
Smart Jay
September 10th, 2009
12:28 am
Ouch.
Smart Jay
September 10th, 2009
12:33 am
Mark, you are clearly correct on all counts. Why managers no longer want to allow anyone to get a complete game, I dunno. I suppose if we’re out of the race, Bobby wants Soriano to be able regain some confidence, but, if we’re trying to win games – there is something going on with Soriano and he shouldn’t be coming in with only a 1 run lead. Shame Hanson getting screwed out of rookie of year by the bullpen.
JP
September 10th, 2009
12:35 am
Norton, Bobby Cox, Kelly Johnson, Most of the bullpen, have to go. we are in a hole now with so much cash in on Kawakami and Lowe. To heck with the braves and their cheap as.
TomB
September 10th, 2009
12:42 am
Why is it I want to blame every loss now on Cox? With a four run lead, he leaves Lowe in for eight runs to be scored on him in one inning – Cox was waiting on the ground out. Calling on Norton to pinch hit late vs the Marlins, and now using Soriano when Hanson was pitching brilliantly. I would have left Hanson at least until an Astro reached base. I know the 90’s run was great with Cox, but I no longer believe.
BugKiller
September 10th, 2009
12:54 am
Norton is only terrible because COX keeps on using him!!!
Still, there is no way Norton is the worst ever. It just feels that way.
Willie Martinez, on the other hand… (had to get that in).
BravesFan79
September 10th, 2009
12:55 am
Norton by far isnt the worst Brave ever. I think that title goes to Corky Miller or Chris Woodcrap. BOTH were given WAY more chances than Norton has this year.
Ostrich Racer
September 10th, 2009
12:55 am
It always comes down to pitching and defense up the middle. Put ten of those blown saves back, and look where we’d be. Reverse the effects of the centerfield fiasco (albeit mostly from an offensive standpoint), and we’re leading by a mile — even in a bad year for Chipper. On paper, the only thing that should have been an obvious no-go was Schafer — but nobody was saying that after the homerun opening night in Philadelphia. Getting McLouth seemed to be the right answer; it just didn’t work out. Bobby can still manage, Wren will be a great GM, Chipper is still very valuable to the team, and Lowe is still a number one starter. The bullpen is a train wreck, but that’s mostly a question of talent and approach rather than overuse. (I’ll say it again — bring back Leo!) As for Norton — okay, I’ll give you that one. At least Pat Rockett could field his position.
Andrew
September 10th, 2009
1:04 am
Mark
I saw Bobby on TV after the game saying usally his bullpen does a great job and you always want the closer to start an inning clean ( bases empty) 20 blown saves is that a great job where does that put our bullpen in NL in blown saves. Also If anyone watched that interview he avoided the question of why he took Hanson out. He just said you always want to start the closer in the beginning of the inning. I forgot where in the rule books is says the closer cant come in and get two outs in the 9th or one out in the 9th if your starter gets in trouble. Worst manager excuses I have ever heard. You could tell in the dugout all the players knew soriano was going to blow another one. Bobby you had a good run its time for you to go.
Ed-Covington
September 10th, 2009
1:04 am
Good post, MB, as usual. Always wondered if Wren asked the Pirates about McCutcheon(?) before they settled for McLouth.
Doesn’t Norton still have a .300 OBP? The problem may not be that he’s still on the team; maybe he should be starting! (JUST KIDDING!)
As for Chipper AND McCann, I’ve always been a fan, but this past month, while other players (Albert, Ryan Howrd, etc.) stepped up, they stepped off. Their (& McLouth’s)lack of production is the real reason the Bravos are missing the post season; not Cox, Soriano, Norton, Lowe, Kawakami, Wren or any of the other reasons everyone claims.
Mark Bradley
September 10th, 2009
1:09 am
Enter your comments here
gotigers72
September 10th, 2009
1:27 am
I hope Bobby chooses to resign and the Braves don’t have to fire him. I would like to see him go out with class, but I want to see him go, PERIOD. I have always taken up for Bobby in arguments with people who are Braves fans and those who are not Braves fans. But his moves this year AND last year have convinced me that it is time for him to retire and go work the farm. Continuing to use Norton as a pinch hitter, and continuing to use Soriano recently are just signs that he may be deteriorating. Sorry BC, you were great, but all of us lose it eventually.
Lower the BOOM!!
September 10th, 2009
1:42 am
Worst Brave ever?
Do managers count?
One World Series title be damned!
tim
September 10th, 2009
1:55 am
Nate McLouth has worked when healthy.
The Braves underperformed so much early in the season, that it took an overhaul of the roster and a major second half surge just to stay on the fringe of contention.
