A race of 6.2 miles, but not, alas, for everyone

jeffrey d

July 4th, 2009
2:12 pm

When I commented on Facebook I thought you meant the people who jump in a mile or two into the race because they don’t want to run the whole 6.2. That’s what bothers me. “I want to proudly wear the shirt and boast to my friends about how I ran the Peachtree, but I don’t want to do the whole thing. Too long.”

I’ve done what you’re talking about…but only to stay with my friend (I was time group 1B she was 1A). But I had no idea people were jumping the gun that early. If they’re there before the Kenyans and seeded runners are there? I’m not sure what “it just takes too long” is supposed to mean.” You know when your time group is going to start so uh….show up at that time.

jeffrey d

July 4th, 2009
2:15 pm

As a couple of side notes about the race:

1) I hate how Moe’s always seems to hand out XL t-shirts. It’s more than likely that the people in the first few time groups aren’t going to need an XL. Oh Moe’s.

2) I love how there’s always at least one guy towards the end offering Krispy Kreme donuts. Very funny (and kind too….they’re legitimately offering donuts, not just taunting)

Elizabeth

July 4th, 2009
2:20 pm

As I was walking to my time group 8, I saw group 2 going by near Lenox. I counted at least 30-40 9’s. I was furious. Play by the rules, people. It doesn’t matter if you “aren’t winning”. They divide the groups up for a reason. No one from the ATC seemed to even be checking. I wish they could track who these people are since we had timing tags this year. Of course, in the 8’s, there were people with no intentions of running walking slowly on the left. Just had to vent! The race was a lot of fun and it was wonderful to be back at the park!

Rebecca

July 4th, 2009
2:21 pm

Wonder if D-tags will eventually fix that problem. I was thinking about it as I watched people jump in left and right.

Dave

July 4th, 2009
2:26 pm

I’m bothered by the people who snap up a “race” number with no intention of even trying to run it. It’s not the Peachtree Walkathon, people. Leave the numbers for real runners.

Beth

July 4th, 2009
2:32 pm

I agree totally with Mark’s post. This was my first Peachtree in 6 years and I was amazed at how many 90,000s and 80,000s I saw finishing around the same time I did (30,000s). Folks who jump in and don’t run the whole thing are cheating all the folks who run/walk the whole race. As Tracy Lott said, it is supposed to be a finisher’s shirt, finishers of the 10K, not a portion of the 10K. As for folks who are just wanting to be with a friend, then follow the guidelines and drop BACK to their time group and run with them there.

Cathy

July 4th, 2009
2:36 pm

They are cheating themselves. I am sure they do the same thing in all aspects of their lives. If you don’t want to run the whole race, then sign up for a 5k and let the honest people get the numbers. I know of several serious runners who would run start to finish in the correct group who did not get a number. It is just pathetic that these people would do that, but they have to live with themselves. Hopefully they will be exposed with the new timing system-

Mark in Woodstock

July 4th, 2009
2:37 pm

Having run the race this morning it was incredible the number of people “waiting” by the side of the road to jump in….get in the back of the pack and run the entire race…also if you want a better starting spot you need to earn it like the rest of us with a qualifying time….we have no place for you CHEATERS in our beloved race.

Jon

July 4th, 2009
2:39 pm

AMEN! I am in TG1A, and ran a 7:35 opening mile, then avg 6:32 the rest of the way. Why? All the bandits and lazy slow butts with numbers 70K plus that jump in front of me. Last year I knocked one guy down, and he deserved it. I HATE the jump ins- friggin losers.

Bill

July 4th, 2009
2:40 pm

I have been angered for years by “Fat Waddling Walkers” (or other descriptions for FWWs) with numbers in the 60,000+ who seem to get in the way of seeded runners at mile maker 2 or greater. They may think they are not cheating, but they sure are making the race less fun for everyone else. And I think they are cheating, if only themselves and the spirit of the event. I say — no time, no t-shirt! (I don’t know how you’d administer that, though.)

Douglas Wood

July 4th, 2009
2:43 pm

I agree wholeheartedly. It was my first race and I was with a buddy whose number was in the 90s, so I ran with him. We didn’t even think of him moving up to my number, which was in the 60s. This all reminds me of what my son’s preschool told us when he started. She said she sees so many adults who can’t wait in line, don’t have patience to play by the rules and thinks, there goes another person who didn’t learn what he or she should have learned in kindergarten. And what’s with Chic-fil-A across from Piedmont Hospital throwing T-shirts into the crowd? That was dangerous. I almost mowed someone over when they suddenly stopped to try and grab a T-shirt.

Tamara

July 4th, 2009
2:43 pm

I heard one pre-race runner give a very snotty remark to an ATC volunteer when they were told to go backwards to their own group. It just isn’t the way to start the day…

Also, WHY must spectators insist on smoking on the course? Seriously, it’s not that pleasant for those of us running!

Bobby

July 4th, 2009
2:43 pm

It’s not that I don’t agree with you 100% about the cheating but I don’t know what you do about it either. For the Peachtree it’s the coveted shirt at the end and I don’t know of any effective way of preventing someone from simply showing up at the end wearing a race bib and collecting the shirt. I suppose race officials could take down numbers along the route and disqualify people but then you have to contend with human error which could deny an actual finisher the shirt. I ran the race the full 6.2 (6.3 by my Garmin) this morning. Congrats to your wife for completing the distance.

Bob

July 4th, 2009
2:49 pm

Perhaps in the future the timing devices can be used to enforce the real rules……

Doc

July 4th, 2009
2:50 pm

Cheating is bad. Another form of nonsportsmanship is escalating each year: aggression. My wife was 4 groups in front of me. She said she got shoved outright (while walking..on the right side..practically along the curb) into one her friends by a ‘gentleman’ running through, nearly toppling both ladies.

Oh, what I was thinking when my wife shared this with me just an hour ago, when we met up back home: first was my wish for the ‘gentleman’ to hopefully read this and accept my invitation for us to meet and let me share some lessons in Tae Kwon Do and proper behavior.

Mainly, I believe the ATC can have their volunteers use some 21st century technology and savvy to send a message: such behavior will deprive one of their beloved T-shirt, and be banned from registering in future events. How hard is it to snap a pick of an offender’s bib number and send that number to an official at the Finish Line? Then, the perp can be met with a T-shirt Nazi line: “No T-shirt for you!”

For sure with this aggression, displayed by the shovers or the rude sayer: “Walk on the right”, which is ‘road rage’ envoking, a message needs to be sent about zero tolerance on any confirmable, verifyable aggression.

BobDog

July 4th, 2009
2:50 pm

I suppose that with the ID tags, people who cut in will not show as having started and should be ineligible to run next year??? Especially if they show a finish and no start.

JimC

July 4th, 2009
2:51 pm

I’m not a runner, but my hat is off to those who do the 10K in the heat and humidity of July. I agree with the person who said that people who cheat in the race probably cheat in other things too.

Mike

July 4th, 2009
2:52 pm

Companions who wish to start together need to start with the group of the runner with the highest number. Using companionship as a reason for moving up is a poor excuse for cutting the line of all the other runners who are in their designated spots.

Frank Beltran

July 4th, 2009
2:52 pm

Since every number got a computer chip, only those whose chip shows that it was recorded at the start and at the end should get the coveted T-shirt. That way those who jump in get no shirt! Only 9 weeks to GEORGIA FOOTBALL! GO DAWGS!!

Johh

July 4th, 2009
2:53 pm

I observe many more cheaters now than when I began running the event 20+ years ago. Many people join the course in Midtown, non-sweating, appearing as fresh as if they had just stepped out of their air-conditioned homes. Start jumpers with high numbers run in the lower number groups. As for the guy that had to cheat by moving up to stay with his partner- did it ever occur to him to move back to the lower time group? That’s the protocol.
Who is being cheated? Everyone of us in the PTRR and the event itself. Our experience and accomplishment are diminished if our “trophy” shirts only mean that we showed up at the end along with thousands who walked or ran only part of the course. And the time group start procedure makes the event enjoyable for all. We pay for event management and agree to a rule system when we enter.
I believe that it is a sad part of what we have become- a cheater society. Too many have no use for rules applyig to them. Cheat in sports, cheat the government, cheat the consumer, cheat merchants. Cheat red lights. Jump into the race at Peachtree Battle. Let the chumps wait an hour and a half to start at Lenox. It’s a lack of respect for your fellow runners, citizens, and 40 year old institution- the PTRR.

The Bald Monk

July 4th, 2009
2:54 pm

I hate cheating cheaters. Course jumpers are the lowest scum. I wish there was some way to prevent the line jumpers from getting their t-shirts.

SA

July 4th, 2009
2:55 pm

This is my 4th year running this race and it annoys me to no end when I spend half my time (in the 20,000 group) trying to go around walkers in the later groups who CLEARLY cheated. All we can hope for is that the ATC will be able to see from the timing who cheated, and prevent them from entering next year’s race. Enough already.

Independent thinker

July 4th, 2009
2:59 pm

As someone who just ran my 25th consecutive PTRR, it galls me to see this type of behavior. I guess some people just believe they are special. Consequently, this may have been my last one. Can’t deal with the cheaters and boorish behavior. I don’t see the spirit of the Peachtree as it was intended. Sad…..

Presenting the first-ever Peachtweet Road Race! | Mark Bradley

July 4th, 2009
3:00 pm

[...] birdies. I thank you for your help, and for cheering me up on a day when I was somewhat angered by the cheating I saw ongoing. And now to your more cheery [...]

Samatva

July 4th, 2009
3:00 pm

Atlanta has problem residents – people who are “too important” to follow the rules. This was so evident by my recent trip to Denver/Boulder – people follow the many, more stringent rules and drivers there are not the jerks that so many Atlanta drivers can be.

While I didn’t run this year, I have found the Peachtree to be the worst 10K due to issues mentioned here – the smoking by participants, the huge number of walkers (many who must have been jumpers) who don’t stay to the side.

If the organizers want to make this a great road race, they must have entry standards, such as a finishing time ( < 1:45? ) from another race. Having 30,000 “real” runners would be so much better than allowing all the others to clog thisngs up.

I hope the ATC will publish a list of “not an accurate or complete time” participants… There’s enough photo evidence to dispute any real malfunctions of the timing system.

It’s so sad that so many in Atlanta need to cheat (or speed or be rude) to prop up their self-esteem.

Mike Lum

July 4th, 2009
3:01 pm

Thanks for exposing this. It’s happened for many years. My pet peeve is the walkers, who should stay to the right. Instead they meander about wherever they wish. I’ve seen a few cell phones in years past. This year a lady was stopped in the middle of the road, near Collier, sending a text. I also saw a lady walking to the start in her running outfit and number…puffing on a cigarette.

Good ideas…since everyone was timed, next year they ought to be able to put the slowpokes in the back…and the cheaters out of the race.

Michelle

July 4th, 2009
3:02 pm

I agree that it’s just wrong to “jump in” down the course, no matter what the reason may be. If you are going to run the Peachtree then commit to running the whole race. If you don’t want to start at the back of the pack then train and get in a time group.I’m not a super fast runner and I’ve worked hard to train and do qualifying races for the past several years for 1 B. I had several people jumping in front of me near Piedmont and then moving a turtle’s pace. It’s really just rude and self-centered, but these cheaters are really just cheating themselves so pity them. I don’t think they have the same mentality about wearing the shirt…they don’t feel it’s a symbol of their dedication and resolve, but rather a fun t-shirt to have in their collection. It’s not a true “runners” race so I guess we should just call it a fun Atlanta tradition and lower our expectations. It’s more of a parade than a race. But for my fellow rule followers out there…the good news is that those that jump in probably won’t have an official posted race time because their timing device never crossed the start line mat…and I am sure they are all just fine with that!

Chuck

July 4th, 2009
3:04 pm

Mark I agree with you somewhat as a long time runner in the seeded section, but you should know a little more about this subject before posting. This year they let the original runners from 40 yrs. ago start at 7:22 AM and they were to stay on the right side of the road. So therefore some you saw were probably the original runners (and family members). It is bad that the others jump in at different parts of the course, but their only cheating themselves and now with the new timing system won’t get credit for their times.

