How the Atlanta Hawks just might stay together after all

ant banks

May 22nd, 2009
11:22 am

am i first??

All I'm Saying Is...

May 22nd, 2009
11:25 am

Unless the dollars don’t work, ZaZa needs to be retained — as a valuable back-up — because he knows his role and plays hard.

We need to do a sign and trade using Marvin to trade up in the draft and pick Thabeet (7′ 3″ and 275 lbs) to have a defensive presence in the middle.

If he will take the market rate for coming off the bench and accept that he will not be a starter much longer, re-sign Bibby as the team responded to his point guard leadership.

Last, sign Andre Miller as our new point guard. He’s an unrestricted free agent with size and experience.

ant banks

May 22nd, 2009
11:30 am

MB,

Sund did an excellent job last year considerin’ that he did not overspend, went on the cheap and got us a fourth seed and 2nd round playoff birth.

He may think that this is the rule, rather than the exception.

I like the rookies that have been tossed around for the Hawks at 19, but if we get a guard, how do you think that Woodson would treat this guy compared to Law? Woody clearly hates rookies.

I think that they East is goin’ to be stronger next year. We still have to contend with the Big 3 Boston, Clev, and Orlando, but we have to be concerned about Indy, Miami, Washington, Charlotte, Chicago, and Philly (in no order).

Can we really expect to maintain or improve in light of the aforementioned?

Foster

May 22nd, 2009
11:33 am

I would love to see all four of those guys back but I honestly don’t see it as realistic. Draft a PG like Flynn, Mayor, or Teague in the first round, try to get Bibby back for another year or two, and then try to resign Pachulia or even get Rasheed in here for a year or two for a deep playoff run. We could use a true center…wouldn’t mind a sign-and-trade with Marvin for a guy like Thabeet, but I don’t wanna give up on Marv just yet.

ant banks

May 22nd, 2009
11:33 am

I AM TIRED OF PEOPLE SAYIN’ THAT WE NEED TO PACKAGE A DEAL TO MOVE FROM 19 TO 2 TO GET THABEET.

it ain’t gonna happen!!! stop it i say. like teams 3-18 ain’t thinkin’ like that.

ant banks

May 22nd, 2009
11:33 am

FOSTER,

what would you do with Law

niremetal

May 22nd, 2009
11:42 am

I actually think that Zaza is very likely to stay put. He’s a back-up center no matter where he goes and he clearly has found a comfort zone in the U.S, version of Georgia. As long as we give him what he’s worth ($5M-$6M, I’d say), I can’t imagine him bolting for elsewhere.

I agree that Smith is a more talented player, but Marvin is a better SF than Smoove, and I think Horford will turn out to be a better PF than Smoove – which is why I think Smoove should be viewed as expendable, his tweener talent notwithstanding. Marvin is one of those guys who is better than his stats indicate, as anyone who actually watched him when he was healthy this year knows (Sekou said he was having a “breakout season” for a reason). My fear is that another team has their eye on Marvin already, and will make a frontloaded offer for him upfront that catches us off-guard. The only thing that makes that less likely is the fact that Detroit, Oklahoma City, and Memphis are the only decent teams with enough of cap room to sign him straight up – and he doesn’t make great sense for any of those teams since they already have Prince, Durant, and Gay, respectively. My biggest fear is that Utah will make a run at him, but they’d only have enough cap room if Boozer, Okur, and Korver all opt out.

We shall see…

Childress is the X-factor. Won’t even begin to speculate as to what will happen with him.

niremetal

May 22nd, 2009
11:44 am

Heh…I meant “teams with enough of cap room” there. Clearly, OKC and Memphis are not “decent” teams…

shayne Light

May 22nd, 2009
11:45 am

Sund should try to sign Jason Kidd. Then Sign and trade Marvin Williams for Shaq. Throw in Acie law and Craig Claxton contract plus a draft pick or two and this could happen. resign Flip Murray. And draft either Ty Lawson, D. Collison from UCLA, or B.J. Mullen.

This team needs Veteran Leadership that has won a title or at least been to the finals, if they want to contend!

niremetal

May 22nd, 2009
11:49 am

One more typo – I meant that Smoove is more expendable than Marvin, not that he really was expendable. I say we only should trade him if we can land a legit big man who will get us a guaranteed 10 boards a game and would allow us to slide Horford over to PF – and there aren’t too many guys who fit that description.

The Smoove-vs-Marvin debate is long-running on Sekou’s blog. My impression is that the more consistently people watch Hawks games, the more highly they value Marvin. I just think it’s one of those cases where Smoove is pretty much exactly as good as his stats indicate, but Marvin is better than his stats indicate.

HawkDawg

May 22nd, 2009
11:54 am

ZaZa is the heart of this team. He likes to dish out hard fouls. In fact, he is the ONLY Hawks who will get physical. We are already soft. Let’s not make it worse.

Mac

May 22nd, 2009
11:59 am

Josh Smith is far superior to Marvin Williams. I can’t even see why there would be any question about that. I think Mark as stated it well. Williams is just a guy, while Smith is a difference maker.

Mac

May 22nd, 2009
12:01 pm

Moses Malone and Reggie Theus are just the pieces to get us over the top.

Howard

May 22nd, 2009
12:07 pm

Mark, Doesn’t it seem wrong that as fans we are told to be patient while younger players develop only to lose them to free agency when they have? If the Hawks won’t spend the money for free agents or to keep our younger players when they develop and reach eligibility for free agency isn’t the Team really saying that we will always be rebuilding?

Oz

May 22nd, 2009
12:16 pm

Mac, I agree but I want to keep both of them. Depth gentleman, Depth…As we all saw what happens when one our starters from the front court get hurt. We were very very thin with the Bigs…Smooth is versatile and explosive but Marvin is consistent. My sentiments is we need another Agile, shot blocker with toughness. Antonio McDyess comes to mind..I don’t like Rashad Wallace to inconsistent and not sure if he is still motivated. Keep Bibby for less of course. Keep Za Za, Flip, and let Acie go and pick up new blood…Whichever the best point available, Flynn or my favorite LAWSON…Speed guy with an improved jump shot. Just my two cents.

EJH

May 22nd, 2009
12:26 pm

In my opinion keeping this young group of players together is very important. For Marvin, Josh Smith, Horford, and acie Law, this is coming up on their 3rd year together and they are only 22 -23 years of age respectfully. You do not groom these guys in the league so someonelse can reap the reward by taking on a veteran for 2-3 years who will then be finished in the league. You want to have a run like the Spurs where you are in contention every year. The Hawks have a group of guys who are almost there, but not quite.

The thought of trading Marvin, who I think is your more consistent player than anyone on the team is ridiculous. The game in Denver where the Hawks lost 110 to 109 Marvin williams matched Carmelo anthony; he had 31 points in that game, he also had 30 points in a game against the Bobcats, where he was 5-15 from the field, but realized his shot was not falling and got to the free throw line 20 times and went 18-20. you do not trade talent like that for a scrub veteran.

I hate to say this but bringing Josh Childress back to be this teams future two guard is probably the right thing to do. He is going to come cheaper than Joe Johnshon’s 15 million per year. If you go back and look at childress’s numbers he average doube digit points off the bench and 6-7 rebounds, 4 assists and almost 1.5 steals, plus he is a better defender and willing participant to pass the ball and not pound it into the floor waiting on double teams. This team is so similar to the Nuggets that it is rediculous. The Nuggets have Dahntay Jones as their starting shooting guard, please. Also to get to the next level guys need to realize that they are going to have to make sacrifices in there games to achieve high levels of success. Josh Smith is going to have to say my goal is to rebound the basketball, block shots, and play great defense, and run the floor and play in the post. Not to put myself in position where I hurt the team. If Joe Johnson stays around he is going to have to realize to that he hurts the team whe he puts up 20 to 25 shots a game and only hits 7 or 8 shots. he must say I am going to drive the ball to the rim and play inside out basketball when the double teams come. To many times this season the hawks shot jumpshots out the double teams instead of getting easier buckets closer to the rim. Each guy has to decide what he is going to sacrifice in his game for the greater good of the team.

Jason

May 22nd, 2009
12:28 pm

I think that the hawks need to try to retain the team from last year. The one position I would look at moving is the PG Bibby. While he has done a great job of moving the hawks from young raw talent, I think we need a guy that plays a higher tempo. We need a PG that can do a bit more slashing than Bibby does. This is in no way a jab at Bibby, but I just think we could find a better fit for this roster.

On anohter note, I still think there is room for imporvement from the young player we have. It would not be a reach to assume that Horford is going to develop more as a scorer and rebounder, especially as he learns some more of the veteran “tricks.”

Smith is a fine player. His problem is he has no midrange jumper. Teams are able to lay off of him, which takes his slashing ability away. IF he were to be able to develop a somewhat consistatnt 15 footer, that would open his ability to take th ball to the hoop. Josh has imporved every year, so it would not be out of the question to assume he could develop the midrange jumper.

Marvin William is still a very young player. Though he has been in the leauge for 4 years, he came out of college after his freshemen year, meaning he is still very young. I think Marvin could be a nice piece in Atlanta to go along with the other pieces we have.

Again, I still think we need to imporve the PG position, but outside of that, there is no reason to give up on any of the young guys on the roster.

Mac

May 22nd, 2009
12:44 pm

I agree with you, Oz. Keep ‘em both. Flush the bottom of the roster and upgrade from there.

NC Braves Fan

May 22nd, 2009
12:48 pm

Mark – if you were running the Hawks, how would you prioritize the player signings and their relationships to the other players? Do you make re-signing Bibby the #1 priority, or do you start with Marvin (sign or sign and trade) and work your way down the list?

For my money, I get Bibby on a one or two year deal #1, try to sign and trade Marvin for a player with a skill set that fits the team a little better – and I would definitely try to re-sign Flip.

As for Zaza, I’d follow the same kind of parameters as with Marvin and if a better player fit can’t be found through trade or FA signing, try to bring Zaza back.

Volman

May 22nd, 2009
12:54 pm

Mr. Bradley, you have done it again. Thanks for throwing these articles at us left and right! We REALLY appreciate it!

You think ZAZA is gone? Ouch. Josh Smith is the MVP of this team, but Zaza is the heart of this team. I don’t think Sund will let him go..but there will be plenty of good teams wanting to get him. Will Zaza stay loyal and stay in Atlanta? I have met him multiple times and he seems very humble and a good person. I think he stays loyal and comes back.

Oz

May 22nd, 2009
12:57 pm

Thanks Mac. Mark that is exactly what I am noticing about Acie. He really got the time to show his worth because of injuries or what not but we have to groom a potential leader at the PG position that is why I would snatch up Lawson…We all know success in college does not always agree with the Pros but I would be willing to take that chance..As I stated ealrier we need another versatile BIG..Someone with some Playoff Experince..Suggestions; I want Antonio Mcdyss but not sure if he will be available. Hell, I’ll take PJ Brown out of retirement..

What is the deal on our other native Atlantian that skipped GT and went to UK? Randolph Morris, what is the deal? Can the ball or what or his he just taking up space?

cp

May 22nd, 2009
1:00 pm

I would rather have Chills than Evans. I wasn’t really impressed with Evans this past season. People we will not be trading up to get Thabeet so please stop suggesting it. I don’t see why people think Horford will be a better pf than Smith. Other than rebounding what does Horford do better at the pf spot? When Horford had to play at the pf position when Smith got hurt I did not see any improvement in his game. He has fewer low post moves than Smith does. Horford is a nice player but sometimes he seems a bit overrated by the fans here.

kj

May 22nd, 2009
1:18 pm

hey mark i know this may sound a little too crazy but what about mrvin at the 2? that way everyone can fit depending if smoov can find a mid range shot and we can snag a big for joe this off season. i know its radical but i think it would work.

NC Braves Fan

May 22nd, 2009
1:19 pm

Mark – thanks! Yeah it was interesting how Sund “played the PR game” in the interview – he really managed it well … gave just enough info to make it relevant, without revealing a lot of information.

The core thing I take away from that interview – and the reference to JChills in this one – is that Sund seems to have a great understanding of resource allocation relative to a player’s position on and value to the team. And hopefully that will mean no Jon Koncak-like, budget-busting contracts will be given out.

f.i.l.a.

May 22nd, 2009
1:21 pm

Trading Marvin Williams would be a huge mistake.He’s 2 years from playing at an all star level, watch and see..Come draft night the hawks need 2 do whatever it takes 2 draft jonny flynn.He’s going 2 be on a level with cp3,d-will,rose and exc..

KEEP THE CORE TOGETHER AND IMPROVE THE BENCH!!!!

Obama hates Cheney's bald head the most

May 22nd, 2009
1:42 pm

MB If you think Zaza is gone, what can we get in return for him? Do you think it is just his desire to start or bad feelings in Atlanta?

Joe

May 22nd, 2009
1:43 pm

The Hawks need to keep their first 8 players if they can stay on budget and resign Bibby, Williams, Murray, and ZAZA with reasonable contracts with odd man out for the player who is too out of touch with his value. Send Jones and Morris to big men’s school this summer and evaluate their improvement, then either sign them or allow them to leave without a contract offer. If Childress will comeback at a reasonable contract, then he could replace one of the players not under contract.
who opts out from the Hawks. Law needs to play somewhere in a summer league and be re-evaluated as to his skills, trade him or play him. Johnson needs to improve next year or be traded during the upcoming season. The team needs to be run through the point guard and not through Joe Johnson as before. Horford needs to develop a low post shot and have plays run for him. Smith needs to play PF and not be shooting from the wing. Hawks need to sign one more outside shot shooter at the guard positions as Murray was all we had when Johnson went cold.
( who says a point guard can’t shoot the three). The draft should be used for the point guard and or big man not for a 3 or 4 player. Hawks need another big body but must sign ZAZA for several more seasons as there is a not many good big bodies out there.

Reggie

May 22nd, 2009
1:44 pm

Mark

What players would you expect the hawks to be looking at as far as free agents? Does players like Antonio Mcdyess, & Marcin Gortat come to mind?

Also, Do you think Josh Smith can play at the three?

jk77

May 22nd, 2009
1:49 pm

Here’s a thought; Sund needs to pick up the horn and chat with Minnesota’s new GM(?) about getting off the 18th and 28th picks in some kind of deal that involves Williams or Law and the pick. Then you pick Mullens at 18 because there is no other big man at this position with his size and upside. There are so many PG’s in this draft, but I really think they could land P.Mills at 28. He has all the PG tools and Olympic experience. Sekou had Minnesota picking these players at these specific spots in his CBS Sports Mock Draft,and I think they would add depth and be a great fit for the Hawks, provided they don’t give up any other core pieces besides Marvin, who I just can’t see $9mil/yr for.

CMC

May 22nd, 2009
1:56 pm

Mark,

My biggest problem with Woodson – besides his unimaginative style of offense – is the fact that he continually fails to develop his bench during the regular season. He commented early this past season that he needed to do so – said it himself to writers – and still failed in this department. I don’t see him doing it in 2009-2010 because he will be coaching for a new contract extension. We sure could have used a better prepared bench during the playoffs this year due to the injuries to Marvin, Joe and Horford. Do you think this might have come up in conversation during his meeting with Rick Sund, or does the GM let Woodson do his thing?

Goodfigs

May 22nd, 2009
1:56 pm

Trade Marvin, #19 pick, and rights to Childress to New Orleans for Chris Paul

PaulDawg

May 22nd, 2009
2:00 pm

We need a center, period. Horford needs to be at PF and Smoove at SF. Thabeet would be great- he wouldnt have to provide a lot of offense- but that won’t happen.

I thought Sund was nuts to let Childress go but he improved our bench. I’m anxious to see what the professionals decide to do (haven’t heard that said about the Hawks in a while, have you?)

PD

May 22nd, 2009
2:03 pm

Hey Mark, don’t you think Speedy’s contract is key to them acquiring another veteran player. He has a 5 mil expiring contract. But the question is who wants Speedy? Maybe we trade him to Memphis for Mike Conley or Washington for Javaris Crittendon or LA for Camby

I think Acie deserves 1 more year in Atlanta.

