Hot Button: Is UGA’s Martinez a good defensive coordinator?
He's no Kevin Ramsey, but really, who is? (AJC photo by Brant Sanderlin)
The answer to the above question depends on definition. If by “good” we mean, “Way better than Kevin Ramsey,” the answer is yes. If by “good” we mean “one of the finest defensive coordinators in the nation,” the answer is no.
Willie Martinez suffers most by immediate comparison to his predecessor. In 52 games under Brian VanGorder, Georgia yielded 30-plus points only in the 2003 SEC championship game against an LSU team that would win the BCS title. In 52 games under Martinez, Georgia has yielded 30-plus points 11 times.
The average score of a Georgia loss in four seasons under VanGorder was 21-12. Not once in any of the 10 losses with BVG as DC did the Bulldogs score 20 points themselves, meaning those defeats were more related to offensive failings. Now look:
The average score of a Georgia loss in four seasons under Martinez has been 32-23. Five times in those 12 losses the Bulldogs have scored 30-plus points, which means the offense has been holding up its end.
The offense has waxed and waned under Mark Richt. (Last season the Bulldogs ranked 22nd nationally in total offense, their best showing since finishing 21st in 2001.) The defense has slipped. In four seasons under VanGorder, Georgia ranked among the nation’s top 10 in total defense twice and scoring defense three times. In four seasons under Martinez, the Bulldogs have ranked among the nation’s top 10 in those categories once apiece.
Over time, the yardage figures are almost congruent. Opponents averaged 305 yards per game against BVG’s D; they’ve averaged 302 against WM’s. What has changed is more problematic:
Georgia now has to score big to win, and that’s a tough way to travel. Forty-two points weren’t enough to beat Georgia Tech last season, and 41 wouldn’t have been enough to beat Alabama or 49 sufficient to unhorse Florida. And before we dismiss 2008 as a function of injuries and penalties and suchlike, let’s note the Bullogs lost 31-30 to Auburn and 38-35 to West Virginia in 2005 and 51-33 to Tennessee in 2006.
In two of the biggest victories of the post-VanGorder era, Georgia beat Florida 42-30 in 2007 and LSU 52-38 last season. The Bulldogs used to win because their defense served as a safety net. They now work without that net.
Loading ...Martinez’s defenders — not to be confused with the men who play his defense — say his units make key stops (against Kentucky and Auburn last season, for example) and that he plays the defense Richt wants played. But it’s tough to imagine any head coach prefers a defense that collapses periodically, and it’s difficult to argue that, given Georgia’s gaudy rankings every single Signing Day, this coordinator is working without talent.
The aforementioned Ramsey lasted one season (1999) as Jim Donnan’s defensive coordinator. His undoing was a 38-21 loss to an Auburn team that entered Sanford Stadium 4-5 but led 31-0 at the half. (Quarterback Ben Leard passed for 416 yards that bizarre night.) Bulldog fans take pride in both their stadium and their history of stalwart defense, and they filed out early on Nov. 13, 1999 believing that hadn’t ever seen and wouldn’t again see such a thing.
On Sept. 27, 2008, Alabama scored on five consecutive possessions against the nation’s No. 3 team. The halftime score in Athens was 31-0.
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353 comments Add your comment
Dawg Tired
August 28th, 2009
11:00 am
Mark – This is not necessarily as simple as most of us, including me, often make it seem. First, let me say that I would have either fired Willie or demoted him to different duties on the staff. As has been pointed out, a lot of things happened last year. The most obvious was an unbelievable rash of injuries. The other problem was an unbelievable inconsistency on offense – look no further than the bowl game against MSU. Really, I’m 63 years old and played QB only one year in high school ( that was due to an injury to the real QB). However, I really believe I could have done better than Stafford did the first half of the bowl game. Such poor offensive performances put tremendous pressure and excessive playing minutes on a defense. Yes, I know many dawg fans got excited about how well the D played against MSU. Have they forgotten it was against MSU, a mediocre team in a mediocre conference? I don’t believe the bowl game performance means much because of the calibre of the team we were playing. Another problem was a team with very poor leadership from players. This resulted in lack of effort several times when the going got tough. Most notably, this was obvious in 2nd half against UF and Tech.
