How the Atlanta Hawks just might stay together after all
Given that Rick Sund only went one-for-two on keeping last summer’s key free agents, the inclination is to think he might pull a Jeff Francoeur and bat .250 (or worse) this time around. But I’m thinking Sund will do better. I’m thinking the Hawks have a real chance to keep this team together, provided two things happen:
1. The economy stays bad.
2. Nobody gets mad.
“I like the core of this club,” Sund said this week. “I’d like to keep as much of it together as I can.” His endorsement is a major factor: It means he likes what he has and wants to add, not subtract.
Sund inherited last summer’s free agents, and it’s no secret he valued Josh Childress less than ownership did. The fractious Atlanta Spirit actually gave the new general manager permission to exceed the salary cap on Childress – you can do that to keep your own free agents – and Sund declined.
Sund has a clear idea as to what he feels guys are worth. He took a media hit, in this space and others, for letting Childress leave, but Sund stuck to his numbers. (Note also that Sund didn’t offer Mike Woodson, whom he says “did a good job this year,” a contract extension Thursday.) If it’s reasonable to assume this GM doesn’t see the 32-year-old Mike Bibby as worth $15 million, which is what he made last season, it’s reasonable others won’t, either.
A lot of real money has been lost these past nine months, and even the millionaires who own NBA teams aren’t worth what they were. If the economy doesn’t spike upward the next five weeks, Free Agency 2009 isn’t apt to be a flurry of free spending.
Is another club apt to see Bibby as its missing piece and hand him, say, $10 million a year? (At his age, there’s no way he gets $15 million from anybody.) Is any team apt to see Marvin Williams, who made $5.6 million last season, as worth $9 million? (Remember, Josh Smith got $58 million over five seasons last summer, and that was because the economy cratered. And Smith is clearly the better player.)
Loading ...A bad economy favors the Hawks, who have committed only $40 million for 2009-2010. (The salary cap was $59 million in 2008-2009.) A bad economy would allow Sund to say, “You can take a bit more cash to go lose games in Minneapolis, or you can stay where you know something good is happening. Your choice.”
Sometimes that pitch works. It didn’t with Childress because he saw playing in Greece as a life experience, not just a career move, and it didn’t because what GMs called “the spite factor” kicked in. Childress thought he was worth more and got mad when Sund disagreed. Bibby might do the same. So might Williams. More than money, spite will be the determinant of this offseason.
Two guesses: Flip Murray will re-sign with the Hawks – no GM likes Flip, who has played almost everywhere, more than Sund – and Zaza Pachulia will leave. The destinations of Bibby and Williams seem more a coin flip, but the Hawks do have this working for them:
The coin in question? It’s no longer a silver dollar. It’s one thin dime.
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203 comments Add your comment
Mark Bradley
May 22nd, 2009
3:13 pm
And New Orleans won’t trade Chris Paul. He’s the franchise.
And let me ask this: If you had the choice of Al Horford or Hasheem Thabeet at center, which would you take? (Me, I’d take Horfy — he’s a better offensive player and a better passer. Thabeet is pretty much a defender.)
Blast
May 22nd, 2009
3:15 pm
Great first move (or no move) by Sund not to extend Woody’s contract. Let Woody coach for one more year, show how he can improve himself or his ball club first before even talking about another contract. Basically, put his ass under fire again and let’s see if he can win more games next season and advance his club past the 2nd round. I see he has been reading the blogs calling for Fire Woodson! Then again, Sund needs to get him the players to work with.
I think Zaza will be back. I don’t think he cares about starting or not. Unless another team offer much bigger money, I think he will be back.
Those calling for Marvin over Josh must be sick. Josh puts butts in the stands, Marvin does not. I like Marvin, he was having a breakout year until he got injured, but if I had to choose between them, It will be Josh. Marvin isn’t exciting enough and he is too injury prone.
Go Hawks, Go!
Daniel
May 22nd, 2009
3:17 pm
I do hope that we keep Zsa Zsa and Flip. Bibby is a different story depending on the money, but if we don’t get Bibby we need another veteran scorer to compliment Joe. A post defender would be nice too. I love Marvin’s overall game and attitude; I am just worried about his health. If I were to trade any core players, Marvin would be the one to trade because of those injury concerns.
