Charter school parents explain why we need Amendment One
“How can I in good conscience send my child to a school that didn’t even cheat right?”
The question from Shelby McDonald has surely been asked by many an Atlanta parent since rampant cheating on standardized tests was uncovered in the city’s public schools. Only rhetorically, of course, because the answer is: You can’t.
Unlike many of those parents, however, McDonald found a way out: a public charter school approved in 2009 by a state commission. That commission closed after a 2011 court ruling declared it unconstitutional, but it would be re-created if voters approve Amendment One in next month’s election.
“I did everything right. I looked at every [school’s] test score between here and what was driveable,” says McDonald, a widowed mother of one whose parents had pledged to drive her daughter as far as Macon each day if that’s what it took. She tried one charter-school lottery and lost. As a single mother, private school was out of the question.
“I did what I was supposed to do,” she says. “And what did I find out [about the local schools]? Y’all cheated!”
Cheating wasn’t an issue at the elementary school Rich Thompson’s daughter used to attend — at least, he didn’t think it was. But low expectations were.
Thompson was the PTA president at Deerwood Academy in southwest Atlanta when, one spring, he realized things weren’t as good as they seemed.
“We had the normal end-of-the-year Awards Day program,” Thompson recalls. “Pretty much every grade level walked across the stage, and every kid got some kind of a certificate or ribbon or trophy. The principal was patting them on the back, saying what a great job they did.”
Within a few days, however, Thompson came across the Georgia Public Policy Foundation’s 2009 “Report Card for Parents,” which ranks the state’s public schools according to their test scores. Deerwood Academy’s third-graders ranked 940th out of 1,208 schools statewide. Its fifth-graders were 470th out of 1,201.
“I just got livid,” Thompson recalls. “How in the hell can everybody be so happy with our performance when one grade level is in the 900s and one is in the 400s compared with the other schools in the state? …
“There just wasn’t any interest in doing anything beyond getting the public recognition we were getting. And it just wasn’t enough for me.” His daughter now attends an independent, start-up charter school.
It wasn’t long before that public recognition proved even more hollow: Deerwood was one of the first schools implicated in the APS cheating scandal. “It was just a big sham,” Thompson says of all the certificates, ribbons and trophies.
Accolades for his son at a south Fulton school also seemed suspect to Gavin Samms.
“His teacher said, ‘He’s so wonderful. He’s so quiet,’ ” Samms recalls. “But I said, ‘He isn’t learning anything.’ “
His son, Samms says, “kept coming home with the same worksheets of things I taught him two years before.” No one at the school was interested in giving the boy more challenging work, he says.
Samms didn’t just look for another school. He started one: Fulton Leadership Academy, which the erstwhile state commission approved in 2009. Despite its focus on the STEM subjects (science, technology, engineering and math) and test scores that last year beat both state standards and south Fulton schools’ averages, the Fulton school board denied FLA’s application to keep its charter. The state granted it under provisional authority that is highly questionable in light of the 2011 court ruling.
“They [the Fulton board] said we’re not ‘unique,’ ” Samms says. “It’s an all-boys school. We have STEM, we have an aviation focus. … You must see African-American boys in planes every day, because apparently we’re not unique enough.”
A note to those who think Amendment One is designed to pave the way for a modern white flight from Georgia’s public schools: Like Samms, McDonald and Thompson are black. Charter schools have a higher percentage of minorities or low-income students than traditional public schools, according to the Georgia Charter Schools Association.
They’re also more likely to serve them better, to hear these parents tell it.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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361 comments Add your comment
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 25th, 2012
1:22 pm
No, JDW, the country is struggling because public schools are so pathetic that they’ve churned out enough failures to get your Idiot Messiah elected.
mike
October 25th, 2012
1:25 pm
md: “What’s the difference between a “for-profit” school that costs the taxpayers 20 million and a gov’t school that costs the taxpayers 20 million??”
The profit.
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
October 25th, 2012
1:28 pm
Republican Rape Advisory Chart
http://www.alternet.org/election-2012/republican-rape-advisory-chart
DawgDad
October 25th, 2012
1:29 pm
bigbill: I agree with your point about private self-interest, and that is a HUGE caution flag, but I believe it goes beyond that as well. For decades the public schools have become increasingly more outlets for leftist/socialist brain-washing of our kids, and what we are seeing is in-part a reaction to that. But I do believe gaining State control to facilitate private access to public funds is the primary motivation.