Wait until next year.
bigdawg
September 10th, 2009
2:46 am
When will major league decision makers like Bobby cox and Roger McDowell realize that pitch counts are good in little league and school ball to protect youngsters from zealous coaches. The Braves have blown game after game that could have been won by going one more inning from the starter (who in most cases wer sailing right along) but we decide to go with our superstar bullpen. Superstar bullpen is my version of sarcasm. Bobby needs to settle in on the farm and let someone else try to get the bravos to the postseason for a while. Bobby was one of the best but he is now his own worst enemy. I have heard people say that he has earned the right to manage for as long as he wants but I ask you if I quit producing tomorrow how long would it take for me to be replaced in my job. It all comes down to production and we haven’t gotten it from Chipper, Bobby, Rafael Soriono, Derek Lowe, Kelly Johnson, Norton, and nearly every one of our setup men in the pen. Time to blow this thing up and retool the position players. See what you can get for Chipper on the market, make McLouth and MCann the face of the position players and Jair and Tommy Hanson the backbone of your rotation.
Crapper John
September 10th, 2009
2:54 am
Actually,I think O’Flaherty, Moylan, and Gonzalez are all actually doing better since the all-star break despite the number of apperances. Soriano has been the weak link.
W L ERA G SV SVO
Moylan – Before All-Star 2 2 4.62 49 0 5
Moylan – After All-Star 4 0 0.38 28 0 0
Gonzalez -Before All-Star 3 2 3.43 45 9 13
Gonzalez – After All-Star 0 2 0.75 26 0 2
O’Flaherty -Before All-Star 1 1 3.34 47 0 2
O’Flaherty – After All-Star 0 0 3.14 20 0 0
Dave
September 10th, 2009
2:59 am
Nate McLouth NEVER had the potential to spark the entire offense! He is a .261 career hitter with one solid season under his belt. The trade was a desperate move by a team unwilling to spend the money to land the good players.The only reason he even got to be an All-Star is because he played for the Pirates, and the league requires at least one player from each team. I would compare it to him being the best-smelling turd in the Porta-John.
I wasn’t sold on the deal then, and I am certainly not sold on it now.
S.S – Someone refresh me on what we gave up for this scrub.
Dave
September 10th, 2009
3:00 am
Oops, meant P.S. It’s late, typos happen.
Boo Boo
September 10th, 2009
3:09 am
I saw a picture of a Pittsburgh Pirates fan holding up a sign that said, “I wish I was a (Detroit) Lions fan”, after they broke the record for consecutive losing seasons (at 19). Tonight I wished I was an Astros fan. As young as Hanson is, if he is ever to pitch a complete game, tonight was it. Bobby Cox just got my vote for being fired. If he coaches Thursday in a Braves uniform, I am no longer a Braves fan. I mean, when you have position players wussing a whole three hits in nine innings, the best offense you have is a pitcher than can throw a shutout. Only a manager too old to know how to manage would make that change, unless Hanson told him he was done. Without Cox, and with ONE good hitter for power (30+ homeruns, 100+ rbi), no pitcher in the Braves rotation would have less that 12 wins, with Vazquez and Jurrjens having 18 apiece. All the talk about trading Lowe is foolish. He’s the only pitcher that seems to be the hitting charm for those ladies playing the field. Bring out the pink tutu’s and trade the whole pitching staff to anyone close to being in the playoffs. They deserve more.
Coach (2010 or Bust)
September 10th, 2009
3:12 am
Unquestionably, this is the worst single season of managing by Bobby Cox in his long history with our Braves. The man has to retire or be forced to.
That said, I am not optimistic for next season. For many reasons.
The outfield is a freaking disaster, platoons be damned. The defense is below average to poor at best. We have three premium position players in McCann, Escobar and McLouth. Chipper is on the slow boat to retirement. There are too many left handed bats and not nearly enough right handed power hitters on the team. Small ball has gone the way of the Dodo bird and the running game is nonexistent. Soriano, Gonzo and LaRoche are likely to hit free agency. So could Tim Hudson if he so chooses. If not, Javy or Kawakami has to be traded.
And last but not least. The vast majority of the fans recognize the need to dump Bobby Cox, although his players love him. Also, the vast majority of the players absolutely despise Frank Wren and I have that info first hand. My personal confidence level in our GM is somewhere between : do you want fries with that? and when will the WWE offer the man a job?????
Boo Boo
September 10th, 2009
3:26 am
Greg Norton certainly sux, but he has an injury excuse, which kept him from playing the whole season. A pinch hitter needs to get some regularity to stay sharp. Norton never got going … twice. I still have chills when I remember Ernie Johnson saying, back in 1978, “Here’s Cito Gaston. Cito’s due.” But good ole Bobby Cox never gave up on Cito, just like he hasn’t given up on Norton.
