Robertson’s remarks highlight cultural shift on pot legalization
Mark this day as a big step toward a major cultural shift. From the Associated Press:
Religious broadcaster Pat Robertson says marijuana should be legalized and treated like alcohol because the government’s war on drugs has failed.
The outspoken evangelical Christian and host of “The 700 Club” on the Virginia Beach-based Christian Broadcasting Network he founded said the war on drugs is costing taxpayers billions of dollars. He said people should not be sent to prison for marijuana possession. …
“I just think it’s shocking how many of these young people wind up in prison and they get turned into hardcore criminals because they had a possession of a very small amount of a controlled substance,” Robertson said on his show March 1. “The whole thing is crazy. We’ve said, ‘Well, we’re conservatives, we’re tough on crime.’ That’s baloney.” …
“I really believe we should treat marijuana the way we treat beverage alcohol,” Robertson told the newspaper. “If people can go into a liquor store and buy a bottle of alcohol and drink it at home legally, then why do we say that the use of this other substance is somehow criminal?”
Robertson added. “I’ve never used marijuana and I don’t intend to, but it’s just one of those things that I think: this war on drugs just hasn’t succeeded.” He has made similar comments in the past, but his reiterating this stance might make his audience pay attention.
His sentiment about the failure of the war on drugs, at least, has been a growing one in conservative ranks. In 2005, Gallup reported that just 21 percent of Republicans, 22 percent of conservatives and 29 percent of Southerners favored general marijuana legalization. By last year, those numbers had increased to 35 percent, 34 percent and 44 percent, respectively. Among all Americans, support for legalization rose to 50 percent last year from 36 percent just six years earlier.
Those are pretty amazing rates of change for a social issue.
As many of you know, I have a 3-year-old son and a 1-month-old son. I am starting to believe that, by the time the oldest is old enough to think about trying marijuana — more than 10 years from now, but less than 15 — it will be legal for adults in this state and many others.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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169 comments Add your comment
ByteMe
March 8th, 2012
2:15 pm
I think he’s lying about his own usage.
I don’t think it needs to be legalized, but I do think the punishment structure for drug usage needs to change to one that helps people overcome their addictions. It’s cheaper for everyone if drug users are taught how to cope and re-integrate them into society instead of locking them up for years for abusing themselves.
ByteMe
March 8th, 2012
2:16 pm
In case no one gets it, my first paragraph was intended to be silly. Sometimes it’s too close to call when you just read it on the page.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
2:29 pm
More and more states are going to continue decriminalizing it and/or allowing medical use. I think legalization is still far off. Most mainstream politicians won’t even consider it. It’s kind of ridiculous though considering how much harm prohibition actually creates and the stupid reasons why it was made illegal in the first place.
1961_Xer
March 8th, 2012
2:36 pm
One word to describe it all: “Prohibition”. It is the perfect, indelible example of what happens when you try to outlaw a substance that anyone can easily make, that lots and lots of people want, and that will command high prices (and high crime, violence, and everything that goes with it) when some do-gooder decides that it should be illegal “for our own good”. Everything has its drawbacks. I have known high school football heroes with messed-up knees for life. I have known hard core runners with painful leg joints for life. I have known great computer programmers with carpal tunnel. Even things that are seemingly excellent for you can cause problems. We cannot outlaw everything that poses a health risk.
Life is about weighing the good (or at least the not bad) against the harm. I could never see, for example, meth being legal. It leaves a path of devastation so great and wide that whatever benefit (or not bad) that it briefly provides is quickly overcome by the harm that it does. Not so with alcohol or marijuana. I have known many people that have drunk alcohol or smoke pot casually for more than 40 years. They get up in the morning, work every day, and occasionally imbibe. This is not saying that the total cost of alcohol or pot has no detriment to society. But the harm caused by their prohibition far outweighs the harm caused by the substances themselves, and that is the lens through which you have to evaluate each and every substance that you criminalize.
HDB
March 8th, 2012
2:37 pm
Pat Robertson for legalization?? Maybe he’s becoming enlightened about the futility of the drug war!!
Don't Tread
March 8th, 2012
2:39 pm
Why stop at legalizing pot?
If you’re going to legalize one currently illegal drug, you might as well legalize them all. Then America can become a nation of junkies with no higher priority than looking for the next hit.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
2:46 pm
“If you’re going to legalize one currently illegal drug, you might as well legalize them all. Then America can become a nation of junkies with no higher priority than looking for the next hit.”
It’s about weighing the cost of prohibition versus the harm caused by the drug. The fact is, with regards to marijuana at least, prohibition causes more harm than it prevents.
Don't Tread
March 8th, 2012
2:58 pm
cost of prohibition = fairly measurable
harm caused by the drug = highly subjective, depending on who you ask
So, how do you define the point where “cost of prohibition”=”harm caused”? (In order to say something is greater than something else, you first have to define the equality point.) How do you measure something based on highly subjective criteria?
Logical Dude
March 8th, 2012
2:58 pm
Quoting: “If people can go into a liquor store and buy a bottle of alcohol and drink it at home legally, then why do we say that the use of this other substance is somehow criminal?”
Huh. . about time. Wonder why he didn’t say this when running for president all those years ago.
@@
March 8th, 2012
3:00 pm
Have you ever been in the home of pot-smoking parents. Their kids are negatively impacted. The same can be said for children of alcoholics…prescription drug abusers.
With me it’s about the kids. Parents should be willing to give up their cravings on behalf of the children.
@@
March 8th, 2012
3:01 pm
Personally, I think Pat Robertson’s a nutjob.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
3:08 pm
“cost of prohibition = fairly measurable
harm caused by the drug = highly subjective, depending on who you ask
So, how do you define the point where “cost of prohibition”=”harm caused”? (In order to say something is greater than something else, you first have to define the equality point.) How do you measure something based on highly subjective criteria?”
Well the biggest thing would probably be the physical harm that drug causes. Both directly from usage, as well as harm caused to others. My outlook is that as long as they aren’t hurting anyone else, people should be free to do as they please. I would not want to legalize harder drugs, but possession should be treated as a health issue rather than criminal.
@@
March 8th, 2012
3:08 pm
CHICAGO — Smoking among America’s youth has reached epidemic proportions, starting them on the path to a lifetime of addiction, the U.S. surgeon general’s office said in its first report on youth smoking since 1994.
I guess all those government mandated warnings didn’t work.
schnirt
Logical Dude
March 8th, 2012
3:08 pm
@@ says: The same can be said for children of alcoholics…prescription drug abusers.
And yes, there is always a *small* percentage of users who fall into the abuser category.
Prohibition does not make sense for the majority of those who would use it when legal.