Jay Litton

July 4th, 2009
3:05 pm

I enjoyed the weather and the Peachtree as much as ever. However, after 12 Peachtrees I must agree that I saw more high numbers in my group after 1/2 mile than at anytime ever before. I even saw numerous 70’s and 80’s at the 3 mile marker!

I agree that a little high tech effort like Doc discusses would increase the costs of the event but would definitely make it fair for the others that are playing by the rules.

Andy

July 4th, 2009
3:06 pm

You are given a number and you need to RUN in your time group. Like when you get a ticket to the braves game, you don’t sit in someone else’s seat and interfere with their enjoyment of the event. I agree with Mark’s post. If it’s too long, then don’t run it. Find a 5k. If you really want to be at the start of the race then run a pre-qualifier like me and get seeded.
What kills me is the folks who intentionally put down a faster time on the app than they will actually run and they end up in a low group and WALK. Do NOT WALK in the lower time groups! I wish to run the event like it should be done. If you wish to walk then join group 9. Thank you again for the blog, Mark.

spider

July 4th, 2009
3:06 pm

i cant believe the PEACHREE has come to this

First Time runner

July 4th, 2009
3:07 pm

Not only is it the cheaters who are irritating, it’s also those who don’t read the rules and WALK across the whole course and leave barely any room for the runners. The rules say that walkers need to walk on the RIGHT side, not thoe whole road. I almost tripped a couple of times because of these people. On top of that, I don’t think the walkers realize you’re making the runners use more energy than we need to be using by having to go around you. The ATC should limit the number of walkers to ensure the runners can actually move on the course. SO annoyed by this

BobBQ

July 4th, 2009
3:08 pm

I’ve run the race since 1978. Here’s what I’ve learned, you join the ATC, you get a lower race #. Period! I’m still amazed at the types who sport a 10,000 or 20,000 # & can barely trot. It’s who you know in this race! I jump in 1/4 mile in, I won’t be held hostage by the ATC. People need to chill.

Justin M

July 4th, 2009
3:10 pm

Simple solution, and they’re almost already there. Put checkpoints up along the course that read the RFID tags they started using this year. If a runner didn’t pass by all of the checkpoints, and they had an abnormal time between two of them (place them equidistant, then average the time it takes that runner to get from point to point — and if one of them is WAY off, something is wrong)… then they don’t get a shirt.

Jon M

July 4th, 2009
3:10 pm

I know the publish the “slower keep right” In the book and announce it but they need to post it or tell the “race staff” to inforce it on down the course. Its horribble!!!!! Oh and if you plan on stopping to drink your water walk/run your butt to the right side of the road!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!!!!! Its a frigan race people!!!!

catlady

July 4th, 2009
3:11 pm

These are the same people who jump in front of the line at an exit on the interstate. Me first! they cry. It’s too hard (or long)! they cry. Just let people pay their money and give them a tshirt. Then maybe they will actually run the thing or not; they will have the shirt. Allow the elite runners ONLY on the course at one time, and everyone else at another. Early nonelite runners pulled off and detained as tresspassers by the police.

When it is time for the wheelchair racers, do they allow “runners” on there then? Is there a problem with wheelchair racers coming in midway?

For goodness sakes, don’t reward cheaters!

Paula

July 4th, 2009
3:14 pm

I agree. I got stuck with the kiss of death 9 this yr. I definitely was not happy. I was one of the first to sign on line. My girlfriend got in about 20 minutes after I did and she got in the 3’s. But even so I followed the rules and went where I was supposed to. Thank God it wasn’t as hot as usual. Too bad there’s no way to stop people from jumping in wherever they feel like it.

Gary

July 4th, 2009
3:14 pm

This was my 29th Peachtree. I was in time group 1 and finished with and shortly before people who obviously didn’t run the whole course. There is no realistic way to keep people from jumping in. However, what if after time group 2, T-shirts were not given to anyone until 50 minutes after their group was scheduled to start. At least cheaters would have to stand around awhile to earn their T-shirts.

Childers

July 4th, 2009
3:16 pm

Howdy & God Bless America! That said, I ran & walked the whole PTRR today with a 40,000 number. I ran my first one in 1983 and ran several more. The I marched several playing a marching snare drum with a man who’d had a stroke and couldn’t quite run – we were always the last ones to finish, AFTER the cleaner trucks. They always found a couple of t-shirts for us – however long it took us.

Thus year my wife, who’d trained all year got a number in the 80,000s. She applied for both of us at the same time. I found odd the apparent randomness of the number assignments. Neither of us had any qualifying times for a lower number and didn’t report any. So, we didn’t cheat and ran/walked the whole thing and had wildly different time groups.

Nonetheless, I too am maddened by the junk in the trunks that want to walk three abreast on the left side of the road. The race officials announce that walker should keep to the right – just as in vehicular traffic. But, people don’t think the rules apply “to them” and are incensed when someone verbally reminds them “walkers to the right” (no, I’m not the rude shover). When we find the cure for people, it’ll all be over.

Happy 4th & God Bless America!

Stating the Obvious

July 4th, 2009
3:17 pm

I’d like some clarification.

If this was the first ARR that was electronically timed, wouldn’t you have to officially cross the start line to have your time start?

Seems obvious to me that you would – and those that don’t, shouldn’t get a shirt! Pretty simple really.

Hopefully the races is 100% privately run (the government could frig up a free lunch) – and if that’s the case, I don’t see this problem happeming much longer with the electronics of today!

Nora

July 4th, 2009
3:17 pm

My favorite evidence of the cheaters is when you see the TV coverage – the reporter standing on Cardiac Hill with the clock showing 45:00 and TG 9 people WALKING by, waving at the camera. Huh? Your Time Group hasn’t even left the corral yet and you’re already at Mile 3? You must be a smoking superstar…..(not)

John

July 4th, 2009
3:19 pm

This was my 5th or so race and I ran it with my two sons in group 9. I’m a pretty slow runner but made it through and had a great time. I agree that this is more of an ATL tradition than a serious race for most (not all perhaps) – even I need to slow down and dodge left side walkers. So – don’t let the cheaters take away your achievement – you have that – they do not. Also – I think the walker situation was better than past races – more in the right lane. I personally suspect that many of the left side walkers might not be aware of the right way to do it. Yes there is info here and there – but there needs to be a LARGE sign at the start and every few miles for walkers to stay right – how about some color-coded markings on the road as well – indicating a walkers lane?

John

July 4th, 2009
3:20 pm

Mr. Bradley, in reference to the companion running statement you made, here is the official statement as listed in the official race instructions. “If you want to run with someone else who has been assigned to a different group, you can do so as long as you run in the later of the two groups.”

I wonder how many folks heeded that rule? But all in all a fun day was had by all.

Philip

July 4th, 2009
3:21 pm

It is the very reason I stopped running the race. I was always in time group 3 and always had people from the last time group in mine. The biggest problem is that these people tend to walk. After dodging these walkers for 6.2 miles i have run the close to 10 miles. I think a they should have everyone qualify for the Peachtree by running 4 other 10k during the year.

Bo

July 4th, 2009
3:22 pm

“How is it cheating? What are those people ‘winning’?” …

I’ll tell you how it’s cheating. I train hard all year long to get a TG1A number. I arrive early and wait patiently in my time group. And then the race starts, and all these cheating lard asses jump from the sidewalk anywhere from .5 miles to several miles into the race.

Instead of running my expected 7:00/mile pace, I weave and bob around the L-A’s for the first couple of miles. My finishing time reflects the obstacles that these cheaters represent.

So, they’ve cheated me out of the space I’ve earned on the road. And they’ve cheated me out of a better finishing time. I’m no elite athlete, but I play by the rules, only to be punished by the idiots that think too highly of themselves.

To you cheaters, you should only pull half that T-shirt onto your fat bodies, because you surely didn’t earn the whole thing.

Thanks Mark, great column, hope your wife had a great experience.

John

July 4th, 2009
3:24 pm

BobBQ, you are not held hostage. You do not have to participate if you feel the ATC is not treating you fairly. You have no entitlement to be in the PTRR or to establish your own rules because you do not agree with them.

I do agree that except for a few thousand people this is a fun event and everyone who can start at the start, finish at the finish, follow a few simple rules, and treat their fellow runners/walkers with respect should be encouraged to participate. This is a great Atlanta event and we should work to keep it fun and meaningful.

Jay

July 4th, 2009
3:24 pm

While running this morning, I mentioned to a fellow runner as we moved to the RIGHT to pass walkers on the left…”they run this race the way they probably drive…clog the left lane instead of “slower traffic keep right”. Folks, they tell you over and over again, KEEP RIGHT IF YOU ARE WALKING OR ARE A SLOWER RUNNER. Walking down the middle with your friends 5 across is just rude and selfish. This is a running event, not a parade! If you want to make it a party and/or a social event, then WAIT IN THE PARK!

just saying

July 4th, 2009
3:27 pm

I did the Peachtree a couple of years ago and I commented to my veteran runner brother about the line jumpers, fast ones in the slow lane, slow ones in the fast lane. He made the great observation that it’s same way people behave on the Atlanta interstates. Some just think they are too damn important to follow the rules.

Coach Scott

July 4th, 2009
3:27 pm

When I’m not even sure Americans are “winning” an Independence Day race – I’m not sure cheating really makes me flinch.

Bo

July 4th, 2009
3:28 pm

BobBQ:

Your excuse is lame. ATC is holding no one hostage. You can certainly stay home if you don’t like their registration method.

You’re a cheater, plain and simple. And if it weren’t for idiots like you, I would chill.

jm

July 4th, 2009
3:28 pm

I saw MANY RUNNERS to the right this year. I thought that the right was for the walkers and left for the runners. We get yelled at when we cross the yellow line to your side…Therefore; you should get yelled at on our side. YOU DON’T OWN THE ROAD!

Shannon

July 4th, 2009
3:31 pm

AMEN!! It burns me up as much as it does you. It is flat out cheating!! If you don’t want to wait until your time group starts, don’t run the race. I know, better yet, if you want to start up front simply run a qualifying race earlier in the year. I am wearing my shirt with pride because I finished all 6.2 miles!

Jay

July 4th, 2009
3:36 pm

I wonder how many of these low -life cheaters have already posted their shirts on EBay? Oops…I hope I haven’t given them any ideas!

Mike

July 4th, 2009
3:37 pm

I was in Time Group 3. I walked, and I kept to the right.

At the two-mile mark, I was passed by a wave of serious runners from Time Group 4. At the four-mile mark, I was passed by the runners from Time Group 5. And at the six-mile mark, I was passed by the runners from Time Group 6. I saw DOZENS of people from time groups 7 through 9 along my route, and I knew they couldn’t possibly have started at Lenox at their official time.

The ATC volunteers at Lenox are very diligent about not letting people into areas for time groups earlier than theirs. The rules state that if you want to run with someone in another group, you run in the later group. I saw a man with a 1B number asking directions to Time Group 8 so he could be with his daughters.

The people who cut ahead are cheating themselves, and they’re cheapening the thrill of winning and getting the t-shirt. Hopefully the timing tags will show all of these cheats who didn’t start, and their names will be blacklisted from future events.

(One question on timing – I was doing about a sixteen minute mile, and I crossed the 6-mile mark 96 minutes after I started. Why, then, did the clock on the finish line say I did the entire route in 90 minutes?)

John

July 4th, 2009
3:39 pm

OK, Coach Scott. As I understand your position, because the event’s elite runners are non-Americans, you can’t get excited about boorish behavior and jumping into the event after the start? Is this how you coach- we don’t have much of a chance, boys and girles, so instead of participating fairly, do whatever you can get by with?

BobBQ

July 4th, 2009
3:40 pm

John: The PTRR has evolved into more than just the road race. It’s an event. People attend for many reasons now- spectate & cheer, hear the music, socialize, visit the park, food & drink, and run. So what if someone hasn’t built up to 6.2 mi yet(not me), & decides to run the last 4 by dropping in (no shirt involved). They can soak up the atmosphere & have a blast- just follow the rules & stay right. I’ll make a deal with you- I won’t focus on the baffling distribution of lower race numbers & you focus on the 99% of everyone that follows safe etiquette and has a great day!

tyler

July 4th, 2009
3:42 pm

i finished in 64 minutes, 9 minutes faster than last year! whoo! legitimately too… what a great event

Julia

July 4th, 2009
3:43 pm

Man- you guys are such whiners!! Have good sportsmanship- stop taking it soo seriously and grow up! I ran the race, my mother walked. Who cares?!?