Vol85
September 10th, 2009
3:51 am
Mark– you are correct, but in spite of all this as recently as a couple weeks ago the Braves looked like they were on an end of season charge that just might bring them a wild card playoff spot. Wren’s acquisition of Adam LaRoche had certainly paid off, and this, coupled with the outstanding work at the plate in late July and much of August by Prado, Yunel Escobar, and Brian McCann, plus the move of Matt Diaz to the leadoff spot seemed to indicate that post- Labor Day baseball might be worthwhile. But then timely hits began to disappear as fast as they had come and, worse yet, the bullpen (specifically the closer role) began to show an inability to nail down games or keep opposing batters at bay in the later innings. BS does not just stand for blown save with this group– especially when it comes to Soriano and Gonzalez. As so many have said about this year’s edition, they (the Braves) are a team that will win 2, lose 3 and then turn around and win 5 and lose 3.
On a brighter note, Greg Norton does have more hits, 10 in 69 ABs, than Derek Lowe, 9 in 45 official ABs.
Robert Barron
September 10th, 2009
4:35 am
MLB needs what the NFL has: contracts written where a team can drop an underperforming player after a year but he keeps the signing bonus.
The owners were fools not to demand this during baseball strikes and lockouts. Except the Yankees don’t want it so they can spend their way to a title as they have this year.
Robert Barron
September 10th, 2009
4:40 am
Doesn’t the Norton problem fall on Frank Wren for not overruling Bobby? Wren can’t trade Vazquez because he needs the reminder to us of what he did get right. What kind of year is ex-Brave and the pride of Brunswick having? His 18th win last night.
Crapper John
September 10th, 2009
4:51 am
The offense going stone cold during key stretches this season has really hurt. Seems like when we lose, we’re lucky to score one run.
Mitch C
September 10th, 2009
4:59 am
Mark, I’m sorry to say “I told you so”, but I did. If you remember a couple of weeks ago, when the Braves went on that good run for a while, you told me, and others, that you thought the Braves had a good chance to make the playoffs, and I told you I didnt think they would. I’ve been a Braves fan for 27 years, and I’m sorry to say, I was right about them not making it.
2009 is history for the Braves, save for the fact that the schedule says we have three meaningless weeks left to play.
A question: As you probably know, Jeff Schultz posted a blog yesterday saying that he thought the Braves will have to trade Javy Vazquez this winter, for financial reasons, because Lowe is virtually untradable with his contract, and having three years left on his deal. Do you think the Braves will trade Vazquez, or do you see a way to perhaps trade Lowe, or someone else, and keep Javy?
JD
September 10th, 2009
6:08 am
Bobby Cox won all those games because he had the players to do so, not because of his managerial skills. Last night was the last straw with me.
JD
September 10th, 2009
6:11 am
Enter your comments here
JD
September 10th, 2009
6:12 am
Bobby Cox has won all those games because he had the players, not because of his managerial skills.
NCBravesFan
September 10th, 2009
6:21 am
Last night was painful to watch. Hanson was so dominant, and you hated to see it all go up in smoke the way it did.
I’m certainly not in the “Cox is moron” camp by any stretch, but it really is time for a new face of the franchise in the manager’s office.
As for Chipper, the Braves’ number one priority this offseason has to be recasting the offense so that when Chipper is out we don’t miss a beat in scoring runs. We’ve come to rely on him far too much over the years, and that is simply not a good idea anymore.
No silly name here
September 10th, 2009
6:26 am
Mark, I will give you five more reasons:
1. B. Cox
2. Bobby Cox
3. Bobby C
4. BC
5. Bobby “DA” Cox
Last night was a joke. Hanson could have finished
Carroll Brave
September 10th, 2009
6:48 am
Baseball season officially ended for me last night when Bubby took out Hanson. Go Dawgs, go Falcons and go Tech (until November 28). And I never thought I would say this but go Bobby Cox (GO HOME)
TampaGator
September 10th, 2009
6:50 am
I watched Bobby Cox keep 14 great division winning teams from winning more than just one World Series title. I again watched Bobby Cox prevent one of the games best young pitchers from pitching his first major league shutout last night…and the Braves from winning a game they had to win. Only Bobby Cox would have pulled Hanson in that game. And only Bobby Cox lost that game last night for the Braves. This is the same man that brought in lefty Charlie Leibrant in to face Kirby Puckett in the the 6th grame of the ‘91 WS for the Braves. Bobby Cox is a preventer of championships, not a manager who wins them. He is the most overrated manager in ML history. All the Astro players and even their manager were happy when Hanson was pulled. It gave them hope and energy to win the game. Nice move, Bobby!!!
