The Hot Button: Do the Braves need a new manager?

I just don’t see or feel any real sense of urgency, especially against lesser opponents, like the team is just supposed to win. “We’ll get ‘em next time,” sounds great only if they do it!

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a⋅vun⋅cu⋅lar  /əˈvʌŋkyələr/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [uh-vuhng-kyuh-ler]
–adjective of, pertaining to, or characteristic of an uncle:

Maddux, Smoltz & Glavine in their prime for 10 seasons, and all Cox has got is 1 World Series championship???….I’d say he’s a tad bit overrated as a manager.

Nice balancing act of a blog story Mark. <<<< insert mucho sarcasm

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Mark, there is a fine line between urgency and loyalty that all managers have to walk. You never quite know when a guy might turn it on. That said, you can’t give players like Jeff Francoeur the benefit of the doubt. He’s proven what he is. Kelly Johnson and Garret Anderson are a little bit different because of a better track record. But let’s be honest here, maybe Cox needs to find himself in the GM role because he’s been saddled with some bad players. Francoeur, Kotchman, Anderson, Johnson—these are bad players right now and will be for the rest of their careers. Only Johnson has shown flashes.

Cox has proven he can develop talent, but he’s also proven a stubborn loyalty that isn’t working out now.
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I still place the majority of the blame on the players. This is what Bobby was afforded; these are the players he’s trying to work with. I don’t really see it as his fault that they’re all stubborn brats. And, especially at this level, you shouldn’t need someone to hold your hand through every swing and every clutch play.

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I hit it on the head. I just knew you were going to praise Saint Bobby.

The bottom line which you ignore, is the game and players have passed him by. Bobby just dosent change with the times.

Like so many players, they dont want to recognise the slippery slope.
They are so caught up in their own little word they refuse to (or cannot) face it (or know) when it is time to go.

Face it folks—it is better to retire at the top of the heap, than it is to be forced out.

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The question and the poll are both blasphemy to me. Bobby Cox is the Braves. It is beyond my understanding how even 1 person who considers themselves a Braves fan could want another manager, and insanity to me to disrespect him. Why would Atlanta fans want to dump on the legacy of our own team? The players just haven’t been very good. You can’t pull a rabbit out of a hat every year, it’s not like the other teams aren’t trying too. Braves fans seem to dismiss Bobby due to some sense of entitlement and don’t realize that he is responsible for us feeling like we have an entitled franchise. The Atlanta Braves were the lowest of jokes in baseball before he got here.

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this is purely hypothetical…if the season gets out of hand, which may soon very well happen. they should have a competition to be the manager for a day. have people buy a raffle ticket or something and then pick a name out of the hat. that being said it would be ridiculous for every fan to be able to put their name in the hat. so you could have them take a test or something so that we dont get an incompetent fool out there name Bo-… wait sorry i wont complete that thought.

anyways, I am the biggest fan of the Braves. I hate to see this continue happening to the Braves and for Bobby, but I think its time for a change (no im not an Obama fan). I think i can manage this team better. I’m not saying Bobby isnt a great manager because he is. All I’m saying, like you Mark, he’s not right for this team.

Personally, I would do this:

1. Prado would be my everyday second baseman. KJ isnt cutting it.
2. Francoeur would be either be in a platoon with Matt Diaz or in the minors trying to get back on track. We all know he has the talent. He is just lost right now. Being out of the spot light for a while and being able to focus on basics and hitting will only help him. In the meantime Brandon Jones and Matt Diaz would provide a decent enough platoon.
3. I would keep the lineup consistant. I dont care about a lefty facing a lefty. I know the numbers are there but seriously a righty faces a righty all the time. I understand its the fact that a lefty match up doesnt occur as much but seriously these are all MAJOR LEAGUE HITTERS. They should just be able to HIT. Here is my lineup:
Yunel Escobar (better avg at the top)
Nate McLouth
Chipper Jones
Brian McCann
Garrett Anderson/Matt Diaz
Martin Prado
Casey Kotchman
Brandon Jones/Matt Diaz
4. I like what Bobby does in the closer situation. Soriano closes if there is a better match up in the eighth for Gonzalez, but Moyland has got to go. He just hasnt been the same since Tommy John surgery. Acosta has pitched well enough to earn the 7th inning slot.
5. Cut Greg Norton. He cant even do his one job. I would not let him come back from the DL. Carnizares will be that added bat off the bench.
6.Hope for a trade for another outfielder. It wont come soon because I have a feeling we will keep pursuing one of the Marlins.

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Finally an article from Bradley with some sense!! Long over due….the change topic and an article from Bradley with some sense!! You just go Mark. A braves managerial change is long over due!~!! and take Chipper (trade David Justice or trade me ) Jones with you!

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Like Glavine, Bobby’s time has come and gone. Like Glavine, he was great in the day, when the Braves were dominant. And like Glavine, it’s time for Bobby to leave.

There’s a new day dawning in Atlanta. These Braves, with their professional demeanor and lack of anything resembling drive or fire or a want to win, are not worth the price of admission.

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He could shake up his in game decisions quite a bit and take some more risks but overall he runs a professional organization. There aren’t a lot of shennigans from his team and in general they play professionally and they act professionally. I’d really love to see him squeeze with a runner on 3rd and no outs or keep a starter in the game longer than 100 pitches or try and steal or hit and run or in general bunt more but the problem with the team isn’t management or coaching, it’s a large portion of guys they count on to produce flat out not producing. He can’t speed up Jeff Francouers bat or force Kelly Johnson to not be abjectly terrible and not even be able to fly out to score a run. Or get bullpen guys to throw strikes. He’s a solid manager and he’s probably an awesome boss who lets his guys play and has faith in them… this group of talent in the order… just isn’t major league caliber.

Everyone always wants to talk about how major league pitching is so good to explain why these guys can’t hit. Ok. Everyone else in the league can hit it….we can’t…so the problem is that we don’t have, speed or power or average or consistancy. The manager can’t really do anything about that other than to hope he’s got someone better on the bench… currently we don’t.

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I Agree with LSU. Overrated and deserving of the lions ahre of the blame for the Braves failures in the post season.

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Everyone knows Bobby likes to go out and compete between the lines, and probably would until the Good Lord calls him home…

But what about the rest of the day at the ballpark…a bunch of tepid instruction from TP, who knows what we get from R Mac, and Bobby sits in his office and holds fort…shows off pics of the grandkids, talks fishing or golf or farming, and then makes the lineup card, gives a little rah rah (or not) and then they hit the field…

I think his energy and enthusiasm for the parts of the job that aren’t the actual game have waned…and understandably so…the team owners aren’t as committed as they once were either…otherwise they’d spend the necessary money to make the team better, and not give us a choice between pitching or hitting in the off-season.

Also notice that the only time he ever rips a player is when they are on their way out, ala Boyer or Kyle Davies…

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Great column, Mark.

What is it going to take to get Kelly Johnson out of the Braves line-up? For all the talk of Francouer being an anchor – and he certainly has his faults, don’t get me wrong – it’s Johnson who kills a Braves rally at every given turn. He can’t even manage to make productive outs. His defense is mediocre, at best. I’ve never seen a more obvious hole in a team’s line-up go unaddressed for this long. What’s it going to take and what are the options? I’m a fan of the man, but it grows more difficult for me to defend Cox when I continue to see KJ in the line-up on a daily basis.

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It’s time for him to go. Actually, it’s long past time. First of all, baseball is a game that’s all about production. Talk all you want about how many division championships he produced, just getting into the post-season isn’t enough. Show me the hardware, the trophies and the rings. In that, the most critical area of production for a major league manager, Cox has not produced. The bottom line will always be, that he only produced one World Series championship team.

Added to his personal lack of critical production, is his absolutely insane penchant for playing players that are not producing. Perhaps the two could be related. Could it be that his many irrational decisions to keep players in the lineup that are not producing, is Bobby’s subconscious way of trying to justify his own lack of critical production. Maybe his “loyalty,” is actually nothing more than his personal insecurity coming to the surface.

Whatever his psychological profile, his lack of critical production, plus his stubborn refusal to pull the plug on players that don’t product, equals a manager who should be relieved of duty.

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Ah man….tough one to talk about. I love Bobby Cox and all that he has meant to Atlanta and the Atlanta Braves. That said, maybe it is time to move on. I think the players of today are less apt to respond to Bobby than guys like Smoltz, Jones and Glavine (and no I don’t think the club screwed up by letting Smoltz and Glavine go). It is time to restructure the team. Look around at the clubs that have gone that way. Only the “mega clubs” with oodles of cash in hand can buy their way back to success. Young players are coming along in the minors and a trade or two now of some of the older players seems the right thing to do. The problem is that the people on this blog and othres in Atlanta would go into spasmodic fits when the young Braves under a new manager next year fall even deeper in the standings. Atlanta sports fans have always been fair weather fans. The Cubs have won nothing yet sell out Wrigly every game. The more the Braves lose, the less behinds will be in the seat.

I would like everyone here who wants Cox gone and a change in direction to remember what they say now in the next two or three years when the Braves fall way back in the standings. Probably the existence of the Nationals will be the only thing keeping them out of the basement when the change takes place.

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Greatest manager you have ever seen? Just like the time you said the ‘95 Braves were better than the ‘27 Yankees. MB… why do you always overreach in your analysis of how great someone or some team is here locally? You come off as more of a dreamy eyed fan than a credible sports journalist. I am not saying Bobby Cox is a bad manager, but there are several current managers that could have had just as much success with the talent the Braves had in the 90s, especially with starting pitching. Cox isn’t even the greatest manager of his generation. I’d rank Lou Pinella and Joe Torre higher. At least Joe Torre is proving he can win somewhere else and in a different league. And this aura of assurance you speak of? That should have left Turner Field about 3 years ago; because even when this team was making the playoffs they couldn’t get out of the divisional series.

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Cox is the leader of this team, and maybe that’s the problem. With Lowe, Jurgens, Vasquez, Hanson, and a healthy Hudson our starting pitching is very good. The line up lacks speed and power. Getting back to leadership, Bobby seems to be the only one with a fire in his belly (he’s into every pitch of every game, will argue on behalf of the team, and will support his players at all times) – he is a Hall of Fame Manager for all the right reasons. But aside from Bobby no one on The Braves has demonstrated any leadership to speak of. This is not a horrible team; it’s not a great team either. If this team comes around it is capable of 85 – 90 wins (but everything has to fall in place due to the aforementioned lack of speed and power); in other words The Braves need to find a way to score about 5 runs a game. If this team does not come around, it is also capable of a 75 – 80 win season.

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LSU, go back to the swamp. Whether or not the Braves need a new manager, the reality is that he won’t be fired. He’ll have to step down. I cannot imagine how a firing of Bobby Cox would resonate with the players (even the dismal ones), especially Chipper and McCann. I think firing Bobby Cox would do more to set back this team than help.

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Kelly Johnson and or Francouer would be seeing more bench time if Infante was healthy and Prado’s knee wasn’t acting up.

He doesn’t have a lot of guys to put in for them.

