All-Trade Friday: Should the Hawks deal Josh Smith?

Agreed. You know what you’ve got with Joe. Knowing that, I could live with it if we let him go. It would be tough to replace him, but I could live with it. You still don’t know quite what you have with Josh. I’ve seen too many flashes of greatness to live with it if we were to let him go. I think he’s got tons of untapped potential. If we keep Joe, we get better by who we add to the squad. He’s as good as he’s going to get (which, I must say, is far above average). We keep Josh & there’s the potential for the squad to improve merely because of his growth as a player.

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I disagree 100%. First the Hawks shouldn’t trade either, but if it had to come down to that, Josh will have to go. If you actually watch the Hawks, you’ll know Josh has a way to go to become an all-star. If we keep waitin on him to become that all-star, teams would already be better than us. The time is now for the hawks to get that best team style. Don’t forget that every team is always trying to get better. Plus, Joe is the face of the organization!!

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We forget the Josh was THE best player his senior year in High School. He has the upside, I’m afraid that coach woodson will NEVER be able to polish this young man into ONE of the ELITE players in the league!

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I think Josh Smith is the guy to keep. He’s 23/24 years, and has a much better chance at being one of the league’s top 5 talent! The Hawks would be stupid to get rid of a 23 year old that can score, rebound, play defense, etc. But, I don’t think J-Smoove can be that great player under Mike Woodson. He has to learn offense to be successful, not defense.

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Josh Smith is a turnover machine. I cringe when I see him taking off downcourt on a break, knowing he’ll turn the ball over. This guy just cannot learn to give the ball to the point guard to bring it upcourt and cannot learn to not take the long jump/set shot which he has about a 25% shooting percentage on. He just lacks in the upstairs department, he’s been a pro long enough to not hide behind that “young and still developing” thing.

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He has plateaued. B-ball players don’t improve exponentially. You can do a lot better than Josh Smith for $70MM.

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Brandon,

That leader would be me!

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Nevergiveup!!!,

I am that coach!

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No

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GREAT job Mr. Bradley. I saw JJJ Joe can be GGG Gone before Smoove is gone.

Joe is a great player, but Smoove has potential to be ridiculous. Can he be, though, is the question.

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You still have the pick left and Andersson from Europe, who is doing pretty well and is considered one of the top PF over there. He is not a child anymore at 28, what are we waiting for??? He could replace Horford when he needs to rest and provide at least 15 pts., 7 rebounds.

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Mark, I am a JJ fan, and a Josh Smith fan. Before we trade either of them, I would like to see what another coach could do. A coach who has an offensive scheme (instead of just iso-JJ), a coach who does not play JJ 40 mpg, a coach who knows to let the Hawks play inside out (like you said, JJ had as many shots as Al and Josh combined), a coach who does not play a switching defense so that our bigs are usually out of position. Can we trade Woody?

Josh is cheaper and younger. But the problem with Josh is you dont know if he will ever mature, if he will ever develop a jump shot, if he will ever learn to play within himself, if he will ever get along with Woody. Whereas JJ is already a top 5 SG, a 3 time All-Star, invited to try out for Olympic team.

I’m glad I’m not Rick Sund, because I dont know. I would trade Josh because I think it is easier to replace him than it is to replace JJ.

David Andersen is a PF. Even if we dont sign Zaza and we sign Andersen, we still need a center (like Gortat from Cleveland, J. Collins etc.)

I guess

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NBA is definitely a star driven league and you can bring in vets and win quick. I would trade him in a heartbeat for Amare Stoudemire or Chris Bosh if I could work out an extension. A better deal would be to get Camby from the Clippers, he was acquired for a 2nd round pick last year so I am sure he could be had cheap especially since the Clips will get Griffin. You get Camby in the middle, move Horford to the PF spot Smith to the SF spot, the move Marvin for a pg like Raymond Felton or maybe Mike Conley, let Bibby go as a FA and bring back J Chills and Zaza.

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You don’t trade any one of them.You sign Joe to an extension.If you trade anyone it’s Chill,Al,or Marvin.They’re young an have trade potential.You build around Joe and Smoove.It’s time for Spirit group to spend money.This off-season is make or break.You cant get equal value for joe or smith

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Mark I know this is off topic but do you think the Hawks would be better served trading pick 19 and maybe Speedy’s deal for a veteran player considering #1. They are looking to go farther in the playoffs as oppsed to rebuilding ( unless they lose everybody in a free agency disaster) and #2. Rick Sund has a horrible draft record.

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Man if any of you think that Josh SMith is the future of this team you are badly mistaken. He has hit his peak. You don’t pay a guy 60 million dollars and “hopes” that he get better. He is not young anymore. Josh has been a starter in the NBA for 5 years. He still is a turn over machine, he still does stupid things, he still has an attitude, he can’t play defense worth a damn. Don’t let the declining blocks fool you one bit. He CANNOT play one on one defense. He takes bad shots. HE s good for a highlight or two but that is it. He is what he is.

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Andersson is a good, maybe even great PF but definently not a C. If anybody has paid any attention to some upcoming goods, McGhee from Washington, Hawes from Sacramento, Gasol from Memphis, these are future Centers in the NBA.
We should get a young uknown center who can grow and be cheat at this point.
If we get rid of JJ, then send him to Chicago for Ben Gordon and maybe even include Marvin in there for Tyrus Thomas.

We do need to let go off Bibby, he is not very consistent and terrible on defense. Give Acie a chance for a few months, if he is not ready you can always start Murry.

You can’t get Bosh for anything we have. Established big men are not going to come here without another threat who can create his own shots.

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You know, I can be a leader, too?

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Al Horford,

Quite lying, man!

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Ah, Othello. I think you meant “quit”, not “quite”? LOL!

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Wetherson, what the hell are you talking about? ” He’s not young anymore?” the man is only 23 years old. Yes he tends to try to handle the ball too much and turns it over sometimes, but lets not forget he was the only guy that consistently showed up in the playoffs for us while the rest of the team adored Lebron as he walked thru the lane and dunked. Josh and Horford should be the only locks that will be here 5 years from now. Too much ups and downs by Joe.

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Josh Smith should be traded now before the hawks fans begin to hate him. If he is not traded, he should at least be turned into a 6th man that doesn’t have the responsibility of being consistent like the starters. Bibby will be considered overpaid the moment we give him a 4 year extension, so we should think about moving on and signing Jared Jack. Keep Marvin on the cheap and start looking for big men in the draft and in free agency. We need to get tougher on the inside.

