Round 2: Live thread for second Obama-Romney debate
UPDATE at 10:28 p.m.: Predicted sound-bite highlights of the night: Romney’s devastating rundown of the failed economic recovery the past four years, Obama’s comment that it’s “offensive” for Romney to suggest he and his administration weren’t forthright about Benghazi attacks. The former was the best, most sustained argument of the night from either man. The latter, a perfect way for Obama sympathizers to say “the president is back!” We’ll see which one — or something else — resonated the most with voters.
***
UPDATE at 9:54 p.m.: One story line tomorrow will be the way Romney dinged George W. Bush for his budget deficits. And, also in his answer to the way he differs from Bush, says his party “has been focused on big business for too long” and should be more focused on small business. That answer flies in the face of one of Obama’s main lines of attack tonight.
***
UPDATE at 9:36 p.m.: Obama says, “It’s just not true.” Romney says, “It’s absolutely true.” The topic doesn’t matter — it’s been like that all night. This one will go to the fact-checkers.
***
UPDATE at 9:15 p.m.: So far, “aggressive Obama” sounds a lot like “lecturing Obama.” He also is making a big bet that viewers will believe his argument that Romney only cares about Big Business and “the rich.” We’ll see how well the two work as a combo.
***
Will we finally see a second-term vision from President Obama tonight? That’s the advice from Democratic consultant extraordinaire James Carville’s firm, Democracy Corps:
The campaign has reached a tipping point where we believe the president has to offer a bold narrative, policies and choice if he is to win re-election and get to a substantial enough victory that enables him to govern and face the great challenges ahead. The first debate really did disrupt the race and presents a painful real-time test of what happens when the president tries to convince people of progress and offer a very modest vision of future change. Voters are not looking for continuity but changes that help the average Joe.
So far, Obama’s second-term vision consists of more of the things he did with Democratic majorities in Congress or would have accomplished, if it weren’t for those darn Republicans after the 2010 midterm “shellacking.” Put another way: leftovers.
Carville’s firm suggests he try something else — but in fact, the advice looks a lot like using better, more poll-tested ways of saying essentially what he’s been saying all along. This is a bit reminiscent of Obama’s customary excuse that he just hasn’t explained himself well enough. And if Obama does come out with new proposals tonight, will that be satisfactory to undecided voters — or will they see it as a cynical ploy this late in the game?
We shall see. The live-blogging will commence shortly after the debate does, and I’ll be tweeting my thoughts as well.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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361 comments Add your comment
jack
October 16th, 2012
10:31 pm
Asking Mitt what he plans to do about Outsourcing ?????? Seriously ????? He is the KING OF OUTSOURCING ….. this is going to be good. The BIG LIES ARE FLOWING NOW
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:32 pm
MHS–Thanks for the time line above. The Libs here would rather sacrifice their own integrity before admitting their man made a mistake. Truly sad.
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:33 pm
These danged Americans! If they’ll just work for $2.00/hr we can return those jobs to America!
Hillbilly D
October 16th, 2012
10:34 pm
MHS
There was an incident in April that you missed.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/15/us-libya-usa-security-idUSBRE89E1AL20121015
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:34 pm
What exactly has obama done to stop the unfair trade practices of China and the rest?
Ah… absolutely nothing!
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:36 pm
God told me to outsource those jobs! God told me to beat those old people out of their Medicare. God told me.
Common Sense
October 16th, 2012
10:36 pm
All you Sean “Great American” Hannity sheep… if Romney wins the election, be prepared for another war and more American kids sent oveseas to die for the cause of the corporate elites. When will you people learn that it’s not about race, religion or political party?
Del
October 16th, 2012
10:38 pm
Whenever Romney is in the process of countering an Obama point, Crawley comes in to cut him off and get the mike back in Obama’s hands. I’ve never seen such an overt bias in a moderated political debate by the media..
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:39 pm
President Barack Obama kicked ***! Watch out for those polls tomorrow! Uh! oh! the 47%! Now you know they don’t belong to the 1%. It’s all over but the shouting now. I know who I’m voting for!
jack
October 16th, 2012
10:39 pm
Did Mitt just say that Government does not create jobs ???? He’s been saying for months how he will create 8 million new jobs in his first 4 years ????? Flip Flop much ???
No Artificial Flavors
October 16th, 2012
10:39 pm
Crowley, you didn’t build that.
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:40 pm
HillbillyD
Perhaps the Hill blog missed it. I simply did a copy and paste that shows obama is lying and covering up. As say claim because he was saying al Qaeda was defeated.
Well obviously he lied again on that one. Al Qaeda just answered with a loud in your face obama!
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:40 pm
Good job, Candy! You’re not just another pretty face!
No Artificial Flavors
October 16th, 2012
10:41 pm
The great Guns & Butter debate. What history folks.