I Have Questions
September 10th, 2009
6:57 am
Could you compare the 91? (worst to first season) Braves pitching, hitting, and fielding stats to this year’s Braves. The current Braves (from my memory) are as good as if not better than the 91? (worst to first) Braves.
Coach (2010 or Bust)
September 10th, 2009
6:59 am
Mitch C, there is the slight possibility that Javy could stay. Hudson’s option for 2010 is mutual, meaning Hudson could forego his buyout and declare himself a free agent.
Otherwise, Hudson and the Braves both exercise the mutual option, he stays and Javy or Kawakami have to be traded. This are a ton of reasons not to drop Kawakami even though he is the weak link in our rotation. Such as politics, Japanese fan base, reasonable contract, ticking off the entire landscape of Japanese baseball, etc.etc.etc.
Personally, I hate trading pitching but the Braves will probably have little choice. We bought low on Vazquez and it looks like we will sell high, which is a good thing in itself.
The American Dream
September 10th, 2009
7:05 am
If the Braves don’t get funky like a monkey soon they gonna be drunk as skunk and end up sitting at home watching reruns on the tube of me giving the nature boy a leg drop. A good player gotta have a good manager. I kicked old Sapphire to the curb when she wore me out. Old Bobby needs the old Dusty finish right bout now. Everyone come out to see my next bout. I’ll be wrestling a tag team match. My partner–Mark FM Bradley– and I will be working over Greg Norton and Kelly Johnson at the Dairy King parking lot in Fairmount. Norton has requested the use of a bat in the ring but I ain’t scared because he couldn’t hit a darn thing with a bat whether on the field or in the ring with a legend. Now everyone needs to come out to watch a true American sport and stop wasting their lives watching the Braves. See yall at the Dairy King. God bless America!!! and God bless Chris Rude!!!
Coog
September 10th, 2009
7:10 am
Worst Brave: did you forget Pepe Frias??
MiltonDawg
September 10th, 2009
7:15 am
You could’ve summed up our whole season by watching last night’s game- Braves could muster up only 4/5 hits & 1 run- looked like a special ed team out there and then have bullpen implode. Do like the Falcons..have a fire sale, get rid of the old (including managers) & bring in the new.
KT
September 10th, 2009
7:16 am
The only good thing about them tanking this year, is we finally might get rid of Bobby Cox’s ass. Why could we have gone after Joe Torre, two years ago? God help us if Cox leaves and they give Terry P. the job.
bull-gator
September 10th, 2009
7:23 am
Keepers (in no particular order): Escobar, Diaz, Infante, McCann, Prado, Jones, LaRoche, Vasquez, Hanson, Jurjens, Gonzalez, and O’Flaherty. Everybody else, including the manager and coaching staff, hit the road.
ches
September 10th, 2009
7:23 am
When was the last time a Braves pitcher was allowed to pitch a complete game?
lin
September 10th, 2009
7:24 am
every good player can have a bad year and this was chippers and nortons. as for last nite game i can not believe bobby would not let tommy h. try finish i knew it get blown by pen. and i am not surprised we not make the playoff
Born2Buzz
September 10th, 2009
7:32 am
If you didn’t think it was time for Bobby to step down, last night should have convinced you.
While Frank Wren did a good job of rebuilding the rotation he has hamstrung the team for next year with the contracts to Lowe and KK. It’s going to be hard to get a solid lineup next year as well. Wait for 2011.
And MLB is just F’d. For one team to have a 200M payroll and another to have 15M just doesn’t make for good competition. Bud Selig and Bobby both should go byebye.
ME AGain
September 10th, 2009
7:36 am
Thank you Captain Obvious. I’ve known they wouldn’t make the play offs since May. Worst Brave ever, for the record, has to be Nick Esasky.
Phil
September 10th, 2009
7:40 am
Well, if last night was not the perfect example of why we need to get rid of this buffoon, I don’t know what is.
What was wrong with letting Hanson pitch the 9th??????? He had just cruised through the 8th, his pitch count was around 100. Why didn’t Cox let him try and get the complete game???
Afer the game Joe Simpson and Ron Gant were saying the same thing, that Hanson should have been allowed to try and finish the game and they were disappointed that Bobby did not give him the chance.