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There is a very good chance that Josh is as good as he will ever be. Players that get better are they guys that have good attitudes and work ethic. I don’t see that happening with Josh. He will continue to rely on his athleticism and will remain a good, but not great player. Joe is a much better player that should be re-signed.

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Josh Smith is no doubt a great player. However, he lacks the discipline and court savy of past great players. He has yet to step up and lead, but the Jury is still out. I think he definitely trade material!

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Josh for Bosh and throw Speedy in to make the trade legal!!!

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YOU KNOW WHAT IS REAL MESSED UP!!!!

So many people talk about Josh Smith and his upside, but the fact remains he already spent a summer working on his dribbling and his jump shot and his post moves and outside of MAYBE the post moves he is below average in all of those areas.

However Marvin Williams well when he took the time between summer and classes to work no his three he came back as one of the best three point shooter on the team.

So he has more upside? The one who can develop his skills, listen to the coach, and play to his strengths or the one who is older than Marvin Williams and cannot do any of the things previously just stated.

When it comes down to it I would not trade either, but if I had to trade somebody on the team It would go in this order, Speedy Claxton, Mo Evans, and Josh Smith. And the reason Smith makes this list is because of statements here like this blog made he has the most upside he is so young. A team would over give for Smith, but not for Joe and not for MArvin, but maybe for Al.

Geeze are you asking who makes the most exciting play or who has the most potential

And whoever said he was the best player his year in H.S. um lets see Dwight Howard, Sebastian Telfair, Al Jefferson, Shaun Livingston, then Josh Smith now yes Sebastian Telfair and Shaun Livingston are ghost, but lets move Lamarcus Alridge, and Rudy Gay up there ahead of him and J.R. Smith, and personally MArvin williams for best players out of his H.S. class.

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Once again ……. none of this matters unless we get a new coach!!!!!

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We need a true Center and true PF. This can only be achieved by trading Smoove for a center (Kaman + trash) and moving Horford to PF. I am SO TIRED of us abusing the PF and C positions

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Tough call either way.

I could go for the “trade Josh for Chris Bosh” thing, but there aren’t many offers I’d take when it comes to Josh Smith.

Whoever said there are better options than Josh at $70 million hasn’t got a clue. It was Joe who we signed to a $70 million contract. Josh was signed to $58 million. Get your facts straight. But here’s some comparisons for ya: Luol Deng got $71 million, and Andre Iguodala got $57 million. How did those two guys do in comparison to Smith?

Josh can improve on his jumper, and put more effort into rebounding. Perhaps both he and Horford would do better on defense if they weren’t having to pick up the slack for Mike Bibby all the time.

Speaking of which, you need two things to keep your speedy power forward from running the break all by himself: a point guard who is capable and willing to run the break, and a coach who will allow it. Until then, it appears only a small contingent of Hawks players seem to believe in running the break when the opportunity presents itself. And they’re all forwards…

Guarantee: Josh Smith will not be a top 10 player in the NBA on this team or any other team at any point in his career. He has no discipline, an atrocious shot, and a terrible basketball IQ. Its not about coaching with him. Yes he will get better than he is now, but he is no franchise player nor someone you look at to lead your team in any way. At most, Josh Smith is a fun player to watch and a compliment to some team looking for an exciting 2nd or 3rd scoring option who can make the highlight reel to put on the JumboTron during the intro’s of every home game. Trade him now before the rest of the league figures this out.

Gee, that sounds so familiar. Wonder where I’ve heard it before? So, are we more interested in having a “top 10″ player, or in winning a championship? Some people don’t consider Joe to be a top 10 player either. And guess what? He’s as good as he’s going to be, so if he’s not top 10 now, he’s not going to be top 10 ever. But that’s hardly the point, now is it?

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Josh Smith will never lead a team anywhere. He has absolutely no fundamentals, NO Defensive ability, middle school players have a better jump shot, and finally the maturity level of a 12 year old. No coach will ever be able to get anything out of him. As long as Josh Smith is part of the Atlanta Hawks, anyone who respects the game will never go and watch his constant temper tantrums.

Isn’t it amazing there was no interest in him when he became a free agent. Even the LA Clippers were glad when the Hawks were foolish enough to match their offer. He has no trade value and will be out on the street with nothing to fall back on other than his street cred which doesn’t pay the bills.

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It is not a given that Josh Smith will eventually realize his talent. He is a great slam dunker, but not offensive player. He is a great shot blocker, but not a great defender. It would depend on what you could get for Josh Smith. If you could get a premium point guard in return for him, I think you trade him. Atlanta still needs a legit point guard. Mike Bibby ain’t the answer.

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I don’t understand all of the negative comments about Josh Smith and then the same people want to trade him for Chris Bosh. If Josh is that bad, let’s just trade him for Kobe or Lebron. I’m sure we could do that if we just throw in Speedy.

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Take Bibby, Childress, and Claxton and trade them to the Raptors for Calderon and next year’s first round draft pick.

Bring Andersson back.

Take Joe and trade him to Orlando for Gordat and Turkuglu.

Now you have:

PG Calderon
SG Turkuglu
SF Smith
PF Horford
C Gordat

PG Law
SG Murry
SF Evans
PF Andersson
C Zaza

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Mark, what about Acie Law, i feel if we let him leave he will shine with another team just like Diaw did and just like Salim will this year with the bucks..Woody does not like young Pgs and has not given Acie Law a chance to develop.If he would have been playing Law the last 2 yerars we would have a easy decision to make on bibby and in the draft..Mark, i think until we get rid of woody we will never get better, what do you think? woody has also held back Marvin and josh because every play is iso Joe..Damn i dont like Woody..

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Josh is Josh. Probably the most athletic player in the league, and cursed to having spent his first 5 years in the league under Mike Woodson, who has made no effort to develop him or run plays that get him the ball while he’s already in motion (which is when he’s at his best). I think he might be a 20/10 guy had he gone to Portland rather than here. But he didn’t, and now the issue is what to do with Josh going forward. It’s pretty clear at this point that he’s a PF, not a SF; his slow release and hitchy form on his jumper combined with his subpar ballhandling skills and mediocre on-ball perimeter defense make working at the SF impossible, but his incredible jumping ability and chiseled physique more than makes up for his slightly-below-average height at the PF position.