Jay

July 4th, 2009
3:44 pm

To “jm”…I was one of those runners that veered into YOUR right along with many others. We HAD TO because there were hundreds of your precious walkers clogging up the left walking in the shade, socializing, petting dogs, etc. I even had one person STOP in front of me so her friend could take her picture! Luckily I had just enough space to avoid her. Next year….right over the top…how’s that picture, sweetie?!

Prevent Cheaters from getting t-shirts...

July 4th, 2009
3:44 pm

The Atlanta track club should hand out wrist bracelets in the the starting carols about 5 minutes before each group starts. Then require a bracelet in order to get a T-shirt.

Brian

July 4th, 2009
3:44 pm

I agree — the number of cheaters has increased substantially. I used to run seeded and subseeded, and saw people jumping in all the way up at Brookwood. Now that the ATC is using chips, there is a reasonable solution: back check the numbers for who crossed the start and finish using the chip technology. Those that don’t start at the beginning should be banned next year and/or for life.

Runner

July 4th, 2009
3:47 pm

Did anyone look at these wacky overall times? How did so many runners in late time groups (like 9)have faster chip times than the runners in time groups 1A/B. Why did lots of runners in time groups 1A/B have times exceeding 1 hour. Didn’t you have to submit qualifying times?

cab

July 4th, 2009
3:48 pm

Mark I’m glad you called these people out. They have no shame and will strut around in their t-shirts like they completed the entire course. Well at least this year everyone’s time is posted online. No more lying about times and if you can’t fine someone’s time? Well, you already know!

JR

July 4th, 2009
3:50 pm

Overall, I agree that people jumping in halfway through the race and trying to jump time groups is reprehensible… on the other hand, not sure what the ATC can do to curb such behavior. It’s unfortunate that we live in such “me first society” where people think the above behavior is OK. On another note, if you’re going to walk, go to the side. I understand that not everyone is in super-duper shape, but to stop and walk RIGHT in the middle of the course… 200 feet into the race(yes, I saw several people do this)… is bad sportsmanship. I think we’d all be better off if we thought about the other participants in the race. My $.02

Mike

July 4th, 2009
3:50 pm

Times are out now for all of the runners – the highest place finish I could find was 50009. Wouldn’t this imply that 4,991 people either didn’t show up, or didn’t get an official time because they cheated?

BG

July 4th, 2009
3:57 pm

I like the wrist bracelets idea (@ 3:44 pm); “back check[ing]” won’t stop the cheaters — they’ll just avoid crossing the finish line, or there will be a horrible jam at the t-shirt station.

Chuck

July 4th, 2009
4:00 pm

Checking out results and perfect example of what Mark is talking about b/c obviously 224-226 didn’t do this time and guessing won’t be running in any more Peachtree 10K’s. http://projects.ajc.com/running/peachtree/2009/?index=200&order_by=place&dir=asc

Mike

July 4th, 2009
4:02 pm

From the Wikipedia article on Rosie Ruiz:

“As a result of the scandal, the Boston Marathon and several other races instituted a number of safeguards against cheating that are still used today. These include extensive video surveillance and the transponder timing RFID system that monitors electronically when runners arrive at various checkpoints on the course. ”

Hmm…

Dave

July 4th, 2009
4:07 pm

It’s not “it’s only cheating if you get caught;” it’s cheating if you cheat. If you jump in someplace other than the starting line, you’re cheating, plain and simple, and you should not get a shirt. People who would cheat in the PRRR probably cheat in other things; it’s part of their fabric. But hey, it’ll catch up with you sooner or later, usually at the most inopportune time.

Keep it up Mark! Good job

Wendy

July 4th, 2009
4:12 pm

I agree with you about the walkers needing to stay to the right out of respect for the runners and I agree with starting at your slotted time – but I don’t see how the numbers can represent what you have done in the past because one of my sisters has only “walked” the race 1 time and she was given a 30,000 #, her husband has walked it a few years more than that and he was in the 90’s, my other sister and mom have never done it and they were in the 80’s. Now – as far as wanting the “walkers” out of the race – it is the ATLANTA Journal and Constitution PEACHTREE Road Race – so I think, before you tell the American citizens – or GEORGIA residents – that they can’t participate in something in their own country/state, you should get rid of the others! Sorry, but that is how I feel! But wtg to the winners…. I LOVED IT and would love to do it again next year – if you allow a GEORGIA walker in.

Dave

July 4th, 2009
4:15 pm

Oh yeah, BobBQ, you just don’t get it; dropping in is CHEATING; you’re breaking the rules. If you haven”t built up for it, don’t run it; wait until next year and do it right (start training earlier and wait your turn to start). Either that, or start where/when you’re supposed to, run/walk it, and stay out of everybody else’s way.

I have a better idea for you; how about just play by the rules, and then we don’t have to have this discussion.

‘k? thx.

Marie

July 4th, 2009
4:16 pm

I’ve been a spectator at Peachtree for years. The timing device which everybody was given this year didn’t do much, if any, good. I had hoped the ATC might publish a list of names of those who did not start, yet finished the race. This morning I was frustrated to see many of the cheaters had not even put the timing device on their shoe as instructed. I guess that would eliminate their name from any “did not start list.” I would love it if along the route, the ATC had volunteers mark any blatant cheater’s number with a magic marker. When those runners arrived at the finish line with a marked number, then they would not be given a t-shirt!

BTY…… the three runners in my family had numbers in the 10,000’s, 60,000’s, and 80,000’s. All three ran in time group 8 so they could be together. Honor IS important in our family.

Charles

July 4th, 2009
4:24 pm

WOW!! This was my first P’tree race and I wanted to say “Thanks” to the ATC for hosting such a awesome event. I started running seriously Jan 09′ and this was my first 10k. Everyone was very gracious, but I did have one girl jump into race at Mile 6 from the sidewalk…( wanted to trip her, but refrained..LOL) Anyways, it is unfortunate that some folks feel they are above the rules or just too impatient! Thanks again ATC, great job!!

Michael

July 4th, 2009
4:25 pm

This kind of cheating mirrors the cheating in Americans daily lives that involve greed, envy, and shortcuts to wealth and perceived happiness.

Everything is a product that can be purchased by just anyone and the exclusivity perishes along with the pride in attaining it.. This means our present economic slump, even if we recover, will be masked in government bailouts and those wanting to profit somehow off scamming the bailout money. BushObama should have just let the house burn down.

Biff Pocoroba

July 4th, 2009
4:25 pm

The last time I ran Peachtree a few years ago, I was sub seeded but could barely run for the first three miles because of people jumping in off the sidewalk instead of starting where they belonged. I haven’t run it again since. I prefer to run the Woodstock 5k that only has about 1000 people and not have to deal with Marta.

Running

July 4th, 2009
4:28 pm

I have to agree wtih Julia … stop whining about this. There are walkers and there are runners. The times start when they cross the start line and finish when they cross the finish line. If they are cheating, they won’t have a time to compare with any other years that they run it. So, even if you run in time group nine, your time doesn’t start until you start, so Chuck, those runners (222-224) that you posted probably did finish in less than 40 minutes. For all of you who get irritated with the “fat walkers”, grow up! They have every right to be doing this, just as you do. Just because you are in shape and run all the time, doesn’t mean that everyone else is going to be the same as you. If the race is so important to you, why are you so worried about what anyone else is doing? As for the ones who mentioned trying to get into a higher time group, unless you are an elite runner and in group 1 or 2, the numbers are given out on a TOTALLY RANDOM BASIS! My husband has run it 8 years in a row, with virtually the same race time each year, and has been in every time group.

Roz

July 4th, 2009
4:33 pm

What about the people with iPods? I thought the rules stated NO earphones? There were plenty of people with those.

Lola

July 4th, 2009
4:33 pm

OK folks…enough with the rude comments. I was in Group 8 and stayed where I belonged and to the right when I walked. But calling people fat *sses, lard butt and wide loads is pathetic. I was just as annoyed by the runners on the far right acting like I was in their way! Move to the left! As a beginning runner, I have a right to try my best and stop when necessary for my health. Not everyone in the world is a size two athlete and we all have to start somewhere! The lady next to me was running her first race after losing 230lbs! She ran and walked and had a right to do both! Another man was crippled…so does he not have a right to walk. Yes…there should be rules and walkers to the right and no cheaters but being rude makes you the *ss!

BobBQ

July 4th, 2009
4:37 pm

Dave: I see many “runners” walking (left side) before hitting the 3 mi mark. I check, issued 10,000 or 20,000 number. That’s a problem. People make the event what they want. This isn’t the Boston. Quit whining. Enjoy the holiday. Focus on yourself. Have fun & stay right if you are walking!

Echo

July 4th, 2009
4:50 pm

I have complained about the jumpers for a few years and most of the time I am told “to stop being a whiner, other people can’t run the entire way” or whatever excuse they have. I like the wristband idea as well!

I was one of those who didn’t have a time. I didn’t wear my d-tag because I didn’t want an “official time”, been out for 7 months with injuries and knew my time was going to be dissappointing. I did start (in a later time group than my TG2) and the wristband idea wouldv’e worked even without my chip time.

If you didn’t submit an official time (from a previous race) you are assigned to time groups randomly. Some slower runners do end up in TG2 and some faster folks get TG9.

DB

July 4th, 2009
4:57 pm

Just had to vent: I was standing in front of the High Museum, just past the water stop and watching for the rest of my family when when idiot teenage runner runs up to me (with a number) and throws the entire cup of water on me, screaming “Happy 4th of July!” Thanks, bozo — you got the cell phone I was holding wet. I was obviously a spectator and was sanding there, politely clapping for runners and chatting with another spectator — why in the hell would he do that?!

Spence

July 4th, 2009
5:05 pm

The people starting beyond the starting line really chap my hide. A few years ago, I shouted “shame!” at some of these people wearing bibs more than a mile into the race sipping their coffee. One shouted back, “no, brains!” I was so peeved I ripped the bib from a woman standing at the 2-mile marker waiting to start. Someone chased me down and got it back from me. He must have felt like a hero, but he was defending a villain.

Pam

July 4th, 2009
5:12 pm

Last year I flew in from Oregon to run the Peachtree with my sister and nephew. My nephew had a fairly low start number, unlike my sister and me. So, he start BACK with us so we could all run together. We roasted on the pavement in the start “corral” for at least an hour and a half. My brother-in-law, on the other hand, was seeded and started a little after 7. He finished quite a while before we even started to run. Was it miserable for us? Yes. Did we “sneak up?” No, didn’t even consider it. That’s part of the experience of the Peachtree. I like to tell people that the Peachtree was the hardest race I’ve even finished, which is absolutely true. Harder than any of the 20+ marathons I’ve run. It isn’t supposed to be easy so why would someone cheat to make it so?

pchtree girl

July 4th, 2009
5:14 pm

The only thing you “cheat” by”jumping in” is getting an official time for yourself. If you paid for a entry/number, you’ve paid for your shirt. As far as inconveniencing others by starting ahead of your time group…if this is a problem, Atlanta Track Club should do something to rectify so people can’t “jump in.” Otherwise, to each his own. Happy 4th Americans. Land of the free.

xc for life

July 4th, 2009
5:47 pm

This year, I tried to register for the Peachtree for the first time ever, but registered too late. I am a serious runner for my high school cross country team. To hear that people are cheating and just walking the race p*sses me off so bad! If you want to walk, walk the Greenway and make way for the serious runners!

Jake

July 4th, 2009
6:03 pm

One of my good friends does this, he was supposed to be in group 8 but jumped in past the buckhead marta station. He says he finished at 8:50… 5 minutes after our time group started. His reason? Doesn’t want to wait around. He tried to get me to join him, but I wouldn’t do it. People who think the rules don’t apply to them (but I’m sure they think everyone else should follow them) are what is wrong with america, and I let him know it!

