Round 2: Live thread for second Obama-Romney debate
UPDATE at 10:28 p.m.: Predicted sound-bite highlights of the night: Romney’s devastating rundown of the failed economic recovery the past four years, Obama’s comment that it’s “offensive” for Romney to suggest he and his administration weren’t forthright about Benghazi attacks. The former was the best, most sustained argument of the night from either man. The latter, a perfect way for Obama sympathizers to say “the president is back!” We’ll see which one — or something else — resonated the most with voters.
***
UPDATE at 9:54 p.m.: One story line tomorrow will be the way Romney dinged George W. Bush for his budget deficits. And, also in his answer to the way he differs from Bush, says his party “has been focused on big business for too long” and should be more focused on small business. That answer flies in the face of one of Obama’s main lines of attack tonight.
***
UPDATE at 9:36 p.m.: Obama says, “It’s just not true.” Romney says, “It’s absolutely true.” The topic doesn’t matter — it’s been like that all night. This one will go to the fact-checkers.
***
UPDATE at 9:15 p.m.: So far, “aggressive Obama” sounds a lot like “lecturing Obama.” He also is making a big bet that viewers will believe his argument that Romney only cares about Big Business and “the rich.” We’ll see how well the two work as a combo.
***
Will we finally see a second-term vision from President Obama tonight? That’s the advice from Democratic consultant extraordinaire James Carville’s firm, Democracy Corps:
The campaign has reached a tipping point where we believe the president has to offer a bold narrative, policies and choice if he is to win re-election and get to a substantial enough victory that enables him to govern and face the great challenges ahead. The first debate really did disrupt the race and presents a painful real-time test of what happens when the president tries to convince people of progress and offer a very modest vision of future change. Voters are not looking for continuity but changes that help the average Joe.
So far, Obama’s second-term vision consists of more of the things he did with Democratic majorities in Congress or would have accomplished, if it weren’t for those darn Republicans after the 2010 midterm “shellacking.” Put another way: leftovers.
Carville’s firm suggests he try something else — but in fact, the advice looks a lot like using better, more poll-tested ways of saying essentially what he’s been saying all along. This is a bit reminiscent of Obama’s customary excuse that he just hasn’t explained himself well enough. And if Obama does come out with new proposals tonight, will that be satisfactory to undecided voters — or will they see it as a cynical ploy this late in the game?
We shall see. The live-blogging will commence shortly after the debate does, and I’ll be tweeting my thoughts as well.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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361 comments Add your comment
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
9:57 pm
All have heard these same obama lies before. Thank God for the mute button!
mike
October 16th, 2012
9:58 pm
Oh no! The Saint Ronnie card! The pre-outsourcing record! Blame Obama for our outsourcing!
iggy
October 16th, 2012
9:58 pm
Lorraine is a cutey!!
mike
October 16th, 2012
9:59 pm
Self-deport them!
Tall
October 16th, 2012
9:59 pm
Mike:
A few things President Obama can’t say:
1. I successfully ran an Olympics.
2. I balanced a state budget as governor
3. I successfully restructured and established profitable private companies that employed more people after I helped take ownership of them. And more tax revenue was generated.
Politico
October 16th, 2012
10:00 pm
Was Bush that bad?
Republicans avoid him worse than Democrats avoid Carter…………. and that is bad
iggy
October 16th, 2012
10:00 pm
Romney crushed Obama with numbers. Lorraine is a cutey and is welcome to stay with me until she is “legal”.
And you libs say us cons dont care….
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:01 pm
Yeah who needs the rule of law, when we got obama… What’s a Republic anyway?
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:01 pm
Tall: weak. Try again.
It we just had more Bains, this country would be great! The problem is, we just don’t have enough outsourcing. We need more!
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:03 pm
Free stuff? Did you missed Romney’s Pell Grant diatribe?
Everyone has their faults, Politico. I have no doubt that the astronomical increase in college tuition is directly proportional to the amount of federal aid handed out. Even at my own alma mater, Harvey Mudd College. In the late 70s, full tuition and board was well under $10K. Now it’s more than $60K per year.
No Artificial Flavors
October 16th, 2012
10:03 pm
People came through Ellis Island on ships with manifests, not through the desert with aliases or though tunnels with ms-13 cover.
Tall
October 16th, 2012
10:04 pm
…”Was Bush that bad?..”
If he progressive media says so.
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:04 pm
Romney trying for the Hispanic vote: hypocrisy much!
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:05 pm
Now, now, we all know outsourcing stopped the moment dear ruler obama took to the throne: He didn’t push for none of those old “Free Trade Agreements” like that old Clinton and Bush.
Tall
October 16th, 2012
10:05 pm
MIke:
Run for office.
