Why the fiscal cliff debate is like a poker hand — and the GOP is losing a lot of chips
Here’s how I see Speaker John Boehner’s failure to pass his own Plan B tax plan in the House last night:
Some people liken these fiscal-cliff negotiations to playing chess or checkers, as one unnamed, senior House Republican did in this excellent write-up of the post-failure mood in the House by National Review’s Robert Costa. Assuming I understand correctly why and how that metaphor is being made, I think it’s inapt because it suggests this debate is proceeding in isolation from everything else Congress has done in the past and will do in the future.
I think it’s much more like one hand in a game of Texas Hold ‘Em, with the chips representing political capital. With both poker chips and political capital, having more means you have more leverage — because those who have less than you don’t have as much margin for error. They have to play it a bit safer.
This particular game of poker, in which House Republicans face President Obama and the Senate Democrats, has been going on for two years. The GOP had no seat at the table following the 2008 election and had to watch Democrats play each other in hands we’ll call the Stimulus, Auto Bailout and Obamacare. The way those hands went dictated the results of the 2010 elections, which put the House Democrats out of the game and allowed the GOP to buy back in.
Between the 2010 elections and the 2012 elections, there were a few small pots and one big one, for the Debt Ceiling. President Obama and the House GOP both put a lot of chips on the table for that one, but it turned out they were both holding a pair of 2’s and so they split the pot. (In reality, it was a bit more like the chips on the table were vaporized and everyone was worse off politically, but hey, there’s no perfect metaphor.)
Heading into the 2012 elections, each player had roughly the same size pile of chips, and a lot at stake. The victory by Obama and the somewhat larger majorities for Senate Democrats meant the House GOP’s pile was smaller than it was before. They weren’t out of the game by a long shot, but they were staring at players with larger piles. So they had to be very canny with how they played the next big hand, the Fiscal Cliff.
As the players kept making bets, the pot kept getting larger. The House GOP obviously didn’t know which cards the other two players were holding, but it knew its hand was decent — certainly not a royal flush, but we’ll say it was three of a kind (Boehner’s Plan B) with two more cards to be revealed (how Senate Democrats and then Obama reacted if Plan B passed the House). That meant the GOP could possibly wind up with four of a kind and significantly boost its odds of winning the hand.
There were signs the other two were bluffing, especially the confidence Senate Democrats were showing (in saying all day Thursday there’s no way Plan B would pass the Senate, a very good sign Senate Democrats didn’t want to have to vote it down and be seen rejecting steady tax rates for 99.8 percent of taxpayers).
Boehner seemed to believe this hand was his best bet to win more chips and thus leverage for future hands, and he put even more chips in the pot (by rolling out Plan B publicly). But before Senate Democrats could raise or call, he suddenly folded instead. In poker, no one tells the player what he has to do, but in Congress, that does happen to leaders sometimes.
As a result, the House GOP is basically left watching as Obama and the Senate Democrats play out this hand. Republicans now have a lot fewer chips, and even though a lot of them have a good feeling about the cards they’ll be holding when the next hand is dealt — the next round of the Debt Ceiling — there are no guarantees. And, with fewer chips, they’ll have to be even more careful and wily when playing that hand.
Maybe winning a comparatively smaller pot in that next hand will boost the GOP’s odds in the larger game going forward. Maybe someone else will come and sit at the table to play that hand instead of Boehner (I don’t know if the speaker erred by taking his plan public without knowing he had the votes or committed the larger sin of being unable to keep the votes he thought he had, but neither possibility bodes well for his ability to hang on as speaker). Maybe this will turn out well for Republicans.
But I don’t see how.
P.S. — No, my chief concern in this debate is not what happens to the Republican Party. But it seems to me that Democrats now are well-positioned, if they want, to make sure taxes don’t rise for good on people earning less than $200,000 per year ($250,000 for married couples) while raising them on everyone else. While I don’t think that ultimately would be good for the country, it seems likely to me that that’s what will happen at this point no matter what — which is why I’ve focused today on the politics of it all.
(UPDATE at 6 p.m.: I am signing off the blog until after the holidays, so comments will be going through moderation until I’m back on Jan. 2. In the meantime, have a merry Christmas and a joyous start to 2013!)
– By Kyle Wingfield
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
168 comments Add your comment
Aquagirl
December 21st, 2012
11:15 am
Play a lot of Poker, Kyle?
Baker
December 21st, 2012
11:15 am
Give Obama everything he wants, which as we all know includes no spending cuts, MAKE IT VERY CLEAR that this is the Obama plan. When we’re back in this same spot in, oh I don’t know, a few months, you come out and slam him for not actually addressing any problem except the, in Democrats minds, the problem of apparently not enough class warfare.
Hillbilly D
December 21st, 2012
11:21 am
To continue with the poker analogy, if you shift gears, you do it between hands, not in the middle of a hand. This hand has been poorly played, in my opinion, so might as well fold and wait for the next hand (which will likely be up by March or April).
curious
December 21st, 2012
11:29 am
It seems the Republicans have folded.
Conservative Republican
December 21st, 2012
11:30 am
You’re right, Kyle. I agree with the conservative side of the House GOP from 50,000 feet. It’s just that sometimes they don’t understand the value of a strategic retreat when you’re not holding the cards. For the life of me, I don’t understand why they want to “die on this hill”.
East Cobb RINO, Inc (LLC)
December 21st, 2012
11:30 am
The face saving way out for Boehner is to quietly allow 25 or so lame duck GOP reps to support the discharge petition and have that bill passed (he knows if that bill gets to the floor it will pass). Then he can still put on his conservative hat when making public statements that he did not support it. With a revenue part of the equation resolved, the GOP could begin to press for budget cuts. If the dems do not want to go along after that, it will look bad on them.
oops
December 21st, 2012
11:31 am
There’s a distinct possibility, with Pelosi being dealt back in, that tax rates are going to go up higher than the Clinton era tax rates.
Republican intransigents just screwed conservatives. Crazy.
Lil' Barry Bailout -OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
11:32 am
Obozo is Phil Hellmuth.
Centrist
December 21st, 2012
11:33 am
I don’t think there is ANY chance Republicans are going to pass a tax reduction on only those earning less than $200,000 per year ($250,000 for married couples) in January. Obama has already moved higher to $400K, and a Politico article said he might go above $700K to get a deal. I expect we all go over the tax cliff unless there is an overall tax and spending agreement.
There is still a chance for such an agreement next week between Christmas and New Year’s Day. Even it goes another couple of weeks while pressure builds even further, it can easily be made retroactive. The real sticking point is spending – Obama/Democrats want too many mirrors and smoke along with less spending cuts than real tax increases.
The media is pretending Boehner is in trouble – but his House members are just not letting the tax part of the equation to go first. It is “Deal, or No Deal” for them.