Good veterans for lockerroom strength
Antonio McDyess, Andre Miller or Mike Bibby, Francisco Elson and Ron Artest as Marvin replacement if he leaves.

Outside chances Rasheed Wallace. He said he will not play unless he gets 8mil per year and starts.

DAVID

May 22nd, 2009
2:03 pm

Dont know what the Hawks are going to do this off season, but I would love to see this line up in 2010. Center-Chris Bosh Power Forward-Al Horford Small Forward-Marvin Williams (Josh Smith comes off the bench) Shooting guard Joe Johnson Point guard Hmmm Dont know what to do at point guard, I really think Flip can run the point and do a good job. After the Cleveland series, it was obvious that the Hawks are young and Joe is going to need help in order for the Hawks to take that next step, gotta have a 1,2 punch in the NBA (Jordan+Pippen,Kobe+Gasol). They need some veteran help why not add another All Star into the line up what do you guys think about that?

All I'm Saying Is...

May 22nd, 2009
2:07 pm

ant banks: we don’t need to move to #2 to get thabeet; most think he will still be around when the t-wolves pick at #6

Someone who is projected to be around toward the end of the first round when the Hawks have their pick is BJ Mullens who is 7′ and 275 lbs with some thinking he could pack on another 25 pounds without losing anything; plus he is supposed to be much more skilled offensively than Thabeet.

Contrary to what did not happen in the past, drafting a point guard in this draft is not what the Hawks should do. Sign a veteran point guard and team them with a re-signed Bibby.

Ken Strickland

May 22nd, 2009
2:26 pm

MARK BRADLSY-realistically, if we drafted a PG with our #19 pick, do you thihk Woodson would give him a fair chance to play and develop, or the same treatment Salim Staudamire, Acie Law got from him? Also, would you recommend drafting a PG or trading our pick, plus an expiring contract and/or player, for a veteran PG?

esaun

May 22nd, 2009
2:35 pm

Trade Marvin is absurd. I luv J-Smooth, but Marvin is the hawks only good on the ball defender with more of a small forward game than Josh. Josh is not even the best pf on the team, that would be Horford. Josh too talented to trade; if we are to use the current lineup we must utilize a pg with speed to push the ball. Hawks one of the best transition teams in the NBA yet used a pg whose strength is 1/2 court sets; sweep go figure. We need to look into Mike Conley his speed with our roster would be a nightmare for teams. JJ may not be a star but imagine Conley pushin, (josh,marvin,al) fillin lanes, with JJ trailin for the kick out. That’s how PHO did it and JJ shot 49% from 3. Marvin is a young 6-9 no problems player who dunks hard, strokes lovely jumpers, and plays great defense; yet we say trade him. In da A do we really know the winning formula; forgot we throw parades for second place and cherish college conference titles

Patrick

May 22nd, 2009
2:38 pm

Unless you’re willing to part with Horford (which I wouldn’t), get any ideas of Thabeet out of your head.

I think priority #1 is getting Zaza signed to a reasonable deal, he’s a very productive backup and covers a bit for how undersized the rest of the frontline is. If Williams can be packaged for a lottery pick I would make the swap, and I would look to keep Bibby at a fair price (something like 3 yrs/25 mil or 4 yrs/30 mil). Keep in mind that the Hawks have to keep their finances in line so they can re-sign Horford to a big extention when he’s due. That’s a much higher priority long-term than Williams, Bibby, or any other FA.

ken

May 22nd, 2009
2:48 pm

MB, we need a center with that 19th pick, bj mullins

Daniel

May 22nd, 2009
2:57 pm

Thanks Mark for the continuing work on the Hawks. It is really refreshing to be getting new stuff in the off season.
I am tired of hearing about Woodson not playing rookies, because of Salim and Acie. Hello people!! Didn’t Josh, Marvin, and Al get tons of minutes their rookie seasons? Everyone needs to get off Acie and Salim’s jock. If they could play they would be in the rotation. I mean Salim just got picked up by Minnesota after being out of a job!!! They just are not that good. Honestly, we are not going to get anything out of the 19th pick this year anyway. We may get a player that could develop in 2-3 years at best. This is a horribly weak draft.

ILL-logical

May 22nd, 2009
3:04 pm

” And Zaza could well return, but I think there’s a part of him that still wants to be a starter. And that’s not happening with Al Horford in front of him”
And there in a nutshell is why Mr. Sund will be joining Mr. Woodson in the unemployment line next year. Calling Al Horford a center is like calling Jeff Francoeur an All-Star: just because you believe it doesn’t make it true.

Until and unless some major,major moves are made with this team, doom is emminent.

Starting with Josh Childress and soon to be goe Marvin Williams( and please ,folks you can’t be an All Star while lying on the floor). And you can’t just make trades because someone fits a team either. The other team;the player and his agent all have to be in the mix. And nobody wants to play in Woodson’s “system”. Even his “son” ,Joe looks a little weary and ready to move on.Sund is a pro in saying the right things to the media but his resume doesn’t have a world championship on it.

Fred

May 22nd, 2009
3:07 pm

My thoughts on Mike Woodson’s contract: http://www.examiner.com/x-2723-Atlanta-Hawks-Examiner~y2009m5d22-Woodson-will-go-into-next-year-as-lame-duck-coach

SB

May 22nd, 2009
3:08 pm

First let me say I’d like to keep both. It kills me how people try to twist and turn ways to try and make Marvin better than Smith. I’ve watched every Hawk game available over the last 5 yrs. Smith is by far the superior player. Marvin has a better jump shot and maybe a higher IQ, but that’s where the debate ends. You can like Marvin’s game and hate Smith’s that dosn’t make Marvin a better player. Smith is better in every other part of the game. Marvin has talent, Smith is a game changer now and they are around the same age. When Smith gets a jumper he will be one of the toughest assignments in the NBA. You just don’t trade away that kind of talent.

That said I wouldn’t trade Marvin unless another game changer came along. ZaZa should be resigned, unless we can get a better big. Childress is the X-Factor, If he comes back I don’t think they resign Flip. I would let Bibby go and go after Sessions ( pg Mil). I like Bibby, But he was a defensive liability all year. I like the Idea of adding a vet big with leadership skills.

Blast

May 22nd, 2009
3:15 pm

Great first move (or no move) by Sund not to extend Woody’s contract. Let Woody coach for one more year, show how he can improve himself or his ball club first before even talking about another contract. Basically, put his ass under fire again and let’s see if he can win more games next season and advance his club past the 2nd round. I see he has been reading the blogs calling for Fire Woodson! Then again, Sund needs to get him the players to work with.

I think Zaza will be back. I don’t think he cares about starting or not. Unless another team offer much bigger money, I think he will be back.

Those calling for Marvin over Josh must be sick. Josh puts butts in the stands, Marvin does not. I like Marvin, he was having a breakout year until he got injured, but if I had to choose between them, It will be Josh. Marvin isn’t exciting enough and he is too injury prone.

Go Hawks, Go!

Daniel

May 22nd, 2009
3:17 pm

I do hope that we keep Zsa Zsa and Flip. Bibby is a different story depending on the money, but if we don’t get Bibby we need another veteran scorer to compliment Joe. A post defender would be nice too. I love Marvin’s overall game and attitude; I am just worried about his health. If I were to trade any core players, Marvin would be the one to trade because of those injury concerns.

Daniel

May 22nd, 2009
3:21 pm

Mark,
I love Biedrins from Golden State. I have no idea what it would take to get him though. I think he has a nice size contract.

Najeh Davenpoop

May 22nd, 2009
3:25 pm

“And let me ask this: If you had the choice of Al Horford or Hasheem Thabeet at center, which would you take?”

If Thabeet really is the next Mutombo — beyond being 7 feet tall and African — you’d seriously have to consider taking him over Horford despite his offensive shortcomings. But I don’t think Thabeet has the toughness Mutombo had throughout his career. Yeah, he’s tall, athletic, and blocks a ton of shots, but he got punked by more physical players many times throughout this past season. That’s not to say he can’t be a good NBA player, but it would take a while and is no sure thing. Do you trade a double-double machine like Horford for a chance at getting, say, the next Keon Clark as opposed to the next Mutombo? I don’t think so.

“And New Orleans won’t trade Chris Paul. He’s the franchise.”

If the franchise is hemorrhaging money as many have indicated, you have to think they would at least consider it, especially if the Hawks offered a package centered around Joe Johnson (not the same caliber player but only a step or two below) in return. It’s a far-fetched idea but I don’t think it’s as impossible as you think.

Steve

May 22nd, 2009
3:27 pm

As for players, I would love to keep Bibby, Marvin and Flip, but on one condition … we resign ZaZa first. I know some people don’t like him (skin color possibly), but he plays harder than anyone on the team, and puts his body on the line doing the dirty work EVERY single game.

Marvin is still too soft on defense, where he should excel due to his wingspan and agility. I would love to see Marvin get more looks on offense, but that just won’t happen with Bibby and JJ at the guards.

It is time to see if we can trade JJ’s expiring contract for a pick or two, or maybe some other expiring contracts. It sucks, because eh is a great guy, but shooting guards are a dime a dozen in this league and he is more easily replaced than others. Not to mention his being here might be holding back the young talent we have as they all look to him to take the shots. That needs to end.

As for the draft, I would love to see either Lawson or Maynor come here, but we might not get a shot at either. I am not a big fan of Teague, as I was forced to watch far too many ACC games on TV in Atlanta, and he did not look nearly as impressive as Lawson. As long as we don’t take another undersized C or PF I will be happy (in other words, NO TYLER HANSBOROUGH). I am not a big fan of Mullens from OSU either, as he is just too soft and the Hawks need an imposing force down low.

Steve

May 22nd, 2009
3:36 pm

One more thing, I saw on nbadraft.net that they are predicting the Hawks taking Mullins in the first round and a French guard named Beaubois in the second.

I don’t know anything about Beaubois beyond what that site tells me, but he sounds like he is worth a shot. He is at least two years from being NBA ready. The player he most compares to in the NBA is Rajon Rondo according to that site. That’s good enough for me considering college players taken in the second round rarely pan out in the NBA. I am willing to take a gamble on him for two years from now.

I still don’t like the Mullins pick all that much, and that site backed up my thoughts in that he plays far too soft for his size. It does mention he could easily add 20+ pounds and some bulk with the correct training program, but that won’t change him from a timid big man into a dominating personality like Shaq, Alonzo, Ewing or a half dozen others I can think of. He sounds FAR too much like Jon Koncak to me. Sorry to end my post on that note, as I know a bunch of lifelong Hawks fans are reaching for their Tums and Rolaids right about now.

Najeh Davenpoop

May 22nd, 2009
3:39 pm

Bill Simmons seems to agree with me that CP3 is more available than you might think…

David Smith

May 22nd, 2009
3:43 pm

I would rather we draft the best point guard availiable because of how many times we were taken to the hole at will by quicker guards this season. Mike Bibby is a good perimeter shooter but, struggles against younger/quicker guards. I would rather we sign Bibby for two more years and then draft his eventual successor in the draft to learn from him (Acie never had a chance to succeed here so he will want a opportunity to start for another team). We should then trade Claxton, Childress (if we wants to return to the NBA), and Morris for a veteran (or two) post players who are decent enough to allow Horford to move to his idea power forward position (I would dangle Marvin in the mix too if we could get someone pretty decent).

Wink from Lithonia

May 22nd, 2009
3:47 pm

No point rookie point guard will florish with Woodson as coach. Any rookie guard would have to be a strong personality (ie Josh Smith), willing to butt heads with Woodson, exceptional self confidence with talent to match and a longer guaranteed contract than Coach Woodson. Otherwise, we would have to get veterans, like Andre Miller, Jason Kidd, ie Mike Bibby.

O'brien

May 22nd, 2009
3:50 pm

Although I like Bibby’s leadership and shot making, I would not want to sign him for more than 2 years. He is such a defensive liability already, and he doesnt dribble drive/penetrate very well.

Mr. Bradley, you said Zaza wants to be a starter, but that wont happen with Horford here. Interesting, because that was also the problem with Chills. I think he wanted a chance to start, but knew that would never happen with Marvin here.

Steve

May 22nd, 2009
3:50 pm

Wow. Najeh, I would trade every Hawks expiring contract to get CP3 here if he would sign an extension in the deal.

Expiring contracts for Hawks after next year: Johnson, Claxton (thank the maker), Morris (not big enough to even add to a trade).

How about those first two players for CP3 and Tyson Chandler (who NOrleans would likely throw in to balance out the trade money wise to fit the NBA rules).

Man, if the Hawks could in any way make that happen, even if they include the first round pick, it would SOOOOO be worth it. I don’t really think Bill Simmons is right very often though, which means he probably is just blowing smoke about CP3’s situation.

Steve

May 22nd, 2009
3:53 pm

Oh, and before anyone says that the trade I mention is lopsided talent wise, please understand that ‘talent’ is not always the key factor in NBA trades.

I am sure many of you know that expiring contracts are a huge bargaining chip, but some people will see the trade and blow up saying the Hornets wouldn’t trade CP3 for the entire Hawks team or some nonsense like that. Just trying to cut those posts off at the pass.

Najeh Davenpoop

May 22nd, 2009
3:56 pm

CP3 has already signed a long-term extension with New Orleans, so there would be no need to renegotiate that. It’s not that New Orleans would want to trade him. The problem is that they have four long-term deals with mediocre players on their books. Peja Stojakovic and Tyson Chandler are both locked into eight-figure salaries, Morris Peterson is getting paid for three more years to do very little, and I would argue even David West is overpaid. Basically, the team that lost by 58 points at home in the playoffs this year is the team they’re stuck with for the foreseeable future, meaning they have no shot at a title and they are losing money big-time. Logic dictates they are going to have to shake things up, and they only have three players — Julian Wright, James Posey, and CP3 — who can provide a decent return on their investment. If they want a team like the Hawks to take on one or more of their bad contracts, they are probably going to have to dangle CP3 to do so.

MannyT

May 22nd, 2009
4:04 pm

Mr. Bradley, your Horford or Thabeet question has domino effects. I’d want to know who leaves in order for us to get Thabeet.

Someone needs to score the ball in the front court. Marvin & Josh both drive to the basket, but Marvin hits his free throws and shoots from the outside much better. Josh probably does a better job of putting fans in seats than any other current Hawk. Al is probably the better leader of the three.

For this team Thabeet means less front court offense and more reliance on back court scoring…which means you almost have to resign Bibby or Flip has to be more consistent, because there is no one on the bench to score.

Bottom line, we have to lose too much to add Thabeet–either in scoring (Marvin), ticket sales & emotion (Josh) or leadership (Al.)

We will be about 15-19 mil under the cap. Yes you have to factor in charges for draft picks et al, but if you look at it solely as Bibby’s 15 mil, you can get 2 established players for that money. Not stars, but reliable vets. You can play it a variety of ways–pick 2 from the list, 3 if you get them on the cheap. You might even trade a draft pick (& Claxton) away to make this happen. That allows us to use more cap money.

A. Young, quick PG
B. Established combo G (requires PG by committee among Murray, Law, & new guy depending on matchups)
C. Big defensive center (Mahorn like-if he blocks shots, it’s a bonus)
D. Big offensive center (Laimbeer like)

…and give up on Chills. Best case is trade his rights to another team. I think Sund would tell him–I’m just not that into you.

BWAF

chuckw/deadjournalist

May 22nd, 2009
4:08 pm

if this hasn’t been posted – a riot broke out last night in the the euro championships … note chills’ quote:

Former Atlanta Hawks swingman Josh Childress had 23 points for Olympiakos, the home team.

“The violence we saw today, will make me think real hard over my future in Europe,” said Childress, who signed a 3-year deal worth $20 million with Olympiakos in July.

chuckw/deadjournalist

May 22nd, 2009
4:08 pm

if this hasn’t been posted – a riot broke out last night in the the greek finals … note chills’ quote:

Former Atlanta Hawks swingman Josh Childress had 23 points for Olympiakos, the home team.

“The violence we saw today, will make me think real hard over my future in Europe,” said Childress, who signed a 3-year deal worth $20 million with Olympiakos in July.

