On T-SPLOST, vote your interests — not what you think others’ are
In recent weeks, a few friends have asked me for advice: How should they vote in July’s T-SPLOST referendum?
I asked them where they do most of their driving. Then I rattled off the nearby projects I could remember — and advised them to check the official map in case I had forgotten others. But one guy replied that he wanted to know what’s best for the region, not just himself.
What’s best for the region, I told him, is for everyone to decide what’s best for themselves, and vote accordingly.
Advocates of the 10-year, $7.2 billion sales tax say many of our transportation problems are regional in nature. One of their favorite illustrations is that the project most desired by elected officials in Douglas County was the interchange of I-285 and I-20 west, which sits in Fulton.
They’re right about the regional nature of many of our problems. And it might well be true that the best way to improve commutes for the people of Douglas County is to spend money on projects elsewhere.
But I’ve come to the conclusion that voting for T-SPLOST based on what I think are the interests of people in Douglas, or Cherokee, or Gwinnett, or anywhere else I don’t travel often, is foolish.
If the list includes projects that will ease bottlenecks and free up travelers from Cherokee to their jobs elsewhere in the region, then by all means those people should vote for it. The same goes for everyone else in every other county.
But if it doesn’t help them, why would I expect them to vote for it anyway with the expectation it could improve my commute — even if they don’t know much about the routes I drive and the traffic I face?
While $7.2 billion represents but a down payment toward the tens of billions in new infrastructure local transportation experts say metro Atlanta needs, it is still a large chunk of money. Not everyone in our 10-county region should expect to see all their problems disappear — not by a long shot. But if the list is as good for the whole region as advertised, a majority of voters ought to believe they’ll see enough progress to make it worthwhile.
The reverse is also true. If a majority of voters look at the list and shake their heads, it’s hard to argue the plan is really the best we could do.
It’s not as if the list reflects an obvious effort by local leaders to take a few important, congested corridors and fix them above all else. That approach might have justified spending a disproportionate amount of money in some places. Instead, the project list looks much more like a grab bag in which this county got its top 10 projects, that county got 12 it wanted, and so on.
Again: If that was the right method, it ought to show up in the vote totals.
Some people thinking regionally fret about the message a rejection of T-SPLOST would send to businesses thinking of moving or expanding here. I’d be much more worried about that message if most tax opponents were questioning the need to do anything in the first place.
Instead, the disagreements are largely about what to do and how to pay for it. Those can be resolved if the tax is axed.
Incidentally, this is one of the main ways government spending has grown so large, with so many complaints about how little we get for it. It does no good to vote more spending on education or anti-poverty programs, without recognizing education results have declined and poverty levels stayed flat.
It makes no more sense to vote for a tax that won’t ease the congestion you know, in the hopes it might help the congestion you don’t.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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244 comments Add your comment
Lil' Barry Bailout (Unexpectedly Revised Downward--Again)
June 23rd, 2012
6:50 am
Liberals have plenty of visions.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Unexpectedly Revised Downward--Again)
June 23rd, 2012
6:54 am
Aren’t the libtards always claiming that the selfish, greedy Republicans vote against their own self interest (quite the paradox, BTW).
Now is our chance to prove them wrong.
@@
June 23rd, 2012
7:19 am
Bruno:
Hillbilly, Dusty, @@, Reporter, Tiberius–Jay chose to honor me on FNM tonight. Please all drop by and put a song up.
Since jay has honored me with a permanent ban, that won’t be possible.
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
June 23rd, 2012
7:30 am
Got a birthday, anniversary, or wedding coming up?
Let your friends know how important this election is to you—register with Obama 2012, and ask for a donation in lieu of a gift. It’s a great way to support the President on your big day. Plus, it’s a gift that we can all appreciate—and goes a lot further than a gravy bowl.
Setting up and sharing your registry page is easy–so get started today.
I’d rather have the gravy bowl, to tell you the truth.
So how many of you dhimmicrats would love to participate but can’t because gay marriage isn’t legal yet?
@@
June 23rd, 2012
7:42 am
Too funny, Andy.
This is not just tacky. It’s wacky. Just when you thought the Obama campaign could not sink any lower they prove you wrong.
The comments left on the site are not exactly complimentary:
“Is this what the office of the President of the United States has come to? Pandering for wedding and birthday money?”
“This is sad, sad, sad. My heart is seriously crying here.”