We could do a lot worse than Bobby Cox…even if we do get frustrated because of the consistancy sometimes.

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Mark, nice column.

In your opinion, do you think Cox will be back next year? If he resigns or is forced out, who do you think would be legitimate candidates for the job?

Brian Snitker?

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I was watching the Reds-Braves game Tuesday night on the Cincy station. Bravos had first and second, no outs, McCann at the plate. Count got to 3-2 and play-by-play man says something like “Bobby Cox is the type of manager who, in the past, would start the runners. McCann doesn’t strike out much–makes sense.” Cox doesn’t start the runners and McCann grounds into a double play. Next batter–Anderson–hits a fly ball that would have scored the runner from third had the runners been started and there was no DP. It seems to me Cox is playing not to lose instead of playing to win. He isn’t aggressive and seems afraid to take a chance believing it will fail.” You’d think a manager in his position–won’t be fired and will leave when he wants to–would take more chances, especially with a team with little power and struggling to score runs.

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FIRE BRADLEY!!

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Who is this LSU person and are you just now coming on to the baseball scene? If not, have you been stuck in Geaux Tiger land with little access to the outside world? Having visited the Lou on multiple occasions I wouldn’t blame you for lacking information or simply focusing on the incredible football played down there.

However, if you really insist on calling Bobby Cox overrated you better come up with some better reasoning than that he only won 1 World Series. Baseball is not a game that judges the talent of the players and coaches in stretches of 3, 5 or even 7 games. They play 162 games and being over .500 usually gets you in the running for the playoffs.

Any team can beat any other team on any given day. The fact that the Braves (under Bobby) did this 14 years in a row means more about the way he teaches and manages the game than any championship statistics you may throw out there.

In a sport where parody still reigns and putting the pieces in place to win is so difficult, not to mention holding those pieces together, they managed to go to the playoffs 14 times in a row. More than any other team, in any major sport, ever.

Call him washed up, out of touch or whatever else you can summon up from around the rock you were under. But to call him overrated is an epic mistake.

Mark, in the eventuality the little tigger still believes his initial argument, I believe you should look into instituting a 5 blog suspension of comment privileges.

Thanks,
AB

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Mark, I believe that you may be to close to the issue, to be objective.

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I’m reading “weaver on Strategy” right now and find many smiliarities between Weaver and Cox as well as the success of their teams. Weaver’s Orioles won 6 division titles and 4 pennants but only 1 World Series. (Interestingly, I’ve never seen Weaver knocked like Cox for having won only a single World Series … and it was an easier road before the wild card.) Weaver’s teams relied on pitching, defense and power — very much like the good Braves teams did. Ejections were hallmarks of both managers, too. Weaver was known for his use of statistics, which is different than Bobby. Weaver is rightfully recognized as a great manager, as Cox is and should be, but it looks like there’s another big difference between Weaver and Cox — knowing when to retire.

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Braves Fan: that was LAST night, not Tuesday night.

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I am the biggest Bobby Cox fan out there….I’ve been drinking the kool aid for many years. That being said, I do agree with you, MB. Do you think that Bobby sees this writing on the wall, or does he have his “baseball blinders” on?

Just a question for you, MB…since YOU mentioned it first. Theoretically, if you were hiring a new manager for the Bravos…who would make your interview list?

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Amen Sir Stealth. He wouldn’t ever and won’t now let his players take the blame. Even though it has hurt his image and opened the door to the cynics forever. Those of us who understand and have been there from the start will never forget it.

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does anyone know how brooks conrad at gwinnets defence is? he seems to hit down there anyways

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That’s your “COMMENT”….Mr. Bradley?…next time…”PLEASE”…SHUT THE ####@@@##$,DON”T SAY NOTHING…”YOU CAN’T DEFEND THE INDEFENSIBLE”Mr “MORON” COX…HAVE TO GO….OK???..HE IS THE “EPIDEMIC”!!!!

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Very good story, Mark. Interesting angle and one I’m somewhat inclined to agree with. I have a lot of respect for Bobby Cox and a great appreciation for what he’s done for Atlanta and baseball but you’re right – this team might not fit him very well. Good writing.

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Mark…..he WAS a great manager. But all people need hunger, need new perspective and need to learn. He just doesn’t seem to do well with young guys like he used to. He has also lost some great talent as his assistants and not sure if he currently has a bunch of yes men or if they are as talented as his past crew.

Having said all this….this current organizational malasie falls at the feet of John Scheurholtz and the fact they didn’t replace Paul Snyder and the player personnel people with nearly as talented as what they had in the early 90s. Just think about this, we haven’t had one positional player since Chipper become a superstar. Mac is becoming that for sure, but that is one every 10 years! We haven’t had one pitcher since Avery develop into a superstar. The exception was Jason Schmidt but he was traded. Now we possibly have Hanson. That is an ABYSMAL track record that comes nowehere close to what they did in the 90s. They have developed many decent players, but no superstars and you just can’t compete unless you either pay the highest salaries or have exceptional scountin i.e Marlins, Rays etc….

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Pittsburgh has a better record than us now. Pathetic.

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By the way, imagine what this team would look like had the Braves signed Sheffield (.886 OPS) instead of Anderson (.661 OPS). And signed Dunn (.931 OPS) instead of adding to the rotation with Kawakami (93 ERA+).

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I’ll say it again, a manager or coach must change his style at times to suit the talents of the players on the team. Bobby Cox cannot coach this team like he did the team in 1995. That team was loaded with talent both on the pitching mound and at the plate. In the 90’s, he could sit back and wait for a home run because he had Smoltz, Glavine, Maddux, Avery and whoever else you wanted to be your number five starter. The chances were that the pitcher wouldn’t give up squat. Now, he needs to manage to actually manufacture runs because this team is good in pitching but not like they were back then. This team also has much younger players than Cox ever had. If you will remember, the Braves simply went out and got what they wanted in the 90’s. HE NEEDS TO CHANGE HIS STYLE.

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Comments like this help me understand why Atlanta has a reputation as a terrible sports town that can’t even sell out its own playoff games. Those of you suggesting that Bobby Cox is the reason for the Braves’ postseason failures are probably the same “fans” who couldn’t be bothered to show up for games in the postseason. And some of you really think Clint Hurdle, who made the postseason once as a complete fluke, or Ned Yost, who never made the postseason at all and blew one division lead after another, would do a better job? Wow. Just wow.

These same kinds of comments–”washed up,” “used to be good,” “game has passed him by”–were exactly what people at Penn State were saying about Joe Paterno when he went through a rough patch a few years ago. Strangely, you’re not hearing those comments much anymore. Funny what a few of Big 10 titles and bowl titles will do for you.

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Blackberry Cobbler, I think that would be a valid argument if we were seeing adjustments from some of the players and it still wasn’t working out. But we’re not. Frenchy is still swinging at the first pitch. And I find it really hard to believe no one has ever talked to him about that. You can’t teach someone who doesn’t want to learn. I think Chipper’s comments about Francoeur further demonstrates this.

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it’s time for a regime change. Out with old, in with new. We said goodbye to our aging pitchers and brining in younger talent. The same can be applied to our coaches & managers. I have nothing but the greatest respect for Smoltz/Glav/TP/Cox..but we have to stop living in the 90’s (and i agree with most that while it was a great run, we only have 1 WS ring to show for all that work & talent). Cox can have a front office position and TP can go down to the farm system. Time for Change!!

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Mark, again another well written, well thought of piece. I couldn’t have put it better myself (guess that’s why you get the big bucks to write…& I don’t). Bobby is by all measure(s) a “great manager”. He has accomplish feats that may never be duplicated or surpassed (14 straight divisions championship is a professional sports record). He truly has his players best interest, & it’s almost surreal to watch & hear him root for every player (you can almost always hear Bobby shout encouragement from the dugout on every at bat).

We must not forget how “great” Bobby has been and will always be (a sure-fire first ballot hall of famer). Now with that being said, you are right on target. As I have preached, Bobby is a professed three-run homer type of manager. His strong suit doesn’t match the team’s current personal and payroll restrictions. The question is, how do you “gently let a manager of Bobby’s stature go”? It would be a colossal mistake for Frank Wren to fire Bobby, so the job of replacing him is not one that will ingratiate Wren with the fans (as if he cares anyway seeing how he has axed Smoltz, Glav, and his overall reaction to us dumb fans). If and when Bobby decides to retire I would have but one choice…Fredi Gonzalez. He is used to having ridiculous payroll restrictions, is great with creating something out of nothing (with young players), and is of course a former Braves coach and spent time in our minor league system.

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FRANK WREN is the guy who should be fired. He is the one who assembled this totally dysfunctional team, the one with no speed and no power and no idea how to manufacture runs, the man who got together the leaky infield when the pitching staff throws a lot of sinkers and needs sound defense. Wren is the guy who chased players all winter with bags of money and usially got rejected. The Orioles fired Frank Wren as their GM, and now they evrn beat the Braves. In baseball and anywhere else, it is seldom smart to hire somebody who has been fired from a similar job elsewhere for being incompetent. Get rid of Wren NOW and maybe, after the season ends, offer Bobby Cox a job as an advisor/consultant in the front office. With THIS team, no manager could be very successful.

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Enter your comments here

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Hell No! The Braves need new owners.

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Freddi Gonzalez! Too bad the Marlins extended him.
Ned Yost would be a replacement Bobby would heartily endorse.
I still think they’re grooming TP, for better or for worse.

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Frenchy led off with a triple. Kelly Johnson proceeded to fly out but not deep enough. Javier Vazquez comes to the plate, one of the best bunting pitchers on the team. Does Bobby try a squeeze? NOPE. With this team you got to take runs how u can get them. That would have been a perfect time to do the squeeze and who knows that could have sparked the offense. It’s the little things that if done right, can really light up an offense. I just dont think he is taking the risks he needs to in order to push this team along. When Bmac was up with Chipper and Yunel on in front of him with no outs, Bobby should have sent the runners with a 3-2 count. The man has struck out only 19 times. Yes, I got these ideas from Joe and Boog last night, but come on they were good ideas and who knows maybe getting that one run from the squeeze and staying out of the DP would have won the game.

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There are many correct observations above including Jborodawg. Most baseball people think he is one of the top 2-3 managers in the game and it is because of what he did for 14 years. I would agree. But because we are talking subjectively, my question comes down to what makes a great manager, what is the criteria?

If it is consistency, Cox wins hands down. If it is titles, Torre. If it is getting the most out of the least, you have others….it goes on and on.

To me it really comes down to WS titles and putting the best teams on the field, year after year. Cox had 3 HOF pitchers and a very good surrounding cast in the 90s. Even then, the Braves still only won 1 WS. That has been discussed ad nauseum (the umpire, the Leyritz HR, on and on). He doesn’t have the players but he also isn’t getting the most out of them and it could be he doesn’t have the coaches, he doesn’t hold players as accountable as he used to or he just doesn’t connect like he used to, we really don’t know that unless we are in the clubhouse.

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Someone needs to light a fire in these guys. They need to play like they are playing for a job. I don’t think Bobby Cox can push those kind of buttons. And then you add to that his line-ups and on the field managing and tactics and I think it’s sadly time for Bobby to go.