MannyT

May 22nd, 2009
4:09 pm

Steve, I think you can get Tyson Chandler in a trade. I do not think you can get CP3 in a trade. The package does not matter.

The GMs that make those (trade away a superstar) deals always end up getting fired or leaving the team. Dumars will be the exception because he got a superstar back (short term) and he gets to remake the team due to Iverson’s expiring contract. If he fails in that remake, he will join the list of future ex-GMs sooner than later.

BWAF

Ben

May 22nd, 2009
4:10 pm

Is the Australian we drafted in 2002, David Anderson, ever going to play for the Hawks?

Wouldn’t we trade Childress’ rights, if he wants to come back to the NBA? Doubt he would play for us. So we also can trade Speedy’s expiring contract and Acie Law.

cj

May 22nd, 2009
4:11 pm

Just a comment on J-smoove, Marvin comparison. J-smoove is a difference maker, he is also an inside player who often thinks he is an outside player. Marvin can actually make outside shots consistently but his drive attempts tend to be a bull in a china shop type drive. J-smoove is an inside defensive presence, Marvin is an outside defensive player. They both are good, but to compare the two is like comparing apples to oranges. I believe that if Marvin can learn to be more under control on his drives, btw he has shown some improvement in that area, he has the potential to be a very, very good player and a difference maker.

MannyT

May 22nd, 2009
4:12 pm

ChuckW…Does that riot matter one bit to Sund?

He’s still not into Chills. With leverage, he might offer him nothing more than his tender amount which was a bit over $3 mil last summer. Chills can come back on the cheap with a trade to another team or he can ask David Beckham et al how the Euro footballers deal with riots.

BWAF

chuckw/deadjournalist

May 22nd, 2009
4:26 pm

MannyT – long time. some thoughts:

lots of dominos, but looking at the teams in the east, the hawks need the following to compete with the big three of the C’s, Magic and Lebron’s:

1) a shut-down swing defender. why? paul pierce, d. wade, lebron
2) a banging big-man who knows how to use his body. why? d. howard, big z and k.g.
3) an effective point defender/slasher. why? rando and mo williams

without a superstar, and without an offensive identity, the hawks showed they can be shut down offensively. unless they finally bring over andersen and shock the world and sign ben gordon, this team is going to have to win by playing defense, defense, defense.

with that said, here are some thoughts about the current hawks in flux:

zaza – if he will play for the same money he’s been getting and if the team doesn’t bring andersen over, then he should be resigned. his game is far from perfect, but who’s out there that’s realistically better as the number two center?

marvin – tough call because he’s got a lot of tools but he doesn’t seem to have that killer instinct to be anything more than a supporting player. with that said, i wonder if he might not blossom coming off the bench.

flip – he has to be resigned unless gordon is added. without him the hawks bench couldn’t score with lindsay lohan.

bibby – i see the results. i see how effective he was at times in the playoffs. but i don’t trust what i see. if a legit co-point that can slash and defend could be signed, then bring him back to play 25 mins a game. he gives up what he gets. maybe he’s a good locker room leader, which would tip the scales toward trying to re-sign him.

childress – at least five times during the playoffs all i could think of was how much the hawks needed j. chill. while it sounds like sund isn’t a childress fan, he’d address a lot of needs on this team. he’s so active without the ball …

andersen – bring the big man over already! he’s be such a good addition to this team. size, the ability to shoot the ball, and he’s experienced.

chuckw/deadjournalist

May 22nd, 2009
4:31 pm

MannyT –

childress is still an asset, whether with the hawks or as a trade piece. the fact that he’s unnerved by the riots might push him back to the NBA either her or elsewhere. and if he does decide to come back, that’s good for the hawks – one way or the other.

MannyT

May 22nd, 2009
4:32 pm

Najeh,

I checked out your boy The Sports Guy’s doomsday scenario for moving CP3. While the trade machine numbers might work, Houston would send 4 startes to the Hornets (McGrady, Brooks, Battier, & Scola) while getting CP3, Posey and 2 lead contracts (Peja S. & Tyson C.)

Houston has Yao and CP3. Chandler doesn’t start above Yao and between the 2 you get maybe 82 games as both keep getting injured. Artest is a free agent, so you have essentially gutted your team to get CP3. I don’t see it happening on the Houston end.

Even if the Hornets are cash desparate, do they send away the franchise or do they have a fire sale on the bad contracts? Look at the Knicks this year. They moved to a better contact position without giving up the farm. Why wouldn’r New Orleans go that route before shipping off their top player?

Simmons likes these type of trades. He’s probably a hoot in fantasy leagues. Big trades and sub 500 record.

BWAF

diego

May 22nd, 2009
4:33 pm

I’m hearing that Washington wants to trade their 5th pick, any chance we could trade Marvin Williams? I know, wishful thinking.

I do think the Hawks should talk with Portland and try to land Sergio Rodriguez. He would be great off the bench behind Bibby. And/Or we could try and sign Jarrett Jack.

chuckw/deadjournalist

May 22nd, 2009
4:46 pm

diego – i don’t think washington would trade the pick within their division.

i do like sergio, and i think he’d be a nice fit if portland would want to move him.

truth-serum

May 22nd, 2009
4:52 pm

Trade ZAZA “watch this turnover and the expressway to the basket is now open” Pachulia, along with Mark Bradley and Rick Sund (dumb and Mo dumb)for a 26th round pick.

Marvin will be a star and gets to the line and the rack better than JJ.He can shoot outside. You must remember he only played one year of college ball. If he had stayed four years he be in his second year now. The dude will be a star and a terror, As will Josh who came straight out of high school and would be a rookie if he had went to college. Those two are worth every penny and Josh will develop a shot!

Marvin,Josh,Horford,flip and JJ. Thats the TEAM, Now go get us a center!

Big Ray

May 22nd, 2009
4:55 pm

Mark,

Great blog.

Re-sign Bibby. Let Law go. Okay, fine. But the plan better be more complete than “we’ll just let Flip play 30 mpg behind Bibby and Joe.”

Flip, for the upteenth time, plays better off the ball than as a backup pg. Let Law go, and there needs to be an alternative. By the way, I’m okay with letting him go. Just replace him with somebody that fits.

It amuses the heck out of me to think that some people value Marvin Williams over Josh Smith. Yeah maybe in a vaccum (or with a more balanced roster). Josh is not more expendable than Marvin by any stretch of the imagination. All you hear is that Marvin is more coachable, Marvin is smarter, Marvin is this, Marvin is that.

Marvin is a lot of things, but he is not more valuable as an asset to this team. If he was, then why are people talking about re-signing him for $8 mil per year? Why did we have a losing record with Josh, while Marvin’s absence down the stretch of the regular season was barely a hiccup?

I’ll agree that Marvin makes a more prototypical SF. He’s a steady guy, and he’s better than his stats indicate. Josh may be as good as his stats indicate, but that statement alone is not a complete one…unless of course, you think that Josh absolutely cannot get any better than he is now. I, for one, do not believe that. Josh has greater trade value, despite the greater amount of money that he makes (over Marvin). That alone tells you the deal…

But all of this doesn’t matter. What matters is that “keeping everybody together” is an idealistic assumption that conveniently forgets that there has to be better chemistry and utilization of resources. Otherwise, watch the whole thing go backward.

O'brien

May 22nd, 2009
4:56 pm

Ont thing to keep in mind with Chills. If he does not come back to the NBA this season, he will be an unrestricted free agent next ofseason. Therefore, it is imperative that the Hawks either bring him back, or trade his rights this year, because next year we will get nothing in return.

Chills was good on this team, because he would get a key offensive rebound/putback, and he hustled. I think he would have been a good fit playing with Flip and Zaza on the second team.

benzo a town

May 22nd, 2009
5:07 pm

I would like to see Marvin, Horford, Smith become the big 3 in the next few years so i say we keep marvin. Try to get a good point guard like Maynor or Flyn. Sign Bibby for a few more years let him be there mentor. Try to get a big man for ZaZa and Mo and the rights to J chill.

C – Horford
pf – Smoove
sf – williams
sg – Johnson
pg- Maynor

Bench
Bibby
flip
west
hunter
gardner
rasheed wallace

Marcus

May 22nd, 2009
5:14 pm

MB
I kinda agre with you: if the Hawks can get a quality PG at #19 to groom to replace Bibby, Acie Law is outta there.
I don’t think we go BIG, as we have a lot of 3 and 4 type players, either on the roster or even holding their draft or contract rights, BJ Mullens does not seem to be worth a 1st round pick (heavy potential but didn’t even dominate as FR, at least he could have been Gred Oden part II befoer declaring for the draft ),and as always if we have a brain fart and draft/trade for a starting C, there is the domino effect of who becomes your starting SF, PF and what to do with all the wing players?

Marcus

May 22nd, 2009
5:18 pm

MB,
maybe your recent post just answered my question, but in one of the blogs (yours or Sekou’s) it was mentioned that someone with the Hawks said they didn’t miss chhildess during teh rg. seson, but in the playoffs definitely he was missed.
Why it that?
Was it because of the injury situation (depth)
or
some intangible that he would have brought to the playoffs that wasn’t necessarily missed/obvious during the reg. season?

Saabotager

May 22nd, 2009
5:23 pm

Gortat (center) in Orlando will come cheap. Keep Marvin. Let Bibby go and pick up Duhon from New York. We will definitely compete next year.

BigEasy830

May 22nd, 2009
5:31 pm

No way Mavin takes 6-7 mill per, not even in this economy. Marvin’s a nice guy but the spite factor will definitely kick in if he is offered that and he will kick rocks. I see him wanting around 9. But, Sund did a great job by not signing anyone to extensions, hopefully the economy is so bad Marvin is offered only only 6-7 and Bibby offered around 6, Then it is a win situation for the Hawks. But, since Marvin is younger, he may want to go to another team where he will have a bigger role in the offense and hit a bigger lick on his next contract. We will see. if we lose ZaZa we will not have a 7 footer to bang with the big guys, if we overspend on anyone it has to be ZaZa, there just isn’t any big men out there. We need to keep him.

SWAT Native

May 22nd, 2009
5:34 pm

@ Mac: “Moses Malone and Reggie Theus are just the pieces to get us over the top”

That’s cold, man, but dead on target. The Hawks need to keep their core intact and add to it as history has shown us.

glw

May 22nd, 2009
5:42 pm

No way New ORleans moves CP, he is too important and the face of their franchise. But I can see them moving Chandler. And I feel we have the pieces that it would take to get them. Chandler is on the books for about 11.8 next year. If we offer Claxton and the rights for Josh Childress, Randolph Morris ( a big body to help replace Chandler) and a future no. 1 draft pick. New Orleans could buyout Speedy for maybe 2 million and choose to let Childress rights expire if they like, they could save themselves a lot of money. Atlanta could get the physical interior defender they need, which makes Zaza expendable.

Reggie

May 22nd, 2009
5:43 pm

Mark

Do you think there is value around the league in a Marvin Williams? I think he can still get better. On this team he is a 13-15 ppg player. On another team where he has more of a load I think he can be a 17-19 ppg player. thoughts?

ILL-logical

May 22nd, 2009
5:45 pm

How about Andrew Bynum at $12.5 million and Jordan Farmar at $ 1.9 million for Joe Johnson at $ 14.9 million. Joe runs the triangle ( see Ron Harper) which the Lakers need badly and the Hawks get a center and a point guard. Marvin plays the 2 and we get bigger,faster and over time better.

Dr. Dave

May 22nd, 2009
5:46 pm

Gortat is a beast and would be an excellent, inexpensive pickup.
We need to keep Marvin because his upside is huge. There are very few 6′10″ players in the league who can shoot jumpers as well as him, and his rebounding has improved as he has matured. I am waiting for someone, ANYONE, in the Hawks organization to tell Josh Smith that he will be benched if he shoots beyond 15 feet. Once he learns what he can’t do he will be a better player and we can become more serious about getting out of the first round.

Big Ray

May 22nd, 2009
5:55 pm

Yeah, Josh should never learn to shoot from anywhere beyond a certain point. After all, he will always have that supreme athletic ability, and expanding your game is bad for you.

If we let Zaza walk, we’ll definitely need to get a guy like Gortat.

Big Ray

May 22nd, 2009
5:59 pm

Marvin definitely has some value. How much is the question. Could be a sign-and-trade in all of this. Maybe….

DP

May 22nd, 2009
6:04 pm

I’d like to see the Hawks move up into the 10–12 range in the draft to take DuJuan Blair if he’s still available. The guy is a beast on the boards, has the body to defend bigs and has a 7 foot plus wingspan. He ate Thabeet’s lunch this year head to head.

Bibby is far better than what the Hawks had before, but in the halfcourt he effectively plays the 2, sitting on the 3 point line while forcing Joe Johnson to handle the ball. I would like to have a legitimate penetrating point guard to allow Johnson to play off the ball more like Ray Allen. But everybody wants those kind of point guards.

West Coast Hawks Fan

May 22nd, 2009
6:20 pm

I’ve been thinking long and hard about what the Hawks should or should not do to take the next step to become one of the elite teams in the NBA. Everyone on this blog has made excellent points. Here’s my take on things. Change the offensive system. The Hawks need to run and gun. They can be like the Warriors of a couple of years ago when they upset Dallas as a #8 seed in the playoffs. The difference being the Hawks play defense. There isn’t one team in the eastern conference that runs on a consistent basis. We could run teams out the gym. My next point is bring in a center that can run and block shots a la Tyson Chandler. Al Horford then could move to his natural position at the 4 spot. That brings me to my next point. Josh Smith can play the three spot. He needs to get in the gym and develop a consistent jumper if that happens watch out there won’t be a three in the east that can check him including Mr. James. Mike Bibby needs to go. The Hawks need a lead guard that penetrates more to set up his bigs and that won’t be a defensive liability. I believe Rafer Alston is a free agent after this season. He would be perfect for the new Hawks run and gun offense. He penetrates well and he moves his feet well on defense. We would have one the best benches in the league. We should bring back Josh Childress if Marvin doesn’t want to accept his neew role off the bench. That’s a lot if this and if that but these are my opinions.

glw

May 22nd, 2009
6:52 pm

I have the ultimate fantasy and right now its just pure fantasy. But suppose the Lakers get blitzed by Denver, Kobe gets mad, opts out of his contract and becomes a free agent. The Hawks are currently at just under 41 million and the cap figures to be maybe around 57-58 million. Then we dump Speedy Claxton on someone, that leaves us about 22-23 million of cap space. Does anyone get where I am going with this?

PG BIBBY
SG KOBE
SF J JOHNSON
PF J SMITH
C A HORFORD

BENCH

FLIP
MO EVANS
ZAZA
ACIE LAW

UGABAN1111

May 22nd, 2009
6:52 pm

CAN PEOPLE STOP SAYING BIBBY CANT PLAY D. DAMN WE KNOW THAT BUT THE REASON HE CANT PLAY D IS BECUASE WE PLAY SWITCH DEFENSE. WE CAN HAVE CHRIS PAUL AS OUR PG BUT IF THEY PICK AND ROLL AND PAUL IS LEFT ON LEBRON OR ANY SG HE WILL GET TORCHED TOO. IF WE PLAY STR8 UP DEFENSE AND ROTATE QUICK INSTEAD OF SWITCHING WE WOULD BE WAY BETTER!!!!!

AND STOP SAYING TRADE MARVIN, DAMN HE GOT HURT FOR THE FIRST TIME AND PEOPLE JUST WANNA TRADE HIM, I DNT HEAR PEOPLE SAYING TRADE HORFORD SHID HE GOT HURT TOO!!! AND STOP SAYING HORFORD IS SOOO GOOD, TO ME HE DOENT EVEN DO NOTHING. HE HAS NO LOST POST MOVES AND IS AN UNDERSIZED CENTER. IF ANYTHANG TRADE HORFORD.

James

May 22nd, 2009
6:55 pm

keep zaza and flip murray and get rid of marvin williams, acie law and soloman jones.

