Advice on self-protection in a gun-controlled America, courtesy of Crazy Uncle Joe
Only Joe Biden could promote gun control in a way that encourages people to break the law and is more likely to injure innocent people than potential threats.
First, here’s what Biden said, during a Facebook chat Tuesday, he had advised his wife to do:
“I said, ‘Jill, if there’s ever a problem, just walk out on the balcony here, walk out and put that double-barrel shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house.’ … You don’t need an AR-15 — it’s harder to aim, it’s harder to use, and in fact you don’t need 30 rounds to protect yourself. Buy a shotgun! Buy a shotgun!”
Now, in a secluded, mostly wooded area, like the one where Biden said he and his wife live in Delaware, that might not be the worst advice. Not the best, either, but not the worst. But not all Americans live like that. In fact, in his state’s largest city, his advice could land someone in jail. From U.S. News and World Report:
A sergeant with the Wilmington, Del., police department explained to U.S. News that city residents are not allowed to fire guns on their property.
The sergeant, who preferred not to be identified, said that Wilmington residents are also not allowed to shoot trespassers. “On your property you can’t just shoot someone,” he said. “You have to really feel that your life is being threatened.”
In fact, Biden’s advice could land his wife in jail in Delaware:
Defense attorney John Garey — a former Delaware deputy attorney general — agreed, and added that several criminal charges might result if Jill Biden took her husband’s advice.
“In Delaware you have to be in fear of your life to use deadly force,” Garey said. “There’s nothing based on his scenario alone” indicating a reason to fear imminent death, he noted.
There’s more at the link, including visual evidence to suggest the Bidens’ home isn’t as secluded as the vice president let on.
On one hand, the illegality of what Biden suggested has more to do with what one does with any weapon — it’s a lot closer to the controversy at the heart of the Trayvon Martin shooting, though not quite the same — rather than the specific kind of weapon one uses.
On the other hand, it’s rather ironic that Biden’s explanation for how you can still protect yourself in a world without “assault weapons” is that you could always … break another law.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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362 comments Add your comment
MarkV
February 21st, 2013
9:12 pm
Bruno @ 7:35 pm
“In case you forgot, MarkV, I attempted to debate you on a few topics, but you were unable to think for yourself, and could never bring yourself to a point of honesty that a meaningful exchange could occur. As such, you are deserving only of my ridicule.”
Bruno – you are so pathetically full of yourself that you incapable of understanding that other people are not at your beck and call when it comes to the choice of topics for a debate.
Dave
February 21st, 2013
9:15 pm
md, I see you subscribe to the latest NRA talking points – it isn’t the bad government we need guns to defend against, it’s the hurricanes, tornadoes and zombie attacks that government can’t protects us from that justify 30 round clips. Good to know you are current with shifting justifications.
JDW
February 21st, 2013
9:17 pm
@Bruno…”JDW–Let’s look at the facts, shall we. For starters, the swimming pool argument is valid. More pools = more drowning accidents, in the same way that more cars = more deaths by car accident.
From a numerical standpoint, approximately 31,000 people die from gunshot wounds per year in the US. Of these, approximately 19,000 deaths are due to suicide, with 11,000 homicides and less than 1000 due to accidental discharge. Putting into a larger context, approximately 4,000,000 people die each year in the US. As such, less than 1% of all deaths are due to firearms.”
We have had this argument before…first off only 2.5 million people die in the US each year. Second when you strip out natural causes you are left with in order….
Traffic…34,485
Unintentional Poisoning….31,758
Unintentional Falling….24,792
Suicide Firearm…18,735
Homicide Firearm….11,493
That means homicide firearm is the leading cause of death that in not an accident or natural causes. Second that number leaves out the 100,000+ gunshot wounds suffered each year, and the 1.3 million times a year a gun is used in the commission of a crime (29% of all felony offenses), and the estimated 2+ million times a gun is used to intimidate or bully.
Bottom line they are a plauge on our society impacting the lives of millions of citizens each year.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
February 21st, 2013
9:19 pm
it isn’t the bad government we need guns to defend against, it’s the hurricanes, tornadoes and zombie attacks that government can’t protects us from that justify 30 round clips.
What do these dumbazz liberals not understand?
A purported gang member convicted of at least two felonies in the past was arrested for a weapons charge Saturday after Cook County Sheriff’s police officers found an AK-47 near his trailer home in unincorporated Des Plaines.