@@
March 8th, 2012
3:12 pm
Logical Dude:
This one’s kinda personal for me. My younger sister started using marijuana and graduated to heroine. The drugs took her out seven years ago.
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
3:13 pm
“Religious broadcaster Pat Robertson says marijuana should be legalized and treated like alcohol because the government’s war on drugs has failed.”
And the left rejoiced. Amen.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
3:13 pm
I’m sorry to hear that @@, but like I said as long as you aren’t hurting anyone else you should be free to do as you wish. In those cases where parents are using drugs and not responsibly taking care of their children, they should be prosecuted.
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
3:14 pm
“As many of you know, I have a 3-year-old son and a 1-month-old son. I am starting to believe that, by the time the oldest is old enough to think about trying marijuana — more than 10 years from now, but less than 15 — it will be legal for adults in this state and many others.”
I also have a child and I also know that God is in control.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
March 8th, 2012
3:17 pm
Wow! A government program that has failed. Certainly a news flash if I here read one.
Seriously, though, I have always maintained that pot use should be legalized, however, anyone distributing pot (or any known addictive substance that impairs your judgment) should be severely dealt with.
Grow your own? Fine.
Try to make money off of getting someone hooked? Go away for a long, long time. Then let’s see how much drug use we really have when the supply dries up.
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
3:17 pm
” Maybe he’s becoming enlightened about the futility of the drug war!!”
HDB, you and I finally agree on something.
@@
March 8th, 2012
3:18 pm
Logical Dude:
In those cases where parents are using drugs and not responsibly taking care of their children, they should be prosecuted.
How would you go about doing that when the government said it’s O.K.? Who’s gonna take care of the kids…you and I?
I’m all for changing sentences for possession but getting into the business of providing drugs? Not so much.
Scooter
March 8th, 2012
3:18 pm
America is fighting two truly endless wars and they are on drugs and poverty. Neither will ever be won and both cost a ton of money; but, both give immense power to politicians.
Logical Dude
March 8th, 2012
3:20 pm
@@, I’m sorry to hear that.
I have a friend who graduated to meth, and was jailed for identify theft.
Legal or illegal, it would not have made a difference to them. My argument is that the war on drugs and/or prohibition has failed. Save the funds, or use the funds for rehab – like my friend went through. People come out much better from a stint in rehab than a stint in jail.
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
3:23 pm
UH OH LEFT WING TARDS!!!!!!
U.S. Unemployment Up in February
U.S. unemployment, as measured by Gallup without seasonal adjustment, increased to 9.1% in February from 8.6% in January and 8.5% in December.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/153161/Unemployment-February.aspx
Logical Dude
March 8th, 2012
3:23 pm
@@ How would you go about doing that when the government said it’s O.K.?
The same way that you do for an alcoholic. There are already rules for child neglect. So it should be treated the same way.
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
3:23 pm
And THIS is why the idiot dems need to go.
SEBELIUS HAS ‘NO IDEA’ IF OBAMACARE ADDS TO THE DEFICIT
http://freebeacon.com/sebelius-has-no-idea-if-obamacare-adds-to-the-deficit/
Rick
March 8th, 2012
3:29 pm
“How would you go about doing that when the government said it’s O.K.? Who’s gonna take care of the kids…you and I?
I’m all for changing sentences for possession but getting into the business of providing drugs? Not so much.”
If the substance is legal or illegal, it doesn’t really make a difference. Do you think alcohol should be illegal again?
And the fact is that prohibition creates more harm than it prevents. It creates a black market for drugs where people will use violence to move their products. It practically creates the gateway drug problem because people buying softer drugs in contact with those who often also sell harder drugs.
@@
March 8th, 2012
3:35 pm
Logical Dude:
I’ll concede but the unintended consequences won’t be pretty.
Know of three young men who suffer from organic brain syndrome as a result of overindulging. One is in prison for murder…one is basically worthless to anyone other than his parents and the other suffers from bouts of paranoid schnizophrenia.
Enjoying a legalized tokefest can also create hazards in the workplace, placing co-workers at risk.
Okey dokey…I’m done.
Jefferson
March 8th, 2012
3:36 pm
The laws cause more problems than the plant causes.
Adults dealing to children is a different issue.
Education is the key to social problems.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
3:38 pm
“Know of three young men who suffer from organic brain syndrome as a result of overindulging. One is in prison for murder…one is basically worthless to anyone other than his parents and the other suffers from bouts of paranoid schnizophrenia.
Enjoying a legalized tokefest can also create hazards in the workplace, placing co-workers at risk.”
Marijuana is impossible to OD on and any links to physical harm are questionable.
Workplaces can still drug test all they want if they desire as they do now, that would be no different.
Jefferson
March 8th, 2012
3:41 pm
Cigs and beer used to be the “gateway drugs”, in todays world I just could not tell you, but I’m guessing a lot of it is legal meds in the form of pills.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
March 8th, 2012
3:44 pm
“Education is the key to social problems.”
Yeah, cause THAT’S worked out so well for us these past 30 years or so . . .
Don't Tread
March 8th, 2012
3:44 pm
I know of someone who went from pot > meth > other stuff > child pornography > child molestation > prison for a very long time.
Anyone know the formula for “harm done”?
Rick
March 8th, 2012
3:51 pm
“I know of someone who went from pot > meth > other stuff > child pornography > child molestation > prison for a very long time.
Anyone know the formula for “harm done”?”
So because he smoked pot, he became a child molester? Dude you have no reasonable way of proving those two things are connected. The fact is that most people who smoke pot don’t move on to harder drugs, just look at drug usage rates and it’s obvious. And as I pointed out, prohibition actually contributes to the gateway drug issue. If someone wants to buy some weed, they have to go to a dealer who may often also sell other, harder drugs. With legalization, you completely remove that element.
Jefferson
March 8th, 2012
3:54 pm
you can’t learn if you are running your trap.
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
3:56 pm
“I know of someone who went from pot > meth > other stuff > child pornography > child molestation > prison for a very long time.”
Sums up getalife.
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
3:57 pm
“Education is the key to social problems.”
HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
3:58 pm
“you can’t learn if you are running your trap.”
Retake remedial english, cupcake.
Now with Ten Percent More Flavor
March 8th, 2012
4:05 pm
“Just say no to drugs.” – What’s her name.
Does anyone know how muc government has spent on fighting drugs and how successful it has been. How about prohibition. Is it a fair comparison. Are alcohol and marijuana comparable. Should people have a choice. Liver damage versus lung damage for the abusers. What about the casual user.