Oh, and the idea that Josh will be the best player on the team in 2 years…that’s something people were saying 3-4 years ago. It hasn’t happened. Right now, it’s not even close. Teams leave Josh wide open on the perimeter routinely while they double and triple team JJ every time the latter touches the ball. Josh is a great help defender, but he still is mediocre at defending players on the ball. Most disturbing is the fact that after 5 years in the league, he still is making a lot of the same, easy-to-fix mistakes that he made as a rookie (taking contested three pointers with 10 seconds left on the clock, bringing the ball up the court himself instead of passing it to a guard with predictable results, biting on head fakes whenever he’s playing on-ball defense…). He certainly has improved since his rookie year, but I honestly haven’t noticed any perceptible improvement since 2007. If he hasn’t improved in the past two years, why on earth would we think he’d make a big leap in the next two years?

In any case, the bigger problem is that Horford is also a natural PF, and while he’s certainly passable as a C, I think the team would be best off with him at his natural position – and I think Horford is a better PF than Josh is.

And then there’s Marvin. He didn’t get any more touches than he did a year ago on offense, but was both more aggressive taking the ball to the basket AND developed a beautiful stroke from behind the arc. Beyond that, he became our best perimeter defender, something that pretty never shows up in the stats (see: Shane Battier, Bruce Bowen (circa 2006), Tayshaun Prince). The stats did not reflect the big leap that Marvin took forward this year across the board. In any case, he clearly is a better SF than Josh would be, thanks to Marvin’s smooth outside stroke, good-and-still-improving ability to take it to the rack and get to the line, and now-great perimeter defense.

So it’s really not even a question of Josh vs. JJ, and this article is a bit inane for suggesting that it is. (And yes, I realize that Bradley is only repeating what ESPN and other folks are saying…but everyone who reads Sekou’s blog knows what I think about ESPN’s opinions on the Hawks, and I see no reason why Bradley feels the need to write about this on his blog AGAIN.). JJ and Josh don’t play the same positions, they don’t have clashing playing styles, they don’t have prohibitive contracts, and they seem to get along well as teammates. The question is more who would fit in better on a title contending team. And on that question, I actually think that there are 3 guys on the team (JJ, Horford, and Marvin) that I would place higher on the “untouchable list” than Josh.

All that being said, Josh is still an eye-popping talent with skill sets we aren’t likely to get anywhere else. We shouldn’t trade him unless we’re getting back a big-time player in return.

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lol at all the haters on here.. Get over it Josh is not going anywhere, Marvin and Al WILL NEVER be better than Smoove is.. If you dont like him or his game get over it and find another team to watch.. Atlanta has the dumbest sports fans in the league..

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I notice everytime the Raptors came in town, the Hawks atmosphere was “hyped” for some reason. Maybe Bosh would fit well? Maybe we should trade for the whole Raptors team? I don’t know, it’s just something about the Raptors. TRADE FOR TJ FORD!!!

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RealSquawk,

Actually, you nailed at least half of what I was thinking. The ball does get put in Josh’s hands more than Marvin’s, or so it looks to me. And while we could certainly follow that trail of bread crumbs to a particular destination (read: head coach), I won’t blame it all in one place.

As Bradley suggests, I think Marvin also holds himself back. How else do you explain a guy like Josh getting more touches (and producing more)when he has 1)a worse jumper, 2)supposedly less IQ, and 3) “less coachable” characteristics?

It boggles the mind. You say Josh’s stats went down across the board. You’re right, they did. Still higher than Marvin’s, who played nearly the same minutes per game as Josh. Why wouldn’t a head coach be giving the ball more to a player who does what he’s supposed to and is a better talent, as people claim?

Here’s what REALLY amuses me. We’re mad at a #17 pick out of high school for not becoming an all-star yet, and are ready to throw him to whomever for a center (look, we’re not getting anybody’s starting center) at the ripe old age of 23. “Oh, it’s been 5 years, he’s no better than when he started.” “Oh, he’s not going to get any better.”

Yet….

We continually take our highest draft pick (#2) in the last decade, who is still not outperforming the “athletic dummy”, and we say “Oh, he’s going to be an all-star next year, I can just FEEL it!”. Been hearing that for the last couple of years. But hey, isn’t that what you draft a guy #2 for? #17 is exactly two spots above what we have this year (#19), and we’re talking about not even getting somebody who is likely to get playing time.

No, this isn’t all based on draft picks, but one cannot throw out that part of the argument without being blatantly facetious.

It’s easy to say that Marvin is a more natural SF than Josh. Of course he is, which is why he’s playing SF, while Josh is playing PF. Duh. But that isn’t what this is about. It’s about an all-star SG who has peaked, and a young PF who has not.

If you think Josh has peaked at 23, then Marvin has peaked as well. Hasn’t he? Ahhhhh, so the age thing isn’t as convenient factor after all.

I don’t see us getting a starting-caliber center for Josh. I’ve heard Josh for Andris Biedrins, but don’t see it happening. Even Nellie’s not that dumb (watch, then the trade will be announced next week, heh heh). So, if you’re going to trade him, it better be for another PF with better offensive skills (Bosh), or a very good, young pg. I don’t see the pg thing happening, because if the pg is that good, no way is his team parting with him. Just like a starting center…

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Real Squawk you are right about Marvin. I keep trying to tell people that he is the better player of the two. The problem is that Marvin is the fourth option on the team behind Joe, Smoove, and Bibby in that order. Marvin is efficient. We seen how well he played when JJ and Smoove were hurt. That should be the barometer of the talent that this kid has. He is the only Hawk that can give Lebron James problems on defense. Smoove can not play SF. He is a tweener. Tweeners are usually exploited come playoff time. You ever wondered why so many of his jumpers are wide open. He is a product of playing with Joe Johnson being tripled and double team. They will leave J-Smoove open all day long. He might have led us in scoring in the playoffs but 17 a game isn’t exactly lighting it up considering Marvin was out or played limited minutes in the post season. I am also for keeping everyone except Bibby but if we had to get rid of one of our core guys it as to be Smoove.

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Same Wetherson,

I’ll ask you the same questions. If Marvin is better, then how come we don’t see the results? Why is he the 4th option on offense (which you yourself noted to be true)?

I think everybody knows why Josh is wide open on a jumper. What nobody seems to have an answer for is how he still managed to shoot 49% from the field for the year, which was higher than our “better shooters.” If he is simply a product of JJ being tripled and doubled, then surely the more talented Marvin could benefit from this as well. Gee, I just don’t understand why he didn’t.