Rafe Hollister preparing for an Obamanist America
December 21st, 2012
11:33 am
Well, I thought Plan B was a game of Old Maid. Boehner was trying to stick Obama with the Old Maid card, before he exited the game. I thought he succeeded in his efforts of moving the Old Maid card, even though he lost and is out of the game. I think the Old Maid card is in Obama’s hand. He can’t put it back on Boehner as he is out of the game. Boehner has shown that negotiating with him, is wasted effort, as he can not enforce any deal he agrees with.
Obama, Reid/Pelosi now have all the pressure to come up with something that can pass the House. Boehner showed that an Obama wish list is not going to pass the house, because a watered down Obama wish list (Plan B) couldn’t pass. So, what do you do now, Barry?
The GOP is going to take the blame for the impass, but Barry will get the blame for the economic collapse. GOP loses the battle, Barry loses the war, he has to get more flexible or he and the Dems pay big in next election.
GOP needs to hang tough and demand real action to our fiscal health and let Barry keep lobbying for kicking the can down the road, once again.
JDW
December 21st, 2012
11:34 am
Not a bad analogy Kyle. Looks to me like the Republicans started with a bad hand and have played it poorly to this point. My nagging question is Boehner himself, how much of this can he withstand? Seems to me he is really a leader without a constituency at this point. It is not out of the realm of possibility that he tosses in the towel.
JDW
December 21st, 2012
11:36 am
@Rafe…”Obama, Reid/Pelosi now have all the pressure to come up with something that can pass the House.”
Nope, all they have to do is come up with something the American people support. Which coincidentally is pretty much what they have proposed so far. Then it will be up to the House Republicans to reject it at their peril.
Hillbilly D
December 21st, 2012
11:38 am
Obozo is Phil Hellmuth.
In spite of all his “act” and the Poker Brat routine, Hellmuth is actually a pretty good player.
clem
December 21st, 2012
11:41 am
with lapierre’s fiasco linked to repubs….this may be the beginning of the end
oops
December 21st, 2012
11:42 am
Why the far far right guys wanted to do something that would deal Pelosi back in, is absolutely beyond comprehension. Almost.
clem
December 21st, 2012
11:42 am
think hellmuth has over 12million in sanctioned poker winnings, not counting side games and endorsements
Lil' Barry Bailout -OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
11:44 am
If Democrats are so enamored of the Clinton-era tax rates, bring them on. Bring on the sequester, too.
Otherwise the other players at the global poker table are going to know they can push us around. That’s how badly Obozo’s economic and fiscal policies have diminished our stack.
Lil' Barry Bailout -OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
11:47 am
Hellmuth is actually a pretty good player.
——–
He can be, but he’s also a petulant putz who comically believes he would win more if only his opponents were more skilled.
RW-(the original)
December 21st, 2012
11:51 am
Where the Texas Hold ‘Em analogy really goes off the rails is when you’re short-stacked you can no longer play cautiously or you’ll get felted on blinds. Unless you’re saying the House GOP is all in.
Kyle Wingfield
December 21st, 2012
11:55 am
RW: I never said it was a perfect analogy. On the contrary.
That said, I guess it depends on how short-stacked one thinks the GOP is at this point.
Don't Tread
December 21st, 2012
11:59 am
Republicans have squandered many opportunities as of late. I don’t think this one will be any different. As a consequence, there will be tax increases, spending cuts to the military (as Democrats despise the military), and continued attacks on individual freedom from the people who supposedly took an oath to uphold the Constitution. (Did they specify the United States Constitution in that oath or is that just implied? Seems they’re adhering more to the Russian Constitution these days.)
Of course, the whole political system has been going downhill rapidly since Daddy Bush was president, and the slope is about to get much steeper.
Aynie Sue
December 21st, 2012
12:02 pm
The Republican politicians are as crazy as a barrel of cats! I don’t want them playing with the American economy as a hand of poker or a crapshoot.
There is a straightforward solution to this “fiscal cliff”. Since both Democrats and Republicans agree on extending the Bush tax cuts on American earning less than $250,000, and on the budget cuts proposed by President Obama, they should pass those measures now.
If the Republicans want the tax cuts extended for Americans earning over $250,000 per year, and want additional spending cuts, they should propose this in separate bills to be debated next year.
Can politicians be more devious than to refuse to enact measures on which both parties agree?
Duped again
December 21st, 2012
12:06 pm
Kyle
Decent article. The Speaker was going to use this vote to tell the people that the Dems were the problem.
Regardless of where one stands politically or on this issue itself, it was bad bad PR for the Speaker and Republicans.
Any spin won’t change the sting.
Plenty of hands to be played out by both sides before its all over and blunders on each side as well.
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
12:07 pm
Didn’t think it could get worse for the GOP, but with the hard Right’s intransigence, and the NRA’s (more guns in our schools, please) help, it has.
And I personally hate it. This country needs, requires even, two Partys living in the real world. It is simply amazing that, by default, most of the country now believes the only reasonable political Party is the Democrat Party. Democrats! Are you kidding?
Only Republicans, never the Democrats by themselves, could create such a perception.
Unbelievable.
H.E. Pennypacker
December 21st, 2012
12:10 pm
Rep. Boehner’s gambit follows on the heels of Sen. McConnell’s equally ineffective attempt to corner the President where he was forced to filibuster his own bill that was to raise the debt ceiling.
Everyone knew the GOP faced a post election reckoning, but few of us expected it to involve such utter and complete humiliation. For those that wondered if the GOP would reflexively tilt further rightward post election, we are starting to get our answer.
RW-(the original)
December 21st, 2012
12:12 pm
That said, I guess it depends on how short-stacked one thinks the GOP is at this point.
I guess since Washington only plays using our stacks the rules that apply to us don’t matter to them.
IT''S ALL BUSH"S FAULT
December 21st, 2012
12:14 pm
It was the idiotic Republicans that got us to this point . And the idiots that keep voting for the idiot Tea party.
Centrist
December 21st, 2012
12:14 pm
What is lost by the liberal media and leftist Democrats about the tax side of the issue is that many Republican politicians have pledged not to raise taxes above where they are now. The only way they can do so with say another tax rate above $500K in income is to claim they reduced them somewhere else and it is just a re-balancing.
They will easily be able to make that claim in January after the automatic tax rate increases for everyone who pay taxes. They can roll back tax rates for all current incomes below whatever threshold is agreed for a new, additional tax rate on the wealthy and claim to have cut taxes for the vast majority.
Educated folks know most of the additional revenue in any deal will not come from a “Buffet rule” new tax rate, but from the hidden further limiting of deductions, exemptions, and credits.
IT''S ALL BUSH"S FAULT
December 21st, 2012
12:15 pm
Kyle your an idiot. Merry Christmas.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
12:16 pm
HE
Tiberius will come on and tell you that McConnell didn’t filibuster his own bill.
Refer him to the US Senate website.
carlosgvv
December 21st, 2012
12:19 pm
It is like a poker game.
Unfortunately, the American people are forced to fold and come out even more empty handed than ever.