Ayn Rant
March 8th, 2012
4:07 pm
Robertson’s right! The war on drugs has been a failure since inception, and the costs continue to mount. Here are some of the consequences:
- Dealers push to expand addiction among the gullible because the illegal drug trade is highly profitable.
- The public squanders billions every year to apprehend, convict, and imprison drug offenders.
- The drug trade blights communities and corrupts public officials.
- Drug addicts commit crimes, especially theft, to support the cost of their addiction.
- The American appetite for illegal drugs supports the international drug trade, which causes corruption, upheaval, and instability in all the Latin American countries from Bolivia north to Mexico. Many citizens of those countries flee to the US to escape the resultant poverty and despair.
The addictive drugs cost a pittance if purchased at source by pharmaceutical companies and dispensed by pharmacies. Addicts who see a physician to obtain a prescription for recreational drugs are, in effect, taking the first step toward identification, protection, and treatment of their addiction. This opens the opportunity for treating addiction, which is cheaper than imprisoning addicts.
Making generic addictive drugs available by prescription will kill the illegal drug trade by depriving criminals of the opportunity for immense, but dangerous, wealth and power.
Jerry Eads
March 8th, 2012
4:09 pm
It would be truly amazing if a major policy change on such a matter were based at least in part on DATA (as hard as it would be to collect) – as in, for example, what percentage of pot smokers migrate to other drugs because the sources are the same? Would they be as likely to migrate to other drugs if pot were taken out of the criminal environment? What percentage of pot smokers are otherwise productive citizens and is that worse or better than for those who consume alcoholic beverages? What is the likelihood that someone who smokes pot legally becomes an UNproductive citizen and is THAT different from those who consume alcoholic beverages? And on and on. In short, what do the DATA show are the benefits and consequences of changing policies and laws on pot possession and use?
@@
March 8th, 2012
4:11 pm
Rick:
Marijuana is impossible to OD on and any links to physical harm are questionable.
If you say so. I never claimed anyone died from overdosing on marijuana. I can only attest to what I’ve witnessed.
Marijuana also may affect mental health. Studies show that early use may increase the risk of developing psychosis (a severe mental disorder in which there is a loss of contact with reality) including false ideas about what is happening (delusions) and seeing or hearing things that aren’t there (hallucinations), particularly if you carry a genetic vulnerability to the disease. Also, rates of marijuana use are often higher in people with symptoms of depression or anxiety.
^^^ From a medical site that neither promotes nor discourages legalization. Acknowledges all the states that have legalized the drug. That excerpt perfectly describes the third fella I mentioned.
I’ve known individuals who’ve smoked it long term and never suffered any negative consequences. No two people are alike. Some will gamble and lose. Others will gamble and break even.
I find no advantage in escaping reality…dulling the senses. I’ll leave that to folks who can’t handle the everyday challenges of life.
ragnar danneskjold
March 8th, 2012
4:14 pm
There are extraordinarily few drugs I think so dangerous that usage ought to be controlled: cocaine and derivatives, meth-amphetamine and derivatives, alcohol and derivatives. Those are all substances wherein people engage in acts they would not when sober – my definition of dangerous, as I have faith in the basic goodness of people. As to heroin, sleeping pills, marijuana – those are broadly no risk to society, only to the individual, and I would wish to see those sold over the counter.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
4:14 pm
In any case @@, as I said people should be allowed to do what they please if they aren’t harming others. If they happen to harm themselves, that its their own choice.
@@
March 8th, 2012
4:20 pm
Alrighty folks! No complaining when the children need our help. I will always be there for the children. The adults? I couldn’t care less about.
carlosgvv
March 8th, 2012
4:21 pm
If someone can assure me being high on pot does not in any way affect safe driving, I will agree with Robertson.
@@
March 8th, 2012
4:21 pm
Paging Hillbilly…where are you? The sports blog. I’m gonna slip on over to see if I can find you.
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
4:22 pm
Part of the problem with this topic of drugs, particularly the illegal drugs, is that too few people understand this nation’s drug history or the Constitution. This overlaps another issue, dare it be said a woman’s right over her body free from government control; and, provided “non-consensual force is used or harm is done” to anyone else, then the right to use one’s own body or to consume any substance in one’s body is the right of every individual. Constitutionally speaking our drug laws fall outside of the strict written limits of the Constitution, despite the court decisions that render them otherwise legal.
No need to say it, my views are Libertarian – Conserva-tarian – on the individuals rights of consenting adults(with stipulations on harm or force issues). If you want to kill yourself by using drugs, so long as you don’t burden, harm or kill anyone else in your quest to commit suicide or burn your brains up, then go ahead.
You are likely right on the change in drug laws, Kyle. My only objections to this change will be the government’s role of regulation via taxation. There will be many newly created addicts as a result of legalization and if government’s traditional role remains the same, which in all likelihood it will – thanks to big gub’ment scumbag politicians – none of these tax monies collected on the distribution and sale of these legalized drugs will ever be used to treat the medical conditions or the addiction rehabs of the drug abuser that are sure to occur that our government will have co-created, enabled and like it are not, “profited from” more than anyone in this new legalized drug market. Et al The taxation and regulation of Tobacco and Alcohol.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
4:26 pm
“Alrighty folks! No complaining when the children need our help. I will always be there for the children. The adults? I couldn’t care less about.”
Again, what is the difference if the substance is legal or illegal? There are already laws in place with regards to child neglect.
“If someone can assure me being high on pot does not in any way affect safe driving, I will agree with Robertson.”
Obviously driving while under the influence should remain illegal. Should alcohol be illegal again because it effects safe driving (even moreso than marijuana)? Or cell phone use in cars (some states already have done this)? Talking to others in cars? Messing with the radio? All these things contribute to unsafe driving.
A Different Chong of Cheech and Chong Fame
March 8th, 2012
4:27 pm
I lived in Holland for 5 years. Legalizing marijuana will not lead to anarchy. We’re such hypocrites over here. We preach personal responsibility but legislate as if no one has one ounce of restraint.
On the other hand, if the government takes over marijuana cultivation, they will surely mess it up. Potency will diminish and we will once again have to take to the streets to find some decent stuff.
A Different Chong of Cheech and Chong Fame
March 8th, 2012
4:30 pm
Any truth to the rumor that Pat will be renaming his program, “The 420 Club”?
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
4:32 pm
Cute one, Fame!
A Different Chong of Cheech and Chong Fame
March 8th, 2012
4:34 pm
My friend started with mother’s milk. From there to apple juice, eventually to Coca Cola, to marijuana, and finally to crack cocaine.
Outlaw breast feeding!
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
4:45 pm
“I lived in Holland for 5 years. ”
Holland is a Muslim country now.