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“He’s the best manager I’ve ever seen. He’s the best manager I’ll ever see. ”

By process of logical reasoning, I deduce you have never ever seen another baseball manager and never ever will – either that or you, Mr Bradley smoke CHEAP crack – cuz Cox is absolutely the WORST manager of all time

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Wow!!! It’s about time somebody realized Bobby Cox must go…done…through..over….finished! He should have been dismissed 10 years ago! Oh…and to the Braves General Manager, please stop bringing back old players with injuries. You can’t teach an old dog new tricks (including surgeries)…not gonna happen if you expect to win a championship anytime soon.

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I am delighted to see this subject being presented in public. Up to this point, any discussion about Cox going was like talking about the elderly aunt in the basement – everybody knew about it, but no one dare bring it up.

If the standard for great managers is longevity and regular season wins, Cox wins hands down.

But in the MLB and other professional sports, the measurements are championships and Cox has but one – only one. Three HOF’ers in the rotation and he only has one.

All you Cox apologists/enablers can choose to shoot the messenger here, but aside from Chipper, who is the constant over this run of failed post-seasons?

Why does blame and accoutability dodge Cox?

Why can’t the Braves develop and keep players?

Why do free agents no longer have Atlanta as a destination of choice?

I could go on, but it is like beating a dead horse – literally and figuratively.

For so many reasons, the housecleaning that began with Smoltz and Glavine must continue to the dugout if there is a sincere desire on the part of ownership to have a contending team.

If not, it shows that ownership is satisfied with the status quo, satisfied with peddling prospects for rent-a-players to perpetuate the myths of a playoff run.

Cox could have bowed out gracefully at any one of a number of occasions. His insistence of sticking around long past his time denies him that privledge.

The Braves seem to have become very skilled at the awkward and embarrassing exit. Now they have yet another opportunity to do just that.

Keeping Cox now assures this team free time in October for as long as this future HOF’er stubbornly sticks around.

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Mark said it best: “With few exceptions, these Braves enjoy the reflection of success without having achieved the success itself.” Those who built the Braves’ legacy are gone, and those who have inherited it are not worthy of it. I think Bobby is a great manager, as do most thinking baseball people. But there are few of those in football-crazy, NASCAR-obsessed Georgia. Others in here think anyone could win with the talent he had. We’ll never know for sure, but I contend it’s not that simple, as it may be in other sports. Managing a baseball team well means getting them to play hard the right way for six months, not blowing a whistle and making them hop through tires. But maybe this bunch of underachievers does need a new, younger skipper. And a few new faces to replace these washed-up former prospects, who (except for McCann) are proving to be marginal major leaguers at best.

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Why should Cox be treated any different than Glavine, Maddux, Smoltz, Murphy, and Niekro.
He’s no longer producing so its time to cut him loose.

This team has too many good baseball players to not be winning more,they are obviously not motivated.

Just look at the facial expressions when they pan thru the dugout, they all look like someone jusy shot their dog!!

You can’t replace all the players, when need someone who will kick them in the ass like a Lou Pinella, or Larry Bowa, or if he wasn’t being blackballed PETE ROSE would be perfect for this bunch!

Where’s Billy Martin when you need him?

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Bobby Cox is one of the best managers ever. But these players need a kick in the pants & often. Not something they’re going to get from Cox. I look at Sweet Lou Pinella. He jiggers the lineup all the time, based on who’s hitting & who’s not. You would never get that with Cox who likes to think his players will just turn things around themselves. That’s not happening with this team. Francouer should’ve been dealt with a long time ago & it was toally mishandled last season. Jeffy lives in a dreamworld where he’s just having a little slump & he’s as good as his buddy McCann. Ha!! He’s delusional. It’s starting to become demoralizing the way we find new & various methods of losing games. Who’s got the cayones to do something?????

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one of the best columns you have ever wrote. i would hate to see cox leave also. the REAL problem is the braves dont PAY anymore, lol. the farm system is still sound, its the big pitcher they need or the big bat they cant get anymore. that failure to get the big bat and the shut down pitching is HIGHLIGHTED by the fact they dont have team speed on the bases or hit for average. its all basic, as most baseball fans know. when the braves didnt care about payroll, cox could get the players he needed. the team is just a bunch of AAA scrubs passing off as major leaguers, thats all.

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It wouldn’t hurt my feelings if Bobby would get a little uppity with some of these slack underachievers. But Bobby’s not the problem. Y’all give Bobby a bunch of crap – “He only won 1 World Series out of all those tries, he must be the most useless manager in the world” – but I gah-ron-tee that Bobby ain’t the problem. TP needs to work on his people skills. Some players need to understand that playing this game is not a right, that in order to be taught, you must first want to learn. Sure, a fresh face might shake things up, but in the long run, shakers eventually fizzle out.

Bobby’s steady. He knows the game. He has been, and will continue to be, a great steward for this organization. He’s doing what he gets paid to do, and he does it well. Maybe there are some other people in the organization who need to be reminded of what they get paid to do.

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It’s not Bobby, IT’S THE PLAYERS! Bobby doesn’t swing at the first pitch or boot a routine ground ball.

Bobby had a bunch of rookies a few years ago (06) and we won the division. A new manager isn’t going to make these players better. They aren’t that good of players in the first place. Batters 5-8 aren’t everyday major leaguers people.

Also, I get tired of hearing he’s a 3 run home run guy only and doesn’t manufacture runs. Those people must not be watching because I saw it the other night in a comeback victory. Frenchy and Johnson bunted both the runners over… IF he has players that can steal like McClouth he’ll give them the green light.

McClouth is a good step in the right direction. Now we need a new 2nd baseman, right and left fielder and we’ll be good to go. It takes time people. THe roster has been greatly overhauled since last year already… can’t be done overnight.

Also, fans and writers certainly tend to overreact during baseball seasons. What’s everyone going to say if/when we fare well against the Bo Sox and Yanks? There’s still time to gain ground with head to head matchups against the division leaders.

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Gayle, the reason free agents no longer flock to Atlanta is simple: The Braves no longer pay top dollar. In recent years, the team’s ownership has gone from among the top payrolls to middle of the pack. Players unanimously love to play for Bobby, but they’re not going to take less money to do so. Would you? To us fans, it’s a game. To them, it’s their job, and their careers are short. I understand the decision.

It’s true he only won one title, and with great pitching. But one thing he never had was a great closer to finish what Smoltz, Glavine and Maddux started. Look back over the 90s and there was a long string of so-so ninth-inning guys who blew a lot of their hard work (like Reardon’s homer to a backup catcher in ‘92, Wohlers doing the same in ‘96). You give Bobby a Mariano Rivera and he might have had all those rings Joe Torre won.

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Mark,

I admire Cox almost as much as you do, but don’t think for one second that Cox doesn’t have a say in what players are brought into this organization, and what players are not.

Because, as you stated, “He’s one of three reasons…the Braves became the Braves”. He may not have the final word, {if he did, Glavine would still be on this team} but he has a lot of input, so he has to partially to blame for the cast that has been assembled.

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If you live by the 3 run homer, you die by the 3 run homer.

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I would also add that passion for the game and the like is only part of the problem. To be frank I just think some guys on our team were over-hyped (Frenchy, KJ, Kotch, Hanson). I just don’t think they’re as good as people thought they were / wanted them to be.

I still say getting Kotch and a failed relief pitching prospect in return for Tex was bad enough to counter the good trade of Renteria for JJ/Gorky. The other trades in the last three years have all been more negative than positive.

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Nice job, Mark. The Braves are in a tough situation; there is no way they can, or will, fire Bobby Cox, but does anyone doubt that any other nmanager who had done the job Bobby has over the past three years would be long gone? Bobby isn’t going anywhere unless he chooses to, which I hope is soon.

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Robert-
What makes you so great in your mind?
Is it
1)The repeated undereducated vitrol?
2)The asinine comments that you repeatedly blog about Cox?
3)The desperate need to be noticed(loved?) by anyone?

Get a new soapbox… and try reading Bradley’s article again.
He is actually talking about people like YOU.

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Painful words that are beautifully written, Mark. I could not agree more.

The Braves are not what they used to be – by a long shot. And honestly, I don’t think this is something that’s going to change a lot in the near future.

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Well, you can argue for not firing Cox right now. But if Kelly Johnson starts one game after Omar Infante comes of the DL, then you can fire Cox and leave no doubts on the table. Prado should be in the starting lineup tonight. And I’d put Brandon Jones in the outfield ahead of Francouer. I mean, really. He could do worse.

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I have seen on more than one occassion in blogs that Kotchman is not very good or is not cutting it. I am not sure what people are basing this on. From my perspective, he has done exactly what was expected of him and filled the role. He is hitting round .280 and plays good defense. Sure it would be great to have a .300 hitter with 30+ homers at first with gold glove defense, but that is unrealistic unless you are give up a lot in other positions.

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Bobby’s done enough to deserve better than this ragtag bunch. It must kill Chipper and Mac to watch Francouer’s lack of any plan at the plate (I can’t get away from the Pittsburgh series, two straight walks given up by their pitcher on only 9 pitches, and French swings at the first pitch, a curve well out of the zone) KJ’s inconsistency hitting and fielding, and Yunel acting as though he’s 10 years old. With Prado gimpy and Infante hurt, there is no one to replace KJ, not that I really think it would happen. Nor do I think Diaz will move to right, which would help immensely at the plate, much more than it would hurt in the field. Bobby’s one big fault, to me, is also his greatest asset: loyalty. I wish Wren would take one decision out of Bobby’s hands by sending French down to let him see if he can hit.

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I can’t entirely agree with your article.
1) as has been pointed out for all the winning seasons and Division titles he brought only 1 World Series win. why? because he’s a by-the-book manager. He plays the odds and during the course of 162 games those odds will fall in your favor. In the post season you actually have to manage and use strategy, which frankly he’s never shown the ability to do.
2) He can’t manage a pitching staff..and I don’t need reminded of the HOF starters we trotted out for many years…I’m talking the bullpen. He has a knack for leaving a starter (or reliever) in there 1 or 2 batters too long. Or taking out a hot reliever just so he can get a lefty or righty matchup and watching the next guy implode!
He’ll get in an umps face to defend his players which I admire but only on rare occasions will he get in a players face (or bench them) like he did Andruw once and Yunel recently. Things like that need to be done more…quit being their friend and actually start managing them.
I have all the respect in the world for Bobby…I’ve watched the Braves win alot more than they’ve lost because of him. But he’s not great manager because of these things and never will be.

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Bubba,

It used to be the manager’s job to make sure that the coaches and players on his team knew what their roles were, and that they executed them accordingly.

Is that not the case anymore?

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All but two teams in MLB would fire their managers today just for the opportunity for BC to tell them no.

Simply the best.

