Clinton: Here’s how you ‘patronize’ gun owners without being patronizing
This is just Bubba being Bubba, in a way no other politician today can quite manage. From Politico:
Former President Bill Clinton warned a group of top Democratic donors at a private Saturday meeting not to underestimate the passions that gun control stirs among many Americans.
“Do not patronize the passionate supporters of your opponents by looking down your nose at them,” Clinton said.
“A lot of these people live in a world very different from the world lived in by the people proposing these things,” Clinton said. “I know because I come from this world.”
So far, so good. Sound political advice, and seemingly genuine toward both the donors he’s advising and the people he’s advising them not to patronize. Toward the end of the story, however, we get this:
“A lot of these people … all they’ve got is their hunting and their fishing,” [Clinton] told the Democratic financiers. “Or they’re living in a place where they don’t have much police presence. Or they’ve been listening to this stuff for so long that they believe it all.”
“Don’t have much police presence” — OK, fair enough. That can be said about a number of rural areas. But “all they’ve got is their hunting and their fishing”? That’s not as bad as then-candidate Barack Obama’s bitter-clingers remark (also to Democratic donors) about religious and/or gun-totin’ folk. But it is, in my experience growing up in North Georgia around a lot of people who liked to hunt, an overwrought generalization at best and a bad caricature at worst.
Yet the real kicker here is the part about how they’ve “been listening to this stuff for so long that they believe it all.” Which is, of course, completely different from, say, wealthy coast-dwelling Democrats who have never held a rifle but have heard (on NPR) all about how anything newer than a musket can only be used to murder dozens of people at a time.
Yes, that’s another overwrought generalization. The point is that so many liberals love to be told they’re the only right-thinking people who consider all sides and then come to the only rational conclusion — which happens to be a liberal one, time and again — and no one is better than Clinton at making them believe that’s all true.
Which is, I have to admit, a gift. A rather patronizing gift, but a gift nonetheless.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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192 comments Add your comment
Hillbilly D
January 22nd, 2013
2:24 pm
and liberal men are ruled by their women.
All men are ruled by their women. It starts with Mama and just continues on. Anybody who doesn’t believe that is just in denial. (IW&SH)
JDW
January 22nd, 2013
2:29 pm
@Kyle…in case you forget I am quite well acquainted with the in and outs of British life and politics…I spent a lot of time there…years in fact. Labour is a center left party much like the Democrats of the US. The Liberal Democrats tend to be further left on social issues. The current edition led by Clegg has been a bit more center right on some fiscal issues but that is a departure from the norm. Either would be considered Liberal in the US.
As for the book already read it.
Now, the data in question does not come from Britain…it comes from the US and it is quite simple…
“Evolutionary psychologist Satoshi Kanazawa at the London School of Economics and Political Science correlated data on these behaviors with IQ from a large national U.S. sample and found that, on average, people who identified as liberal and atheist had higher IQs.”
There is a simple correlation between IQ and liberal/conservative self identification in the US at the current time. The disparity between those that self identify as “very conservative” vs. those that self identify as “very liberal” is about 14 points.
Looking for supporting evidence…Pew found that only 6% of scientists today are Republicans…6% !
Bottom line is this…Conservatism at its core (Goldwater/Bill Buckley-type conservatism) is a perfectly legitimate and intellectually sound ideology but modern conservatism (today defined by the likes of Reagan/Bush/Palin) has evolved into a predominantly anti-intellectual movement.
That tends to produce disparity in the numbers
Logical Dude
January 22nd, 2013
2:31 pm
Hillbilly: A Federal firearms permit for an automatic weapon, is considerably more difficult to obtain than a driver’s license.
Which is why I was saying that I was being silly.
CC
January 22nd, 2013
2:33 pm
Rush:
Please don’t confuse MarkV by giving him factual information. It deestroys his universe!
@@
January 22nd, 2013
2:35 pm
Hillbilly:
All men are ruled by their women. It starts with Mama and just continues on.
Up to a point.
Then there’s the adversarial relationship….the woman who loves the combat AND the combatant, equally.
(ISH)
JamVet
January 22nd, 2013
2:35 pm
That’s probably why 53% of women vote democrat.
Cool.
Female self-hatred.
Not something one sees everyday.
But it does serve the sluts, prostitutes and FemiNazis right for not doing as Rush commands them.
Just ask Todd Aiken and Richard Mourdouch…
Kyle Wingfield
January 22nd, 2013
2:35 pm
JDW @ 2:29: The Tories would be considered liberal in the U.S. And before 2008, the Democrats would have been considered rather conservative in the U.K.
You keep insisting on the validity of the self-identification. I keep going back to the parts of the study that seem to undermine said validity. When you consider how misinformed people (on both sides) often are about what others believe, you can grasp how meaningless these kinds of studies are.