Allen

July 4th, 2009
6:32 pm

I was in time group 1B for about the 5th year in a row and thought it was noticably less jumpers than usual. It was pretty much open to as fast as you wanted for a 50-55 minute 10K guy like myself. (1st mile always a little clogged) So hopefully the psyche of the timing devices at least detered a few hundred from years past and will only get better in the future.

run_all_the_race

July 4th, 2009
6:35 pm

This has been my pet peeve for several years. One year I took a disposable camera and snapped or fake-snapped pictures of runners obviously cheating, telling them they would be on “peachtree.cheaters.com” (never actually did this). Several ideas that have been stated are great – all about returning the race to runners. Who said everyone could do it. I remember the ‘T-shirt clock’ from my early PRRs. The first PRR I ran (1989) I was extremely motivated to beat the T-shirt clock. I certainly don’t remember any walkers then – but the race was limitted to 20 or 25K – big difference from 55K. Anyway, my response to the people that say they paid their money and should get a T-shirt – mine is cheapenned by your actions. Mine is from the Peachtree RR 10K, not 8K, 5K, etc.

Danny

July 4th, 2009
7:10 pm

I’ve been watching from my favorite spot for 9 years now. (About 100 yards short of the finish line, Piedmont Park all around me.) I too was annoyed at the cheating that I noticed this year. Seemed to be more than ever. I like to compare it to golf. A person plays a round of golf, takes “gimmees” that he happens to miss, rolls the ball in the fairway for a better spot, drops a ball out of his pocket while searching the woods for his wayward ball, etc…. Then this person comes in boasting about the 80 he shot! Unbelievable! Absurd! And it’s the same exact thing with the Peachtree Road race participants. I don’t care whether they run the entire distance, if it’s not when they’re supposed to, it wrong! And those jumping in, don’t get me started…

Rogers Nelson

July 4th, 2009
7:15 pm

Who cares? Why doesn’t the AJC quit sugar coating this event and talk about how bad MARTA is about getting people to and from the event? Come on, no shuttle to the Midtown station? Did it really need to take an hour to get from Five Points to the start?

Oh but no, people jumping in the race to get a T-shirt is much more important. Continue please…

Bobby

July 4th, 2009
7:25 pm

Chill folks. I was in TG3 and had no problem finishing just under an hour. True in a less crowded I would have finished a little faster but I enjoyed the race. I ran it all the way including up Cardiac Hill. I did dodge walkers on both the right and left but I didn’t have a difficult time getting past them when I wanted to. I even ran the PRR 18 minutes faster than last year. It is what it is. Looking forward to next year.

Runner Girl

July 4th, 2009
7:32 pm

I’ve run in the Peachtree for years now. To me, it’s always seemed to be more of an “event” than a serious race – at least once you get beyond that first group of runners. I thought the vast majority of walkers were on the right side of the road today, and if I had to run around someone here and there? Big deal – the Peachtree is what it is. It’s a holiday event, and most people seemed to be enjoying themselves. If you want a really serious road race, this is not the race for you in my opinion. I’ve always felt this way, but I still participate. I’m surprised at how many posters here are so up in arms about people jumping in along the way. Yes, some people do this, but I think the vast majority start where they are supposed to.

Carrie

July 4th, 2009
7:44 pm

This was my 5th Peachtree Road Race and I chose not to wear my chip because I didn’t care about having my time included. I walk and I know I’m slow – and I started with my time group. I don’t think I should not be allowed a number next year because it didn’t trigger at the start line. You guys are way to wrapped up in this – it’s a fun run. You’re not going to win.

Mark

July 4th, 2009
7:50 pm

Folks, it’s not a ‘Race’ for 90 percent of the people out there, it’s a social event, a celebration, a fun for everyone in the family tradition. They might as well call it the annual Peachtree Fun Run. And that’s OK, there’s nothing wrong with a Fun Run.

Anyone looking for a serious race can find one on the other 51 weekends of the year.

John Yackett

July 4th, 2009
7:53 pm

I was in the sub-seeded group. I was amazed at the number of folks with numbers lining the street at mile 3-5, just waiting to jump in. At mile 5 I got pushed by a jumper and he did not even say “sorry.” When I passed his ass running I looked at his number and he was in to 90’s. I too hope that the d-tags for all the runner are there to stop some of these folks who Jump in or do early starts. Who are they cheating?? Those that work hard each year to get into shape to walk or run the event. They also diminish the value of the shirt. BTW, It was in the 100’s in Kuwait when the soldiers did the “peachtree.” If they can do it in that temp, you sure can get off your lazy ass and do it in the 70’s here in ATL.

Alicat

July 4th, 2009
7:58 pm

Prevent Cheaters from getting t-shirts… – your idea is brilliant. Not foolproof, as people could still get into their time groups pre-race, get their bracelets, and then head out again, but I bet it would deter a good bit of the cheating. At the T-shirt area…. instead of crossing through the race bib, perhaps volunteers could remove the bracelet, and then give the T-shirt bag. No bracelet = no t-shirt.

I don’t mind people that run/walk. I don’t mind people that need to walk the entire event. Common courtesy is what seems to be lost these days. Stay to the right (or at least the far left/far right, if moving to the right isn’t feasible / safe at the moment), don’t walk more than 2 people wide, and for pete’s sake.. start at the official start line. Easy peasy!

fin c

July 4th, 2009
8:04 pm

1 Maybe more timing mats at each 1 km,
2 Also there could be a TV H.D.live feed at each 1 km mark that you could buy later.
3 If all timing mats very passed you finished.

Alicat

July 4th, 2009
8:23 pm

Heywood.. here’s the thing: Those that are serious runners… CANNOT have a good time on the course, if slower people are cutting in front of them. It’s dangerous. It’s frustrating. Should one person’s enjoyment be at the expense of another who refuses to be honorable?

Maryanne

July 4th, 2009
8:42 pm

What they need to do is severalfold: stop paying out prize money because that corrupts the race. I was involved with the Peachtree for 17 years before I got tired of the snotty attitudes of the ATC and decided I had had enough. Secondly, they need to reduce the number of runners. When they incresed it to I believe it was 40,000, that is when the problems started, especially with runners coming off Lenox Road from the train station.

Thirdly, they need to have more runner-friendly parking cooperation with Phipps Plaza and Lenox Square. It used to be that we (volunteers and runners) were allowed to park in those areas and now I think Lenox charged $5 this year to park. Not everyone is enamoured of Marta!

The Peachtree has lost it’s focus: it was orginally NOT about the elite runner but the everyday fitness enthusiast with a love for the sport. The Track Club says they can’t attract the elite runners without offering prize money, but when I first started, that was never a problem because the elite runners still entered.

It’s a shame the Peachtree has gone so far from it’s original intent-and the issues with cheating that have surfaced are a result of it’s lost focus and for that I entirely faut the Atlanta Track Club.

Peachtree Road Race | All Days Long

July 4th, 2009
9:16 pm

[...] A race of 6.2 miles, but not, alas, for everyone | Mark Bradley By Mark Bradley Mark Bradley of the AJC expresses despair over the course-jumping and start-flouting that has become a sad side note to the Peachtree Road Race. Mark Bradley – http://blogs.ajc.com/mark-bradley-blog/ [...]

Jeremy

July 4th, 2009
9:32 pm

They could totally fix the problem with Dtags. The Volunteers keep people in the appropriate time groups and if someone has a tag that didn’t pass go they shouldn’t get a shirt. I completely agree that it is cheating if someone jumps in at mile 2,3,5,etc. Facts are facts, they didn’t run the race. NOW how about the problem with my friends who couldn’t get a number through the ATC but the day after electronic registration they could buy numbers for 100 bucks from 4 different online commercial outlets! Thats a real problem and the ATC has to be involved.

Nancy Miller

July 4th, 2009
10:06 pm

I am VERY proud of my Bosom Buddies, who walked in Time Group 9. We have been walking since last October to train for the Atlanta 2 Day Breast Cancer walk. It was my very first Peachtree, and I managed to come in at a respectable (for me, who usually walks a 20 min mile) 1 hour and 49 minutes. I am proud of walking EVERY step of the way, including back up the hill from the park to the Broadway Diner, where we enjoyed the most delicious breakfast EVER!!

Jay Stone

July 4th, 2009
10:12 pm

While I would agree that it’s not a race for 90 percent — probably a higher percentage than that — if people can just jump in, traverse two miles and get a t-shirt, it does undermine the value of the event. I’m proud of my t-shirt because, as Mr. Yackett mentioned, I trained and got myself into good enough shape to do the whole thing, and then I did the whole thing. If it’s too much trouble to do that, then don’t go out there. It does burn me a little that some people felt it was too early to get up, too much of a hassle or the course was too long, yet they walked out of Piedmont Park with the same t-shirt I did.

Eric

July 4th, 2009
10:22 pm

One way to cut it down – you have to show you finished some other 10k in the last year to even GET an entry to the Peachtree. Prove you are willing to make some effort to get in the race, and it might cut down on some of the cheaters.

Just using the new timing tag won’t matter because they don’t have real-time data at the shirt station. Unless you want to mail shirts to proven finishers the tags are meaningless.

BG

July 4th, 2009
11:19 pm

Eric (@ 10:22 pm), and what’s to make the cheaters run a complete 10K to qualify? Furthermore, that just increases the already-too-high cost of the PRR.

Ken

July 4th, 2009
11:25 pm

Chik-fil-A stinks.

My 10 year old son and I ran up to their truck to get a T-shirt, but they wouldn’t give us one because we weren’t “running” at that exact moment. They would rather throw the shirts into the running masses as they go by and then have them trip over each other and fall to get one of their lousy shirts.

Shame on them.

Ranae

July 4th, 2009
11:26 pm

This was my 4th year participating in the Peachtree Road Race. I always run the race with my mother because she’s my running partner. When we signed up for the race this year only one of received a number because of the new random selecting the ATC did for this year’s race. I have always been bothered by those who jump on the course before their time groups but this year I will admit my mother and I did jump on the course a half mile away from the starting line. We had made the decision to watch the elite runners go by because we’ve never had the opportunity to watch them run. Since this year was the 40th anniversary for the Peachtree we were also able to watch the group of the original 110 finishers run past us. That was an incredible experience and moment for me to share with my mother, a moment I would have missed if we had started the race at the starting line. We didn’t jump on the course until after group one ran past us. I don’t intend to make this habit and I probably won’t ever do it again because there’s nothing like walking up to the starting line of the Peachtree and seeing that great huge American flag hanging above the crowd. I view the Peachtree as a fun10K race, not a race for a PR, but a 6.2 mile run with my mother on our Independence Day.

Bryan M.

July 4th, 2009
11:27 pm

Two very distinct issues here, and only one is “cheating”. Anyone who jumps in the race after the start has little shame. They deserve our scorn, forearm shivers, or maybe a nice lugee on their leg for hopping in front of us.
However the corralling issue is completely different. Everything from 20-99k is a random issue. Most of that is done so ATC can have some type of crowd control, but to expect every corral to only have their numbers (or earlier) is unrealistic, and truly not that big of a deal. For someone earlier to suggest that someone in the 90,000 numbers could not run a 36 min race is a mistake. Most likely that twosome started in an earlier time group, but to have the time they had to cross the start and finish line, and No way MARTA could get them there that fast! I think the ATC volunteers do about as well of a job as a volunteer force can to keep at least the first 4 to 5 time groups as tightly controlled as possible.

Ken

July 4th, 2009
11:40 pm

In the past I have been seeded, subseeded, and this year (after 14 races) I walk-ran in TG 3 with my wife and son because of a worn out knee.

You people need to get over yourselves, especially you idiotic twits running at breakneck speed in TG’s 2 and above (these timing tags for everyone is the stupidest idea I’ve ever seen–it just creates more midpacker jerks). If you are so hellbent on running a fast time, then run in a regular race and get a QT to run in TG’s 1 or better. Newsflash: if your number has more than 4 digits in it, it’s not a “race” for you!

I watched today as some middle aged jerk literally ran over about 10 people, including a much older woman, on the way to the finish line, checking his watch as he crossed. The “gun time” was about 1:33. And there are plenty more like him. If you want to run fast, earn your time and run with the big boys, rather than feed your ego by running over people in the slower groups while trying to shave 2 seconds off your meaningless PR.

It’s an event. Not a race. Enjoy it and chill out.