I have to admit, 17ppg in the playoffs wasn’t very impressive. Yet it was a team high. Wow, this is getting even harder to explain. Must have been a mixture of two things: pure blind luck and athleticism. Of course, if that’s the case, then Mario West could have led us in scoring in the playoffs….

But you’re right. Marvin’s way better. He averaged 13.9ppg and 6.3 rpg. Definitely an improvement over the previous year (14.8ppg and 5.7ppg). In fact, I say he makes the all-star team next year if he continues to improve at that rate. We should trade Josh now, while other teams think he’s worth a bag of peanuts and a player to be named later, perhaps a center who starts on the local D-league squad.

Championship, here we come!

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If Marvin is better, then how come we don’t see the results?
We do when he gets the ball. But he doesn’t get the ball except on 1) bail out passes or 2) when JJ is out of the game.

Why is he the 4th option on offense (which you yourself noted to be true)?
See above. Why didn’t Boris Diaw get the ball on offense until after we traded him?

I think everybody knows why Josh is wide open on a jumper. What nobody seems to have an answer for is how he still managed to shoot 49% from the field for the year, which was higher than our “better shooters.”
Because he hits about 40% of his open jumpers and 60% of his shots within 12 feet (I admit that I’m guesstimating here). The problem is that 40% isn’t a very good percentage when you’re wide open – and teams leave him wide open all the time because they can live with Josh shooting jump shots.

If he is simply a product of JJ being tripled and doubled, then surely the more talented Marvin could benefit from this as well. Gee, I just don’t understand why he didn’t.
Well, he did. But when JJ drives, the opposing teams leave Josh open on the perimeter more often than Marvin. Thus, JJ’s kick-out passes go back to Josh more frequently than to Marvin.

I have to admit, 17ppg in the playoffs wasn’t very impressive. Yet it was a team high. Wow, this is getting even harder to explain. Must have been a mixture of two things: pure blind luck and athleticism.
Yeah, and we all saw how well the Hawks did in the playoffs. We were such a consistent team with Josh as our top scoring threat…

But you’re right. Marvin’s way better. He averaged 13.9ppg and 6.3 rpg. Definitely an improvement over the previous year (14.8ppg and 5.7ppg). In fact, I say he makes the all-star team next year if he continues to improve at that rate. We should trade Josh now, while other teams think he’s worth a bag of peanuts and a player to be named later, perhaps a center who starts on the local D-league squad.
See my last post re: both of these.

There’s no comparison between Josh and Marvin. Josh is a game-changer. Marvin isn’t.
I seem to recall that when JJ went down for two games in February, it was Marvin who carried us to two wins on the road. But I guess that doesn’t count, right? I know, you probably weren’t really paying attention to the Hawks before they made the playoffs (as your lack of posts during the regular season indicates). But those of us who actually watched a majority of the games saw what Sekou wrote in his season-ending summary – Marvin was having a breakout year before he got hurt.

And you’re right, Josh is a game changer. The problem, though, is that on any given day and even on any given play, you don’t the way in which he will change the game. He usually changes it for the better, but all too often he still changes it for the worse. The other problem is that sometimes game-changers aren’t what you need to get to the next level. There have been plenty of game-changers who never sniffed a title. I have a hunch Josh will join those illustrious ranks. When you’re working towards a title, more important than having a game changer is having a guy who gives the team what it needs when it needs it. If that weren’t the case, then Allen Iverson would have 7 rings and Robert Horry would have 0. But we all know what the real count is.

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PS – in case you didn’t figure it out, my first two responses in that last post were supposed to imply “Because Mike Woodson has no clue how to a) have an offensive scheme; or b) recognize or optimally utilize the talents of the players he has”

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“OPTIMALLY”???? wow

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Hoops

I see where you going with your comment involving Speedy, but here is my understanding of the trade rules involving players with unbalance salaries:

If a team trades away a player with a higher salary than the player they acquire in return (we’ll call this initial deal “Trade #1″), they receive what is called a Traded Player Exception. Teams with a trade exception have up to a year in which they can acquire more salary in other trades (Trade #2, #3, etc) than they send away, as long as the gulf in salaries for Trade #2, #3, etc are less than or equal to the difference in salary for Trade #1.

Therefore, with the trade exception feature, this deal wouldn’t need to be balance; because in addition to acquiring Josh, Toronto would also acquire a trade exception to use to acquire more players. To give them Speedy and the trade exception would be unnecessary on their end. However, on our end, I would still trade Speedy to dump his 5M to acquire Bosh, but I would use him in another trade with another team for a better long term deal. However, we both reached the same conclusion of higher risk to the Hawks, I just offered more scenarios.

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Big Ray, Mark Bradley,

I see two solution to this old age problem.

A scenario we keep all of them Josh, Marvin, and AL simply because they are still ridiculously young and will improve how much they individually improve is really up to them. If we keep all of them it presents us with two many options to have a one man offense and Woodson either changes or we get a new coach.

The other scenario is one of them is traded and we immediately regret it. That regret that we would fill will will be there for either one of them because if they are traded its because some one fills like they can maximize their potential.

And I definitely agree with Wetherson Marvin being the fourth option is of course going to place his scoring lower than it could be. thats going to happen for anyone who is the fourth option. If Josh is the guy then when joe was out I am pretty sure Woodson would have run the ball through him he isn’t incompetent.

You run the ball through Marvin more than Smith and then lets try to sit and compare stats.

We loose Marvin we loose one of the better on ball defenders on the team.

We loose Smith we loose one of the better Weak side shot blockers on the team.

Why loose either one if you could keep both.

And Big Ray I asked you a question man what about Josh moving to sixth man and focusing his energy into some parts of the game he can focus in on?

And yes I do think Mike Woodson is holding all of them back. Maybe its a bigger conspiracy he holds them back so that the ASG can sign them for less.

I think we will see how much Marvin is valued when free agency starts just like how we saw with Josh.

Until one of those things happens

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The Truth,

You are probably more versed on NBA trade rules than I am. My understanding is that the salaries must be within 125% plus $100,000.00. I’m not saying that I am right, that’s just my understanding. Manny T or niremetal – HELP!!!

Publix,

I guess it just boils down to one opinion vs. another. I would love to make the deal you suggested with Portland. I think Aldridge is a really good player and he could really help the Hawks. I just don’t see them agreeing to that deal, especially since I don’t believe Childress will come back.

