Why George W. Bush was one winner of last night’s debate
First, a PSA: Jay and I, along with Aaron Gould Sheinin, are about to record a video chat discussing last night’s debate. We’ll both be posting that on our respective blogs around noon.
But before we get to that, one more thought about the debate:
You could argue that the winner of last night’s debate was George W. Bush. Before you tell me that’s ridiculous, let me explain:
One reason Mitt Romney was so quick to agree with President Obama on so many issues is that his clear goal for the night was not to damage his candidacy by not appearing “presidential” or believable as the commander-in-chief. He didn’t want to come across as a war-monger — as I wrote last night, that seemed to have been drilled into his head by his aides — and he made that point several times. He still has to win this election on the economy, and his aim regarding foreign policy was not to provide a distraction from that. I think he did that.
Another reason is that foreign policy is one area on which voters have tended to rate the president rather favorably. But perhaps most important, he couldn’t put much daylight between himself and Obama because Obama’s foreign policy has dove-tailed with Bush’s in many ways. This allowed Romney to hit on many themes that resonate with the Rand Paul/less-interventionist wing of the GOP, without having to disavow some of the principles that Republican neocons believe.
The prison at Guantanamo Bay? Still open. Civilian trials for terror suspects? All but abandoned. Tellingly, neither topic came up last night.
Troops in Iraq? Withdrawn on the timeline to which the Bush administration agreed (and, contra Obama last night, only after negotiations to keep some number of troops in Iraq broke down). A bias toward letting predominantly Muslim nations, in particular, choose their own governments? Demonstrated from Tunisia to Libya to Egypt. Benign (or not so benign) neglect of both the U.S. dollar and our neighbors in Latin America? Continued.
Obama has sounded different than Bush, to be sure. And he did preside over the killing of Osama bin Laden. But the deaths of our ambassador and three other Americans in Benghazi demonstrate that killing bin Laden did not decapitate al-Qaida, just as the Bush administration often argued it wouldn’t.
One difference between Bush and Obama has been the latter’s approach to harsh interrogation techniques. But instead of torturing captives, or coming close to it, Obama’s policy has been to kill them — and possibly innocent people nearby — via drone strikes. An intellectually honest antiwar left would be marching in the streets about that. And from the right’s perspective, one critique I’ve heard about Romney last night was that he missed an opportunity to point out that drone strikes make it much harder to gather intelligence about the terrorists we’re still very much at war with.
In many ways, though, Obama’s presidency has served to validate many of Bush’s foreign policies. You don’t hear that often, from either side, but it was one reason for the lack of fireworks last night.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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68 comments Add your comment
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed
October 23rd, 2012
11:58 am
“Why didn’t the war monger show up last night?”
Because the “war monger” was just like a list of Obama’s successes – a figment of the left’s imagination.
Bruno
October 23rd, 2012
11:59 am
Watching the debate last night, if you didn’t know anything about either guy, it would have appeared as though Romney was leading and Obama was trying to close the gap. . .
At least we finally had a fair moderator. Generally good, pointed questions from Bob Schieffer.
Obviously the Libs are attempting to spin this as another “win” for Obama, but I wasn’t impressed by his performance, either in the debate or as the leader of the free world during the past 4 years. Romney came across as being firm in his convictions, yet reasonable and informed.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed
October 23rd, 2012
12:00 pm
“Tonight at 9pm on C-SPAN there will be a debate between the 4 other presidential candidates running for president.”
Will there be free straight jackets provided to each participant?
Just can't bring yourself to say
October 23rd, 2012
12:02 pm
That President Obama won the debate.
Bruno
October 23rd, 2012
12:04 pm
That President Obama won the debate
On what basis?? Give me some solid analysis, and not a bunch of Chris Matthews cheerleading BS.
Speaking of Chris Matthews, Michael Steele absolutely owned him last night in the post-debate wrap-up on MSNBC.
Ronald
October 23rd, 2012
12:10 pm
What no one has mentioned is that Obama really has no response whenever Mitt brings up the economy numbers and all of the promises that Obama said (no doubt, the man will say whatever he has to, promise anything he has to) when he was running in 2008. Rather Obama deflects, dodges or twists the question to the wording that he wants to answer. Bottom line, Obama had his chance and he blew it. He failed and generally has the attitude of “I’m Obama and just see if you can stop me.” How he is even IN the running with his economic record is baffling to me. He has a hold over the Obama sheeple unlike anything I’ve ever seen. Mitt is the person to elect. Obama just wants to be king.