I may be out of my mind to you but you should stay out of my business
March 8th, 2012
4:56 pm
Marijuana is not physically addictive. Period. That is not an opinion, but a simple fact. Yes it can be psychologically addictive but so can food, or shopping or pretty much any other behavior. So the idea that marijuana is inherently a gateway drug is preposterous.
Marijuana has virtually NO long term impact on the user and certainly has far fewer impacts than legal alcohol. Period. The marijuana high is completely unlike that of other “harder” drugs which actually alter the chemical balance of the brain. Rather then altering the chemical balance, THC increases the uptake potential of neurotransmitters in certain areas such as the Basal Ganglia, the Hippocampus and the Cerebellum. It is the impacts on these areas that can lead to short term effects such as coordination issues, short-term memory and the dreaded munchies. Once the THC is metabolized out of your system its long term effects are minimal if not non-existent.
Over all the negative impacts of THC on the body and brain PALE in comparison to those of ethyl alcohol readily available even on Sundays now.
People are perfectly entitled to differing opinions on whether or not marijuana should be legal but they are not entitled to their own set of facts.
The days of “Reefer Madness” must be put behind us as should be the days of the religion or morals of other dictating what people do in their own homes. If we are going to champion smaller, less intrusive government then we must be consistent.
A Different Chong of Cheech and Chong Fame
March 8th, 2012
4:56 pm
And America is a Mexican country right now. Your point?
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
5:00 pm
“And America is a Mexican country right now. Your point?”
Mexicans dont fly planes into buildings.
carlosgvv
March 8th, 2012
5:00 pm
Rick
Drunk driving is illegal because it’s dangerous. Texting is illegal while driving because it’s dangerous. So, are you saying pot smokers should get a free pass?
jconservative
March 8th, 2012
5:00 pm
Kyle, I agree completely with your timeline.
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
5:03 pm
Well, I was reading a report from the USA Department of Drug Enforcement and it was not encouraging.
According to them, when the Netherlands relaxed its laws on marijuana, the use of that substance increased among 18-25 year olds two fold. It doubled, folks.
Since legalization of marijuana, heroin addiction levels in Holland have tripled.
These are statictics from 1984-96 but they do show what happened as soon as legalization of marijuana came to the Netherlands.
If you read more, crime also increased.
I hate to see the legal doors open for a drug that is detrimental in many ways. But, I guess if enough people want to “drug” themselves to death, they will want laws changed so they can do it legally.
Pompano
March 8th, 2012
5:15 pm
Many people actually graduate from Pot to other drugs due to drug testing. It’s actually easier to pass a test when using harder drugs than when using Pot. If Pot were legal, they’d likely stop there.
ESPN did a great special on Todd Marinovich. He changed from Pot to LSD because LSD would not get detected on an NFL drug test.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
5:17 pm
“Drunk driving is illegal because it’s dangerous. Texting is illegal while driving because it’s dangerous. So, are you saying pot smokers should get a free pass?”
Not at all. Notice the first sentence I wrote in that comment: “Obviously driving while under the influence should remain illegal.” My point was that marijuana shouldn’t be illegal simply because it is dangerous to use while driving, as there are an infinite number of things that are dangerous to do while driving. It should be illegal to drive under the influence of any substance, because it increases the chances of you harming someone else. If someone wants to smoke marijuana in the privacy of their own home though, I see no issue with that.
1961_Xer
March 8th, 2012
5:17 pm
@@ wrote: This one’s kinda personal for me. My younger sister started using marijuana and graduated to heroine. The drugs took her out seven years ago.
… And you saw how making those illegal worked out for her. Since you brought it up, this begs two comments:
1. When pot is illegal, then finding it often brings one in contact with unsavory people. The same guy who sells the illegal pot also sells the illegal heroine. Had the pot been legal, she would have never come in contact with those selling heroine.
2. You make the case that criminalization did not help. The money would have been better spent on programs to get her off of those drugs.
Sorry for your loss, but your experience affirms that pot should be legalized. Your gut instinct may say “no way”, but reality shows the folly of your thinking
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
5:20 pm
Sometimes I have to wonder.
Smoking is now seen as taboo and every smoker is predicted to have lung cancer and so will the non-smokers, and children around them So we get NO SMOKING signs everywhere and great penalties to the cigarette companies.
Now we have laws forbiding a habit forming, detrimental drug use and a whole gang of people want us to abolish the laws so they can inhate, inject or whatever no matter what it does to their health.
So throw out your tobacco but bring in your marijuana. And rub your stomach and pat your head while standing on one foot. Makes just as much sense!
Rick
March 8th, 2012
5:21 pm
Dusty,
If you have a link to that, I would like to see it. You should read about how drug decriminalization worked in Portugal http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html.
And again, it is impossible to OD on marijuana so using it you can not “drug yourself to death.”
I may be out of my mind to you but you should stay out of my business
March 8th, 2012
5:21 pm
Dusty,
The “studies” cited by the DEA are cherry picked by the bureaucrats there to justify their continued existence. There have been literally HUNDREDS of studies on the Dutch and Australian Models for the simple reason that research on those models is like having an open, free air laboratory. Overwhelming the studies have shown that legalization of cannabis has NOT led to an increase in overall use of the substance.
There are also many studies inquiring into the “gateway effect” of legalization and those studies OVERWHELMINGLY discount that legalization leads to an increase of the use of other drugs.
As a researcher in this area I can tell you that bias creeps into this area of research at an alarming rate and it is possible, if you begin your research with an eye toward a certain outcome, to slant the research to “prove” your point.
The reality is, however, that the number of studies disproving the “findings” of the DEA are vast in number.
And since when did conservatives trust anything coming out of the government. Be consistent.
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
March 8th, 2012
5:22 pm
I always thought it took being caught with like a ton of skunk before you were sent to jail?
I’ll have to remember not to fire one up in Pat’s neighborhood, geez.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
5:24 pm
Dusty,
I think if people want to smoke cigarettes, that is their choice. I agree with stricter regulations for smoking in public though, as secondhand smoke can harm others. Why is personal responsibility such a bad thing? A bigger problem in this country than drug use is obesity. Should the government start banning unheatlhy foods too?
I may be out of my mind to you but you should stay out of my business
March 8th, 2012
5:27 pm
Dusty,
I’m not trying to pick on you but a recent study has confirmed that the cancer risk associated with tobacco use does not extend to marijuana use.
In fact a May 2011 Harvard study shows that THC actually cuts tumor growth rates in half and significantly reduces the ability of the cancer to spread.
So that is yet another myth you cannot rely on in this discussion.
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
5:28 pm
Rick,
I picked that DEA report from google. You can find it.