Daniel
May 22nd, 2009
3:21 pm
Mark,
I love Biedrins from Golden State. I have no idea what it would take to get him though. I think he has a nice size contract.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 22nd, 2009
3:25 pm
“And let me ask this: If you had the choice of Al Horford or Hasheem Thabeet at center, which would you take?”
If Thabeet really is the next Mutombo — beyond being 7 feet tall and African — you’d seriously have to consider taking him over Horford despite his offensive shortcomings. But I don’t think Thabeet has the toughness Mutombo had throughout his career. Yeah, he’s tall, athletic, and blocks a ton of shots, but he got punked by more physical players many times throughout this past season. That’s not to say he can’t be a good NBA player, but it would take a while and is no sure thing. Do you trade a double-double machine like Horford for a chance at getting, say, the next Keon Clark as opposed to the next Mutombo? I don’t think so.
“And New Orleans won’t trade Chris Paul. He’s the franchise.”
If the franchise is hemorrhaging money as many have indicated, you have to think they would at least consider it, especially if the Hawks offered a package centered around Joe Johnson (not the same caliber player but only a step or two below) in return. It’s a far-fetched idea but I don’t think it’s as impossible as you think.
Steve
May 22nd, 2009
3:27 pm
As for players, I would love to keep Bibby, Marvin and Flip, but on one condition … we resign ZaZa first. I know some people don’t like him (skin color possibly), but he plays harder than anyone on the team, and puts his body on the line doing the dirty work EVERY single game.
Marvin is still too soft on defense, where he should excel due to his wingspan and agility. I would love to see Marvin get more looks on offense, but that just won’t happen with Bibby and JJ at the guards.
It is time to see if we can trade JJ’s expiring contract for a pick or two, or maybe some other expiring contracts. It sucks, because eh is a great guy, but shooting guards are a dime a dozen in this league and he is more easily replaced than others. Not to mention his being here might be holding back the young talent we have as they all look to him to take the shots. That needs to end.
As for the draft, I would love to see either Lawson or Maynor come here, but we might not get a shot at either. I am not a big fan of Teague, as I was forced to watch far too many ACC games on TV in Atlanta, and he did not look nearly as impressive as Lawson. As long as we don’t take another undersized C or PF I will be happy (in other words, NO TYLER HANSBOROUGH). I am not a big fan of Mullens from OSU either, as he is just too soft and the Hawks need an imposing force down low.
Steve
May 22nd, 2009
3:36 pm
One more thing, I saw on nbadraft.net that they are predicting the Hawks taking Mullins in the first round and a French guard named Beaubois in the second.
I don’t know anything about Beaubois beyond what that site tells me, but he sounds like he is worth a shot. He is at least two years from being NBA ready. The player he most compares to in the NBA is Rajon Rondo according to that site. That’s good enough for me considering college players taken in the second round rarely pan out in the NBA. I am willing to take a gamble on him for two years from now.
I still don’t like the Mullins pick all that much, and that site backed up my thoughts in that he plays far too soft for his size. It does mention he could easily add 20+ pounds and some bulk with the correct training program, but that won’t change him from a timid big man into a dominating personality like Shaq, Alonzo, Ewing or a half dozen others I can think of. He sounds FAR too much like Jon Koncak to me. Sorry to end my post on that note, as I know a bunch of lifelong Hawks fans are reaching for their Tums and Rolaids right about now.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 22nd, 2009
3:39 pm
Bill Simmons seems to agree with me that CP3 is more available than you might think…
David Smith
May 22nd, 2009
3:43 pm
I would rather we draft the best point guard availiable because of how many times we were taken to the hole at will by quicker guards this season. Mike Bibby is a good perimeter shooter but, struggles against younger/quicker guards. I would rather we sign Bibby for two more years and then draft his eventual successor in the draft to learn from him (Acie never had a chance to succeed here so he will want a opportunity to start for another team). We should then trade Claxton, Childress (if we wants to return to the NBA), and Morris for a veteran (or two) post players who are decent enough to allow Horford to move to his idea power forward position (I would dangle Marvin in the mix too if we could get someone pretty decent).
Wink from Lithonia
May 22nd, 2009
3:47 pm
No point rookie point guard will florish with Woodson as coach. Any rookie guard would have to be a strong personality (ie Josh Smith), willing to butt heads with Woodson, exceptional self confidence with talent to match and a longer guaranteed contract than Coach Woodson. Otherwise, we would have to get veterans, like Andre Miller, Jason Kidd, ie Mike Bibby.