Lola

July 4th, 2009
11:59 pm

Bravo Ken…

Ken didn't get a shirt

July 5th, 2009
12:04 am

Ken, who are you to dictate if Peachtree is a “race” for anyone with any number? Some people race the clock, try to beat the last 10K time, last year’s PRR, or have a little race with others from their club or family. For some it is a race, even if they are in TG6. You were “seeded and subseeded for 14 years” (yeah right) and you are bitter because Chic-fil-a wouldn’t give your kid a freakin’ shirt…maybe you need to just “enjoy it and chill out”.
It is called the Peachtree Road RACE, not the Peachtree Road T-Shirt Giveaway.

Ken

July 5th, 2009
12:16 am

KDGAS,

It’s impossible for a race with 55k participaants to be a true “race”. It’s simply too packed-in to run to your potential unless you steamroll people the entire way, but apparently plenty of jerks do anyways–sounds like you are probably one of them.

As for me, I used to take the Peachtree seriously, and collected my finisher’s mug every year, until I chilled out, grew up, and decided to enjoy the event with my family, and not make my personal self-worth dependant on whether I cut 5 seconds off my PR.

Newsflash: nobody really gives a rat’s patootie what your PR is.

And I wasn’t angry because my kid didn’t get a shirt. I was ticked off because Chik-fil-A was endangering the runners by tossing shirts out into the streaming masses rather than allowing them to run off the course to the truck and receive them safely.

Besides, I already had a Planet smoothie, Willie’s, and Moe’s shirt, so my wardrobe was quite well-stocked to that point, thanks.

Chuck

July 5th, 2009
12:23 am

Bryan M. if you think they Condra’s (just an example) ran http://projects.ajc.com/running/peachtree/2009/?index=200&order_by=place&dir=asc this time together side by side the whole course I’ve got a magic carpet I’ll sell you. That is when they finished, note the highlighted ones. Not saying someone can’t run 36 mins. but maybe someone who knows them can tell they jumped in b/c never seen their names in running events and probably won’t again at Peachtree.

Bryan M.

July 5th, 2009
1:02 am

I hear you Chuck; on second look I see your point about them not being “elite” category. I am red/green colorblind so it does not jump out of the page that they are the first non-elites in the finish order. Someone (whether it was them or not) had to cross the start line, trigger the timer and end up at the finish 36 minutes later with their D-Chip. I’m just saying that is not impossible. There would be no time if they jumped in later in the race.
Another interesting thing to think about: I had to get my number on the secondary market this year (I have run Peachtree somewhere close to 15 times since 1982), and the guy I bought it from has an official time of 55:00 flat from my run today. Hope he is ok with that. I wonder how many people who sold their numbers have an official Personal Best/Worst today.

Gen Neyland

July 5th, 2009
8:17 am

Cheaters, bandits all. The leaper has no conscience, no sense of fair play. These are the people that will try and steal your wife or husband, your dog. When a line opens at a jam packed grocery store and the checker announces,’I can take the next in line’, they will jump from the back of the masses and swipe the spot. They have no sense of fair play. We that start at the start and finish at the finish have seen them. We may not know their names and won’t remember their faces but that’s okay. They’re not real runners anyway. Just wannabe’s in search of the prize the rest of us have worked for. In essence, they are the runner’s version of a loser…

dmac

July 5th, 2009
9:01 am

I agree that the Peachtree is a very large moving party.

I used to be a serious runner and the one time I ran the Peachtree I started with the “elite” pack. It does not bother me that people jump-in/start early, just so long as these people don’t finish in the top 200 or so.

As Garth and Wayne liked to say, “Party on”.

Ken didn't get a shirt

July 5th, 2009
9:39 am

Ken, you still didn’t answer the question. You just made assumptions about me and commented on your belief that you are a more enlightened person because you now run the peachtree for pleasure (but you mentioned that you got the finisher’s mug and ran seeded several times, refreshing to see you aren’t one of those jerks who thinks your time grouping and finishing spot means you are a man of substance).
So the PRR is your opportunity to spend quality time with your family while filling your wardrobe with cheesy t-shirts, super! As far as being crowded, the PRR is that every year. And yes, a person who positions themselves well can “run to their potential” without running others over. Please do everyone a favor and let others enjoy the race as they wish and not dictate that everyone should be as enlightened as you are…there just aren’t enough shirts! (BTW…most people who have run Peachtree as often as you say you have know all the spots where the shirts get tossed and they are cautious in those areas.)

Kev

July 5th, 2009
9:40 am

Ken -

Your a loser. It is a race, and cheating is cheating. I have a hard time believing that you have been seeded in anything other than a whining contest.

For those of us that look forward to a challenge it is frustrating to see cheaters and deal with knotheads like you.

#82,393 – You are a perfect example

Slow Moving Vehicle

July 5th, 2009
9:50 am

This was my second Peachtree, and the sixth race (10K or half-marathon) I have done, and while I agree that cheaters and line-jumpers are annoying, I can’t get too exercised about them. The Peachtree is more an event than a serious race. I did it for the bands playing along the course, for the cheering spectators, for the “Holy Water” spray at St. Phillips, for the sheer unadulterated fun of it. It’s a great Atlanta street party. I had a wonderful time.

As for having to dodge walkers and slower runners – well, not long ago I was one of them. They are part of the race and part of the fun, and I very much dislike the nasty attitude of some of the “serious” runners – calling people “wide loads” and “lardbutts” is as classless as cheating, and quite a bit more malicious. There are plenty of smaller, less crowded runs over the course of the year, if you’re trying to set a PR or looking for a more competitive race.

I certainly don’t think my t-shirt is “cheapened” in any way by the cheaters – I know I ran the full 6.2 miles, and under my target of 60:00, and my t-shirt represents that accomplishment to me.

Navairmike

July 5th, 2009
10:12 am

Come on Bradley,
You need to get a life.
You absolutely wasted an entire Sunday sports column discussing people walking down Peachtree.

Jay

July 5th, 2009
10:15 am

Hey, cheating is the American way. No problem. Where’ve you been? I ran some P’trees in past years. I really *ran* it. I was a 38-40 minute 10-k’er and was always able to start just behind the elites and seeded runners, and I would occasionally see peope there who clearly didn’t belong there–obviously bought someone else’s number. I’ve also seen this many times in other, smaller, races not as tightly controlled (at the front anyway) as P’tree is. Within one mile, these clowns begin to “die” and are nothing but a hazard for the others, having been burned by the pace. I never could figure out what these idiots were trying to accomplish. But of course, it’s pretty common knowledge now that the P’tree is (and has been for years) a big joke for the most part. For the vast majority of participants, it is nothing but a 6.21-mile cattle drive. And as far as the silly t-shirt thing, I always gave mine to my wife who’d wear it a little.

Tone LaRone

July 5th, 2009
10:38 am

I agree with most of you. I have ran the Peachtree for over 15 times. I started years ago in Group 9 and Saturday I was in Group 2. I start at Lenox and finished at Piedmont. I thought that was the intent of the race or gathering, or whatever you want to call it. Thousands do the correct thing, but more and more others do not. It does bother me that a guy had 99000 and was waiting at the train station with me at 9:00 a.m. I always think of those individuals who register and do not get a number that would love to complete the entire course for the t-shirt.

Mr. Touchdown

July 5th, 2009
11:13 am

People – how many of you would like to start a “race” 90 minutes after it really started? It is 5 to 10 degrees hotter, the sun is higher, the ceremonies are complete, your fan club is tired of waiting on you, and Ken Rodriguez has already gone home. There is no solution to this issue. Chill out and move on to something important.

ty

July 5th, 2009
11:23 am

Imagine if some of the wheelchair athletes had this attitude given what they sacrifice. I cannot hear any of them saying “it takes to long starting from the back, so I rolled in with the group ahead of me”. It is cheating. You cannot rationalize it. If you want a better number then train for it. This behavior reflects the all too familiar American “it’s all about me” attitude. It is lazy and just shows many people want everything but don’t want to “inconvenience themselves” to get it. It is hard enought to get in the race, so respect the process.

Jason Luft

July 5th, 2009
11:24 am

Cathy you are the smartest person to post a comment, you are right everyone who “cheated” (took a short cut) most likely takes short cuts in their lives also. Look people running 6.2 miles is hard but it’s not for everyone. So if you feel like you need to cheat just stay at home or on the sidewalk and cheer.

Quick 6

July 5th, 2009
11:31 am

One of the biggest problems caused by those who jump in at various points during the race, or who manage to acquire numbers they obviously should not have, is the added congestion they cause for faster runners. …case in point – I started in time group TG-5 and approximately 1 1/2 miles into the race, I encountered a group of people with numbers in the 20,000 – 30,000 range who were WALKING! Over the course of 6.2 miles, the extra effort it takes to maneuver around such groups of people could cost you anywhere from several seconds to 1 or 2 minutes. This may not seem like a big deal for many, but for runners attempting to improve their PRs, this can be extremely frustrating! After missing their PRs by a few seconds or more, I’m sure these runners couldn’t help but wonder if they could have achieved their goals, had it not been for the number of 5′-5″ 230 pounds guys they encountered at miles 2 and 3 (wearing numbers in the low 30,000’s, of course), or the several romantic couples they encountered at miles 4 and 5 (wearing numbers in the 20,000’s) holding hands to commemorate how they first met at last year’s race. TRUE RUNNERS OF THE WORLD, UNITE!

Hillbilly Deluxe

July 5th, 2009
11:45 am

Taser ‘em, Bro.

Gen Neyland

July 5th, 2009
11:55 am

Jay : The Peachtree is an event where the runner is actually the spectator. Those chasing the mug every year never truly enjoy what the event is about. Your tone sounds rather condescending to all the people that are out there without blinders, set only on a PR and a flipping mug…This PRR was special to me because my daughter’s purpose for running this year was simply to run with her Dad. I played it Gallowayish and let her set the pace. This was my fifth one and her first. I wouldn’t trade the experience for all the worthless mugs you’ve lined up on your mantlepiece…

Jay

July 5th, 2009
11:55 am

“People – how many of you would like to start a “race” 90 minutes after it really started? It is 5 “to 10 degrees hotter, the sun is higher, the ceremonies are complete, your fan club is tired of waiting on you, and Ken Rodriguez has already gone home. ”

I agree. If you are not in condition to actually RUN the 6.2 miles, then walk or jog with your dog somewhere. The ATC long ago let the Peachtree Road Race lose its identity as a RACE. And where does all that money go?

Gen Neyland

July 5th, 2009
11:57 am

…BTW Jay, take a year and volunteer the event. I have and will do so again.

Gary Hosmer

July 5th, 2009
11:58 am

Thank you Mr. Bradley, but I will tell you this – the cheating has been going on for at least 30 years, as that is how many Peachtrees in a row I have done (all from start to finish ranging from 38:23 in 1989 to 59:00 this year). I can tell you that I have seen people standing at Colony Square (past 5 miles) with numbers on who jump in there and run the entire last mile for their coveted T-shirt. I have seen fathers teaching their children wonderful life lessons jumping in at the 3 mile mark to get their coveted tee shirt. The only shirt I wear is my 1980 shirt one day a year to the Expo. The shirt is meaningless these days – they stay on a shelf in my closet. I will probably have them made into a quilt one day when I am too beat up to toe the starting line.

Jay

July 5th, 2009
12:00 pm

“Jay : The Peachtree is an event where the runner is actually the spectator. Those chasing the mug every year never truly enjoy what the event is about. Your tone sounds rather condescending to all the people that are out there without blinders, set only on a PR and a flipping mug…This PRR was special to me because my daughter’s purpose for running this year was simply to run with her Dad. I played it Gallowayish and let her set the pace. This was my fifth one and her first. I wouldn’t trade the experience for all the worthless mugs you’ve lined up on your mantlepiece…”

Gen Nylande, I don’t have any Peachtree Road Race mugs. I’ve never taken one.
Can’t you bond with your daughter in many other ways? If foot “races” are your thing, there are many dozens of them in the area every year. Your response does nothing to defend the joke of the Peachtree Road “Race.”