Logical Dude
October 23rd, 2012
12:20 pm
Kyle says: But instead of torturing captives, or coming close to it, Obama’s policy has been to kill them — and possibly innocent people nearby — via drone strikes…. an opportunity to point out that drone strikes make it much harder to gather intelligence
Now Kyle, this makes it sound like you and the Right support torture.
Yes intelligence is needed, but torture is NOT the way about doing it. There are more effective ways with widespread support. Using torture *for any reason* makes us the “bad guys.” If you don’t think we look like “bad guys” to the rest of the world when we torture, (or worse, if you don’t care), then I wouldn’t want you or those who think like you to lead the country.
With that being said. (and not watching the debate). Both candidates are similar to Bush in foreign policy. Not as much changed with Obama as he “promised” and you can bet that anything Mitt will do will mirror Bush/Obama’s lead.
independent thinker
October 23rd, 2012
12:21 pm
Loved Obama’s response on Israel last night . Went over the heads of the cons and Kyle completely.
Bush forced Israel to abandon settlements and businesses in Gaza and unilaterally pull out. Result- daily rocket barrages from Gaza on Sderot in Israel. Obama went to Sderot in 2008 and the holocaust memorial. He provided funding to protect Israelis and potentially Americans with joint development of the Iron Dome rocket defense system saving Israeli lives every day.
What does chickenhawk Romney do when he went to Israel?
Fundraiser with wealthy American expatriates, photo-ops and insulting the Palestinians telling them they are inferior economically because they are lazy.
Then he lied last night about wanting to be Jimmy Carter and promote peace with Palestinians -the opposite of what he said on the 47% fundraiser tape.
As Joe said- a whole lot of Malarkey!
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed
October 23rd, 2012
12:25 pm
Not so independent thinker, some people don’t have to visit a museum to remind themselves what evil looks like.
md
October 23rd, 2012
12:48 pm
“The market got smacked right from the opening bell on Tuesday as the third quarter earnings season continues to come in even worse than expected. ”
Yep, this is what one can expect for the next 4 years under the idea that gov’t is the answer……….
independent thinker
October 23rd, 2012
1:10 pm
Sderot is not a museum. It is a city with live rockets falling daily.I have been there. It is not a place for a fundraiser for chickenhawks..Willard has never been to a war zone.
Pizzaman
October 23rd, 2012
2:05 pm
Ronald @ 1210: ” …… Obama (the President I assume) really has no response whenever Mitt ( I assume Mitt is Willard M. Romney, correct?) brings up the economy….”. Then some gump about politicians promises that they never (or can’t) keep.
So what’s your point. Better yet explain to me how Willard can promise 12 million jobs in 4 years and give no details as to how he intends to get Congress to enact laws that would make 12 million jobs possible. And please don’t hand me the party line–reduce taxes, reduce federal spending, relax business regulations, repeal the ACA. With the exception of the ACA it’s all have been tried by Reagan, Bush 1and Bush 2. It caused the second great Depression that started in 2006 and we, as a Country, continue to struggle with today.
Fact is Presidential candidates promise anything to get your vote and then when they get in find they can’t deliver. Just look at all the promises the President made and couldn’t fulfill. Your side relentlessly repeats the.
john
October 23rd, 2012
3:07 pm
It’s Dirty Politics there ain’t no doubt
That’s what this here elections all about @ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uQ2sRiz_JE
J.T. Douglas
SBinF
October 23rd, 2012
3:24 pm
Kyle, I would take the lack of activity on this post to mean that even the GOP hacks among us can’t even get behind your ridiculous assertion.
Romney could walk on stage and projectile vomit along with explosive diarrhea and the GOP ranks would still toe the line and declare him the winner. Your inability to do that today leaves you to claim Bush the winner. I wonder about anyone who considers Bush’s foreign policy anything but an abject failure.
I demand to see Cheesy Grits Birth Certificate- Long Form Please
October 23rd, 2012
4:32 pm
But I do think there’s a link running from Bush’s “freedom doctrine” to those uprisings.
Unbelievable.
Just unreal.
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 24th, 2012
5:54 am
The world will be a much safer, more democratic, more free place thanks to Our President Bush and the war in Iraq. He created a huge democracy smack in the middle east and freed 50 million people. The Arab Spring was an echo of that and will eventually result in a majority of middle east countries doing likewise.
MrLiberty
October 24th, 2012
1:13 pm
Lil’ Barry Bailout – Vote American – Wow, you just didn’t stop drinking the coolaid did you?? I wonder how the hundreds of thousands of dead Iraqi’s feel about your misguided statement? And the hundreds of thousands of dead Afghanis?
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 24th, 2012
10:22 pm
Mr. Liberty, your question makes about as much sense as asking how the thousands of dead Confederates feel about the slaves being freed.
You can’t make an omelette without breaking some eggs.