Award for Ivy Prep shows just how wrong Lowery and others crying ‘resegregation’ are
Dear Rev. Joseph Lowery: Before you agree to record another advertisement decrying state charter schools as a maneuver to reinstate segregation in Georgia, perhaps you should check out the news about Ivy Preparatory Academy.
Ivy Prep, to which the Gwinnett County school board refused to grant a charter, and which as a result had to resort to the state’s chartering process, was named one the state’s highest-performers among schools with a high proportion of low-income students.
This news ought to be of interest to Gwinnett voters, given that their school system has fought tooth and nail to prevent the state from having a process to approve charter schools in general, and Ivy Prep specifically. The Gwinnett system was one of the plaintiffs in the lawsuit that resulted in the old State Charter Schools Commission’s being declared unconstitutional, and about 20 percent of all the money donated to the anti-amendment campaign has come from administrators in the Gwinnett system alone.
But this news may be of particular interest to Lowery because Ivy Prep’s student body includes a much higher percentage of black students than the schools around it: 75 percent, compared to 46 percent for its nearest peer (Peachtree Elementary School) and 30 percent for Gwinnett’s entire public school system. (These and other data in this post come from the most recent Adequate Yearly Progress Reports available, those for the 2010-11 school year, on the Georgia Department of Education’s website.)
It may also be of interest to Lowery because black students at Ivy Prep were more likely to exceed state standards for both math (43 percent) and English/language arts (48 percent) than their peers at Peachtree Elementary (42 percent and 34 percent, respectively) or Gwinnett as a whole (36 percent and 38 percent, respectively).
And Ivy Prep’s black students were much less likely not to meet standards: just 6 percent on math and 2 percent on English/language arts, compared to 13 percent and 7 percent for Peachtree Elementary; and 12 percent and 5 percent for Gwinnett as a whole.
These students and their parents have chosen to attend Ivy Prep, rather than the traditional public schools Lowery defends as being better for black students — on what grounds and evidence, no one knows.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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209 comments Add your comment
CharterStarter, Too
November 1st, 2012
1:24 pm
@ JDW – and why is that more applications will be approve by the state? Consider this?
* Why would districts be LESS likely to approve charters? We believe with an alternative route, districts will see the benefit of being fair in their processes and keeping the charters local. That’s what we hope happens.
* The SBOE will still have oversight over the Commission – what would cause them to recommend an approval of more charter applications?
Just trying to understand your logic.
JDW
November 1st, 2012
1:26 pm
@CharterStarter, Too…the board may have thought they had the authority but they also knew they could be sued by the local systems…if they didn’t they need better counsel. Now they will know that they in fact cannot be sued because their authority is constitutionally explicit.
As for shuttering poor performing charters, I am not worried about that. What I am worried about is a rash of new unneeded charters that dilute both the student base and active parent base of a local school. We are better served if that energy and funding is directed into the existing framework.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
1:26 pm
JDW @ 1:15: “unlike the new commission idea if the BOE overrules the local system does not lose property tax revenue.”
That was the old commission funding model. The new model does not reduce QBE funding for local systems where state charter schools are located.
md
November 1st, 2012
1:27 pm
“* Can’t move for 100 reasons”
It would be 100 excuses, not reasons……….the choice to move is ALWAYS there, where there is a will there is a way…….and I already said before, there are also numerous good public schools.
And I’m not opposed to charter schools, I’m not sure where that is coming from………
CharterStarter, Too
November 1st, 2012
1:28 pm
@ I demand… show me ANYTHING, any little piece of actual data that substantiates the paranoid, ridiculous claims you continue to make under various names on these blogs.
FEDERAL law prohibits public schools from being affiliated with religious institutions. STATE law does as well, and state CHARTER LAW does as well.
Give it a rest, buddy, it’s a tired argument with zero merit.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
1:28 pm
Cheesy @ 1:19: The same restrictions on using public money for religious purposes will apply to these public charter schools.
