Question on new stadium remains: Why so soon?

If you haven’t yet read Jeff Schultz’s column today about whether it would be “the worst thing in the world if the Falcons moved to the suburbs,” I recommend it. Spoiler alert: Schultz thinks it would not be the worst thing in the world if that were to happen.

Although I think downtown is ultimately far preferable to the suburbs for the Falcons’ home games, Schultz makes a number of good arguments. But this is the part to which I want to draw your attention (with emphasis added):

The [San Francisco] 49ers couldn’t get a downtown stadium deal done, so they’re moving to Santa Clara, 30 to 45 minutes away. … By the way, Candlestick Park is 53 years old.

The [New York] Giants left the old Meadowlands stadium, which was 34 years old. The [Miami] Dolphins left the Orange Bowl, which was built in 1939. The [Dallas] Cowboys and [New England] Patriots left stadiums that were opened in 1971. The [Washington] Redskins left RFK Stadium, built in 1961.

The Georgia Dome opened in 1992.

For me, much of what’s disquieting about the drive to ditch the Dome is the timing. In 2017, by which time the Falcons insist they’ll be in a new stadium, the Dome will be a mere 25 years old.

The stadium the 49ers are leaving is twice as old (53) as the Georgia Dome will be in 2017. The same goes for the Dolphins’ old stadium (48) when their new stadium opened in 1987.

The stadium the Giants and New York Jets replaced was about as old (34) as most Georgians probably believed the Dome would be when it was replaced. Ditto for the old stadiums of the Cowboys (38), Patriots (29) and Redskins (36).

I think it’s fair to assume most Atlanta residents recognize that the Dome will have to be replaced at some point in time. I think it’s also fair to assume most of us wonder why that point in time is coming so soon after the Dome was built.

Of course, the Dome will need money for repairs if it stays open. As the AJC has reported, professional estimates of those costs run from $115 million by 2020 (when the Dome would hit 28 years of age) to $401 million by approximately 2035 (when it would be 43 years old).

So, it seems questionable to most people outside the Falcons organization that the Dome has to be replaced so soon. If we having this discussion five to 10 years from now, it would be going a lot differently.

– By Kyle Wingfield

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545 comments Add your comment

Politico

February 15th, 2013
4:33 pm

Kyle

You already know the answer. Because Blank (the Falcons) and the NFL want it. Simple as that.

Let’s not kid ourselves. The deal will be done. Most of the posturing from Deal and the Legislature is just that…. posturing. There will certainly be a few who will stick to their guns, but in the end, most will come on board.

I’m with you, but it is going to happen.

md

February 15th, 2013
4:39 pm

Just keep hitting the snowbirds with the hotel tax on their way through, they will be none the wiser……

indigo

February 15th, 2013
4:41 pm

I seem to remember, years ago, that the Minnesota Vikings located their stadium in the suburb of Bloomington.

Don't Tread

February 15th, 2013
4:50 pm

Two words: skybox revenue. The revenue from these (space rental plus catering plus bartender plus whatever) exceeds the revenue that would be collected by regular seats covering the same area, probably by a lot. And you can still put regular seats underneath/over most of it, or stack the skyboxes.

That’s ok…I have a big widescreen HDTV to watch the game on if I so choose…without all the hassle (and parking lot attacks).

Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories

February 15th, 2013
4:52 pm

Be careful of what you wish for, the Chicago Bears rebuilt Soldier Field, now it looks like a spaceship crash landed on the lakefront.

Rafe Hollister preparing for an Obamanist America

February 15th, 2013
4:53 pm

md

Don’t know where I saw it the other day, but I believe the AJC. Someone made an excellent case about why this motel tax is not just something out of towners pay for. The people of Atlanta pay for it indirectly.

Kyle

Why is no one talking about replacing Lambeau or the Superdome in NOLA. This bunk about having to keep up with the rest of the NFL is about as legit as the bunk about the dome needing $350,000 in repairs. Arthur is not making as much with the team in the Dome as he feels he should, is the reason we need a new stadium, nothing more, nothing less.