JamVet
January 22nd, 2013
2:39 pm
For those Republicans out there (because NO ONE else is crazy enough to assert it) who absolutely insist that the United States of America is a non-democracy:
Liberal democracy is a form of government in which representative democracy operates under the principles of liberalism. It is characterized by fair, free, and competitive elections between multiple distinct political parties, a separation of powers into different branches of government, the rule of law in everyday life as part of an open society, and the protection of human rights and civil liberties for all persons. To define the system in practice, liberal democracies often draw upon a constitution, either formally written or uncodified, to delineate the powers of government and enshrine the social contract. After a period of sustained expansion throughout the 20th century, liberal democracy became the predominant political system in the world.
A liberal democracy may take various constitutional forms: it may be a constitutional republic, such as France, Germany, India, Ireland, Italy, or the United States, or a constitutional monarchy, such as Japan, Spain, or the United Kingdom. It may have a presidential system (Argentina, Brazil, Mexico, the United States), a semi-presidential system (France and Taiwan), or a parliamentary system (Australia, Canada, India, New Zealand, Poland, the United Kingdom).
luangtom
January 22nd, 2013
2:45 pm
Hey, Clinton was the one that convinced the media and the country that oral-sex with Ms. Lowinski did not constitute infidelity. The media and the country bought it, didn’t they? So, why not say that the Right listens to things and believes them. We all sure know that the Left does.
Our country and its leaders learned alot from the government of pre-WWII Germany. If the media says it enough, the citizens will believe it. Look at what happened there………..gun-control was “for the safety of the children”…..look what that got them and will get us.
Hillbilly D
January 22nd, 2013
2:48 pm
Then there’s the adversarial relationship….the woman who loves the combat AND the combatant, equally.
Seen a lot of those and never have understood it.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
January 22nd, 2013
2:48 pm
I’d like to weigh in on this whole IQ discussion -
Nancy Lanza described her son to friends as a genius of sorts with a high IQ who was able to complete his high school studies in the 10th grade.
Yeah, he probably would have voted democrat.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
January 22nd, 2013
2:51 pm
I’ve known a lot of highly “intelligent” people in my life that didn’t have a bit of common sense. They were always thinking about weird things. And a couple of them got killed because they were off in dreamland and paying any attention to what was going on around them.
CC
January 22nd, 2013
2:51 pm
luangtom:
All of that is dependent upon what your definition of “is” is . . .
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
January 22nd, 2013
2:51 pm
“not” paying any attention, of course.
yuzeyurbrane
January 22nd, 2013
2:57 pm
Truth is always a defense.
Dave
January 22nd, 2013
2:58 pm
That is indeed Clinton being Clinton, or to patronize, Bubba being Bubba. Having a slow “reasons to bash moderate former Presidents” day?
Lil' Barry Bailout - OBAMAPHONE!!!
January 22nd, 2013
3:01 pm
Liberal men ARE women.
southpaw
January 22nd, 2013
3:03 pm
LBB @3:01
I’m almost afraid to ask, but–
What then are liberal women?
Lil' Barry Bailout - OBAMAPHONE!!!
January 22nd, 2013
3:04 pm
Libs think their messiah is a genius, and yet four years with zero progress on unemployment.
Politico
January 22nd, 2013
3:07 pm
“Liberal men ARE women.”
As he opines and wails from a step stool……………
JamVet
January 22nd, 2013
3:08 pm
…zero progress on unemployment.
Riiiight.
Because we are still hemorrhaging hundreds and hundreds of thousands of jobs a month like we were in 2008.
You did a heckuva job, connies…
Politico
January 22nd, 2013
3:10 pm
Kyle
Pretty good article, but just reading the comments of some of your right leaning regulars, the same can be said as was mentioned about liberals in your next to last paragrah
But if it made you feel good to post it, what the heck
Have a good one
Lil' Barry Bailout - OBAMAPHONE!!!
January 22nd, 2013
3:14 pm
What then are liberal women?
———-
Whatever they are, they think the world owes them free contraceptives and partial-birth abortions.
Lil' Barry Bailout - OBAMAPHONE!!!
January 22nd, 2013
3:17 pm
JamVet: Riiiight.
——–
Unemployment higher today than four years ago.
PMC
January 22nd, 2013
3:18 pm
Police are rarely there when you do need them and always there when you don’t.
MarkV
January 22nd, 2013
3:21 pm
Rush @ 1:57 pm: “A AR15 was not used in the shooting in Connecticut but was recovered in the suspects car. Maybe the AR15 just decided to walk into the school on its own since, you know, guns kill people.”
A large quantity of unused ammunition was recovered inside the school, along with three semi-
automatic firearms found with Lanza: a .223-caliber Bushmaster XM15-E2S rifle, a 10mm Glock handgun and a 9mm SIG Sauer P226 handgun.[18][19][17][20][62] High capacity 30 round clips were recovered with the rifle.[18] Outside the school, an Izhmash Canta-12 shotgun, 12 gauge, was found in the car Lanza had driven.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Hook_Elementary_School_shooting
JamVet
January 22nd, 2013
3:22 pm
Unemployment higher today than four years ago.
