2012 Tuesday: Voter fraud, not suppression, is real
It’s an election year, so we’re being treated to the usual back-and-forth about whether requiring voters to show a photo ID at the polls is an attempt to suppress voting or just voter fraud.
U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder — never hesitant to politicize an issue — last month likened voter ID laws to Jim Crow-era poll taxes that suppress minority voting. Of course, neither he nor any plaintiff in a court challenge to a voter ID laws has produced any evidence that suppression has taken place. I’ve always thought it is insulting to minorities to suggest they are incapable, or unmotivated, or whatever, when it comes to obtaining a free, state-issued photo ID.
On the contrary: Georgia Secretary of State Brian Kemp noted in a recent interview that since the General Assembly passed our voter ID law in 2006, the number of minority voters has soared — between both the 2004 and 2008 presidential elections, and the 2006 and 2010 gubernatorial elections. That’s strong evidence against the idea that the law is suppressing voting by minorities. (H/t: Georgia Tipsheet)
Critics of voter ID requirements argue that voter fraud is non-existent, and that champions of these laws are trying to solve a non-problem. A new book by two leading supporters of voter ID laws aims to take away that argument, too.
In “Who’s Counting?”, conservative journalist John Fund and former Civil Rights Commissioner (and one-time Georgia resident) Hans von Spakovsky argue that a current U.S. senator may be in office thanks to voter fraud. Byron York explains in a Washington Examiner column about the book:
In the ‘08 campaign, Republican Sen. Norm Coleman was running for re-election against Democrat Al Franken. It was impossibly close; on the morning after the election, after 2.9 million people had voted, Coleman led Franken by 725 votes.
Franken and his Democratic allies dispatched an army of lawyers to challenge the results. After the first canvass, Coleman’s lead was down to 206 votes. That was followed by months of wrangling and litigation. In the end, Franken was declared the winner by 312 votes. He was sworn into office in July 2009, eight months after the election.
During the controversy a conservative group called Minnesota Majority began to look into claims of voter fraud. Comparing criminal records with voting rolls, the group identified 1,099 felons — all ineligible to vote — who had voted in the Franken-Coleman race.
Minnesota Majority took the information to prosecutors across the state, many of whom showed no interest in pursuing it. But Minnesota law requires authorities to investigate such leads. And so far, Fund and von Spakovsky report, 177 people have been convicted — not just accused, but convicted — of voting fraudulently in the Senate race. Another 66 are awaiting trial. “The numbers aren’t greater,” the authors say, “because the standard for convicting someone of voter fraud in Minnesota is that they must have been both ineligible, and ‘knowingly’ voted unlawfully.” The accused can get off by claiming not to have known they did anything wrong.
York adds: “With 1,099 examples identified by Minnesota Majority, and with evidence suggesting that felons, when they do vote, strongly favor Democrats, it doesn’t require a leap to suggest there might one day be proof that Al Franken was elected on the strength of voter fraud.”
At the very least, those 1,099 examples — and 177 convictions, so far — represent far more evidence in favor of voter ID laws than opponents have ever mustered for their case.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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472 comments Add your comment
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
2:24 pm
“GOP should self deport”
You should try remedial english.
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
August 7th, 2012
2:25 pm
Logic how ironic for a mooron…
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
2:25 pm
“You made the statement. Back it up or you are a LIAR
Uh, yeah I made the statement, sport. You called me a liar so prove that I lied. Come on sport, do it.
“But keep lying if that pumps up your ego and gets you through your day
Blah blah blah… Is that all you got, cow?
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
2:26 pm
“Logic how ironic for a mooron…”
PERSONAL ATTACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
August 7th, 2012
2:26 pm
Logic your a water carrier for the loser party…
Holy Cow
August 7th, 2012
2:28 pm
Logic
Don’t get so excited that you get booted…………
Good day
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
August 7th, 2012
2:28 pm
You mean fool’s logic?