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I first had my doubts about Bobby when his vastly superior 1985 Toronto Blues Jays team blew a 3-1 ALCS lead againt the Royals. And then he blew chances in 1991, 1992 and 1993. 1995 proved to be an anomaly. 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004 and 2005 again demonstrated he couldn’t bring it on home. The seasons the Braves have had since then would’ve gotten anyone else fired.
Cox’s reputation was always that he was a great manager for the long haul of a season but couldn’t outcoach anyone in the short playoffs. Now, the record demonstrates that he aint so hot for the regular season.
That said, the Braves are lousy because their players and organization are lousy. A different manager isn’t going to make much difference.

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I agree, Cox is great but also agree his players are not listening (although they hear him). Kick Bobby back upstairs to an Asst GM – Player Personnel position and let him work on finding our next Chipper, Tom Glavine and John Smoltz (I think all were acquired by Bobby while he was GM). Find something else for Terry Pendleton to do in the organization, and bring in a manager and batting/hitting coach who will hold the players accountable for their results, and over the last few years their lack of results.

I’d like to see Chipper as the batting coach and maybe someday we will, but it does not appear that Jeff Francouer or Jordan Schafer listened to what Chipper has told them. As for Yunel, he just needs a good ass-kicking from somebody to get him out of his fog. Might help Jeff too.

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Bobby Cox should have retired years ago—he doesn’t have it anymore. Plus, the braves management is incompetent and the owners too cheap to bring in better talent. Another mediocre year for the braves in store!

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We need a Black Manager like Dusty Baker! Then we will win it all!
OBAMA is my black presidents!

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Bravesfan: It’s understandable. When every single loss is exactly the same as the one before it, the memories do tend to blur together.

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Rasheed – tell us you are not serious here. Come on, some one being black will suddenly make the Braves winners? Not hardly!

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Dr.R; I’ll check you off as a Cox apologist. If you think that Burnett, Furcal and Griffey went elsewhere because of money, then I guess you’re also checking your mailbox for your playoff ticket applications.

Cox’s time and best work is behind him. It’s time to let go of the past and move on.

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Taking a hint from B-rockGT….

Here is my lineup which would produce more runs and may actually keep us somewhat competitive…

Escobar SS
Prado 2B
Chipper 3B
McCann C
McLouth CF
Kotchman 1B
Diaz LF
B Jones RF
Pitcher

I’m not sure what the deal is but for 20 years, Bobby Cox would always have at least 3 guys in the line up at any one time who can’t hit. “Gotta have defense” I guess. But I think we have to consider all facets of the game and not just defense. I think it is one reason the Braves have won only one WS. They have played too conservatively. They do it during the season and in the post season.

I’ve always been an advocate of Davy Johnson’s thinking: Put all the guys in the line up who can hit. Defense is one thing but you gotta score runs to win games too. Hitting is far more important. It’s great to get both but unfortunately we don’t have very skilled hands on this team right now.

I think with regular play, Prado and Diaz will hit better. I know we tried that experiment with Diaz before, but just tell him that he’s only going to play the second half in left. Maybe he won’t notice that means he is actually full time (shhhhhhh…)

Brandon Jones should hit just enough to keep himself in the majors, until we make a trade, or if Schafer is going to prove himself at the MLB level. Jones could not possibly do any worse than Frenchy. Trade him or release him. I can guaranty you that he will either be someone’s bench player for the next few seasons or he will be out of baseball. He is not going to make a comeback people. Forget it.

McLouth really needs to hit in the middle of this line up. We need power! Escobar and Prado should get on base more than enough to be at the top. Maybe switch them if Escobar starts whining again that he doesn’t like hitting first or if he keeps hitting homers we will need him batting second. Not sure why no one has EVER suggested putting Prado leading off. Why not? He had a .377 OBP last year.

I agree that Greg Norton needs to be cut. It is absolutely 100% ridiculous that he is still with the team. He might be a nice guy but frankly, if a person does not produce then he should be fired. Sorry, but that’s just the way it works. I’ve fired people on my staff too because they were a drain on resources. He is taking up a roster spot for a TRUE hitter in Canizares.

WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT HITTING! Bring in everyone who can hit and put them in the line up!! This should not be about relationship building or character building or whatever. It’s about winning games. If we have a player on the bench who is clearly outperforming the regular, then PUT HIM IN THERE!!! There is no reason why Prado, B. Jones, and Diaz should not be playing right now.

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“This team has too many good baseball players to not be winning more,they are obviously not motivated.” Understand that in baseball, you can’t become a better player just by TRYING harder. This isn’t pee-wee soccer. It’s a game of highly skilled players that requires execution and adjustment. If the players are no good, and I agree this roster is lacking, it’s because the front office did not judge the talent effectively. Even then, it’s not an exact science.

By the way, LaRussa has managed longer than Cox and has exactly one more title (including suffering two World Series sweeps) and Billy Martin also won just two in all the years he managed, and that was with the best team money can buy. Some express great love for these fiery old-school guys but their track records really aren’t so great, and they tend to wear out their welcome in short order. Martin was famous for getting teams to a certain point but he didn’t really win that much. Much of that is because his ego got in the way of letting the players get credit for winning.

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The farm beckons, Bobby. Writers like MB and many of the bloggers show kindness out of respect. Make this your last season-for your sake.

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I agree. The Braves need a change in manager, but they also need new manageMENT.

Their current GM has been suckered multiple times already (ie. Furcal), has alienated not one but two Braves legends (I personally think it’s good that they gave up on Glavine, but it didn’t need to be so bad), and just can’t find really good players.

Their current president, for all the praise he got while GM for deals like Maddux and McGriff, also made boneheaded deals like Rico Brogna, Albie Lopez, and giving away the farm for a few years rental of Gary Sheffield and J.D. Drew.

They need ownership this isn’t a faceless corporation.

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Will you please quit suggesting that Vazquez be traded??? Right now he is our BEST pitcher. He has been consistent throughout his career.

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How about Ed Yost as manager n gerald perry as the hittin coach…We need fire Bobby cox n friends not the pitchin coach he okay.I still feel francoer will be traded with KJ to cubs for 4 minor league players n a outfielder not known maybe Milton Bradley..is one! Lets see if i get a answer back on that

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Jeff Francoeur is batting 6th today. I dont care if it is a left hander pitching today. The fact that he is batting 6th today speaks volumes about this line-up. He should be batting 8th, PERIOD.

What continues to BAFFLE me is that Bobby Cox refuses to bench Francoeur and start Matt Diaz in right field. Yet today, Diaz is batting 4th and Francoeur 6th.

Now, some of you may be saying “Hum, Diaz rakes the lefties, therefore batting him higher makes sense”. Well, if you are going to judge by the numbers, then look at this:

Batting vs. Lefties……………..Matt Diaz………………Jeff Francoeur

At-Bats………………………………55…………………………74……….
Average…………………………….273………………………..297………
Doubles……………………………….3……………………………1………
Triples…………………………………1……………………………2………
Homers………………………………..0…………………………..1………
RBIs……………………………………6…………………………..11…….
Walks…………………………………6…………………………….2……..
Strikeouts…………………………….8……………………………8……..

Judging by those left numbers, I would “give” Francoeur a slight edge.

Lets look at their numbers vs. righties:

Batting vs. Righties……………..Matt Diaz………………Jeff Francoeur…..

At-Bats……………………………….59…………………………..166………….
Average……………………………..271…………………………..229…………
Doubles………………………………..2………………………………5………..
Triples………………………………….1………………………………0………..
Homers………………………………..2………………………………3………..
RBIs…………………………………..10…………………………….19………..
Walks………………………………….6………………………………8………..
Strikeouts…………………………….16…………………………….27……….

In almost 3 times that at-bats, I give the edge overwhelmly to Diaz. Francoeur’s batting average alone warrants him to be benched against right handers. If anything, Francoeur should only play against left handers and ride the bench against right handers.

Yet Matt Diaz is the one riding the bench against righties while Francoeur is free to drag the line-up with his .229 average against righties.

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Mark,

I love these bombs you’re throwing this year! Smoltz is a jerk! Fire Frank Wren! Get rid of Francoeur! It’s about time the AJC columnists stopped drinking the Kool Aid!

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Gee what is there not to like ?

We are battling for the cellar in the division…….. We walk less than most teams, make crucial outs with Impatience at the plate…….and have players that are constantly rally killers.

I think since the money they make is so small……. they should be allowed to relax and take their pay, after all isn’t baseball a long season……..gosh don’t they work about 1/2 as much as a regular workers, and sometime they have to work when it gets hot.

It must be tough to be fat out of shape and have to play ball when it is hot.

No wonder Bobby doesn’t expect too much…….why should we ?

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Where to begin?

Kevin, it’s Ned Yost, not Ed, and I doubt the Cubs would give much of anything for players the Braves don’t want. So go back to your coloring books and behave until mama gets home.

Forsyth Fan, Bobby does not “gather” the talent. He plays the guys the front office gets him. He doesn’t not go recruting like they do in high schools in your county.

And Bulldog Female Grad, first get your thumb off the shift key; then understand that Barry Lamar Bonds is 45 years old, has bad knees, hasn’t played in two years and may soon be in prison.

I’m gonna bow out now ‘cuz there’s just too many of these for me to bother with.

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Paul Lentz… I really think Diaz’ numbers would be better if he got more consistent ABs. I know what happened earlier with him being picked to start regularly but honestly, what player doesn’t hit better when in the line up consistently?

Personally, I would bring up B Jones to play RF and put Diaz in LF regularly. Anderson needs to be released or retire.

This is only a short term fix because I still believe that we need to trade Vasquez, Johnson, and Francoeur for some hitting.

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Mark….talk about Spin! Its for sure the spin don’t stop with MB. Can’t have it both ways, friend.

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Amen! I LOVE Bobby, and I always will. But, absolutely NOTHING is working. Perhaps it’s time to let Bobby retire into the sunset while he’s still young enough to wait the 5-year period for his HOF installation so he can be there to receive the honor. It’s time to move on to another regime, which will most likely not be matched by Bobby’s. But, the next guy can most certainly try to come close.

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Very well done, Mark!! Really great articles this week!!

I have a great amount of respect for Mr. Cox and what he has done for the Braves organization – period. However, we all have a season, and I truly believe that his has passed.

As fans, maybe we won’t truly appreciate what he accomplished until he’s gone, but I’m actually kind of ready to see what’s next. Time for a new face and hopefully a new brand of Braves baseball!!

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Personally I think the days when Cox’s management style was successful are gone. The game has changed and the players attitudes have changed. He’s a “player’s manager” which means, to me anyway, he’s fiercely loyal to his players. However, in this day and age, how many of today’s players will return the same degree of loyalty?

The last couiple of years we’ve agonized over having to let go of our long time veterans and how to do this respectfully. Do you see that happening anywhere else in the league with the recent generations of players? I don’t.

The MLB has become much more like the NBA – the players are multi-media, multi-outlet celebrities. I would guess the salaries of most of the MLB’s All-Stars doesn’t even pay their taxes any longer – the vast majority of their income comes for outside sources. Baseball is just what they have to do to secure these lucrative contracts. “The Game” just isn’t as important to this day’s player is it was 20 years ago.

Coaching had to adjust in the NBA and has been adjusting in the MLB. Cox just doesn’t seem the type to adjust.