As a conservative, I believe in a proper limited role of government, with local control preferred. Corporatocracy or whatever you want to call it is no better than liberal socialism; in the end it is corrupt if not outright tyranny.
Private education means sending your kids to a private school, or home schooling, NOT sending your tax dollars to the State to pay someone to compete with your local public schools (compete with yourself, essentially). This is so wrong-headed it makes me increasingly more nauseated.
md
October 25th, 2012
1:29 pm
And if the for profit is getting better results Mike, why should it matter?
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 25th, 2012
1:29 pm
The difference is that teachers unions and associations are threatened by the thought that their outsized pay packages and gold-plated benefits might be brought back into line with the folks who pay the taxes.
Real Athens
October 25th, 2012
1:32 pm
“Care to cite the number of school board officials kicked out of office by the voters in failing school systems, Real Athens?”
Easy. Two school board members were replaced in our last local election (2012) and we’ll choose another in this one (as a former board member was elected to the commission).
If you don’t like the way the constituents vote in Forsyth County, move. It’s not like it’s some liberal bastion. Don’t ask the state to fix local politics. Those are Marxist, Socialist, Chicago — possibly even Kenyan-style — solutions,
“the NEA … controls (sic) the education agenda in every state”
And your citation? Please don’t say Neil, Rush or Sean
If the NEA controls education in every state, why is it that Georgia is consistently ranked last? Would you complain if we were ranked first?
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
October 25th, 2012
1:33 pm
Yeah, we have such a big teachers union problem here in GA.
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
October 25th, 2012
1:34 pm
For decades the public schools have become increasingly more outlets for leftist/socialist brain-washing of our kids
examples? Or just making stuff up?
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
October 25th, 2012
1:35 pm
Md, the answer to your earlier question is that I can fire my for profit school if they fail.
I’m stuck with my public school no matter how bad they get.
mike
October 25th, 2012
1:36 pm
md: “And if the for profit is getting better results Mike, why should it matter?”
OK, let’s try this: let’s close down all public schools in Georgia and replace them with private for-profit schools. Then, all these problems we have now will magically disappear, right? It’s a panacea! Why didn’t we think of it before?
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
October 25th, 2012
1:38 pm
Real Athens, you said “replaced”.
Were they voted out, or did they leave willingly?
Kinda weren’t very specific
md
October 25th, 2012
1:40 pm
“OK, let’s try this: let’s close down all public schools in Georgia and replace them with private for-profit schools. Then, all these problems we have now will magically disappear, right? It’s a panacea! Why didn’t we think of it before?”
One would be amazed at what accountability can do for a business……..gov’t accountability? I don’t think that even exists………..
Rockerbabe
October 25th, 2012
1:42 pm
Even though I do not have any kids and none in school, I usually vote for the tax amendments for our public schools as I believe the kids should have what they need given that they are growing up in such a complicated world. However, all of the duplication and mistrust amendment #1 on charter schools represents, is more than I am willing to gol along with at this time. I listened to the panel discussion at the Atlanta Press Club on PBS last Sunday and found it to be enlightening. After some thought, I actually voted no on the amendment when I went to the polls on Tuesday. I think this charter school stuff has gotten out of hand and is really just a way to further denigrade the teachers in our community. Charter schools are not the answer and since there is little transparency with this amendment [as I understand its provisions], I think tax dollars need not be spent on such a secret society. As I have said in the past on post regarding public schools, if you really want to improve education, get the politicans out of the mix and turn the schools over to the local school board, the parents, teachers and principals. No good has ever come of politicians mixing up the public with their brand of “solutions”.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/reports-on-charter-schools-expose-new-problems/2011/10/31/gIQAcMye3M_blog.html
md
October 25th, 2012
1:43 pm
“I’m stuck with my public school no matter how bad they get.”
Which takes us back to the only option for those that can afford it…..move. Which is why we keep getting pockets of bad schools……..
And I really don’t see the cycle ending anytime soon, there will always be those that choose not to care or participate…….
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 25th, 2012
1:45 pm
mike is afraid to answer the question. The reason he would oppose for-profit schools even if they did a better job for the same cost is that he, like Obozo and Marx, oppose free markets and think the government solution is the only solution.
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
October 25th, 2012
1:48 pm
I can fire my for profit school if they fail.