You people need to wake the hell up about this moron. It’s time we get rid of this idiot once and for all!!!!!!!
curtis jones
September 10th, 2009
7:40 am
Mark Bradley has discovered the Braves won’t make the playoffs, and just repeated verbatim what we’ve been blogging for months. Log on tomorrow, when Mark discovers unemployment is up, Teddy Kennedy is dead, and swine flu is bad for you!
Braves WIN, Braves, WIN, Braves...NEVERMIND
September 10th, 2009
7:44 am
Come on, where was your blast on Terry Pendleton. The Braves had EIGHT hits in the last two games, and two of those were from a pitcher.
Bobby Cox is a BOOB when it comes to filling out a line-up card. Chipper? Take a NAP, or maybe you can fly up to College Game Day this Saturday.
GO HAWKS
September 10th, 2009
7:46 am
FIRE TP. The Braves aren’t a hitting team eventhough they have the talent. The guys that perform well were coached elsewhere – minors or another team – and progressively get worse as braves.
Called it right
September 10th, 2009
7:48 am
I called it with a bunch of guys when I saw that Booby (Bobby) was taking Hanson out after the 8th inning. Hansen had just had a strong 8th and he takes him out for what. Would he have done that if it were Glavine, Smoltz, or Maddox, Of course not. Braves deserved to lose that game after not hitting once again, not allowing a young pitcher (who was under 100 pitches) to atleast start the 9th inning, and bringing in a closer who has done nothing to instill confidence the last 10 to 12 outings because he is tired. Way to lose a game for them Booby.
Mac
September 10th, 2009
7:48 am
Have the Braves been appointed the Ambassador to Japan? What’s with folks proclaiming Kawakami is untouchable because Japanese people will be ticked off if he’s traded? Weird. Very, very weird.
Disappointed
September 10th, 2009
7:51 am
Mark, are you just now figuring this out? Going into the season I thought they would finish 3rd in the division and maybe win 85 games. Too many holes in the lineup, etc, etc, etc… Bobby, you had a great run but it’s time to retire please.
Phil
September 10th, 2009
7:53 am
Bradley, anybody, please explain that Moron Cox descision to not let Hanson pitch the 9th inning last night. He deserved a chance to finish the game and get the win. But no, that buffoon of a manager denied him the chance and we lose the game. Hanson was strong, he had just cruised through the 8th. His pitch count was around 100.
Cox probably cost him rookie of the year because of that idiotic move.
When is enough enough?????????? People, wake up, we HAVE to get rid of this moron.
Bank Walker, Texas Ranger
September 10th, 2009
7:54 am
Worst Brave ever, jeeeezzz, name any middle infielder from the 70’s through the 80’s. Rockett, Frias, Garrido, Gilbreth, Rob Belloir, Larvell Blanks, Darrell Chaney, Sonny Jackson not to mention the pitching up until the 90’s. You could swing a stick and hit 4 of the worst Braves ever in the bullpen in the 70’s.
Bama Sports
September 10th, 2009
8:01 am
Has Nate McClouth ever tried to throw a base runner out or does he only have the lob toss in his arsenal?
RGP
September 10th, 2009
8:01 am
When was the last time a Braves starter pitched a complete game? Has any Braves starter pitched a complete game this year? No wonder the bullpen is worn out.
Mrs. Norton
September 10th, 2009
8:01 am
I dare Mark Bradley write that my son is the worst Brave ever, everybody knows that title will always belong to Kenny Lofton.
All I'm Saying Is...
September 10th, 2009
8:01 am
Worst Brave Ever? Bradley, you obviously don’t remember the Braves teams of the 1970s. Lot of candidates (from Asselstine, Brian to Williams, Earl (and lets not forget Willie Montanez and don’t get me started on the pitching)) from those teams because nothing says you stink like losing 100 games year in and year out.
LET’S GO BRAVES!
Disappointed
September 10th, 2009
8:02 am
TH should have been allowed to start the 9th inning. He was cruising along thru 8 and his fastball was still hitting 95 mph! This stupid pitch count crap is ridiculous. It was barely even discussed 6-7 years ago and now it’s a rule of thumb? Not one Braves starter has even had a chance at a complete game this year and they have how many blown saves? Stupid!
O'Brien
September 10th, 2009
8:02 am
Mark,
What did you think of Bobby’s decision to bring in the closer although Hanson only threw 98 pitches, and he was sharp as ever.
Phil
September 10th, 2009
8:04 am
I would like to hear any Cox lover explain what that buffoon was thinking last night by not allowing Hanson to finish the game.
Disappointed
September 10th, 2009
8:05 am
TH should have been able to pitch the 9th. His fastball was still hitting 95 mph in the 8th! This pitch count thing is ridiculous. It was barely even discussed 6-7 years ago and now it’s a rule of thumb?