However, I can’t see firing Cox. Encouraging him to retire is about as much as you can do at this point. Hopefully he’ll get the hint and make a graceful exit before it becomes necessary to take a stronger stance.

So, assuming he leaves – who gets the job? Pendleton? I’m not crazy about this considering his lack of success as a hitting coach but, it would at least allow us to get someone into take his place!

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A really superior article, Mr Bradley. You are spot on.

“It has gotten too easy to be an Atlanta Brave. With few exceptions, these Braves enjoy the reflection of success without having achieved the success itself.”

” I respect the man too much to see him lose with players who have little sense of what it once meant to be a Brave.”

“I like Bobby Cox. I don’t like what the Braves have become.”

My feelings exactly.

Just a beautiful article. Thank you.

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Bulldawg – Because Barry Bonds did wonders for San Francisco. I’m sure he’ll be even better after two more years of aging and inactivity.

Anyway…every coach I played for acted like a coach – they were mean and they were ugly. Not for the sake of being a jerk, but for the sake of helping us to do our best. They pressed our buttons to fire us up. They chewed us out when we did something stupid. Then they’d work to make sure we didn’t do something stupid again.

Like you said, Mark, this obviously isn’t working with these Braves…KJ, Yunel, and Francoeur particularly. They all have star potential, but they need more coaching, and it’s obvivous that Bobby’s style isn’t working.

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Yes it is time, As much as we hate to say it. Bobby is not getting the job done. He is a mere figure head for the position, of his former self. With that being said, I hope John S, not Frank Wren, handle this situation with the upmost respect deserving of a great Manger, Man, an employee of a world class organization.

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I love Bobby but frankly, the conservative style has to go. This has gone on long enough. His style is well suited for an established team where keeping the guys from griping in the clubhouse and keeping their minds solely on the field is paramount. I don’t think it works well with teams in transition where you literally need to start kicking some a$$es to get them to perform.

Put in all the guys into the line up who can hit. I don’t know why Bobby has always traditionally had 2-3 guys in at any one time who flat out cannot hit the ball. I just don’t get it. It’s this conservative approach that keeps rearing it’s ugly head. Francoeur, Anderson, and Johnson all need to be benched indefinitely or until we can trade them. They have ALL had more than enough ABs to figure things out by now. Start producing or you are canned. Period. End of story.

You know, going with a 4-5 man rotation in the playoffs is ridiculous. I know that’s nice to keep the guys “fresh” but we are talking about do or die. Put the top 3 guys in there and when it comes to the WS keep throwing out the top 2! Whatever it takes to win!

We still could use another trade but…

Escobar SS
Prado 2B
Chipper 3B
McCann C
McLouth CF
Kotchman 1B
Diaz LF
B Jones RF
Pitcher

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MB I think you hit it right on the nose. BC is a Great guy, he treats his players like men. Problem is he has some kids playing for him. Kids who need guidence from Coaches who don’t coach. First rule change would be absolutely no working with another coach from another orgainazation. You work with our hitting coach, the one who is going to see you everyday, in the cages and games. More coaching ought to be done during the game. Talk to players about mental errors at the time they happen. Talk to players when they are on deck about the situation at hand. Whatch the coaches during a game they don’t coach.Move Chipper to first, should have happened years ago and it would have been settled at first. I think I heard last night that Mac had not struck out but 17 times this season. Frenchy take notice, if you swing on first pitch outside I would take you out of the game. Get your head out of your a__ _ and listen to your hitting coach. Heshould know you better than anyone except your father. Sorry but Anderson hasen’t shown me anything. Diaz would play everyday. Prado and Infantie would play alot couldn’t hurt or be anyworse than it is now. Just my opion.

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Bobby Cox deserves the best treatment he can get. I have a Braves fan since birth. Even if I do live in wisonsin. I have always been a loyal fan. The Game doesn’t change. The players do. Mr Cox may not be able to reach all players anymore. That doesn’t make him a bad mamager. vince lombardi was a great football coach. i don’t think he could coach these days today’s NFl players wouldn’t respond. Maybe the Braves’s need a change. Then who would fill bobby’s shoe’s. make a change when Cox is ready to leave and not before. he deserves respect.

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The Braves, where young men learn right values to prosper playing a game, should have fired Cox when he showed up on the police blotter for drunkenly beating his wife. After that was all the trouble with Chipper Jones that a better coach and mentor might have steered him around. Chipper’s performance on the field was negatively affected by the life choices made with a bum for a coach.

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Changes from top to bottom. Need to go with young players.

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bravesfanforever…………..I totally agree that Matt Diaz would play better if he played regularly. That is why I posted the contrast in numbers between Diaz and Francoeur, especially their numbers batting against righties.

If anything, against righties, I would play Diaz in right and Anderson in left (bringing in Francoeur to pay right and move Diaz to left in late inning situations where the Braves have the lead). The only way I would start Francoeur is to give Anderson a rest against lefties, where I would switch Diaz to left field so Francoeur can start in right.

However, I still would start Anderson in left the majority of the time. Anderson still has pop in his bat. I would just replace him in left in late inning situations.

Regardless, Matt Diaz needs to play much more than Francoeur does.

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I’ve felt for years that Ned Yost should be the next manager once Bobby C retires.

I wouldn’t mind bringing him in an apprentice like role with the understanding that whenever Bobby decides to step down, Ned would take over.

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It is amazing that people on here took that Bobby should stay.In the MLB and other professional sports, the measurements are championships and Cox has but one – only one after 14 straight divisions championship only one championship.Out with the old and in with the new the game has past him by now for the last 10 years.

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Mark- these people have no idea what your article was about.

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Today’s game is a perfect example of not thinking about hitting first. Why is Ross hitting 8th when he has a .982 OPS?? It’s the highest in the line up!! He should be batting 4th or 5th!

What about McLouth? Why is he leading off? It’s not like he is a speedster. Put Prado in the lead off position and drop McLouth to 5th. This team has zero speed anyway and frankly we don’t take advantage of anyone’s speed so why worry about it?

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Send Wren packin also.

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Mark Bradley… Your article was fine–borderline great in fact.

I agree that Bobby is a Hall of Famer and one of the best ever. But there is a certain fit with every club and it’s clear this club does not match Bobby.

Just blow off the comments. Some of these comments are ridiculous.

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Well done Mark
I might have said it differently using different words but your message is accurate. Bobby Cox has reached a point in his life where a “player’s manager” is wrong for this team. In fact, Bobby being a player’s manager was ok when he was surrounded with veterans and Cy Young pitchers. I cannot agree or disagree with how effective he is as a manager, but the numbers indicate he is legendary. I only question if his only job was filling out the lineup card each day was enough, because in my eyes, a player’s manager just let’s the players go about their business and does not meddle. Except for the Andruw benching i such a way (in the middle of an inning) I haven’t seen much managing. But in Atlanta, he is idolized and that is fine with me. I have been a Braves fan for a long long time and yes, he was a part of baseball history that I was priviledged to witness night in and night out.

Again, well put Mark.

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WOW! A whole six and a half games out of first place…and we’re raising the white flag, and calling for Bobby’s head on a platter (at least a lot of fans are). I’ve been a Braves fan for twenty years. I grew up watching them on TBS, Dale Murphy, Ron Gant, Bob Horner, Jeff Blauser, etc, etc. I will always be a Braves fan, and is shames me to go to games where the visiting team is louder than the home team. That’s the problem in Atlanta, there are so few true fans. So few people willing to stand up and cheer the home team, unless the Chik Fil A cow or the big drum starts chopping…sad, sad, sad.

I remember when Kent Hrbek muscled Gant off first base. I remember Joe Carter. To say the Braves “ONLY” won one championship during their span, remember that there were other very good teams competing as well.

Bobby still has the passion and ability to manage the team. While I do agree that KJ should be on the bench, Bobby can’t get out there and field. Bobby can’t step up to the plate. Bobby isn’t the one coming out of the bullpen and blowing a lead. Bobby may have made some bad decisions, but what manager doesn’t? I think Bobby has done a great job with the limitations he’s been given financially. Once Jeff gets his swing back, and the Braves start giving their great starting pitching some run support, we’ll see that six and a half game lead get lower and lower. The Braves will be in the postseason this year folks…mark it on the calendar.

Tim Hudson comes back, Kawakami goes to the pen, Jeff finds his swing, and Omar finishes as our starting second baseman.

Braves win NL East…there are still 98 games to play.

my name is abudefdef…and I’m a true Braves fan.

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No matter who the manager is you can’t win races with mules.

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Wow, I posted immediately after reading your column and then went back and read some other posts. Unbelievable, how could anyone call you an idiot for voicing your opinion? I’d say maybe the idiots are the ones bashing you as they respond to your column.
Jezzzz people, rad between the lines, does Mark feel like a change is needed? YES. Would he fire Bobby? NO, but no one inthis organization will fire Bobby Cox, he has been around too long and we are not in NY. We are in Atlanta and in Atlanta, Bobby Cox calls his own shots. We can only hope that Bobby decides to hang them up after this year.

Again, very nice job Mark and well said.

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Mark, I’ve always liked and respected Bobby Cox. He;s one of my favorite people in baseball, and belongs in the Hall of Fame, while he’s still living.

That being said, while I wouldn’t “Fire” Bobby Cox, after 20 years as our manager, and 25 straight years working for the Braves, I do think that it’s time for a new field manager. The Braves seem to have stagnated to a mediocre to less than mediocre team, and maybe, a fresh perspective is needed.

I’m not saying that it;s Bobby’s fault that someone like Jeff F isnt hitting, or that our entire team doesnt score runs. It isnt. I just think that it might be time to have someone else try life at the helm of the Braves from the dugout.

What I would do: Make Bobby the GM again, make Wren his assistant, and keep John S as president. Maybe with the three of them figuring out drafts and front office moves, we can get this team back to respectability.

Mitch

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Mark, a very insightful and accurately focused article. Sometimes it’s difficult to be the person to ask the questions that need to be asked, especially when you are dealing with an icon. But someone has to ask the questions that for too long haven’t been asked. Thank you for publicly asking the questions and thank you for asking them within the context they should be asked.

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A little screaming, locker bashing and fining never hurt any time. Bobby, you are too nice and your players know it. Sure they may respect you, but they continually call your bluff.

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enough is enough. If you can’t get to play get me someone who can. There is no urgency from the top down, no passion and especialy no attitude. This team is vanilla and its time for a shake up. We had the best pitching staff ever for 14yrs and won the division in part to them inpart our division all those yrs was weak. We never play base to base or small ball and now we can out hit most teams but we still don’t score and we keep wasting good starting pitching. Here you go trade kelly and francoeur to cleveland for mark derosa. Now put prado in left and trade anderson, and a pitcher and go get me a bat that can produce 30 home runs to put behind Chipper. Use Ross to back up both catcher, which he does and at first, where he might eventually end up.Fire Pendleton and go get me Tony gwinn. Give Cox ultimatum, you get this club to the playoff or adios and thanks for the memories. As a fan I am tired of this ho hum attitude around here. John and Frank you are next if this s**t continues!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Man o man – now we’re back to the “only one World Series Championship”. What about having YOUR team in first place for 14 years in a row? What about having a team like the Marlins where they either finish 4th or they win it all? Or how about having a team like the Braves have been for the past 3 1/2 years? Pitiful and frustrating. I appreciate everyone’s frustration….trust me.