H.E. Pennypacker
December 21st, 2012
12:19 pm
IT”S ALL BUSH”S FAULT,
It’s “you’re” not “your”
Georgia, The " New Mississippi "
December 21st, 2012
12:23 pm
GOP Johnny Rebs and The Tea Party Aryan Brotherhood control the Republican Party. I do not think J-BO can do much of anything except continue to collect paychecks. He will be forced to walk the plank if he works with Democrats over “his kind”. Every man for himself.
td
December 21st, 2012
12:24 pm
The stack of chips go right back up if the Republicans take the following action after next year.
Propose legislation that will put the tax cuts permanently back for those making under $250,000 and pay for it with the ending of all those lib loved programs (planned parenthood, arts, Federal DOE, ect).
I would do it in a series of simple bills: Example: 5% tax cut for people making between $50,000 to $75,000 per year will be paid for by eliminating all funds going to planned parenthood. If dems do not pass it or Obama veto’s the bill then the argument is Obama and the Dems care more about abortion then cutting your individual taxes.
ByteMe - Got ilk?
December 21st, 2012
12:25 pm
“Plan B” was a bonafide blunder. To even propose it was a blunder, because everyone under the sun knew it wouldn’t make it into law, so all it did was make Republicans look weak. Which they are, but why remind everyone of it?
The best plan has always been the default plan: instead of raising a law to raise $1.2 trillion in taxes — which the Republicans hate that idea — let all the existing tax cut laws expire and start over, giving $3 trillion in new tax cuts to everyone and everyone gets to declare victory.
But nooooo… they can’t seem to just shut up and let it happen, they have to stick their chins out for the next right-cross/left-uppercut combination from Obama. Just stupid.
Thomas Heyward Jr
December 21st, 2012
12:25 pm
Naw……….a better analogy is—————
Three parties are playing 3 card gut.
The Democrat is representing the poor moocher class.
The Republicans are representing the crony rich moocher class.
And Gerard Depardieu is representing the dwindling middle class.
.
The Democrats and the Republicans are both cheating , aided by the Lamestream Media Dealer (dealing from the bottom).
And everytime Depardieu tries to leave the game……Obama the Bank turns another one of the brave frenchman’s pockets inside out and discovers another coin…….. points a gun at him and convinces him to play another round.
Uncle Billy
December 21st, 2012
12:26 pm
Let’s go over the cliff. Then in January Harry Reid can bring a clean bill to the floor to lower tax rates on those earning $250,00 or less and see what the Republicans do about it. It will make clear whom the Republicans are really concerned about.
jconservative
December 21st, 2012
12:26 pm
The Speaker has the option of simply letting the tax increase on 100% of taxpayers become the law off the land or bringing the bill up for a vote and counting on Democrats to pass the bill.
And apparently he will have the same option on the sequestered spending cuts.
This goes back to August 2011 where the Republicans made a mistake in judgment, their belief that Obama would be easy to defeat at the polls in November 2012.
For all those who have been hollering for a reduction in deficits, you have your Christmas present; in January 2013 government revenue goes up and government spending goes down.
ByteMe - Got ilk?
December 21st, 2012
12:27 pm
5% tax cut for people making between $50,000 to $75,000 per year will be paid for by eliminating all funds going to planned parenthood
More stoooooopid. I’ll bet td doesn’t know how much money is paid by the Federal government to fund planned parenthood OR how much a 5% tax cut for that particular income bracket costs. Here’s a hint, the tax cut is a many many many times larger.
JamVet
December 21st, 2012
12:34 pm
Looks like thirty years of trickle down and voodoo economics has finally turned into an avalanche.
That may finally bury the Neocon Village of Fiscal Insanity.
Let it snow, let it snow, let it snow!
Aquagirl
December 21st, 2012
12:34 pm
I’ll bet td doesn’t know how much money is paid by the Federal government to fund planned parenthood OR how much a 5% tax cut for that particular income bracket costs.
You’re focused on Marxist tripe like numbers and math. How silly, everyone knows that budget debates are about principles, and as long as you de-fund whatever offends you the money thing will magically solve itself.
If we’d just pray more and bring poor expelled Jesus back to the classroom we’d be running a surplus in no time flat.
Cheesy Grits is gone but not forgotten
December 21st, 2012
12:36 pm
I’ll bet td doesn’t know how much money is paid by the Federal government to fund planned parenthood OR how much a 5% tax cut for that particular income bracket costs.
Thats one of the problems.
They dont really even understand the basic math of what we are talking about here.
They have been lied to about entitlements for so long they just assume the silly numbers in their heads are correct.
JamVet
December 21st, 2012
12:36 pm
Aquagirl, the man is a complete psychopath.
Ask him what he would ultimately like to do to women who have abortions…
Kyle Wingfield
December 21st, 2012
12:38 pm
“They have been lied to about [tax cuts for "the rich"] for so long they just assume the silly numbers in their heads are correct.”
I Democrat-ized it for you, Cheesy.
Cheesy Grits is gone but not forgotten
December 21st, 2012
12:41 pm
I Democrat-ized it for you, Cheesy.
You Sean Hannitized it.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
12:51 pm
A better analogy is that Plan B, the morning after pill, was aborted.
Now there’s an outcome we can all be happy about.
Especially considering that that wasn’t a pile of chips on the table but it was a pile of something. You couldn’t smell it?
Tax hikes together with spending hikes all under the Republican brand name??????
Kyle Wingfield
December 21st, 2012
12:53 pm
Aesop @ 12:51: What “spending hikes”? Plan B was only about taxes.
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
12:53 pm
td, here’s Speaker Boehner’s email address:
http://boehner.house.gov/contact/
Why don’t you send your Party’s Leader your marvelous solution, watch him immediately lead the Party out of a bind into the Promised Land, have Boehner forever grateful to you, and become a Party hero?
Your Nation needs you..
JDW
December 21st, 2012
12:55 pm
@td…”Example: 5% tax cut for people making between $50,000 to $75,000 per year will be paid for by eliminating all funds going to planned parenthood.”
A PERFECT example of how out of touch people are with what is really spent and collected…
The most recent funding numbers for Planned Parenthood indicate it recieved $487 million in Government (state, local and federal) funding. The federal portion of that is roughly $200 million.
There are 18.7 million taxpayers with AGIs between $50,000 and $75,000. In 2011 their aggregate income tax bill was $77 billion.
A 5% tax decrease would cost about $3.9 billion. In short using the federal funds given to Planned Parenthood could fund about 5% of such a tax decrease.
Michael
December 21st, 2012
12:55 pm
The historic dysfunction of the GOP brought about by the TP and Grover and the far right fringe elements, most of whom are from the south.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
12:56 pm
Kyle – I know. So did the House Republicans. That’s why it’s DOA.
Reagan got fooled but some of us have learned.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
12:58 pm
Reagan was fooled by whom?
What spending did he veto?
Kyle Wingfield
December 21st, 2012
12:59 pm
Michael @ 12:55: Remind us, what was Grover’s stance on Plan B?