O'brien
May 22nd, 2009
3:50 pm
Although I like Bibby’s leadership and shot making, I would not want to sign him for more than 2 years. He is such a defensive liability already, and he doesnt dribble drive/penetrate very well.
Mr. Bradley, you said Zaza wants to be a starter, but that wont happen with Horford here. Interesting, because that was also the problem with Chills. I think he wanted a chance to start, but knew that would never happen with Marvin here.
Steve
May 22nd, 2009
3:50 pm
Wow. Najeh, I would trade every Hawks expiring contract to get CP3 here if he would sign an extension in the deal.
Expiring contracts for Hawks after next year: Johnson, Claxton (thank the maker), Morris (not big enough to even add to a trade).
How about those first two players for CP3 and Tyson Chandler (who NOrleans would likely throw in to balance out the trade money wise to fit the NBA rules).
Man, if the Hawks could in any way make that happen, even if they include the first round pick, it would SOOOOO be worth it. I don’t really think Bill Simmons is right very often though, which means he probably is just blowing smoke about CP3’s situation.
Steve
May 22nd, 2009
3:53 pm
Oh, and before anyone says that the trade I mention is lopsided talent wise, please understand that ‘talent’ is not always the key factor in NBA trades.
I am sure many of you know that expiring contracts are a huge bargaining chip, but some people will see the trade and blow up saying the Hornets wouldn’t trade CP3 for the entire Hawks team or some nonsense like that. Just trying to cut those posts off at the pass.
Najeh Davenpoop
May 22nd, 2009
3:56 pm
CP3 has already signed a long-term extension with New Orleans, so there would be no need to renegotiate that. It’s not that New Orleans would want to trade him. The problem is that they have four long-term deals with mediocre players on their books. Peja Stojakovic and Tyson Chandler are both locked into eight-figure salaries, Morris Peterson is getting paid for three more years to do very little, and I would argue even David West is overpaid. Basically, the team that lost by 58 points at home in the playoffs this year is the team they’re stuck with for the foreseeable future, meaning they have no shot at a title and they are losing money big-time. Logic dictates they are going to have to shake things up, and they only have three players — Julian Wright, James Posey, and CP3 — who can provide a decent return on their investment. If they want a team like the Hawks to take on one or more of their bad contracts, they are probably going to have to dangle CP3 to do so.
MannyT
May 22nd, 2009
4:04 pm
Mr. Bradley, your Horford or Thabeet question has domino effects. I’d want to know who leaves in order for us to get Thabeet.
Someone needs to score the ball in the front court. Marvin & Josh both drive to the basket, but Marvin hits his free throws and shoots from the outside much better. Josh probably does a better job of putting fans in seats than any other current Hawk. Al is probably the better leader of the three.
For this team Thabeet means less front court offense and more reliance on back court scoring…which means you almost have to resign Bibby or Flip has to be more consistent, because there is no one on the bench to score.
Bottom line, we have to lose too much to add Thabeet–either in scoring (Marvin), ticket sales & emotion (Josh) or leadership (Al.)
We will be about 15-19 mil under the cap. Yes you have to factor in charges for draft picks et al, but if you look at it solely as Bibby’s 15 mil, you can get 2 established players for that money. Not stars, but reliable vets. You can play it a variety of ways–pick 2 from the list, 3 if you get them on the cheap. You might even trade a draft pick (& Claxton) away to make this happen. That allows us to use more cap money.
A. Young, quick PG
B. Established combo G (requires PG by committee among Murray, Law, & new guy depending on matchups)
C. Big defensive center (Mahorn like-if he blocks shots, it’s a bonus)
D. Big offensive center (Laimbeer like)
…and give up on Chills. Best case is trade his rights to another team. I think Sund would tell him–I’m just not that into you.
BWAF
chuckw/deadjournalist
May 22nd, 2009
4:08 pm
if this hasn’t been posted – a riot broke out last night in the the euro championships … note chills’ quote:
Former Atlanta Hawks swingman Josh Childress had 23 points for Olympiakos, the home team.