Hillbilly D

February 15th, 2013
4:56 pm

My take on this is that the Falcons aren’t going anywhere. This is just Arthur playing the same ol’ game that’s been played time and again. Cough up some public bucks for my business or I’ll take my football and go somewhere else. This isn’t even a question of making the Falcons a profitable business, any NFL franchise is a license to print money, basically. If you can’t make a profit with an NFL team, you’re a doofus, just to put it plainly. This is just Arthur wanting to make more money and there’s nothing wrong with that. Of course, it’s easier to make more money, if you can find somebody else to pay the bills. So I don’t really care what Arthur does or where he does it but he needs to do it with his own funds or some other private funds, if he can find somebody to fork some out.

Arthur is smart enough to know that he can play this little game and the city and state will give him whatever he wants.

JDW

February 15th, 2013
4:58 pm

I am a bit ambivalent on this…on the one hand I think the Dome was and remains a huge mistake…football indoors in Atlanta BAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.

On the other it has been built and it seems a bit silly to spend a bunch of tax money on a new venue unless there is a tangible ROI which I have not seen.

Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories

February 15th, 2013
4:58 pm

NASA predected the asteriod would come close.

It did.

What are you talking about?

indie – This morning nasa had the Roid showing up at 1:15 pm, it didn’t arrive until 2:24. This is basic stuff we’re talking about. This thing wasn’t speeding up or slowing down nor was it stuck in traffic. We’re talking basic trig here and they blew it.

Meanwhile, they spend all their time bobbing around in the ocean, mounting thermometers next to building exhaust vents and forging climate data, even though their mission is to KEEP AN EYE ON SPACE.

Seems as though we’re not getting the bang for our buck.

Centrist

February 15th, 2013
5:00 pm

Why is Mayor Reed now so hot on replacing it?

(How rich will he be after 8 years of being Mayor?)

The Ghost of Willie B

February 15th, 2013
5:01 pm

Why not build a multi-use entertainment, shopping and residential development on the site of the old GM plant in Doraville. There is easy access to two interstates and a MARTA station as well as major local roads. The facility could host other events and be an entertainment draw all year long. Also, if it were a privately owned facility it would be much easier to manage the hobos/peddlers/gypsy lots that plague downtown.

Hillbilly D

February 15th, 2013
5:04 pm

Blank is on the board of directors of Cox Enterprises, whose media holdings include The Atlanta Journal-Constitution.

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/local/atlanta-falcons-stadium-debated-at-city-hall/nWNf7/

josef

February 15th, 2013
5:07 pm

I had a lot to say about this, but I think Hillbilly said it all @ 5:04.

This is just yet another act of “The Little Foxes.”

indigo

February 15th, 2013
5:07 pm

Aesop

If you have evidence NASA is forging any data, let’s see it.

Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed

February 15th, 2013
5:12 pm

“If you have evidence NASA is forging any data, let’s see it.”

Pay attention. No claim of forging data was made. Mistakes and mismanagement?

You betcha!

And if they can’t get basic space velocities right, why do we think they can get temperatures right?

Hillbilly D

February 15th, 2013
5:23 pm

josef @ 5:07

They always talk about how these things “help the neighborhood” but Atlanta Stadium and Turner Field have been in pretty much the same location, since 1966 and that neighborhood doesn’t seem to have been helped one bit by it. At least not for the people who actually live there.

Cheesy Grits is gone but not forgotten

February 15th, 2013
5:29 pm

If you have evidence NASA is forging any data, let’s see it.

He doesn’t because they aren’t.

They are just on the wrong side of the Global Warming political aisle for him so they must be all bad.

NASA seems to think Global Warming is real.

Excuse me if I take their word over an internet redneck.

Cheesy Grits is gone but not forgotten

February 15th, 2013
5:31 pm

And if they can’t get basic space velocities right, why do we think they can get temperatures right?

They get a helluva lot more right than they get wrong.

They sent a man to the moon basically usually less than a modern PC built 10 years ago.

Have a try at that and let me know how it works out for you.