You don’t overdose on tobacco or marijuana. But they both can be blamed for death at an earlier age.
rightwing troll
March 8th, 2012
5:35 pm
“I guess all those government mandated warnings didn’t work.”
Then what will work? I mean, obviously it’s not working because it’s the government trying…
schnirt
Rick
March 8th, 2012
5:38 pm
Dusty,
It is actually possible to overdose on tobacco. It’s actually called nicotine poisoning. If you’re going to claim marijuana has an effect on life expectancy then let’s see a study that says that.
Aquagirl
March 8th, 2012
5:39 pm
You don’t overdose on tobacco or marijuana. But they both can be blamed for death at an earlier age.
So can Big Macs. But as I recall, conservatives pitched a fit when New York went all nanny-state over food. Matter of fact, weren’t you in that group, Dusty?
Pompano
March 8th, 2012
5:40 pm
The last 3 US Presidents have all admitted to using/trying Pot! BO even had pictures taken with him holding a blunt.
In spite of this, while we often hear of politicians with drinking or prescription drug problems that inhibit their ability to perform their duties, I can’t recall one with a Pot problem.
S
March 8th, 2012
5:41 pm
Well Duh, me thinks old Bubba Pat has been spending to many hours talking to God. Millions have people have thought just that same thing for years and years. We waste billions and billions of $’s on fighting this drug war. Make it legal and sell just as they do alcohol and Tax it to high heaven, like cigarettes.
rightwing troll
March 8th, 2012
5:43 pm
Heh… Dusty relies on the gubbimint for information… heh… talk about cherry picking… either you want the gubbimint out of our lives or you don’t, you don’t get to decide the gubbimint shouldn’t work to discourage cigarette smoking and then point to gubbimint info to buttress your argument to keep an adult from making up thier own mind as to whether or not they wish to inhale somethin you don’t care for… be consistent please.
Don't Tread
March 8th, 2012
5:47 pm
“you have no reasonable way of proving those two things are connected”
No I don’t, but then again I don’t have to prove anything. The US District Attorney who prosecuted the case can easily prove it via confession and interviews of said drug addict/child molester.
Ironically, it turns out that the mother’s pot problem was the catalyst that set all that mess in motion to begin with. (No Dad in the house, as Dad took a hike when Mom refused to give up the pot.)
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
5:48 pm
AquaGirl,
I certainly was against Big Macs. Give me a WHOPPER and I’m happy. BurgerKing is my favorite.
They don’t serve marijuana so you probably haven’t been there.
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
5:58 pm
Right Wing Troll.
I learned a lot from gubbiment. One thing was how to spell “government”. I see you didn’t have that advantage.
Yes, we live in a democratic republic with a fine constitution. So I do expect the government to follow those “instructions”.
When you learn to read you will find that a bloated government raising a mountain of debt was not suggested in the constitution. Perhaps you should call Washington and tell the Obama administration about that little fact. Also learn to spell “bankruptcy” since that is where your Dem led administration is leading us.
Aquagirl
March 8th, 2012
5:58 pm
Give me a WHOPPER and I’m happy.
Oh, the jokes, they write themselves…..
Anyway, I see you’re using the standard prohibitionist defense–completely dodging the logical question (because you have no answer) and falling back on the “pothead” attack. Oh, so predictable.
So, is Pat Robertson a dope fiend? I think some of the Drug War fans are gonna have to choke on this one. Pat is clearly crazy without the influence of drugs. I don’t think they pass a doobie around the prayer circle at the 700 Club.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
6:02 pm
Dusty,
The constitution also didn’t suggest that the government should mandate what we can do with our own bodies.
Ending the drug war, or at least focusing it on drugs that are actually harmful, would save lots and lots of money. In 2010, over $15 billion was spent on the drug war. Plus legalization would increase tax revenue.
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
6:06 pm
Rick,
I don’t need a study to prove that people are dying from drug overdose and addiction. It is on the news every day, quite often a celebrity. And marijuana is the usual introduction to other drugs.
If you don’t believe what is well known, then find your own statictics that prove otherwise.
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
6:10 pm
You don’t overdose on tobacco or marijuana.
Yes you can overdose on tobacco. Have you ever heard of nicotine poisoning?
Both if smoke either tobacco or marijuana long enough it will eventually lead to COPD.
If you want to live happy and feel good for a likely long time then live and eat healthy.
If you want to kill yourself, then smoke, drink to excess and eat anything you can stuff into your mouth, take every kind of pill, upper, downer, or in-betweener you get get your hands on but don’t come crying about it later on when the dying starts.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
6:14 pm
Dusty,
As I have pointed out, it is impossible to OD on marijuana. And as I also already pointed out, in addition to that most people who use marijuana do not move on to harder drugs, the fact that marijuana is illegal actually contributes to people moving on to other drugs. It puts the buyer into a black market deal where the seller is often going to be pushing you other, harder drugs. If marijuana were legal, that interaction would not occur.
Button Gwinnett
March 8th, 2012
6:14 pm
Nosey Effing Do-Gooders are evil .
.
They never do good……….and they see evil everywhere they look..
.
I own myself.
Butt out of what I want to ingest…and take your government thugs with you.
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
6:18 pm
Rick,
The government is supposed to protect us from harm. Drugs are harmful. YOu might look at it that way.
The cost of treating drug addicts is not cheap. Neither is drug education so children won’t be drug addicts by the time they get out of high school.
I don’t want taxes raised from habit forming drugs.
I don’t want other countries like Mexico and Afghanistan using drugged Americans for their livlihood although they are doing quite well with lawbreakers here. I don’t want legal drug lords here either.
Did I mention I don’t like DRUGS which includes marijuana.?
Rick
March 8th, 2012
6:19 pm
Michael,
Studies have shown that smoking marijuana only does not lead to COPD. Combining it with tobacco does further increase the risk compared to only smoking tobacco though.
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
6:21 pm
Rick
Don’t blame drug addiction on anybody but the drug user. Just say NO.
Aquagirl
March 8th, 2012
6:23 pm
I own myself. Butt out of what I want to ingest…and take your government thugs with you.
Or, take the Dusty approach….let the government tell you which drugs are good, while simultaneously complaining about government overreach because the government can’t be trusted.
Yes, people really do this without their heads exploding from the obvious irony. Amazing.