P.S. — I know you’re out of ammo when you start in on your creationism diatribes.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
1:29 pm
JDW @ 1:21: Your belief is at odds with the record. And I would argue we could just as easily expect fewer state charters to be approved annually as time goes on, because in the early years there is more pent-up demand being satisfied.
I demand to see Cheesy Grits Birth Certificate- Long Form Please
November 1st, 2012
1:29 pm
This is what they teach in Charter ” Schools ” in Louisiana.
“God used the Trail of Tears to bring many Indians to Christ.”
“Perhaps the best known work of propaganda to come from the Depression was John Steinbeck’s The Grapes of Wrath…Other forms of propaganda included rumors of mortgage foreclosures, mass evictions, and hunger riots and exaggerated statistics representing the number of unemployed and homeless people in America.”
Gay people “have no more claims to special rights than child molesters or rapists.”
And the list goes on and on.
Charter schools will be a boon for the dummies in this state.
Meanwhile the rest of the country will be falling over laughing at Georgia….. again.
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
November 1st, 2012
1:30 pm
Randy, the Dow was over 14,000 before the Dodd-Frank recession. Your guy isn’t even keeping up with inflation.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
1:31 pm
And this @ 1:24, Cheesy: “Getting control of the curriculum so they can get Christianity back in schools.”
The GOP already holds all the levers of power in this state, including over education policy. If that’s the goal, why aren’t Georgia Republicans already doing it?
I know, I know — reality is of little value in your world.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
November 1st, 2012
1:31 pm
I know Cheesy is out of ammo when his fingers hit the keyboard.
CharterStarter, Too
November 1st, 2012
1:31 pm
@ md -
Single mom (divorced)
Works full time 2 jobs
Lives with grandparents to help care for her daughter when she’s working because she can’t afford day care.
Grandparents own their home and can’t see it in this economy
Grandparents also need to stay close to great grandmother who recently had a stroke and owns her own home, too
What would this mom do if her daughter attended a failing school?
BTW, this is MY PERSONAL STORY growing up.
It’s not always a choice.
JDW
November 1st, 2012
1:32 pm
@CharterStarter, Too…I don’t think local boards will be less likely to approve charters…as for BOE oversight thats not what I see….
“The commission would have seven members appointed by the state Board of Education. Three recommendations for appointment would come from the governor, two from the president of the state Senate, and two from the House speaker.”
Thats not oversight…that is the governor,president of the state Senate, and House speaker handing out cookies.
I demand to see Cheesy Grits Birth Certificate- Long Form Please
November 1st, 2012
1:32 pm
Cheesy @ 1:19: The same restrictions on using public money for religious purposes will apply to these public charter schools.
Wanna bet ?
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
1:34 pm
JDW @ 1:32: Keep reading. Lines 94-97.
Actually, you might want to read the whole document. It would clear up a lot of your misconceptions about what’s happening here.
CharterStarter, Too
November 1st, 2012
1:34 pm
@ JDW – How much is “enough” to educate a child. Give me a dollar figure, please and provide some justification.
Also, how much of that should go to instruction?
I demand to see Cheesy Grits Birth Certificate- Long Form Please
November 1st, 2012
1:35 pm
The GOP already holds all the levers of power in this state, including over education policy. If that’s the goal, why aren’t Georgia Republicans already doing it?
Because Charter schools give them the cover to do it.
they are already doing it in Louisiana.
But that sort of thing won happen in Georgia right ???? LOL
Talk about diverging from Reality.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
1:35 pm
Cheesy @ 1:32: We’ve had state charter schools for a few years now in Georgia. Why don’t you point to any evidence for your claim? Or should I say, why can’t you point to any evidence for your claim?
JDW
November 1st, 2012
1:36 pm
@Kyle…”I would argue we could just as easily expect fewer state charters to be approved annually as time goes on, because in the early years there is more pent-up demand being satisfied.”
You could be right, but given that we have a process, including an appeal process in place already to manage this I see no need for the risk involved in another commission. Now if it should come to pass that the BOE’s appeal power were taken away it would be time to revisit the issue.