Del
October 16th, 2012
10:05 pm
Man is Candy a left wing political hack for Obama or what…She is the same lib pos that’s she’s always been throughout her career. Disgusting.
No Artificial Flavors
October 16th, 2012
10:05 pm
I made a lot more money under bush while in college than as a post grad adult.
iggy
October 16th, 2012
10:05 pm
Romney kicking Obama on his immigration record….LOL.
Politico
October 16th, 2012
10:06 pm
Bruno
I hear ya and agree. Just saying that Obama wasn’t the only one on the free bandwagon………
They are both weak
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:07 pm
Speaking of Bush,,, has ANYONE here EVER seen a Presidential Election where a political party has done such an excellent job of not having ANYONE from the previous administration involved in the current election ????
For starters, Jack, Bush has been out of office for 4 years not and doesn’t seek the limelight a la Bill Clinton. Most importantly, Bush’s presidency finished on a big sour note, so there’s nothing to celebrate. Which has nothing to do with Romney’s candidacy.
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:08 pm
Yes, by all means, Harvey Mudd tuition increase is the result of Federal aid. Nothing whatsoever to do with 50 years of inflation. And I believe in the Easter Bunny!
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:08 pm
The obama economy has deported more illegal aliens from south of the border than Mitt Romney would ever dare to send home.
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 16th, 2012
10:09 pm
Answer the question about Benghazi security, coward.
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:10 pm
Now, now, we all know outsourcing stopped the moment dear ruler obama took to the throne: He didn’t push for none of those old “Free Trade Agreements” like that old Clinton and Bush.
As did the disparity in wealth between those at the top and the bottom. (Not)
Which hasn’t prevented Obama from trying to make political hay at every turn at how he’s fighting for the little guy. Somehow his rube followers keep believing the rhetoric and ignoring the reality.
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:10 pm
Now obama is lying about his recent failure in Libya.
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:10 pm
I really enjoyed that rousing speech that George W. Bush gave at the Republican National Convention explaining the successes of his administration.
What? He didn’t give a speech? He wasn’t even invited? WTF? You can’t be serious?
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 16th, 2012
10:10 pm
Oh great, Obozo thought to increase security AFTER the Benghazi attack.
No Artificial Flavors
October 16th, 2012
10:11 pm
Just take responsibility. Reagan did.
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:13 pm
I hear ya and agree. Just saying that Obama wasn’t the only one on the free bandwagon………
Politico–If you know my blog history at all, you know that I don’t sugarcoat the faults of those I support. Obama has his good points, and Romney has his faults. In putting them side to side, however, I think Romney is the clear choice to help us achieve prosperity again.
Ted Tysk
October 16th, 2012
10:13 pm
Obama may think he is clever by suggesting that Romney is insensitive, unlike himself, rich with too many benefits, unlike himself, not a man of his word, unlike himself, but, Obama never mentions that Romney is even more educated that himself, a Harvard graduate, a very charitable man who gives many millions to charity every year, unlike himself, has a resume that is long and illustrious, grounded in reality. Obama is trying to portray Romney as a selfish, greedy, a liar. Obama is trying to put words in his mouth. Obama likes to paint Romney as a rich man who is out of touch with normal citizens. Untrue. Romney donates his time for good causes without pay all the time. Romney is willing to challenge Obama unlike those who surround Obama in his daily life, telling him what a great job he is doing, buT never confrontiNg him for fear of reprisal. Obama has finally met his match.
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:14 pm
Yeah everybody will be held responsible…. everybody but you obama and YOU will take no responsibility anytime in the future or you would have done so already, before this debate.
Lil' Barry Bailout - Vote American
October 16th, 2012
10:14 pm
Nice of Candy to lob that softball to Obozo!
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:17 pm
Obama’s combativeness will work against him with the voters.
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:18 pm
Obama you don’t support the second amendment you liar!
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:19 pm
Well, so much for an unbiased moderator. Is this b!ich working for the DNC or what?? The record clearly shows that the Obama admin blamed the attack in Libya on a film, and only reluctantly agreed two weeks later that it was a planned attack.
Once again, the media in this country sucks.
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:23 pm
Obama never mentions that Romney is even more educated that himself, a Harvard graduate, a very charitable man who gives many millions to charity every year, unlike himself, has a resume that is long and illustrious, grounded in reality.
Ted–I’m sure you’re aware, but the Obamas gave only a pittance to charity prior to his candidacy for the Presidency. Joe Biden shouldn’t even show his face in public based on how little he gave. Yet, these two Bozos want to paint the ever-so charitable Romney as being hard-hearted. Worse, their rube followers believe them. Style over Substance all the way.