Liar.
Junior Samples
January 22nd, 2013
3:22 pm
If you need 10 rounds or more to fall a deer before reloading, I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest more practice.
JDW
January 22nd, 2013
3:27 pm
@Kyle…”You keep insisting on the validity of the self-identification. I keep going back to the parts of the study that seem to undermine said validity. When you consider how misinformed people (on both sides) often are about what others believe, you can grasp how meaningless these kinds of studies are”
I think the self-identification part is the really interesting part. For most of the last 30 years the word “liberal” has been a disparaging term used by those on the right. Now what we are seeing is a resurgence in acceptance and even an embrace of the term. At a macro level I think that is another trend against the current crop of Republicans. Over time demographics and other trends such as “liberal” self identification are going to force a move to the center or a move to irrelevancy.
As for the misinformation…yep there is a lot on both sides of these arguments, but I don’t think that renders the studies meaningless. One of the things you learn when trying to get large numbers of people to do what you want is that truth and reality are really meaningless. Everyone has their own version, the trick is trying to make what you are trying to accomplish fit in their narrative. That is what makes the way people see themselves as the really important bit.
@@
January 22nd, 2013
3:28 pm
And here comes AmVet right on cue.
I am powerful beyond text.
schnirt
Female self-hatred.
Not something one sees everyday.
Imagine that, AmVet…a woman who can think outside “the box.”
Hillbilly:
Seen a lot of those and never have understood it.
We disagree on principle but our goals are the same. The old adage…”How do we get there from here?”
Dusty
January 22nd, 2013
3:32 pm
Well, heck, I have to get all these super superlatives straight here. Never saw so much “intelligence” paraded around. It’s enough to make universities close shop after hearing what these intellectuals call “smart”.. But never mind. Here’ s my “WHO IS SMARTER” chart & other Cliff Notes
—————————
smartest—–dumbest
^^^ ^^^
liberals conservatives
women men
elephants giraffes
dogs cats
gators lizards
snakes worms
crabs shrimp
oysters plankton
bacteria viruses
This research was done by the Higher IQ Section of the San Diego Zoo in their Annual Treatise Review of Higher Learning Snafus and Less Than Human Liberal Leanings. . For further information contact: Chairman Gorill Baboo B.S, M.S.,PhD in the AJC Banana Unit.
FOOTNOTE: The Feds just dropped the $$ for this study. A statistical review now shows that CONSERVATIVES are more intellectual than liberals. Absolutely!.
PS: For those who did not understand the review, this is a “flight of fancy” not drawn from facts. Sho nuff!
East Lake Ira
January 22nd, 2013
3:32 pm
Make no mistake. I’m a liberal gun owner and I want to take all your – cons – guns away. I’ll surrender mine as well but only whey you crazy mfers do the same. Since you won’t volunteer, we’ll be there shortly to collect ‘em.
Deal with it.
Now, you threaten me in 5, 4, 3, 2…
Junior Samples
January 22nd, 2013
3:33 pm
“Clinton: Here’s how you ‘patronize’…”
“This is just Bubba…”
Rising above the fray Kyle?
MarkV
January 22nd, 2013
3:36 pm
CC @ 2:33 pm: “Please don’t confuse MarkV by giving him factual information. It deestroys his universe!”
January 18, 2013
STATE POLICE IDENTIFY WEAPONS USED IN SANDY HOOK INVESTIGATION;
In previous press conferences, the Connecticut State Police clearly identified all of the weapons seized from the crime scene at Sandy Hook Elementary School.
To eliminate any confusion or misinformation, we will again describe and identify the weapons seized at the school crime scene.
Seized inside the school:
#1. Bushmaster .223 caliber– model XM15-E2S rifle with high capacity 30 round clips
#2. Glock 10 mm handgun
#3. Sig-Sauer P226 9mm handgun
Seized from suspect’s car in parking lot:
#4. Izhmash Canta-12 12 gauge Shotgun (seized from car in parking lot)
http://www.ct.gov/despp/cwp/view.asp?Q=517284&A=4226
Hillbilly D
January 22nd, 2013
3:39 pm
And all this time I thought viruses were smarter than bacteria…………
Hillbilly D
January 22nd, 2013
3:42 pm
For the music lovers…….
http://www.theboombox.com/2013/01/22/beyonce-inauguration-2013-singer-lip-synched-her-performance/?ncid=webmail2
Matz
January 22nd, 2013
3:49 pm
Mr. Wingfield,
I just read this piece, and from the tone of it, you are the one looking down your nose at others. So Pres. Clinton made some frank observations. What of it? Are you going to say you didn’t jump on the opportunity to leave your native corner of Notmuchtado, Georgia to fill your life with new, different, and exciting things? Please. Since when is Pres. Bubba from Bubbaville obligated to put shinola on the manure pile to keep from offending your delicate, “open-minded” small-town sensibilities? Oh right; he’s not.
@@
January 22nd, 2013
3:58 pm
Notmuchtado, Georgia?
Things to do in Georgia
HDB
January 22nd, 2013
4:06 pm
Del
January 22nd, 2013
2:00 pm
“HDB, — If education produces greater prosperity than economically the state of Texas, a red state outperforms California and New York both blue states. I guess that the education system in Texas must do a few things better.”
If you check the education system ratings, New York and California students are outperforming those in Texas…..
Kyle Wingfield
January 22nd, 2013
2:03 pm
Kyle…the systemic designs for the private sector preclude its being effective enough to handle the myriad problems of society; in fact, the private sector is limited by money, reach…and in certain cases, motivation. As I stated…the VOLUME is the key here! In a nation of 320M people, lets use as an example…25% need assistance….80M people….the private sector could probably reach 10% efficiently (8m)…that leaves 72M people without access to certain services. The government is the only entity that could address that volume! The efficiency scale would decline due to the volume…but it could be handled. The design of the private sector would cause a systemic breakdown when the capacity exceeded a certain percentage of the design……130% let’s say!!
Dusty
January 22nd, 2013
4:08 pm
Hillbilly,
Viruses are not smarter than bacteria. They are just meaner. If you have ever had the flu, you know that is true.
RGB
January 22nd, 2013
4:11 pm
Liberals are all hot now for background checks even though every FFL holder is required to execute such a check before selling a gun.
Liberals are quick to seize on checks for private sales but cannot explain why people who lie on background checks are almost never prosecuted. Of about 70,000 cases of such lying reported to the feds annually, only about 400 are prosecuted.
What’s the value of calling for more laws when many of the ones now on the books aren’t enforced? Answer: it makes liberals FEEEEL better.
Hillbilly D
January 22nd, 2013
4:12 pm
Dusty
I’d rather have a smart adversary than a mean one……..they’re easier to deal with.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
January 22nd, 2013
4:16 pm
New Zealand environmental advocate launches campaign to ban cats as pets.
You can have my guns but when you libs come for little Killer, we’ll scratch your eyes out.
RGB
January 22nd, 2013
4:19 pm
Though I didn’t listen to it, I heard that Obama’s inauguration speech was written at an eighth-grade level and that it was the fourth lowest level of all such speeches in history.
Give him credit: Obama knows his audience.
Steve
January 22nd, 2013
4:20 pm
You guys lost the election and the majority of voters are outnumbering your stubborn, ignorant, paranoid ways. Deal with it. Or hell, move to South America or the Middle East.
Dusty
January 22nd, 2013
4:25 pm
Hillbilly,
I’ve been meaning to ask you, have you read any of Jeff Shaara’s novels? I”ve been reading “The Glorious Cause” (American Revolution) and he seems accurate on facts with a whole lot of them. You probably prefer straight history books but this one seems close. Just a little conversation thrown in to keep it a little lighter.
So far , Washington, Franklin, Lafayette, Greene, Cornwallis,Hale ….good! Howe, Clinton, Hessians, Arnold….bad. It is fairly interesting. .
@@
January 22nd, 2013
4:36 pm
Two-word description of the Inaugural Address: “Djobama Unleashed” … #FreeToFightForAll #HopeWIns
—
Van Jones (@VanJones68) January 22, 2013
Tacky but typical for Jones. A call to all comrades?
mbtc
January 22nd, 2013
4:36 pm
Bruno:”In an honest moment, most liberals will admit that they believe that they are more intelligent AND more compassionate than the average conservative.”
Wouldn’t take more than a casual scroll down through the comments of lil Barry, Rafe, etc. on a typical day to see why.
Bruno must have gotten beat up over at Bookman’s a few times too many and is now lurking around over here with his feefees all hurt. Remind me again, are liberals limp wristed babys or jack booted thugs. I can never for the life of me keep that straight.
md
January 22nd, 2013
4:38 pm
Boy, all that talk about logic and ideology sure fizzled out fast when confronted with logic……
Hillbilly D
January 22nd, 2013
4:40 pm
Dusty
Haven’t read that. My reading is pretty much 99% non-fiction; it’s far more interesting to me than fiction but to each their own.
I’ve never thought that highly of Washington as a general but the one thing he did have going for him is that he was persistent. That’s probably what made the difference, in the long run. He had his high points and low points like all of them but persistence was why he won. Of course, the French get some credit and the contributions of the O’er Mountain Boys are overlooked by the “Major Historians” that somebody, we won’t mention, is so fond of.