Aquagirl
February 21st, 2013
9:19 pm
The last time I came home to some “uninvited guests”, there were more than one…….I didn’t have a gun, but I would have preferred the bigger clip as I was outnumbered……
Oh fer chrissakes, just kick the garbage can a couple times and those raccoons will clear out.
Aquagirl
February 21st, 2013
9:21 pm
And I totally can’t believe that post made it through the filter.
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
9:21 pm
Bruno
Haven’t heard 31st of Feb in a long time.
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
9:23 pm
kick the garbage can a couple times and those raccoons will clear out.
They can be pretty tough if you corner one. And if a coon ever gets a dog into water, you’ve got yourself a dead dog. They’ll hop on the back of the dog’s neck and drown him, nearly every time.
Sailfish
February 21st, 2013
9:25 pm
I think kyle figured it out: every time there’s a click, he gets another nick – into his account. Those nickels add up pretty quickly, why refuse them or limit them? I’m sure he’s a capitalist at heart.
Dave
February 21st, 2013
9:25 pm
AF, it’s been many decades since I’ve been called a dumb ass or as you put it dumbazz, to my real life or virtual face, indeed I was a juvenile as was my antagonist. I just love the nostalgia. All that junior high banter. Gosh, I just really miss it. Thanks.
Del
February 21st, 2013
9:26 pm
Joe Biden is and has always been someone who fails to engage brain before putting mouth into gear. He clearly doesn’t know anything about shotguns or he would not have made those stupid comments. If you’re going to use a shotgun for self defense you should not choose a double barreled gun but rather a tactical 12 gauge, pump action with an extended magazine like a Rem. 870 or a Bull Pup Mossberg. Most in home encounters with a home invader will put you within 25 yards of an adversary. Within that range your shot pattern utilizing a 2 3/4 quarter inch 00 buck round or even a 3 inch magnum will only be about the size of a half dollar. Maximum pattern expansion about the size of a plate won’t occur until the shell expands at about 45 yards. The bottom line is you will need to aim and not aim, aimlessly with a shotgun in spite of what Joe Biden says. BTW…good idea to have a backup semi-auto with a high capacity magazine because your adversary probably will have one at the ready.
Aquagirl
February 21st, 2013
9:29 pm
They’ll hop on the back of the dog’s neck and drown him, nearly every time.
Nothing against dogs, but I hope md is smarter than that.
Dusty
February 21st, 2013
9:29 pm
Well, I kinda like Joe Biden. He doesn’t act like he’s Lil Lord Fauntleroy, God’s gift to the world. He just acts like Joe. If he got where he is without being smart, I’d be surprised.
Besides that, he’s been through some tough times. You do know his first wife and 13 month old daughter were killed in an auto accident back in the seventies. It doesn’t get much worse than that.
I will now confess that I have a GUN!! One of these days I shall get some ammunition to go with it.
I’d hurry but I don’t even have a balcony. First things first ya know..
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
February 21st, 2013
9:29 pm
ave- It’s been decades since I encountered an intelligent dummycrat – what’s your point?
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
9:31 pm
Del
Especially if it’s a full choke. Real tight pattern.
Sailfish
February 21st, 2013
9:31 pm
“And if a coon ever gets a dog into water, you’ve got yourself a dead dog. They’ll hop on the back of the dog’s neck and drown him, nearly every time.”
Racoons crack me up, they really are peaceful critters but that’s a good thing to know. I guess it’s true that you can learn something new every day.
Bruno
February 21st, 2013
9:32 pm
We have had this argument before…first off only 2.5 million people die in the US each year.
The US has 315,371,722 people right now with a life expectancy of 78.7 years. That comes out to about 4,000,000 deaths per year on average by my math.
Dave
February 21st, 2013
9:33 pm
AF, you’ve made it.
JDW
February 21st, 2013
9:35 pm
@Bruno and Dusty…to our conversation yesterday on paying cash for medical bills…here is a story about a guy that had to and it is not pretty…
http://healthland.time.com/2013/02/20/bitter-pill-why-medical-bills-are-killing-us/?hpt=hp_bn18
Amoung other tidbits these really stand out…
“Dozens of midpriced items were embedded with similarly aggressive markups, like $283.00 for a “CHEST, PA AND LAT 71020.” That’s a simple chest X-ray, for which MD Anderson is routinely paid $20.44 when it treats a patient on Medicare”
or
“Every time a nurse drew blood, a “ROUTINE VENIPUNCTURE” charge of $36.00 appeared, accompanied by charges of $23 to $78 for each of a dozen or more lab analyses performed on the blood sample. In all, the charges for blood and other lab tests done on Recchi amounted to more than $15,000. Had Recchi been old enough for Medicare, MD Anderson would have been paid a few hundred dollars for all those tests. By law, Medicare’s payments approximate a hospital’s cost of providing a service, including overhead, equipment and salaries.”