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
1:01 pm
Reagan was fooled by Tip O’neill. Reagan allowed a modest tax increase in exchange for spending cuts that were never delivered. To this day, the disingenuous liberal contingency (yes, an oxymoron if there ever was one) calls Reagan a tax hiker over it.
Deal with democrats at your own risk.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
1:04 pm
Oh yeah and they call Reagan a big spender over that too, I forgot.
liberals are pretty pathetic when you think about it.
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
1:04 pm
“what was Grover’s stance on Plan B?”
Hypocritical, actually.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:04 pm
Aesop
Reagan made the government spend those dollars? Do tell.
Again, did he veto any spending bills?
Over 12 yrs didn’t Reagan and Bush Sr present 9 budgets out of 12 that were actually higher than eventually agreed upon?
Aquagirl
December 21st, 2012
1:06 pm
Ask him what he would ultimately like to do to women who have abortions…
Please, I just ate lunch.
Jefferson
December 21st, 2012
1:07 pm
It’s not a game to adults. Grow up GOP and accomplish something.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:09 pm
Aesop
Excuse me, it was 7 times. Do look it up when you have the time?
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
1:10 pm
Over 12 yrs didn’t Reagan and Bush Sr present 9 budgets out of 12 that were actually higher than eventually agreed upon?
Yeah and he rebuilt the military that Dhimmi Karter gutted.
Centrist
December 21st, 2012
1:10 pm
@ Aesop – You may be recalling how George H.W. Bush got taken in when David Stockman convinced him to accept tax increases for promised (and of course never delivered) future spending cuts. Bush lost re-election by changing his slogan from “Read my lips” to “Read my hips”.
House Republicans learned from this, and refused to even pass Plan B yesterday. It is “Deal, or No Deal” for them, and waiting until at least next month is what they will do until there is an overall deal on both taxes and spending.
Georgia
December 21st, 2012
1:11 pm
Sure, Kyle, we followed THAT along. Take a couple weeks. You’re fried, man.
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
1:12 pm
“The face saving way out for Boehner is to quietly allow 25 or so lame duck GOP reps to support the discharge petition…”
Of course, THAT’S it! Because the Speaker has throughly demonstrated a remarkable ability to persuade GOP congressmen to vote for legislation that’s not in their personal interest…
JDW
December 21st, 2012
1:18 pm
@Kyle…”Remind us, what was Grover’s stance on Plan B”
Funny how “Plan B” was ok while extending the tax cuts for $250K and under didn’t pass muster….hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:19 pm
“Yeah and he rebuilt the military that Dhimmi Karter gutted.”
But you just said it was the Dems who reneged. You can’t debate the facts so you deflect to the spending on military.
As for military spending it was already going down under Nixon then Ford. The percentage decrease leveled off under Carter. You can argue it should have went back up, but what you can’t argue with fact is where the decreases started.
Keep swinging. You are going to get a hit one day. It will probably be a foul ball, but at least bat will meet ball.
Try to cheer up and enjoy the holidays.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
1:19 pm
After weeks of wrangling, O’Neill and the Democrats would not budge on their insistence that raising taxes had to be part of the final deal. To make it more palatable for Reagan, O’Neill offered a three-to-one ratio of spending cuts to tax increases. On that basis — that the deal, on paper, was designed to result in a net shrinking of government — Reagan and enough Republicans signed on, over the strong objections of many anti-tax conservatives in the Republican ranks.
Thus was concluded the Tax Equity and Fiscal Responsibility Act (TEFRA), signed into law in September 1982. In hindsight, Reagan came to see the deal as one of the biggest domestic errors of his presidency. The tax increases went into effect immediately but as Reagan wrote in his memoirs, “later the Democrats reneged on their pledge and we never got those cuts,” so there was no shrinking in the size of government, and no taming of the deficit.
And now they’re supposed to sign up to Plan B without even a false promise?
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
1:22 pm
You deflected, Pol, I was specifically talking about Reagan- O’neill and you dragged HW Bushie into it.
Pardon me for answering your question.
blackbird13
December 21st, 2012
1:22 pm
@Kyle
“While I don’t think that ultimately would be good for the country, it seems likely to me that that’s what will happen at this point no matter what — which is why I’ve focused today on the politics of it all.”
But that’s why chess is the apt metaphor here. Republicans can keep posturing–moving the pieces around–but in the end it’s checkmate. But if gambling is the preferred metaphor: the Republicans in Congress put all their chips on Obama being a one term president when they agreed to the fiscal cliff. They lost the hand on Election Day and have been trying to welch on the bet ever since.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:22 pm
Aesop
Let this help you out.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/omb/budget/fy2009/pdf/hist.pdf
Kyle Wingfield
December 21st, 2012
1:23 pm
JDW @ 1:18: Plan B meant tax rates stayed the same for a lot more people. I don’t know why you’re confused about this. You might not agree with it — heck, I know you don’t agree with it — but I don’t know why you think Grover would like the Obama plan better than the Plan B.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:24 pm
Aesop
Take out HW and Reagan still proposed several budgets more than Congress agreed on.
How is that small government?
What spending did he veto?
Why did the government grow under his two terms?
Kyle Wingfield
December 21st, 2012
1:24 pm
blackbird13 @ 1:22: It’s never checkmate, because neither side ever wins an issue forever. Disagree? Take a look at what people were saying about gun control as a politically viable issue just two months ago.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:25 pm
Aesop
Great words @ 1:19, but nowhere does it show vetoes on spending.
Why is that?
getalife
December 21st, 2012
1:26 pm
The gop ran out of chips after the election.
I would not be surprised to see our President and senate bail out the speaker.
getalife
December 21st, 2012
1:29 pm
BTW, I don’t think Seniors think it is a game when cutting SS is on the table.
Stop scaring Seniors with your stupid games cons.
Failed the moral test again.
Lil' Barry Bailout -OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
1:30 pm
Obozo and the Democrats “won the election”…why don’t they just handle it?
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
1:31 pm
“Obama, Reid/Pelosi now have all the pressure to come up with something that can pass the House. Boehner showed that an Obama wish list is not going to pass the house, because a watered down Obama wish list (Plan B) couldn’t pass. So, what do you do now, Barry?”
Rafe, Plan B was no Obama wish list of any stripe, and it wasn’t that it couldn’t pass the House, it couldn’t pass the House Republicans.
The bill that ultimately passes will have almost all House Democrats and enough Republicans, absent the Cantor/Ryan cabal. And it will be less than Obama’s last offer to Boehner.
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
1:33 pm
“…why don’t they just handle it?”
Barry, be careful what you ask for…
getalife
December 21st, 2012
1:33 pm
The gop refuse to vote to increase taxes but will vote for a tax cut next year.
Lil' Barry Bailout -OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
1:35 pm
Ending the tax cuts and cutting spending was the price for increasing the debt ceiling. Why does Obozo insist on going back on that commitment?
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
1:36 pm
” the Republicans in Congress put all their chips on Obama being a one term president when they agreed to the fiscal cliff. They lost the hand on Election Day and have been trying to welch on the bet ever since.”
Blackbird13, you nailed it.
WAW
December 21st, 2012
1:36 pm
Okay, I’ll stick with poker theme. The hand was dealt over a year ago and the bets were made. The GOP checked, didn’t bet (didn’t hold enough to open) but held a reserve. The cliff was a plan to win the big pot because after the November elections and “anybody but Obama” would be elected with a majority the both houses of Congress coming in January, the GOP would, with a little help from defeated Democrats, rescue everyone from the cliff and take the pot. Two things went wrong; 1) Obama won! 2) Obama not only won but the GOP lost seats in both houses of Congress. Results, GOP ain’t got no chips. They can talk all they want. They can parade around and show their feathers. The game is now right where it was November 7th, call Senate Bill 3412 for an up or down vote (discharge petition is not necessary if the Speaker will call the bill). Accept the fact that Obama will be the President come January. Accept the fact that unless the GOP refutes its Pledges and gets busy working for the citizens, they will loose the House in 2014. The end of the world didn’t come on December 21, the end of the GOP came on November 6,
td
December 21st, 2012
1:36 pm
ByteMe – Got ilk?
December 21st, 2012
12:27 pm
5% tax cut for people making between $50,000 to $75,000 per year will be paid for by eliminating all funds going to planned parenthood
More stoooooopid. I’ll bet td doesn’t know how much money is paid by the Federal government to fund planned parenthood OR how much a 5% tax cut for that particular income bracket costs. Here’s a hint, the tax cut is a many many many times larger.
I totally understand do you understand that restoring all the Clinton tax increases will not even balance the budget? It is a symbolic and puts the screws to the democrats.
Lil' Barry Bailout -OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
1:36 pm
No vote is required to increase taxes.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
1:37 pm
Poli – Let’s stay on subject. Today it’s why Republicans were wise not to get swallowed up in another democrat spending spree with their name all over it.
Maybe tomorrow Kyle will write an article about how some modest, targeted government spending in the 1980’s unleashed an expansion of the economy that never had been seen before.
Be sure to check back.
Centrist
December 21st, 2012
1:37 pm
Since Obama has already agreed to move off his $200,000 per year ($250,000 for married couples) tax rate increase, why are Kyle and others posting that Republican House members will have to go back and accept it – makes absolutely no sense – especially when they wouldn’t even accept $1 million yesterday?
The biggest problem I see is that Obama and Boehner may come up with a bargain that a majority of Democrats in the Senate ignore Obama, and a majority of Republicans in the House ignore Boehner. Maybe it will come down to the minority parties in the Senate and House agreeing with the majority leaders – strange bedfellows indeed.
Bob Loblaw
December 21st, 2012
1:37 pm
Please. The Speaker went all-in last night with a 2,7 off suit and got beat by a pair of 8’s. Crazy 8s. Probably positioned to his right at the poker table.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
1:38 pm
Ooops, excuse me -
Maybe tomorrow Kyle will write an article about how some modest, targeted government spending in the 1980’s —>helped to unleash<—- an expansion of the economy that never had been seen before.
JDW
December 21st, 2012
1:38 pm
@Kyle…”I don’t know why you think Grover would like the Obama plan better than the Plan B.”
I completely understand why he would like it better…what I don’t understand is why one is ok and the other not. Seems hypocritical to me…but then again it is Grover.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:40 pm
“targeted government spending in the 1980’s unleashed an expansion of the economy that never had been seen before.”
Keynesian I presume?
hahahahahaaha
Have a great holiday.
Hillbilly D
December 21st, 2012
1:40 pm
I guess since Washington only plays using our stacks the rules that apply to us don’t matter to them.
That’s it, in a nutshell.
It’s never checkmate, because neither side ever wins an issue forever.
Exactly, it’s all about pendulum swings.
My own solution, not that I think there’s a snowball’s chance it’ll ever happen is that no member of Congress nor the President, should receive another paycheck, until a budget is passed and signed. You don’t work, you don’t get paid. Think of it as the John Smith at Jamestown approach.
Lil' Barry Bailout -OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
1:45 pm
Most of those in Congress would work without pay–the “fringe benefits” are sufficient for most of them.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:45 pm
HillyBilly D
Senate should be doing a better job in terms of the budget, but “budgets” have been busted before. Since spending is done via appropriations, they can still spend and spend.
Granted it does provide a known benchmark, however in itself it doesn’t provide an automatic mechanism to stop spending.
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
1:47 pm
“…and puts the screws to the democrats.”
Hard to understand those who won’t act in their own interest, Bar?
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:47 pm
HillBilly D
Should have said Congress as a whole, but recently it has been the one failing because the sides can’t come together on numbers once it gets though the House.
breckenridge
December 21st, 2012
1:48 pm
The problem is that there are too many House republicans who are simply uncompromising ideologues. Those that are willing to negotiate and bargain – in other words do something other than obstruct – have largely been drummed out of Congress. It’s not healthy for the party or the country.
Bargaining has always been part of the equation, starting at the Constitutional Convention in 1787, followed by the momentous Dinner Table bargain between Jefferson and Hamilton in 1790. This idea that “we’re not going to compromise” is just poisonous to the political process.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
1:50 pm
*the Senate has been the one failing……..
Lil' Barry Bailout -OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
1:53 pm
Republicans did compromise. They raised the debt limit.
Hillbilly D
December 21st, 2012
1:55 pm
Politico
Valid point but we gotta crawl before we can walk, so to speak. Baby steps are better than no steps.
CC
December 21st, 2012
2:00 pm
“Nope, all they have to do is come up with something the American people support. Which coincidentally is pretty much what they have proposed so far. Then it will be up to the House Republicans to reject it at their peril.”
More taxes, more spending and NO cuts in spending sounds like a wonderful Obama dream!
When my son was eight years old, he declared his intention to jump off the roof of our house. It seemed like a great idea for an eight-year-old who could not see the danger inherent in his wish. I see little difference in that scenario and “something the American people support”.
Centrist
December 21st, 2012
2:01 pm
breckenridge posted “The problem is that there are too many House republicans who are simply uncompromising ideologues.”
While I certainly don’t disagree with that, what about the reverse in the Senate? They were the ones who blocked Obama’s and Boehner’s “Grand Bargain in the middle of 2011.
It is tough to get a centrist agreement with split government. We’re going to need enough minority Republicans in the Senate and Democrats in the House to overcome the majority party idealogues in Congress if we are going to avoid sequestration and across the board tax increases.
IMO Boehner is a little closer to the middle right now than Obama. I think it will take a gradual increase in Medicare age eligibilty to get to the needed spending cuts for an overall deal, and Democrats/Obama say that is currently off the table. Maybe next month.
Lil' Barry Bailout - OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
2:03 pm
You greedy Democrats need to quit begging for your Bush tax cuts to continue, and start paying your fair share. We’re all in this together.
Lil' Barry Bailout - OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
2:05 pm
Here’s an idea: How about the House and Senate do their jobs, beginning with the House drafting legislation, going through the committee process, and then vote it up or down?
nathan's political arsonist
December 21st, 2012
2:08 pm
its headed in the right direction for the american public. f the GOP and the rich
iggy
December 21st, 2012
2:14 pm
Glad is not strip poker. And the particaption of Nasty Pelosi would make it horrific. ACK!!!
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
2:16 pm
Kyle, this may not be the Friday you were hoping for. The AJC reports that the NRA wants, beyond the armed officer at each school, a model program led by a former congressman (guess which Party) for armed volunteers at schools.
2 to 12 George Zimmermans for our children. Because volunteers with guns would NEVER kill an unarmed student. Or end a fight with a double tap to the head.
But I know you’ll be able to persuade any doubters, with some Righteous Logic, as to why it’ll make us all safer. Take a coupla days. Should be easy…
Lil' Barry Bailout - OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
2:18 pm
I heard exactly what I had hoped from the NRA: “Stuff it, liberal fascists”
iggy
December 21st, 2012
2:21 pm
“2 to 12 George Zimmermans for our children.”
Wow…that rich.
PS…Watch Zimmerman get just slap on the wrist, which is the Most he deserves. HA HA!
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
December 21st, 2012
2:34 pm
The Cons got played?
Again?
carlosgvv
December 21st, 2012
2:36 pm
iggy – “watch Zimmerman get just a slap on the wrist”
And then, watch blacks all over the country start to riot.
CC
December 21st, 2012
2:41 pm
“Glad is not strip poker. And the particaption of Nasty Pelosi would make it horrific. ACK!!!”
Best birth control method I can think of . . .
CC
December 21st, 2012
2:42 pm
“And then, watch blacks all over the country start to riot.”
That’s unusual?
Centrist
December 21st, 2012
2:42 pm
For the House to follow a possible Obama – Boehner deal on taxes and spending, it may not happen for 5 or 6 weeks because these 4 very conservative members were a big part of killing Boehner’s Plan B, but will not be in the new Congress at the end of January:
Jeff Landry of LA
Ron Paul of TX
Jean Schmidt of OH
Joe Walsh of IL
Dusty
December 21st, 2012
2:48 pm
At this point, I don’t care what they do in Congress. I don’t care what Obama does either. I don’t care because I have become numb from the constant rebellion against reason and fiscal soundness in Washington..
Kyle is correct in picturing our government leaders as game players. . It is a game.and only a game except it is the country they gamble with like silly losers.
I will read in the news how this wrestling match ends. I’ll complain at tax time and vote in the next election. But neither of those does any good. Washington continues like a battle of spitballs at the OK Corral. Meanwhile the country hurridly heads for Cemetery Hill. Pack your bags for the ride..
Michael H. Smith
December 21st, 2012
2:49 pm
We shall see how the people view this no deal making dealing, Kyle.
obumer saying in effect the Republicans just want do what I want them to do isn’t going to win him many chips either my friend.
JamVet
December 21st, 2012
2:52 pm
Just keep losing elections, bigoted cons. That is the most beneficial thing we can have in this republic right now.
And if you think the past six years have been horrible for you, you are really gonna hate the next six!
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
December 21st, 2012
2:56 pm
Dusty, quit complaining and embrace the Christmas spirit, fer cryin’ out loud….already.
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
2:57 pm
Dusty: “At this point, I don’t care what they do in Congress. I don’t care what Obama does either. I don’t care because I have become numb from the constant rebellion against reason and fiscal soundness in Washington.”
For the life of me, Dusty, I can’t understand why other countries don’t want to be just like us…
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
December 21st, 2012
2:57 pm
Obama doesn’t need to do anything. With no deal, on January 2nd the Dems will introduce a tax cut for those making under $200,000.
Cons will have to agree to it.
Michael H. Smith
December 21st, 2012
3:02 pm
obumer has no less onus to reach the compromise than does the GOP.
It takes two to make a deal and it takes two not to compromise.
obumer is not off the hook.
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
December 21st, 2012
3:02 pm
from twitter regarding LaHood’s wish to add armed guards to schools:
if only we had armed guards at Fort Hood
true dat.
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
December 21st, 2012
3:04 pm
Another good one:
I played a ton of Mario Kart as a kid, which is why I’m always throwing bananas out of my car.
Michael H. Smith
December 21st, 2012
3:05 pm
In fact, obumer has more to prove in making a deal, because he has been RIGHTLY TAG as unable to do what other President’s in the past have done: Which is to work his will with members of the opposite party, as did Reagan and Clinton.
Dusty
December 21st, 2012
3:14 pm
I have the Christmas spirit, FINN. But I did not lose reality while enjoying it.
blackbird13
December 21st, 2012
3:15 pm
“blackbird13 @ 1:22: It’s never checkmate, because neither side ever wins an issue forever. Disagree? Take a look at what people were saying about gun control as a politically viable issue just two months ago.”
Well, of course there’s always another game, but in terms of tax rates during this “game,” Obama’s second term, they are going up no matter what. By agreeing to the fiscal cliff, Republicans in Congress put themselves in “check”; the election put them in checkmate.
Centrist
December 21st, 2012
3:17 pm
Finn posted “With no deal, on January 2nd the Dems will introduce a tax cut for those making under $200,000.
Cons will have to agree to it.”
That is about what Kyle said at the end of the initial blog – but I don’t think so. We may have to see how bad the fiscal cliff is for the economy, and even then the House can pass a bill with their own version of tax increases (revert back to Bush brackets plus new bracket above $750K) and spending cuts including phasing in Medicare age eligibility. Senate would certainly amend – but there would be pressure on Senate, House, and Obama to agree and sign – well above the $200K tax threshold that has already been abandoned by Obama.
Dusty
December 21st, 2012
3:18 pm
JUST SAYING, we are the greatest country in the world.
Some are trying to be just like us. Greece and Spain have gone just a little too far.
Lynnie Gal
December 21st, 2012
3:25 pm
It was my understanding that Plan B wasn’t only tax hikes, but maybe it was an additional bill lumped next to it that cut food stamps and meals on wheels. Boehner added those to sweeten the deal to lure Republicans to tax increases on millionaires, by letting them kick the poor in the gut a little bit before Christmas. It’s Republican’s favorite sport.
Just Saying..
December 21st, 2012
3:25 pm
…we are the greatest country in the world.”
…without a functioning government…
blackbird13
December 21st, 2012
3:30 pm
“Senate would certainly amend – but there would be pressure on Senate, House, and Obama to agree and sign – well above the $200K tax threshold that has already been abandoned by Obama.”
The abandonment of the 200k threshold may be off the table (the Medicare age increase is definitely off the table) after Boeher’s gambit blew up. Since Obama can order Geithner not to change witholding, the income tax increase will not be felt for wage earners immediatley. I think the pressure is going to come on the sequestration side, which hits defense the hardest.
blackbird13
December 21st, 2012
3:34 pm
“It was my understanding that Plan B wasn’t only tax hikes, but maybe it was an additional bill lumped next to it that cut food stamps and meals on wheels.”
That’s correct. The bill changed the defense cuts in the sequestration to social program cuts. That part of “Plan B” passed, but will go nowhere.
Rafe Hollister preparing for an Obamanist America
December 21st, 2012
3:38 pm
JDW
Then it will be up to the House Republicans to reject it at their peril.
The American people have said they support significant spending cuts. All Obama has proposed, regarding reduced spending so far, is more silliness. Just because low information voters think he is cool, handsome, hip, like him, love him, want to have his baby, and think he is our lord and savior, does not mean they support all his policies. His regime is more of a cult of personality than one of ideological purity. Many of his voters don’t know what ideology is, or what his ideology is.
@@
December 21st, 2012
3:39 pm
They’ve left for the holidays?
From what I’ve seen, Harry never returned from Christmas 2011.
Let us fall….let us fall….let us fall.
Centrist
December 21st, 2012
3:41 pm
@ blackbird13 – liberals (especially the media) pretend that Boehner lost Plan B because of more liberal members of the House, when it was just the opposite. This from Politico today: “Boehner told reporters that he was unable to pass a bill with a $1 million threshold because enough members thought it would be considered a tax increase. By that logic, a $250,000 doesn’t stand a chance.”
Of course the $400K threshold is still on the table, the new bottom line and Obama indicated he would go higher. The Constitution states that tax bills must start in the House. They are not about start one with threshold for higher taxes below Obama’s latest offer of $400K, even if they include greater domestic spending cuts.
blackbird13
December 21st, 2012
3:46 pm
I think we’d be better off in the long term if all the fiscal cliff provisions stayed in place. The Pentagon can close some of the 200+ golf courses they operate. Everone, including the middle class, can start paying more for the level of government that a clear majority of the country desires. If only there were a substantial gas tax hike in this fiscal cliff, it’d be a slam dunk winner.
blackbird13
December 21st, 2012
3:54 pm
“Of course the $400K threshold is still on the table, the new bottom line and Obama indicated he would go higher.”
But what maybe you’re forgetting is that once the new year comes, tax rate go up and then anything Democrats agree to will be a tax cut, even if the threshold were 100k. So Republicans will have to vote against or not bring up a vote on a tax cut. And after the new members are seated, it would take less than 20 Republicans to join with House Democrats to a pass a tax cut on those under 250k. The big IF is Boehner, and whether he will bring it up or continue to try and preserve his speakership.
Centrist
December 21st, 2012
3:58 pm
I agree with blackbird13 on maybe being better off accepting the fiscal cliff provisions – unless it really does shock the economy into recession. We may have to test that, or House/Senate/President come to a softer agreement after Christmas or in the 1st quarter of next year.
I am certain that the House is not going to agree to Obama’s current negotiation position (any more than he or the Senate will agree with the Boehner’s current position). This is a lot like union – management negotiations just before a strike deadline. The deadline may get pushed back, there may be an agreement, or there may be a strike with further negotiations. We’re likely to feel some pain before we get more concessions from both sides – but who knows if the House and Senate will ratify a tentative agreement.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
3:59 pm
Centrist
The quote you posted infers nothing about moderate or “liberal” Republican House members. It was a quote from the Speaker and the only inference is in your own mind
getalife
December 21st, 2012
4:01 pm
The gop are still trying to get our President.
That is the game they play.
Disband.
Dusty
December 21st, 2012
4:03 pm
Harry Reed.
Frail knight without a steed.
Obama
The charmer without karma
Joe Biden
Who should be in hiden’
Hillary
Married to tomfoolery
And next to make us merry
Comes purple heart John Kerry.
Oh what gifts the Dems do give us!
Aser796
December 21st, 2012
4:03 pm
President Obama’s American Recinvery and Reinvestment Act…. The gift that keeps on taking.
blackbird13
December 21st, 2012
4:15 pm
@centrist
“liberals (especially the media) pretend that Boehner lost Plan B because of more liberal members of the House, when it was just the opposite. ”
I’ve seen no such commentary from the media. It’s been widely reported by all the outlets that Boehner’s plan failed because an unknown number of Republicans refused to vote for a tax increase on people making over a million dollars a year.
the red herring
December 21st, 2012
4:18 pm
i think letting obama own his mess would be a winner since he formed simpson/bowles and then wanted nothing to do with their recommendations. obama also said he needed 800 billion in new taxes then upped the ante to 1.6 trillion. obama has offered nothing in the way of spending cuts (other than ones that weren’t counted in the budget to start with– medicare cuts that went to obamacare and cuts due to ending the wars). so if we have to go off the cliff to get the spending cuts to go along with tax increases then perhaps that’s the best for the country—take the pain over the next few years in order to get the country at least headed towards a balanced budget which is where we need to be. if you can’t stand up for what you believe in then therein lies the problem.
getalife
December 21st, 2012
4:22 pm
Dusty,
w was a disaster and your party can’t even run a party.
Try holding your party accountable for their failures for a change.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
4:51 pm
Well, it appears as though the Mayan Cataclysm has petered out, much like global warming did.
A bunch of pillow clutching liberals running around shrieking and then bang, nothing happens.
When have we seen this picture before?
If you really want to know when the world is going to end, it will be the first time a democrat tells the truth. The North and South poles would switch up, the center of the Earth would explode, the seas would drain out and our time on this planet will be ova.
But I know that’ll never happen. It’s impossible for a lib to be honest.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
December 21st, 2012
4:54 pm
You mean the Senate website run by Democrats, Politico?
Got it.
Just because you don’t understand how the Senate operates,, doesn’t mean the rest of the real world doesn’t.
Aesop's Fables and other Lib Economic Theories
December 21st, 2012
4:55 pm
I heard that when the first baby was born to a democrat, the doctor slapped the mother.
Cons Need To Know When To Hold 'Em, Fold "Em and Know When To Walk Away
December 21st, 2012
4:56 pm
” What “spending hikes”? Plan B was only about taxes.”
Cons LOVE THE RICH. Ain’t that RICH.
DON’T blame Democrats because CONS don’t want to
raise taxes on the RICH.
DON’T blame the Democrats BECAUSE you just
got THROWN UNDER THE BUS because you are POOR.
DON’T blame the Democrats BECAUSE you just
got STABBED IN THE BACK because you are not RICH.
DON’T blame the Democrats BECAUSE you just
got BAMBOOZLED by your OWN CONS.
“If you ain’t RICH….BLAME YOURSELF.” Herman Cain
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
December 21st, 2012
4:58 pm
Ive finally come to the realization that neither party is willing to fix the fiscal mess they equally contributed to, so give the Dems everything they want. It will just kill the country faster and we can start over once the fires burn out.
Cons Need To Know When To Hold 'Em, Fold "Em and Know When To Walk Away
December 21st, 2012
5:02 pm
@Dusty
December 21st, 2012
4:03 pm
Harry Reed.
Frail knight without a steed.
Obama
The charmer without karma
Joe Biden
Who should be in hiden’
Hillary
Married to tomfoolery
And next to make us merry
Comes purple heart John Kerry.
Oh what gifts the Dems do give us!
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Dusty is RUSTY.
Dusty is a LUSTY con.
Dusty is a FUSSY con.
Dusty is a NUTSY con.
Don’t BLAME the democrats cause you belong to
the party of CRUSTY NUTSIES.
Cons Need To Know When To Hold 'Em, Fold "Em and Know When To Walk Away
December 21st, 2012
5:08 pm
@Tiberius – pulling the tail of the left AND right
December 21st, 2012
4:58 pm
Ive finally come to the realization that neither party is willing to fix the fiscal mess they equally contributed to, so give the Dems everything they want. It will just kill the country faster and we can start over once the fires burn out.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Dems have not KILLED the country so FAR.
The CONS want to THROW people like you under the bus
to HELP THE RICH.
Did they not tell you (the 47%) that they were NOT CONCERNED
about you?
Cons are TRYING TO SAVE THE RICH.
You “poor” cons KEEP defending the people
who don’t care about you.
WAKE UP CONS….
You are being bamboozled by your own CONS.
“If you ain’t RICH….blame YOURSELF.” Herman Cain
Cons Need To Know When To Hold 'Em, Fold "Em and Know When To Walk Away
December 21st, 2012
5:13 pm
@Lil’ Barry Bailout – OBAMAPHONE!!!
December 21st, 2012
2:03 pm
You greedy Democrats need to quit begging for your Bush tax cuts to continue, and start paying your fair share. We’re all in this together.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
GREEDY DEMOCRATS?
What about the GREEDY RICH CONS?
Cons LOVE THE RICH. Ain’t that RICH.
Cons DON’T want to raise taxes on the RICH.
DON’T blame the Democrats BECAUSE you just
got THROWN UNDER THE BUS because you are POOR.
DON’T blame the Democrats BECAUSE you just
got STABBED IN THE BACK because you are not RICH.
DON’T blame the Democrats BECAUSE you just
got BAMBOOZLED by your OWN CONS.
DON’T blame the Democrats BECAUSE your cons
LOVE THE RICH MORE THAN THEY LOVE YOU (the poor).
“If you ain’t RICH….BLAME YOURSELF.” Herman Cain
Hillbilly D
December 21st, 2012
5:16 pm
They’ve left for the holidays?
That’s a good thing. It’s like the Legislature, the less time they spend in session, the less damage they can do.
Well, it appears as though the Mayan Cataclysm has petered out,
That ought to knock the bottom out of the price of survival shelters. Trouble with those shelters is, sooner or later, you got to come out and face the sunshine.
Politico
December 21st, 2012
5:17 pm
Tiberius
Do as always do; kick, scream, huff and puff…………. McConnell’s bluff was called and he stopped the proceedings, ie he filibustered the bill………
But you keep saying he didn’t because it makes you feel better about yourself.
Don’t stay too angry and lonely. Try to enjoy the holidays.
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/votes/112-2012/s225
Politico
December 21st, 2012
5:18 pm
http://www.senate.gov/
S 3637
Don’t fall off your step stool and have a great night little fella
And do have a Merry Merry and a Happy Happy
Politico
December 21st, 2012
5:27 pm
“In relation to the Senate’s initial consideration of a bill or resolution, there usually can be at least
two filibusters: first, a filibuster on the motion to proceed to the measure’s consideration; and
second, after the Senate agrees to this motion, a filibuster on the measure itself. If the Senate
cannot agree to take up a measure by unanimous consent, the majority leader’s recourse is to
make a motion that the Senate proceed to its consideration. This motion to proceed, as it is called,
usually is debatable and, consequently, subject to a filibuster.14 Therefore, the Senate may have to
invoke cloture on this motion before being able to vote on it. Once the Senate adopts the motion
to proceed and begins consideration of the measure itself, a filibuster on the measure then may
begin, so that cloture must be sought anew on the measure itself. Except by unanimous consent,
cloture cannot be sought on the measure during consideration of the motion to proceed, because
cloture may be moved only on a question that is pending before the Senate.”
http://www.senate.gov/CRSReports/crs-publish.cfm?pid=%270E%2C*PLW%3D%22P%20%20%0A
Politico
December 21st, 2012
5:32 pm
McConnell’s objection, no different than any Dem when the Republicans held the Senate is considered a FILIBUSTER and that is how it goes down for the OFFICIAL RECORD
All the semantics, linguistics and theatrics will not change that in any shape, form or fashion
getalife
December 21st, 2012
5:37 pm
This is a congress created crises.
Self inflicted like the downgrade debt debacle.
The gop are begging our President to fix this congress created problem.
It is ignorant. Just ignorant.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
December 21st, 2012
5:39 pm
Its only a filibuster when you wish to diminish someone rather than face reality.
Something Politico just can’t seem to do – face reality.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
December 21st, 2012
5:41 pm
And I see Trashman is back with a new handle but the same nonsensical repetitive posts.
getalife
December 21st, 2012
5:42 pm
“Now is not the time for more self inflicted wounds” President Obama.
Our economy is starting to take off, so the only regulation stopping it is this congress created crap.
Tell your party to get out of the way of free enterprise cons.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
December 21st, 2012
5:43 pm
Yeah, getalife, cause you wouldn’t expect the leader of the country to show a modicum of leadership ability and actually lead, now would we?
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
December 21st, 2012
5:45 pm
Getalife, your posts would be laughable if they weren’t so sad.
JF McNamara
December 21st, 2012
5:46 pm
You are severely overvaluing the Republicans hand. The situation is that they really have a junk hand because their stances on cutting entitlement and raising taxes are in the minority in every public opinion poll. They have fewer chips and a junk hand. Boehner did what any good player would do. He folded.
Kyle Wingfield
December 21st, 2012
5:47 pm
And with that, our annual year-end period of comment moderation has begun. I’ll have a Christmas-y column posted upstairs shortly. I’ll try to take some time to push comments through moderation over the next couple of weeks.
I’ll be back Jan. 2. Until then, have a merry Christmas and a joyous start to 2013!
Dusty
December 21st, 2012
6:13 pm
Awww Kyle, you are NOT going to spend Christmas with us? And I had the fruitcake ready? Oh well. Have a wonderful Christmas and I await your Christmas message..
Del
December 21st, 2012
6:14 pm
Kyle must be a poker player. Some say that the Republicans hold playable cards and using that analogy should we go off the so called fiscal cliff Republicans will take a hit politically but in the longer run Obama and the Democrats will also pay a political price. I don’t know if a MAD or mutually assured destruction strategy would work ultimately in the Republicans favor but falling off the fiscal mountain is in the not too distant future. Maybe taking the smaller fall now might snap reality into the equation for both parties and meaningful economic priorities will be forced for the better good of the country. I don’t know.