RamblinWreck

July 5th, 2009
12:19 pm

Mark – thanks for bringing this issue to light. I hope that given the advent of the D-tag this issue can be fixed in future Peachtree Road Races. I think there are a number of other salient issues that ought to be implemented Among them: (i) force walkers to the right (ii) refine the criteria that determines start group. I run a 7:30 mile and was not happy to be in the 90000’s (which I of course started on time), and (iii) take fewer entrants – there were simply too many people. that said, what a brilliant event this is, and i still had an excellent day. thanks to all volunteers yesterday, you guys did a marvelous job!

dpjr

July 5th, 2009
12:21 pm

Who cares? Not one of the “cheaters” walks away with anything(but an overpriced t-shirt). If someone wants to jump in or start early or ?????, that is their perogative and it’s their conscience that they will need to live with. Do we not have better things to worry about on the day of (or day after) the birth of our great nation?

Runner

July 5th, 2009
12:29 pm

I worked hard and had a 10,000 number! I proudly wore it. I also proudly ran in group 5 so I could run with a good friend… we used the extra time to chat and spend time together on an American holiday.

Isn’t that what it is REALLY about?

Gen Neyland

July 5th, 2009
12:35 pm

Jay : I really don’t think you get what the Peachtree is about. If you consider the Peachtree a joke, that’s okay, but you can also entertain the reason the majority of the 54,000 everyday type runners run this race. Yes, I’ll call it a race for time groups 2-9. It’s a personal thing like it was for my daughter and me, or the guy that does it with a walker on wheels, or the guy pushing his kid in a wheeelchair. You see Jay, it’s many different things to many different people. But the bandit is the topic and to go back there is what MB would want us to do…No matter your opinion in the PRR, I’ll still consider you a brother in the world of running…oh and too, I’ve been at this game for nearly 2 decades and have my share of finisher do-dads and shirts. I’m proud of them all…

Chickadeewatcher

July 5th, 2009
12:40 pm

I’m an asthmatic and unable to run but enjoy participating as a walker. Runners must be given priority. AJC please find a way to prevent higher numbers from getting into wrong time group. Otherwise legitimate runners are hampered by cheaters. Runners/walkers can we police our own time groups? Have race supporters nearby that you can report cheaters to? Hope timing of everyone will help next year. Keep those cheaters back with us walkers where they belong.

Nora

July 5th, 2009
1:04 pm

To Runner: It is possible for a TG9 runner to have a better chip time than a TG 1-A/B if he or she is a faster runner who just didn’t happen to submit a qualifying time and was randomly assigned to TG9. And it is conceivable that someone could barely qualify for TG 1-B with a sub-55:00 and still run the Peachtree (which is usually a slower 10K for most people) in a little over an hour. I know because I am someone who has done that!

I am over the t-shirt hype. The shirt means nothing to me. Basically if you pay the entry fee you get the shirt. You can just stroll into Piedmont Park and pick it up. It means nothing – its not even a tech shirt that would be useful for everyday running.

The cheaters make me mad because they are people who think they are better than everyone else – the rules don’t apply to them. If you want a better time group, then run a qualifying race. If you don’t want to do that, then take the number you’re given, be a good sport and play fair.

I HAVE A QUESTION! It is my understanding that if you submit a QT of 55:00+ you get assigned to TG 2 regardless of your time. Okay, that is fair enough. But now, with the everyone in the Peachtree being chipped, does that mean all 55,000 runners will be able to submit a QT for TG 2 next year? They can’t all be in TG 2. And then what would be the point for anyone running over 55:00 to bother running another qualifier? They need to change this where your TG reflects your qualifying time – period – all the way up to TG 7, 8 or whatever. Those with no qualifying times are in TG 9. End of story.

John Bacheller

July 5th, 2009
1:06 pm

Agree with your dislike of cheaters. It is inexcusable. However, I do want to make a correction to your article that appeared in the AJC this morning. I am sure that my wife and I are the runners you were referring to when you said “I saw a couple jogging on the right while the lead pack buzzed by on the left (near Peachtree Battle). The man was wearing a number in the 90,000’s. That group wouldn’t start officially for another 90 minutes.” Actually, the Atlanta Track Club let the “Original 110″ and their immediate families start 8 minutes before the official race start. We were running at just under an 8 minute pace which only looked like jogging because those guys were running sub 5 minute miles. If you had checked the back of our shirts you would have seen we were “Original 110″. Hopefully that will restore a little of your faith in humanity. My family and I have run the race for many years and never cheat.

Chuck

July 5th, 2009
1:15 pm

To RamblinWreck: Turn in a time next yr. when signing up, even if 5K, 8K, or 10K you’ll get seeded at least in time group 3 or better.

To Mr. Touchdown: There is a solution, you can run other races if you want to start on time and then turn in a time to get seeded higher (by turning in a time you’ll be NO worse than time group 4.

Peachtree is the largest 10K therefore you probably get 15K to 20K in which this is the only race they do each yr. therefore the frustration of many that want to “run the race” but can’t b/c of others crowded on the course. I suggest anyone wanting to run comfortable to run a race during the yr. before March and then turn in that time to get up closer to the front where they shouldn’t have these problems.

BnB

July 5th, 2009
1:23 pm

Get over it folks. It’s just a t-shirt and a foot race. This was my second and I ran with my bro-in-law (his 29th consecutive). It’s a wonderful even and the ATC and all those involved do a fantastic job in my opinion. Are there really people out there who get some ind of thrill wearing the t-shirt when they know they didn’t complete the race? Oh yeah, this is the country where people give their daughters fake breasts for graduation gifts.

I’m not setting the woods on fire but ran in under an hour. Yes, I had to dodge some folks an occasionally get up on the side walk or whatever. Life goes on….if you’re lucky. Just enjoy it for what it is. doesn’t someone want to complain about the GI marching with full back pack clogging the road? Get a grip folks. Three cheers for the PTRR.

Judy Peters

July 5th, 2009
1:48 pm

I consider it cheating when someone from time group 9 starts with an earlier group. If you want to start earlier you need to run a qualifying race. It’s the luck of the draw when you sign up without qualifying. There are 55,000 participants of the Peachtree. If you want to stay with your friend that has a lower number…well that “friend” should move back with you..not the other way around. Those are the rules. If you don’t want to abide by those rules…you shouldn’t sign up. You agreed to the rules when you did so. If your friend isn’t willing to do that..well..they aren’t much of a friend or really don’t want to run with you anyway.

This was my 3rd year. The first year I was in the 9’s, last year 7’s and this year 3’s. I saw more from the 6 and 7 time groups than I did my own. With a few 9’s thrown in as well. It was obvious they were in my opinion cheating. I don’t know what else you’d call it.

I also saw a few that jumped in along the way…maybe they didn’t want to run the entire 6.2 miles? Who knows..also cheating not only themselves..but the event itself. If you want a T-shirt…you should earn it. If you don’t want to earn it..go out and buy one later. I’m sure you can find one on ebay! Those should have a big “I didn’t actually run the Peachtree, but I got this great shirt”.

Steve

July 5th, 2009
2:06 pm

This is the Peachtree Road Race, not the Peachtree t-shirt give away. Whether running or walking, it is a challenge of your fitness. Those participating should follow the rules. If it takes too long to get started then try to submit a time to get moved up or don’t race!. I can’t stand seeing everyone in their numbers standing along Peachtree Road in their numbers waiting to jump in.

Those handing out the t-shirts should scan each individual chip to see that they have a start and an end time or no t-shirt.

Runninchick

July 5th, 2009
3:12 pm

I agree with what many have said here: 1. It’s frustrating that there are cheaters, 2. it’s frustrating that people don’t follow the rules and 3. it’s frustrating for people expecting the “run” this event to bob and weave around the less serious people.

However, to expect the ATC to develop a system to check the D-tags is absolutely absurd. There is no way that could be done effectively at t-shirt pick up or the finish for 55,000 runners. If I were to make a suggestion, the ATC should have volunteers at the corral entry somehow mark the bib numbers to indicate they passed that checkpoint and entered the corral. The volunteers are checking the bib numbers already (theoretically) and could make a mark, punch a hole, something. That way, when a participant goes to pick up a shirt at the finish, no mark of corral entry bib number means the individual didn’t enter the corral or get marked, so no t-shirt.

Kevin Jones

July 5th, 2009
3:35 pm

I agree with most people that if you start somewhere other than the Lenox start time that is cheating

so there should be no debate about that.I was in TG-3 and I had to dodge people who were walking

on the left side of Peachtree so my solution to that would be to have one group maybe the last

reserved for walkers and for anyone else who just want to be seen.That way runners can devote our

energies to finishing the race and and not dodge the walkers who are on the left side and the

walkers can devote there energies to also finishing the race.Maybe not perfect but it is something to

think about.

Bill

July 5th, 2009
4:09 pm

Excellent idea from Runninchick about marking bibs as you enter corrals.

I appreciate the comments from those in groups 4-9 about it not being a race. However, when you have trained, ran another race to get a qualifying time, gotten into TG1 and still have to dodge walkers at mile 2+, then cheaters are causing a problem.

Meg

July 5th, 2009
4:20 pm

To Chuck, and others who are looking at the results here on the AJC website:

The places AND results are based on the individual line to line time, NOT gun time. So those people in the 90,000s who placed better than those in the 1,000s (ie, 224-226 as mentioned above) didn’t cheat. Go to the ATC website results… you can see that those people actually have a clock time, from the point the race actually started, of just over 2 hours, and a chip time- the amount of time elapsed between when they crossed the start and when they crossed the finish, of just under 40 minutes.

So, those specific cheaters mentioned definitely did NOT cheat.

Peachtree Justice

July 5th, 2009
4:31 pm

I disagree that there is not a victim when these vermin cheat by jumping in the race ahead of the start line. The victims are the thousands of people who wanted to run it but were closed out because the 55,000 limit was reached. Peachtree cheaters should be tasered. Repeatedly.

ames

July 5th, 2009
4:58 pm

I agree with Mark and BnB . It’s just a fun event that brings to many a feeling of city pride. I was scheduled to run at 7:30. My number was in the 1500s. My friend did not submit a time and was placed in the 90,000s. We found a place in the 80,000s and started there. It was super fun! Definitely no PRs were made- but who cares.

Watt

July 5th, 2009
5:33 pm

This was my 18th P’tree Road Race. I ran group 4 and finished at 62:07 –my best time was in ‘97 at 42:21. I want to thank all of the wonderful volunteers for this year –without you there would be no PRR.

The PRR is a reflection of society isn’t it? I mean, you have people who are honest, dishonest, selfless, selfish, abide by rules, break rules at any given opportunity. I cannot understand why anyone would cheat. I train, prepare and look forward to both the physical as well as the mental challenge of running 6.2 miles in 60 minutes. I like knowing that I really accomplished something when I stick my chest out, have a black mark marked on my bib # and get handed my tee-shirt. The rulebrakers, well that’s on them. They are the ones who have to live with themselves.

What I do get a little annoyed at is the walkers on the left side of the road. Dear people, just move over to the right. It really is a problem when you are attempting to thin yourself out from your group and you’re dodging walkers before the 1 mile mark. I’m all for anyone and everyone who wants to participate in this event to have the opportunity to register, pay, and receive a bib #. Walk the entire course if you so desire –but do it on the right side of the road, please.

I dealt with two “self-before-others” happenings in 2009. 1) At the 4 mile mark two “runners” with group 6 bibs (hmm, must be some fast runners), having finished a chat with spectators on the left sidewalk, walked, yes walked, right out into our running group –thank goodness I saw this happening as it unfolded or I would have run slap over the woman. As it turned out I had to dodge fellow runners who were having to dodge them –like a domino effect.
2) When group 4 approached Pharr Road, a spectator with a bicylce was pedaling up the left side of the road –bad enough– but he was pedaling AGAINST the flow of runners. Unbelievable stupidity.

As always though, I had a terrific time. I thoroughly enjoy myself each and every year, be it I’m running with family and friends, or running by myself. I look forward to #19 in 2010 –and know that I will still have to avoid those left-side walkers.

Patricia Angle

July 5th, 2009
6:37 pm

This was, as always, fantastic fun! Great job by the ATC!!! I actually thought that fewer walkers were to the left this year – normally I get pretty upset about that – but what I did notice was that there were lots of kids whose parents had lied about their ages to get them into the race. In fact, the little girl and her mother who started near me didn’t even bother with numbers! Silly me, I actually got up early one day in March and went through a lot of frustration and spent money to get a number.