“My six-year-old just lost a lower incisor. He’s going to be SO excited when the tooth fairy leaves him an Obama-Biden donation receipt in his name!”
http://communities.washingtontimes.com/neighborhood/middle-class-guy/2012/jun/22/obama-event-registry-new-low-trolling-cash/
Have they no shame? Too stoopid to be embarrassed?
Lil' Barry Bailout (Unexpectedly Revised Downward--Again)
June 23rd, 2012
7:44 am
I Report, that’s just pathetic.
“Support the pResident on your big day”
It’s all about Obozo, isn’t it? What a self-absorbed putz.
@@
June 23rd, 2012
7:52 am
More comments from Obama’s registry.
Now let’s check the comments for reactions from REAL PEOPLE who visit Barack Obama’s website.
Have I stumbled onto a comedy site?
I smell the smoke of desperation here guys. Seriousl, don’t you find this idea a tad arrogant? However, it is great blog material. Thanks.
IT IS GREAT BLOG MATERIAL!
What a freaking joke… In lieu of birthday, graduation, wedding gifts, etc., make a donation to Barack Obama’s campaign in my name? This is the most absurd thing to come out of his mind to date. What a bunch of ignorant arrogant douch-bags. Sorry to offend real douch-bags but this idiocracy has got to stop.
Oh my God! When is this amateurs hour going to be over with?
What’s next?….should we ask friends and family to send donations to Obama in lieu of bereavement gifts? This is an embarrassment.
http://wonkette.com/476206/barack-obama-would-like-anyone-with-a-gift-registry-to-just-give-to-him-instead
TBone
June 23rd, 2012
7:56 am
This is pretty much a no-brainer; giving more hard earned money to bureaucrats and politicians to “fix” problems created by their lack of vision in the first damn place is stooopid. NO I say.
How Inciteful Is That!
June 23rd, 2012
8:00 am
A little musical tribute to Kyles Konned Kons.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Unexpectedly Revised Downward--Again)
June 23rd, 2012
8:04 am
California defeats $1 per pack cigarette tax.
I don’t get it. I thought the answer to budget problems was higher taxes. Are there still enough Americans left in California to impose some fiscal sanity on the Democrat regime there?
Tiberius - Banned from Bookman's and proud of it!
June 23rd, 2012
8:11 am
If you want to improve transportation, then you need to fund it by hitting those people who use it the most, NOT spreading it across to everyone.
Improve MARTA? Raise the fees.
Build roads? Raise the gas tax.
But both of these actions would require our elected representatives to grow a pair, which isn’t going to happen anytime soon.
Whirled Peas
June 23rd, 2012
8:22 am
The government has a thousand ways they could save money. But for the politicians it is not fun to cut. It is more fun if they can get us to agree to let them into our pockets and then they can roll out the good times at our expense.
Not this guy. The government needs to learn to live with less.
Big D
June 23rd, 2012
8:51 am
Fixed rail short trip systems start where you aren’t and end where you don’t want to be. Marta is a prime example of this stupidity. The system will not and cannot exist without endless taxpayer subsidies. The solution to traffic congestion is for business to locate in the suburbs where the land is cheaper and the work force plentiful. Traffic congestion is caused by people going to and from work. Move the location of work and the traffic problem will be solved without one dime of tax payer money.
Big D
June 23rd, 2012
8:57 am
@@
June 23rd, 2012
7:52 am
More comments from Obama’s registry.
Great post. I think Obama’s next move will be to ask the unemployed to donate a portion of their unemploymnet compensation via a direct deduction. This president has no shame.
Grasshopper
June 23rd, 2012
9:01 am
Voting for T-SPLOST is akin to voting yourself a 1 percent pay cut. And it will NOT improve traffic one iota.
Vote NO.
skydog
June 23rd, 2012
9:17 am
This is fun watching these goobers NOT funding raw Deal and the Chamber of Republicans!
Choke um down. I`m in.
Steve Dunbar
June 23rd, 2012
9:20 am
Kyle is the perfect Republican. It’s all about me. No thought that every once and a while we have to do something for the common good.
Rafe Hollister, suffering through Oblamer's ineptocracy
June 23rd, 2012
9:27 am
Conservatives have no vision of the future, let alone the present!
Yes, we do Road, and it is frightful for our children and grandchildren. Never ending taxes, debt, and interest on the debt. They deserve better!
marko
June 23rd, 2012
9:35 am
What do get when cross a Jewish carpenter, Jesus, with a Russian atheist, Ayn Rand? A modern conservative. Evidently what Kennedy meant to say was ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you. Brother can you spare a tax cut? I’ll say one thing, for Ayn, the old girl was honest. She saw that her moral philosophy differed a hundred and eighty degrees from the one espoused by Jesus. Therefore she rejected Christianity. A man cannot serve two masters. You can’t serve both God and Money. That’d be Matthew 6:24 folks. Jesus choose to serve the poor and down trodden. Ayn took the greed is good option.
Enough tirade for now. I believe Kyle was trying to make a comment about T-Splost. There’s an old saying, you get what you pay for. A totally ridiculous expression. We’d all be happy if we got what we paid for. Is T-splost a regional solution to our obvious transportation problems, or a collection of localized boondoggle’s? I’m inclined to believe it’s the later. I don’t mind using my hard earned money to serve others, but it’s too hard to come by to simply throw it away. I’m not opposed to a plan in principal, but this looks a little too much like kids fighting over a candy bar.
Spartacus
June 23rd, 2012
9:40 am
Hmmmm…..let’s see now. We’re already a metro area of 6 million. So we want to build more roads, rail, and buses for “growth”. Why, so we can be a city of TEN million? Don’t we have enough lefty Yankees here already??
Vast Right Wing Conspiracy
June 23rd, 2012
9:43 am
Kept all my receipts one year – everything – to see how much I was taxed. Came out to around 57% – too much. When you assume 60% to 70% of this money would be wasted through graft, general incompetence, etc., I will be voting “NO!”. They take way too much of my money now.
Spartacus
June 23rd, 2012
9:43 am
Besides, we don’t have enough water for more Yankees and growth….just sayin’
Streetracer
June 23rd, 2012
10:01 am
If I remember high school civics right (and I may not, it was almost 50 years ago and I’m just a dumb a$$ chemE, not a really smart public admin or gender studies or whatever grad) the basic, core functions of government are 1. national defense, 2. public safety, and 3. stable economic system. Infrastructure to support those functions is implicit to basic government responsibility. If that is true, why are we not getting infrastructure improvements from current tax assements? Shouldn’t special taxes be proposed to support non-basic government operations?
carlosgvv
June 23rd, 2012
10:10 am
Since my interests are keeping politicians from taking more tax money and using it for their personal gain, I will vote no.
zeke
June 23rd, 2012
10:45 am
To be a true patriot, CUT GOVERNMENT FUNDING BY RAPING TAXPAYERS FOR SOME FEEL GOOD SOCIALIST AGENDA PROGRAMS OFF! The problem with this albatross is that IT WILL DO NOTHING TO EASE CONGESTION! Anyone who even thinks this ridiculous expansion of marta will reduce congestion needs to be put into an insane asylum! It is simple! YOU REDUCE TRAFFIC BY REROUTING TRAFFIC WITH NO DESTINATION INSIDE 285 AWAY FROM 285! The Outer Loop or some direct route with little or no interchanges from interstate to interstate! A worker going from Covington to a job in Marietta or Newnan should never have to go into the perimeter area! And, although not a part of this insane tax area, the proposed Paulding bypass is a prime example of how to ease congestion!!
obozo
June 23rd, 2012
10:50 am
R u gowing intu duh militaree? R we shippen u off to wor? Then donate all ur belongins to duh Obama 2012. Dont throw all that stuff away. Give it tu us and will pawn it off and win back the presidency just for u. You dont need all that junk in Afghaneestaan anyway.
Rafe Hollister, suffering through Oblamer's ineptocracy
June 23rd, 2012
10:51 am
Funny, when the DOD asks for more money the left goes apoplectic and says the DOD is always gearing up to fight last years war.
Yet, they never question other big government boondoggles, like the GA DOT fighting last years congestion.
obozo
June 23rd, 2012
10:53 am
Skip out on ur next Government Motors car payment and will tell them to piss off for you. All you have to do is give half the monee to us, Obama 2012!