I’ll finish with this one….
“The hospital’s hard-nosed approach pays off. Although it is officially a nonprofit unit of the University of Texas, MD Anderson has revenue that exceeds the cost of the world-class care it provides by so much that its operating profit for the fiscal year 2010, the most recent annual report it filed with the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, was $531 million. That’s a profit margin of 26% on revenue of $2.05 billion, an astounding result for such a service-intensive enterprise”
To put that in perspective…one of those enterprises I managed was a software company…we sold air and turned a profit margin of around 15%.
Thulsa Doom
February 21st, 2013
9:43 pm
“They can be pretty tough if you corner one.’
And they don’t retreat in a staredown either. I was in the Fla. keys years back just a few miles before hitting the 7 mile bridge. We pulled off on this tiny little key about 10 yards wide on either side with a row of 5-6 very small trees about 6-8 feet high. Anyway its pitch dark cause they’re no lights around and I’m doing my bidness in the bushes and I feel like I’m not alone. I yell to Bill who is 10 yds away in the ocean spotlighting crabs and other critters. He spotlights the bush where I’m standing and there’s a coon staring straight at me about a foot away from my nose. We engage in about a 2 minute stareoff with neither of us moving nary a muscle. Finally I knew I’ld been beat. Plus I needed a fresh beer. So I just started laughing at this coon sitting up in this bush or small tree less than a foot from my face. I moved back and he finally kinda moved and made his way over to some of the other bushes. To this day I still can’t imagine what the hell that coon did for food. He was miles away from any keys of substantial size and it looked like there was little to no freshwater. I can only surmise he was eating up on all those slow moving crabs in the shallows but otherwise I can’t figure out what the hell he lived on. And he was big.
Bruno
February 21st, 2013
9:45 pm
Bottom line they are a plauge on our society impacting the lives of millions of citizens each year.
JDW–You should know by know that I’m a straight shooter, no pun intended. I can see things from the standpoint of someone who doesn’t like guns. Less guns = less gun deaths. And I acknowledge your point that many people misuse guns to intimidate others, sometimes their own spouses. At the same time, however, I think that gun advocates have their points as well. Of the 19,000 suicides and 11,000 homicides, that number wouldn’t go to 0 in the absence of guns. Guns are used for legitimate hunting, and should be available for self-protection.
As such, I’m kind of in the middle regarding guns. Though I absolutely support the 2nd Amendment, I also think that society has a legitimate interest in restricting certain weapons from being sold.
Aquagirl
February 21st, 2013
9:48 pm
I’m doing my bidness in the bushes and I feel like I’m not alone.
Let’s see…dark secluded spot…Florida Keys….fly unzipped…..you’re darn lucky it was a raccoon.
Thulsa Doom
February 21st, 2013
9:51 pm
JDW,
That hospital profit margin of 26% was highly unusual. Most average around 5% from what I saw.
On the routine stuff I’m all for getting the insurance company out of the way and letting people shop for and buy their own medical care and services for routine stuff. People and Docs generally have no incentive to keep costs down because a third party- insurance co., is footing the bill. When its your own money you’re a lot more careful about how you spend it. When its a third party’s money not so much.
Let people pay for the small stuff and the expected routine care out of their own pocket and let insurance do what its supposed to do- pay for unexpected and catastrophic events such as heart attacks, cancer, etc. Car insurance doesn’t pay for normal routine expenses such as new tires, oil changes, maintenance. And health insurance shouldn’t pay for routine stuff either IMO.
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
9:52 pm
I’ve caught coons in a trap (trying to catch coyotes) and you have to be careful when you let them out. They come out fast and they’re usually not in a good mood. Possums on the other hand are so dimwitted ’til you have to pretty well make them get out of the trap. A lot of times, you open the door but they just can’t figure it out. And you hear of rabid coons, up in here in the Hills, every 3-4 months.
Bruno
February 21st, 2013
9:57 pm
@Bruno and Dusty…to our conversation yesterday on paying cash for medical bills…here is a story about a guy that had to and it is not pretty…
JDW–In case you missed it, your article completely supports my contention that the biggest problem in our health care system is cost. I work in the industry, so am very well aware of the abuses the article points out in terms of price gouging. And, as I attempted to explain, the main driver of this is the third-party payment system. No savvy consumer would be willing to pay the prices listed in your examples. And they wouldn’t have to in a more honest system.