Oh, and re the iPods, I use a Nike+ sensor in my shoe, and it uses the iPod to record my distance, time, and pace. It only works with the headphones plugged in, although I tuck the earpieces into my shirt and don’t wear them. Maybe some of those other iPod people are using the same device?

Bill

July 5th, 2009
6:45 pm

I must have said “loser” 50 times during the race. Once for each time I saw someone that I knew started way before their time group did. I was in Group 2 and I passed many people in the race that had numbers in a higher group. Their groups hadn’t even started yet and I saw them 2 miles into the race. It’s cheating. If you want to walk then walk, just start with your group. I saw a mom jump in from the sidewalk with her 2 young sons about a mile into the race. A fine example she is setting. If it’s just about the t-shirt then pay your registration fee and go striaght to Piedmont Park and get your shirt. But stay out of the race.

Chris

July 5th, 2009
7:16 pm

I run a qualifying race every year and am proud to earn my 1A spot. While cheating may occur in other races, the blatant disregard for the rules and disrespect for other runners seen at the PTRR tarnishes the spirit of the event, not to mention presenting serious hazards for other runners. Don’t know how to fix this problem other than to publicize it and “call out” those who do jump in. Volunteers do a fine job of manning the start corrals but you can’t police the whole course. Check out the picture in the AJC – there’a a guy with a TG9 number finishing with TG1 and 2 folks. Think he started fairly??

Brandon

July 5th, 2009
9:13 pm

I certainly agree with the you on the cheaters, but even worse is the fact that 25% of the walkers are on the left side of the road. You have to dodge them all race long if you are legitimately running the race. This can clearly be enforced by race offficials but isnt at this point.

Chad Eaton

July 5th, 2009
9:26 pm

The folks jumping ahead into groups they dont have a number for does tick me off, but I have to say that people walking, and I mean slowly walking down the left side bothers me more The registration clearly says if you plan to walk, tell them, so they can give you a 9 for crying out loud and stay out of my way and the thousands of others who like to actually run the race as it is intended.

Nikita

July 5th, 2009
10:33 pm

I’ve run 7 times in the last 12 years. I thought the volunteers did a reasonably good job of stopping people from moving up to earlier groups, but there were definitely some people who either jumped a higher group or jumped in later.

Other thoughts:

1. I ran in group 2 this time, and I turned in a time in a qualifying race that was not good enough for the official seeding time (I ran the US 10K last year with a 102-degree temperature. and didn’t PR. Shocker.) I understand that if you turn in any time, you will get into a group that is relatively high. I understand also that a lot of the corporate groups are in higher groups, and the people in those groups may not be runners at all. Plus, of course, people sell their numbers. As a result, there are always people clogging up the lanes by trudging along in all the groups, starting at 2. The further back you are, the more of them there are. I don’t so much care, except that my time suffered a bit when I had to dodge walkers walking 5 abreast in the first few miles and I don’t think that’s right.

2. I really think the PTRR folks need to limit what kind of items can be given/thrown at the race — and I think anything other than paper cups of water should only be obtainable by stepping off the course. The Moe’s and Chick fil-A t-shirts were really distracting and potentially dangerous.

3. As to the comments about it being hotter later…true. But that doesn’t give you the right to get the conditions you want if you haven’t earned them. I have to admit I’d consider not running if I ever drew a number in the 9s again, because it does suck. But again, it’s not fair to switch up by breaking the rules.

4. I like the idea about DQing those who fail to cross both timers. That would open up the opportunity for more serious entrants to get numbers, and that’s a good thing. But no doubt some cheaters would cheat by just buying someone else’s number.

5. The t-shirt — whatever. This year’s was ugly and cheap.

SGonzales

July 5th, 2009
10:35 pm

You 2s and 3s whiners, not to mention non-participating sports reporters, should get a life! I’ve run the Ptree off and on since ‘79 and it’s now a race for about 1000 runners, and a parade for the other 54000. Just because you lucked into a low number you resent someone not wanting to start a 7:30 race/parade at 9:00? Let me guess; you’re also prone to road rage? Another news flash; a whole lot of folks in the 2s can’t break an hour and a half. Chill out and try to enjoy the fireworks without having to ’set the world straight’!

Dave F.

July 5th, 2009
10:36 pm

“Cheaters” are those who collected a t-shirt without completing the race from start to finish. I don’t know how many of those there were, but surely there were plenty. I don’t know how they can live with themselves, but it’s probably something they do every day.

I wouldn’t call those who start before they should “cheaters.” I’d just call them selfish. It’s just not convenient for them to obey the rules, and of course the whole point of the rest of the world is the make life convenient for them. They are the same people who cut through shopping center parking lots to avoid waiting in line at a traffic light, or who leave grocery store buggies in the middle of a parking lot rather than walking 30 feet to put it in a safe, out-of-the-way place. They are too self-centered to care that rules are created to maintain order. But a lot of our culture these days teaches people that they should just grab and claw and push and shove and ignore other people and disobey rules that make living easier for everyone. It’s all about them.

Keeping people out next year if they jumped their start time would be a good idea, but I don’t know how you’d enforce that. They’d just register under another name or email address. It would be more immediate punishement to deny them their shirts at the finish. Have computers at the shirt handout so people can tell what time any tag crossed the start line. If you started before your designated time, no shirt. The problem with that is the tag they used yesterday. I looked around and noticed many tags improperly applied (or not applied at all). Only 50,009 folks officially were timed, which means almost 10% didn’t get times. Most of those surely did not “cheat.” The instruction sheet was poorly designed: The side with the big, colorful pictures was the side that showed how NOT to do it. Obviously many people just saw the pictures and didn’t read a word. That will need to be improved before it can be used to enforce the rules.

I had a great time (though my time wasn’t great), and I hope to be back next year, starting in my designated time group once again, doing my part to keep things orderly and fun for everyone.

Tracy

July 6th, 2009
9:06 am

Yes, cheaters suck. It is a slap in the face to those of us that bust our butts training, getting a qualifying number to get into a time group, show up on time to our groups, and then run the race start to finish. We can wear our t-shirts proudly because we EARNED them.

I hope the ATC uses the information provided by the timing tags when they send out next year’s numbers. If you didn’t have a start time but you have a finish time, no number for you!

LisaRW

July 6th, 2009
9:44 am

as a walker/jogger i DO stay on the right side of the road. and there are participants that i must pass and there are those that must pass me. when there are 50,000 – 55,000 participants, there is going to be some congestion. the event organizers and volunteers do a wonderful job!! it is unfortunate that some “participants” are unable to appreciate the beauty of the event and/or the sense of accomplishment from an honest run.
i personally believe that all participants should be qualified for this event in order to assign everyone to an appropriate group. a 10k event should be part of any training plan for the PRR! of course there will always be those who negatively impact the event by not being able to follow the rules!

dlp

July 6th, 2009
9:57 am

I think the tags would not take care of any cheaters, because when you cross the finish line, the rfid tags would not tell you if they ever crossed the start line.

You would need one additional step at the end of the race to verify a true start line position.

Had a great time and could care less if cheaters participated. They have to live with it, not me. I enjoyed the real thing!

Gary

July 6th, 2009
10:26 am

I also dislike the “cheaters”. I think the volunteers could do a better job of monitoring who goes in at each location, but moreso, with the timing chips, they could determine who started with the correct group, and maybe they should send them an email saying “We Know!” and for those who went over the finish without going over the start… ban them from future participation. If you can’t run/walk a 10K you shouldn’t enter the race. There are only 55,000 spots available.

Chris

July 6th, 2009
11:14 am

All that has to happen is the Atlanta Track Club prohibit people from signing up next year that didn’t have a start time this year. The problem will work itself out shortly.

Long time runner

July 6th, 2009
11:28 am

Just sent my annual note to the Track Club concerning the cheating. For a number of years I have suggested that wrist bands be distributed in the time group areas before the race. In order to receive your t-shirt you would have youe wrist band removed. Pretty simple, right? Just get a note saying thanks for my idea.
After 19 consecutive years I did not run this year and I am one of those grandfathered so get an application early.
Now with the new timing strips they could check to see if the strip had been activated before you get your t-shirt.
Tracey- bring back the honor to the Peachtree Road Race!

Brian

July 6th, 2009
12:30 pm

Thanks Mark B. for giving voice to the frustrations I’ve had for the last several years over Peachtree cheaters. For most of us, that treasured _finisher’s_ shirt is the only trophy we get. Those that don’t go the whole 6.2 miles (at whatever speed they’re capable of) demean and devalue the shirt that we’ve earned. To repeat, the shirt is earned in covering the distance, not by paying race fees. (Do you wonder if the same individuals eaned a degree by paying tuition and then blowing off classes?) Hopefully the ATC will muster the will to use the timing information to disqualify or ban those who cheat — whether shortcutting the course, throwing an elbow at the finish, or jumping their assigned time group!

J

July 6th, 2009
2:10 pm

This was my 1st PRR and it was quite an experience. Yes, I did walk. but I did the whole thing, no cheating.. I was in time group 8 and made very sure that I stayed to the right. I guess because I was in 8 I didn’t see that many people cutting in. I was about run over by a woman pushing a stroller. I really wanted to remind her that strollers weren’t allowed, but couldn’t think of a way to say it without calling her a b****. Yeah I agree they should do something to try and stop the cheating, but what do the cheaters have – a $30 shirt. Me, yeah I have the shirt too, but I also have the memory, and the sights, and the great feeling of accomplishing something that I never thought I’d be able to.

J.D.

July 6th, 2009
2:29 pm

And the big surprise here is…? There are always going to be cheaters. They cheated growing-up and in school, cheat at their jobs and cheat in their marriages. A large group of us have lost their morals and ethics.

If they get busted for cheating they’ll whine and moan and make enough of a racket to the point somebody’ll give ‘em a shirt just to shut ‘em up. We can’t change them. They’ll have to live with themselves and know deep-down what the real truth is.

Les

July 6th, 2009
2:31 pm

I had a Peachtree number in the 90,000 grouping. And I started at the back of the pack and walked the Peachtree. I walked at a stiff pace… and although I was walking, I passed countless people who were only strolling or meandering.

When I checked my time results, I discovered that I finished my walk of the course faster than nearly half of the “runners.” Almost half the participants had a finishing time slower than me… and I walked the course.

That is evidence to me that very few participants actually run the Peachtree Road Race. They casually and liesurely walk their way down the course. A minority of the participants are actually running.

It is not a “road race.” It is a social event, and “the thing to do” on July 4th. The tee-shirt is not about bragging rights for running the full 6.2 miles. The tee-shirt is a statement that you were there on that date.

If the Atlanta Track Club wants that to change, then they should require a qualifying time for every participant, and cut the number of participants down to about 30,000.

T. Lane Gray

July 6th, 2009
3:07 pm

This year was my 15th at the PTR and I have volunterred for the past four years to assist at the start line for time group 8. Most runners follow the track club’s written instructions to arrive in time to join their assigned number groups. Unfortunately there will always be the runners that are special and make their own rules. As a friend’s father said there may be no justice in this life, but lets hope they receive their reward in the after life in a much hotter and more humid place than Atlanta on the 4th of July.

Ellen Nemhauser

July 6th, 2009
3:48 pm

Oh, so Mr. Bradley now allows for walkers since his wife is one. Several years ago he was really nasty about us walkers – those of us who are honest, start with our own group and are in it to test our personal best.

Doh

July 6th, 2009
4:26 pm

It’s called cheating. It’s taking space from others. It’s against the rules. If you can’t deal with the rules stay home and watch it on TV.

John

July 6th, 2009
5:09 pm

I’m 60 years old and this was my first Peachtree event. I walked a lot and ran a little and did not cheat. It was a challenge to myself and the fact that 48K+ participants posted a faster time than I is of no concern to me. I finished it – won my personal challenge and look forward to next year. Congrats to all those like myself who did likewise.

Meanbgreen

July 6th, 2009
5:19 pm

This is terrible and suggests deeper problems with the individuals who do this. This spring, Powerman Alabama officials put their head in the sand and didn’t disqualify Uli Broome who ‘took’ third place for the women’s race by cutting a block, thus cheating every single woman in the race. She also lied to officials that she didn’t cut while atleast 20 saw her cut and all started screamin that she cut immediatly. This race has made itself a joke in the Duathlon/Powerman league. And so have the officials.