CharterStarter, Too
November 1st, 2012
1:37 pm
@ I demand,
The argument over “local control” would imply that the local school districts (confirmed by the Supreme Court) have the “ultimate” power…and now you are saying the GOP holds this power? Huh?
CharterStarter, Too
November 1st, 2012
1:38 pm
@ JDW – so… if we truly do already have an appeals process in place…. and the locals AND the state share this authority….
THEN WHY ARE YOU OPPOSED TO AFFIRMING THIS EXPLICITLY ON THE BALLOT?
iggy
November 1st, 2012
1:39 pm
The liberal excuse machine is in high gear. Keep em coming!!
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
November 1st, 2012
1:41 pm
Crazed monkeys, I tell ya!
iggy
November 1st, 2012
1:41 pm
Even more hilarious is Gov Cuomo rambling along side Napliatano….blah blah blah…
Beyond The Middle of the Road
November 1st, 2012
1:45 pm
One data point is not a trend. Still very happy to see that Ivy Prep and its students are doing so well. Study after study agrees that charter schools are as a rule more segregated than their public counterparts. And I’m not just talking black versus white. Students are being grouped together by race, national background, religion, gender and a variety of other factors. And while I’m not entirely certain that this is a good idea it’s important to note that no one is forced to attend a charter school — as long as we still have a strong and viable public school option.
I demand to see Cheesy Grits Birth Certificate- Long Form Please
November 1st, 2012
1:46 pm
Cheesy @ 1:32: We’ve had state charter schools for a few years now in Georgia. Why don’t you point to any evidence for your claim? Or should I say, why can’t you point to any evidence for your claim?
I have.
Its already happening in Louisiana.
If you think it isn’t going to happen here you are nuts.
Enjoy Sunday School …. I mean Charter Schools in Georgia.
Meanwhile the state gets dumber and dumber and redder and redder.
Its sad really because for the grown ups it doesn’t matter . They are already idiots.
Its the kids who lose.
http://www.au.org/church-state/june-2012-church-state/people-events/jindal-voucher-scheme-will-subsidize-religious
THE SAME THING WILL HAPPEN IN GEORGIA.
hardmanb
November 1st, 2012
1:46 pm
@Mom…you quoted a Maureen Downey article about a bad incident involving a charter school as a point in your argument that charter schools should only be controlled by the existing public school local school boards.
The article you quoted, without giving a URL, was misleading and not to the point, as it was about an incident that did not have similar facts to the debate at issue, and was an incident in Florida. If you can quote an unsourced article about a single, individual criminally-related incident to ban a broad, proven charter school issue that has worked well in many jurisdictions…then you can prove anything!
If you are going to make comparisons, compare “apples with apples”….not “apples with cantalopes”.
As a retired public school teacher, married to another, and the child of two retired public school teachers…I can assure you that if Charter schools are placed under the control of public school boards…who are the deadly enemy of “anything” that threatens their jobs monopoly control and power…then that is the same as putting the fox in charge of the hen house. Public school board will ensure that no charter school is ever allowed to be better than your existing neighborhood schools. These “government schools” will not allow any honest competition.
JDW
November 1st, 2012
1:47 pm
@CharterStarter, Too…”How much is “enough” to educate a child. Give me a dollar figure, please and provide some justification.”
Rhetorical question to which there is no answer…I can say that in MA they spend $13,361 and rank first (due mainly to Romney predecessors) and in Finland it is $5653 and rank first. As usual we aren’t getting the value we should.
“Also, how much of that should go to instruction?”
Again…depends in Fulton it is around 67%…my guess is that is good not great. I see for profit schools that have gone as low as 17%…thats just bad
JDW
November 1st, 2012
1:48 pm
@Charterstarter Too…”THEN WHY ARE YOU OPPOSED TO AFFIRMING THIS EXPLICITLY ON THE BALLOT?”