Atlanta Journal Constitution » Blog Archive » How the Atlanta Hawks just might stay together after all

May 22nd, 2009
7:10 pm

[...] Mark Bradley | ajc.com – [...]

RealSquawk

May 22nd, 2009
7:47 pm

Marc,

One of the interesting things you got out of Mr. Sund was that he was fine with the Hawk’s size. Which, makes me think and correct me if I am wrong, that Al Horford is our long term solution at Center.

That is one scenario the other is that he plans to acquire a center and slide everyone down putting Josh Smith as a sixth man in a Lamar Odom role.

That would make the team extremely dangerous if all the pieces fall in the right place. bibby, Joe, Marvin, Horford, Center

2nd unit. flip, josh, mo, josh, zaza, david anderson.

That seems like fantasy, but it is possible and would be extremely dangerous.

I still don’t agree with the whole Marvin Josh debate, but only time will tell so I am going to sit back and be patient.

ET

May 22nd, 2009
8:38 pm

I think we should trade our rights for draft pick Pal Gasol to get J.R. Rider… that will take us over the top. (Or was it for Harrington? I get confused!!!)

freshd

May 22nd, 2009
8:52 pm

Hey Bradley, COURTNEY LEE was the 22nd pick in the 2008 draft and he is starting for ORLANDO in the playoffs against the LEBRONS. I don’t RICK SUND”S theory on playing rookies. Why don”t he ust say WOODY prefers vets. Oh yeah, LEE is averaging 12 points per game in the playoffs.

freshd

May 22nd, 2009
8:53 pm

buy

brewdawg

May 22nd, 2009
9:51 pm

Mark,

Jeff S. has a good article on our favorite debate topic. I highly recommend reading it.

dap01

May 22nd, 2009
10:52 pm

Forget drafting anybody. Woody will be playing for another contract, forget developing anyone, forget an offense. Let’s have a statue PG in Bibby and a pound, pound, pound SG offense.

Hopefully Sund will have a couple of tricks up his sleeve. Get us a defensive center, a veteran PG, develop AC and pick up another shooter like Jarvis Hayes.

dap01

May 22nd, 2009
10:54 pm

By the way, great coverage MB!

Miles D

May 23rd, 2009
12:29 am

I say resign everybody! However, JS is the most expendable. He STILL can’t consistently hit the mid-range J after 5 years in the league and makes too many mistakes in critical situations TRYING to be something he’s not a SUPERSTAR…hell he’s not even a STAR…just an ATHELETE! At this point we need much more and I just don’t believe he is the one. I mean you do the math! 1. Bad attitude. 2. ALWAYS into it with coach. 3. STILL making poor decisions with the baskeball. and 4. NOT really a 3 but NOT really a 4…then what the hell is he! I say trade him in the draft, get Thabeet, and lets get on with it! I just gives OUR TEAM an identity something our TRUE fans desperatley have been wanting and need! OH! And by the way…I am FROM Atlanta! College Park to be exact!

MannyT

May 23rd, 2009
12:38 am

chuckw…O’brien nailed the core of the Chills problem. He has to opt out of that Olympiakos contract this summer for the Hawks to get any value for him. Bottom line, I think both Chills and Sund would say I’m just not that into you.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/2009-05-22-373411029_x.htm

I am a Chills fan, but I don’t see it happening in Atlanta unless he has found an outside shot and 30 lbs of muscle.

You bring up valid points about the defensive needs of the team.

As for the shut down defender, unless there is someone out there you see on the cheap that is big enough (height AND weight) to defend Lebron, Marvin is one of the best available. Not that he is a star defender, but he has gotten better. He also makes those guys work on defense.

The banging big man might slow down Howard, but it’s too hard to stop him. I am not worried about Big Z’s inside game, but he easily shoots over our bigs. Josh has to slow down KG, but Al is not big enough to move the fire plug, Kendrick Perkins–who will rebound, but not drop 20 on us. Orlando has a choice to make, pay Hedu and the luxury tax or let him go. If they pay Hedu, Gortat (or more likely Battie in magic beans trade) might be available. If not him, that’s where you look to deal the Claxton contract and possibly AC Law to get a big man.

The on ball defender solution has options. As I mentioned before, you can try to go big with another combo guard that can run the point…check out what Shelden’s brother in law (Anthony Parker) did when Calderon was out in Toronto. Might find similar success with Marquis Daniel (Indy) in a trade.

If it is Sund’s preference, we can also find our own speed demon (TJ Ford available? They started the less expensive RFA, Jarrett Jack toward the end of the season.)

FYI–One benefit of being the 2nd pick, Marvin’s one year tender is over 7 mil.

BWAF

hawksfan4life

May 23rd, 2009
12:43 am

Please don’t resign Mike Bibby: HE CAN’T PLAY D!!!!!!!!!!!!!

dap01

May 23rd, 2009
7:38 am

The reason I say that Bibby can not play defense if because he is slow and not physical at all. He is the least agile guard in the NBA. He can’t jump at all.

I like Bibby and I want him back. The point that I would like to make is Woody will never use Bibby as the role player that he is. Woody will run him in the ground (with Joe) just like this year because with with Bibby and Joe, no offense if required, simply jack up the 3’s.

Bibby will be very valuable as a 20 mpg guard but that is all.

TJ

May 23rd, 2009
7:52 am

Mark, how much money will the Hawks receive from the league (TV contract, etc.)? I am curious what percentage of the payroll is covered by shared revenues.

new cars

May 23rd, 2009
9:20 am

Would we be better with Bibby and no Marvin or with Marvin and someone like Jarrett Jack at the point…We may miss some of Bibby’s big shots, but we would be able to keep Flip and get a little more out of the other guys with more of a pure point guard…Everyone keeps talking about Chris Paul and I would love to have him, but I have my doubts about that working out…But what about Raymond Felton from Charlotte…Good citizen, good all-around point guard who can push, distribute and score…If we could take an assett and get him, then we could take the draft pick and take someone like Terrence Williams from Louisville who could give Joe a breather and extend our bench….On another subject…I hope they have a backup plan if Woody refuses to use his bench early in the year and continues to wear out the first 7…That was part of the problem in the playoffs.

James Banks

May 23rd, 2009
9:53 am

SI’s Ian Thomsen thinks the Hawks need another all-star to go with Joe Johnson in order to reach the championship contender level. If that’s true, could the Answer be the answer for the Hawks?

Think about this starting five: Allen Iverson and JJ in the backcourt with Marvin, Smooth and Horford up front?

Mike

May 23rd, 2009
10:26 am

Mark, the one-year qualifying offer for Marvin is 7.3 million, not 6-plus. That’s what makes working out a deal so hard. Do the Hawks really want to offer him a multi-year deal worth, say 8 or more million a year? Probably not, especially with questions about his back. But he probably won’t sign a multi-year deal that gives him an average salary less than the 7.3 he gets just by accepting the qualifying offer.

braveshater

May 23rd, 2009
10:28 am

Marvin has terrible feet and balance, therefore will never be more than a 3rd option on any team. We should trade him, Acie, the 19th pick, Childress, and cash to New Orleans for Chris Paul.

MBZ

May 23rd, 2009
11:23 am

Marcin Gortat is someone we need to target. He is,unlike Pachulia, very athletic and could turn into a defensive force of the bench. Our lack of size really hurt us in the playoffs and he is probably the best finisher at the rim available outside of B.J. Mullens, whose draft stock is going to rise considerably. Mike Bibby cannot run this team. It is far more likely that the pg spot is run by committee but flip isnt the guy that should do it. He plays best off the ball. Eric Maynor is too good to drop to us at 19. I think that this team can grow from the inside but it has to do primarily with coaching. The offense can be run through Marvin Williams at certain times during the game, Josh smith needs to work on his MID RANGE Joe needs to be not run into the ground just for the Hawks to make the post season. But that takes a coach that cares about developing his bench and trusting Acie Law to do what he was drafted to do…run this team. Free up the offense, move the ball, sign some bangers inside, and play/develop the bench. and Sund’s phone will be ringing off the hook in the offseason of 2010.

ILL-logical

May 23rd, 2009
11:34 am

Watching last night’s game-playoff basketball at its best,inspite of the officiating-made wonder if Josh Smith had a coach who was invested in his devlopment like Mike Brown is in LaBron’s, where could the Hawks be today.

A bit of history.Josh was drafted as a 3but woodson put him at 4 to get his athletic skills on the floor for HIS system to work. I don’t recall any public comments about improving shot selection or ball handling skills .
Now back to the present. I hope that Josh was watching the game and imaging how his team could be engaged in a series of this magnitutde and motivate himself to do the work that will take his athletic skills ,equal in many respects to LBJ’s, and solicit help in developing his game just as LBJ has done over the years. Not to equate what Josh with LBJ but to point out to some of the short history participants on this board, that LBJ coudn’t hit the outside shot and was a mediocre foul shooter earlier in his career. Plus he had to play in effect three posistions on a just fair team.

Josh doesn’t have to be the whole show here nor do I believe that he wants to. However, he can be a feared offensive weapon at the 3 because of his physical advantages over almost everyone but LBJ. With a better and more consistant shooting touch he can increase the offensive capability of the team while continuing to be the energy ,crowd exciter that he is today.

Last night LBJ made me sit up and take notice of how far he has come beyond the media hype and how hard he worked for it.and the role his coach had in growing and developing him as a player and a leader. A great lesson for all of us sports fan or not.

Sautee

May 23rd, 2009
12:47 pm

MannyT,

So am I hearing you right…. let Bibby walk and use that 15M elsewhere?

Jody

May 23rd, 2009
1:10 pm

Mark,

Do you think that if Marvin Williams decides he wants more than the Hawks are willing to pay him, they might consider someone like Charlie V., a free agent of the Bucks who’s a great outside shooter, instead?

J-MAN

May 23rd, 2009
1:35 pm

I’d trade Joe Johnson, Acie Law, and Zaza and the #19 pick to Memphis for Rudy Gay the #2 pick and Marc Gasol if we could get him and draft Tabieet because we GOT KILLED and HAVE BEEN KILLED in getting rebounds the past 10 years and the Cleveland series show our flaw to the whole world and if we resign Bibby for 6 mil for 2 years and give Marvin a J-Smoove type contract and give flip about 5 mil for 2 years will work for me

O'brien

May 23rd, 2009
2:00 pm

I’m sorry, but if we continue to play Josh at the 4 and Al at the 5, we will always be undersized (how do we match up with Denver, Lakers, Houston, Magic, Celtics, Cavaliers etc). regardless of what Sund thinks).

One reason for keeping Josh is if he ever gets his head together, and develops a consistent jumper (even if it’s only 15-18 ft), can you imagine the mismatches he would create on offense? And although his man defense needs improvement, he has very good help defense. Plus if he ever played for a coach who had an offensive system, and knew how to use him, the sky is the limit for Josh.

In my opinion, the sky is not the limit for Marvin. Although he still has room for improvement, he is what he is. And I dont think he will ever live up to the potential that BK (or Dominique) saw in him.

That being said, if we can trade Josh for a combo (2 out of 3) of legit Center/PG/draft pick, then I think Sund should look at it seriously…

Jody

May 23rd, 2009
2:15 pm

Mark,

It would make sense for Charlie V. to be an option because, offensively, I think the Hawks would benefit from having a big who could draw opposing bigs away from the basket and possibly force other teams to have to guard Josh Smith or Al Horford in the post single coverage and sometimes with smaller players.

Jesse

May 23rd, 2009
5:34 pm

We need Darren Collison or Chase Budinger (let Marvin go or sign & trade). Collison is a VERY VERY good FT shooter. I’ll really miss Mike Bibby and his veteran leadership/knowledge. I hope we can keep Flip Murray and keeping Zaza is must.

Sautee

May 23rd, 2009
6:03 pm

Mark, don’t misunderstand me. I NEVER thought Bibby would get even $10M.

Manny had posted earlier (if I read him right) that money towards Bibby’s salary would be better spent elsewhere. At least that what I THOUGHT he was saying.

And he mentioned $15M because that was what we paid THIS year, and therefore IF we were letting him walk, AND were willing to spend the same amount overall, then…. you get the picture.

Manny?

Ken Strickland

May 23rd, 2009
9:15 pm

Why do people keep saying the Hawks are undersized? The Phoenix Suns were one of the winningest teams in basket when they we, so called, undersized. It wasn’t until they decided to get bigger that they started to faulter. They were at their best when their tallest starter was 6′10″ C AStaudamire, and their next tallest starters were 6′7″ SG JJohnson and 6′7″ PF SMarion.

The Phenomenal One

May 23rd, 2009
10:15 pm

Eric Maynor or Ty Lawson would definitely be a good look for the Hawks! Fingers crossed that they’ll still be around when the 19th pick comes up. No more forwards please. So Terrence Williams from Louisville is a no go in my book. N-O M-O-R-E F-O-R-W-A-R-D-S!

Jody

May 23rd, 2009
10:17 pm

Ken,

Here’s a few reasons why:

1. The tale of the tape in comparison to other teams who are still playing shows the Hawks are undersized.

2. The fact the Hawks struggled to rebound the ball throughout the regular season and in the playoffs shows they are undersized.

3. They struggle to get easy baskets in the half-court set which great teams do not.

4. All of those Phoenix Suns teams were built to win alot of regular season games but never won a title. When playoff time came, they struggled to defend the painted area which always got them ousted. If the Hawks goal is to win a title someday, they need to build the team in the mold of an actual champion and not a team who simply won alot of games and nothing more.

Truth-serum

May 23rd, 2009
10:27 pm

J-MAN

May 23rd, 2009
1:35 pm

I find it hard to believe that the playoff and the season clearly demonstrated out inability to defend the post….In case Sund or Mo dumb Bradley are reading defending the post in Basketball is a-kin to defended the goal in soccer or the goal in hockey or football or for that matter most sports… lets start with fundamentals: to defend the post means to alter shots,block shots, pull down offensive rebounds and force the opposing center to the high post or the perimeter. As in chess center control is dominating….My bad Im trying to get Mo dumb with Sund’s attention, im sure he doesnt understand chess. Horford is a good pf and can give you minutes at the center post but is not longstanding match for a true NBA center. For all you Z”the expressway to the bucket is now open” supporter, the man had the starting job as center with the hawks. He lost it because he cant man the position. Ill grant him that he is physically a NBA center and he pushes and shoves with the best of them but he cant Man the position and it seems that he is a continuous turnover. Dude. Let it go. He cant Hold the post and he lost his starting Job to a powerfoward. Just keeping it real.

Back to fundamentals, on the offensive end you want to move the opposing center off the low block and open lanes for your slashers like marvin and josh and joe…that way you wont find Josh deep on the wing because the other teams seven footer is clogging the middle. This normally requires some weight on your center someting Horford does not have. Your center must also finish consistantly in the low block something Zaza cannot do and something Horford cant do against the big men and he must resort to his lane shot,. The reason this is imperative, Dumb and Mo Dumb, is that it forces the other team to drop down into the low post to defend and there by making the range of outside shots smaller and the percentage of made shots higher.

There is a role for Marvin who can go 2 or 3 and can draw the fouls Joe cant. 3 years from now Joe wont be in Marvins league. Joe is Good and still the lead man. He can do it all. Theres room enough for Josh and Horford because they play different roles. Joshs plays 3 and 4 horford plays 4 and 5. They blend very well together and if they had a center like the U-Conn center or even the back up from Chicago Grey, Shaq has 3 strong years left and proved this year he can still take over a game when the shots dont fall he can and will dominate any center in the post. With shaq on this squad this is a final four team no doubt. Yeah, he can run and open lanes for the J and H assualt team.
Camby is still a great pick!! There or lots of true centers available that can finish and defend the post. So stop whinning saying there arent any. Do your home work.

The bottom line is you wont get past the second round with Horford as your pf playing center and for sure you may not get out of the first round with Z top this turnover Pachulia.

Here is the nucleus of the team, J.J. Josh, Marvin, flip and Horford and Woody (just keeping it real). Build around this crew. Get them a center and were in the final four…. with what you have in salary cap room and trade material with Bibby(sign and trade), Za”have you seen this turnover before”Za,Acie law, solomon,and the GA tech guard you can get a good center another point and money left over.