“The violence we saw today, will make me think real hard over my future in Europe,” said Childress, who signed a 3-year deal worth $20 million with Olympiakos in July.
chuckw/deadjournalist
May 22nd, 2009
4:08 pm
if this hasn’t been posted – a riot broke out last night in the the greek finals … note chills’ quote:
Former Atlanta Hawks swingman Josh Childress had 23 points for Olympiakos, the home team.
“The violence we saw today, will make me think real hard over my future in Europe,” said Childress, who signed a 3-year deal worth $20 million with Olympiakos in July.
MannyT
May 22nd, 2009
4:09 pm
Steve, I think you can get Tyson Chandler in a trade. I do not think you can get CP3 in a trade. The package does not matter.
The GMs that make those (trade away a superstar) deals always end up getting fired or leaving the team. Dumars will be the exception because he got a superstar back (short term) and he gets to remake the team due to Iverson’s expiring contract. If he fails in that remake, he will join the list of future ex-GMs sooner than later.
BWAF
Ben
May 22nd, 2009
4:10 pm
Is the Australian we drafted in 2002, David Anderson, ever going to play for the Hawks?
Wouldn’t we trade Childress’ rights, if he wants to come back to the NBA? Doubt he would play for us. So we also can trade Speedy’s expiring contract and Acie Law.
cj
May 22nd, 2009
4:11 pm
Just a comment on J-smoove, Marvin comparison. J-smoove is a difference maker, he is also an inside player who often thinks he is an outside player. Marvin can actually make outside shots consistently but his drive attempts tend to be a bull in a china shop type drive. J-smoove is an inside defensive presence, Marvin is an outside defensive player. They both are good, but to compare the two is like comparing apples to oranges. I believe that if Marvin can learn to be more under control on his drives, btw he has shown some improvement in that area, he has the potential to be a very, very good player and a difference maker.
MannyT
May 22nd, 2009
4:12 pm
ChuckW…Does that riot matter one bit to Sund?
He’s still not into Chills. With leverage, he might offer him nothing more than his tender amount which was a bit over $3 mil last summer. Chills can come back on the cheap with a trade to another team or he can ask David Beckham et al how the Euro footballers deal with riots.
BWAF
chuckw/deadjournalist
May 22nd, 2009
4:26 pm
MannyT – long time. some thoughts:
lots of dominos, but looking at the teams in the east, the hawks need the following to compete with the big three of the C’s, Magic and Lebron’s:
1) a shut-down swing defender. why? paul pierce, d. wade, lebron
2) a banging big-man who knows how to use his body. why? d. howard, big z and k.g.
3) an effective point defender/slasher. why? rando and mo williams
without a superstar, and without an offensive identity, the hawks showed they can be shut down offensively. unless they finally bring over andersen and shock the world and sign ben gordon, this team is going to have to win by playing defense, defense, defense.
with that said, here are some thoughts about the current hawks in flux:
zaza – if he will play for the same money he’s been getting and if the team doesn’t bring andersen over, then he should be resigned. his game is far from perfect, but who’s out there that’s realistically better as the number two center?
marvin – tough call because he’s got a lot of tools but he doesn’t seem to have that killer instinct to be anything more than a supporting player. with that said, i wonder if he might not blossom coming off the bench.
flip – he has to be resigned unless gordon is added. without him the hawks bench couldn’t score with lindsay lohan.
bibby – i see the results. i see how effective he was at times in the playoffs. but i don’t trust what i see. if a legit co-point that can slash and defend could be signed, then bring him back to play 25 mins a game. he gives up what he gets. maybe he’s a good locker room leader, which would tip the scales toward trying to re-sign him.
childress – at least five times during the playoffs all i could think of was how much the hawks needed j. chill. while it sounds like sund isn’t a childress fan, he’d address a lot of needs on this team. he’s so active without the ball …
andersen – bring the big man over already! he’s be such a good addition to this team. size, the ability to shoot the ball, and he’s experienced.
chuckw/deadjournalist
May 22nd, 2009
4:31 pm
MannyT –
childress is still an asset, whether with the hawks or as a trade piece. the fact that he’s unnerved by the riots might push him back to the NBA either her or elsewhere. and if he does decide to come back, that’s good for the hawks – one way or the other.
MannyT
May 22nd, 2009
4:32 pm
Najeh,
I checked out your boy The Sports Guy’s doomsday scenario for moving CP3. While the trade machine numbers might work, Houston would send 4 startes to the Hornets (McGrady, Brooks, Battier, & Scola) while getting CP3, Posey and 2 lead contracts (Peja S. & Tyson C.)