Having said all that, suffice it to say that it is the responsibility of the coaches to make sure players play hard and “execute properly.” If they don’t, put someone else in the game. Neither Richt nor Martinez seem very good at being willing to do that. As to defense specifically, my admittedly limited experience as both a player and coach at the high school level makes me think that defense is primarily about effort. Having the players play hard is the job of the coach. Our D does not always show great effort under Willie. That’s his fault. That he is still the DC is also partially his fault. Knowing the “loyalty to the staff to a fault” syndrome of his boss, Willie should have already voluntarily stepped aside. However, ultimately the fault lies with the head coach. I love CMR, but he’s messed this DC thing up.
Looking at the talent that has been brought into Athens, there is no excuse for poor defensive play. Many on this blog have indicated this year is the year to determine whether Willie stays on as DC. While I think the decision is already over due, I do agree that with the talent on D we have this year, anything less than a top 5 defensive year should result in replacing Willie. I fear neither will happen.
icedawg
August 28th, 2009
11:20 am
I think there are three main factors to be considered in defensive performance in order talent, coaching and desire. A coach has to work with the talent that he has and often that mix is beyond his control. If your players are not as talented as the opponent, then you will probably end upon on the short end of the stick. Granted good coaching and desire can at times offset lesser talent, but the sustainability of that over the long term is questionable. On defense UGA has lacked talent at critical skilled positions over the past couple of years, particularly defensive end and in the secondary. The end result has been a lack of pass rush and blown coverages. Being weak in those two areas also eventually opens up the run option. It is a wonder that they’ve done as well as they have. I am not convinced that coaching is the main problem. Recruiting is not an exact science either. There is huge jump from high school ball to college. Many of the so-called “stars” fizzle. UGA has had its share. So, hopefully more of the recruits that we land will actually turn out to be the real thing and make the necessary contributions. Lay off of Martinez. Hope that some of the recruits will really pan out and be the hype that the media heaps on them.
AltamahaDawg
August 28th, 2009
11:23 am
Yea homer, that’s exactly what I (and 20 other people in here) have been saying, Nothing is Ever the coaches fault. geeez! That’s why you drama queens are so difficult to have a discussion with.
And at least identify yourself to your comments, coward.
Jaybo
August 28th, 2009
11:57 am
Willie Martinez for President!
Dawg Fud
August 28th, 2009
11:58 am
RAMBLE ON!!!
who is Tech’s opening opponent, again? (crickets chirping)…that’s what i thought sweetheart. leave this debate to people who can actually provide analysis – it is not for wives of Tech alumni who log on their husbands’ computers.
Altamahaisahomer
August 28th, 2009
12:00 pm
Can’t say i’ve ever heard you say a negative thing or criticize any of the coaches, ever. What a boring blog it would be if we all operated under your “coach knows more than us” mentality. Actually it wouldn’t be a blog, it would just be an article. Drama queen? Not sure how calling you out is being a drama queen but ok.
identify myself to my comments? I thought that’s what I did by putting something in the “name” box. Is altamahadawg your first name? What is that, dutch?
Ted Striker
August 28th, 2009
12:16 pm
Interesting trivia about the ‘99 Auburn game and the ‘08 Bama game.
chazzo
August 28th, 2009
1:12 pm
Hey, think what you want, but let’s make a pact. Any Georgia fan who boos any Georgia player or coach at a game, should be escorted from the stadium in disgrace.
Oledawg
August 28th, 2009
2:41 pm
Sic’em, Alt. Tag time since you, Cuz and a few others did yeoman work yesterday also.
Mark, you knew this would trip the smoldering fire that was finally diminished from a conflagration during and right after last season. The same fans are on here agreeing and disagreeing with the same reasoning as before, but with no resolve. You just had to start this up before the season’s start so that the naysayers could blog and hold Martinez’s feet to the fire once again. To what avail? You don’t compare apples to oranges, then sell it and then act as if a meaningful discussion might ensue.
Can’t we pack everything together and make a meaningful analysis somewhere? I have not seen the omission of last year and a comparison made to VanGorder’s years. Either you think the injuries accounted for a great deal of the problems last year or you don’t. Using the data from a flawed year when averaging all the years produced a “kickout” in my statistics when comparing apples to apples. Solution: Go back one year and start the comparison. Of course, if you don’t believe that is an anomaly (# of injured players), then that is what your blog is centered on, not Coach Martinez. Isn’t there a scientist anywhere on this blog? Mobile Dawg-Where are you?
Mark-Leaving out last season, how about a comparison to Van Gorder as to points scored, overall defense each year and all the other subjective “data” compared? Then we have a discussion. Otherwise you are holding Martinez to an artificially created standard that is flawed(by you) from the beginning. You either accept or reject last year’s injuries cascading thru the team and leading to other problems that permitted us ONLY to win 10 games. You cannot compare the two men otherwise.
It’s bad enough with the advent of spreads that Coach Martinez dealt with about five times more often than VanGorder. Compare their successes to like offenses you bonehead. I don’t recall VanGorder doing very well against the option.
I have read your articles and saw disguised humor and a little sarcasm that most bloggers haven’t caught, but somehow feel that I’ve missed those flavors this time. Go back to tongue-in-cheek, it’s better than ped in buccal cavity.
lynninsavannah
August 28th, 2009
2:52 pm
Ok i am back. Been upset at the Dogs for last years efforts not the games we lost but no having no fire or wanting to win. I truly beieve Joe COx is a winner Georgia born Georgia bred and he will carry the offense thry and get them up. On the hand we got Owens back. That will fire up the defense. Now if we can get a fire under WM we will be fine. IF not another lohg year. GO DAWGS
Life coach
August 28th, 2009
3:03 pm
We like Martinez. But don’t be too down on him because UGA is (as usual) overated. With or without him UGA will have another average year with out SEC honors, no BCS bowl, no Nat Champ (as usual).
Here are five reasons UGA will flop this year:
1) Overated (See last year)
2) UF, LSU, GT & Bama
3) Can’t win the big one (See 30 years and counting to a Nat Champ.)
4) Arrests of various players
5) History: Lot of wins but few against top talent See #1, 2 & 3
Coach BooBoo
August 28th, 2009
3:07 pm
Keep Willie and Richt where they are…It makes it easier to out-coach the mutts.
Atticus
August 28th, 2009
3:14 pm
#1 reason he probably isn’t that exceptional…..NOBODY comes offering him a job. Every great coordinator at big schools get offered HC jobs even if at smaller schools…..and he hasn’t been offered anything because he is just average. Just average aint good enough in the SEC.
Mark I will say this to play the other side….our special teams have gotten worse and given up worse field position. It shows because we don’t give up any more yardage than VG’s teams did, just more points. When the field is 10 yards shorter each drive, they can score more points with the same yardage.
chazzo
August 28th, 2009
3:41 pm
Life coach,
You think we are overated this year???????? Most think we are going 8-4 and mediocre. I hope everyone thinks like you, fella.
GA DAWG in CT
August 28th, 2009
4:34 pm
I agree with Gator Fan (and that hurts) way back up there in this post. We have lost opportunities to win because of REALLY bad defensive coaching. Let’s dig up Erk. He could do better, if in spirit only.
Time to fire the guy and move on…… I remember scores like 7-0, 13-7, 10-3, where the defense WAS the game because we had little or no offense.
Blah Blah Blah
August 28th, 2009
4:39 pm
I don’t know about Martinez but I do know that Mark Bradley is a worthless hack. Who cares what this guy thinks??? He has no talent for writing sports articles so all he does is try to stir up crap.
Are you kidding me?
August 28th, 2009
4:47 pm
Umm where were Mr Martinez’s key stops in the tech game when we needed it most. Or in the ALabama game when the game was avalancing on us? Thats a load of you know what if thats what his defenders are saying. He has this year to fix it or Mark Richt may not be able to save him.
UGA NO NATIONAL TITLE IN 28 YEARS
August 28th, 2009
4:54 pm
Georgia sucks!! Keep Willie Georgia will always be 3rd in the SEC East.
newideas
August 28th, 2009
6:40 pm
Rodney Garner for DC
Twitter Trackbacks for Hot Button: Is UGA's Martinez a good defensive coordinator? | Mark Bradley [ajc.com] on Topsy.com
August 28th, 2009
9:21 pm
[...] Hot Button: Is UGA’s Martinez a good defensive coordinator? | Mark Bradley blogs.ajc.com/mark-bradley-blog/2009/08/27/hot-button-is-ugas-martinez-a-good-defensive-coordinator/ – view page – cached Mark Bradley asks if Georgia defensive coordinator Willie Martinez is among the nation’s best at his job and decides the answer is, Not really. — From the page [...]
AltamahaDawg
August 28th, 2009
10:25 pm
Um, Where were our 3 first round draft pick in the entire 3rd quarter of the tech game when we needed ONE first down? It’s a team sport.
And in the Bama game, how many points did we score during the first half? Is that acceptable whatsoever? Or is the defense the only squad with any control over the score of a football game.
And to the other guy, you know and I know and everyone in this blog knows that you usually post under a different name. Coward. And stating that sometimes things are factors in a GAME played by teenagers is hardly saying that coaches can’t do anything wrong. That’s just a stupid. I leave myself open all the time, just hoping somebody will take me up so we can have banter. Don’t preach to me about an interesting blog when you come up with to call me on is “coaches know more than we do”. brilliant! Thats just saying something for the sake of doing so, cause it damn sure isnt an opinion or fact. How boring would this blog be if everyone just accused each other over overly simplistic cliches. How about quote me correctly if you are going to tread on my name.
AltamahaDawg
August 28th, 2009
11:28 pm
CT, do you remember getting beat 0-33 by Va, or 0-35 by Ky back then too? How about those 5 and 6 loss seasons back in the day? Is that better, if only in spirit?
Lisa
August 29th, 2009
12:40 pm
You Dawg fans should just be happy you only have to play one high school offense a season.
Thank you God for the 5 year extention!
August 29th, 2009
3:17 pm
We are going to be ga tech every year. Meow!
Thank you God for the 5 year extention!
August 29th, 2009
3:19 pm
who farted?
Camden Mark
August 29th, 2009
3:48 pm
UGA’s D over the last few years has suffered from poor game prep,poor game planing,poor in game adjustments and lack of overall effort.
All falling back on the DC.This has to be his last chance,get it turned around or get outa town.If MR won’t ditch him maybe we need to give serious thought to running him off too.
All depending upon this upcoming season ofcourse
Camden Mark
August 29th, 2009
3:51 pm
I think Jim D is looking for work
Oledawg
August 29th, 2009
4:54 pm
Now we are going to start the season with Coach Martinez under a fan microscope. This is not a worthy endeavor. Leasve the hiring and firing to the Head coach. That’s why he’s paid the big bucks and he can elect to rise or fall at UGA while paid to do that. Efforts to coach or make his decisions for him SHOULD fall on deaf ears. Inviting God and everybody to comment on Richt’s and Evan’s business is arrogance of the highest order. Many of you sound like ESPN. You have been given no charge to influence our coaching staff, but you seek the power to run things without taking the responsibility. That sucks bigtime. It’s our school’s team and many of you go too far trying to influence our business.
Mark- Have you compared defensive coaches by dropping last years stats? Why not? It’s the only meaningful comparison unless of course you enjoy putting flawed stats for comparisons. This means that you have reached a conclusion before typing your article that only is a negative article about Martinez. You are not asking a sports question, rather you are making an indictment of an individual. Someone should do it to you.