So, you move your kid from school to school until one day it dawns on you that maybe it isn’t the school that is at fault, maybe it is the child.
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
October 25th, 2012
1:49 pm
this isn’t a question of free markets. When there is an application process and a limited head count there is no free market in play.
mike
October 25th, 2012
1:50 pm
Lil B: “mike is afraid to answer the question. The reason he would oppose for-profit schools even if they did a better job for the same cost is that he, like Obozo and Marx, oppose free markets and think the government solution is the only solution.”
As I have stated and has been stated numerous times here today, I don’t really care if it’s a for-profit or public school, I don’t want my property taxes to go up because people are diverting their property taxes from the public school system.
No one, including yourself, have offered any real examples where a wholesale replacement of the public school system results in any marked improvement in outcomes.
Tonto
October 25th, 2012
1:52 pm
Is Marx opposing from the grave?
Real Athens
October 25th, 2012
1:52 pm
“Real Athens, you said “replaced”. Were they voted out, or did they leave willingly? Kinda weren’t very specific.”
It’s all about semantics with you, isn’t it; always t least half of your straw-man arguments. Voted out.
Sorry you’re so obtuse:
ob·tuse/əbˈt(y)o͞os/
Adjective:
1. Annoyingly insensitive or slow to understand.
2. Difficult to understand.
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 25th, 2012
1:53 pm
So, Finn, it would appear that the answer is MORE charter schools, given the additional demand.
Glad to see you’re on board.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
October 25th, 2012
1:53 pm
Mike, economics 101.
When you move kids to a different school, you need less people at the old school, therefore your cost goes down accordingly.
sam
October 25th, 2012
1:55 pm
lets be honest here about the real problem with Gedorgia’s schools. we’ve been breeding dumb down here for hundreds of years. its gonna take a while to reverse that.
mike
October 25th, 2012
1:56 pm
Tiberius: “When you move kids to a different school, you need less people at the old school, therefore your cost goes down accordingly.”
You are wrong. The fixed costs, i.e. debt service, support staff, teachers, utilities, materials, etc. do not change
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
October 25th, 2012
1:58 pm
Real athens, forgive me, but you libs are trained to tell half the story or just plain lie
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 25th, 2012
1:58 pm
mike, you listed several variable costs (support staff, teachers, utilities, and materials) as fixed.
sneak peak into education
October 25th, 2012
1:59 pm
I have to question those that blame the unions for the “ills” of public education; the schools with the best scores are, for the most part, in states that are unionized. If the unions are such a huge obstacle to the successful education of children, how does that equate in your world? Also, look at Finland, top of the world when it comes to education; their entire workforce is unionized. Does that mean I am totally pro-union; it doesn’t matter. The facts speak for themselves.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
October 25th, 2012
2:00 pm
So the numbers of teachers aren’t reduced when student loads are reduced, Mike?
Thanks for confirming how badly run government schools are.
DawgDad
October 25th, 2012
2:01 pm
mike: Personally, I’d expect to see Haverty’s schools in the affluent areas, Ikea or Rooms-to-go in the working class areas, and Pawn Shops in the poorer areas. But maybe I’m a class-bigot; I don’t think so, though. The root problem is how to deliver education in areas where significant numbers of students and parents either don’t care or don’t have the wherewithall to act in their self-interest.
You have to wonder about all the APS students who ran through the test-cheat mills. No doubt some learned of their own accord and initiative, but many likely cakewalked through and are now paying a price, and extracting a price from the rest of us.
Now is the time for Finn to ask for examples.
Real Athens
October 25th, 2012
2:06 pm
No need to beg forgiveness. You can’t help it. You Dixiecrats just can’t figure out where to fit in these days … drink the tea? Side with the neocons? (but they’re so smart, and from the northeast)
It was so much easier when you could just walk around in sheets, wasn’t it.
mike
October 25th, 2012
2:06 pm
* On average, charter middle schools that hold lotteries are neither more nor less successful than traditional public schools in improving student achievement in reading and math. However, these averages mask wide variation across individual charter schools in their impacts.
* Study charter schools were more effective for lower income and lower achieving students and less effective for higher income and higher achieving students. In addition, charter schools in large urban areas had positive impacts on students’ achievement in math; those outside these large urban areas had negative impacts on achievement.
* Study charter schools did not significantly affect most of the other outcomes examined, including attendance, student behavior, and survey-based measures of student effort in school.