Let me know when you land something on a dime on Mars.

josef

February 15th, 2013
5:35 pm

Hillbilly

My Uncle Ralph used to call Atlanta “the city the magpies built.” A cache of cheap and tawdry baubles. Its Hubbards will throw away a diamond for a ball of tinfoil,

Cheesy Grits is gone but not forgotten

February 15th, 2013
5:36 pm

Bottom line NASA has had a lot more successes than failures.

Do they fail sometimes. Sure. What they are doing isn’t easy.

Considering though they have produced some amazing results.

Hillbilly D

February 15th, 2013
5:40 pm

Sounds like Uncle Ralph was a very smart man. Some folks will do anything for a dollar, especially if they’re the one getting the dollar.

Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories

February 15th, 2013
5:43 pm

Last Thursday, Certified Consulting Meteorologist Joseph D’Aleo and computer expert E. Michael Smith appeared together on KUSI TV [Video] to discuss the Climategate — American Style scandal they had discovered. This time out, the alleged perpetrators are the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) and the NASA Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS).

It seems that stations placed in historically cooler, rural areas of higher latitude and elevation were scrapped from the data series in favor of more urban locales at lower latitudes and elevations. Consequently, post-1990 readings have been biased to the warm side not only by selective geographic location, but also by the anthropogenic heating influence of a phenomenon known as the Urban Heat Island Effect (UHI).

They only like the real hot locations, for some odd reason.

http://www.americanthinker.com/2010/01/climategate_cru_was_but_the_ti.html

Rafe Hollister preparing for an Obamanist America

February 15th, 2013
5:49 pm

We need to all realize that the Dome opened in 1992 and that Turner Field opened in 1996. The way things are going, by the time construction is completed for Arthur’s Taj Mahal, the Braves are going to say, well, are we being taken for granted or what? Our stadium is as old as the Dome was when you started planning to replace it, and by the way, it is so hot in July, maybe you should plan on building us one of those new roof optional facilities, like they have in Houston.

Rafe Hollister preparing for an Obamanist America

February 15th, 2013
5:53 pm

md

Here is the article where the writer explains the myth that only snowbirds passing through are adversely effected by the hotel/motel tax.

http://blogs.ajc.com/atlanta-forward/2013/02/12/the-myth-of-the-hotel-motel-tax/

indigo

February 15th, 2013
5:54 pm

Tiberius – 5:12

Aesop said “and forging climate data”

“No claim of forging data was made”, you say?

Hillbilly D

February 15th, 2013
5:54 pm

Rafe

Yep, it never ends.

getalife

February 15th, 2013
5:55 pm

indigo

February 15th, 2013
5:58 pm

Aesop, Tiberius

On Feb. 7, NASA said the asteriod would make it’s closest pass at 2:24.

They were exactly correct.

Do you think myself and others don’t notice your lies?

http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2013-02-07/national/36968849_1_da14-don-yeomans-space-rock

Cutty

February 15th, 2013
6:00 pm

If you don’t live in the city limits of Atlanta, this really has nothing to do with you. The republican led legislature punted on the issue, as we knew they would. Funny how republicans always want to the states and local governments to always make the final decision Until its about something they don’t want. Worry about the corruption on Gwinnett or numerous meth labs scattered around the state. When will Wingfield write about any of that?

josef

February 15th, 2013
6:09 pm

CUTTY

I live in the city limits of Atlanta, And it REALLY has nothing to do with me! :-)

independent thinker

February 15th, 2013
6:12 pm

Kyle – the paint is starting to peel in places and they are having trouble getting the stains out of the urinals- good enough reason to tear that sucker down sooner than later

MarkV

February 15th, 2013
6:18 pm

Aesop’s @4:58 pm,
“This morning nasa had the Roid showing up at 1:15 pm, it didn’t arrive until 2:24.”

Reality check:

March 6, 2012 … the small asteroid 2012 DA14 will pass within about 3.5 Earth radii of the Earth’s surface on February 15, 2013. … with its closest Earth approach occurring about 19:26 UTC …

http://neo.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news174.html P

An asteroid passed relatively close to Earth around 2:24 p.m. ET Friday. As scientists had been predicting all week, it did not hit.

19:26 UTC = 2:26 pm EST

Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories

February 15th, 2013
6:30 pm

Yes, I digress, the time I was looking at was when it would first enter the Earth’s “ring.”