Willy
September 10th, 2009
8:06 am
At this point, what kind of plan do the Braves have for next year? Will they trot out a mediocre team and hype it with the worst kind of marketing and expect the fans to buy it? I have lived and died with the Braves for 25 years, and I can’t just drop them now. But, I’m starting to feel like a fan from Pittsburgh or Kansas City because this team (GM, manager, etc.) makes decisions that don’t make sense. Paying $60 million for Lowe was stupid. Paying $23 million more for Kawakami was a knee-jerk reaction to a well-made player video. Is keeping Chipper around for two more seasons going to advance this team to the playoffs?
I could support the Braves more if they offered some buy-in to the fans. If they were relying on youth, as say the Rays, and were still struggling, then I could understand this. But we have a mixture of vets and young players and are still not getting it done. Yes, I do believe that Bobby has now gone past the point where he can accurately make logical calls. But Bobby cannot perform on the field and get key hits and avoid errors.
No one can tell at the beginning of the season whether offseason or midseason moves will pay off. A host of conditions come into play. What is certain is this team had potential and didn’t live up to it. You decide why.
Turtsnap
September 10th, 2009
8:06 am
MB, A Braves failure story after the biggest failure game of the year (since the 3rd game of the year when we blew a big lead in Philly). Bloggers will be out for blood today. I try to stay out of all the
“Fire Bobby” chatter, but I must say last night was totally unbelievable. I am so sick of the “gotta protect the future and the young arm” crap. Given the recent failures of the bullpen, why the HELL do you take out Tommy Hanson when he is dominating the opponent. I thought the object of the game was to win. Say what you will about “gotta have faith in your closer” and “Sori is our guy”, Hanson was dominant, DOMINANT and you pull him!!
RDM
September 10th, 2009
8:09 am
RGP, no starter has pitched a complete game all year. I don’t think anyone of them has even been given the opportunity to pitch past the 8th.
Seriously?
September 10th, 2009
8:10 am
Thank you Captain Obvious!
RDM
September 10th, 2009
8:13 am
TH should have been given a shot at a complete game last night. He was cruising and his fastball was still hitting 95 mph in the 8th! Why has the pitch count become a rule of thumb when it was barely even discussed 6-7 years ago? The kid is 23 years old. He didn’t even break a sweat…
JeffBlouser
September 10th, 2009
8:14 am
Braves need some base-stealers. We are always at the bottom of the league in stolen bases. Cox relies too much on pitching and a mediocre offense.
Oh, and worst Brave ever?- Without a doubt RAFAEL BELLIARD.
busacap
September 10th, 2009
8:14 am
the braves are just good enough to keep you interested, then they lose
pstlparks
September 10th, 2009
8:17 am
The Braves won’t make the playoffs because of Bobby Cox. Praise him all you want. Over the years it has not been he who pushed the Braves to victory. They have won in the past inspite of him. Great pitching and adequate hitting in the nineties and only one championship? You can
credit the big three, Maddox, Glavine, Smoltz, for a great portion. Additional pickups for a year or two has helped, but Cox has been thrown out of more games than he helped win. Sure he’s just like a granddad to the players. Most grandkids get everything they want when at the grandparents house. Have a plan in place before you remove Cox though. Hopefully he will “gracefully” bow out. Pendleton as a replacement is ridiculous. You need a leader. Chipper will make a good manager some day. In the meantime allow Braves Brass to veto Cox’s game management decisions before he makes another foolish mistake, i.e., pulling Tommy Hanson. A closer should only be used when the starter is in trouble or tired.
Turtsnap
September 10th, 2009
8:17 am
All I’m Saying Is..
WHAT?? Montanez?
1976 .321 BA 9 HR 64 RBI
1977 .287 BA 20 HR 68 RBI
the anti-clutch
September 10th, 2009
8:17 am
If one game could exemplify Bobby Cox it was last night. Hanson was dominant at not even 100 pitches and he puts in Soriano.Cox loses 8-9 games a year just from his pathetic managemnt of pitchers. Look at the bullpen , my god they are lucky there arms did not fall off.
Bank Walker, Texas Ranger
September 10th, 2009
8:18 am
All I’m Saying, heck you named the best players from the 70’s. They could hit .250 with a little mustard on that hotdog Montanez.Although second tour, Earl Williams was pretty bad.
Crapper John
September 10th, 2009
8:19 am
Javy Vazquez has a complete game.
JASon
September 10th, 2009
8:23 am
Reasons we didn’t make the playoffs in order: 1)Bullpen 2)Bobby Cox 3)Hitting. Wow, hitting came in third on the list, numbers one and two must have been really bad.