Dangerous
August 29th, 2009
10:14 pm
I say let’s see what happens this year. I do believe that this will be a telling year for WM. Injuries and poor offensive play I do believe hurt the GA D lately. The year after BVG left GA had absolutely no LB play and that was a glaring weakness and the ultimate undoing against Auburn and W Virginia. POOR Oline play and injuries have haunted this team for years now, but I think we can all agree the right man is on the job now! Just as I think Donnan and Gary Gibbs deserved another year, especially without Q Carter and with D Green, I think WM does too, but this will be a telling year for him………………………..YOU SHOULD HAVE PAID BRIAN VANGORDER BUT YOU DIDN’T AND THAT WILL HAUNT YOU FOREVER! HE DESERVED A HEFTY RAISE AND YOU JUST LET HIM WALK….FEELING BETRAYED FOR HIS HARD WORD. BVG LEFT AND A WEEK OR TWO LATER R GARDNER THREATEN TO DO THE SAME AND EVERYBODY (cmr AND adams) FLEW BACK INTO TOWN TO SAVE HIM! I’M SORRY BUT BVG WON ALOT OF THOSE GAMES HIMSELF AND DESERVED A HEFTY RAISE. LSU WAS PAYING ITS TWO TOP COORDINATORS OVER $400,000 AND I DON’T THINK BVG WAS MAKING OVER $200,000.THIS IS A TRUE AND FACTUAL STATEMENT!
Dangerous
August 29th, 2009
10:15 pm
BRIAN VANGORDER SHOULD HAVE NEVER HAD TO ASK FOR A RAISE AND I MEAN A NICE RAISE!
Lib from Midland
August 29th, 2009
11:17 pm
The better question: Is Mark Bradley compent to write a column about which he knows nothing?
Lib from Midland
August 29th, 2009
11:33 pm
Enter your comments here
Dangerous
August 29th, 2009
11:43 pm
Willie will have a good year! Stacey Searls will have a good year! The real question is will Bobo have a good year? Does anyone else think that Stafford was not coached up enough like I do? How good would he have been under Cutcliff? Cox can’t be any worse on the deep ball……….and for all those that say we missed on Chavis you’re smoking CRACK! UGA’s year will depend on the running game and I believe that anyone can run behind GA’s line this year…..GO DAWGS…SIC EM!
Dangerous
August 30th, 2009
12:09 am
WM will have a good year! S Searls will have a good year! Will Bobo have a good year, that’s the question! I think the year comes down to the running game and I do believe that the backs GA has will be able to run behind the Oline……I mean the Olines that GA has. What a great feeling to have a lot of good linemen ready to go…..GO DAWGS….SIC EM!
WildBill
August 30th, 2009
1:34 pm
Willie would have been gone a long time ago if he was coaching for anyone but CMR. I have been watching Willie. He is showing more energy, but everything else is the same. Either you have it, or you don’t. Willie doesn’t.
AltamahaDawg
August 30th, 2009
1:42 pm
I agree we should have tried to do whatever it took to keep BVG. I just dont know if that was possible for any more than another year or two, short of naming him head coach.
AltamahaDawg
August 30th, 2009
1:46 pm
What exactly is “it”?
DawgFan1
August 30th, 2009
6:04 pm
I guess we will soon see if Martinez has made any improvements during the off season with his defensive scheme. If not, it will be another long season and I say we pay Van Gorder what he wants to get him back on OUR sidelines!!!!!
WildBill
August 30th, 2009
6:30 pm
Altamaha, “it” is coaching ability.
AltamahaDawg
August 30th, 2009
8:24 pm
Oh, ok. Well you just keep up that “watching” for us all.
Chuck Uga
August 30th, 2009
8:36 pm
Mark,
It is real simple. No one is worrying about last season. It is THIS SEASON that counts. I have been in the presence of a University board member who stated “Richt better win more than nine games if he wants to stay at Georgia.” Certainly that doesn’t mean a particular year, but on average. This has to do with the amount of money being spent, the players being recruited and the expectations of those who write the checks. The rest of us are irrelevant. My opinion is that the Georgia D will likely be the best since 2002. They may or may not win the SEC East, but they will be in the race until the last week. Florida holds the cards this season just like UGA did last season. Let’s tee it up and see what happens. I like theire chances mainly because of the significant upper classmen starting and the bitter taste from last year….and no one worrying about their NFL draft position. If I am wrong, then you can guarantee changes will be made by Mark Richt including the departure of CWM. I don’t think he is going to sacrifice his job to protect his DC. At least I hope not.
FloridaDawg
August 31st, 2009
8:28 am
When anyone wants to compare Defensive Head Coaches I only have one measure and that is Erk Russell.
What would Erk do?…Well I’ll tell you what; no way would he have let use lose by so many points last year.