As far as the trade with the Bulls, I just like JJ and Marvin as players better than Hinrich & Gordon. I think my plan of trading Speedy & Josh for Bosh gives the Hawks a much better chance to make a run for the title than your trade does. I understand and agree that we have got to sign a PG and Hinrich is a good one. But, I feel that we can sign Sessions, keep Acie, and resign Flip and we will be really good @ PG. Hopefully we are getting rid of a guard that does not play defense. We don’t need another one in Gordon.

Just my thoughts. This is fun!

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And I do not agree with the guy from SI either. at least his reasoning

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Mr. Bradley,

You are probably absolutely right Marvin would adjust far quicker than Josh.

And this a serious question. Is that a problem that Josh Smith would have such a problem still getting starters minutes but coming off the bench or is it that they type of competitive spirit we need on any team?

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Definitely agree,

Definitely Agree but I do think it would help Josh Smith if they were able to focus him in on giving this or that type of production off the bench in an energy filled matter, but I think the times he does look lost or out of game is because he hasn’t learned how to pace himself through a game consistently. And I think he would be able to provide more of a spark, but what is RS?

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Based on draft status, then more should be expected from Marvin. A #2 pick (taken over CP3 and Deron Williams), compared to a #17 pick.

However, my problem with Josh is that he’s like a box of chocolates. You never know what you’re gonna get (please excuse my lame Forrest Gump reference). He will give you one highlight play, followed by one boneheaded play or turnover. Marvin does not have the upside that Josh has, but he is more consistent. And to be a championship team, you need consistency.

And I agree with some of nire’s points. How many open jumpers did Josh get? Imagine if Marvin was left open like that? And Marvin plays much better man defense than Josh. Plus if Marvin would hold on to the ball on the break like Josh does, Marvin would average more points too. But Marvin gives it up to JJ or Bibby. Which ties into Marvin’s biggest weakness. Too passive.

That being said, I think Marvin and Josh are being held back by Woody (I wish Woody would get an offensive assistant).

As far as making the Josh for Bosh, teams have to be willing to take risks. Everyone (me included) said Orlando overpaid for Rashard. But they’ve won the division the last 2 years, and they’re in the finals. The Celtics made the trade for KG and Ray Allen (very talented, but they are old and very expensive). Why should the Hawks continue to stand pat because of Chemistry, or because they’re still young?

Teams that are afraid to take calculated risks will not win championships. Maybe the Hawks are content at fighting for the 4th – 8th seed every year.

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Marvin and defense DO NOT belong in the same sentence. He plays none.. Please stop it with the lies lol.. Marvin is soft, and he will always be soft.. He doesn’t want to nor will he ever be more than what he is now.. Especially not on the hawks.

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Marvin can play defense and he has shown that. The problem is his ability to stay on the court. He prove to me last year that his game has gotten better.

The Hawks need a LEADER on the team!!!

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Red,
What do you want in return for Josh; altough I disagree with you. Granted, he cries like his mommie took away his playstation, with hard off season training and the desire to be one of the Best it is Possible!!!

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I said Marvin Williams would be better off as our 6th man, too! Speaking of 6th man, when was the last time we had a “legit” 6th?

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Publix,

Can you bring me some bannana’s and milk, please? LOL!

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Mark Bradley,

Josh Childress was OK, and yeah, Flip Murray was good this “past season”, but I don’t think we should call him our 6th man just yet?

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publix tradin away the whole team lol.

But my thoughts are that smoove and jj should stay and isnt smoove locked in 4 years basically?
Al will be better than smoove, give him a couple of years(not exactly better but they could be equally matched) Its a hard bargain when you deal with two great players. Trade a 3 time allstar and not happening! Trade the highlight reel not happening!

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Aight fellas! Lets be real here. Atlanta does not have a legit “SUPERSTAR”… We have a great “ALL-STAR” and a “POTENTIAL ALL-STAR” To me a “SUPERSTAR” is top 5-10 player in this league and neither is that. But we do have two guys who if we get talent around them we can make a legit run. But 1st priority is a C or PG. Now If I had to choose between Joe and Josh, as of today I pick Joe. At least with Joe you know what you are getting. Josh has “potential”. Potential is just what it is “a potential possibility” Every team enters the NBA looking and hoping for the next “SUPERSTAR” and drafting off of potential but how many of the players ever tap into that potential. Josh has the potential to be a top 10 “SUPERSTAR” in this league, but I question the work ethic and the basketball IQ of Josh to become that player. Athletisism and intangables come a dime a dozen. But a guy that has heart, character, work ethic and b-ball IQ to go along with the athletisism and intagebles (ala LEBRON JAMES/KOBE BRYANT) are rare.
You make a run at CHAMPIONSHIPs and consistently keep a “PLAYOFF” team by keeping your best players and adding pieces around them to put the best team together not by trading your best player, on your team as of today, in hope that a player taps into his potential. If you trade JOE and JOSH never taps into that potential you are back at square one. But if you keep JOE at least he can consistently have someone who can carry team until you find someone who taps into their potential…

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Trading Johnson, and Horford to Toronto would be like Christmas in July to Raptors fans!

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Mark,

Thanks for the kudos, my man! But I’m not right half as much as I’d like to be (well, I am married, that would explain that, would it not? )

RealSquawk,

Sorry, I meant to answer that question and totally forgot. Actually, I don’t see Josh adjusting to a sixth man role. As Mark Bradley says, it suits Marvin better. Really, that’s something you have to think your way through. If Josh goes to the bench, who plays PF? If it’s Horford, who’s the starting center? Sure, we say all the time “get a center”, but how realistic are we being about who we can get? Nobody GIVES away a good center.

We are going to end up sacrificing some of our young talent. I really believe this.

Niremetal,

I am well aware and equally as frustrated with some of the things Josh does.

I love how you’re willing to put Marvin ahead of him on the strength of two games in which he led the team in scoring. TWO GAMES. Since we’re going to use small test samples to prove a point, let’s talk about Win/Loss totals when either player was out with injury.

While Josh was out, we went 6-6 or 6-7. With Marvin out from March 8th to about April 9th, we went 10-6, including a 6 game winning streak right after he was injured. Hmmmm. Nothing like small test sample stats…

I also like your comments about the playoffs. As I recall, we did win the first round. JJ led the way with 17.1 ppg, with Josh scoring 16.3 per. I’m sure his scoring was all a by product of Joe drawing the entire Miami defense on every play. Yep, that’s the ticket. The difference between the two is that Josh brought his level of play UP from the regular season, exceeding nearly all of his regular season stats, in each category, to include shooting roughly 15% higher on his free throws. Nearly all of Joe’s stats went DOWN.