M. BRADLEY
September 10th, 2009
8:24 am
September 9th, 2009
5:08 pm
I have to talk about these sorry aizz braves because every time I try and talk falcons all the people want to discuss is MICHAEL VICK! I did not cut VICK BLANK did that@**#==##@ hole! Like everybody else I want Vick back. Does any body care about these sorry aizz redneck braves? who gives a f__k! This is football season and Im stuck with having to write about mattie lice….Son of a b__t__h.
Somebody get Vick on the phone I gotta sell some papers…
And with that, I’m closing these comments. Just not in the mood today.
Steve in Blairsvile
September 10th, 2009
8:26 am
I have been a Bobby defender for a long time, but last night’s decision to pull Hanson was just about the most idiotic move I have ever seen in baseball. The kid had everything working to get a CG Shutout. He retired the last 6 batters he had faced, had a reasonable pitch count and was still going strong. There was NO reason to pull him. Bobby, you blew it.
RB
September 10th, 2009
8:29 am
I was going to blast Bobby Cox but enough has been said already.
Coach (2010 or Bust)
September 10th, 2009
8:30 am
Javier Vazquez complete game was eight innings because we lost it 4-3.
kdbanks
September 10th, 2009
8:31 am
Way to go out on a limb there, smart guy. Tomorrow’s article: “UGA won’t go undefeated this year – 5 reasons why.”
Kashi
September 10th, 2009
8:33 am
How Bobby OVERUSED bullpen? If your starting pitcher is giving 5 or 6 inning on most nights, what do you expect from a manager? Leave a worn out pitcher on mound and complain next morning for NOT taking him out early to save a game? I also do not see Martin Prado is any better in second base then Kelly Johnson. How many games Kelly won for us Vs. Martin Prado?
AlternateReality
September 10th, 2009
8:33 am
I too saw the writing on the wall when Bobby removed Hanson. Probably trying to protect his psyche,worried about him pitching a great game and falling short. I thinkit would be better for all parties to see if he could close the deal.
Thinking back to the early days of the Braves’ run, do you think Bobby would have pulled Glavine, Smoltz, or Avery (all still very young then) in that situation? I don’t think so, and it might have had something to do with Mazzone’s influence. As Leo said, “If you have the horses, you need to ride em”.
TN Jeff
September 10th, 2009
8:34 am
Hmmmm… as usual too easy on Cox. Why is Norton worst Brave ever? Cause Bobby loves keeping guys around for no apparent reason (remember Corky Miller – is he still in the majors?).
When was the last Complete Game by a Braves pitcher? Bobby loves wearing out his bullpen – this is not a new phenomenon MB. Seriously, when was the last complete game? Hasn’t happened this year and don’t think it did last year. Believe Hudson came the closest last year.
mountain_jim
September 10th, 2009
8:35 am
Soriano can not hold a one run lead, I knew the game was lost as some as Cox brought HIM in. His arm is dead, and so is Cox’s judgement.
AlternateReality
September 10th, 2009
8:35 am
And when was the last time the Braves actually stole a base (a straight steal, not just sending the runner on a hit and run)?
Has the stolen base been banned?
Preston Hannatized
September 10th, 2009
8:36 am
Don’t knock Rafael Belliard … his running catch of Kenny Lofton’s flare leading off the 9th in WS Game 6 may have been the play that saved the Braves only world championship.
AlG
September 10th, 2009
8:38 am
I don’t know if Norton is the worst Brave ever, but surely there is someone in the minors who could replace him and benefit from facing some big league pitching this month. Whoever that is, including pitchers, couldn’t do worse than Norton at the plate.
The Alpha Male
September 10th, 2009
8:39 am
Dear Mark:
Duh.
mountain_jim
September 10th, 2009
8:39 am
as soon as. ack.
Mark Bradley
September 10th, 2009
8:40 am
Here’s my defense of Cox for bringing in Soriano: I don’t have one.
T-Mama
September 10th, 2009
8:40 am
First of all, JeffBlouser, you are full of it. PacMan was an AMAZING shortstop and could NEVER be considered anywhere on the list of bad Braves players, much less the worst ones.
Secondly, let’s get an “Amen!” for Bobby’s retirement. He should be allowed to go quietly before he ends with up a string of 14 consecutive division disappointments atop his 14 consecutive titles.
Thirdly, TP may be a cruddy hitting coach, but why not just move him to coaching third base? I imagine he learned a lot about the offensive side of things with all the years he spent there defensively (and kicking AS$, I might add).