But they still fake climate data.

getalife

February 15th, 2013
6:43 pm

“Do you think myself and others don’t notice your lies?”

It is all they do so to be expected from them.

Bruno

February 15th, 2013
6:44 pm

My song dedication to the Atlanta stadium:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94bdMSCdw20

“They paved paradise and put up a parking lot”

Rafe Hollister preparing for an Obamanist America

February 15th, 2013
6:46 pm

Aesop: Glad you didn’t act like a liberal and say something like “At this point, it is over, so what difference does it make”!!!!!!(in a high screeching voice)

You admitted your error, something only conservatives do, good!

Bruno

February 15th, 2013
6:47 pm

the paint is starting to peel in places

independent thinker–You just inspired the next song dedication from Gentle Giant:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIl5RCLNy1E

Extremely deep cut ^^^^^^

indigo

February 15th, 2013
6:48 pm

Aesop

I repeat, do you have actual proof NASA fakes ANY data?

indigo

February 15th, 2013
6:49 pm

Rafe

I have “stood corrected” more than once here.

Bruno

February 15th, 2013
6:49 pm

I live in the city limits of Atlanta

Damn, you guys are making it easy for me tonight:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sw8mpxp-MHM

Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories

February 15th, 2013
6:59 pm

I already provided and still stand by it. See 5:43.

Bruno

February 15th, 2013
7:05 pm

I am a bit ambivalent on this…on the one hand I think the Dome was and remains a huge mistake…football indoors in Atlanta

I was a season ticket holder for the Falcons in the late 80s/early 90s. After the first season in the dome, my buddy and I canceled. Football is meant to be played outdoors. But, as many other posters have pointed out above, it’s a money thing.

They always talk about how these things “help the neighborhood” but Atlanta Stadium and Turner Field have been in pretty much the same location, since 1966 and that neighborhood doesn’t seem to have been helped one bit by it. At least not for the people who actually live there.

A couple of my former clients in Atlanta were long-term Marta Board members. They said that the reason that Marta doesn’t go directly to the stadium is that Joseph Lowery and others led protests to stop Marta from “destroying” their neighborhoods. IMO, it would have been the best thing to happen to some of those neighborhoods. I’m not exactly sure what they thought they were “preserving”.

Bruno

February 15th, 2013
7:06 pm

indigo

February 15th, 2013
7:07 pm

Aesop – 6:59

I found the site where you got your “proof”.

It is exactly what I expected from you.

Going thru life filled with fundamentalist ignorance is really NOT a good thing.

http://babbleonbabylon.wordpress.com/2009/03/10/american-thinker-propaganda/

Hillbilly D

February 15th, 2013
7:10 pm

Bruno @ 7:05

For what it’s worth, I’ve always heard the reason MARTA doesn’t go to Turner Field is that the Braves didn’t want it. It’d cut into parking revenue.

Bruno

February 15th, 2013
7:14 pm

Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories

February 15th, 2013
7:15 pm

According to H. Sterling Burnett, a senior fellow at the National Center for Policy Analysis (NCPA), NASA scientist and famous man-made global warming proponent James Hansen’s well-known claims that 1998 was measured as the warmest year on record in the U.S. were the result of a serious mathematical error.

NASA has been forced to correct calculations for temperatures of the last 120 years taken from ground-based measuring facilities. Critics of the man-made global warming theory have long been vocal that these measurements are distorted because the ground, and even more the urban ground where most of these measurements took place, is warmed considerably by human activities and cannot accurately represent atmospheric conditions.

Next.

Bruno

February 15th, 2013
7:17 pm

HD @ 7:10–There may be some truth in that as well.

Hillbilly D

February 15th, 2013
7:20 pm

Bruno

I also was told, by somebody who should know, that in the old Atlanta Stadium deal, the city was supposed to get money after a certain revenue/income figure was reached each year but that the trigger number was never reached, so they never got a dime.

Bruno

February 15th, 2013
7:22 pm

HD–Any feeling toward this Clapton number?? Pretty basic chord sequences, but he seems to hit all of the right notes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMiBbAvsFfY