Obama’s idea of compromise: All take, no give

At this point, Obama’s strategy is clear: Raise $1+ Trillion through new revenue to cover spending gaps, cut nothing. Do nothing whatsoever about the current $16 Trillion debt, do nothing whatsoever about future growth of government.

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The Republicans should demand the 3% spending cuts promised under Reagan & the 2% spending cuts promised under Papa Bush, just for starters.

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People did pretty well with “Clinton Era tax rates” Kyle. You were there, so was I. Don’t try to cover that up or forget about it.

As for bargaining, the GOP has been saying no to everything Obama has said for the past 4 years and making every single issue a line in the sand. Why was that OK for them but not for the President? You know he’s going to flex his new found political muscle for a minute and then compromises will be made.

This cliff was designed by the right to make the left look bad. It’s having the opposite effect though. You can’t blame Obama for it when he’s been trying to reach a deal with Congress for 4 years and they’ve consistently said they weren’t interested in anything he says period.

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Forget the fiscal cliff, Im still awaiting my Free Obama television and all the other trimmings..

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More lies from the Mistake during his never ending campaigning when he said he wanted a balanced approach to the fiscal problems and when he said he would take a deal involving 2/3 spending cuts for every dollar of new revenue. Lying, deceitful, deceptive, and duplicitious best describes his approach to the fiscal cliff.

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Kyle, sorry this is left over from the previous blog, but I’m sure Mark and Finn will make the same arguments here pretty soon.

Finn:
Look, you Cons lost big time on Nov 6th. No one is interested in your points of view, your opinions, your ideals, your goals, or what gives you the wet dreams.

MarkV
“No wonder Lil Barry raises the flag of patriotism. It seems to be mostlhy missing here. Not to mention civility and consideration.”

I will let one of your own leftwing socialist wantabee’s explain this to you two.

Hillary Clinton Apr 2003

I am sick and tired of people who say that if you debate and you disagree with this administration, somehow you’re not patriotic, and we should stand up and say, “We are Americans and we have a right to debate and disagree with any administration!”

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“President Obama came into office trying to be a grown-up and find common ground with the GOP”

Obama in 2009: “We won.”

Common ground and grown up, reebok? Not hardly. But another epic fail on your revisionist history of President Incompetent.

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“This cliff was designed by the right to make the left look bad”

Not intended to be a factual statement:

“Woodward reports in his book that White House Office of Management Director Jack Lew and Legislative Affairs Director Rob Nabors took the proposal for sequestration to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, and then it was presented to congressional Republicans.”

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1012/82772.html

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and a number of Republican House members and senators who are sticking their necks out to talk about reneging on their no-tax-hikes pledge.

If a bunch of Republicans were idiotic enough to make a pledge to some neckbeard that’s their problem. “I need concessions to save my @$$ because my constituents like dumbed-down politics” is not a valid argument. Not in the non-Gooper world anyhow, and they can either accept reality or go the way of the Passenger Pigeon.

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Mitch McConnell said the number 1 priority of the Republican party was to make Obama a one term President.

What was their second priority or did they even have one?

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Agreed Billings. Give Obama what he wants, then later the Reps can say…”TOLD YA”

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or go the way of the Passenger Pigeon

Careful, there. There is a VERY REAL chance that the passenger pigeon can and will be resurrected.

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I’ll tell ya what: Let’s agree to returning to the Clinton-era tax rates . . .

. . . if the Dems agree to Clinton-era spending levels.

How about it, libs?

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The GOP House won on the promise of no tax hikes. Live up to the commitment.

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“Remove the gop out of the way.”

And how would you suggest doing that, getalife? You know, given they were just re-elected to a majority in the House for the next 2 years and all?

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“And how would you suggest doing that, getalife?”

Walk away.

Done.

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You are trapped like rats.

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“If it weren’t for Gerrymandering, we might still have a Democratic house as well.”

And if it weren’t for dumbed-down, government-educated voters, we’d have a President-elect Romney right now, JF McNamara.

Your point?

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It may not be worth a crap, but a deal will be made. Both sides will claim victory. What’s new?

On the other hand as a recent President said:

“Elections have consequences”

“I plan to use the political capital I EARNED from winning the election”

Kyle: Did you forget that? You might want to have that selective amnesia check out.

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Since the majority of Americans decided they wanted the “obama free stuff presidency”, my personal opinion is that ok if thats the way it’s going to be, we are doomed anyhow, so time for EVERYONE to start taking all the free stuff from the government they can before it all fails. For a start I’m going to stop working and go take disability that I couldlhave received years earlier, but chose to work thru my paralysis,loss of sight in an eye, and minimal use of right hand. Think about it…if your one of the 50% that actually pay FEDERAL INCOME tax to support all the freeloaders, why should you continue? Soon it’ll be 60-40 then 70-30, why be the sucker on the 30% end?

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There is a VERY REAL chance that the passenger pigeon can and will be resurrected.

Only to be promptly eaten by Velociraptors.

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Folks still whining and crying about the election results.

How much whine can they make from sour grapes…

Excuses and more excuses. Not much about the lack of ability of the candidate and Party…

Guess they haven’t noticed that the popular vote has not been in their favor 5 of the last 6 elections….

I say keep up with the same. It is working so well.

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Here’s the leverage Finn. Let Obama take us off the cliff, market drops, unemployment rises, people demand action. GOP says sure, but we need substantial cuts and make Obama’s extended tax cuts permanent. GOP gets the blame for a while, but there is no election anytime soon. The regime gets the long term blame for being unable to work with the other side. America loses in this deal, which is why the GOP is working to resolve the issue, Obama not being interested in any cuts and in favor of raising taxes, is that not concerned with the cliff, at this point. He would be once he has to deal with the ramifications of the economic drop.

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Note that the fiscal cliff cuts are set to go in gradually so congress can stop them at any time.

In other words, there is no “cliff”.

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I can survive the tax increase with no problem. And it will be soooo entertaining listening to the idiotarian left whining about how eliminating the Bush tax cuts means financial disaster for the middle class (you may recall their whining for the last decade about how only the rich benefitted from them).

Time to eat your peas, Obozo receptacles.

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Kyle

What did your boy Newt say about the fiscal cliff?

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The Republicans will never be blamed for the carnage the Democrats are causing but will be there to pick up the pieces, if there are any left.

You got that backwards, we are still picking up the pieces of 8 years of Shrub and 10 years of GOP rule in the House and Senate. We have a lot of repair work left to do.

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Glenn Beck: your messiah has been in office four years. Why hasn’t he fixed the economy? And let’s not forget your admonishment: “Excuses and more excuses. Not much about the lack of ability of the candidate and Party…”

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One of the biggest jokes about our Congress is when they state “they are struggling to find places to cut spending” According to the non partisan Citizens against government waste CAWG.org this is an example of just a few of the thousands -yes thousands of incredibly wasteful programs the government has that they will not even attempt to fix -just these three programs cut -savings og $8.5 BILLION dollars !!!!

FAILURES
Essential Air Service: The Essential Air Service
(EAS) was created in 1978 to subsidize airline
carriers that provide service to small communities.
Originally funded at $7 million, the program
has since grown to cost taxpayers $200 million,
subsidizing a dozen airline carriers in more than
100 communities.
On February 17, 2011, senators voted 61-38 to kill
Senator John McCain’s (R-Ariz.) amendment to
repeal the subsidy for the EAS. The Senate did,
however, subsequently adopt by voice vote Senator
Tom Coburn’s (R-Okla.) amendment that would
restrict the EAS to airports more than 90 miles from
certain larger airports, while providing an exemption
for flights in Alaska.
On November 1, 2011, the Senate also rejected
Senator Coburn’s amendment to eliminate the
Small Community Air Service Development grant
program by a vote of 41-57

Weatherization Assistance Program: The
Weatherization Assistance Program (WAP)
is a Carter-era Department of Energy (DOE)
program originally designed to lower consumers’
energy bills during the 1970s oil crisis. Under
the 2009 American Recovery and Reinvestment
Act (ARRA), the program, whose budget had
hovered at approximately $250 million for years,
received an injection of roughly $5 billion.
Prior to ARRA, the program had been operating
virtually without oversight from DOE. Since
its expansion, WAP has left in its wake reports
of substandard work, abandoned projects and
fraud. Numerous states have experienced
problems with fraud and mismanagement.
On February 16, 2011, Rep. Paul Tonko (D-N.Y.)
attempted to remove a provision from the FY
2011 Continuing Appropriations bill that would
bar funds for WAP. His amendment was rejected
in a 208-223 vote.

Market Access Program: The U.S. Department
of Agriculture’s Market Access Program (MAP)
is the epitome of a corporate welfare program,
spending millions of taxpayer dollars annually for
advertising and promotion to profitable, private
companies. Recipients have included Butterball,
Tyson, Monsanto, Dole and Sunkist.
President Obama’s Terminations, Reductions and
Savings for the FY 2011 federal budget identified
MAP as a potential spending cut and the National
Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform
report also listed MAP funding among its $3 billion
in recommended agriculture program reductions.
On June 16, 2011, Rep. Jeff Flake (R-Ariz.) offered
an amendment that would bar the use of funds in
the FY 2012 Agriculture Appropriations bill to pay
the salaries and expenses of personnel to carry out
MAP. Unfortunately, this amendment was rejected
in a 101-314 vote.

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“Folks still whining and crying about the election results.”

The ONLY people bringing up election results in ANY blog posts are the liberals on here, Beck.

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How much money would shuttering our military bases in Italy, Germany and Japan save us?

Are we protecting the sushi? and the lasagna?

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Washington definition of compromise: Compromise is when a Conservative agrees with a liberal

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What is the ultimate end results so far? If the fiscal cliff is not solved, Americans are in deep d–d-/
If they vote for the plans that Obummer has laid out we end up in deep d–d-/ No one is looking out for all Americans at this point. No budgets from Congress in 4 years. Can’t read Bills before they are passed. Transparency through dark glasses. Congress and the President needs some maturing.

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The President ought to get on his knees and beg Ben Bernanke to reconsider his decision not to seek another term as Federal Reserve chairman after January. The Fed has single handedly propped up the economy (and got Obama reelected) by printing money. They announced this week they’ll probably keep QE’ing in 2013.

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If they walk away, they break grover’s pledge.

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Our President warned the gop , he will take this fight to the American people.

That is code for he wants the house in 14.

And he will get it.

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Logical Dude
Yes, the majority of the country agrees that spending cuts AND raised revenues are needed. Obama (or is it Geithner?) is using that to press for immediate action on the tax pieces, and some of the cuts.

The rest of the country is also under the impression that the revenue and cuts will be used to bring some balance to our budget.

Obama has never given more than cursory statements that he cares anything about reducing the deficit or debt. He is out there now talking about spending this new revenue, to implement his “jobs” bill. More government spending is what he wants, and the American people will be hoodwinked again, by this Spender in Chief.

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Logical@11:43, “Why is Geithner presenting this, and not Obama? You can put as much on Obama as you like, but if he’s not even in the picture, then why blame him?”

Your first question is good. Your second question is not so good & should be: “Why the #%@$ is Obama NOT in the picture & why shouldn’t he be blamed for NOT being there?

Obama voted “present” almost the entire time he was in the US Senate. Now, he’s not even present. If he won the election, why is he still out campaigning?

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You can’t solve big problems with small ball….if any of you think the GOP, particularly in the House, give a flip about the re-election of President Trillions…or otherwise suggesting BO has the upper hand…you are fooling yourselfs..

If you think our current spending trends are sustainable, regardless of soaking the rich, you are equally delusional..

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1. Boehner is not “whining about ANY tax increases” — he’s offered to increase tax revenues by other means, with the new revenue coming from wealthier taxpayers, just as Obama has said he wants.

By closing loopholes they will just open elsewhere in a year or two when nobody is looking.

How did all those loopholes get there in the first place?

No. Raising the marginal rate is the only way.

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Stevie

I’m for going back to the rates under Clinton for all.

When looking at historical rates, your 250K blather is nothing more than rhetoric and hyperbole…

Just saying

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Now to find some way to pay off the $16 trillion debt.

Why?

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How much money would shuttering our military bases in Italy, Germany and Japan save us?

We have 50,000 troops in Germany alone

Imagine the savings there.

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“Fiscal Cliff” = “ObamAusterity”

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As you wrote some weeks ago, when there is a “spending cuts for higher taxes” deal, the taxes always go up but the spending cuts never happen. Why should this time be any different? (But we knew that already.)

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Bye Bye Cheesy Grits

November 30th, 2012
11:56 am

Just remember that there is a significant chance increasing the tax rates will result in decreased revenue….if this happens and combined with increased, unsustainable spending, the deficit will increase and the debt will increase..

I say lets give BO everything he wants and see what happens…the marginal tax rates will simply lead the “rich” to find other means to keep taxes as is or otherwise keep increases to a minimum. An increase in the cap gains tax will result in materially less cap gains reciepts, and increased dividend tax will decrease interest in providing shareholders annual dividends…fewer stock will be purchased and fewer will be sold…

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WHAT IS THE REPUB COUNTEROFFER??????

There isn’t one.

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I would pass the President’s tax cut for the middle class first.

Then the gop can walk away.

Looks like it is the only way for the gop to wiggle out of their pledge.

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Stevie Ray, you are correct:

Two-thirds of millionaires left Britain to avoid 50p tax rate

“Almost two-thirds of the country’s million-pound earners disappeared from Britain after the introduction of the 50p top rate of tax, figures have disclosed.

Far from raising funds, it actually cost the UK £7 billion in lost tax revenue.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9707029/Two-thirds-of-millionaires-left-Britain-to-avoid-50p-tax-rate.html

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The debate over taxes is no longer about increasing revenue, but who wins the way we get there. Obama/Democrats want it via tax RATES, and Boehner/Republicans want it via limiting deductions and credits.

A little of both is the most logical, but politics is about in your face slap downs – until the last minute for politicians. Just look at the hard line posts here to see how partisans NEVER compromise.

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Someone compared the Democrats’ offer to the Republicans to the BIG GAME tomorrow. It would be like the GA Bulldogs asking the Crimson Tide to give the Bulldogs 4 touchdowns & the SEC Championship with the promise that the Bulldogs would discuss the possibility of letting the Tide ride the bus to Atlanta some time next year.

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@Kyle…”Instead, we have Speaker John Boehner, who has offered to raise revenues by capping deductions in exchange for concrete entitlement reform, and a number of Republican House members and senators who are sticking their necks out to talk about reneging on their no-tax-hikes pledge.”

You think that is a serious offer? That is BS and Obama is right to ignore them.

The Republicans need to move off of Romney light and start talking about higher rates for incomes over 250K, higher capital gains rates, no more carried interest and limited deductions. At that point the subject of spending cuts can be entered into the equation.

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Stevie

You don’t know me and quit deflecting… You blather and blather…. Same on Bookmans blog..

Looking at historical rates your 250k “soaked” comment is bs and you know it.

Clinton rates and cuts across the board…. If you can show where I said anything different, put up or …….

Good day

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Bye Bye Cheesy Grits

November 30th, 2012
12:03 pm

Warren Buffet gets all his revenue from dividend income…he also ignores the corporate tax when he says he pays less than his secretary. the reason cap gains and dividends are taxed at a lower rate is because they are already taxed at the corporate level of 35% ergo the real cap gains tax is 44%…

I think the uber rich should pay more but the level should be kept at the 80 billion a year previously agreed as opposed to the ridiculous opening salvo of DEMS..cuts alone wont’ get us out but the Simpson Bowles plan will…

Lets go off the cliff..bearing in mind that if it happens, no party has less cupability than the other..they both agreed to this debacle.

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sticking their necks out to talk about reneging on their no-tax-hikes pledge

this what passes for political bravery in 2012? A willingness to throw Grover Flippin’ Norquist under the bus?

Who had died and made THAT guy king, anyway?

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I see Bill O’Reilly is spouting off his War on Christmas BS again.

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Lets go off the cliff..bearing in mind that if it happens, no party has less cupability than the other..they both agreed to this debacle.

I agree lets go.

If thats the only way we can cut out of control Military spending and raise taxes im all for it.

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Its funny, the only time Republicans care about compromising is when they have no leverage.

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grover is just one lobbyist but shows how weak the gop are for being scared of one lobbyist.

I have never seen the gop so weak, so lost and so leaderless.

They have no idea what to do and lash out over our President opening position that is not new.

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@Stevie Ray…”Warren Buffet gets all his revenue from dividend income…he also ignores the corporate tax when he says he pays less than his secretary. the reason cap gains and dividends are taxed at a lower rate is because they are already taxed at the corporate level of 35% ergo the real cap gains tax is 44%…”

Boy do you need an education. First off almost every penny of Buffet’s gains come from the appreciation of Berkshire stock not dividends, though there are some in there.

Second capital gains are taxed in no way at the corporate level. A capital gain is the difference between what you paid and what you get when it is sold. Taxes are levied at the point of sale on the seller the corporation is not involved.

Dividends are paid after corporate taxes and while the top rate is 35% the average rate paid by US corps last year was around 12%…nobody pays 35.

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Its funny, the only time Republicans care about compromising is when they have no leverage.

Indeed. It would be downright hilarious, if they weren’t cashing such huge paychecks, reaping the rewards of the enormous personal opportunities that come with their positions, and enjoying a lifetime of benies and perks for standing on fabricated sanctimonious principles while throwing the American people under the bus. We already bought the wars, and the surplus is gone. Now we have to PAY for what we already bought on credit. All those who got filthy rich off their defense contractor stock from those wars should be paying triple the tax rate!

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Glenn Beck

November 30th, 2012
12:22 pm

I have looked at % of GDP of tax revenues..the disappearing number of millionaires since 2006 has resulted in a drop of 42% in total taxes they paid…point here is that if you reduce the amount of millioinaires…tax reciepts will decrease..this goes a long way to explaining why revenues have sunk to 15 % of GDP in recent years..

Our system doesn’t even raise taxes efficiently. in 2009 reciepts averaged barely 15% of GDP, With spending closer to 25% of GDP…no workie. Leaving rates as is or cutting them historically offers best odds of growing economy..opinions of all sorts are offered by all sides..IMO spending is unsustainable..period..if we increase tax revenue, historically it has been offset by new spending..can’t have both..

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KYLE

What did you think about the dysfunctionality of BO as well as congress as portrayed by Woodwards’ Price of Politics?

Eye opening lack of presidential leadership as well as GOP/DEM leadership in congress…

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Sorry, Kyle, but you and your myrmidons here are just silly, and should be ignored.

Obama proposed a $4 trillion reduction in the deficit, along the lines of what he ran on – and the voters overwhelmingly approved.

He’s doing the job we elected him to do. If the Repubs want to propose something different, fine, have at it. But don’t whine that Obama isn’t playing fair somehow because he makes a proposal that is similar to what the people voted for.

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Kyle

The post about GOP banking on a Romney win has merit. That doesn”t absolve Obama and the Dems, but if the GOP House was as confident as the talk and radio show host they pander to as well as the right wing blogging world, they thought they would be dealing with Romney..

Elections do have consequences and while the House is Repub and have power in that regard, time to play ball.

You are kidding yourself had Romney won, that the GOP House wouldn’t be pressing the Senate and reminding them of the election and who held the upper hand come Jan.

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Matz
November 30th, 2012
12:35 pm

Its funny, the only time Republicans care about compromising is when they have no leverage.

Indeed. It would be downright hilarious, if they weren’t cashing such huge paychecks, reaping the rewards of the enormous personal opportunities that come with their positions, and enjoying a lifetime of benies and perks for standing on fabricated sanctimonious principles while throwing the American people under the bus. We already bought the wars, and the surplus is gone

Would you like to see a list of Geithner’s buddy recipients of the great bailout or Obama donor paybacks under the green energy handout program? I though not…

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Sick

Provide that list as well as a list of Republican Governors, House and Senate members who still cry about the stimulus yet had their hand in that stimulus cookie jar.
Start with Gov Perdue

Thought so

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The gop said no to a tax cut and wants to add regulations.

Downright liberal and totally bizarre.

Just pass the middle class tax cut and walk away gop to lose the house in 14.

You got owned.

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Kyle, it’s taking Romney’s plan. You want Boehner and Obama to compromise by taking Romney’s plan. What is it exactly that the Republicans are giving up in that case?

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Tax increases on the productive is the Viagra of the left.

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1. The rich are paying the lowest taxes in decades and government is starving.
2. Historically, the country thrives when the middle class is strong and the wealthier pay higher taxes. This worked under Ike, and under Clinton. And under Saint Ronnie (50% tax rate).
3. Cut spending, look at the military industrial complex! That is where we waste BILLIONS
4. Social Security is FUNDED – leave that alone
5. cut Medicare so old folks have to eat cat food to afford their prescriptions? Really?

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Or we could increase the rates for the 2% and then offer them a deduction of the same percentage if they actually DID produce some jobs…

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How much more tax would you pay if ALL the Bush tax cuts expire? If the Bush tax cuts expire on those making $250,000 or more? Use this calculator to find out. I already put some data in to get you started. Change the data for your situation.

http://interactive.taxfoundation.org/taxcalc/#calculator

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Cherokee: Sorry, Kyle, but you and your myrmidons here are just silly, and should be ignored.
———–

And yet, here you are. Perhaps you should take your own advice. Go ahead, we’ll wait while you change your sockpuppet.

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Next week is Hobbit week on the Colbert Show?

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Ah, come on man!

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“Next week is Hobbit week on the Colbert Show?”

Newt is going on Colbert, cool.

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“The middle class will not get stronger if the taxes are increased on the rich?”

What has happened to the middle class since 2000? Did they get “stronger” until Obama took office??? Because I missed that if they did…

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The middle class has shrunk as tax policies now favor the rich. You and I pay 28% (or whatever) on income, the rich pay 15% or less thanks to loopholes and the lower rates on dividends.

The middle class has shrunk slowly since the 1980s, since “trickle down economics” has been introduced, fallacy that it is.

That is fact.

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Cherokee

November 30th, 2012
12:44 pm
And exactly where are the cuts? So far, all he’s done is play class warfare (and if you don’t think his raise rates on the rich is not class warfare then there is no use talking to you) so he can point to it and tell the wannabees, see I got them for you (see his revenge ad during the campaign), then act all benevolent and condescending while talking about fairness and then make some vague promise about reducing spending in the future while asking for $50,000,000,000 in immediate spending, asking Congress to remove itself from it’s position of keeper of the vault and then jump on a plan while saying the Republicans arent going along with my mandate. NEWSFLASH: Uh, President Obama, over 46% of the nation voted against you and last I looked at my passport, we’re still citizens and we don’t have to roll over and play dead! Our debt is still soaring, people are still unemployed, the value of the dollar is still falling and you, Mr President are doing zilch to stop it and we will remember this and the pendulum will swing back.

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Wrong. You and I don’t live off of dividends. The wealthy do. That is THEIR income.

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JDW

November 30th, 2012
12:34 pm

I give you the one about corporate taxes which I should have factored in a actual 12% as opposed to figurative 35%.

I’ve have made money off cap gains as well as dividends so I have an understanding of these issues. Despite that the federal government collects 44.75% of each dollar of income earned by the corporation and paid as a qualified dividend, the dividend recipient appears to “enjoy” a 15% qualified dividend rate because the first round of taxation occurs before it reaches the investor’s hands. Were the dividend-paying enterprise organized differently, it might lawfully pay zero taxes at the corporate level, and allow investors to receive the enterprise’s taxable income pre-tax so that they pay taxes at the investors’ own tax rates – which would range from 0% to nearly 40% depending on the taxpayer’s own tax situations and the tax character of the enterprise’s income. In theory, of course, some of that income might itself be characterized as qualified dividends subject to the 15% cap – in which case yet another entity would have already paid a marginal tax rate up to 38% on the pre-dividend taxable income.

In Buffets case, Berkshire Hathaway has not paid a dividend since 1967, but last year authorized repurchase shares at prices below 110% of book value.

Its also worth noting that Berkshire and related entities are in distasteful battles with IRS…they want money back while the IRS thinks they are due…issue is around $1 billion..

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Steve

November 30th, 2012
1:35 pm
So do retirees

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All take, no give

He does represent the “takers”, right?

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Rightwing Troll

November 30th, 2012
1:19 pm

Check out tax reciepts after cuts in personal taxes per JFK, Reagan, Clinton and Bush…tax INCREASES will not in any way shape of form help the middle class…unless of course President Trillions increases the Income Tax Credit…you know that free give away…he can also spend more money “creating jobs” for the middle class…oooops, that didn’t work so well before.

Big Question…why did BO extend tax cuts just a few years ago? Why is it ok now?

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Steve – a lot of those deductions already get phased out under income thresholds or are offset by the AMT.

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Finn McCool (The System isn’t Broken; It’s Fixed)
November 30th, 2012
1:44 pm

The effective tax rate for the top percentile (i.e., the highest 1%) was 28.9% of income.

We can do better than that. I say we push it to 35%.

I say we put all welfare recipients into work camps and have them rebuild the infrastructure of the country and leave the margins where they are at!

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Kyle

It might be “irrelevant” to the discussion of the fiscal cliff that your boy Newt says doesn’t even exists (I grant you that), but put in context, it does provide a much more clearer picture than the deception that is played out about how all these people pay no taxes….

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“I say we put all welfare recipients into work camps and have them rebuild the infrastructure of the country and leave the margins where they are at!”

This is an idea I could wholeheartedly support!

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Kyle

Point I was making is very clear, even if it doesn’t fit directly into the “fiscal cliff” and Federal tax rate debate.

When looking at all taxes paid, the disparities that many on the right love to point out, dissipate. We can debate and argue all day who pays what or doesn’t pay what, but for it to be factual that the disparity shrinks when looking at all taxes then on a local and state level it appears that the lower income folks are paying a good portion of their incomes. If this were not true and the same held as for the national level, mathematically you would have a shrinking of the percentage differences.

Either way.

Thanks for the reply.

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If a majority of the country elected Obama to four more years in the White House, then let them have it their way without GOP support. The tax increases that happen will be the Obama tax increases. When spending spikes, it can be the Obama tax and spend plan. And we slide into recession as the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office (CBO) predicts will happen, it will be the Obama recession.

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And for the record I am phased in rates back to the Clinton era……..

Cut in all departments including the holy grail called the DoD………..

Granted my point wasn’t directly related to the “fiscal cliff”, however it does put into context what many of your bloggers do not know or wish to ignore

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Black Label, then you should be putting in personal property taxes which does disproportionately hit the middle and upper income earners regardless of where their income comes from.

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Kyle

And I do take it up on a state and local level by not voting for any clowns with D or R on by their name.

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Kyle

Transfer payments skew the numbers……… The avg percentage of what is paid and is a much clearer picture on the micro level.

When looking at the income disparities, it is easy to float the transfer number and stay on the macro level. That is why many on the right love to tout that percentages of total Fed Inc taxes paid, but rarely mention the growing income disparity over the last 40 years. Looking at the disparity leads anyone to see that more taxes are being paid from the top on a Fed level. And of course we could throw in the EITC that both parties have implemented and increased over the years.

Overall you bring good game to the table, but did want to point out the total taxes in terms of how it gets presented by many, not necessarily this article per say.

Thanks again.

GO DAWGS.

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Look at the funny morons spinning away so vigorously to try to deflect from the truth of who pays the highest tax rates!

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What would Jesus do with the poor?

God & Allah ask for a measly 10% & They abide by the Golden Rule, i.e. treating everyone equal. Doesn’t matter to Them whether you earn $10,000 or $100,000. 10% is all They ask.

(Proves our Creators, whoever you worship, weren’t heathen “progressives.”)

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For those that believe that the rates on capital gains and dividends should be rasied, I ask a very simple question. Where is this money going to come from? Do you believe that this money is sitting under the bed of these “rich”? Even if higher rates don’t drive investment away from our shores, the “rich” will have to pull some money out of whereever it currently is in order to transfer it to the government. If they have been spending it, it will come out of GDP; if they have been investing it, it will be pulled out of those investments. Please explain how this transfer of 1.6 trillion is going to produce as much as the private sector and since you believe revenue is king, please explain why the mass infusion of half that amount ($800 billion stimulus) in 1/3 of the time did not right this economy.

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Finn McCool (The System isn’t Broken; It’s Fixed)
November 30th, 2012
2:12 pm

You proggies are the drain on society and must be eradicated!

Yes, Jesus approves of extermination.

You have a fixation on Jesus. Why not go to Mexico and fulfill your fantasies, there are plenty of them!

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Kyle: Try again…I’ve changed email addresses.

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For those that believe that the rates on capital gains and dividends should be rasied, I ask a very simple question. Where is this money going to come from?

Um, from capital gains and dividends?? What a silly question. No amount of taxation is going to drive investment away from these shores or any shores. You Cons are silly.

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Hello Sick of Progs,

The largest beneficiaries of Medicaid (60%) are those that are in Nursing Homes…like your relatives and other who receive long term care. You, like so many other people assume it is your WIC, and welfare recipients that are running up Medicaid. When your governor refused to expand Medicaid assistance to Georgia, he essentially cut off subsidized long-term care funding. Which means that YOU, my friend will be paying for your parents long term care expenses. So you see Gov. Deal, refused Medicaid to spite Mr. Obama, when in actuality, he actually hurt you and many other Georgians. By the way…the largest recipients of Medicaid…are in the rural areas…

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“MANGLER @ 10:51: Well, if we can also have back a) the tech boom; b) $20/barrel oil and the commensurate gas prices; c) the lack of a war on terror (or at least the awareness that they were already at war with us); and d) Clinton-era federal spending, maybe we’d do just as well now with those rates as we did then. What do you think the odds are that those things will come back?”

They aren’t, Kyle. So are you saying that the government should give tax decreases because gas prices went up? I think we all realize it costs more to fight the war on terror ( and wars with Iraq and Afganistan) so where are the “increased revenue” (let me translate that for you – TAX INCREASES) to pay for these increased costs. Also, medical costs have gone up over 300% in that last 20 years while wages (and , correspondingly, Medicare tax receipts) have only increased 68%. We NEED to balance our budget – that means deciding what things we want and then tax ourselves accordingly. I think the vast majority WANTS Medicare – so we need to up Medicare taxes significantly to pay for Medicare. Now Medicare Pard D is another story – it was passed with no tax increases to cover it – either take it away completely or phase it in 20 years down the road with tax increases now. I think we should let all tax rates go back to Clinton era taxes – and yes MR. President, that means increasing taxes on people earning less than $250,000 (the 97%). You can’t ask Republicans to tax their rich friends more and then say you are sticking to YOUR campaign promises of no tax increase for the middle class! We need to all be chipping in.

As far as cuts, if you take SS and Medicare out of the equation, what you are left with is : Defense (all programs) – 40%, Interest 17% (can’t cut that without defaulting), Medicaid 11%, welfare 11%. So where do we to cut (everywhere obviously, but slowly so we don’t send the country into recession again).

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All Take? That would be “Taxe increase on 250K & Above & done” THAT is what exit polls supported. AND AS IF GOP is doing any compromise?? WHERE?? Does Rupert Murdoch pay this alleged “reporter”?

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Old School Girl
November 30th, 2012
2:25 pm

Hello Sick of Progs,

The largest beneficiaries of Medicaid (60%) are those that are in Nursing Homes…like your relatives and other who receive long term care.

Sorry, none of my relatives lived past 57 except old granny MacDougall. Which raises a question? What happened to the social security money that all of my ancestors and family paid in to and never lived to collect? I guess it is now funding single mom sluts and their baby daddy ghetto thugs.

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Finn McCool (The System isn’t Broken; It’s Fixed)
November 30th, 2012
2:31 pm

So, Sick of Progs wants a jesus who sits in judgment and contempt for the less fortunate?

Define less fortunate. Does it include lazy people and those who decide to have 5 babies from 5 different daddies who disappear.? Maybe that’s why Jesus had a no adultery clause in the bible.

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Finn McCool (The System isn’t Broken; It’s Fixed)
November 30th, 2012
2:31 pm

So, Sick of Progs wants a jesus who sits in judgment and contempt for the less fortunate?

You have a problem with Jesus, or accepting the fact that your ilk have self control problems and lifestyle choice problems, and you want taxpayers who have their sh!r together to pay for these?

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The obama tax cut would be for everyone. Everyone gets the lower rate on the first $249,999 they earn.

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I wish BOTH sides could sit down and have a serious discussion and solve some real problems without the POLITICS and posturing and ultimatums that we see from Congress. NO TAX INCREASES! NO TAX INCREASE FOR THOSE MAKING LESS THAN $250,000! NO CUTS FOR THE MILITARY! NO CUTS FOR SOCIAL PROGRAMS! NO CUTS TO ISRAEL AID! NO CUTS TO FARM SUBSIDIES (I represent a farm state)!

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The Obozo tax increase would only be for some.

Republicans believe we’re all on this together.

Want tax rates to be higher? Put some skin in the game.

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Hello Middle of the Road,

I do stand corrected. On average according to Kaiser Foundation, the average percentage of Medicaid dollars spend on long-term care it is 43%. In some states it is lower, but in a growing number of states it is higher and stedily growing based upon the continuous growth in the baby boomer population. I have attached the link for those that are interested in actually seeing the issue that Middle of the Road and I are discussing. Bottom line, a balanced approach is needed.

http://facts.kff.org/chart.aspx?cb=56&sctn=153&ch=994

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The Obozo tax increase would only be for some.

You are looking at this the wrong way. The tax increases aren’t on people, they are on income. You are welcome to live your whole life in America without ever earning any income and we won’t ask you to pay any taxes. But if you are going to try to earn money, those earnings will need to be taxed.

Or else we lock you up.

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“changes such as higher Medicare premiums for the wealthy, an increase in the Medicare eligibility age and a slowing of cost-of-living increases for programs like Social Security, Republicans would agree to include more tax revenue in the deal, though not from higher tax rates.”

I would agree to that. I would even include higher Medicare rates for EVERYONE. Slowing (or even cutting out) COLAs for SS is one way to balnce ITS budget. I don’t care WHAT you call it, more revenue is needed, so if you want to cap deductions (or eliminate them) rather than “up tax rates” I don’t care, just so long as more money comes in.

One thing that rarely gets mentioned, but I believe if you significantly increased the enforcement of tax collection by the IRS, you would have a huge return on your investment. There are a lot of scofflaws out there not paying their taxes (remember all those fishing employees who wanted to claim losses in income from the BP oil spill). A few million extra in IRS funding of investigators would probably result in BILLIONS of extra tax receipts.

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“Um the adultery thing was in the ten commandments, right? which has nothing to do with Jesus. That was Moses.”

That is true, but Jesus upped the ante by saying that anyone who looked at a woman with lust in their heart is guilty of adultery. Unfortunately, I am guilty of that sin.

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Republicans would agree to include more tax revenue in the deal, though not from higher tax rates.

Right. they dont want higher tax rates.

They want to close loopholes and then slowly open them again.

In other words they want to cut spending but do nothing about taxes.

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You pay for that swill?

The guy voted for Newt Gingrich.

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Ill give this for Republicans.

They got killed in the election protecting tax cuts for the wealthy.

And yet they continue to do it.

Takes alot of brass.

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Hi Linda,

You are correct. My late mother paid into Social Security when it first started, and they took out about 10 cents per check. When she retired, her earnings statement indicated that she had paid into the system for 40 years, which came to 10 years worth of payouts. She lived seven years beyond the contributions that she made to the system. She clearly knew she was receiving money that even with interest, did not cover what she received. As some have said, adjust the contributions. But as you know the bigger problem is that there are so many that paid so little into the system who are now receiving so much more. My recommendation….phase out the program over a 50 year period of time. Those born today, know that the system will not be around when they retire. Increase deductions today to cover the shortfall, and then begin to reduce the deductions, as each generation dies.

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She lived seven years beyond the contributions that she made to the system.

This is why we need death panels for grandma? Using the old Barney Fife strategy, we’ll nip that problem in the bud.

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@Stevie…”I’ve have made money off cap gains as well as dividends so I have an understanding of these issues. ”

Then you ought to know that a corporation pays no tax whatsoever on an investors capital gains…as for dividends, yep they are double taxed and shouldn’t be. They should be pretax expenses for a company.

As for Berkshire and the IRS EVERY major corporation is in CONSTANT discussion with the IRS it is normal not unusual.

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BBCG – good point. I forgot some people can’t seem to get off their fox news addiction.

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A dollar contributed to Social Security in 1950 was worth $9.43 of today’s money. So it is skewed somewhat to compare money paid in, to money received, decades later.

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“I think that eventually Medicare will simply have to reduce coverage in some form or fashion to remain solvent. Exactly how I have no idea. ”

The other “third rail” that no one ever wants to talk about is coming to grips with medical costs. People want to have the ultimate in medical technology but don’t want to pay for it. Do we really give a heart transplant to a 90-year-old man? Do we do an expensive bone marrow transplant for a cancer aptient when it only has a one in a thousand chance of working? Do we insist that our child that has a hurt wrist get a $1200 MRI when a $100 x-ray will tell us all we need to know in 99.99% of the cases? Do we spend $500,000 on a patient in the last six months of their life? These are HARD questions, believe me, I KNOW.

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Finn McCool (The System isn’t Broken; It’s Fixed)

November 30th, 2012
3:08 pm

Classic:-)

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middle of the road

You’re right that these are hard questions. On the flip side, do we tell a patient, “we have the technology to save you but you aren’t worth the cost”? And I hear people all the time say don’t spend money on a 70 year old but on the flip side of that, who’s to say that 70 year old won’t live 20 more years?

And unless you die suddenly, the last year is going to be the most expensive for most anybody.

There are no easy answers.

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Linda, that dollar amount being cut was an agreed to amount – between the doctors, hospitals, and government.

They AGREED to it. No one FORCED it on them.

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The cascading euphoria from the top Democrats in government that appears to be pervasive among the left wing ideologically captivated that there’s been a dramatic shift in the country toward their brand of government could be what puts the country over the fiscal cliff. Should we go over that cliff the Republicans would indeed take fire from the public but as the pain reaches out and touches everyone particularly the now significant percentage of uninformed voters AKA the stupids, the Democrats will also then be taking their fair share of fire. Those who have become accustom to government financial hand outs will be more concerned with the cut backs in those programs and will become madder than hell when they begin to feel the effects. When that happens they’ll focus their wrath at government in general and Democrats won’t escape by the political cover they believe they now enjoy. I hope the Republicans stand firm on their insistence that specific spending cuts and entitlement reform be part of any agreement with Obama and the congressional Democrats.

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“Otherwise, I’m assuming you just made that up, since it’s so far out of line with how the discussion has generally gone.”

Exactly!!! I’m a Republican now…

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Seems to me you’re raising a pretty silly objection.

Doesn’t seem silly to me.

They dont want to raise marginal tax rates just close loopholes to generate more revenue.

Why ?

What does it matter where the money comes from ?

Because they know that one is much much easier for them to reverse.

Plain and simple.

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why should janitors have to retire later because lawyers are living longer?

also from the Krugman article.

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I keep forgetting – deficits only matter when Dems are in office. When repubs are in – start a few unfunded wars and never look back. Sheesh – the GOP is pathetic.

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whose loophole is getting closed.

Oh, we know whose loophole is getting closed. Middle class and poor people, that’s who.

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Stevie

Are you not blogging on a right leaning blog at this moment?

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Stevie@3:14, The health care insurance bill had nothing to do with health, care or insurance.

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For the healthcare people on here – we should have gone with single payer system. We negotiated with the republicans and what we have is what was agreed to. It is not perfect, but it is far better than nothing. So let’s improve on it and move on.

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Del@3:21, Enjoyed your comment. In short, what you said was, “Greece.”

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Stevie

Would you say Thomas Freidman and Ross Douthat are liberals?

Their Op Eds run in the NY Times. How about Bill Kristol who was also employed a the NYT at one time?

You seem so biased yet uninformed as to what is actually ran in the NY Times.

They run a combination of liberal and conservative Op Eds every day. Nothing new.

Open your eyes and mind sometime.

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Linda – please read up on budgets. Presidents don’t pass budgets, congress passes budgets. The supposed “budget” you are referring to was about a 64 page document that had no specifics, whereas the last true budget was about 885 pages. You see, Jeff Sessions from Ala. did this to embarrass the president, so republicans could say, he can’t even get his own party to pass his own budget. He forgot most voters are a little smarter than that…well 51% of the voters are smarter than that. The budget he put forth was basically a blank document. Before we start down this same old road of the same old Fox news talking points, try doing a bit of research and really learn about what really happened.

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And I will be heading out in 10 minutes so if I don’t respond, don’t think it was because I don’t have an answer. Then when I get home, FNM over at Jay’s will be in full swing! If I don’t get back on, have a good weekend everybody. Roll Tide and Go JACKETS!!

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I’m loving the tacit admissions from all my friends on the Bush-hating left that His tax cuts put a significant amount of cash in middle-class pockets.

Democrats: Wrong on the Bush tax cuts.

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Well, a bit of worry arises.. Look at the road leading OUT of Washington. Traffic getting heavy.
Here’s the top of the departure list:
Bernanke-fair financial foundation man
Hillary Clinton– one of the few with a spine and a brain
Petraeus-military genius foiled by a bimbo
Panetta-understands you cannot protect USA without money
Jesse Jackson Jr—well he is leaving and we ‘ll get another Chicago hoo,,,er..hopeful.
Geithner?? only if he has NOT paid his taxes this year which is a good probability…

I won’t go so far as to say “rats leaving the sinking ship” but the band is up on deck playing “Nearer My God to Thee”.and the termites are stirring in the lifeboats and there’s no guiding light above the CLIFF.

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A CBO article estimated that eliminating the Bush tax cuts on the upper 1 to 2 % would bring in an additinal 82 billion per tax year.

Eliminating the Bush tax cuts for everyone would bring in an estimated 423 billion per tax year.

Does not mean much when you have an annual trillion dollar deficit.

Maybe it’s just me, but I think I could spend my portion more wisely than the Federal government.

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Petraeus-military genius foiled by a bimbo

Whether or not he’s a military genius is a matter of opinion. Time will shed light on that.

As to being foiled by a bimbo. We don’t know who the initiator was in all that; might of been her, might of been him, might of been both of them. Either way, they were both adults and both knew what they were doing. If you’re gonna be dumb, you gotta be tough. If she was the instigator, all he had to do was pull up his big boy britches and say no. He’s got nobody to blame but himself.

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Finn hates rich people ’cause he aint one .So obvious!

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A few days ago, Obama gave a speech to a room full of middle class working people.

Not to be outdone, the Republicans gave speeches while being surounded by Big Business types.

Cons, how much clearer do the Republicans have make it as to just which group of people they truly care about?

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splavistic:

What compromises did Papa Charlie or any of the Deocrats ever offer?

The first two year when the Democrats controlled both the House and Senate, it was pretty much sit in the back seat and shut up.

After the 2010 mid-terms, what compromises were offered then?

None that I can recall.

Since the Repubs hold the House, what ever they can do to stop PC’s bad policies is OK with me. Let’s go over the cliff together.

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Hilllbilly,4:06

I agree that Petraeus can only blame himself for his actions but it does take “two to tango”and that was the dance.

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Buzz Belle

November 30th, 2012
3:57 pm

If you remain amongst us, I did want to point out that the 400 billion in Medicare spending cuts is..well 40 billion a year..guess how much he wants to spend on stimulus..$50 billion..guess what he needs to spend on doubling of food stamp recipients, finally, funny how the 80 billion tax increase he tacitly agreed to in 2010..oddly correlates to the 80 billion he has already spent on the Unearned Income Tax Credit….

So the net of above is as follows: 80 billion plus 40 billion equals 120 billion a year. Take away 80 billion plus 50 billion…well you see where this is going…

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” The Democrats have offered 400 Billion in cuts as in cutting down the amount of money currently spent.”

The cuts have been previously agreed to and along with these cuts previously agreed to Obama wants a like amount in new stimulus spending. Obama wants to raise taxes on those earning income over 250k and maintain the current rate for those earning less. The revenue realized from this increase would amount to about 802 billion over ten years. The annualized increase would be enough to fund the federal government for 8 days each year for ten years. No one with any ounce of honesty could deny that this increase on Americans in the highest brackets isn’t anything other than symbolic and does nothing to address our debt problem. Obama also wants to postpone addressing spending cuts and entitlement reform until sometime next year and after the the rate increases take effect on higher income earners. Is there anyone here that thinks that this is a fair and reasonable proposal?

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Dusty

Yes Jessie Jackson Jr is leaving as he should be. If he has done anything illegal he should be indicted and prosecuted.

Don’t forget the 8 Republican House members and 3 Senators who have also had to arrange a U haul to get out of town.

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don’t eat the sausage

November 30th, 2012
4:24 pm

Who cares? So you like the sheep on both sides are preoccupied with who is at fault..they are all at fault…what’s the difference..so you can repeat same crap like those on other side?

Our DEMS and GOP are equally complicit in this cliff thingy which speaks for the growing dysfunctionality of our failed government.

Why not try something creative like developing your very own talking points…??

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Buzz@3:57, The Democrats agreed to $3 in spending cuts for every $1 in tax increases under Reagan & $2 in spending cuts for every $1 in tax increases under Papa Bush. The tax increases materialized but we are still waiting on the cuts. Papa Bush lost re-election due to his broken promise on raising taxes. The Republicans won’t sleep with the fleas again.
No, the Democrats are not asking the wealthy to pay more. Taxes are not based on wealth. I don’t know anyone making $250K who is wealthy but plenty who are living paycheck to paycheck. It is servitude to ask anyone to work for the govt. more than 6 months out of the year.

If a sheik from Saudi Arabia offered Obama a check for the amt. of revenue he wants, Obama would still raise taxes. This has nothing to do with taxes or revenues. Obama SAID that it would hurt the economy to raise taxes in this environment & he SAID he knew that raising capital gains taxes has never resulted in higher capital gains revenues.

Republicans have been sitting at the table the entire time Obama has been out campaigning. I can’t see how the Republicans can possibly be blamed for Obama raising taxes on every taxpayer in the US & the country going into another recession, since that has been the Democrats plan from day one.

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How do you think the rich got where they are? We are not a barren third world country. We are wealthy country where people USED to pay taxes to make this a great country via our infrastructure, our schools and universities, you name it. Taxes provide the foundation for a great society where capitalism can thrive.

The rich are paying the lowest PERCENTAGE of taxes in decades, period. Look, when I made 50K a year, a $1000 expense was a big hit on me. When I make $120K a year, it doesn’t hit me nearly as hard. When you are very wealthy, a FOUR PERCENT INCREASE IN TAXES does NOT EVEN AFFECT YOU.

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MarkV

I can answer your question but Steve can’t. Maybe you should talk to him.

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don’t@4:24, You win the prize for the most uninformed, misinformed minion on this blog for the day. There were no Bush tax cuts for the wealthy. The Bush tax cuts brought in the highest revenues in the history of the country. Obama added more to the natl. debt that the 1st 42 presidents & he added more in less than 4 yrs. than Bush did in 8 yrs. Obama’s proposal does not reduce current or future deficits.

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Linda

Comparing tax revenue percentages vs GDP, they went up how high after the Bush tax cuts?

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=205

Average during Bush years was no higher than the previous 8.

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w lost two occupations, collapsed our economy and exploded our deficit. Facts.

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Steve@4:39, Can you prove that a family of 4, making $250,000/yr., taking care of elderly parents, sending kids to college, etc. has a dime in the bank, especially if they are self-employed & pay for their own health care & retirement out of their own pockets, especially is their rent is $4000 per month & their local & state taxes are 10%?

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I just don’t understand why liberals do not look at the actual numbers. The $1.6 Trillion in revenue is spread out over 10 years. The budget deficit is $1 Trillion per year. That is a yearly deficit. The extra revenue is 16% of the shortage. Where is the rest coming from???? Without servicing the current debt, that adds another $3.5 Trillion to the debt as we climb to $20 Trillion. That does not even include the interest on the current debt. When the FED stops artificially keeping rates down, we are blowing up. Raise taxes if you want but where is the rest of the money coming from?

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Linda, a family making 250K a year can make lifestyle choices and live comfortably. Please, stop with the insanity.

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Del,

I will compare our President’s accomplishments to w’s any time.

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Why in the world do you cons fight for the wealthy when you are broke?

It does not make sense.

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@Kyle,

This is a good read.

http://swampland.time.com/2012/11/30/how-to-negotiate/?hpt=hp_t1

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Black Label

November 30th, 2012
4:53 pm

Good point..this even despite anemic GDP. However, this relationship is IMO a red herring once I did below the surface..everyone has gotten poorer over the past several years with median household incomes falling $4500. According to the IRS, the number of millionaires tax payments have plummeted from 2008-2011…in 2007 there were 390,000 filers with AGI over $1mil..in 2009 there were 237,000 filers. In 2007 this group paid 309 billion in taxes…in 2009 they paid 178 billion a decline of 42%.

The millionaires club fluctuates as many sell a business or otherwise don’t stay in the club year after year. the permanent players income is mostly cap gains and dividends.. there are always 3 sides of a story.

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getalife – because we do not trust politicians. If you give them a dollar, they will spend it 5 times and promise to pay it back later. Eventually, we will all have to pay off the debt and jsut giving them money that they will pi$$ away makes no sense.

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Madmax,

Thank you for your honest supply.

The spending message was heard and being addressed.

We balanced our budget before but the gop blew it.

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Linda

It was higher in 2000 so what is your point?
You speaking to yourself or is there a blogger named “stupid”?

And again was it higher then the previous 8 yrs? NOPE

If it was just the tax cuts than why didn’t the percentage go up?

Is that the best you have when you are unable to rationally debate an issue?

Typical pout and whine for you. No surprises.

Next

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Our President is doing exactly what he campaigned on.

He won so he gets what he wants.

Get out of the way of free commerce gop.

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The President told you he would take this fight to the American people and he is.

If you want to lose the house to give him a rubber stamp congress, keep playing your losing game.

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Linda- Learn the difference between “losing” and “loosing”. Your side is going to continue to do one of those two for a long time.

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Linda @4:14 – Here you go:

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/apr/06/mitt-romney/romney-says-obama-failed-pass-budget/

The ruling states:

In his speech, Romney faulted Obama for failing to pass a budget. He was correct that the two times Congress voted on the president’s budget requests, both times they were voted down. But the job of passing a budget resolution is not the president’s. That responsibility falls to Congress, and even then the president doesn’t sign it. As Ellis, our expert, put it: “The president has no role in passing a budget. The president can cajole Congress about passing a budget and advocate for positions and funding levels, but in the end, Congress approves the budget resolution for their own purposes.” That’s the difference between this and other claims we’ve rated which blamed Congress for inaction on the budget.

If you need, I will link you to the blank budget Sessions placed for vote – or you can google it yourself. Wine and music is awaiting me.

Kyle – I figured you were a UGA kind of guy. Good luck to you in the game tomorrow! I will need more than luck to get through mine.

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It is a ignorant move to ignore the majority of the American people.

I guess the gop want to lose the next election.

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Kyle, you have the nerve to complain the President is now standing firm to what he campaigned on?

Give me a break. The Republics have been the party of No, No, No for 4 years. The economy has progressed, albeit slowly, with no support from your side. The President accomplished the ACA and other initiatives only through good politics.

As GWB said, I won the election, I now have political capital. Where were you when he said that? Were you complaining about his boldness? I doubt it.

The President won a substantial electoral college majority and won 51 to 47 % over Romney. The Democrats picked up seats in the Senate and the House.

So yes, this is the time when “elections have consequences” comes to play. Don’t whine over the fact the Republics lost. Time is passing and we need to get on with governing this nation, with or without Republic support.

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“Americans voted for Obama and for a tax increase.”

Wrong, they voted for a tax increase on others…..BIG difference.

The new America…..let’s all take a tax cut and then vote for others to give theirs back.

The difference between the 2 ideologies?

Take the NY cop that gave the homeless guy a new pair of boots…..those on the right would pay for them with their own money while those on the left would vote for the cop to pay for them with his money…….no different than what Obama is proposing now.

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“Who does Obama think he is a “real” President? Don’t pay any attention to him.”

No, he thinks he’s been coronated as the King of America, answerable to no one.

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Linda

And when you can post where I said Bush was the cause, post it for us all to see.

Thanks

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Linda

Was this you @ 5:06?
_____________________________________

Linda

November 30th, 2012
5:06 pm
It’s the spending, stupid.
_________________________________

Do you make a habit out of lying or is that just your blog persona?

Bookman has FNM: Friday Night Music

Linda has Friday Night Meltdowns

hahahahaha

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You Republicans have whined and cried for four years that Obama failed to provide any “leadership” (although we also know that you were repeating what the right wing echo chamber TOLD you to whine and cry about). You were wrong, because your sheep herders were wrong. Obama LED this nation out of the deepest recession since the great depression through the policies he called for. He LED in the takedown of Osama Bin Laden. He LED by reversing countless Bush era boneheaded policies. He LED the response to hurricane Sandy.

Now he is leading again to finish the job of getting America’s economic house in order, and you losers whine and cry some more, and call it “campaigning”. Why? Because again, its what the sheep herders of the right wing echo chamber told you to do. This president has been a competent leader, despite the fact that some people are too blinded by ideology to see the truth (i.e. the same people who “knew” Romney was going to win).The Presidents job is to lead, not spoonfeed reality to people too stupid to see it on their own.

Hows this for a compromise? Do what the President asks, and the Republican party may still be relevant for more than just the next two years. The American people have spoken. They said “Obama”.

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CC

Yet you vote for Ryan whose own numbers showed the debt going up to 23T……

oooooooppppppsssssssssss

But don’t let those facts get in your way of your typical bs

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“Obama LED this nation out of the deepest recession since the great depression through the policies he called for. He LED in the takedown of Osama Bin Laden. He LED by reversing countless Bush era boneheaded policies. He LED the response to hurricane Sandy.”

Yeah, right, and he LED in refusing the help to the four Americans killed in Benghazi, and then he LED the lying about the entire incident.