Houston has Yao and CP3. Chandler doesn’t start above Yao and between the 2 you get maybe 82 games as both keep getting injured. Artest is a free agent, so you have essentially gutted your team to get CP3. I don’t see it happening on the Houston end.
Even if the Hornets are cash desparate, do they send away the franchise or do they have a fire sale on the bad contracts? Look at the Knicks this year. They moved to a better contact position without giving up the farm. Why wouldn’r New Orleans go that route before shipping off their top player?
Simmons likes these type of trades. He’s probably a hoot in fantasy leagues. Big trades and sub 500 record.
BWAF
diego
May 22nd, 2009
4:33 pm
I’m hearing that Washington wants to trade their 5th pick, any chance we could trade Marvin Williams? I know, wishful thinking.
I do think the Hawks should talk with Portland and try to land Sergio Rodriguez. He would be great off the bench behind Bibby. And/Or we could try and sign Jarrett Jack.
chuckw/deadjournalist
May 22nd, 2009
4:46 pm
diego – i don’t think washington would trade the pick within their division.
i do like sergio, and i think he’d be a nice fit if portland would want to move him.
truth-serum
May 22nd, 2009
4:52 pm
Trade ZAZA “watch this turnover and the expressway to the basket is now open” Pachulia, along with Mark Bradley and Rick Sund (dumb and Mo dumb)for a 26th round pick.
Marvin will be a star and gets to the line and the rack better than JJ.He can shoot outside. You must remember he only played one year of college ball. If he had stayed four years he be in his second year now. The dude will be a star and a terror, As will Josh who came straight out of high school and would be a rookie if he had went to college. Those two are worth every penny and Josh will develop a shot!
Marvin,Josh,Horford,flip and JJ. Thats the TEAM, Now go get us a center!
Big Ray
May 22nd, 2009
4:55 pm
Mark,
Great blog.
Re-sign Bibby. Let Law go. Okay, fine. But the plan better be more complete than “we’ll just let Flip play 30 mpg behind Bibby and Joe.”
Flip, for the upteenth time, plays better off the ball than as a backup pg. Let Law go, and there needs to be an alternative. By the way, I’m okay with letting him go. Just replace him with somebody that fits.
It amuses the heck out of me to think that some people value Marvin Williams over Josh Smith. Yeah maybe in a vaccum (or with a more balanced roster). Josh is not more expendable than Marvin by any stretch of the imagination. All you hear is that Marvin is more coachable, Marvin is smarter, Marvin is this, Marvin is that.
Marvin is a lot of things, but he is not more valuable as an asset to this team. If he was, then why are people talking about re-signing him for $8 mil per year? Why did we have a losing record with Josh, while Marvin’s absence down the stretch of the regular season was barely a hiccup?
I’ll agree that Marvin makes a more prototypical SF. He’s a steady guy, and he’s better than his stats indicate. Josh may be as good as his stats indicate, but that statement alone is not a complete one…unless of course, you think that Josh absolutely cannot get any better than he is now. I, for one, do not believe that. Josh has greater trade value, despite the greater amount of money that he makes (over Marvin). That alone tells you the deal…
But all of this doesn’t matter. What matters is that “keeping everybody together” is an idealistic assumption that conveniently forgets that there has to be better chemistry and utilization of resources. Otherwise, watch the whole thing go backward.
O'brien
May 22nd, 2009
4:56 pm
Ont thing to keep in mind with Chills. If he does not come back to the NBA this season, he will be an unrestricted free agent next ofseason. Therefore, it is imperative that the Hawks either bring him back, or trade his rights this year, because next year we will get nothing in return.
Chills was good on this team, because he would get a key offensive rebound/putback, and he hustled. I think he would have been a good fit playing with Flip and Zaza on the second team.
benzo a town
May 22nd, 2009
5:07 pm
I would like to see Marvin, Horford, Smith become the big 3 in the next few years so i say we keep marvin. Try to get a good point guard like Maynor or Flyn. Sign Bibby for a few more years let him be there mentor. Try to get a big man for ZaZa and Mo and the rights to J chill.