Woody did his job even though you insulted him with your lack of a contract offer.
Now do your and get him a CENTER!

Sam Wetherson

May 23rd, 2009
11:45 pm

Yeah I have to agree Truth Serum. People are really under estimating Marvin Williams. The guy is super efficient and seems to have enough sense to drive to the basket when his shot isn’t falling. JJ has to many 7-24 nights. I mean at what point do you stop shooting. Josh SMith is the better athlete but Marvin Williams is the better play and is a lot smarter. Josh Smith will not play to his strenghts. His blocks were way down this year. We better keep MArvin Williams!!!

Steve

May 24th, 2009
4:01 am

Oh man, please tell me JChill is staying in Europe. I don’t want him ANYWHERE near this team. His ’show up one game out of three’ skills can’t touch Evans or Flip. Our bench is why we were SO much better this year, and that was without the most overrated player in the NBA from last year.

Look, JChill was scrappy when he tried, but for every lose rebound he got under the basket, he let his man beat him down court at least twice for easy baskets. Just because he made some nice offensive rebounds and putbacks on a highlight reel, everyone overlooked the fact his penchant for sneaking to the basket left the fast break WIDE open for the other team. Maybe if JJ and Bibby didn’t stand around watching so much it would have been ok, but I was getting so tired of seeing JSmith being the only one getting back on D whenever JChill was in the game. I can’t figure out why so few other people noticed that. Evans played much better for the Hawks, though it would be hard to notice because he wasn’t on the highlight reels every game. There is more to basketball than a few offensive putbacks.

Oh, and just because CP3 is a star, it doesn’t make him untouchable. They are losing so much money there right now that they are going ot have to do something or close the whole thing down. He is the main thing keeping them in the top half of the NBA in attendance, but they are just not getting money from the corporate level that they need.

It boggles my mind how good the attendance is in New Orleans/OKC, and it’s all because of CP3. If there is any chance at all of him being available, the Hawks had better be all over it. They have as much young talent and expiring contracts as almost ANY other NBA team, so they really would have no excuse not to get involved in talks at the very least.

Veteran Fan

May 24th, 2009
11:24 am

Let Bibby and Zaza go and find a younger free agent pg. Trade Josh and Law for Chris Bosh. Sign Gortat and resign Murray and Marvin. Or trade #19 and Marvin to Memphis for Conley. Line up Bosh, Horford, and Gortat rotate at 4 and 5. Johnson,Murray, and Marvin rotate at 2 and 3 and new pg and Evans rotate at 1. Good defensive matchups and plenty of offense and rebounding! Bibby is an expensive luxury whose legs are done and Josh could put people in the stands in Toronto and Bosh wants out. If you keep #19 draft like you would normally.

Mitch

May 24th, 2009
11:33 am

Mark, maybe I’m wrong, but if I were the Hawks, I would make every effort to keep Zaza and Bibby, and if need be, let Williams and Murray go.

The way I see it is this: Zaza is the big man in the middle, needed for presence/defense, etc. While we know that Bibby can be off at times, the guy is also an explosive scorer at times. While we know that teams can win championships with only two scorers, (Shaq and Kobe, Michael and Scottie). Bibby to me is in his prime, and just too valuable to be allowed to walk away.

Keep Zaza and Bibby, or, if you can only keep one, then keep Bibby. This team has had a such a long, difficult climb to respectablity, that it would be pitiful to see them take signifcant steps backwards, due to losing major free agents.

Mitch

Ken Strickland

May 24th, 2009
12:00 pm

JODY-our frontline’s so called lack of size isn’t the reason for our rebounding woes.

(1)The poor positioning of our frontline players is a major problem. Woodson has gone almost exclusively to a switching DEF and teams have learned to take advantage of it. They use pick and rolls with their PG/SG’s and C/PF to force a switch and mismatch. That’s why we consistently see JSmith, AHorford, ZPachulia or SJones(when he plays) isolated away from the basket trying to defend against players like DWade, CPaul, LJames or KBryant. The switch also leaves our PG’s and SG’s trying to defend and rebound against their C’s and PF’s. We accomadate teams attempts to create mismatches against us by not even trying to fight over picks. Is there any wonder why we consistently get pounded on the boards?

(2)When you consistently play your frontline heavy mins during the season it’s not surprising to see them become leg weary and outrebounded over the course of the season. Against Both Cleveland and Miami Woodson chose to battle their frontline by forcing heavy mins on ZPachulia, JSmith, MEvans, and injured players like AHorford and MWilliams, rather than play our healthy bigs like OHunter, SJones or even RMorris. Even when Zaza was ejected in gm 3, and we were getting pounded with him in the gm, Woodson refused to give his remaining frontline players any relief by using the remaining BIGS on his bench.

(3)When you have a PG that plays a matador type of DEF and is unable to offer any type of DEF pressure on the ball, it forces your frontline players to have to cover by rotating to his man, which takes them out of rebounding position and often creates foul difficulty for them.

Having weary legs from being overused and playing a DEF that allows your frontline players to be consistently taken out of rebounding position has far more to do with our rebounding issues than our so called lack of size or height. JSmith’s blocked shots are way down because he’s not able to rotate over and protect the basket since far too often he’s out on the floor trying to guard quicker faster PG’s and SG’s.

Everyone has complained about him being out on the perimeter shooting 3’s when we should also complain about him having to be in the same position on DEF. Look, we managed to win 47gms with a flawed OFF/DEF system, as well as limited strategy and bench use. That tells me this team is talented enough, tall enough and big enough to do even better if it can overcome all of that. They just need better direction and an OFF/DEF system that better utilizes their talents.

jhan

May 24th, 2009
12:23 pm

Ken – I can’t disagree with your reasoning. It just makes sense. Even though I believe this team still needs 2 more big bodies off the bench. I suppose Woody will have to actually play them.

Mitch – where was Bibby during the playoffs? Can you really count on him to produce when we need it the most? He totally disappeared when we needed him this season

Sautee

May 24th, 2009
3:09 pm

Ken S

Big co-sign on that, buddy!

Truth-serum

May 24th, 2009
3:22 pm

Veteran Fan

May 24th, 2009
11:24 am
Hummm. You are thinking for sure. I do like Bosh But I am really believing Josh is a set shot or jump shot away from being the next great superstar and Yea, he can put fans in the stands in Toronto…but he puts them in the stands here in Atlanta too.
I do like your premise that we need a larger force at center…Chris Bosh is a force. I like your direction.

speaking of center needs

Ken Strickland

May 24th, 2009
12:00 pm

It’s clear you don’t have a clue and your hater attitude for Woodson won’t allow you to see reality.

Za did not play overworking minutes…Dah. There is no excuse for his lack of athleticism or his humongous amount of turnovers. There is no excuse that he lost his starting job to a power forward because he can’t jump or block shots, or force any true center off the post. He may be a nice guy but he can’t finish in the post. Any special rotations Woody would have made would have been to shore up his lack of talent or his inability to protect the post.
It was so blatantly clear in the playoffs that opposing players attack the rim whenever he’s in the game. ESPN and TNT commented on the fact that whenever he’s in the lane to the cup is green lighted. If he were any count he’d be starting, like he used too. Double Dah!

Why it is all the pros can see this but you can’t? (Help me spell Woodson Hater)

Za-top this turnover-Za did not play mega minutes ala JJ or Horford. That’s a poor cop-out! Clearly we need a center. Hate is blinding.

Your tangent had no real substance or value to it, just a lot of abstract reasoning that you used to mask your dislike for Woodson. Ray Charles could see that.

I will grant you that Bibby is a liability defensively.

I dont know what games you were watching but the way teams handle Bibby is to back him down to the low post and then shoot over him or dunk. In a perfect world a true center would not allow that and the shooter would be forced outside for lower percentage shots. What games were you watching? You do have a good imagination. The post players dont need to rotate out to help Bibby, his man is going to back him down to the center spot!

Who wouldnt?

He and Pachulia have the same vertical leap.

Ken Strickland

May 24th, 2009
12:00 pm

Truth-serum

May 24th, 2009
3:29 pm

Ken Strickland

May 24th, 2009
12:00 pm

Did I mention how slow ZaZa is?

Truth-serum

May 24th, 2009
3:30 pm

Sautee

May 24th, 2009
3:09 pm

Shouldnt that be co-sign on that BUBBA?

Jody

May 24th, 2009
3:37 pm

Ken,

I don’t disagree with anything you said. In fact I agree with what you said. However, there’s a reason a guy like Jermaine O’Neal (a major reason the Heat series went 7 games) went off on us and why guys like Big Z and Varejo did whatever they wanted to against the Hawks. It didn’t matter who the hawks put on them, they were too big and skilled for the Hawks frontline to handle. When opposing teams bigs are 3 and 4 inches taller, you can try and box out all you want, if they want to go and get the ball, they will.

Lastly, consider the psychological effect. Currently, teams score inside against the Hawks sometimes at will. No one fears the Hawks inside. Teams drive the ball because they know no one big enough to make them alter or change their shot is back there. That’s not the case with the teams who are playing right now while the Hawks sit at home.

Truth-serum

May 24th, 2009
3:37 pm

Ken Strickland

May 24th, 2009
12:00 pm

THE MORE I READ YOUR BLOG THE FUNNIER IT GETS. I DONT RECALL EVER SEEING PACHULIA GUARD KOBE OR LABRON… YOU ARE FUNNY MAN!

BY THE WAY LABRON AND KOBE PLAY 2,3 AND 4. 99.9% OF ALL COACHES PUT THEIR MOST ATHELETIC PLAYER ON THEM AND CERTAINLY THAT WOULD NOT BE ZAZA WATCH THIS MELTDOWN PACHULIA.

DID I MENTION THAT HE IS SLOW?

Truth-serum

May 24th, 2009
3:37 pm

LEBRON

Truth-serum

May 24th, 2009
3:39 pm

Jody

May 24th, 2009
3:37 pm

ILL CO-SIGN THAT!!

BosnianBaller

May 24th, 2009
4:20 pm

Ronny Turiaf really Bradley.The guy has a horrible contract.

Mitch

May 24th, 2009
4:35 pm

Jhan, the question is: If Bibby goes, will the Hawks have enough scoring? As I said, he’s not perfect, but.. I’ve always been a believer, that the team could use a big third scoring option, behind Joe Johnson and Josh Smith. Yes, I know teams win titles with only two, but to have a third option, would be good.

Sund has some difficult decisions to make. I wouldnt want to be him.

Mitch

Osama

May 24th, 2009
4:37 pm

A couple of bloggers made some nice suggestions that may have been overlooked. I’m a big supporter of the Hawks acquiring a center to shift the two low post players (Horford & Smith) to their natural positions–PF & SF. It would send Marvin to the bench and give us a truly two-deep team. The two names mentioned were Marcus Camby and Tyson Chandler. Either of whom would fit perfectly for the half-court set and Tyson is no stranger to running the floor in transition w/ CP3. Camby is an excellent shot blocker and rebounder and both clog the lane by their presence alone. I don’t know the contract status of either player but those would be two strong candidates to properly align the starting five.

E43

May 24th, 2009
4:40 pm

i dont see why people are thinking about letting marvin go i mean he plays both forward positions well and adds his length. i mean marv just included the 3ball to his game, injuries hurt his career. drafting a point guard is nonesense, after all the point guards in hawks draft history, i think the best bet is free agency. where you can pick your strenghts and not just flip a coin and hope. i also think that mr Sund should push to get childress back he was extremely/remarkably efficient just look at his stats over his career. jchill isnt very strong but he can add to the offense upfront despight being a guard. he could be the G/F to compliment Jsmiths SF/PF abilities. my last opinion is risky but trade speedy with a draft pick. nobody wants him but im sure sum1 wants the pick and we free up sum space on the cap and have sumone that will score at least 2points a game. .

E43

May 24th, 2009
4:55 pm

MEMO TO ATL FANS.

atl where less than 10 years ago the hawks were a 16 win team happens.
where josh smith with the jam/block/assist/oop/steal happens
where joe johnson for threeeeeee happens
where mike bibby for threeeee happens
where marve with those two clutch threes at the corners happens
where. flip murray with 3 straight threes in the forth quarter happens
where zaza in the face of garnet happens
where mario west D on Kobe happens.
point is we trully have a highlight factory if you dont beleive in your team then go watch those teams that didnt make the playoffs and youll see that you have 82 exciting fun games to watch

Texas Pol Killer

May 24th, 2009
5:11 pm

OT but still sports. Texas political hacks cause deaths of very endangered whooping cranes:

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/editorial/outlook/6409645.html

STREETQ

May 24th, 2009
5:32 pm

THE HAWKS ANSWER TO GOING TO THAT NEXT LEVEL IS TRADING JOSH SMITH.HE IS NOT A PF, AND MARVIN WILLIAMS IS A NATURAL SF. JOSH DOESN’T COMMAND A DOUBLE TEAM IN THE POST,NO MID-RANGE SHOT AND WANTS TO SHOOT 3′S, NO BALLHANDLING SKILLS TO CREATE A SHOT FROM THE SF POSTION. HIS BLKS ARE DOWN BECAUSE HE CANT BANG WITH A TRUE PF IN THE LEAGUE.MARVIN IS FAR MORE SUPERIOR AT THE SF SPOT.CONSISTENT,GREAT ON BALL DEFENDER ( THE ONLY ONE WHO CAN GAURD LEBRON JAMES ON THIS TEAM).
TRADE SMITH FOR CHRIS BOSH AND MOVE HORFORD TO PF.DRAFT PG LAWSON AND IMPROVE BENCH AND WILL WOULD BE IN THE CONF.FINALS NEXT YEAR GAURANTEED.
C-CHRIS BOSH
PF-HORFORD
SF-WILLIAMS
SG-JOHNSON
PG-BIBBY-(1 YR CONTRACT)
BENCH.

FLIP MURRAY
ZAZA
EVANS
LAWSON-PG OUTTA UNC
CHILDRESS??
______<FILL IN ANOTHA BIG MAN

Hoops

May 24th, 2009
5:55 pm

Street Q,

I like your plan. You are going to need some money to make it happen. Would you consider letting Bibby go (he will not sign for a 1 yr. contract)? That will give you some money to go after another point guard like Sessions and be able to resign Zaza, Marvin, and Flip. I don’t think Lawson will be available @ #19 in the draft. Would you consider offering Acie and the #19 pick for the #2 or #3 pick? It might even cost you Speedy! Then you could draft Thabeet. Now you look like this:
PG-Sessions,Flip
SG-JJ, Evans
SF-Marvin, Childress
PF-Horford, Morris
C-Bosh, Zaza, Thabeet

ILL-logical

May 24th, 2009
7:11 pm

One of the bigger misconceptions about the Hawks interior players is that their length is their primary handicap, I believe it is their heft as well.

First, Al is listed at 245lbs; Josh Smith is listed at 240(which is to much for his frame IMO) and Solo is generously listed at 245 lbs.They are all giving up 20-40 lbs per man at the current postions.

ZaZa is the only player would qualify as having heft but his lack of over all athleticsm negates his heft.

Al will fill out to 255-260 lbs over the next few years so he might be able to compete better in the post but Josh must loose 10 lbs to keep his agility. for all of the folks who don’t believe his future is at 3, it is for not only the obvious reasons-more heft and increased interior defense but the need to run and gun to make into later rounds of the playoffs.

And for the record, Chris Bosh is not a center. If he is acquired, he will play the 4 and if I had my ‘druthers-he is a beter all around player than Al. But not to worry, the BAASP cannot afford Bosh.

Net-net, while the team is operating on the cheap-and that will be for the foreseeable future like most of the NBA, we need to see an emphasis on heft not height.

Truth-serum

May 24th, 2009
8:39 pm

Mark Bradley

May 24th, 2009
7:41 pm

Its quite amazing how Mo Dumb Bradley can be entrusted to relay any meaniful commentary or insight when he clearly doesnt know the difference between a power forward and a center. Al Hordford was,is and will always be, a Power forward. All Power forwards spend minutes at the 5. Al plays best facing the basket or cutting to it. A true center plays with his back to the basket.