Holy Cow
August 7th, 2012
2:29 pm
AGAIN
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
2:29 pm
“Logic your a water carrier for the loser party…”
You should try remedial english.
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
2:30 pm
“Don’t get so excited that you get booted…”
Not sure how I’d get booted since it was you that name called, sport.
Keep trying.
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
2:30 pm
“You mean fool’s logic?
tick…tick….tick…
Holy Cow
August 7th, 2012
2:32 pm
logic
You know about that clock running out on these AJC blog, don’t you?
Dirty Dawg
August 7th, 2012
2:34 pm
No Kyle, your purpose is to perpetuate the flow of disinformation, in order to fuel the ignorance, that breeds the hatred and bigotry, that results in dumbasses shooting a bunch of innocents…and the worst part is you’re proud of it. After all you know damn well the only reason ALEC started these Voter ID bills in the first place was to, in fact, suppress the vote of those likely to support Democrats…and I don’t mean cheaters, of which there ain’t many, if any. If you want some real voting fraud, read up on the ‘RobGeorgia’ patch associated with the rigging of Diebold voting machines here in Georgia in the ‘02 election. Then again, that’s not your job, is it?
ITS ALL BUSHS FAULT
August 7th, 2012
2:39 pm
Dont worry logic in 90 days it will all be over….tool ..
JamVet
August 7th, 2012
2:40 pm
177 convictions, huh Kyle?
So where is the link to corroborate this fact? It appears that you forgot to include it.
Bueller? Anyone? Anyone?
Not that I wouldn’t just take the third hand word of some anecdotal report.
LOL…
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
August 7th, 2012
2:41 pm
No one from either side is claiming they support voter fraud. It’s a really bad thing.
But to claim thousands and thousands of cases when no one can produce more than barely a thousand in a single statewide vote of 2.9 million.
…and then comprehend dem dar facts as significance is totally mind boggling.
td
August 7th, 2012
2:41 pm
JDW
August 7th, 2012
2:23 pm
@md…”So we shouldn’t try?”
Frankly, no. Ever hear of the Law of Diminishing Returns? It costs too much. When it comes to voting 97-98 percent is good enough.
Then why not just do away with elections and poll for the winners of each contest. They all claim to +- 3 to 5%? While we are at it, let us not do an actual census but instead to a statistical determination of the population of each state and the nation.
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
August 7th, 2012
2:41 pm
Yeah, Jam, I’d like to see a few of those cases and see what the circumstances were.
Dave
August 7th, 2012
2:41 pm
Let Leonard Pitts explain the suppression thing:
http://www.tmsfeatures.com/columns/political/independent/leonard-pitts/Leonard-Pitts-Jr-columnist.html?articleURL=http://rss.tmsfeatures.com/websvc-bin/rss_story_read.cgi?resid=201207171700TMS_____LPITTS___ctnwl-a_20120718
Holy Cow
August 7th, 2012
2:42 pm
JamVet
Check out the last part of the article. It “suggests” that the voters were Democrats. Not one shred of hard evidence to back up Kyle or the organization in MN.
But it didn’t stop the overall innuendos in how the article was depicted.
Kyle is usually pretty good, but this was nothing less than a hit piece.
Holy Cow
August 7th, 2012
2:43 pm
Jam
The facts are correct. It is what he left out that is the real “story”
JamVet
August 7th, 2012
2:44 pm
Finn, perhaps someone has a link?
It seems like it would be extremely easy to produce it, no?
Or do you think that the faithful just accept such proclamations as incontrovertible proof?
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
August 7th, 2012
2:47 pm
Two days after a right wing nut job goes postal on people practicing their chosen religion and the right wing supporters have NO commentary about it???????????
Come on, Kyle!