* These charter schools did positively affect levels of satisfaction with school among both students and their parents.
http://www.mathematica-mpr.com/newsroom/releases/2010/Charterschool_6_10.asp
Not quite the panacea you were looking for, huh?
mike
October 25th, 2012
2:08 pm
DawgDad: great analogy!
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
October 25th, 2012
2:09 pm
Finn’s too busy salivating over another Gloria Allred non-event.
Not that he’s ever focused, but he’s particularly unfocused today.
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 25th, 2012
2:09 pm
Panacea? That’s for the parents to decide.
It’s about parental choice.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
October 25th, 2012
2:12 pm
Real Athens, I take my belief in the equality of mankind seriously. You crossed the line with your last comment
Real Athens
October 25th, 2012
2:12 pm
“Panacea? That’s for the parents to decide.
It’s about parental choice.”
So give LOCAL parents the last word about THEIR local school systems — not a board of bureaucrats appointed by the “gub’mint”
Tonto
October 25th, 2012
2:13 pm
“When you move kids to a different school, you need less people at the old school, therefore your cost goes down accordingly.”
Depends on how many are moved and over what period of time?
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 25th, 2012
2:13 pm
If you’re against charter schools, don’t vote for the amendment. You’ll be on the losing side. And when charter schools start popping up across the countryside, don’t complain and whine, just remember the words of your Idiot Messiah.
To paraphrase: “We won”
Real Athens
October 25th, 2012
2:15 pm
Tibby:
I’ve been reading your posts for awhile. Just because you wrote it, doesn’t make it so.
Personally, I don’t believe you.
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 25th, 2012
2:15 pm
So give LOCAL parents the last word about THEIR local school systems
——————–
I’d rather give them the last word about their SCHOOL.
profroberts
October 25th, 2012
2:15 pm
There are many, many public schools here in Georgia along. We have heard about teachers cheating and so many other negative things about or surrounding public schools. Now what do you do about it, really! Can you improve on these schools…yes, it can be done if we stop creating more and more problems about public schools which many want private and now charters school…..well, they are all the same and no different. If you think your children are getting more than the other one, great, but that just don’t happen. When we have finance being the issues someone or somebody will always try to get the first millions for school that they children are in, private, charter etc, but we all suffer because somebody have to pay and if it is done right the money for public schools should take the first millions because all schools are public no matter what we want to called them. Stop making school more than others because they are not!
Tonto
October 25th, 2012
2:16 pm
“Finn’s too busy salivating over another Gloria Allred non-event.”
If her crap is anywhere close to Trump’s birther bs and yesterdays dud, she as usual will be in the same boat.
Numbers-R-US
October 25th, 2012
2:20 pm
Cons want to take away choice and yield it to the state and claim that it is about choice. And they believe their own con game.
mike
October 25th, 2012
2:20 pm
Let’s say we DO turn over our education system to private corporations. What do you think is the first thing they are going to do? You guessed it. They’re going to cut teachers’ salaries to increase profits. By cut, I don’t mean “trim,” I mean cut. Then, guess what? Teachers will leave the system and new teachers will be reluctant to enter the system. Is this what you really want? Remember, these are your children we are talking about. Do you want teachers who make a little more than what they can make at Wal-Mart teaching your children? Think about it.
Gail
October 25th, 2012
2:20 pm
I’m not against charter schools, just this amendment and the people who created it.
Part of the reason students drop out or take longer than 4 years to graduate is the state’s increased graduation requirements. We need to be realistic. All students do not need four years of math and science. Starting with the class of 2012, there is hardly any room in a high school student’s schedule for career exploration. In my county, a student must go to a satellite school for vo-tech options. All students are not college material.
State approved charter schools will not solve this problem.
JKL2
October 25th, 2012
2:22 pm
finn- Republican Rape Advisory Chart
What we really need to do is sit down and talk with the rapist. If we better understood their position, we would be able to reach an understanding with them.
Gail
October 25th, 2012
2:23 pm
Oh and I forgot to mention accreditation. This was brought up at a meeting I attended.
If the state charter schools are not accredited, graduates will not be eligible for Pell Grant and federal loans.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
October 25th, 2012
2:26 pm
Real Athens, you have read NOTHING in my posts to come to that conclusion.
I suggest an apology is in order.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right
October 25th, 2012
2:29 pm
Mike you forget. If the charter school is failing I can fire them.