Im not big on T Chandler but Im certainly not going to try to get to the next level with Horford as a center. Surely you jest!

Ken Strickland

May 24th, 2009
10:27 pm

TRUTH SERUM-I am so pleased that I can bring some jocularity into your otherwise negative existence. It’s truely revealing how you criticize me for making HC MWoodson an issue while you single C ZPachulia out and made him your issue. I noticed you conveniently avoided referencing the lack of quickness, speed and penetrating ability of PG MBibby, which is an issue, especially considering his size.

Using your flawed attempt at logic one can criticize AHorford and JSmith for not being 7′ tall, or JJohnson for not being as quick, fast and athletic as KBryant or DWade. PEOPLE THAT PRACTICE HYPOCRISY ARE CALLED HYPROCRITES. THERE ARE THOSE WHO SEE THE FOREST AND THERE ARE THOSE WHO SEE THE TREES. GUESS WHICH CATEGORY YOU FALL INTO, HYPOCRITE.

ORLANDO LEDBETTER-MBibby did have a good OFF series against Miami, but his DEF, as always, was lacking. Bibby is smart, savy and an excellent 3pt shooter especially in the clutch. However, he doesn’t penetrate and breakdown DEF’s to help his teammates get easy scoring opportunities. and that’s important when you don’t have a lot of players with one on one ability.

JODY-few if any players that can match AHorfords speed, quickness and athleticiam can match his size and strength. Few if any that can match his size and strength can match his speed, quickness and athleticism. Therefore, against JOneal, if the team had forced the issue and Horford had been allowed to utilize his decidedly superior speed, quickness, strength and athleticism, there’s no way Oneal could have stayed on the floor with Horford. THAT’S WHERE THE ABSENCE OF THAT THING CALLED STRATEGY, AND TAKING ADVANTAGE OF THE TALENTS OF YOUR PLAYERS, COME INTO PLAY.

AHorford’s 9.3RPG makes him the NBA’s 9th best rebounder and that’s better than starting BIGS like JPrzybilla, SDalembert, LAldridge, CVilanueva, who are BIGS that some of you have mentioned acquiring. That also beats BIGS like EDampier, SHawes, JThompson, AVarejo, JNoah, BLopez, DNowitzki, MGasol and SOneal, to name a few, and all of the aforementioned players are TALLER than AHorford. IN FACT, THE MAJORITY OF THESE PLAYERS ARE 7 FOOTERS, SO PLEASE STOP USING THAT “HE’S UNDERSIZED”, OR WE’RE UNDERSIZED, OR HE’S A NATURAL PF AS AN EXCUSE AND LOOK AT THE REAL REASONS WE GOT OUT REBOUNDED? DO ANY OF YOU THINK DHOWARD, THE NBA’S LEADING REBOUNDER, WOULD AVERAGE AS MANY REBOUNDS IF HE HAD TO SPEND AS MUCH TIME AS OUR BIG’s DO OUT ON THE FLOOR TRYING TO DEFEND THE OTHER TEAMS BEST PG’s AND SG’s?

dap01

May 25th, 2009
8:28 am

We need help at center, we need a shot blocker. That does not mean replace Hortford. The Center Defensive position is weak on the Hawks.

We need help at defense at the PG position. Bibby is the worst defensive PG in the NBA. You can not take a team but so far with a very one dimensinal PG. I like Bibby but if he is on the team Woody will only play him and again we will be severly flawed at crunch time of any game.

Truth-serum

May 25th, 2009
9:04 am

Ken Strickland

May 24th, 2009
10:27 pm

Woodson has done a superior job. 95% of knowledgeable basket-ballers will acknowledge that. TNT had, ESPN has and I do believe he was in the top nine for coach of the year award. Since everyone else acknowledges it that make your attacks personal.

Speaking of personal, I just reread my commentary of your irrational BLAH, BLAH, and BLAH and found no personal attack against you from me yet you have resorted to ill founded name calling…why am I not surprised? Usually when a person’s writings have no substance they resort to name calling. You are no different.

I analyzed ZaZa because he lost his starting job and now we have a power forward trying to man a position that Z was brought here to man. He hasn’t panned out like Koncak did not. My thoughts are to make the Hawks better and have nothing to do with you personally. You can’t get to the next level without a legit center. Period. You haven’t learned that. You regurgitate knowledge but are a glutton for hate.

You charge that I did not analyze Bibby for what he brings, that is not true and a borderline lie.
You obviously read with your overburdened heart and not with your mine (I’m assuming you have one) because I did mention that the way to take Bibby is in the low post where he, like Z is defenseless. In addition if you read my previous blogs I have mentioned that Bibby is a liability defensively.
Having said that, I must added that what Bibby lacks in D he more than offsets in offense. I can’t say the same for Za watch this turnover Za, A.k.A. the fast lane to the rack is now open please practice your show dunks while I watch.
Bibby was the # 3 three point shooter in the NBA and his shots are a significant reason the Hawks are in the hunt. Can we live without him? For sure! We’ve got Flip! Bibby is on his last legs….figuratively. I’d like to add that because of his high level of experience, his three point shot and his point guard wisdom Bibby is an asset for any team including the Hawks. If he stays it’s time to move flip to start and Bibby to come off the bench.

Pachulia gave it his best, “I ain’t mad at him” but lost his job, nothing personal, like your hate of Woodson. Perhaps if you can get past your hate you can begin to see clearly. You will recognize the Hawks need for a center, how important a position the center is in sports, appreciate Woody and learn the basics and beauty of basketball.

Until then have a nice day.

Did you read in my address to you something about 7 footers? I dont think so…like I said before you do have a imagination. Most SF and Pf arent 7 footers. Now that you mention it…it would be GREAT to have a athletic 7 foot presence in the low post…

Sam Wetherson

May 25th, 2009
9:08 am

I am just wondering if the ASG can afford to pay people. Another thing no one is paying to see Josh Smith. People are going to see the Hawks. Did you guys hear how bad he got booed when he would take long jumpers. Some tough decisions are going to have to be made for us to make it to the next level. We should build around JJ-Marv-Horf.

I respect everyone’s opinion but I question what games are some of you watching. Josh Smith is a horrible defensive player man on man. His blocks are down. He is trying to become the black Dirk Nowinski. He has to go or needs to come off of the bench. He shouldn’t complain because he will get paid the same.

Truth-serum

May 25th, 2009
9:19 am

Ken Strickland

May 24th, 2009
10:27 pm

Are you really this lost or is it just for show?
Dennis Rodman led the nba in rebounds for many years, but he is a PF not a center. How small minded to think that being a center is about getting rebounds. DUDE. I thought Mark Bradley was DUMB. You are MO DUMBER! Dumb, Mo Dumb, and Mo Dumber.

Being a force in the paint is not about rebounds dude. True Horford goes to the boards. That doesnt mean a power forward is a center. As a matter of fact if you man the postion correctly you will get non athletic rebound because youve box out. Most of Al’s rebounds are a result of his atleticism and tenacity like Rodmans. He is a good rebounder as are many powerforwards…Duh! That doesnt mean he is a center because he can rebound, Mo Dumber!

Ken Strickland

May 24th, 2009
10:27 pm

Truth-serum

May 25th, 2009
9:23 am

Sam Wetherson

May 25th, 2009
9:08 am

Why does it have to be the”black Dirk”? Why cant it be “Dirk”?
What has race to do with it?

jhan

May 25th, 2009
10:42 am

Truth – are you really saying you never noticed the switching defense we played all year? You never saw ZaZa, Al or Josh trying to guard the other teams PG at the top of the key? This defensive strategy is Woody’s signature on this team. Hard to believe you’ve even watched a Hawks game and this is not obvious to you. Strange from someone who wants to teach the fundamentals of basketball to the entire blog.

incredible

May 25th, 2009
11:37 am

Niremental said:The Smoove-vs-Marvin debate is long-running on Sekou’s blog. My impression is that the more consistently people watch Hawks games, the more highly they value Marvin. I just think it’s one of those cases where Smoove is pretty much exactly as good as his stats indicate, but Marvin is better than his stats indicate
This might be the biggest case of hypocrisy ever. Smith was the Hawks best player in the playoffs. Smith has had better stats than Marvin his whole career. They also are the same size and Marvin is about six months younger. Yet let you tell it people should value you Marvin more. Please tell us based on what? Why do people try to make Al Horford some great player. He was getting destroyed by Jermaine O’Neal before he got hurt against Miami. He got benched for Zaza. Horford does not even have a post game at all. His best shot is a mid-range jumper. He also doesn’t have the foot speed to play the four.
The Hawks biggest need is a leader pg who can run this team and play defense. Tell Smith to stop shooting jumpers and get his but in the post. Tell JJ to grow a pair and stop whining about being tired when the going gets tough.

Joe Johnson

May 25th, 2009
12:30 pm

Guys, cut me a break: I’m…tired.

truth-serum

May 25th, 2009
12:50 pm

jhan

May 25th, 2009
10:42 am

If I was a coach and I saw a slow ackward 6′11″ center who cant jump trying to guard My most athletic player like Kobe or Lebron, in the high post or at the top of the key or on a wing Id think the opposing coach has taking the day off. No. Ive not seen or will I ever see Z trying to guard Kobe or Lebron on the circle. Hes to slow and theyd blow right past him and dunk. Get real.

No. I dont want to teach fundamentals here. Id rather have an more serious level of conversation. I order to have any conversation on this sight I must wade through the blatant racism and basketball ignorance in search of some one with some sense. Sometimes its hard to discern which is racist

Sam Wetherson
May 25th, 2009
9:08 am

and which is ignorant

Mark Bradley
May 24th, 2009
7:41 pm

sometimes there is a combination of both

Ken Strickland
May 24th, 2009
12:00 pm

No Ive never saw Z trying to guard a point guard. If he did Maybe thats why he lost his starting job to a power forward!

truth-serum

May 25th, 2009
1:10 pm

jhan

May 25th, 2009
10:42 am

One other thing, if an opposing coach runs a screen pick or another play that forces a switch and a low post player is left out of position, understand that it happens all the time In Basketball. It’s a part of coaching. It doesn’t mean the coach’s philosophy is to put our slowest player with the least jumping ability to guard their fastest and most skill play which many times is a guard or small forward.

Coaches force these mismatches. Woody has done an excellent job despite being short handed with defensive liabilities like Za ” please dunk on me ” Za and “back me down” Bibby.

No, I don’t want to teach fundamentals but sometimes to have conversation you must reach people where they are at.

Speaking of reaching people where they are at, are you continuing the hate on Woody campaign, or, are you truly without understanding?

Ken Strickland

May 25th, 2009
4:15 pm

SERUM-ANYONE DUMB ENOUGHT TO PRETEND THEY KNOW THE EXACT PRECENTAGE OF KNOWLEDGEABLE BASKETBALL FANS THAT WOULD CLAIM MC MWOODSON HAS DONE A SUPERIOR JOB IS TRUELY DILLUSINOAL AND LOOKING TO JUSTIFY AN UNJUSTIFIABLE POSITION. BOTTOMLINE, YOU’RE A LOT OF NEGATIVE HOT AIR AND A COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME. GOOD LUCK TO YOU AND THE 95% OF YOUR IMAGINARY KNOWLEDGEABLE BASKETBALL FANS.

jk77

May 25th, 2009
4:28 pm

Forget about Chris Paul. Billy( I pick the raw post player over obvious need at 2 in 05, then the undersized Duke product over another future all-star-B.Roy- the next year) Knight shafted your franchise to the point where some of you are now renting on this blog about your teams future. Trading players who start and are under the age of 25 is never a good thing, especially ones as talented as Smith, Williams, and Horford.

dsouth

May 25th, 2009
6:00 pm

Why not Andre Miller, the guy would fit the bill for what we need in a point guard and not cost much more than Bibby. I like Bibby, but this guy has constantly gotten better and still doesn’t get the respect he should. Plus he is in the mold of AC which gives us a seamless transition to the reserve rotation, running a similar offense. Opinions? Another interesting guy would be Big Z from Cleveland. I think that Miller would be the man though running the fast break. Go get sick wit it!

See what I did there?

May 25th, 2009
10:33 pm

Chris “The Birdman” Anderson + Atlanta Hawks uniform = Destiny?

O'brien

May 26th, 2009
12:17 am

Mr. Bradley, as mentioned on the other blog, Mike Bibby is good offensively, but his weak defense has a trickle down effect.
1) JJ is forced to guard quick PG’s (more wear and tear on JJ)
2) Bibby’s man gets in the lane easily and forces our bigs to foul
3) Bibby’s man gets in the paint and finds shooters when our bigs have to switch
4) Bibby is already on the decline. Imagine how much slower he will be this coming season (and the season after that).

If Woody plays Bibby 24-28 minutes every game (unless he is hot), then his defensive weaknesses wont be as magnified. But even when he is getting lit up (or when his shot isnt falling), Woody still plays him. We need a PG who can defend his position, push the ball, and drive and dish. If we have a PG who gets other players involved more, I think Bibby’s offense can be replaced if Marvin gets more shots, and if our bigs get more shots.

Publix

May 26th, 2009
12:34 am

I would agree that we need a new PG. I would go risky here and let Law try it again. He definently has the potential, just seems a little too afraid and tries a little too hard.

I would draft a C and work on developing him to be ready in the next two years.

We should sign Sessions from Milwaukee and Powe from the Celtics.

I would trade Marvin to Memphis for Navarro and Warrick (both free agents).

PG- Law
SG- Joe
SF- Smith
PF- Horford
C – Powe

PG- Sessions
SG- Murry & Navarro
SF- Warrick
PF- Jones
C – Zaza & Draft Pick

dap01

May 26th, 2009
7:35 am

O’brienL: I agree.

truth-serum

May 26th, 2009
12:41 pm

Ken Strickland

May 25th, 2009
4:15 pm

For you this is not about growing the Hawks, It’s about your hate of Woody. It’s very difficult to argue with results, Ken.

Hate is blinding.

Don’t Hate…Congratulate!!!!…

Woodson on an excellent season, and for making the top 9 in the coach of the year polls (he did it without a superstar), and for the accolades’ offered by TNT and those offered by ESPN and for having the young and emotional Hawks up to the challenge of advancing in the playoffs…and the Great job he did with Josh’s attitude. Not to mention the negative press and the loud and vocal Bubba Crew.

Don’t hate congratulate!

The Hawks on a very good year!!

Smile God loves you too!!!

O’brien
May 26th, 2009
12:17 am

Good post!!!

The only issue I have is that nobody “forces our bigs to foul”. Z fouls because he’s not athletic enough to man the post. He can’t jump or run and he is a continuing turnover and is zero threat offensively. In the NBA many coaches will tell their guards to force their man to the center, having the expectation that the Center with get the job done without fouling out. I ask you to research Duncan in his youth, or Olajuwon, or Moses Malone or Mutombo for that matter. One of the advantages of having a true center is that if your man beats you he still has an uphill battle in the low post. Most teams with a real center will slant their man to the rack and dare him to try…
Here again is my take on Bibby:
The way to take Bibby is in the low post where he, like Z is defenseless. In addition if you read my previous blogs I have mentioned that Bibby is a liability defensively.

Having said that, I must added that what Bibby lacks in D he more than offsets in offense. I can’t say the same for Za watch this turnover Za, A.k.A. the fast lane to the rack is now open please practice your show dunks while I watch.

Bibby was the # 3 three point shooter in the NBA and his shots are a significant reason the Hawks are in the hunt. Can we live without him? For sure! We’ve got Flip! Bibby is on his last legs….figuratively. I’d like to add that because of his high level of experience, his three point shot and his point guard wisdom Bibby is an asset for any team including the Hawks. If he stays it’s time to move flip to start and Bibby to come off the bench.

dsouth

May 25th, 2009
6:00 pm

You’re on to something with this Miller thing. Miller is bigger and faster than Bibby but young enough to run with the Josh, Al, JJ, flip and Marv. He can distribute. Our guards will need speed to maximize the talent on this team. Question is what Miller has in terms of a three point shot. Never underestimate the power of three. When we are facing a team with a true center outside shooting will be necessary to create open lanes and higher percentage shots. With Bibby there were only two guys better at the three in the entire NBA!! That’s saying a lot!!
What is your opinion of getting Flip moved to the start? I do believe he can play the 1 spot as well as anyone. He can hit the three, make assists and run the offense. He won’t get back down to often and is fast on switch.