Fourthly, Kawakami has proven to be the most disappointing acquisition by FAR this season. What is the big hairy deal about him, anyway? A star pitcher in his home country – really? I hate to say it, but players in Japan must really suck if he was so successful against them, ’cause we ain’t seen ANY of that action Stateside.
Finally, at this point, I’m just hoping the Braves finish in second place. That would be a major improvement over the last few seasons and as someone who still remembers how terrible they were for sooooo long, I’ll take it.
Realist
September 10th, 2009
8:42 am
Five reasons? How about 8 1/2?
Banjo E. Devine
September 10th, 2009
8:43 am
The decision to remove Hanson was quizzical – but it is important to monitor the kid’s pitchcount in his first ever LONG season. You have a closer for a reason – alas Soriano is done. Wohlers (pre-Leyritz) & Smoltz were the only reliable closers Bobby’s ever had. The problem is really the pathetic offense. Losing to the Padres, Reds and Astros was due to a lack of hitting. Why is Francouer hitting 290 with 30 rbi in NY while Church is floundering here? Pendleton has to go. Would he be a good manager? I would not be surprised. As a hitting coach, he’s crapped the bed.
Coach (2010 or Bust)
September 10th, 2009
8:43 am
Worst Brave and biggest bust?
Undoubtedly………Brad Komminsk.
I'm Pretty Sure None of Us Expected to Make It Anyway
September 10th, 2009
8:43 am
Come on, it’s a nice story and all, but too little was done to the line-up too late. What we DID do was turn this team around, jettisoned some old blood and made some nice trades for everyday players next year. Plus we have some great talent on the farm. The future’s bright, even if the recent present hasn’t been.
The biggest concern is going to be the bullpen next year. Soriano and Gonzo are both Free Agents.
Braves_Guru_32
September 10th, 2009
8:46 am
Ahhhh….I have so many mixed emotions right now about this team its hard to even think. Watching that game last night I just knew that the one run was not going to hold up, and you should’t expect to win on one run. The Braves have NO SPARK/ENERGY! I have always liked Bobby but it really is time to go. Hanson hadn’t even thrown 100 pitches yet when he took him out last night. With Happ out for a couple starts, that complete game shutout would have been the lock on the ROY award for Hanson. And I hate to admit this but I was somewhat rooting for the Astros in the 9th just so everyone can see that Bobby has gone off the deep end and its time for him to quit.
Furthermore, The Braves need a spark plug at the top of the order and a right handed power hitter batting clean up. That is what wins Championships! Look at the Phillies last year. Speedy top 2 hitters get on base, middle order drives them in. Case and point, the 2003 Marlins who slayed the Yankees in 6 games. That team had great pitching as we already have, but they had Pierre and Castillo doing damage on the bases. The Braves have NO SPEED OR POWER and they hit into ALOT of DP’s because of it. Cox and Pendelton have to go and Wren can go too if he doesn’t start addressing these needs. Maybe next year….maybe.
Doug
September 10th, 2009
8:47 am
Well, at least they got us to football season.
It used to be by the 4th of July and it was over.
Now maybe if the Braves ever get back to the playoffs, fans will show up at the Division Series and fill the stadium.
I said all along this team was at best a 500 winning percentage.
We have average players and management, who play and manage – average
Pittsburgh Al
September 10th, 2009
8:48 am
Enter your comments here
Ralph
September 10th, 2009
8:49 am
As I recall the braves got McLouth mainly because of his speed not his batting average, he had a 97% stolen base etc, but he has only attempted 3 or 4 SB’s with the braves, he would be great with a small ball offense.
O'Brien
September 10th, 2009
8:52 am
I think one unresolved issue with Nate McLouth is where should he bat in the lineup. Is he the leadoff guy? Should he bat 6th or 7th? I have no idea, and I dont know if Bobby has any ideas either.
jake
September 10th, 2009
8:54 am
I agree with bigdawg’s assessment. And the remark about Cox’s postgame comments, they were incredibly lame and illogical. The man is wooden and robotic; he has no feel for the game whatsoever. Soriano barely escaped the night before last, and gave up a run. Hanson should have stayed in, period. But if he had to be replaced, Moylan would have been the right choice. This isn’t on Soriano — he was clearly overused. This is on Cox, who is and has been Typhoid Mary to relievers. His time was up three years ago.
Phil
September 10th, 2009
8:54 am
It was pretty evident last night to Ron Gant and Joe Simpson that Cox did the wrong thing by not allowing Hanson to finish. Those guys are catching on, when are the rest of you Cox lovers going to wake up???
Not only did Cox lose the game, but destroyed come confidence in Hanson. That kid probably couldn’t even sleep last night. This buffoon of a manager has got to go.