MarkV
March 8th, 2012
6:26 pm
Dusty,
I see you are waging a battle, in which you are vastly outnumbered, and you do not have good arguments on your side. I cannot offer support, because I do not know what exactly the solution should be. I think those people, who point out to the failure of the current war on drugs, are absolutely right. On the other hand, I think any “legalization” would have to be done very carefully and with safeguards against the problems that concern you. The proponents seem to think it to be a much too simple.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
6:26 pm
Dusty,
The cost of running a drug war and imprisoning people is not cheap. It means police wasting their time when they could be more effectively be stopping violent crime, clogs up the courts with petty drug possession cases, and increases our incarceration rate further. The USA has one of the highest incarceration rates in the world. Your argument fails to realize that the drug war hasn’t been effective. We are not saving money by fighting this war, only wasting it. It far outweighs the cost for treatment of serious drug abuse.
Parts to your argument are actually things that are already going on. We do spend money on drug education, how would legalizing drugs change that? And if drugs are legalized, that takes away the profit from the Mexican drug cartels and puts it in the hand of legitimate businesses. Look at what happened when alcohol became illegal. Al Capone and the mob made their money off of bootlegging, and the same thing is happening now with the drug cartels.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
6:29 pm
“Don’t blame drug addiction on anybody but the drug user. Just say NO.”
We all make our own choices, no doubt about that. It doesn’t change the fact that I pointed out though. The gateway drug theory is a load of crap and is actually contributed to because of prohibition.
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
6:29 pm
AquaGirl
Is Robertson a drug fiend? I don’t know. I have never listened to him.
Who is joking about BurgerKing? Not me. I really enjoy their tasty hamburgers and their polite staff. Sounds like you are afraid to be seen eating good hamburgers. Figures…
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
6:33 pm
Rick..duh!
People are dying every day from drug addiction and you say prohibition caused it. Yeah sure…
You won’t present any statistics but I suppose you are too “laid back”. Just don’t move to the harder stuff like so many do. You, too, might become a statistic.
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
6:37 pm
Rick
Studies have shown that smoking marijuana only does not lead to COPD/em>
Wrong!
A televised documentary you obviously missed did prove exactly that my friend and it only took about five years to develop COPD from smoking marijuana by the island Rastafarian in that study.
Furthermore Rick,
In the November issue of Chest Physician, the association of regular marijuana smoking with chronic respiratory symptoms was examined in three published studies of young and middle aged adults residing in Los Angeles, California, Wellington, New Zealand and Tuscon, Arizona. “All three studies showed a correlation between the smoking of marijuana and chronic bronchitis, independent of the effects of cigarette smoking.”
http://copd.about.com/b/2008/12/08/does-regular-marijuana-smoking-lead-to-copd.htm
Best update your research of the facts, Rick
tiberius your lightning rod of hate!
March 8th, 2012
6:37 pm
Dusty, the government is supposed to protect us from OTHERS who might harm us. NOT from all harm.
My only issue with legalizing pot is stiffer penalties for DUI accidents.
MarkV
March 8th, 2012
6:38 pm
At least this discussion is a respite from the usual Obama bashing.
Aquagirl
March 8th, 2012
6:42 pm
Sounds like you are afraid to be seen eating good hamburgers. Figures…
I know you’ve abandoned all logic when you mention “good hamburgers” in conjunction with Burger King. I’ve heard you say crazy things before, but that..for the love of God, get hold of yourself!
Pat Robertson Is One Of You (A Conservative)
March 8th, 2012
6:45 pm
@Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
3:13 pm
“Religious broadcaster Pat Robertson says marijuana should be legalized and treated like alcohol because the government’s war on drugs has failed.”
And the left rejoiced. Amen.
**************************************************************************
Pat Robertson Is One Of You (A Conservative).
How you like them apples?
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
6:47 pm
MarkV
I believe I have some good arguments on my side. You don’t see many here against drugs because the people who don’t use them are not here wanting to make them legal. They don’t care until it hits home. Do you not believe that the use of marijuana often leads to hard drugs? I do.
Perhaps some changes in the laws would be effective. Putting young people in jail for trying a small amount seems a bit drastic. But I do believe that is when it often starts. So some punishment or education or something should be done at that time.
As you said,”any legalization would have to be done carefully”. Very carefully indeed.
aloysius
March 8th, 2012
6:48 pm
It’s smoke. People who smoke too much get lung issues. Legalize it, tax it, and for God’s sakes stop with all the hand wringing and teeth gnashing about it. It is NOT physically addictive, never has been, never will be. If people smoked it instead of drinking , there would be a decrease in violence; an increase in the snack food business and an increase in our tax revenues. The people railing against it generally, like most topics, know nothing about it other than some drivel they read in Reader’s Digest.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
6:50 pm
Dusty,
I didn’t blame prohibition for causing people to die from addiction. I said prohibition contributes to it. And I have provided statistics throughout this dialog, I haven’t seen a single link from you.
And this conversation is not about my own personal habits so please refrain from making assumptions. You seem to have an affinity for Whoppers but I haven’t warned you about becoming obese, have I?
Rick
March 8th, 2012
6:52 pm
Michael,
Please look at this study. It has some different findings apparently http://www.cmaj.ca/content/180/8/814.abstract
tiberius your lightning rod of hate!
March 8th, 2012
6:53 pm
The reason Obama bashing is always in season is because (like MarkV) he so rarely right on the issues.
MarkV
March 8th, 2012
6:54 pm
Dusty,
What I meant by you not having good arguments was mainly the conflict between the incredible losses of money and lives that the current law result in, and the seemingly much lower danger of consequences of marijuana legalization.
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
6:56 pm
tax it?
Not one chance in hell – unless 50% of all taxes collected on the sale of marijuana is taken out of direct political control and deposited in privately incorporated fund to pay for drug abuse treatments and any other health related issues due to smoking marijuana. It is time government stops profiting of creating addicts as it has with other drugs like tobacco and alcohol.
Dusty
March 8th, 2012
6:58 pm
Aquagirl,
RELAX!
Opps! That is not a good word to use in this discussion.
I’ll be glad to give you my favorite location for my ever-favorite BurgerKing. They are generous on the lettuce, tomatoes that adorn that juicy delicious beef, not to mention a nice onion slice & pickle.
Ohhhhh….see ya later. Gotta go order me a …oh nevermind. you just don’t understand perfection! Whatta shame… .
tiberius your lightning rod of hate!
March 8th, 2012
7:02 pm
One of the best investments our county ever made was to institute a drug court. Keeps people out of jail and gets them off the drugs. Always a problem finding enough money to keep it going.
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
7:04 pm
Rick
Not going to bother Rick. I seen all the evidence – in two cited cases – I need and as a former smoker of tobacco and recovering nicotine addict you are really wasting my time.
If you want to smoke marijuana until your lung harden and fail to function properly, fine, it doesn’t bother me in the least: So long as you don’t force anyone else to smoke it or smoke it around others who object to it.