The solution that I advocate on the capitalistic side is to restore consumerism to health care. Which means returning insurance to its rightful place as a hedge against catastrophic loss, and paying for routine services out of pocket. Which means preventing mds from receiving direct kickbacks from pharmaceutical companies for prescribing certain meds. Which means removing the barriers set in place by the state medical boards designed to limit the number of doctors in practice. Which means changing malpractice laws so that docs don’t have to practice defensively, thereby leading to unnecessary tests. Which means………the list goes on and on.
There’s plenty we can do to get the waste out of health care without resorting to a government takeover.
Dusty
February 21st, 2013
10:01 pm
JDW
I couldn’t get your attachment to open up but I wish you would also report on how much “free” work is done at MBAnderson. Everything in a hospital is expensive and much of it cannot be resused. Equipment, analyzers, every thing sterile, it is all expensive. Infection control is expensive and a constant effort is made to prevent it. Many of the people in a hospital have had years of education and training, ’specially the doctors but also many others. Quite rightly, they do not expect to be paid like they are doing manual labor.
As to cash and high bills, the best treatment does not come cheap. It won’t come cheap with Obamacare and therefore you won’t get the best.
Sounds like your patient could pay cash for his treatment. He wanted the best and he got it.
I”d love to know how to cut medical bills and we must try. Mlost people don’t want any “corners cut” when it is THEIR treatman. We can just call up a Medicine Man which does work for some people but not for most.
td
February 21st, 2013
10:01 pm
Bruno
February 21st, 2013
9:32 pm
We have had this argument before…first off only 2.5 million people die in the US each year.
The US has 315,371,722 people right now with a life expectancy of 78.7 years. That comes out to about 4,000,000 deaths per year on average by my math.
Don’t forget to add the 54,000,000 aborted Americans since 1973.
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
10:07 pm
Which means preventing mds from receiving direct kickbacks from pharmaceutical companies for prescribing certain meds.
Used to have a doc who was always asking about my prescriptions. I said, well I’ve got 3 more refills and I’ll be back for a check-up before they’re out. He kept on and on about how he didn’t mind writing me a new one, so I figured there must’ve been a reason.
Also one time, I told him insurance would no longer pay for a certain drug. He says, “I can give you this one; it’s the same thing and it’s cheaper”. So my question was, if it’s the same thing and cheaper, why haven’t I been getting that one all along.
I also stopped for a sandwich today and happened to sit next to a couple of drug company reps. One was schooling the other on how to take advantage of 3rd party payers, as a sales tool. Quite slick the guy was.
md
February 21st, 2013
10:08 pm
“Oh fer chrissakes, just kick the garbage can a couple times and those raccoons will clear out.”
Wish they were merely racoons…..it isn’t a pleasant feeling to come home to folks that violate one’s space. Just another wake-up call that the predators do actually exist outside the movies…..
md
February 21st, 2013
10:12 pm
Dave, just being realistic. So you ban larger clips…..and then the bad guys just acquire more smaller clips.
Have you read the old gun ban? It is for show…..it is illogical. It distinguishes assault rifles as those with various cosmetic differences. Same gun without the cosmetics? Not banned…….
It’s staged theater so folks like you can feel all warm and fuzzy that our benevolent masters did something……..
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
10:14 pm
I wish you would also report on how much “free” work is done at M D Anderson.
A friend of mine’s son went to M D Anderson. The first thing they told then was, if they had insurance, that was good (they did) but if they didn’t he would be treated anyway. The 2nd time (2nd cancer) he went in, they told them they would send his chemo regimen here, so they wouldn’t have to go to Texas so much. It was sent to a major Atlanta hospital and they were told, you either have insurance or you pay in advance. So M D Anderson is alright by me.
And Jerry Glanville was instrumental in getting my friend’s son in there, so you’ll never see me say a bad word about him, on sport’s blog or anywhere else.
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
10:15 pm
So you ban larger clips
And people will just make their own. Any machinist can do it.
md
February 21st, 2013
10:21 pm
“To put that in perspective…one of those enterprises I managed was a software company…we sold air and turned a profit margin of around 15%.”
I get a kick out of bottled water…..getting to cost as much as gasoline. I carry a bottle with me and fill up at the free drinking fountains…….
Lil' Barry Bailout - OBAMAPHONE!!!
February 21st, 2013
10:22 pm
JDW: one of those enterprises I managed was a software company…we sold air and turned a profit margin of around 15%
———————
Sounds like that company was mismanaged. Decently-run software companies have profit margins upward of 50%.
md
February 21st, 2013
10:26 pm
“And people will just make their own. Any machinist can do it.”