We had a team that made major league baseball history with their winning. We witnessed that and at that point we weren’t whining about WS championships….we were taking greatness for granted.

Was it Bobby Cox doing the winning? He was part of it, can’t say he was a huge contributer, but he was part of it. Three Cy Youngs going out there makes it a lot easier to look good as a manager. I think we all agree that Bobby’s time as manager has reached its end. but he will be replaed as manager when he is ready.

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Coaching changes are good they need a big shake up. They ship in players and ship them out that’s not working….Braves are long overdue for manager change.

Look what happened to the Pittsburgh Penguins this year. Under 500 record and coach is fired..new coach in they made the playoffs and a got another Stanley Cup. City of Champions!!!

Pull the Trigger!!

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Bobby is lacking as a baseball strategist? lol I think not. BUT this team needs someone that will come in and kick some ass and threaten jobs. This team has the ability to win, but the underschievers need a wake up call in a big way. Bobby is not that man, but we need a strategist and a bad ass manager.

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Maybe Bobby Cox is the best manager ever. If you limit that statement to the REGULAR SEASON! I was screamed at by friends for wanting Bobby gone in the early part of the decade. No one wins championships based on the regular season. In football, players coaches do well for a moment, and then end up getting fired for the team’s performance – those teams usually lack intensity and disipline – much like the 09 Braves. While Bobby would never be fired, it would be incredible if he decided to step aside and allow new blood into the dugout. I know an office is waiting for him as soon as he wants it. Maybe he will think of the organization first and realize his glory has faded.

When Bobby finally leaves, if TP is promoted, I will have lost all confidence in the Braves exec management.

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.MB

Idiot up and Idiot down would tend to on the whole make you an all the time Idiot.

I dont buy that. I dont think you are an Idiot at all and I dont believe in name calling.I think most of your problem is that you are biased and not objective.

Anyone who is not biased and analysies objectively can see that BC is no longer a good manager, If he everwas.—That is another debatble subject.

BC has many good traits, but those same traits sometimes cause problems that he wont face. (Frenchy, Kelly and TP to mention a few)

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All I have to say is that without Bobby Cox, we wouldn’t have come close to 14 division titles, much less a Series victory.

Too many short memories around here. I prefer not to go back to the days of Chuck Tanner, Russ Nixon, and Eddie Haas, thank you. Talk about a waste of a decent pitching staff.

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In John McGraw’s day there were no division titles or wild cards. You were the best in your league or no title and World Series appearance. To compare his record to Bobby Cox’s is comparing apples to oranges. It’s not fair to McGraw or Cox.

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It’s time for Cox to go, Send Wren packing too while your at it. Let’s get Jim Leland from Detroit. Shame we didn’t jump on the opportunity to get Torre a year ago.

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I watched 2 nites ago and the players looked pathetic in the dugout! I was glad that Brian Jordan mentioned the same thing on tv last nite. Bobby Cox is a players mgr. However, it is time for new energy. I am trying to be real here. It did not take much mgr strategy to coach Glavine, Maddux, Smotlz, Avery, . I could have done that. The Braves shuold have more WS rings. B.Cox has showed his mgr strategies in the post seasons, of which, at best mediocre. Not trying to be mean. The Braves need new energy perhaps with most of the coaching staff…..! And many of the players!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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It boils down to this for me: Cox may not be the problem, but he’s clearly not the solution either. The Braves over the last few years have become a very dysfunctional and mentally weak outfit. Again, I don’t know if this is the fault of Cox, but I don’t know if we can get rid of this defeatist mentality without a new coaching staff. Not to say Cox has a flawless roster at his disposal, but this team does have enough talent that they should be on the good side of .500.

I like Cox and respect what he’s done in the past. Honest to God, I do. But first and foremost, I love the Braves and want to see them succeed. Every argument I’ve seen from those who are in favor of keeping Cox is based on what he’s done in the past. Barring something bordering on miraculous, we’re going to miss the playoffs for a fourth straight year and fail to qualify for the NLCS for an eighth straight year. How long do we have to continue to accept substandard baseball because the front office and a group of fans feel he’s entitled due to his past accomplishments?

I really hope we don’t have to fire Cox. It truly saddened me to see the Braves’ relationships with Smoltz and Glavine come to such raw ends, even though I felt in Glavine’s case that getting rid of him was in the best interest of the team. My hope is that Bobby will do the gracious thing and retire after this season.

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This is one of Mark Bradley’s best. I tell you what, as the Braves get worse he gets better. After 15 years you would think it would be hard to spot what is going on, good for you to see it. Glavine kind of gave it away with his lack of respect for this team’s chances. You think he would have raised all that hell thinking he was stepping in the way of something that might win a pennant. No he saw this as what it was and couldn’t understand why he was tossed to let this band of assorted juveniles take an unearned position. The problem is the only thing right about this team is it’s pitching. Remember before shortstops dyed their hair, when you had some real gymrats playing the middle for the Braves. All good things come to a end, unless you are the Yankees.

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The Braves have the opportunity to make a major move and forever mark the new style of Braves in the baseball history books by getting rid of Cox with the same type of class and style that they’ve used to push aside other future hall of famers. Here’s how they can do it:
1. Cut Francoeur, Johnson, Anderson, Kotchman, Chipper (he’s in a slump), and a few pitchers.
2. Bring up a bunch of the young players from the minors that everyone has read about, but never actually seen. (Who cares if they’re ready? They have a name people have heard about and nothing is more exciting than unexplored potential.)
3. Select a group of “experts” from the AJC frequent posters and make them the new Braves manager. It’ll work kind of like the Atlanta Spirit, with a bunch of unqualified people with different ideas all pulling in different directions.
4. Fire all of the AJC staff, turn the print edition into a flyer instead of a newspaper, and let the fans take over as the writers. Put the whole thing on the internet and sit back and wonder why there’s no money. Oh wait…wrong topic. That’s already in progress.
4. Tell Bobby Cox that the team is going to have a “Bobby Cox Appreciation Day”. Make the coaching change during the 7th inning stretch.
5. Be sure to have plenty of cameras on hand to catch Bobby’s reaction as the new team of managers takes place.
6. Send Shuerholz out to apologize for the way things were handled. Surprise him too…

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Thanks for the reality check Fan since ‘85. Point well made.

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It’s times like these that I really wish Arthur Blank had bought the team when he was interested.

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Bradley, this is the first time I’ve seen this question raised by an AJC columnist. Yet, the question – the title of your piece – is really just a tease to lure us into reading what amounts to a cop-out of an answer.

Whether or not you would hire Cox as manager of the Braves isn’t relevant at all. He IS the manager, so the only question at hand is whether he should continue to be the manager. Basically, you reach the conclusion that he shouldn’t be fired after spending most of the article talking about the reasons he’s not effective. You took a first step with raising the question, but then took two steps back with your answer.

Unfortunately, I think the Braves organization is about as afraid of answering your question as you are.

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To me, cox is not an “in-game” manager. In the 90’s it was easy for Cox to pen a line-up and sit back and let the players play. Not too often did Cox have to do anything extraordinary to influence the games and when he did, sometimes he got lucky and sometimes he didnt. Cox has a general philosophy that not every game is necessary to win; that if you lose, there is always tomorrow. And, over the course of along season, this is not a bad tactic to take. It takes the pressure off the players and lets them go out and do what they do best, in a relaxed, relativly non-pressure atmosphere. One can just picture cox sayng “we’ll get’em next time”. And this worked in the 90’s because the Braves had better players than most everyone else….except during the playoffs.

In the playoffs, things start to equalize. The teams have decent talent (or why else would they be there) and the deeper into the playoffs you go, the better the talent on the opposing teams gets. Also, in the playoffs, EVERY game matters. This is where Cox’s philosophy breaks down. There is no “we’ll get’em next time”. In the playoffs there is pressure and a Cox managed team just does not know how to handle pressure.

Also, baseball managers need to know when to manage a game and when to step back and let things happen. When to pull pitchers and when to let them go. Cox has demostrated that he knows how to sit back and let the players play. He has demonstrated clearly that he knows how to wait for the big hit. What Cox has not demostrated is an ability to influence the game. Cox’s way of infuencing a game is to get himself thrown out. Really, when was the last time you saw Cox do anything really dramatic to help the team win? How often do the Braves steal? hit and run? Bunt anyone other than the pitcher or when the game absolutley dictates a bunt (late in the game, one run down, man on first, on outs) and even then were someone like Chipper to come up, Cox would let him swing away.

Yes, Cox is a nice guy and yes, the players love to play for him…or is it just that they love being left alone and patted on the back? The fact is that this is a new era and the Braves have not been a winning team in a long time.

Fans are growing tired of the talk and the promises and the losing. The Braves budget is plenty enough to have the right players, the farm system is stocked enough with talent to (with a few of the veterens) field a decent team. It is time to put Cox to pasture and find a manager who will influence the game (when needed), put some life into the players and interest in the fans.

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“What Cox has not demostrated is an ability to influence the game.”

Oh how I disgree – he can affect a game all right – just never positively for his team

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We had a great next manager in Freddi & we let him leave, he would be perfect for todays players most of which are Latin, Bobby needs to gracefully step down after this year, him Smoltzie & Glavine should have all left together. Enough with the Chipper bashing, check the stats, in the last 3 years the dude is the best hitter in baseball, he came within 1 pt. of winning the batting title 2 years in a row, so the guy goes in a mini slump, so what thats gonna happen. If we had Freddi here still he woulda cussed out Escobar in Spanish, then maybe he would comprede’ LMAO & Yes Infante should be starting at 2nd, then we get Huddy back, & we have a pretty good team. Oh wait I forgot we still have only 1 REAL outfielder(McClouth) That is the problemo in a nutshell, no production from your corner outfielders! DUH! Has Garret woke up yet, Mr. Friggin Excitement hes not At least Frenchy wants to be the best, Escobar needs an attitude adjustment & Bobby aint gonna do squat about it, cause he no speak Spanish!

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There was a crazy guy on 680 the Fan – he calls Cristopher Rude “Ru Ru” and Perry Lorintino “Carpet Bagger” – anyway he suggested that Terry Pendleton should take over as Manager.

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Hey I tell ya what fellas, most all the Braves players and coaches are just sucking up money! No fire, they look like they just DONT CARE! AND AS A LONG TIME FAN WHO BUYS TICKETS….SOMETHING NEEDS TO CHANGE, ATTITUDES #1!

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As a former GM, Bobby Cox must realize that the last 3 seasons are unacceptable, unless he’s blaming injuries to 40 year old pitchers as an excuse…3 bad years in a row, unless a miracle happens this season, means that something ain’t working and changes need to be made…Surely Bobby realizes this, because why else >sarcasm< would Kelly Johnson & Jeff Francoeur be in the lineup everyday?