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
August 7th, 2012
2:50 pm
When Homeland Security director Janet Napolitano released a report in April 2009 identifying right-wing extremists as a threat to the country, conservatives howled. The general sentiment was expressed by Michelle Malkin, who declared the report a “piece of crap … propaganda … an Obama hit job.” Jonah Goldberg complained that the DHS report failed to stick “to the practice of describing these groups with more specificity and without the catchall, ideologically loaded descriptors.” Well, now that we have learned the murderer of six people at a Wisconsin Sikh temple was a well-known white supremacist, conservatives might want to consider reexamining their claims that terrorists don’t exist on the right side of the political spectrum.
http://www.salon.com/2012/08/07/fbi_right_wing_terror_is_real/
JDW
August 7th, 2012
2:53 pm
@md..I never suggested we dispense with elections…merely that we stop spending money and time on non-material issues.
HDB
August 7th, 2012
2:53 pm
The problem here is that there’s greater evidence of voter SUPPRESSION rather than voter FRAUD!! The GOP is at the vanguard of voter SUPPRESSION…starting with the “Southern Strategy”…states’ rights….
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
2:53 pm
“Dont worry logic in 90 days it will all be over….tool”
Dont’ say I didn’t warn you, sport. Kyle doesn’t like what you’re doing.
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
2:54 pm
JamVet
Nice job getting the blog shut down early yesterday with your mindless rant about white people.
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
2:55 pm
“The GOP is at the vanguard of voter SUPPRESSION…starting with the “Southern Strategy””
Ah yes, the resident race baiter speaks for the millionth time about how the south suppresses black people.
ProfPalefuddy
August 7th, 2012
2:56 pm
Felons can get ID after they are released. How does having an ID stop voter fraud? It won’t. It will frustrate the very old, the very young and the poor voters who may not have a Government ID handy on election day. I suggest everyone either get the ID or Ask for an absentee ballot so you can vote and mail it in early. Make sure to follow the directions on the Absentee ballot.
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
August 7th, 2012
2:57 pm
Logic is like the person at work who is always keeping tabs on who is leaving early, who is arriving late, etc..
md
August 7th, 2012
3:06 pm
“Vote for the Romney Hood , raises YOUR taxes while he evades paying his….”
May want to check the innards of the hc and cc bills……it was very subtle pickpocketry….so subtle most are still not even aware of it…….
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
3:07 pm
“Logic is like the person at work who is always keeping tabs on who is leaving early, who is arriving late, etc..”
Finn is like the gal who’s always gossiping with the local overweight women in the office who can’t get a date.
JamVet
August 7th, 2012
3:07 pm
Kyle Wingfield
August 6th, 2012
6:52 pm
As usual, comments are now going into moderation for the night.
Go hump someone else’s leg, boy, you bother me…
md
August 7th, 2012
3:07 pm
“Frankly, no. Ever hear of the Law of Diminishing Returns? It costs too much.”
I don’t see much added cost, I’ve been required to provide ID to my polling station “volunteer” for 30+ years……
Logic was never intended for libs
August 7th, 2012
3:11 pm
“Go hump someone else’s leg, boy, you bother me…”
Sorry JamVet, I’m just not into beastiality like you are.
md
August 7th, 2012
3:12 pm
“Two days after a right wing nut job goes postal on people practicing their chosen religion and the right wing supporters have NO commentary about it???????????”
You left out the operative word of “radical”……of which they exist on all “sides”……unless you are trying to paint with a very, very broad brush??
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
August 7th, 2012
3:14 pm
I don’t see much added cost, I’ve been required to provide ID to my polling station “volunteer” for 30+ years……
people who have no concept of work often can’t see past their outstretched hand.
1) there is training the poll workers again
2) new literature detailing all the details
3) legal work to check that all the details are spelled out correctly
4) a process for handling all exceptions/questions. (This isn’t someone with just an 8th grade education, ya know?)
Now, how about the cost and bureacracy at the place you get the ID?
1) system for verification
2) printing of new instructions
3) training staff
4) additional open hours/ hours of operation may be necessary (people don’t work for free so hire another employee)
5) everyone who is just going for their normal renewals now lose extra minutes of their day (time is money)
etc
etc
etc
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
August 7th, 2012
3:17 pm
That’s right, md, all right wingers are “nut jobs”…and some are even “radical.” But, as you suggest, they are all “nut jobs”.