C – Horford
pf – Smoove
sf – williams
sg – Johnson
pg- Maynor
Bench
Bibby
flip
west
hunter
gardner
rasheed wallace
Mark Bradley
May 22nd, 2009
5:07 pm
So long as I watched Childress, I’d think, “He’s the kind of sub every good team has.” Except that right at the time the Hawks were getting good, he left. I’d love to see him back. If nothing else, he’d ratchet up the second-unit energy level still more.
And you can’t trade Marvin for any draft pick. You can only do a sign-and-trade once free agency opens, which is July 1. The draft is June 25.
Marcus
May 22nd, 2009
5:14 pm
MB
I kinda agre with you: if the Hawks can get a quality PG at #19 to groom to replace Bibby, Acie Law is outta there.
I don’t think we go BIG, as we have a lot of 3 and 4 type players, either on the roster or even holding their draft or contract rights, BJ Mullens does not seem to be worth a 1st round pick (heavy potential but didn’t even dominate as FR, at least he could have been Gred Oden part II befoer declaring for the draft ),and as always if we have a brain fart and draft/trade for a starting C, there is the domino effect of who becomes your starting SF, PF and what to do with all the wing players?
Marcus
May 22nd, 2009
5:18 pm
MB,
maybe your recent post just answered my question, but in one of the blogs (yours or Sekou’s) it was mentioned that someone with the Hawks said they didn’t miss chhildess during teh rg. seson, but in the playoffs definitely he was missed.
Why it that?
Was it because of the injury situation (depth)
or
some intangible that he would have brought to the playoffs that wasn’t necessarily missed/obvious during the reg. season?
Mark Bradley
May 22nd, 2009
5:22 pm
That was Sekou’s line, I believe. He said it to me as we were walking down the street in Beautiful Downtown Cleveland after Game 2, and I readily agreed.
And here’s why I think they missed Childress against Cleveland: Because the Cavs’ defense is so good, you have to find some easy points somewhere. That’s what he does. He runs the floor. He revs the tempo. And he was excellent against the Celtics last spring, if you recall.
Saabotager
May 22nd, 2009
5:23 pm
Gortat (center) in Orlando will come cheap. Keep Marvin. Let Bibby go and pick up Duhon from New York. We will definitely compete next year.
Mark Bradley
May 22nd, 2009
5:28 pm
Here’s my trouble with letting Bibby go: The Hawks went so long without a point guard, it would be scary to think of them without one now that they found him.
Speaking of scary: That Gortat guy. Yow.
BigEasy830
May 22nd, 2009
5:31 pm
No way Mavin takes 6-7 mill per, not even in this economy. Marvin’s a nice guy but the spite factor will definitely kick in if he is offered that and he will kick rocks. I see him wanting around 9. But, Sund did a great job by not signing anyone to extensions, hopefully the economy is so bad Marvin is offered only only 6-7 and Bibby offered around 6, Then it is a win situation for the Hawks. But, since Marvin is younger, he may want to go to another team where he will have a bigger role in the offense and hit a bigger lick on his next contract. We will see. if we lose ZaZa we will not have a 7 footer to bang with the big guys, if we overspend on anyone it has to be ZaZa, there just isn’t any big men out there. We need to keep him.
Mark Bradley
May 22nd, 2009
5:33 pm
You’re probably right, BigEasy. It probably will take more to keep Marvin.
SWAT Native
May 22nd, 2009
5:34 pm
@ Mac: “Moses Malone and Reggie Theus are just the pieces to get us over the top”
That’s cold, man, but dead on target. The Hawks need to keep their core intact and add to it as history has shown us.
glw
May 22nd, 2009
5:42 pm
No way New ORleans moves CP, he is too important and the face of their franchise. But I can see them moving Chandler. And I feel we have the pieces that it would take to get them. Chandler is on the books for about 11.8 next year. If we offer Claxton and the rights for Josh Childress, Randolph Morris ( a big body to help replace Chandler) and a future no. 1 draft pick. New Orleans could buyout Speedy for maybe 2 million and choose to let Childress rights expire if they like, they could save themselves a lot of money. Atlanta could get the physical interior defender they need, which makes Zaza expendable.
Reggie
May 22nd, 2009
5:43 pm
Mark
Do you think there is value around the league in a Marvin Williams? I think he can still get better. On this team he is a 13-15 ppg player. On another team where he has more of a load I think he can be a 17-19 ppg player. thoughts?