Florida would not have scored 49 points…and Bama…no not in the same season.
We need an Erk Russell clone…and we needed him last year.
The Hot Button: Who's the biggest dud in local sports? | Mark Bradley
September 3rd, 2009
10:34 am
[...] Willie Martinez, Georgia defensive coordinator: His players were in position; they just didn’t make the tackles. But seriously, folks … here’s the reason Unslick Willie is substandard. [...]
shards1967
September 3rd, 2009
11:17 am
If we look at the D record of late, under CWM, we can see the ugly stats. The tech game and the Bama game and such were huge D let downs. Heck, we were blowing Tech out at the half with what? 28-12? Fumbles, Pics, missed tackles and leaving our feet??? See # 09 flying into the side line and TD tech. Over and over. Sloppy was the UGA D and Tech knows it.
I am not really a M Stafford fan but he was constantly having to”save” UGA do to the D let downs over his entire career. One hand washes the other, so to speak…………the D let him down and his ill thrown PICS caused the D to have to go back on the field and so on. we were sloppy and it became a trademark of UGA’s team of late. I am a UGA grad and so is my wife and I have pulled for UGA since 1959, when I was 10.
It is clear for UGA fans starting Saturday in Stillwater ……………CWM has he troops really rev ved up and playing smash mouth and also for most of the season, or he is gone. The $$ alums will demand it and so will AD Damon Evans. CMR will have to comply or else.
This is the year to be maybe 9-3 and 10-2 BUT play solidly on BOTH SIDES of the ball and look crisp for such a young team, building for years 10 and 11,12.
Topp Dogg
September 3rd, 2009
1:07 pm
The facts dont lie,CWM should have been run out of town after GT BREAKDOWN.Time will soon tell weather he goes or stays.It is sink or swim timeCWM!
Whopper Dawg
September 3rd, 2009
1:22 pm
Willie is a fair coordinator with a lot of talent that plays a no risk, bend but don’t break emotionless defense. He also cannot adjust on game day.
That the defense has gotten worse cannot be debated, it is beyond argument. You can debate stats all you want, but the reality is that you are playing a game and playing to win. Willie’s defenses just do not have important, timely, game saving/changing plays/stands. They just don’t.
UGA has a long tradition of tough, hit you in the mouth, defense. That is long gone. Sad really. I used to love watching them play defense, now I cringe.
Choco lott
September 3rd, 2009
1:24 pm
If I were the DC, I would make it simple. Tackle the ball carrier before he crosses the line of scrimmage. If the quarterback tries to pass it, don’t let him. Any questions?
DFR
September 3rd, 2009
2:31 pm
Yeah, but BVG never coached on a team that had 20 season ending injuries in one year. We also had a very quick scoring offense last year that left the D on the field a good bit. ALSO, we had atrocious kick-offs pretty much all year that pinned the D back a good bit. Arguments can be made both ways. The fact is, other than last year, Willie has shown that he knows how to beat the spread of Florida. We played them good every year. Last year was a debacle littered with mistakes, crucial penalties, and missed opportunities (pretty much summed up our year). If we are decimated with injuries again, I think we’ll be proud of this D after this year. Leave Willie alone for now. Last year was a tough year and can’t be put on the shoulders of one man.
AceDawg
September 3rd, 2009
4:03 pm
Where did Martinez even develop his style from? If he worked under Van Gorder briefly, it would have been nice if he mimicked his schemes. Like the Van Gorder schemes where UGA was dominant, got lots of sacks and turnovers, and brutalized the opponents with several memorable hits every game. Ahh, the days of the early and mid 2000’s…
OedipusTax
September 3rd, 2009
4:59 pm
I love Rennie Curran, I really do. It is great to watch him chase down a runner. However, it seems to me that Rennie doesn’t cover the pass well at all. I don’t see him reacting to the pass quickly enough, thus, it is really easy to throw in front of him. And then he also seems very vulnerable to a tight end on a fly pattern, since the QB can throw over Rennie. However, can this weakness also reflect coaching, or the lack of coaching? I’d be interested in knowledgable feedback, as you can bet I’m watching Rennie on most defensive plays, and I want him to do well.