Obama FAIL
October 16th, 2012
10:41 pm
Obama lies…typical… This was a push debate at best.
JamVet
October 16th, 2012
10:42 pm
Oh by the way, which one’s Pink?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVdJBNQMCMc
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:42 pm
Republicans will once again fade into obscurity. Goodbye.
JDW
October 16th, 2012
10:43 pm
@bruno…”Do you deny the truth, or is it so important for you to spin things your way that you would damage your own credibility in the meantime”
If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck and he called it a duck then it’s not me spinning
jack
October 16th, 2012
10:44 pm
Well,,,there goes Mitt’s 15 minutes of fame,,,,,,, I wonder if Romney will run again in 2016 ??? What will that be,,, his fifth attempt ???
Obama FAIL
October 16th, 2012
10:45 pm
Buh bye Obambi… November cant come soon enough!!!
Del
October 16th, 2012
10:45 pm
Candy Crawley is the very same far left POS that she’s been for years. What a disgusting woman.
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:46 pm
Whenever Romney is in the process of countering an Obama point, Crawley comes in to cut him off and get the mike back in Obama’s hands. I’ve never seen such an overt bias in a moderated political debate by the media..
Agreed, Del. Her interjection in supporting Obama’s version of his administration’s response to the terror attack was way, way out of line. I’ll be curious to see how much this is highlighted by the Lib media. Likely it wont even be mentioned.
Del
October 16th, 2012
10:47 pm
Oh well…..no big deal the Obummer didn’t move the needle in his favor.
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:48 pm
If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck and he called it a duck then it’s not me spinning
SO, you’re denying that the Obama Administration pushed the idea that the Libyan attack was a reaction to an anti-Islamic video?? Your integrity is on the line, that is the tiny amount that you had before tonight.
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:48 pm
Once again the farce that is the Republican agenda comes to the fore. And once again, the Republican agenda has been shown to be nonsensical. It’s all over but the shouting now.
You’re going to lose. Just like you lost in 2008 only worse.
getalife
October 16th, 2012
10:49 pm
16 is right around the corner cons.
Run a con next time.
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:50 pm
Sadly some folks don’t understand how the economy works and what the role of the government is in helping it to succeed in creating jobs.
Mitt, unlike the Marxist obama, understands that the role of government is to create an economic climate that is conducive to job creation in the private sector.
The corporate tax rate obama now claims is too high he could have cut four years ago when he had absolute power, why didn’t he?
Nah go read what Steve Wynn said about obama… obama is clueless about how jobs are created in the private sector.
Wynn On Obama: “I’ll Be Damned If I Want To Have Him Lecture Me”
On the Tuesday broadcast of the nightly Nevada political program “Ralston Reports,” Steve Wynn, CEO of Wynn Resorts sat down with host Jon Ralston to discuss the presidential election.
Wynn, an outspoken critic of President Obama, didn’t hold back in his latest criticism of the incumbent president seeking a second term.
“I’ll be damned if I want to have him lecture me about small business and jobs. I’m a job creator. Guys like me are job creators and we don’t like having a bulls-eye painted on our back,” Wynn said about Obama to Ralston. An excerpt of the interview is below.
WYNN: I’ve created about 250,000 direct and indirect jobs according to the state of Nevada’s measurement. If the number is 250,000, that’s exactly 250,000 more than this president, who I’ll be damned if I want to have him lecture me about small business and jobs. I’m a job creator. Guys like me are job creators and we don’t like having a bulls-eye painted on our back.
The president is trying to put himself between me and my employees. By class warfare, by deprecating and calling a group that makes money ‘billionaires and millionaires who don’t pay their share.’ I gave 120% of my salary and bonus away last year to charities, as I do most years. I can’t stand the idea of being demagogued, that is put down by a president who has never created any jobs and who doesn’t even understand how the economy works.
Wynn on a scrapped business plan: “I’m afraid of the president. I have no idea what goofy idea, what crazy, anti-business program this administration will come up. I have no idea. And I have to tell you Jon that every business guy I know in the country is frightened of Barack Obama and the way he thinks.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/10/09/steve_wynn_on_obama_ill_be_damned_if_ill_have_him_lecture_me.html
Politico
October 16th, 2012
10:50 pm
Del
Didn’t you say yesterday, you would be ready to call it after tonight’s debate?
Damn you are wishy washy……….
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:51 pm
I’m for tax cuts that don’t benefit me and increase my taxes. I’m for outsourcing that ensures that my children can’t find decent jobs. I’m for gutting Medicare so that I or my parents are cast out into the cold in their golden years of like. What’s not to like?
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:51 pm
Goodnight to all.