And in the second round, only Josh looked like a player, though we did lose badly to the Cavs. He raised his scoring further against Cleveland, while Joe’s scoring took a further dive. Oh, and Cleveland wasn’t triple teaming Joe, either. Maybe a few doubles, but mostly Delonte West had him locked down.

Strange. Best player on the team outplayed by the one you want to trade the most (you know, the dummy who can’t shoot and gives you occasional highlight plays).

I realize Marvin doesn’t get left open as much as Josh, simply because he can hit the jumper. Only, it’s not that simple. Marvin is more than just a “shooter.” He can score in other ways, and isn’t that why y’all keep saying he’s a better player? Well, there’s another reason Josh is open, and Marvin isn’t. He might want to try moving without the ball, instead of standing around. Sorry, but even with Woody running all the wrong plays, Marvin’s 13.9 ppg is not impressive by any stretch. Perhaps his deference only encourages Woody to keep running plays for the much more aggressive Smith.

By the way, I do watch the regular season games, smarty-pants. And while it’s convenient for people to note that Josh’s stats have gone down in nearly every category, perhaps it’s inconvenient to note that so have Marvin’s and Joe’s stats have gone down to, though not in all categories.

Simple answer: Mike Bibby. When you introduce a scoring/shooting pg into the mix, and have a head coach that insists on running the whole offense through the backcourt, that will happen.

Red,

I understand your point about Josh not becoming a top 10 player, and I know some people said he could be top 5 guy (I don’t agree with that either). But here are some guys I think are arguably top 10 in the NBA: Kobe Bryant, Lebron James, Tim Duncan, Chris Paul, Dirk Nowitzki, Dwight Howard, Dwyane Wade, Brandon Roy, Chris Bosh, and Tony Parker. Arguments can be made for Deron Williams as well.

What’s my point? Joe Johnson ain’t on that list. And he’s not going to BE on that list. Why? Because he’s not appreciably better than guys like Deron Williams (I don’t think he’s better than Deron anyway). He doesn’t necessarily give more than a Vince Carter, Devin Harris, or Al Jefferson.

So here we are with the “best player on the team”, and even he’s not a top 10 guy (though I’m sure there are arguments for an opposing point of view). And guess what? He’s not going to get any better than he is NOW. But we’re complaining about a 23 year old guy who came here out of high school knowing how to do NOTHING but run, jump, and dunk? Alrighty then.

What do you suggest we trade Josh for? If you as a blogger, is able to see that Josh can’t get any better than he is now, then what do you suppose GMs and other front office personnel of other teams think?

Look, either Josh’s talent and upside are real, or they are not. Can’t have it both ways. If he’s never going to be that good, then surely guys who get paid big money to evaluate such talent will know this, and try to give us CRAP in return. Besides, maybe they read blogs, and now that you’ve suggested trading him while they still THINK he’s worth something, you just let the cat out of the bag!

Still doesn’t change the fact that Marvin, for all his blog-appointed basketball halos, lacks the mental capacity to take over games. Well, at least for no more than 2 GAMES. Heh…

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O’brien,

That’s the whole point. You never know what you’re going to get with a #17 pick, which is what Josh was. Marvin was a #2 pick. Now, is it fair to judge guys on draft position? I’ve argued that it’s not, as where a player is picked says more about who picked him than about the player himself.

All the same, the draft positioning also says something about how the player is regarded. Josh was regarded as a lesser talent. What I find maddening is how people will unwaveringly maintain the idea that Marvin will one day be a star player. They claim they’re worried about him going to another team and becoming that great player. I understand this concern, and share it. But how can you think that of Marvin, yet openly say that Josh (who is the same age) is all but guaranteed to not get any better than he is now? The double standard is getting very OLD…

As for team’s taking risks, I agree wholeheartedly. I defend Josh a lot, but I’m equally disappointed in his shortcomings. And I have no issues with a trade involving him or anybody else, that makes us better. So having said that, I’ll say again for the millionth time that I’d trade him for Bosh if it could be done, and we didn’t give up too much. Obviously there would be other pieces in place.

The whole thing surrounding that is that Sund cannot dodder around like a senile old man, as he did with both Joshes. Do that, and you lose both JJ and Bosh. Then we’re back to rebuilding, and Sund is NOT good at that.

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TRADE FOR A BIG MAN TO REBOUND AFTER ALL THOSE MISSED JUMPERS FROM THE BACKCOURT

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Ray,

I don’t suppose Joe being hurt during the playoffs could have had anything to do with his declining production then? Nah, that couldn’t be it…

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Does anybody like Marc Gasol?

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B: I would love to see us either a) get Memphis’ #2 pick or b) get Marc Gasol by trading Marvin, Acie, etc. Marc has skills and is the big wide-body we need to compete in the East (especially if those Shaq to Cleveland rumours ever turn out to be true).

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Ray,

Man, the humidity of Savannah must be seeping into your brain. Take a look at Josh’s month-by-month stats. His biggest downturn came in February, two months AFTER his injury. In fact, his best month was January. So you can’t just blame it on his injury. Incidentally, in December I most certainly did acknowledge that Josh’s struggles were due to his recovery process, but that doesn’t explain why his stats in February and March were down.

In any case, my biggest issue with Josh has actually never been his stats. It’s been the things that DON’T show up in stats that concern me. Like him continuing to bring the ball up himself on the break even though he gets his pocket picked every damned time (remember when Kidd did that 3 times to him in one game?). And him not realizing that the reason that he gets all those open looks from 3-point land is that other teams WANT him to take that shot?

That’s what concerns me most. I could definitely deal with a slight dip in production if it was accompanied by a better all-around game. Marvin came back with an improved trey, a greater willingness to attack the rim, and a fiercer effort on D. But Josh showed no improvement in any facet of his game this year as compared to last year. He wasn’t any better at on-ball defense, he wasn’t more circumspect about shooting 3’s, he wasn’t crashing the glass like he used to (a point that you yourself made many times), and he didn’t shoot any better from the line. The only “new wrinkle” that I noticed was that he got a lot more open lay-ups and dunks this year. But that can easily be attributed to the presence of Bibby for a full season – and in fact, his stats for this year were basically a carbon copy of his stats during late February-April of last year, after Bibby arrived. His little lefty hook looked a little better this year, but he didn’t make the same improvements in his post game that Horford showed. And his free throw shooting took an atrocious turn for the worse – he never cracked 70% from the line for any month of the season.