Z from Cleveland for Z from Atlanta…. Wed get the better in that trade. Zydrunas Ilgauskas seems to be much more athletic and is a true center (note he plays best with his back to the basket).
This is the one he removed.

Right now we don’t have a center and we have a power forward filling in and our center is relegated to the bench. We won’t get to the next level without a center.

I like your line of thought.

truth-serum

May 26th, 2009
12:43 pm

Ken Strickland

May 25th, 2009
4:15 pm

This is the one he removed

For you this is not about growing the Hawks, It’s about your hate of Woody. It’s very difficult to argue with results, Ken.

Hate is blinding.

Don’t Hate…Congratulate!!!!…

Woodson on an excellent season, and for making the top 9 in the coach of the year polls (he did it without a superstar), and for the accolades’ offered by TNT and those offered by ESPN and for having the young and emotional Hawks up to the challenge of advancing in the playoffs…and the Great job he did with Josh’s attitude. Not to mention the negative press and the loud and vocal Bubba Crew.

Don’t hate congratulate!

The Hawks on a very good year!!

Smile God loves you too!!!

O’brien
May 26th, 2009
12:17 am

Good post!!!

The only issue I have is that nobody “forces our bigs to foul”. Z fouls because he’s not athletic enough to man the post. He can’t jump or run and he is a continuing turnover and is zero threat offensively. In the NBA many coaches will tell their guards to force their man to the center, having the expectation that the Center with get the job done without fouling out. I ask you to research Duncan in his youth, or Olajuwon, or Moses Malone or Mutombo for that matter. One of the advantages of having a true center is that if your man beats you he still has an uphill battle in the low post. Most teams with a real center will slant their man to the rack and dare him to try…
Here again is my take on Bibby:
The way to take Bibby is in the low post where he, like Z is defenseless. In addition if you read my previous blogs I have mentioned that Bibby is a liability defensively.

Having said that, I must added that what Bibby lacks in D he more than offsets in offense. I can’t say the same for Za watch this turnover Za, A.k.A. the fast lane to the rack is now open please practice your show dunks while I watch.

Bibby was the # 3 three point shooter in the NBA and his shots are a significant reason the Hawks are in the hunt. Can we live without him? For sure! We’ve got Flip! Bibby is on his last legs….figuratively. I’d like to add that because of his high level of experience, his three point shot and his point guard wisdom Bibby is an asset for any team including the Hawks. If he stays it’s time to move flip to start and Bibby to come off the bench.

dsouth

May 25th, 2009
6:00 pm

You’re on to something with this Miller thing. Miller is bigger and faster than Bibby but young enough to run with the Josh, Al, JJ, flip and Marv. He can distribute. Our guards will need speed to maximize the talent on this team. Question is what Miller has in terms of a three point shot. Never underestimate the power of three. When we are facing a team with a true center outside shooting will be necessary to create open lanes and higher percentage shots. With Bibby there were only two guys better at the three in the entire NBA!! That’s saying a lot!!
What is your opinion of getting Flip moved to the start? I do believe he can play the 1 spot as well as anyone. He can hit the three, make assists and run the offense. He won’t get back down to often and is fast on switch.

Z from Cleveland for Z from Atlanta…. Wed get the better in that trade. Zydrunas Ilgauskas seems to be much more athletic and is a true center (note he plays best with his back to the basket).

Right now we don’t have a center and we have a power forward filling in and our center is relegated to the bench. We won’t get to the next level without a center.

I like your line of thought.

jhan

May 26th, 2009
1:29 pm

Truth – then I guess your boy Woody takes a lot of games off because he likes to switch defensively. Every time an opposing team needs a basket they run a pick & roll from the top of the key which forces our big man to guard their slasher. Check on Youtube for highlights if you think I’m joking. If our coach can’t figure out a way to stop that play then maybe he isn’t that great of a coach.

I don’t hate Woody but I do see several flaws (my opinion) in the way he coaches. Are you satisfied with his offense? Do you think he utilizes his players to their max? Do you think he develops his players to their full potential? If you don’t agree with all these questions do you now hate Woody? Do you hate everyone you disagree with? You can certainly disagree with someone without hating them.

I’m not sure about the racist comment – I hope that wasn’t directed my way because I’m certainly not a racist person.

truth-serum

May 26th, 2009
2:54 pm

jhan

May 26th, 2009
1:29 pm

I understand your comment “Every time an opposing team needs a basket they run a pick & roll from the top of the key which forces our big man to guard their slasher.”

This is why teams run the pick and roll. Its basketball. All coaches will run the pick and roll on all teams. Teams with superior personnel will run it more. It’s a rehearsed play that has proven result. No team is immune. It’s like a screen option in football. It forces d-backs to come up to the line. If Z were more athletic he would not get trapped as often. Never the less, I don’t fault him. Every coach looks at your limitations and run set plays to exploit your weakness. That why I’m pushing for a more athletic and imposing center.

Woody’s team won how many games? Of the games they lost how many were lost going into the fourth quarter? These kids under Woody almost won 50 games, they were winning, or in, 95% or more of their games going into the last quarter.

I don’t argue with results. How many coaches are in the NBA? Woody was number nine in the coach of the year poll and 4 of the coaches in front of him had legitimate superstars. If you don’t like his style of coaching that it’s fair to express your opinion. He’s winning! Like it or not he’s one of the better coaches in the NBA. His team is in almost every game and he’s coaching the 3rd youngest team in the NBA. I appreciate your analysis. TNT and ESPN disagree with your assessment of Woody’s Job performance. Me too. I think He’s a winner.

Here is an obvious racial comment:

Sam Wetherson

May 25th, 2009
9:08 am

He had written that Josh Smith was trying to be the Black Dirk Nowitski. It appears to have been removed, but the way this site is being managed it may appear again later. The implications were clear… to me anyway so I wrote and asked:

Truth-serum
May 25th, 2009
9:23 am

Sam Wetherson
May 25th, 2009
9:08 am

Why does it have to be the “black Dirk”? Why can’t it be “Dirk”?
What has race to do with it?

No, jhan I did not read you as racist just misguided in your view on Woody. We can agree to disagree.

jhan

May 26th, 2009
4:32 pm

Truth – I see where you’re coming from on ZaZa. I would like a better alternative coming off the bench as well. I just don’t know that one is available right now.

He’s not exactly a “winning” coach yet – his team has had “one” winning season. He is on the way. Before you go crazy – I do realize that he was dealt an awful hand to start so in my mind he get’s a pass for his first 3 seasons.

I said before the season started that if the Hawks had a winning record I would endorse bringing him back. I still stand by that & think that firing him right now would be unfair. I also feel that he has many shortcomings that need to be repaired.

His players are all in their 3rd – 6th seasons in his system so now is the time to shine. If I see no progression next season the blame has to fall on Woody. I hope this team wins the title next season & Woody gets a 10 year extension. Nothing would make me happier.

truth-serum

May 26th, 2009
8:31 pm

jhan

May 26th, 2009
4:32 pm

What you miss is that Za was brought here to start. He was a starter and he lost his job. Now by committee we have a power forward holding the post and doing better than our starter (formerly). That’s what you are missing. Now we are out of position and weaker at the post as a result.

As for as your disapproval or skepticism of Woody, you and a loud few others are willfully ignoring the man’s accomplishments and accolades. You are certainly the minority in this view. It’s hard for me to see how you can ignore his success. Finally your statement “3rd – 6th seasons in his system so now is the time to shine.” Well they are Shinning! So what’s the point!?! You also must consider that Josh did not get the refinement of college ball but came from high school. Marv has only one year of college before being drafted. These boys are just coming to manhood not just NBA maturity. The Hawks are the 3rd youngest team in the pro game and last year they were the youngest. So you again overlook the tremendous job Woody has done. Are you ignoring What TNT and ESPN said about him? Are you ignoring his top ten finish in the coach of the year poll?
I’m not trying to fix “what aint broke”!
What is broke is our center position. I like Al Horford and he needs to go back to the position he was drafted at and Z should be traded for a real center. That’s what he was brought here to do and if he can’t get the job done let’s give that position to someone who can and let’s give Woody the tools he needs to compete now that he has us on the playoff level. Nobody gets to the next level without a center.

Just for the record this is Woody’s fifth year, so no one has been in his program 6 years. Check the record. Here’s what the Hawks are saying about Woody?

College – Indiana

After four seasons of fielding one of the youngest teams in the NBA, you can understand the feeling of satisfaction as Hawks head coach Mike Woodson looks back on the 2007-08 campaign. To lead a franchise that was devoid of postseason competition for a then-league high eight years to the brink of one of the biggest upsets in postseason history, he has challenged his players to build on their accomplishment and make it back-to-back playoff appearances in 2008-09.

Woodson, who entered his Hawks coaching career as a rookie head coach, inherited a rebuilding situation that brought a lot of pain, heartache and long nights on the bench. While the wins were few and far between, he never stopped preaching and teaching his troops towards the ultimate goal – to become one of the 16 teams to make it to the playoffs and compete for the NBA championship.

Entering his fifth season, “Woody” is more determined than ever to make sure his team reaches that level again. At the end of the day he wants each of them to walk away knowing they have given their best each time they set foot on the court, and to become a better player for the experience

I must add that Woody got a championship ring with the Pistons.

To the Woody haters…hate on. Like I said earlier this year…he’ll be back next year.

Career Averages
REGULAR SEASON POST SEASON
YEAR TEAM WINS LOSSES PCT WINS LOSSES PCT
2004-05 Atlanta 13 69 .159 0 0 .000
2005-06 Atlanta 26 56 .317 0 0 .000
2006-07 Atlanta 30 52 .366 0 0 .000
2007-08 Atlanta 37 45 .451 3 4 .429
2008-09 Atlanta 47 35 .573 4 7 .364

Ken Strickland

May 26th, 2009
11:36 pm

JHAN-It’s rather obvious SERUM stands in front of a mirror and responds to his reflection when he claims certain individuals know nothing about basketball. He also claimed he understood what you were talking about, but clearly he doesn’t. Yes, every team runs pick and rolls, and every team has to defend pick and rolls. However, the Atlanta Hawks are the only team that switches on every pick and roll, refusing to fight over picks which would eliminate mismatches. If opposing teams consistently attempt to create a mismatch, would you consider a HC that continues to employ a DEF that consistently accomodates those efforts, to the detriment of his team, brillant? What advantage can we possibly gain having our biggest and best rebounders and shotblockers out on the perimeter trying to defend against the quickest, fastest and most athletic PG’s and SG’s, leaving our SG’s and PG’s to defend their BIGS.

I see why TRUTH SERUM is so enamored with Woodson. He’s just as shortsighted and clueless. By the way, I don’t know anything about Woodson personally, so from a personal prespective, there’s no logical reason for me to HATE him, which is SERUM’s uninformed assessment. However, as a HC, I do hate certain things he does or doesn’t do that hurts the team and some of its players.

ant banks

May 27th, 2009
9:23 am

Enter

cdog

May 27th, 2009
11:44 am

EVERYONE TRYING TO FIGUERE OUT KEEPING CERTAIN PLAYERS WITH THE HAWKS. WE SHOULD BE TALKING ABOUT ADDING PLAYERS.QUESTION TO RICK SUND AND THE HAWKS MANAGEMENT.WHY ARE THE MAJIC UP AT THIS TIME 3-1 AND THE HAWKS WERE SWEPT 4-0?BECAUSE THE MAJIC PLAYERS HAVE HEART AND THEY HAVE BIG MEN ON THE DEFENSIVE WHO WILL NOT ALLOW LEBRON JAMES TO COME INSIDE AND DO WHAT HE WANTS TO LIKE HE DID THE HAWKS.GET THE PICTURE SUND?YOU CAN’T WIN WTHOUT GOOD BIG MEN ESPECIALLY ON THE DEFENSIVE END. THAT’S WHAT TORE UP THE HAWKS LONG TIME AGO. THEY WERE A TREMENDOUS TEAM WITH TREE ROLLINS INSIDE REBOUNDING AND BLOCKING SHOTS.THEN THEY WENT AWAY THINKING THEY NEEDED OFFENSE FIRST. THEY BROUGHT IN MOSES MALONE WHO COULD SCORE BUT WAS PAST HIS PRIME ON DEFENSE. THE RESULT, THE TEAM WAS NEVER THE SAME ONE THAT WENT TO THE EASTERN CONFERENCE FINALS.I’M SURE THE MAJIC HAS PLAYERS THAT ARE TIRED, HURT WRIST AND SORE ANKLES BUT THE DIFFERENCE WITH THEM AND THE HAWKS PLAYERS THEY ARE NOT SITTING OUT SCARED AND SHAMMING.THIS IS CRUNCH TIME NOW. THEY HAVE MORE HEART THAN THE CURRENT HAWK PLAYERS.SUND GET THE CELL OUT YOUR EAR AND FIX THE TEAM.WE WANT AN NBA CHAMPIONSHIP. NOT JUST MAKE THE PLAYOFFS.REMEMBER HAWKS MANAGEMENT, YOU CAN’T TAKE A MULE TO THE KENTUCKY DERBY AND EXPECT TO WIN

truth-serum

May 27th, 2009
11:57 am

Ken Strickland
May 26th, 2009
11:36 pm

I hope you enjoyed the Hawks and their season.They arent having any problems selling tickets so be sure to get yours early!!!

Here’s what the Hawks are saying about Woody?

College – Indiana

After four seasons of fielding one of the youngest teams in the NBA, you can understand the feeling of satisfaction as Hawks head coach Mike Woodson looks back on the 2007-08 campaign. To lead a franchise that was devoid of postseason competition for a then-league high eight years to the brink of one of the biggest upsets in postseason history, he has challenged his players to build on their accomplishment and make it back-to-back playoff appearances in 2008-09.

Woodson, who entered his Hawks coaching career as a rookie head coach, inherited a rebuilding situation that brought a lot of pain, heartache and long nights on the bench. While the wins were few and far between, he never stopped preaching and teaching his troops towards the ultimate goal – to become one of the 16 teams to make it to the playoffs and compete for the NBA championship.

Entering his fifth season, “Woody” is more determined than ever to make sure his team reaches that level again. At the end of the day he wants each of them to walk away knowing they have given their best each time they set foot on the court, and to become a better player for the experience

I must add that Woody got a championship ring with the Pistons.

I hope you enjoyed the Hawks and their season.They arent having any problems selling tickets so be sure to get yours early!!!

Career Averages
REGULAR SEASON POST SEASON
YEAR TEAM WINS LOSSES PCT
2004-05 Atlanta 13 69 .159 0 0 .000
2005-06 Atlanta 26 56 .317 0 0 .000
2006-07 Atlanta 30 52 .366 0 0 .000
2007-08 Atlanta 37 45 .451 3 4 .429

truth-serum

May 27th, 2009
12:03 pm

cdog

May 27th, 2009
11:44 am

Good post!
I agree.

Its very clear that the Hawks next step is to get an established center, not a project or incomplete center or an unathletic post player who losses his starting job and is content with the bench. They need a center who can truely man the position in Defense and Offense.

Biker Dude

May 27th, 2009
12:45 pm

Mark Bradley,

We have to have a center to compete. We need a center…where are we getting him from? We need to do something with Bibby but I feel he should stay and we need to get a true point guard who is an assist machine and can score at will. These are the 2 pieces we are missing to compete for a championship. Joe Johnson needs to be much more consistent from the outside. I look at him with the likes of Wade & Lebron James and some other all stars. Joe Johnson can’t score at will like these guys can.. That’s the key component we are missing from Joe. What do you think?