JDW
August 7th, 2012
3:17 pm
@md…here is a nice state by state list based on actual costs incurred in Ga and In. Total $250 to $750 million not including lawsuits, wasted time and opportunity cost.
http://assets.democrats.org/pdfs/photoid/Dems-report-real_cost_of_voting_ID.pdf
BTW…Voter ID only impacts voter impersonation…there are less than 100 documented cases nationwide in the last 50 years. Including zero in MN 2008.
td
August 7th, 2012
3:18 pm
Finn McCool (The System isn’t Broken; It’s Fixed)
August 7th, 2012
3:14 pm
I will ask one more time. Voter id requirements have been in effect for four years now so where is the evidence that it created voter suppression? Matter of fact Brian Kemp said we have record minority participation since the law went into effect.
Finn McCool (The System isn't Broken; It's Fixed)
August 7th, 2012
3:19 pm
logic, the skinny women never gossip? Is that it? And all skinny women can get dates but no fat women can get dates?
You can’t even do a put down without also putting down two other parts of society? 1) women 2) fat people?
JamVet
August 7th, 2012
3:19 pm
Talk about voter suppression…
Mitt Romney is trying to restrict voting rights for over 900,000 Ohio veterans (along with every other Ohioan). This includes military retirees with more than 20 years of service and multiple tours.
Late last week, the Romney campaign came out in defense of a new Ohio law, which would take away early voting rights for Ohio citizens – a law which President Obama is fighting against in court. That new law, passed by Ohio Republicans, would restrict the incredibly successful early-voting program in the state, and specifically do away with voting the weekend before election day, when many working Ohioans chose to vote early. In 2008, almost a third of Ohio voters used the early voting program, including veterans.
Hillbilly D
August 7th, 2012
3:21 pm
how do i get a voter ID card? don’t i need ID? and if so, why isn’t THAT ID good enough?
In Georgia, you register to vote and they mail you one or at least they mailed me one when they moved me to a different precinct. It doesn’t have your picture on it, though, so just about anybody of the same sex and species could use it, if nobody there knows you. Personally, I think if they’d just put a picture on that, we could quit arguing about this.
td
August 7th, 2012
3:21 pm
JDW
August 7th, 2012
3:17 pm
Money well spent if it gives 80% of the population a better feeling that their vote is not being stolen by someone voting illegally.
stands for decibels
August 7th, 2012
3:22 pm
the group identified 1,099 felons — all ineligible to vote — who had voted in the Franken-Coleman race.
We’re talking about people who’ve served their time, but are disenfranchised because of state laws that don’t re-enfranchise these people upon release, who go to the polls because, I guess, they figure they’ve paid their debt and can go back to voting again–yes?
Sorry, Kyle, but I guess I’ll have to channel my outrage for something more outrageous.
/drive-by
I demand to see Cheesy Grits Birth Certificate- Long Form Please
August 7th, 2012
3:23 pm
You made the statement. Back it up or you are a LIAR
Plain and simple.
Thats exactly what he/she is. He cant back it up so it will be spin spin spin and move those goalposts.
stands for decibels
August 7th, 2012
3:24 pm
one other thing:
if it gives 80% of the population a better feeling
Filed for the next time someone from the right explains that we libruls are all about “feelings,” and that it’s the right wing who are the cold, hard, logicians.
Don Abernethy
August 7th, 2012
3:24 pm
Welcome to the real world of corruption in politics in 2012 thanks to the Democrats and their connection to unions, mafia, and liberal socialist misfits. Obama,Reid, and Polsie leading their group in a win at any cost mentality.
InAtl
August 7th, 2012
3:24 pm
Kyle, the poster at 2:34 should at the very least have his post deleted. If it were me, I would ban him for it.