Big D
June 23rd, 2012
10:56 am
Steve Dunbar
June 23rd, 2012
9:20 am
Kyle is the perfect Republican. It’s all about me. No thought that every once and a while we have to do something for the common good
Just what is the common good? My experience is the “common good” is usually a goal of a special interest group to satisfy the wants of that particular group. Democrats as an example want higher taxes for their own common good. They have an insatiable desire to spend other peoples money on their own selfish wants. One of their current “common good” programs is to find ways to increase taxes on U.S. Citizens to give the money to the United Nations. Another, is the fraud they have perpetrated on us to entice us into spending our money on anything they call “green”. Their needs are endless but the source of funding is never their own pocket. There is nothing common about the common good. I would respect the common good argument if the proponents actually funded the common good project. The present argument is that building a road is for the common good. No it isn’t. If may benefit those who happen to live in that area. But common, no. Mass transit is another “common good” program, Again, no.
Rafe Hollister, suffering through Oblamer's ineptocracy
June 23rd, 2012
11:01 am
http://www.torontosun.com/2012/06/22/green-drivel
Interesting article on a hot Saturday. The Godfather of global warming, an Al Gore disciple, says he may have overdone it on the alarmist rhetoric and says this settled science stuff is nonsense.
If all these scientist overstated GW, do you think maybe the DOT just might have overstated the benefits of T-Splost. When there is money to be made by some, never underestimate the level of deception that may be involved.
Will the last Democrat in Georgia please turn off the lights?.....
June 23rd, 2012
11:11 am
zeke
June 23rd, 2012
10:45 am
Your suggestion is to revisit the political slaughterhouse that is known in Georgia history as the Outer Perimeter/Northern Arc?
You know that after watching the long-controlling Democrat Party get thrown out head first, largely for their support of what became an increasingly unpopular Outer Perimeter than Northern Arc proposal, the dominant and now-ruling Republican Party won’t touch that proposal with a 10,000-foot long pole, no matter how practical it actually is and despite the fact that it is perfectly normal for many cities, both auto-oriented (like Dallas, Houston and Miami) and transit-heavy (like Chicago, Washington DC, Toronto, Boston) to have outer bypasses.
obozo
June 23rd, 2012
11:22 am
R ur folks gittin along in the years? Have they becum a royal pain in the a$$ four u? Can you no longer stay high all day, like us, becuz they r always callin u about being hungry and needing there diaper changed? Well, we r the guvernment and we our here tu help! Just bring them tu the Obama 2012 Kampaign Headquarters and will eliminate them under Health Care Law Section XL859(T)34EQS-BC567 Chapter 7,367,856 Sub Section Q. But you need to hurry before that orangutang and his racist white rich buddies on the Supreme Court throw the whole law out. Offer good only this weekend only, we think.
Be sure to bring all of your parents financial information along with you, credit card numbers, bank accounts, stocks, bonds, munis, iras, foreign holdings, corporate earnings, offshore accounts, currencies, coins, stamps, look under the mattress and dig around in the backyard if the mood strikes. Bring all that with you and will set u free!
Steve Dunbar
June 23rd, 2012
11:28 am
Big D
Please source for me your comment that “Democrats…find ways to increase taxs on U.S. Citizens to give the money to the United Nations”. Your comment, you wroteit. . I want to know the source. Let me give you some choices
the late Roy Harris
1) Sarah
2) Neal /Neil
3) Glenn Beck
4) The Donald
5) Newt
6) Fox News
7) the late Lester Maddox
9) Hannity
10) Rush
11) some guy that sits next to me at Starbucks.
Aquagirl
June 23rd, 2012
11:32 am
The present argument is that building a road is for the common good. No it isn’t.
What both you and Kyle fail to understand is that the other people affect your lives. Let’s say congestion kills a restaurant…customers won’t fight the traffic to get there. Your next-door neighbor then loses his restaurant job. Then he defaults on his house. Now you’re wondering why crackheads live next door and you’re underwater on your mortgage because Ayn Rand didn’t ’splain that to ya.
Modern conservatism is a dangerous combination of selfish and dumb.
Ol' Timer
June 23rd, 2012
11:45 am
The 1% tax is insignificant — it’s not the issue. What is the issue is the unwillingness of a certain faction to plan for the future. Infrastructure is so essential to the health and wellbeing of a local economy and not to plan for it is irrational. It’s stupid.
Let’s see how a deteriorating infrastructure will play into your future. A front-end alignment will cost more that the 1% sales tax. But I don’t guess one can expect some people to look beyond the next talking point by some disciple of Grover Norquist.