Truth-serum

May 27th, 2009
5:57 pm

There are 16 teams that make up the playoff run. Of those that get to the final 4 or the “serious” level they all have a center. The Hawks are knocking at the door. No one said they need a superstar. The concensus is that they must have a center! A point guard who can play defense and create his own shot would help. Thats all the hawks need to take it to the next level

cdog

May 27th, 2009
6:24 pm

WHAT DOES A SUPERSTAR HAS TO DO WITH ANYTHING?THEY HAVE POTENTIAL SUPERSTARS IN 3 OF THEIR CURRENT PLAYERS JOSH,JOE AND HORFORD.THEY NEED THE GOOD BIG MAN AND THE POINT GUARD ADDED. REMEMBER PAUL PIERCE?HE WAS A SUPERSTAR BUT THE CELTICS WERE LOSERS.THEN THE BIG MAN, GARNETT AND THE POINT CAME ALONG, RONDO.THEN THEY STARTED ADDING AND SUBTRACTING ROLE PLAYERS LAST.THE REST IS HISTORY, THE NBA CHAMPIONSHIP. HAD GARNETT NOT GONE DOWN THIS SEASON, THEY WOULD HAVE WON IT THIS SEASON. THATS WHY SUND SHOULD GET THE CELL OUT OF HIS EAR AND SERIOUS GO AFTER THE IMPORTANT BIG MAN AND POINT GUARD.WE ARE NOT WORRIED ABOUT WHAT OTHER TEAMS NEED,WE SHOULD ONLY BE WORRIED ABOUT THE HAWKS.

jhan

May 27th, 2009
6:42 pm

We can’t afford to resign all our players then add a dominant center & penetrating point guard. Also, those types of players aren’t just waiting around to be signed either. There just aren’t enough dominant big men to go around.

Truth – if we want a dominant center 2 of these 4 players will probably have to go (Marvin, Bibby, Josh, Al). Which would you keep & how would you fill out the rest of the roster.

If you inherit a 13 win team & don’t improve your record then you really are a poor coach.

I also heard ESPN/TNT guys talking about the Hawks total lack of offensive identity & their underdeveloped bench. They also said this team rotates poorly on defense. I suppose you didn’t hear any of that or chose to ignore that talk.

Antoine Walker, Boris Diaw, Al Harrington & many others were brought here to be starters as well. I’m not sure why you are so caught up with ZaZa. He is one of the better back-up centers in this league. Not everyone can start.

Jfreak

May 27th, 2009
6:50 pm

Smoove vs Marvin? MARVIN STAYS! First, Marvin can shoot free throws. Second, Marvin has a good Basketball IQ. Third, Marvin conintues to improve in the above mentioned areas and Smoove continues to decline. We need inside defense and rebounding more than we need Smoove, sorry Josh! Also, this debate Bibby vs Kidd come on! Kidd is way over done and Bibby has proven for a year and a half that he is still clutch and a great Vet to have on team. Sund has done a good job so far no reason to think he wont continue to that end?

Chico27

May 27th, 2009
6:51 pm

Check this… Keep all the players from this season except Zaza (i honestly don’t know why everyone is in love with the guy when the only thing he is good for is to agitate players on opposing teams. He can’t shoot worth a damn and he’s weak offensively under the paint) Bring in Rasheed Wallace under a one year contract to see how he fits with the Hawks (give him the 8mill he wants put the pressure on him and see how he performs.) Put him at Center which would move Horford to PF, have Marvin and Josh compete for the starting spot on the SF position (this would give us bench depth regardless of who gets the starting position) and keep Joe and Bibby as the SG and PG, respectively. I think this would be a great team that would keep or even exceed their 4th spot in the Eastern Conference. I guess where i’m getting is this… give this team a chance to see how they play together two years in a row and buy time until summer 2010 when the Hawks can make some big moves with the salary cap room they’ll have available. Remember, the list of free and restricted agents in 2010 is ridiculous!!!

Truth-serum

May 27th, 2009
9:16 pm

Season Champion center
2007-08 Boston Celtics- Kendrick Perkins
2006-07 San Antonio Spurs Tim Duncan
2005-06 Miami Heat Shaquille O’Neal
2004-05 San Antonio Spurs Tim Duncan
2003-04 Detroit Pistons Rasheed Wallace
2002-03 San Antonio Spurs Tim Duncan
2001-02 Los Angeles Lakers Shaquille O’Neal
2000-01 Los Angeles Lakers Shaquille O’Neal
1999-00 Los Angeles Lakers Shaquille O’Neal
1998-99 San Antonio Spurs Tim Duncan
1997-98 Chicago Bulls Luc Longley
1996-97 Chicago Bulls Luc Longley
1995-96 Chicago Bulls Luc Longley
1994-95 Houston Rockets Hakeem Olajuwon
1993-94 Houston Rockets Hakeem Olajuwon
1992-93 Chicago Bulls Bill Cartwright
1991-92 Chicago Bulls Bill Cartwright
1990-91 Chicago Bulls Bill Cartwright
1989-90 Detroit Pistons Bill Laimbeer
1988-89 Detroit Pistons Bill Laimbeer
1987-88 Los Angeles Lakers Kareem Jabbar
1986-87 Los Angeles Lakers Kareem Jabbar
1985-86 Boston Celtics Robert Parish
1984-85 Los Angeles Lakers Kareem Jabbar
1983-84 Boston Celtics Robert Parish
1982-83 Philadelphia 76ers Moses Malone
1981-82 Los Angeles Lakers Kareem Jabbar

Truth-serum

May 27th, 2009
9:57 pm

jhan

May 27th, 2009
6:42 pm

I cant tell whether I talking to you or Ken after he passed your instructions

Ken Strickland
May 26th, 2009
11:36 pm

Either way I wont waste the time to speak to you because you are apart of the Ken Strickland Bubba posse.

Just to enlighten you, have you looked at the hawks salary cap this up coming season? Did you look at who was undercontract and for how much? Why do I think you are just making blanket statement with no knowledge of facts? The Hawks are very capable of adding the two missing pieces and would have money left over. Im not going to waste my time dealing with your non issues while you try to fix what aint broke. You totally disregard the fact that you dont build a team around a back up center….Duh, what are you thinking? He wasnt brought here to be a back up and we dont need a slow ackward turnover machine picking his nose when we are trying to win a championship.

I Hope you enjoy this side bar:

NBA’s Top 10 Centers
By Terrell James
NBA Jun 18, 2007

Remember when big men ran the NBA? In the ’90s, superstars like Hakeem, Ewing, Robinson, Young Shaq and Young ‘Zo had a huge impact on the League’s balance of power, and even second-tier guys like Rik Smits, Brad Daugherty, Vlade and Elden Campbell put in work.
Those days are ancient history. Now it’s the era of Jerome James and Adonal Foyle, where all 7-footers have to do is look like they can play and they’re almost guaranteed a fat contract. That’s why Greg Oden has been so hyped since early in his high school career; if he doesn’t usher in a new era of dominant centers, he’ll at least destroy most of the fives in the League on his way to multiple championships. Who will be Oden’s top comp? We ranked the League’s 10 best centers…

10. Zydrunas Ilgauskas — He’s slow and methodical, but Big Z gets the job done, as he showed throughout the Cavs’ run to the Finals. When he gets involved in the offense, he’s a decent scorer (11.9 ppg) who can draw the opposing big man away from the basket. Z is a great offensive rebounder (7.7 rpg) — you saw all the tip-ins — and a decent shot-blocker (1.3 bpg). Of course there’s that nonexistent quickness and lateral movement, which exposes him against bigs with any kind of speed, but Z has a niche and fills it well.

9. Mehmet Okur — Definitely not the prototypical center; he spends all game on the perimeter, but then again, he’s one of the best shooters in the League, so why not? Memo hit on 38 percent of his threes this year and put up 17.6 points a night while making his first All-Star team. His problems are: one, he’s a shameless gunner, and two, he gets destroyed on defense sometimes. While he was good against Yao at times in the Houston series, Tim Duncan took Memo to daycare.

8. Ben Wallace — He got off to a rough start in Chicago (stats-wise and the whole headband thing), but eventually got back to that blue-collar style fans and teammates know and love. As always, he was amongst the League leaders in boards (10.7 rpg) and blocks (2.0 bpg), and as always, the offensive game was somewhere between minimal and comical (6.4 ppg, 40 percent at the stripe).

7. Eddy Curry — The Knicks haven’t had a decent center since Marcus Camby, so Curry’s breakthrough ‘06-07 season was like winning the Lottery for Knicks fans. E-City came into training camp in the best shape of his career (all jokes aside) and it showed; he went for 19.5 points a night and was a borderline All-Star. Curry commands a double-team, but still turns the ball over too much trying to pass out of it, and his rebounding (7.0 rpg) could stand to improve.

6. Tyson Chandler — A prime example of how a change of scenery and system can change someone’s career. After five lackluster years in Chicago, Chandler made an impact right away with the Hornets, and was one of the NBA’s best rebounders (12.4 rpg). He also put up 9.5 points and 1.8 blocks and shot 62 percent from the field — which makes sense seeing as a lot of his buckets come on alley oop finishes and putbacks. He was in the discussion for Most Improved and Defensive Player of the Year.

5. Marcus Camby — See what he can do when he’s healthy? Playing an iron-man-ish (by his standards) 70 games this year, Camby copped Defensive Player of the Year after averaging 11.7 boards and a League-high 3.3 blocks a night to go along with 11.2 points. He’s the only reason Denver’s D doesn’t give up 120 a game. He scored an invite to Team USA’s training camp, but the Nuggets understandably wanted Camby to stay home — and healthy — this summer.

4. Dwight Howard — Getting better every year. 2007 saw Dwight’s first All-Star appearance and his first playoff experience. After getting a lesson from the Pistons in a first-round sweep, Howard should be that much smarter and better next year. Physically, Howard is an animal who blocks shots (1.9 bpg), dunks on everyone in sight (17.6 ppg), and dominates the glass (12.3 rpg). If you were starting a team from scratch and were looking long-term, Dwight would be one of the Top 5 players you’d have to consider.

3. Shaquille O’Neal — Don’t get it twisted; Shaq is still one of the best in the game. When D-Wade went down with his shoulder injury this year, Shaq showed he’s still capable of being the most dominant player on the floor, helping carry the Heat from what looked like a Lottery season into fourth-place in the East. He put up 17.3 points, 7.4 boards and 1.4 blocks in an injury-shortened regular season, and upped his numbers to 18-8-1.5 in Miami’s first-round loss to Chicago. Yeah, he’s getting up there in age and misses more and more time on the bench in a suit, but there’s still few players who are harder to stop 1-on-1.

2. Amare Stoudemire — Not only did STAT come all the way back from the knee injury (playing all 82 games), he was better than the last time we saw him at his peak. Amare dropped 20.4 points and 9.6 boards on his way to getting All-NBA first team, went for 25 and 12 in the postseason, and added a 15-footer to his repertoire that makes him a certified problem for any defense.

1. Yao Ming — Instead of dominating for a few minutes here and there, Yao took over entire games this year, averaging 25 points, 9.4 boards and 2 blocks a night and entering the MVP discussion before a leg injury limited him to just 48 games. Yao’s conditioning has improved since he first came into the League, allowing him to stay on the court and avoid senseless fouls. Houston is still T-Mac’s team, but no way they even challenge Utah in seven games without the best center in the League.

Honorable mention: Emeka Okafor, Chris Kaman, Andrew Bogut, Nenad Krstic, Brad Miller

I DID NOT SEE ZA “THE CONTINUING TURNOVER” ZA NAME MENTIONED, EVEN AMONGST THE HONORABLE MENTIONED AND THIS ARTICLE WAS FROM THE LAST YEAR WHEN HE WAS STILL A STARTER. WE HAVE BACK UPS WHO NEED DEVELOPEMENT SINCE YOUR VISION IS TO DEVELOP BENCH PLAYERS. WE HAVE TWO YOUNG AND INEXPERIENCED CENTERS TO HANDLE THE SCRUBB MINUTES,…FOR LESS!!

You Woody haters dont have a clue,nor facts or knowledge. All you do is hate. Instead of learning and researching you try to blame Woody because a player doesnt step up or doesnt take advantage of his opportunities. Nobody can play for you!

Its not Woodys fault Paschulia is a slow non athletic turnover factory. What? You expect Woody to make him into Tim Duncan? Get real. The NBA is litter with players on every team that have the physical ability and will not step up to the task. Paschulia is equal to Koncak!

Real players step up and make good.

The rest of them go home to mommy. Speaking of which…inst it about time for you to called Ken?

jhan

May 27th, 2009
10:29 pm

Truth – why do you continue to compare our “back-up” center to starter? Our starting center is Al Horford.

Have you read any of the salary cap breakdown on Sekou’s blog? We don’t have enough money to sign all our guys plus this dominating center you seem to think is just sitting around waiting for us.

Check out the posts from “niremetal” & “MannyT” – these guys know the salary cap as well as anybody.

truth-serum

May 28th, 2009
6:24 am

jhan

May 27th, 2009
10:29 pm

You are willfully ignorant and take pleasure in stupidity.

What you miss is that Za was brought here to start. He was a starter and he lost his job. Now by committee we have a power forward holding the post and doing better than our starter (formerly). That’s what you are missing. Now we are out of position and weaker at the post as a result.

As to your unlearned, and lazy charge that the hawks don’t have money to put the final pieces together…The Hawks have only committed 40mil, and the 2009-2010 salary cap may be 60 mil or better. That’s at least 20 Mil to shop with and keep the current salaries intact.

Quit begging for knowledge and stop spewing hate.

Sund may keep ‘core’ of Hawks together
By Mark Bradley
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Saturday, May 23, 2009

“I like the core of this club,” Sund said this week. “I’d like to keep as much of it together as I can.” His endorsement is a major factor: It means he likes what he has and wants to add, not subtract.
Sund inherited last summer’s free agents, and it’s no secret he valued Josh Childress less than ownership did. The fractious Atlanta Spirit actually gave the new general manager permission to exceed the salary cap on Childress —- you can do that to keep your own free agents —- and Sund declined.
Sund has a clear idea as to what he feels guys are worth. If it’s reasonable to assume this GM doesn’t see the 32-year-old Mike Bibby as worth $15 million, which is what he made last season, it’s reasonable others won’t, either.
Is another club apt to see Bibby as its missing piece and hand him, say, $10 million a year? (At his age, there’s no way he gets $15 million from anybody.) Is any team apt to see Marvin Williams, who made $5.6 million last season, as worth $9 million? (Remember, Josh Smith got $58 million over five seasons last summer, and that was because the economy cratered. And Smith is clearly the better player.)
A bad economy favors the Hawks, who have committed only $40 million for 2009-2010. (The salary cap was $59 million in 2008-2009.) A bad economy would allow Sund to say, “You can take a bit more cash to go lose games in Minneapolis, or you can stay where you know something good is happening. Your choice.”
Two guesses: Flip Murray will re-sign with the Hawks —- no GM likes Flip, more than Sund —- and Zaza Pachulia will leave. The destinations of Bibby and Williams seem more a coin flip…..

Sund and I agree on this much. Flip is a beast!!! I sure hope we can keep Marv. 3 years from now he will be one of the best play makers in the NBA, but I do agree that Josh is better right now.
What you miss is that Za was brought here to start. He was a starter and he lost his job. Now by committee we have a power forward holding the post and doing better than our starter (formerly). That’s what you are missing. Now we are out of position and weaker at the post as a result. Say Good bye to Z. The Hawks will probably take your advice and let Randolph Morris be the backup center (since you whine about development and he s cheaper) and go after the starter they thought ZaZa the human meltdown would be. Al Horford is going back to his natural position of PF.
Now you and Ken call a meeting of the Southern Chapter of The Grand Knights of the BUBBA CREW, and discuss your last efforts of hate!

truth-serum

May 28th, 2009
6:54 am

cdog

May 27th, 2009
11:44 am

Great post Cdog!

jhan

May 28th, 2009
7:54 am

I guess you can’t have a discussion without name calling. I’m done.

Chico27

May 28th, 2009
4:53 pm

jhan got called out… ha ha ha

How the Atlanta Hawks just might stay together after all

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How the Atlanta Hawks just might stay together after all

203 comments Add your comment

About Mark Bradley

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