You wanna kick Joe for being hurt, fine. You wanna slam the guy who has led the NBA in minutes over the past 5 seasons, fine. All I’ll say is that his assist numbers went up around the time his scoring went down. That showed that Joe knows how to adjust his game to help his team when he was having trouble scoring. Can’t say the same for Josh.

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Hoops,

The Hawks would clearly be wasting money and time, re-signing all their core. The Hawks need to “spicy up” their core a little bit. It’s like every season the Hawks have the type of team…

2 PG’S, 3/4 SG’S, 5,000 SF/PF’S/ and 1 C! LOL!

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Hey Mark,

Are you enjoying this “back and forth?”

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i am so sick of woody & iso joe.to trade josh over joe would be insane.
woody has hurt josh as he has done with other players over the years.we have such an athetic team but never fast break. joe does not know what a fast break is. he walks the ball & dribbles & dribbles using way to much of the shot clock & puts the ball into players handsbwith no time on the clock.the worst thing about the hawks is gthat there is no ball movement. we will never have a good offence with the ball always in jj hands i am so sick of this type of basketball

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My bad, didn’t know BJ was off-limits.

Anyway, you’re right on this one Bradley. Josh + real coach = All-Star.

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Sorry, not the answer we were looking for

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Marvin Williams and Randolph “the bust” Morris for Marc Gasol and Greg Buckner, also we can swap 2nd Rd. Picks!

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hoops: your scenario will not work. your basically putting the same hawks team on the floor only your adding a power forward that has established roles. Marvin was fine in Atlanta he just had a health wise bad year.. 2nd thing dont forget you have to pay this guys and any trades you make take away from your future so you end up being unable to draft next year. you can have trades but dont trade for people that will only be here one year. it would be a dissaster if we lost joe johson and gay in the exact same year. 3rd too many allstars, i kno this sounds wierd but all these people will want to be paid more if the hawks move forward, giving us a setback

back to the point. i would let jsmoove go. hes just too risky for a team with younger people coming in. look at dwayne wades team. joe is the closest thing to Dwade Kobe, ray allen etc.unless josh puts up allstar visits then i would let him stay, i mean rookies do make allstar teams. its not unheard of so y shouldnt he?

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Patrick,

I agree with a lot of what you say.

Niremetal,

I liked that Marvin added a 3 point shot. And I realize that shooting it took his overall FG% down. He wasn’t bad with the 3-ball, at 35.5%.

But Josh “happily chucking 3s?” Come one man. Last year, he took 99 attempts, which over the course of the 81 games he played, came to a whopping 1.22 attempts per game. This year he took 87 over the course of 69 games, which as you say WAS an increase….to a lofty 1.26 per game. And guess what? He made one more 3 (26) in those attempts than he did last year (25), which is STILL an increase in production/percentage no matter how you slice it. I have two things to say to that:

2) If you think one-and-a-quarter three point attempts per game is “happily chucking away”, then you don’t want to know what Flip (3.06), JJ (5.24), and Bibby (5.42) were doing. To be fair, Bibby hit a nice 39%. JJ and Flip were 5% to 6% better than Josh…

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Josh will never be mature enough to be a leader. Isn’t coachable. Great athlete, no basketbal fundamentals.

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We dont trade either…. JJ is our leader and currently our best player, Josh is a yung therobred/stat stuffer the guy does a little bit of everything- He will get better and refine his game eventually. the problem is coaching or lack there of- I wont start bashing the coach but our players are limited because we dont play in any particular system and 60% of the time its free lance offense-no plays just make something happen because we are long athletic and Young….. We would be alot better if these guy’s had defined roles and we ran more of a high low inside out type game.

Improving the team: Pick up two big men that can really help us…. Gortat and Ronny Turriaf- Let Bibby/ZAZA go else where
their 20 million can be used to get these guys.

This maybe a long shot but since Turkoglu is a free agent we S&T Marvin/ 2010 1st for him…… this would eliminate the need for a true PG -Turk and JJ both handle the ball alot. JJ needs help its a proven fact he cant do it alone we need another dependable scorer to really see a difference (Rudy Gay/ Turk type players)

If we cant get Turk then Charlie V and Jarret Jack would work as well -We have get better but trading Josh or JJ wont help us -we need to add not subtract peices…….

Draft- Wayne Ellington and Toney Douglas – in the draft -they both seem like Woodson type guy’s – guards who can get their own shot.

Bosh for Josh is a good deal only if we can get him to sign for more than one year -What good does it do the team if he’s here one year then goes to Cleveland or Miami……

Line up 1

Law/Flip/TDouglas Flip/Law/TDouglas
JJ/Wayne Ellington JJ/Wayne Ellington
Turk/Mo Turk/Mo
Josh/Turiaf/Hunter Horford/Smoove/Hunter
Horford/Gortat/Solo Turiaff/Gortat/Solo

Gardner,Speedy …Ahhh good bye

2nd line up

JJack/Flip/Law
JJ/MO/Wayne ellington
Marvin/Charlie V
Josh/Charlie V/Hunter
Horford/ free agent center/Solo

Why the hell didnt we sign Petriuis last summer-Him and flip off the bench would have been fire!
We can sing free agents and draft whoever but the real change should be the Coach -just my two cents……

Whass up officer friendly!! ………

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Ray,

JJ, Bibby, Flip, and Marvin all shot from the perimeter with a hand in their face or at least a defender nearby. Josh was more often then not all on his lonesome. As I said, that makes Josh’s percentages much less impressive.

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IMUS,

I was thinking the same thing, too! Jamario Moon is a lot like Childress. And, he will be cheap, but the only problem is he’s a RFA. So Miami could easily match our offer. Paying him a little bit more may be the trick, like what we did with Flip Murray last season.

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I wonder who would be the best C for us…

Marcin Gotat is too thin.

Tyson Chandler, and Shaq are too expensive (Shaq’s too old, too)!

Chris Kaman is too expensive, and is injury-prone (at least in my opinion).

Marcus Camby is too old, and with no doubt wouldn’t fit our future.

Hasheem Thabeet is too high of an draft pick for us to draft him, unless we trade one of our core players and a expiring contract. If not, it’s not happening!