You are only fooling yourself with this silly notion that smoking marijuana unlike tobacco never causes COPD. It is only a matter of how much it will take and how long it will take it is not of if will it occur: It will.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
7:08 pm
Michael,
So you’ll just completely disagreed a perfectly legitimate study? Ok then…
As far as the gov’t profiting of addicts, I guess they should stop taxing food too huh? Obesity is one of the biggest problems in our country, far bigger than that of drug use, and our gov’t is continually profiting off of creating addicts by your definition.
tiberius your lightning rod of hate!
March 8th, 2012
7:08 pm
My understanding is that serious weight gain over time is likely due to all the munchies you end up eating. . .;)
Or so I’ve heard.
tiberius your lightning rod of hate!
March 8th, 2012
7:11 pm
Rick, I don’t think any valid study of the effects of long term use is out there, but I can see Michael’s point. Inhaling smoke of ANY kind us likely to affect your breathing. Simple logic.
tiberius your lightning rod of hate!
March 8th, 2012
7:16 pm
I will say the effects of pot would be much less given the lesser amounts of smoke inhaled overall due to lower use than cigar, but with legalization would likely come higher use.
Moon Mullins
March 8th, 2012
7:18 pm
Dang @@ — It’s like you’re on Meth today or have Tourettes! Geeez. Take a breath!
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
7:18 pm
Rick
You disagreed with three perfectly legitimate studies and that was okay. And, a documentary of people who smoked Marijuana all day long, day in and day out who all showed sign of COPD after five years but that doesn’t count because you don’t want it to mean anything?
Not to mention marijuana has many of the same chemicals in it as tobacco. Ah but that doesn’t mean anything either, right?
Nah, you need to go argue with closes stop sign you can find. From the way you talk here on this blog I get the feeling you already have a addiction problem you cannot face and you are doing your best to remain in denial by attempting to justify it with anything you can drag up as an excuse.
Rick, I don’t give a Rat Rump about what is the number one addiction. All addictions are bad! There is no good addictions, only good recoveries. By the looks of things I hope you have one real soon.
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
March 8th, 2012
7:22 pm
RUSH: No matter how you slice it, ladies and gentlemen, there are two million fewer jobs in this country since Obama took office, two million fewer jobs that you can get, two million fewer jobs to be filled. And that number is from place called PolitiFact, which is the fact checkers at the Atlanta “Urinal Constipation,” two million fewer jobs since the regime came to power.
The Urinal told the truth???????????
Why hasn’t all hell broke loose?
Why are the dogs not sleeping with the cats?
Did I die in the resulting maelstrom and I just don’t know it?
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
7:24 pm
tiberius,
Actually it is science fact. The human lung was never designed to inhale the tars from burnt substances of any kind.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
7:34 pm
Michael,
I only pointed out that there are studies that say the contrary. I posted a perfectly valid study and you disregarded it. I never said yours didn’t count, but you refused to even look at the evidence I posted.
Again, this conversation is not about my personal habits and I ask that you give me the courtesy of not making assumptions when you know nothing about me, my life, or how I spend my time. I have been nothing but respectful in these comments and it would be nice if you do the same. Thanks.
Michael
March 8th, 2012
7:37 pm
@@ said: “With me it’s about the kids. Parents should be willing to give up their cravings on behalf of the children.”
So I can’t smoke weed because other people have kids? Okay, make it illegal for parents to smoke weed. Yeah, I know you didn’t mean that, you are just using kids for cover for your prohibition talk.
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
7:41 pm
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin..
You crack me up. No pun intended.
Do what??????
March 8th, 2012
7:42 pm
“Pat Robertson Is One Of You (A Conservative).”
Reading is fundamental, cupcake.
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
7:49 pm
Rick
I’ve been very respectful and much to your misunderstanding my last comment was out of compassion not from a condescending attitude of condemnation. How you live your life is your business and choice, how I reach out when I sense someone needs encouragement is mine. I’ve seen most everything or similar things to what you’ve presented to spin marijuana in a positive light and I’ve probably pointed out a few things you haven’t seen. There is nothing you could possibly say to change my mind, I’ve made my choices. Others can make their choices and I’ll be around to warn them if I think it will help and perhaps if I live long enough help some other addict get clean from whatever substance is controlling their life and destroying their health.
You know I used to really despise that Joe Califono guy, simply because I never understood what drove the man.
Now I know.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_A._Califano,_Jr.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
7:55 pm
Michael,
Not just in making assumptions about me, but I find it disrespectful when you tell me I need to go “argue with a stop sign.” It tells me that you aren’t taking my arguments seriously. I’m not trying to spin marijuana in a positive light at all. I am only trying to point out the flaws in drug prohibition and why I believe people should have the freedom to do what they want so long as they are not harming others. I in no way want to encourage drug use.
euler
March 8th, 2012
7:59 pm
@MIchael: “There is nothing you could possibly say to change my mind.”
So you admit you are close minded. That’s a good first step. The second step is to stop being close minded.
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
8:13 pm
Rick
I took your arguments about as serious as you took mine – not very much at all but particularly when I seen your arguments before. You really should go back and read what I said and my positions on drugs and legalization while you’re telling me about making assumptions, prohibitions and freedoms.
You’ll find I fully support individual liberties even when I know the individual is solely abusing themselves or consenting others with their liberties provided no force is used or harm is done and they are accountable for their deeds.
I only encourage the proper use of drugs, warn against addictions and fight to see that government shall never again profit from creating addicts as it has with tobacco and alcohol without paying a heavy toll for having done so from the taxes it collects from other regulated recreational-drug sales.
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
8:18 pm
@euler
Wrong, it is good final step.
You should open your blind eyes, my mind fine. Meanwhile you have some reading to do,if you’re not too lazy or too CLOSE MINDED. My previous post on this blog are easy enough to find and clearly state my case.
Michael H. Smith
March 8th, 2012
8:22 pm
America is an addict nation, should change that and we can.
Goodnight to all.
Just a Flirt
March 8th, 2012
8:35 pm
So, in return for taking rights away from women, Republican will allow potheads to enjoy a toke.
Rick
March 8th, 2012
8:41 pm
Michael,
I responded to your arguments with mine, and you disregarded them and insulted my intelligence. I hope next time you can show some mutual respect.
Tom
March 8th, 2012
9:00 pm
I guess this attitude won’t extend to Jeff Sessions, who said he thought the Klan was OK until he found out some of them were pot smokers.
GodHatesTrash, Superstar
March 8th, 2012
9:34 pm
SPEAKING OF DRUGS – LITTLE BARRY, CURLY, DOO, ETC, ETC, AD NAUSEUM – THIS DRUG’S FOR YOU!