Because it is a duplication of effort that Barge believes will cost us $430 million and it is rife with possiblities for abuse.
two cents
November 1st, 2012
1:53 pm
Way to go Ivy Prep! However, I’d like to point out that most charter schools (state and local) serve predominately underserved (minority) populations. The Charter School fight isn’t about “resegregation” (is that really a word?), but about choice. I thought long and hard before casting my ballot this past Saturday, and in the end I just couldn’t vote to create yet another unaccountable state body withouut oversight to do as they please. I’m a parent with a child in a charter school and certainly believe that parents should have choices, by amending the constitution isn’t the way to do it.
resno2
November 1st, 2012
1:53 pm
Lowery can’t enrage black voters by using accurate information.
Beyond The Middle of the Road
November 1st, 2012
1:56 pm
Oh, and here’s a comprehensive document listing all the states and their policies toward public funding for nonpublic religious schools. Some states do allow it and to various degrees: http://www.ecs.org/clearinghouse/01/00/97/10097.pdf
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
1:56 pm
Cheesy @ 1:46: Louisiana also has the Mississippi River. Next you’ll claim Old Man River is heading our way, too.
We have state charter schools in this state. Why can’t you point to examples of your fears coming true in those schools?
SBinF
November 1st, 2012
1:57 pm
“SBinF @ 12:02: As I’ve written before, the data in Georgia show state charter schools outperform the nearby traditional public schools.”
I’m speaking more in terms of longitudinal examples. Larger sample size, quantitative methods, and the peer review process.
The point is that the increase in student success must be weighed against the decrease in funding that public schools receive. If charter schools only perform marginally better than public schools, why support the cost of operating them at the expense of public schools?
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
1:58 pm
Beyond @ 1:45: No, it doesn’t make for a trend. Yet. But then, we haven’t had enough of these schools for long enough for a trend to exist, either way.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
2:00 pm
Beyond @ 1:56: Prohibited in Georgia? How can that be?!?!?! Cheesy assured us it was just around the corner!
southpaw
November 1st, 2012
2:00 pm
Cheesy Grits –
Check out who CAN’T start a charter school.
http://www.doe.k12.ga.us/External-Affairs-and-Policy/Charter-Schools/Pages/Frequently-Asked-Questions-for-New-Petitioners.aspx
If the material you cited is still taught in Louisiana, then it’s a good bet that Louisiana doesn’t have the same requirements of charter schools as Georgia does. Can you cite something in GEORGIA law or policy, rather than that of Louisiana, to back up your claims of Adam and Eve, Noah’s Ark, ad nauseum, being taught in the charter schools?
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
2:01 pm
SBinF @ 1:57: We don’t have a long enough track record of these kinds of schools in Georgia to produce that kind of data — which, I agree, would be more instructive. But as I’ve explained already to JDW today, the new commission model does not rely on decreasing QBE funding to local systems. Do there’s no “cost of operating them at the expense of public schools.”
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
2:04 pm
SBinF: I also meant to say: And we never will have that kind of data, if this amendment fails.
JDW
November 1st, 2012
2:05 pm
@Kyle…”Do there’s no “cost of operating them at the expense of public schools.””
That assumes an unlimited pile of money which we all know is not true…at some point it MUST impact local schools.
curious
November 1st, 2012
2:05 pm
“Blacks make up 40 percent of the county _ which is about 75 miles east of Atlanta _ but the majority of them live north of the highway in Greensboro and Union Point. The 2,100-student public school system, however, is 70 percent black, and more than three-quarters of students are eligible for free or reduced lunches.
The charter school would serve students primarily from the tony Lake Oconee developments _ including Reynolds Plantation and Reynolds Landing, resort-style communities with a Ritz-Carlton Lodge. Ten percent of the school’s planned 400 seats would be reserved for students outside the primary attendance zone.”
Charter Starter, Too.
If 70% of the children living around Reynolds plantation and the Ritz Carlton are eligible for the FRL we have found where the moochers are.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed
November 1st, 2012
2:07 pm
“The point is that the increase in student success must be weighed against the decrease in funding that public schools receive.”