Celia Gilner

July 6th, 2009
6:16 pm

Having run the Peachtree 19 consecutive years I’ve seen many improvements and the crowd is always so wonderful. There aren’t many things about the race that dampen my enthusiasm, but the CHEATERS do. I raised my children by the “What if” rule. “What if” everyone did what you did? If everyone jumped in wherever they wished we wouild not be able to have a Peaschtree Road Race, so CHEATERS get back in your assigned groups!
Be a good example to your children and mine.

Charlie Original 110

July 6th, 2009
6:37 pm

The ATC really honored the original 110 this year with an early start. It was an awesome experience to see the elite runners go by. The cheating has been going on for years for mainly 2 reasons. One is to get in the top 1000 to get the finisher’s cup and the other is to get the t-shirt. The chip system installed several years ago resolved the problem of cheaters getting the cup. This year all runners had an opportunity to compete for the The Top 1000 finisher’s Cup since it is awarded on net chip time. In years past the 1000th person may run well over 44 minutes. This year because of the cooler weather and more competitors the time to beat was 43:23.
The Georgia Junior Olympics used the wrist band system this year and it work very well. It is a good idea that I also support for the ATC and have recommended it to the ATC as many have on this website. Many charity races give you the t-shirt when you receive your number. As long as the Peachtree shirt is a FINISHER’S shirt earned by completing the 6.2 miles, then it seems that trying to set up a system to eliminate the cheaters as was done for the Top 1000 Cup would a good move for the ATC.

Walking Tall

July 6th, 2009
7:08 pm

I am a walker and I signed up online this year. I was very honest about my intention to walk, not run the peachtree and a medium pace. When I got my number in the mail, I was very surprised to get a number in the 30,000’s and thought it had to be a mistake. I went ahead and lined up in my proper group. As I started looking around me I noticed that there were many people around me that did not look like they were running either. As we started, I realized what the ATC had done this year. They were assigning walkers and non-seeded runners randomly and in what seemed to be equal numbers. I have to say, that it was great. In my group, the walkers stayed to the right as instructed and we walked as other time groups passed us on the course. We never bunched up at the start, or any of the water stations as we have done in years past. A lot of people on the sidelines made comments about the walkers “lying” to get their numbers. Not me..it was what I was given. I think it was deliberate, and it worked. I hope they do the same next year.

Chicken

July 6th, 2009
8:09 pm

Here’s an idea….arm volunteers and runners with Black Sharpies. See jumpers or a 90,000 in 1B time group, mark through the number. No t-shirt!

I thought the requirement for a T-shirt was to run the race in under 55 minutes. Remember the T-shirt clock? Didn’t start until the last person crossed the starting line. Yeah right! Now we have the D-tags. No excuse for not requiring 55 minutes to get a shirt. (Will never happen)

If you are going to CHEAT, at least WAIT until the seeded and time group 1 runners have passed.

Jeff

July 7th, 2009
12:00 am

The only people being cheated are the cheaters themselves, who will not have earned the sense of fulfillment and accomplishment that comes from legitimately running the race from start to finish. Losers!

jct

July 7th, 2009
7:58 am

This was my first race. I was going to run but hurt my back last month. I had a group 4 number. I walked with the group 9 because I did not want to be in the way of the ’serious’ runners. I walked to the right. I can’t understand why people have to jump in late. It took me 1 hour and 56 minutes to finish but I finished. I had fun and hope that next year I will be able to run with a better time.

It’s supposed to be fun.

j

July 7th, 2009
8:10 am

I’m a former runner, and even though i’ve never run the peachtree, I can understand where people are coming from. Of course, try running a cross-country race, and this wouldn’t seem like a big deal … no matter how much you complain, there is always going to be people walking in the wrong lane or slower runners in front of you. I recall having to elbow and push my way through a pack in cross-country b/c the other teams had their slower runners near the front. Stop whining, nothing is going to change … this event seems to have become more a social event than an actual race.

Les

July 7th, 2009
8:36 am

The Peachtree Road Race is NOT an actual race. 90% of the people out there are not there to win anything… or even do a personal best. They are out there simply to participate, and have bragging rights that they went down Peachtree on July 4th. More than half of the people out there walk the entire course. Another 25% run/walk the course. A fraction of the people out there are actually running the entire distance.

With that in mind (that it is a social event, and not a race), it helps to keep you in the right perspective about the behavior of errant individuals. I am sure that the people who “cheat” in the Peachtree Road Race don’t see it as cheating. I am sure that they would rationalize their behavior. Despite that, all of the posters here have pointed out the problems with the cheating behavior, and why it is wrong – even at the Peachtree.

Thomas P.

July 7th, 2009
8:48 am

Ken

July 4th, 2009
11:40 pm
In the past I have been seeded, subseeded, and this year (after 14 races) I walk-ran in TG 3 with my wife and son because of a worn out knee.

You people need to get over yourselves, especially you idiotic twits running at breakneck speed in TG’s 2 and above (these timing tags for everyone is the stupidest idea I’ve ever seen–it just creates more midpacker jerks). If you are so hellbent on running a fast time, then run in a regular race and get a QT to run in TG’s 1 or better. Newsflash: if your number has more than 4 digits in it, it’s not a “race” for you!

I watched today as some middle aged jerk literally ran over about 10 people, including a much older woman, on the way to the finish line, checking his watch as he crossed. The “gun time” was about 1:33. And there are plenty more like him. If you want to run fast, earn your time and run with the big boys, rather than feed your ego by running over people in the slower groups while trying to shave 2 seconds off your meaningless PR.

It’s an event. Not a race. Enjoy it and chill out.

- – - – -

This has got to be the stupidest post on here. You’re chastizing runners for wanting to finish up with a good time? Are you serious!? And hey pal, guess what –it is the Peachtree Road RACE, not the Peachtree Road EVENT.

I check my watch at every mile marker, and certainly try to finish up with the best time possible. That’s what it’s all about, running and finishing.

Wrong again

July 7th, 2009
9:37 am

Les

July 6th, 2009
2:31 pm

…It is not a “road race.” It is a social event, and “the thing to do” on July 4th. The tee-shirt is not about bragging rights for running the full 6.2 miles. The tee-shirt is a statement that you were there on that date.

———-

It is called the Peachtree Road RACE, not the Peachtree SOCIAL EVENT.

Les

July 7th, 2009
4:18 pm

Wrong again: You may disagree with what I said. And that’s fine. I was not giving my opinion of what it should be… I was making an observation.

When 60% of the people out there do not run at all… and when at least 25% of the people out there liesurely stroll… it may be called the Peachtree Road RACE. But an overwhelming majority of people out there are not racing. They are treating it like a social event.

I am not saying that is what it is supposed to be. I am merely making a statement of what is happening.

And, as I said in my previous post… the Atlanta Track Club can easily change that. But I believe that the Atlanta Track Club does not want to change it. ATC wants to have bragging rights that they sponsor the biggest 10K in the world. If the ATC restricted the PRR to real runners and real racers, then the field would be smaller and they would no longer be able to tout having the largest “race” in existence.

George

July 7th, 2009
11:17 pm

Meg wrote: “The places AND results are based on the individual line to line time, NOT gun time. So those people in the 90,000s who placed better than those in the 1,000s (ie, 224-226 as mentioned above) didn’t cheat. Go to the ATC website results… you can see that those people actually have a clock time, from the point the race actually started, of just over 2 hours, and a chip time- the amount of time elapsed between when they crossed the start and when they crossed the finish, of just under 40 minutes.

So, those specific cheaters mentioned definitely did NOT cheat.”

It’s not as straightforward as that. It’s possible for runners to take MARTA or a car to Midtown after crossing the starting line. Alternately there might have been a computer error. In the case of these particular three runners with 9xxxx numbers that ran just under 37 minutes, one of them Cameron Reid in 225th pace looks legitimate. A quick search shows that Cameron is a 4:27 miler and was a top high school runner in the state last year. However Scott and Robin Condra in 223rd and 224th don’t look right, Robin in particular stands out. A 36:58 for a 39 year-old woman is very, very fast. She’d be one of the top women runners in Atlanta if she could run that fast and would certainly turn up in race results from other races. However the only other two race results I found for her were a 36:32 at the 2007 Gobble Jog 5K and a 36:20 at the 2008 Polar Bear 5K. Those were 5Ks not 10Ks! So I think it’s safe to conclude she didn’t run a 36:58 at the Peachtree. I didn’t find any race results from other races for Scott Condra, which is unlikely for a sub-37 minute male masters runner, but not impossible. Maybe somebody else that was really fast used their numbers. Maybe there was a computer glitch in the results. Maybe they took MARTA to Midtown after jogging across the start line.

Les

July 8th, 2009
9:20 am

George,

I agree with what you have written.
In the marathons that I have run with the timing chip, they provide splits at various other points in the race. Usually the time is captured at three other points in the race.

If the ATC is going to provide timing strips to every single runner, then the next logical step is to capture splits at 2-miles and 4-miles. That would prevent the type of cheating that may be possible here.

It is certainly plausible (and an easy thing) to cross the start line, then run off the course and get in a car. Drive (or get driven) close to the finish line, then jump back on the course. Using Marta to cheat is unlikely, because on race day the Marta trains were running a delayed schedule, and the Marta stations down track are too far away from the course to make it feasible to use it as a time advantage.

Then another possibility is system error… which I know happens, because my time was erroneous. I did not put my timing strip on my shoe; I put it in the pocket on my shorts. I did not want to get timed, so I decided not to install the strip onto my shoe. When I pinned my number onto my shirt as I was standing in the 90,000 starting chute, I pulled-off the timing strip and put it in my pocket. Apparently something got picked-up because I see that I am listed with a recorded time that is twenty minutes slower than my actual time. The time is very slow, so it is inconsequential in anyone’s examinations of the results. But errors can happen.

Chicken

July 8th, 2009
6:24 pm

I think all times were defaulted to 7:30 start time if chip did not cross the start line. I know of a pair of runners who were late for the race, came out of MARTA North Springs Station about 8:30, did not cross the starting line but crossed the finish line just after 9:30. Their times were listed in results as over 2 hours.

That probably means that our friends the Condra’s are triple cheaters. They did not start in their time group, probably jumped in at the halfway mark just as the elite runners were coming through, and ran a 36 minute 5k. Congratulations! Wear that shirt with pride Scott and Robin! Everyone can now improve their finish position by AT LEAST 2. WhoHoo.

Alan

July 12th, 2009
6:20 pm

lol, someone coined the term FWW (fat waddling walkers). Not saying that they have less right to be in the PT Roadrace than me, but I ran by a FWW with her elbows swinging about three people wide and she nailed me in the gut as I ran by…not too cool when I’m already huffing. Honestly, if they say walkers to the right….walkers, please get over to the right. It’s hard to push yourself for a good time when you have to zig-zag for 6.2 miles.

Sam Cox

June 11th, 2010
9:40 am

I grew up in Atlanta, where most of my family still lives. I ran mhy first PRR in 1972, at the age of 13, when there were only 200-300 runners, still the biggest race in the South. Since 1972, I have run 31 Peachtrees, in spite of coming in from out of town. I’ve missed a few when living in Europe and a couple of others due to injuries. Peachtree has many positive memories for me, as it has for years been somewhat of a family reunion, with my two brothers, my sister, and a sister-in-law all running. For years I was a seeded runner, running in the 31:50-34:00 range. Now, at 51, I’m hoping to run 39:00 but I’ll probably just be in a time group that will make this goal difficult because of thei increasing number of cheaters. I agree with many of the comments above; for years now I’ll be running 6:00 minute miles and have overweight walkers and 12:00-14:00 minute mile joggers ahead of me at miles 2, 3 and even 6 miles. It is so frustrating, that every year i debate whether i will ever run this race again. And, as an out-of-towner/non-ATC member I have over the years faced significant discrimination in both an entry as well as seeding. After all these years, 2010 may be my 32nd and final PRR; it is just not worth it anymore.

A race of 6.2 miles, but not, alas, for everyone

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A race of 6.2 miles, but not, alas, for everyone

195 comments Add your comment

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