ILL-logical
May 22nd, 2009
5:45 pm
How about Andrew Bynum at $12.5 million and Jordan Farmar at $ 1.9 million for Joe Johnson at $ 14.9 million. Joe runs the triangle ( see Ron Harper) which the Lakers need badly and the Hawks get a center and a point guard. Marvin plays the 2 and we get bigger,faster and over time better.
Dr. Dave
May 22nd, 2009
5:46 pm
Gortat is a beast and would be an excellent, inexpensive pickup.
We need to keep Marvin because his upside is huge. There are very few 6′10″ players in the league who can shoot jumpers as well as him, and his rebounding has improved as he has matured. I am waiting for someone, ANYONE, in the Hawks organization to tell Josh Smith that he will be benched if he shoots beyond 15 feet. Once he learns what he can’t do he will be a better player and we can become more serious about getting out of the first round.
Mark Bradley
May 22nd, 2009
5:53 pm
Yes, I think some NBA people would rate Marvin fairly highly. He’s a double-figure scorer and he’s young. I think he could go to a team where he’d get more shots and score 17 or 18 a game. But he’s fourth or fifth in line on the Hawks.
Big Ray
May 22nd, 2009
5:55 pm
Yeah, Josh should never learn to shoot from anywhere beyond a certain point. After all, he will always have that supreme athletic ability, and expanding your game is bad for you.
If we let Zaza walk, we’ll definitely need to get a guy like Gortat.
Big Ray
May 22nd, 2009
5:59 pm
Marvin definitely has some value. How much is the question. Could be a sign-and-trade in all of this. Maybe….
Mark Bradley
May 22nd, 2009
6:02 pm
Marvin could wind up signing a one-year qualifying offer to stay with the Hawks for $6-plus million and then becoming an unrestricted free agent in the summer of 2010. Don’t be surprised if that happens.
DP
May 22nd, 2009
6:04 pm
I’d like to see the Hawks move up into the 10–12 range in the draft to take DuJuan Blair if he’s still available. The guy is a beast on the boards, has the body to defend bigs and has a 7 foot plus wingspan. He ate Thabeet’s lunch this year head to head.
Bibby is far better than what the Hawks had before, but in the halfcourt he effectively plays the 2, sitting on the 3 point line while forcing Joe Johnson to handle the ball. I would like to have a legitimate penetrating point guard to allow Johnson to play off the ball more like Ray Allen. But everybody wants those kind of point guards.
West Coast Hawks Fan
May 22nd, 2009
6:20 pm
I’ve been thinking long and hard about what the Hawks should or should not do to take the next step to become one of the elite teams in the NBA. Everyone on this blog has made excellent points. Here’s my take on things. Change the offensive system. The Hawks need to run and gun. They can be like the Warriors of a couple of years ago when they upset Dallas as a #8 seed in the playoffs. The difference being the Hawks play defense. There isn’t one team in the eastern conference that runs on a consistent basis. We could run teams out the gym. My next point is bring in a center that can run and block shots a la Tyson Chandler. Al Horford then could move to his natural position at the 4 spot. That brings me to my next point. Josh Smith can play the three spot. He needs to get in the gym and develop a consistent jumper if that happens watch out there won’t be a three in the east that can check him including Mr. James. Mike Bibby needs to go. The Hawks need a lead guard that penetrates more to set up his bigs and that won’t be a defensive liability. I believe Rafer Alston is a free agent after this season. He would be perfect for the new Hawks run and gun offense. He penetrates well and he moves his feet well on defense. We would have one the best benches in the league. We should bring back Josh Childress if Marvin doesn’t want to accept his neew role off the bench. That’s a lot if this and if that but these are my opinions.
glw
May 22nd, 2009
6:52 pm
I have the ultimate fantasy and right now its just pure fantasy. But suppose the Lakers get blitzed by Denver, Kobe gets mad, opts out of his contract and becomes a free agent. The Hawks are currently at just under 41 million and the cap figures to be maybe around 57-58 million. Then we dump Speedy Claxton on someone, that leaves us about 22-23 million of cap space. Does anyone get where I am going with this?
PG BIBBY
SG KOBE
SF J JOHNSON
PF J SMITH
C A HORFORD
BENCH
FLIP
MO EVANS
ZAZA
ACIE LAW