Yep. The bad guys don’t much care do they….
I have an old .22 semi-auto non clip that holds 22 rounds…..won’t make very big holes but 22 of them might hurt a bit.
Dusty
February 21st, 2013
10:26 pm
Hillbilly,
I’d say your doctor does not want a call Saturday evening that someone is out ;of medicine and there are no refills. You keep track ;of yours but everybody doesn’t. When Emory Clinic calls to remind someone of an appointment, they also say bring your meds with you. Then the doctor knows exactly where you are on meds by looking at the containers. Also, new meds come out frequently. I understand there is a several year waiting period (by FDA) that generic drugs cannot be made like the new drugs. After the waiting period, the price drops and generics are available..
Some doctors I know don’t even give out samples any more. One told me he did not want to be accused of helping the drug companies so he stopped giving all samples. I don’t think the drug companies even give out many samples any more..
Some of the drug companies will give their medications free if you can prove that you are really in need. I know that Lilly has a program like that. I think there are others. You just don’t hear much about that.
We should remember that drug companies are usually the ones who do the research and the delivery of new drugs. They spend millions doing that. We should realize the benefits along with our complaints. (NO, I don’t work for a drug company!) .
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
10:32 pm
won’t make very big holes but 22 of them might hurt a bit.
Most gunshot victims actually die of blood loss, anyway.
Dusty
The Doc kept insisting on writing a new prescription, even after I told him there was no need.
Thulsa Doom
February 21st, 2013
10:32 pm
“I get a kick out of bottled water…..getting to cost as much as gasoline. I carry a bottle with me and fill up at the free drinking fountains…….”
md,
Same here. My cheapass has a pur water filter and then I take an empty plastic jug or big mug and fill it with my purified filtered water which is far, far more cost efficient. I don’t buy case after case or gallon after gallon of bottled water. I can’t understand for the life of me why people do that. All that plastic going into the environment is not a good thing and on a cost basis I just don’t understand why people do it.
Thulsa Doom
February 21st, 2013
10:37 pm
Hillbilly D,
Maybe those possums are docile in a cage but out in the open I’ve come upon them twice. They made a nasty little growl and screech and bared them little fangs. Scared the hell outta ole Doomy and I got the hell outta there. I’ve had post traumatic possum disorder ever since.
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
10:37 pm
I get my water out of a well but I put it in glass jars. Can’t stand that plastic taste.
Lil' Barry Bailout - OBAMAPHONE!!!
February 21st, 2013
10:40 pm
Democrats are deathly afraid that government spending will be cut and no one will notice.
They’re working hard to make sure that doesn’t happen.
Democrat voters: Idiots.
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
10:41 pm
All that plastic going into the environment is not a good thing and on a cost basis I just don’t understand why people do it.
For every 6 bottles used, only one makes it to the recycle bin. Manufacturers use 17 million barrels of crude oil to make the bottles. Not very environmentally conscious.
http://kids.nationalgeographic.com/kids/stories/spacescience/water-bottle-pollution/
Bruno
February 21st, 2013
10:45 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEMuAnFH_lM
Politico
February 21st, 2013
10:47 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kd2sOqbIcaM
Dusty
February 21st, 2013
10:48 pm
Hillbilly
Sounds like your doctor has had some trying experiences with refills. Does make you wonder though.
I’ve known my doctor so long I try to take her advice. She’s ways been such a good friend and good doctor, I feel most fortunate. But then I’ve trusted docs for a long time. My father and my uncle were doctors. I got off to a good start with them and that never changed. They were special.
Politico
February 21st, 2013
10:49 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjrIa3szE3w
Hillbilly D
February 21st, 2013
10:50 pm
Davey Johnstone was the real star of this song.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAhpIjazFN0
Nite all.
Politico
February 21st, 2013
10:51 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCVRE6qXdwU
Politico
February 21st, 2013
10:54 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d369pj8YG_s
BADA BING
February 21st, 2013
11:02 pm
I am not a gun expert or a physics major, but shotgun pellets fired straight up in the air go up, and then lose their speed and power. They come down only at the speed of falling objects due to gravity. A pellet hitting you at that speed will sting, but not penetrate the skin. Remember the old story about dropping a penny off the Empire State building, and killing someone? Can’t happen. Fired in an arc would be a different story, but the pellets would still be traveling slower due to the greater distance traveled. Don’t you people watch ‘MythBusters’?