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Black@5:47, “It’s the economy, stupid” is Carville’s coined phase that has been repeated in the political circle for 20 years. The Republicans have repeated that it’s the spending, stupid, for 4 years.
Sorry you missed it on the children’s news network show.
If I was naming someone Stupid, I would at least capitalize Stupid.
Sorry if I got under your skin today. You’ll get over it by tomorrow.

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Linda

Quit melting. You have been melting down going on a month

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saywhat@5:48, Obama has not created one, single net job in 4 years.
He LED the response to Sandy? He said he would stop the rise of the oceans. Sandy was just another broken campaign promise. The Sandy victims will never vote for another Democrat.
The American people also said a Republican House.

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Yes they did with 8 less members………

And 3 less in the Senate, but if that gives you solace and helps stop the meltdown…… good for you

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Looking over the comments today, the liberals are the ones who are erroneously stating that the GOP never tried to compromise on earlier budget issues (and Bob Woodward pretty much destroys THAT contention in his recent book – but I guess you only believe Woodward when he’s taking on a Republican), and the liberals are, by and large, the ones screaming for no compromise with the current GOP.

Liberals = no class uninformed liars.

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Hi, Black Label / Oh Well / Sunny / (insert your own sock puppet here)

Do you have anything to add besides rehashing the election results, or are you going to post something of substance sometime soon?

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Any guesses as to who said this:

“The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies. … Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that ‘the buck stops here. Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better.”

Maybe saywhat should take a stab at it after his leadership post…..

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md:

I know! I know! I know who said it, and it wasn’t the Puddy Tat!

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Linda – you stated Obama couldn’t even get his budget passed. That is a statement the republicans like to try to use to make Obama look like he can’t get things done. It is a typical ploy used by those on the right but Obama and the democrats did not fall for the game. The American people are sick of those games, of those talking points, of a party whose only mantra the last four years was to make Obama a one term president. It didn’t work so either help become part of the solution or consider yourself part of the problem. Now, I am really leaving this time because my wonderful husband is picking me up to take me out for my favorite dinner. I am sure I will see you on this blog again, although I don’t usually post on Kyle’s blog. I’m a Bookman kind of girl. Enjoy the night all and may your team win, whoever it is!

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I’m voting “present”.

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Tinerius:

It truly is, Tiberius. Sort of like someone who can’t seem to take “Yes” for an answer.

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Black Label, you can continue to quote GWb all day long, but he isn’t President anymore.

Neither did he campaign on reaching out to compromise with the GOP, as Obama claimed to want to do.

Now, you can use old quotes that have no meaning or comparison all night long, but it doesn’t make your case for support of Obama’s tactic of non-cooperation any better.

When President Incompetent lies during the campaign about lack of GOP compromise (again, as Bob Woodward has shown), then in the same week of claiming to want compromise (again), he shows no such direction, this particular Emperor has no clothes on.

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Tiberius the little tough tike

He has his huff and puff on tonight.

Get em, little fella.

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And you are the last to say anything about insults, but then again you are a hypocrite……

Nothing new

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Bill Kristol knows the Repubs are going to fold

Just said that, they need to look at it as keeping 98% of the Bush and now current Obama rates…

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Tiberius

Thanks for the suggestion, but if it was about adults, Kyle would have to ban you permanently and not for a week. We know those permanent and temporary deals are right up your alley on these AJC blogs.

So I will be here and you can pout all you like. Your choice

Thanks again.

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Still waiting for anything of substance from Black Label . . . .

Anything at all . . . .

Anything . .. .

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I see Tiberius is still chasing his tail and still thinking every blogger is someone else.

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“”"”"”"”"”"”And if it weren’t for dumbed-down, government-educated voters, we’d have a President-elect Romney right now, JF McNamara.”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"”"

The only person dumbed down is the writer of the above statement who is incapapble of understanding why Romney lost and why the GOP is in serious trouble with the voters. Any idea what pecentage of the voters said they disliked Romney due to his assinine comments and disrespect for minotities, women, veterans, the middle class and factory workers as well as the fact that he was a high priest in a cult?
Oh I forgot the writer of the quoted statement suffers from some of the same problems.

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don’t eat the sausage: The primary contributor to the current deficit are the Bush tax cuts for the richest.
———————–

Absolute nonsense.

According to the Washington Post, eliminating Our President Bush’s tax cuts for the most productive, as Obozo wants, would raise all of $65 billion per year.

Meanwhile, Obozo has increased federals spending by $500 billion per year.

$65 billion versus $500 billion.

Get a grip.

It’s the spending, stupid.

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Is Reid also a high priest?

If so, good for him

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Is Reid also a high priest?

That I don’t know but they are both of the same faith. The same people who bash Romney for being a Mormon never bash Reid. Either bash ‘em both or bash neither.

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“Reid wears a bow tie and drives an ice cream truck in his spare time ”

I think he is an awful Senate leader, but if he likes doing that, good for him

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Hillbilly

Thanks for the honest reply, however you didn’t answer the question.

Not that you have to, but it does speak volumes to say the least

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Romney 2016

It’s been a while but when all that was going on I said that the birther stuff was non-sense. It’s quite a reach to think that Obama’s family (or whomever) would have had the foresight to fake a birth announcement in a Hawaiian newspaper at the time of his birth. I was over at the other blog at the time (Kyle may not have even been here then, not sure), when they were having the mosque in NYC brouhaha, I stated that as long as they followed the local zoning, permitting laws, etc, I had no problem with it.

As for his religion, if Obama says he’s a Christian, I’ll take his word for it, it’s between him and God and not for me to say.

I’ve also called out the 911 truthers, who I feel are just as loonie as the birthers.

But anyway, as Paul Simon said, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.

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Hillbilly

I was just asking. You say you did speak out, so I applaud you for calling out the lefty and righty kooks. There is no shortage on either side.

You have a great weekend. Much prosperity and good living to you and yours.

later

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There’s a reason the Dems are known as the tax-and-spend party, Kyle. These people have never met a tax they didn’t like. Fortunately; as I’ve often posted, it’s self-correcting. The money WILL run out.

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“wprd” should be “word” . . . sorry!

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Michael H. Smith:

Obama and his merry band of fools stole the keys, the car, the money and the credit cards. Just as the car starts over the cliff, Obama will make sure that he isn’t hurt, but his band of merry fools (as well as the rest of us) will be injured severely!

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Oh, and unbalanced thinker? Responding to a post by JF McNamara does not equate to “harping” on the election.

It is simply a response; nothing more, nothing less.

Reading comprehension is your friend – just not your strong suit.

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Mitch will fold like a cheap suit before it is all over.

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Democrats are looters and destroyers by their very nature. They are now about the business of looting a nation of its wealth, and then the ultimate destruction of the greatest nation the world has known.

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The Crisis of American Self-Government

‘We have now an American political party and a European one. Not all Americans who vote for the European party want to become Europeans. But it doesn’t matter because that’s what they’re voting for. They’re voting for dependency, for lack of ambition, and for insolvency.”

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323751104578149292503121124.html

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Tiberius – pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed

December 1st, 2012
7:09 am
“I see that the “fair and balanced” and “independent thinker” sock puppet is back on board.

Kinda makes you wonder why some people can’t stick to one moniker on a blog. It’s not as if they have multiple personalities, as they post the same thing written the same way.”
______________________________________________________
I know, right? There used to be some crybaby loser frequenting this forum whose blog handle was DaveR. He came back under a different name, but his whining hypocrisy, inflated sense of importance, and consistent inability to grasp basic reality are still easily recognizable in his new persona.

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Kyle, so what is the GOP’s counter offer? What do they want to cut and how much? Obama and the Democrat’s are done negotiating with themselves. When are they going to put something on the table?

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Oh how they cry

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You folks that are calling the voters dumb, and calling the President “Obozo”, are fueling the fire. You may think that’s a smart way to take our your anger, but don’t be surprised when the “dumb voters” blame your side for the consequences of another financial crisis.

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