It’s no way in the world we can trade for Dwight Howard, or Yao Ming.
Plus, Yao always seems to be injured at the end of the season.

BJ Mullens has a 99.9% chance of being a “bust”.

David Andersen, Chris Anderson, nor Antonio Mcdyess are legit C’s.

Zaza Pachulia would be a waste of money. We can sign more helpful vets for the type of contract he might want.

Marc Gasol is probably the best fit for our club. He has size and can play defense and be a legit scoring weapon in the post.

TRADE FOR MARC GASOL, RICK SUND!

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B -If we let ZAZA go then all we will have is SOLO- so im in favor of bringing in two guys – Any 2 will do….. Gortat, Marc Gasol, Birdman Anderson,Ronny Turiaf, Tyson Chandler

Id rather have any 2 of the 5 over ZAZA,Solo and R Morris, Really tho Randolph Morris played a total of 16 minutes the entire season, One might ask the question -Y is he here then….. Well he’s here because we refuse to spend money to better our team- This garbage happens every year-then in mid august we will start throwing around our MLE to find sum end of the bench players. Ex we could have signed Petrius last july after josh got his deal done butthat didnt happen……. Petrius is better than any other PG/SG we have on the roster.

Oh well im bythn again -but its all for nothing the same garbage will be going on the next 2 months….. Dont be suprised if we pick up greg buckner and melvin ely AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!

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Besides JJ

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Niremetal,

Nowhere did I suggest that Josh’s 3 point percentage was impressive. You can come up with enough straw to feed 5 horses, I swear.

On the flip side, would you have me believe that those other guys were shooting contested shots every time they went for the 3-ball? I’ll go along with the fact that Josh was usually open when he shot his 3s, but the other guys had open looks too, though not as many.

And tell me this: if they were shooting with hands in their faces, then they weren’t open, right? So why were they taking the most difficult shots…with hands in their faces as well? And you say Josh has bad shot selection. It was Marvin’s first year actively shooting the three. He could have/should have driven the ball more (especially with his size and speed), but he gets a pass. Bibby hit 39% of his 3s. He gets a pass. Joe and Flip? No pass. Both guys attempts vs. percentage were not impressive at all, hand in their face or no hand. Learn to take better shots.

But I forget. It’s never Joe’s fault. He does everything exactly right, and it’s everyone else in the world who does things wrong. Wow, you’ll make a victim and martyr out of him yet…I sure hope he appreciates his one-man groupie…;)

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Hoops -ur probably right …so sad

B Easy- No way in hell, but Bogut/# 10 -yes sir!!!!!!!

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DHD,

Not trying to fit in, homie. Black folks up here use yall just like EVERYONE does down there. Plus, I lived in Charleston, SC for 5 years. Don’t hate me for my punctuation. “y’all” is as natural to me as “ya’ll”

Back to the topic, can we please have Josh Smith?

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Red,

Educate me. What do you mean by the 6 million dollar kicker?

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Marvin should defintely embrace the role of 6th man next year. We let JT go, Nique, Steve Smith…all the Hawks greats. Let’s not panic here and do the dumb do-wa-diddy and trade away our future. Put a damn Center around these guys and quit whatever “experiment” that has been going on by having nine power forwards on this team. LOL We hogging up the Power Foward lane.

Mark B. I need to look up this David Anderson kid. I’m sleepin on him, but I usually do come draft night until recently. With the 19th pick draft a combo guard PUH-LEASE!!

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I dont follow the Hawks as closely as I do the Braves, simply because I live outside Atlanta, and dont get their games. I do watch them every night during the playoffs, though, and based on what I’ve seen, and know, my answer is no, you dont trade Josh Smith.

This team has progressed in each season Smith has been here. We went from one of the worst teams in the league, to improving, to finally getting to the playoffs, and scaring the daylights out of the eventual NBA Champs last year, to finally winning a playoff series this year. With us making progress in every year Smith and Johnson have been the core, why would we trade one of our top scores now, if we are trying to be a team on the rise, and make progress every year?

I know that basketball isnt exactly like baseball, but, in 1997, in the prime of their careers, when they were even older than Josh Smith is now, the Braves signed Tom Glavine and Greg Maddux to lucrative five year deals, as we wanted to keep winning. Would the Braves have even thought about trading one of our top two star pitchers then? I dont think so.

Josh is still very young, and I’m of the belief that most NBA teams that aren’t the Lakers, and dont have Kobe, need a second big scorer, to compete at a high playoff level. If the Hawks trade Smith for picks now, we would be down to one big scorer on this team, and might well have a lot of trouble putting up enough points to win every night.

I hope the Hawks dont trade Smith. I think that would be a huge mistake. One cant really worry about free agency a year from now. It isnt likely that the Hawks will get equal value for him, so I say, let him play with us this year, and hopefully the Hawks can go further in the playoffs in 2010, and let the free agency thing sort itself out.

Mitch

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I would trade for Tyson Chandler an athletic 7 foot center.
They tried to get rid of him last year and he is 27.
His contract is 11,350.000 in return we send them Speedy Claxton who has an expiring contract 5,757.818 Mo Evans 2,500,000 1 year contract and Randolph Morris 797,581 1 year contract. This deal would work.

Sign Andre Miller to play the point

Trade Josh Childress and draft BJ Mullins
draft with our pick draft Ty Lawson

Resign Zaza Pachulia

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You don’t deal your best players! you build around them with a support staff. It’s BONEHEAD ideas like this that keeps Atlanta teams from competing for championships. Keep Josh,llya & Jeff.

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Heres what we need to do…build around smith!

trade JJ and Law for another pick plus a veteran center (Camby Please!)

draft lawson if available, if not maynor or teague, second round get another center and a three point shooter from the pick we get in the trade

sign bibby and murray!

get claxton out of atlanta

go after another FA (hedo, im not sure who else is out there

PG – Bibby, Draft pick
SG – murray/evans
SF – Smith/Draft pick
PF – Horford/Hedo
C – Camby/Zaza/Draft pick

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I think its funny to see people get throw trade ideas and they obviously dont know what they are talking about.. U cant trade bibby because he is a free agent. The bosh deal will work only if bosh signs a deal otherwise its a wasted trade like the Danny Manning deal was a wasted trade. And if Bosh signs we need to get an extension with Johnson who i think would benefit from Bosh coming here because he want have to take all the shots.. Who agrees?

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[...] Other installments: Should the Braves trade Jeff Francoeur? And also: Should the Hawks trade Josh Smith? [...]

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