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Leo Mazzoni said Cox is the best manager in the history of the game

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“Leo Mazzoni said Cox is the best manager in the history of the game”

Leo was at one time working under Cox
Leo then went to work for another team

Both valid reasons to laud Cox

If the man controls your job status, praise him. And who better to manage a team you might have to beat?

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I believe that in spite of doing performance enhancing drugs, Barry Bonds, Rafael Palmero, Gary Sheffield, Sammy Sosa, Manny Ramierez, Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez ALL DESERVE TO MAKE THE HALL OF FAME. They just need to be in a different area of the hall of fame than the players who never used PEDs. In fact, I’m hoping that the hall of fame will build a new wing called the “Steroids Wing”, were you could put the likes of those guys who just couldnt help themselves. Put in a new wing in Cooperstown and place Barry Bonds, Rafael Palmero, Gary Sheffield, Sammy Sosa, Manny Ramierez, Roger Clemens and Alex Rodriguez into that wing to show that although what they did on the field was special, what they injested into their bodies was even so much more special that we decided to build a wing (called the steroid wing) IN THE SHAPE OF A SYRINGE!

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“All but two teams in MLB would fire their managers today just for the opportunity for BC to tell them no.”

I call THAT bluff. If Cox were unemplyed, he’d be getting fewer job offers than Glavine is right now. Aint a team in organized baseball other than Braves that would let this buffoon manage

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““All but two teams in MLB would fire their managers today just for the opportunity for BC to tell them no.”

If you name them, then I’ll tell you which two teams will play in the World Series

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I have a question. How come none of the great franchises keep their winning mentality going for more than 20 years. I think about the Oriole way under Earl Weaver- How come that fell apart after about 5 seasons after his retirement? Then I think about the Dodgers of the 70’s and 80’s. They had a great run through Walter Aston and Tommy Lasorda. Then came the 90’s and they fell apart as a franchise. I had high hopes at one point that the Braves could be a consistent factor for a long time following he philosophy employed by this team during the 16 year run. Why would a philosophy that works so well just no longer work? I’m less inclined to think it’s the new group of players and their poor attitude. The Braves have usually had their share of Escobar type players during the great run. I pose that it’s the 3 changes in ownership since this run all began. Different budgets and different management styles limit the ability of the GM and manager to get the players that mesh with their style. For all the luck of the 90’s I think we were terribly unlucky to get cast off into the ownership of mega corporations. If Ted had kept the tema or if Arthur Blank could have purchased the team I have to think we could of kept a manner of consistnecy from the ‘good old days’. Anyway, now I’ve gone from posing a question to stating my theory of what went wrong. What do you think Mr. Bradley?

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“And why do I think Bobby Cox is darn great? Those 15 division titles might have a little something to do with it.”

So beating four other teams every year with a roster jam packed with HOFers qualifies one as greatest ever?

Sheesh – I might just be the second best manager in the history of the game

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“Yes, Cox is a nice guy and yes, the players love to play for him…or is it just that they love being left alone and patted on the back?”

Ya think?

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I’m pleased to see Diaz show what he can do when given an opportunity to bat up in the order. 2 for 4 with a homer and a double. It’s production like that that we need on days that Brian McCann has off.

When was the last time that Francoeur had a homer and a double in a game? Or two extra base hits in a game? Hitting 9 for 26 with 1 double is ok, however when Francoeur falls back down to his normal self average wise (.250), then his lack power really hurts the line-up. Dude simply cannot drive the ball anymore.

Yet tomorrow, rest assured, Bobby will have Francoeur and his .228 average against right handers (Dice-K is pitching for Boston tomorrow night) in the starting line-up. Meanwhile, thanks for the double and homer today Matt Diaz, but you’ll be back on the bench tomorrow.

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Another nice effort by Chris Hanson. He didnt have his best stuff today, but he grinded out 6 shut out innings. His ERA is down to 4.08. When he gets the walks down, I think his potential for dominance will show.

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Mark,

I disagree with you on the point that 95% of managers would do what Cox does and also, what difference does that really make. What you want to do is what produces wins..not what evryone else does. The fact is that the world is littered with managers who did what everyone else did.

You are right, 15 titles does have something to do with Cox. As I suggested Cox did know how to win during the course of a long season. What Cox and Cox teams to not do well is win under pressure. I believe that this is a matter of style and Cox’s style does not work in pressure situations. I also believe that Cox’s style does not work when talent is equal (or in the Braves case, slightly less).

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With the pitching talent the Braves for the 14 years in a row that they Braves won the Division Championships, Mickey Mouse could have managed the team successfully.

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This team lacks fire and motivation which surprizes me. There does not appear to be a team leader. No one holding people accountible at the player level. Is that Bobby’s fault? Soneone needs to throw a major league tantrum. Destroy some furniture. Call some people out. Someone needs to generate some intensity. Business like has turned into malaise.

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The Braves are a good team, but have been getting terrible luck. When Javier vasquez pitched an 8 inning game and only give up 4 hits, the other teams score shouldnt be over 4 runs. I am not saying that the braves are a bad team, I am just saying that the Braves record does not reflect on how good the Braves actually are.

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To all the Cox apologists – if the Braves failure to perform is not the fault of the manager, then how can you give the manager credit for any success?

You can’t have it both ways.

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Ditto **AtlantaBytes**…”Baseball is not a game that judges the talent of the players and coaches in stretches of 3, 5 or even 7 games. They play 162 games ….the Braves (under Bobby) did this 14 years in a row means more…”

And how bout 2007? Perhaps one of his best managing years, even tho they didn’t go far.

Ditto **All I’m Saying**…”he’s one of the few reasons free-agent players even want to come to Atlanta…”

“Don”…You gotta be kidding. We’ve seen opposing pitchers have 100 pitches by the 5th and 6th innings on many occasions.

I’ll admit it’s maddening sometimes when he stays with players in slumps. As has been stated, sometimes he doesn’t have a replacement on hand. Sometimes he just stays with them too long. But, how does one get out of a slump without playing? That, and lately he doesn’t seem aggressive enough with base runners. Where are we ranked in stolen bases? Again, the Braves are very near the bottom in team BA; and probably base running too.

Another question: how many different teams have won the WS in the last 17 years? And how many have not?

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“For all those people saying anybody could have won with those teams … well, only one guy did”

Bradley – come on – Cox is the best because he is the only one who got the chance to manage the Maddux-Glavine-Smoltz teams? Come on

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There’s no intent to be mean here but I’m struck by those who think Cox is a bad manager and that his record is unsatisfactory. I guess you have never followed other teams, looked at how they’ve done over a period of years. My lord a mercy, Cox compares favorably – based on his record over the years – with any manager in baseball. I realize that – by saying this – many of you still won’t understand. But honest, spend a little time looking at how other teams – any other team, pick one – do over long periods of time with a manager. Have the Braves fallen into a bad spell – heck yes, you already knew that – but take a look at other teams and see how many have avoided that. Cox has been a magician and – at times – has done his best work when the team has had a bad year. He’s taken injury-ridden lineups at times and produced decent teams. I understand that you won’t believe me, and I sort of doubt that you’ll be able to pick up the telephone and talk to real baseball people. But – believe me or not – if you could talk to other managers, other players, they would make fun of you if you claimed that Cox is a bad manager.

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Bobby Cox had his own bonehead play last night when with no outs, men on first and second, count 3-2 to slow McCann and he DOES NOT send the runners and McCann hits into a DP. Pitiful managing as he also does by always bringing in the struggling reliever in the tight games just so they can lose another one and BOOST their confidence! The Braves need a boss not a big brother best friend. I predicated a bad season for the Braves before the season started due to the way Smoltz was treated and now Glavine. The Braves are reaping what they have sown.

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excuse my typing old guy and dont have my glasses on lol

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hey folks, I stared a blog of the braves for a school project, would you guys check it out and comment, just for fun
http://www.newblogofbraves.blogspot.com
thanks all

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cox just like everyone, me included, loose their edge after a certain age, the game has pasted him by just like when Bud Wilkerson tried to come back and coach footbal or Joe Gibbs Don zimmer in Baseball sometimes you have to admit it hes just too damn old

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Cox is like the grandfather you love to hug and listen to his war stories but deep in your heart you really don’t think he really udnerstands what you are going through in your generation. I love him and respect him but do you trust him to be right about what your are going through? I too would let Cox manage as long as he wants because he is one of the good guys, but to think he can reach some of these players seems unreasonalbe to me. As far as who would manage the Brave if Cox leaves, Ned Yost seem to have gotten raw deal and he a braves guy?

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How dare you Mark B to even say that. You should find another city. Atl fans are completely bandwagon fans and the media Sucks!!!

GO BRAVES AND GO BOBBY COX FOREVER

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Nothing wrong with a good old fashioned butt kicking! Play and stay!
Thanks Bobby for the memories, but it’s time to move to the front office or the porch swing.
Fordcobra

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Bobby was great during the regular season but his teams folded in the playoffs, year after painful year. Teams take on their manager’s personality; Bobby’s as responsible for the streak as he is for all the gut-wrenching post-season failure. And let’s not forget the ALCS he blew after being up 3-1 while he was managing Toronto. That said, no matter what you think of him, the devil you know is often times better than the one you don’t.

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Bobby should have been gone long ago. He has cost us at least 1 or maybe 2 more world series. Most likley at least 2 more world series apperances. I was pretty easy to coach the talent we had in the 90’s in the regular season, but when it came to the playoffs and the talent was more even, coaching cost us wins, Bobby gets outcoached all the time. Has the man ever heard of playing a hunch or going against what the book on baseball says. He pretty much made an average player out of Ryan Klesko because he never gave him a chance to hit against a left handed pitcher. The day Bobby and his washed up coaching staff go the braves will be instantly better. Oh and by the way I’m sure Tommy G. would have 2 wins by now. NOT! good job Wren you made the right move. The next right move would be giving Bobby his walking papers.

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Yes Bobby Cox needs to go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Bobby’s can’t hit for these guys !! We need to get rid of Pendleton. Everyone knows it but they will not get rid of him. Even Andrew said today how great the hitting coach in Texas is. Let get rid of T.P. !!

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Some of this stuff isn’t rocket science.

Right now anyway, Diaz and Prado are better than Frenchy/Anderson and KJ. Frenchy and Anderson should be platooning and Diaz should be playing every day, until they prove they can be more productive. Also at worst, KJ and Prado should platoon.

This team really isn’t far from being a winner. Oh yeah, stop using the bullpen so much, especially Bennett and Moylan, the more you pitch those guys the greater chances of losing games.

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Don’t worry so much about replacing Cox, but replacing the owners!

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Hometown Discount Glavine told fox 5 tonight that he will not pitch this year. I guess his phone was not ringing from the other 29 teams.

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As much as I dislike Bobby Cox, I really don’t want to see it get sad ugly. Losing is one thing but it would suck to see him look like an idiot to the point where fans forget all the good he did in the 90’s.

With that said, he is being selfish by not retiring and dragging this out. He’s a smart guy and has to realize it isnt there anymore but keeps hanging around.

Walk away Bobby. It’s time.