But if the charter schools are siphoning off students from the “public” schools, shouldn’t the cost to educate kids in those schools go down? And if not, why not? In every business, less volume means less expense.
eddy
November 1st, 2012
2:07 pm
All us white folk are going to hell if we don’t vote for Obama according to Lowery. This old fool is so dumb and out of touch with reality, why would anyone want an opinion from him!!!
Remember Revrund, dumb is forever and not fleeting.
Jimbo
November 1st, 2012
2:11 pm
Just finshed your editorial in today’s paper and was kind of amused. We can start with the carefully crafted wording of the amendment was does everything it can to hide the fact that this amendment takes control away from local school boards and turns it over to the state. Got to love it when the party that prides itself on opposing “big” government seems to like it when it serves their purposes. But lets go over your 8 points. 1 & 2) Charter schools are not private schools. You used a very narrow definition of private schools (or seg academies as we used to call them). They may be publically funded, but in every other way they will look and act like a private school. They may have to accept all applicants but they don’t have to keep them. So first you’ve creamed off the top of the group that have parents that are at least aware enough to figure out that they might have a choice and, unlike public schools that have to educate everybody, you’ve got a school that can weed out the kids who can’t cut the academics or who act up (unless of course, they are gifted athletes). Check the stats are the end of the school year and see who’s still there, how the racial percentages have changed and how close those percentages match the nearest public school. 3) Hey you’re right about charter schools being held to the same standardized test level as public schools although I suspect the incentive to cheat will be even greater and I am not sure if they will be watched as carefully. 4) Charter schools perform better than public schools, 75% meet AYP as opposed to 67% public schools – you used the Governor’s numbers to prove this. Really? Wow, there’s an impartial source. And this against a lot of non-biased evidence to say that there is very little difference between the two. 5 & 6 & 7) The amendment isn’t redundant, doesn’t expand government and doesn’t centralize power. No it’s not redundant, but it sure as heck expands and centralizes government control. Any time the state can put it’s hand in my pocket here in Gwinnett to force me to pay for private schooling, it’s a government expansion. I can vote against the idiots in my own country but I have no say about a state board. Try rereading all your columns against Obama over the past three years and then look yourself in the mirror and say you’re not a hypocrite.
We need an appeals process. Really? For who? Obviously not for the citizens of the school district. If the guys we voted in deny a charter school and then the state forces it on us and makes us pay, who do I appeal to? Kyle, this is all about the money. A great many of these charter schools are going to be founded by private companies looking to make a buck. This is capitalism at its most basic. The profit motive is the number one concern – educating kids is a distant second at best. If the school does well, the top guys make a lot of money. If the school sucks, the top guys make a lot of money. We’ve got one of the most corrupt legislatures in the country and even if, against all odds, we can limit them to one $100 bribe per lobbist per day, the potential for graft is staggering. Check out the campaign donations right now and see who’s contributed to whom to get this, oh so cleverly worded amendment on the ballot.
JDW
November 1st, 2012
2:14 pm
@Kyle…see what I mean…
“But if the charter schools are siphoning off students from the “public” schools, shouldn’t the cost to educate kids in those schools go down? And if not, why not? In every business, less volume means less expense.”
We haven’t even voted yet and the funding vultures are out.
Del
November 1st, 2012
2:16 pm
Me thinks Cheesy lets political ideology crowd out objectivity.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed
November 1st, 2012
2:17 pm
I’m not stating that it will go down, JDW, just asking the question that if funding is taken from “public” schools, it’s not really going to be a loss for them as they will have less students to educate, therefore, their costs should go down.
Of course, we’re talking government here . . .
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2012
2:18 pm
JDW @ 2:05: By that logic, local schools get short-changed any time we build a road, too.
carlosgvv
November 1st, 2012
2:18 pm
CharterStarter – 12:58
Someone else brought this topic up. I’m just responding.
The tone of your comments suggest someone who is a legend in their own mind.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed
November 1st, 2012
2:19 pm
“We need an appeals process. Really? For who?”
Fr parents who are tired of being trapped in failing schools by BOE’s that have been captured by the system.
Haven’t you been paying attention?