Hillbilly D
October 16th, 2012
10:53 pm
MHS @ 10:40
Was just making you aware of it. Thought your source probably omitted it.
td
October 16th, 2012
10:55 pm
We do not have to settle on what we currently have.
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:55 pm
Here’s a question? What is the maximum IQ of Republicans? Beyond what minimum IQ do people “figure it out?”
Hillbilly D
October 16th, 2012
10:57 pm
The thing about these debates (and most debates for that matter) is that they’re both preaching to the converted.
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
October 16th, 2012
10:58 pm
Romney debated obozo and crawly and beat them both.
I say, yes!
Obama FAIL
October 16th, 2012
11:00 pm
little mikey fail… IQ in the double digits for little mikey…
Politico
October 16th, 2012
11:00 pm
hillbilly
yes, it is as much about riling up the bases as it is swaying the few you are undecided
bluecoat
October 16th, 2012
11:02 pm
TD in one of your previous post you said Obama had the moron’s vote.The R’s will never miss your vote.
Dusty
October 16th, 2012
11:03 pm
One announcer just reported that Obama called Romney a liar five times the firstt half hour. I guess tht’s one way to bully your way into a second term.
I thought the moderator and timekeeper(?) did a terrible job. There seemed to be no plan to follow and Obama seemed to be talking much longer than Romney. The president jumped off subject repeatedly to avoid making a direct answer.
I would say the whole debate was off key, uncoordinated and of no benefit to either candidate. It did show the spirit of liberalism and that is to win any way you can; lying, bullying and pushy rudeness…
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
October 16th, 2012
11:04 pm
4 years ago obozo was asked “what are you going to do about equal pay for women” and obozo said I’m going to fix it and tonight obozo was asked “what are you going to do about equal pay for women” and again obozo said I’m going to fix it and then babbled about lilly ledbetter, like that somehow made a difference, even though equal pay for women is still a problem.
Then Romney said what if there were so many jobs that employers HAD to pay women equally and I said “wow, it’s so nice to hear an adult speaking.”
And then I come here and read the comments from the obamamorons.
I pray for you, America.
mike
October 16th, 2012
11:05 pm
“little mikey fail… IQ in the double digits for little mikey…”
Whoa! Kyle! I believe that I Report has referred to me by a moniker other than my login name. Is that an actionable offense for your faithful or is that just for “liberals.” Kyle? I’m waiting. How many “days off” will I Report get? I’m waiting?
After all that’s the cause of “fights on the blog.”
Politico
October 16th, 2012
11:06 pm
Dusty
I’m sure they both lied. They did two weeks ago.
What would have changed from the last time?
Atlanta Mom
October 16th, 2012
11:06 pm
George Will said Obama won the debate. Don’t you just hate that?
Georgia
October 16th, 2012
11:07 pm
Americans aren’t likely to switch horses in a mid-recession comeback. Obama only had to show that he is still our president. and he is. I want Romney to run my company, but I want Obama to run my country.
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
October 16th, 2012
11:07 pm
Romney crushed obozo after his rambling idiocy about tax cuts and debt, and it was a softball that Romney blasted out of the park; who are you to talk of deficits mr. tax and spend? 6 trillion dollar clown?
It’s Ova.
Georgia
October 16th, 2012
11:08 pm
The moderator was an embarrassment, and she scored the only points ROmney made: sympathy votes.
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
11:09 pm
The thing about these debates (and most debates for that matter) is that they’re both preaching to the converted.
HD–There’s probably a lot of truth to that, but there may be a sizable number of undecided voters still out there.
From a scoreboard standpoint, Obama definitely did a better job tonight, but Romney was just as strong, if not stronger than the first time out. Once or twice, I think Romney could have done a better job by softening up a bit. Bottom line, however, is that he projected an image as a tough fighter, while Obama still was long on making excuses and evading taking responsibility.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed
October 16th, 2012
11:09 pm
Overall, a draw.
Until the fact-checkers get to work.
I’m not sure Obama told the truth once tonight. Not sure his constant interrupting is going to go over well with women (something I warned about in this format), even if it will energize his base.
I found the questions that were picked (by the moderator and crew) were largely irrelevant, nor evenly balanced. Most were clearly designed to put Romney on the defensive and a bunch of softballs for Obama.
I’ll also note that if you really listen, Obama never directly answered any questions asked of him. While Romney wasn’t much better, he at least tried to stay focused. Obama was (wrongly) describing what Romney would do, and throwing out sound bites instead of actually answering the questions.
Tiberius - pulling the tail of the left AND right when needed
October 16th, 2012
11:10 pm
“George Will said Obama won the debate. Don’t you just hate that?”
George Will has been a prepuce and has had an inflated sense of worth for decades now.
mike
October 16th, 2012
11:11 pm
If you think this debate was a draw you’re either smoking something or you are suffering from delusions.
Get real!