Del
October 16th, 2012
10:23 pm
First off the majority of this group is anything but undecided as most sounded like they were on the left by their questions. Candy Crawley has been an Obamanation with her difference to the Obummer. Terrible.
JDW
October 16th, 2012
10:23 pm
That little green line on the bottom of CNN is killing mittens
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:23 pm
Thousands of assault weapons sold legally every day in Texas without any ID or background check which are then sold to legally Mexican druglords.
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:24 pm
He was for it before he was against it. Where have we heard that before?
JDW
October 16th, 2012
10:25 pm
Bruno…from the transcript of the presidents comments in the rose garden
No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/09/12/transcript-president-obama-remarks-following-deadly-attacks-at-us-consulate-in/#ixzz29WFgYWb8
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:25 pm
Hey Candy, why didn’t you reel your boy in when he went off on hand guns in response to the assault weapons question?
And now he is going off on schools?
Atlanta Mom
October 16th, 2012
10:26 pm
Enjoying your echo chamber Kyle?
iggy
October 16th, 2012
10:26 pm
“That little green line on the bottom of CNN is killing mittens”
Of course it is. Its CNN.
jack
October 16th, 2012
10:26 pm
“Oh great, Obozo thought to increase security AFTER the Benghazi attack.”
I guess maybe he should have sat there looking like a complete moron and read a book to school children while the country was being attacked ???
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:27 pm
Mitt: I plan to double down on outsourcing during my presidency! Think about how much you’ll enjoy you’re kids living at home in your basement! What a hypocrite!
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:29 pm
The Easter Bunny lives! I know, I’m for him! –Mitt!
Michael H. Smith
October 16th, 2012
10:30 pm
Timeline of Libya Consulate attack reveals administration contradictions
• June 6: Unknown assailants blow a hole in the consulate’s north gate described by a witness as “big enough for 40 men to go through.” Four days later, the British ambassador’s car is ambushed by militants with a rocket-propelled grenade.
• July: Anti-Islam video “Innocence of Muslims” posted on You Tube.
• Aug. 14: SST team leaves Libya. Team leader Lt. Col. Andy Wood has testified that Stevens wanted them to stay on.
• In the weeks before Sept. 11, Libyan security guards are reportedly warned by family members of an impending attack. On Sept. 8, the Libyan militia tasked with protecting the consulate warns U.S. diplomats that the security situation is “frightening.”
• Sept. 10: Al Qaeda leader Ayman al Zawahiri calls on Libyans to avenge the death of his Libyan deputy, Abu Yahya al Libi, killed in a June drone strike in Pakistan.
• Sept. 11: Protesters converge on the U.S. embassy in Cairo, scale its walls and replace the U.S. flag with the Islamist banner. The protests eventually spread to 20 countries around the world. That night, Republican candidate Mitt Romney criticizes an embassy statement denouncing the video before the events unfolding in Libya are known to the world. Late that night, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton says in a statement that “some have sought to justify this vicious behavior as a response to inflammatory material posted on the Internet.”
• Sept. 12: Media outlets report that Stevens and three other Americans have been killed in an attack by well-armed militants. Obama denounces an “outrageous and shocking attack” without mentioning the video or terrorism. Reuters reports for the first time that some administration officials believe the assault “bears the hallmarks of an organized attack.”
• Sept. 13: White House spokesman Jay Carney says “the protests we’re seeing around the region are in reaction to this movie.”
• Sept. 14: Carney says the administration had “no actionable intelligence” about a pending attack.
• Sept. 16: Susan Rice, the U.S. ambassador to the UN, does the rounds on the Sunday talk shows and says the video is the “proximate cause” of the assault in Benghazi. “Our current best assessment, based on the information that we have at present, is that, in fact, what this began as, it was a spontaneous — not a premeditated — response to what had transpired in Cairo,” Rice tells ABC. That same day, interim Libyan president Mohamed Magarief insists on CBS that “it was planned, definitely.”
• Sept. 19: National Counterterrorism Center director Matthew Olsen testifies before the Senate Homeland Security Committee that the assault was a “terrorist attack” but goes on to call it an “opportunistic” attack in which armed militants took advantage of an ongoing protest.
http://thehill.com/blogs/global-affairs/terrorism/261839-timeline-of-libya-attack-reveals-administration-contradictions-
Bruno
October 16th, 2012
10:30 pm
No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for
That statement assigned no blame. The blame was then squarely placed on a film within days, and only repudiated two weeks later.
Do you deny the truth, or is it so important for you to spin things your way that you would damage your own credibility in the meantime??
mike
October 16th, 2012
10:30 pm
Why wouldn’t you want to move to China?