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Hell yes, the Braves need a new manager. They’ve needed a new manager since 1996. The team hasn’t played with any sense of urgency or passion in years. It’s easy to win when you have a pitching staff filled with future hall of famers and position players who can actually hit. Shuerholtz deserves the credit for that. Not Cox. All he did was fart away a bunch of first place finishes by treating the post season like any other day at the park. Cox seems to have no connection to today’s players and has failed to develop our young talent. On top of that, his blinding loyalty to a handful of players and coaches is retarding the team’s progress.

Players are a reflection of their manager. What hope do we have?

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It’s Too Late

Lingerin’ in the clubhouse just to pass the time

There’s something wrong here, there can be no denying

Pennant race is fading, the players have just stopped trying

And it’s too late, Bobby, now it’s too late

Though we really did try to make it

Something inside has died and I can’t hide

And I just can’t fake it

It used to be so easy back in ninety-two

Glavine Smoltz and Avery and you knew just what to do

But now those days are over and changes are overdue

And it’s too late, Bobby, now it’s too late

Time has passed you by, don’t mistake it

Steppin’ aside, your pride can hurt inside

But I know you can take it

Winning every season like we used to do

Is what everybody wants I know you feel it to

Still, I’m glad for what we had and I want to thank you

But it’s too late, Bobby, now it’s too late

Though we really did try to make it

I can’t deny it’s time to say good-bye

But I sure do hate it

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NO! Bobby Cox is an a GREAT Manager. More than that – he is a GREAT LEADER. There is not a single manager alive today that a player will run through a brick wall for other than Bobby Cox. He hurts himself in the public eye because he is a private team manager and not public manager trying to get that 20 second ESPN quick line. He doesn’t need the limelight to validate him as a great leader and manager. I have never seen any manager garner more respect from players than Bobby Cox. He get’s the most out of his players – more than they never realized they had. How many careers has he resurrected or vaulted? . He never says a negative word in public. In his quiet way, he redefines positive attitude. After 30+ years I know he has witnessed train wrecks of players on all levels. He could easily throw them under the bus. I am sure he has been tempted to but he never does.

He has always held his tongue and made a choice to encourage people. His players respond to his style regardless of talent level.

The best author other than Jesus that I have ever read on Leadership is John Maxwell. He happens to live in Atlanta. John Maxwell should do a book on Bobby Cox’s low profile leadership style. He is unparalleled in professional sports.

Thanks for giving me the time,

Bruce Frcek
Boca Raton, FL

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I think that if the Braves had good ownership that cared about contending, then Cox would have the good players to work with.

Don’t get me wrong, we do have some good guys on this team; Lowe, Jurrgens, Vazquez, Hanson, McLouth. But these others? They’re just pathetic. The reason the Braves have this limited payroll is because Liberty Media is a bunch of tight wads!

The Braves need new ownership before it’s too late and there is no one at Turner Field during the games.

Come on, Ted, come on, Arthur, come on, ambitious business people. Buy this team from the Liberty Losers.

We Need New Ownership, NOW!!!

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If 14 great years with 3 HOF pitchers makes Cox GREAT, Then how would you rank Leo Mazzone, He was the spark plug for those HOF pitchers. In fact” Bobby the Great” has not won anything since Leo left. So maybe it was Leo’s doing not Cox.

When a team goes bad, the buck stops with the Coach, mgr. Thats Little League, Babe Ruth, High School ,College and the Pros. Thats just the way it is. Bobby needs to go.

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PT and Mark should read the story in ajc on Andruw’s Texas pitching Coach and how he now sees the light because the Ranger Pitching Coach can teach which he didn,t get here.

People in Baseball never say anything bad about Bobby…thats true because you don’t burn bridges you may cross again. Baseball is a brotherhood, you keep your mouth shut are you will be out.It seem to be the same with some reporters, they don’t wish to get black balled by home team. Right AJC reports.

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Remember the saying “Coaches are hired to be fired”. Bobby Cox has done a great job over the years but watching the braves the last few seasons, you can tell the players just don’t play hard the man anymore.
This is why I think they need to go in a new direction but he should be ask to retire after this season and if he doesn’t then they need to let him go, just think, he might pull a Tommy Glavin.

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Joe Torre was even let go by the Yankees (forced out/let go=same thing). Bobby was a better GM than coach if you ask me because we blew 3 of those World Series when we clearly had the better team and also no way you get swept by the Yankees. Charlie Liebrandt is not pitching and I am figuring out a way to score one run for Smoltz because we deserved tha game. Can someone tell me how we blow the Yankees out the 1st 2 games then up by 7 in game 4 and somehow lose it and the series. Unbelievable. Atlanta is a city of overhype ala matthew stafford so what do you expect.

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Let’s get the media focused on the real issue – we need a hitting coach.

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A manager is only as good as the players and support the front office give him.

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Bobby Cox is among the best ten managers of all time. The man is a winner, period. Universally loved by players, he has stuck around major league baseball for the better part of half a century. The man bleeds baseball. Cox is a players manager because he treats them like men and they in turn, treat him like a father. And like most fathers, Cox is loved by all who truly know the man.

Bobby will waltz into Cooperstown on the first ballot as a two time World Series manager. Yes, surprise. The man has not one but two WS rings to his credit. Cox was the 1st base coach on the 1977 WS Champion New York Yankees under the management of Billy Martin.

Among other things, Cox is the GM who rebuilt the Braves minor league system in the first place. Cox was the same GM and manager who brought Leo Mazzone on board and also had a a hand in the hiring of none other than John Schuerholz. He also drafted Chipper Jones. Simply put, Bobby Cox defines greatness. The man has won in both leagues. Taking both the Braves and Blue Jays into the post season.

I said all that to say this. Cox has far outlived his greatness. With every year he manages his legacy is tarnished. He will always be a one trick pony as 1995 was the only season where the man got it all right for at least one full season as a manager. You don’t take fourteen straight teams into the post season without doing a lot of things right in the regular season, and even more things wrong in the post season by coming away with just one Championship team. Cox will never be the greatest tactician and he is undoubtedly, his own worst enemy. Overrated? In a word, Yes. First ballot Hall of Fame? Yes. Should he keep managing? The results speak for themselves. Cox needs to retire and I think he knows it.

I wish the man all the best and I will cheer like mad when Bobby is inducted into Cooperstown. I also hope he calls it a career, and soon.

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Different question – if you were hiring an owner would you hire Liberty Media? Have you really seen an increased budget?
Kotchman at 2.9M replaces Teixeira at 12.5M,
Kawakami at 3.7M replaces Glavine at 10M,
Vazquez at 11.5M replaces Smoltz at 14M,
Lowe at 15M replaces Hampton at 15M (wash),
O’Flaherty at 0.4M replaces Ohman at 1.6M,
McLouth at 2.5M replaces Kotsay at 7.35M

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Here’s the thing: a team should only fire its manager if it can get someone better. And in the case of the Braves, it wouldn’t be enough to get someone marginally better, in which any would-be added wins would likely be (more than) offset by the hit to team morale. Cox is solid, he’s certainly not a liability; any replacement (not named Torre or LaRussa) would be a gamble.

Agree with the final sentiment: maybe he wouldn’t be the first hire if you were starting over, but you can’t fire him.

We may need a new hitting coach, though. Maybe Chipper’s dad?

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Bobby Cox is a great manager. His problem is that he has NOT communicated with upper management enough (President John Shuerholtz) and the powers that be with respect to bringing in enough hitting pitching and enough good players to help Cox win. In my blog yesterday, I pointed out that during the offseason there were three future hall of famers available that the Braves could have signed: Gary Sheffield, Barry Bonds and Sammy Sosa. All three guys still wanted to play baseball and all are great hitters and can be productive. Unfortunately, the Braves didnt invite any of them to camp. Barry and Sammy both are being blackballed and cant find a job anywhere. Gary Sheffield signed with the Mets and IS NOW HITTING .300. (NO SURPRISE THERE). Steroids or no steroids, Gary is a former brave and is also a Lifetime .295 hitter and certainly could have helped the Braves in the middle of the lineup. Although Shef got cut 1 home run away from 500 (he was at 499 home runs when he was cut by Detroit) one of the biggest insults I have ever seen. So what does Gary do when he is signed by the Mets: just hit .300 is all he did, being productive as he always is and the Braves could have had his bat in the lineup for certainly the major league mininum salary. There is still time to sign Sammy Sosas and Barry Bonds. Just because all the other major league clubs are blackballing them doesnt mean the Braves have to do that. What would you rather do, bring in Sammy and Barry and help you win a world series, or not bring those guys in and watch Bobby Cox get fired. Either way it makes sense to upgrade the ballclub and make it better. In addition, the Braves are fools for releasing Glavine. Glavine would almost certainly make the Braves a stronger team. Plus, if Glavine had continued with the Braves, he most certainly would have won the Cy Young award in the National League this year. The Braves continue to make blunders in the front office and then wonder why they keep putting a pathetic product on the field.

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Well, journalists aren’t exactly rocket scientists, are they. Nor are they very accurate either. Next time a story about your field of expertise appears, pay attention to how the most basic facts are wrong. Extrapolate that to every story, and it becomes obvious, when you figure in the Liberal Bias, why newspapers are dying a deserved death.

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A players manager is the worst thing to have for a bad team with no superstar. They seem to play with no fear of acountability. And I have been saying for years that is how he manage. He should have been fired after 1996. 5 is the number of rings the braves should have, at the least. I root for the front of the jersey not the name on the back.

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[...] — sorry to be quoting my silly self here, but know no way around it — he’s the best manager I’ve ever seen and the best I’ll ever see. But now I’m thinking maybe only the first part [...]

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Bobby should not be questioned at all by anyone of us couch managers! He is a HALL OF FAME manager and what he has done for the Braves and Atlanta will always be greatly appreciated! He is a true warrior and competitor, I would follow him to battle anyday period!!!

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Being one who casts a very cynical eye on all the spoiled ‘everybody needs to hear my opinion so they can see how wrong theirs is’ Braves fans and sports writers who simply cannot fathom the thought of OUR team not being as good as they once were, I find this whole discussion distasteful and pointless. Bobby Cox is not the Braves’ ‘problem’. Heck, they don’t have any real ‘problems’ anyway. They are men who get to play baseball for a living. Whether they win or lose and whether they entertain me to the extent that I want them to, is really of no consequence…it still beats the heck out of what I do for a living. So take it from somebody who has been a Braves fan thru a WHOLE lot worse than just three or four years out of the playoffs, do something better with your time than bash a man who is better at his job at the end of his career than most of us will ever be at ours.

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I tell you this. The Braves do NOT need a new manager, but the AJC needs to replace you. You are the cockiest, useless excuse of a coward I have ever met. Taking potshots at Glavine and Smoltz….now Bobby. Why don’t YOU retire so we can have some decent opinions around here? I can name a LOT of columnists I would rather read than your moronic idiocies. Smoltz shoulda beat your ass….

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Bottom line is that Cox is old. He will be allowed to continue until he decides to step down. And God help us, but I think Terry Pendleton is a lock to replace him.

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