Rafe Hollister, suffering through Oblamer's ineptocracy
June 23rd, 2012
11:51 am
Modern conservatism is a dangerous combination of selfish and dumb.
Modern collectivism is a dangerous combination of envy, sloth, apathy, and lack of motivation.
Corey
June 23rd, 2012
12:01 pm
Those of you here commenting about the silly beltline do realize that construction on the beltline is already underway? You do realize that some of the parks along the beltline are already open? You do realize the rail overpass on Ponce near City Hall East is being retrofitted? You do realize that the beltline is moving forward with or without T-SPLOST? You do realize that commuter buses are already being rerouted downtown to accomodate construction and moving utility lines to make way for the street car project? While you fling mud at the beltline and street car, progress is already underway for those proojects with or without the T-SPLOST. In other words, your railing against them is a waste of time.
Samantha
June 23rd, 2012
12:06 pm
I will vote NO on TSPLOST. Our leaders must do better than this!
How Inciteful Is That!
June 23rd, 2012
12:31 pm
What revenue stream will be used to fund these projects, assuming they will ultimately be funded projects one way or another, if it is not a sales tax?
@@
June 23rd, 2012
12:53 pm
@ 11:46 & 11:50:
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
MiltonMan
June 23rd, 2012
1:25 pm
Kyle, you really do have friends who are asking for your advice how to vote on T-SPOLST???
Pal, you need new friends.
MiltonMan
June 23rd, 2012
1:26 pm
“Conservatives have no vision of the future, let alone the present!”
As opposed to Rat Roy Barnes who stole money from Ga400 toll for his buddies pet projects.
Tiberius - Banned from Bookman's and proud of it!
June 23rd, 2012
1:27 pm
“The Godfather of global warming, an Al Gore disciple, says he may have overdone it on the alarmist rhetoric and says this settled science stuff is nonsense.”
AmVet is now walking back on his support?
Tiberius - Banned from Bookman's and proud of it!
June 23rd, 2012
1:30 pm
“What revenue stream will be used to fund these projects, assuming they will ultimately be funded projects one way or another, if it is not a sales tax?”
As stated before, Inciteful, raise the gas tax to fund road construction. That way, the people who use them pay for them according to actual use.
Tiberius - Banned from Bookman's and proud of it!
June 23rd, 2012
1:33 pm
“Let’s say congestion kills a restaurant…customers won’t fight the traffic to get there.”
Or, how about reality, and let’s say that too much traffic has never killed a restaurant in the history of mankind.
How Inciteful Is That!
June 23rd, 2012
1:40 pm
As hybrid and electric vehicle use increase, a gas tax becomes less capable of collecting taxes from actual users. Also, natural gas is used by some as well. Is it taxed according to use? A gas tax also does not provide funding for rail. Perhaps state and local roads should all be converted to toll roads in order to make sure that users are truly taxed according to their usage.
Tiberius - Banned from Bookman's and proud of it!
June 23rd, 2012
1:45 pm
“As hybrid and electric vehicle use increase, a gas tax becomes less capable of collecting taxes from actual users.”
Given the slow pace of both those technologies, we’ll still get far more income from a gas tax increase (and it is still taken from those who actually USE the roads) than we would in 10 years of TSPLOST.
“A gas tax also does not provide funding for rail.”
Rail should fund rail. If rail can’t fund rail, then rail shouldn’t exist.
“Perhaps state and local roads should all be converted to toll roads in order to make sure that users are truly taxed according to their usage.”
What do you think a gas tax is?
@@
June 23rd, 2012
1:46 pm
Obama talks student loans in weekly radio address; ignores gov’t role in spiking college costs
IT’S THE ECONOMY, stoopid!
What’s wrong with this guy (Obama)?????
How Inciteful Is That!
June 23rd, 2012
1:50 pm
What do you think a gas tax is?
A tax that inadequately reflects actual road usage since it does not account for fuel type or fuel efficiency or vehicle weight, etc. Tolls account for actual use of a specific length of road and is a natural extension of the argument that rail users should pay for rail since rail users are effectively charged a toll for the use of said length of rail.
Tiberius - Banned from Bookman's and proud of it!
June 23rd, 2012
1:52 pm
“What’s wrong with this guy (Obama)?????”
So many answers – so little time.
Easier to say, “Just about everything”.