A commonly prescribed drug used to treat high blood pressure may have the unintended benefit of muting racist thoughts in those who take it.
A new Oxford University research study found that Propranolol, which works to combat high blood pressure, anxiety, migraines, and a number of heart ailments, affects the same part of the central nervous system that regulates subconscious attitudes on race.
“Implicit racial bias can occur even in people with a sincere belief in equality,” said Sylvia Terbeck, lead author of the study, which was published in the journal Psychopharmacology. “Given the key role that such implicit attitudes appear to play in discrimination against other ethnic groups, and the widespread use of Propranolol for medical purposes, our findings are also of considerable ethical interest.”
Of course, the study is sure to raise concerns both over its validity and whether we should rely on prescription medication to regulate behavior, even for positive outcomes.
As Cardiff University School of Psychology’s Dr. Chris Chambers told the Telegraph: “We don’t know whether the drug influenced racial attitudes only or whether it altered implicit brain systems more generally. And we can’t rule out the possibility that the effects were due to the drug incidentally reducing heart rate.”
I Report (-: You Whine )-: mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
March 8th, 2012
9:44 pm
I only discriminate against dumbasses like trashman, so I guess drugs won’t help me any.
@@
March 8th, 2012
10:18 pm
Whoa!
Far be it from me to tell people they can’t “torch their buds”.
Cannabis for cannibals.
schnirt
ragnar danneskjold
March 8th, 2012
10:29 pm
Dear I Report @ 7:22, the good news is that you have found irrefutable proof that the “rapture” took place last week. Now the bad news, we’re left behind.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
March 8th, 2012
10:32 pm
The CBO projected the government will run a deficit of $229 billion in February, the highest monthly figure ever. The previous high was $223 billion a year ago, in February 2011.
Mr. Obama last month released a budget that showed the government averaging $1 trillion deficits for the rest of this decade. House Republicans are working to write their own budget now, while Senate Democratic leader Sen. Harry Reid of Nevada has said he doubts his chamber will write a budget this year.
————-
Heckuva job, Obozo.
Thanks, Democrats
ragnar danneskjold
March 8th, 2012
10:33 pm
Just for the fun of bragging, or maybe it is a confession of blogging where I am insufficiently informed – our leftist friends will aver that is not a first, either – I have never smoked marijuana or made recreational use of any drug except the arguably most-dangerous, alcohol. I really am as boring as I seem.
BlahBlahBlah
March 8th, 2012
10:42 pm
The war on drugs hasn’t worked. Mandatory minimum sentences don’t work. It’s about money spent vs. the benefit derived from the spending. Time to legalize weed and quit acting like it’s any worse than beer or liquor.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
March 8th, 2012
10:56 pm
Same with me, ragnar!
Was in a barracks full of 49 other raw recruited airmen, and they took a casual poll of who did alcohol and/ or various drugs. They started in the more dangerous scale (coke, heroin) and worked their way down to pot. A few hands went up each time a drug was mentioned until finally they got to pot.
49 hands were raised, and mine was the only one that stayed down.
After some lighthearted ribbing, I reminded the rest of the barracks that they all had lied on their applications, and that none of them were eligible for a security clearance any longer.
MrLiberty
March 8th, 2012
11:00 pm
All drugs need to be legalized. You cannot legislate morality, but you certainly can generate enormous profits for the criminals and the govenrment and you can certainly cause untold unforseen consequences – violence, teen drug abuse, police corruption, etc.
Prohibition of alcohol should have taught us something, but americans clearly do not learn. Maybe its the horrible education system or the fact that so many make so much money off prohibition.
Time to try freedom once again. It has always worked before.
Acts committed under the influence that harm others must be punished. Legalization is about use and possession, it is not about unchecked behavior. Try using some common sense.
Progressive Humanist
March 9th, 2012
12:09 am
Tiberius,
So those other 49 airmen did not disclose their prior use of illegal substances and you did not disclose your sexual orientation? Didn’t that put you in the same boat? But you’re safe to reenlist now, as you should be.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
March 9th, 2012
12:22 am
Progressive Humanist, there was no “sexual orientation” to disclose.
Fully and proudly heterosexual my whole life.
Do not confuse my principled argument for equality and freedom for anyone as being of any particular persuasion. Equality and freedom knows no color, gender or sexual orientation.
Figure it out
March 9th, 2012
12:25 am
There’s no research evidence to suggest that marijuana is more dangerous than alcohol. In fact, the opposite is true. There is an abundance of evidence to support the premise that alcohol is associated with far more damaging outcomes than marijuana.
The fact that it’s illegal is a drain on society in terms of the financial and human cost.
I’ve been partaking weekly since the age of 17, and it hasn’t ruined my life. I’m a professor at a respected university, I publish scientific research, I’ve got a great family, we own two houses, and my daughter is in the gifted program in her school. Consistent low key relaxation on a Saturday night is a good thing for one’s psychological well being, and as a result, one’s career.
Progressive Humanist
March 9th, 2012
12:33 am
So you’re still in denial? Come clean; the truth will set you free.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
March 9th, 2012
12:51 am
Progressive Humanist, my wife and two children would find your ignorant assertion humorous.
If it actually was humorous.
captguitarman
March 9th, 2012
1:00 am
This was a surprise, but surprises like this are not uncommon these days. Yes, the war on drugs has largely been a failure, and the facts are that those who suffer are way at the lower levels of sales and distribution. The architects and greatest beneficiaries of the drug trade are seldom brought to justice. Those arrested and convicted are arrested, convicted, and stigmatized for life. If understand the arguments and they are not competlely unfounded. Legalization arcross the board would destroy the illegal drug business (one reason it will never happen – drug kingpins can afford lobbyists too), and take a huge and expensive burdern off of law enforcement. But the big fallacy is that marijauana is not “like’ alcohol. In most cases it ultimately leads to either a useless and dependent on others (typically parents until they die) “stoner” lifestyle, or on to harder drugs. Alcohol is typically enough for those addicted to it, and while rife with its own bad individual and societal bad consequences, does not lead to an unending search for greater and better highs. The one question I have for Robertson or anyone advocating legalization of drugs, from marijuana on up, is this — Would you be willing to live as a child ( just say for example, from 3 to 10 years old) with two drug addicted parents, with unlimited legal access to any drug they want? . . . . I thought not. Contrary to popular belief, drug use is not victimless.
Lib in Cobb
March 9th, 2012
5:25 am
There are people who have smoked grass for years and have never used anything stronger. If anyone is going to be drawn to something stronger they are going to get it easily, whether reefer is legal or not. We as a nation lived through Prohibition, it didn’t work, alcohol was still available and the criminal element made millions. The distribution network of legal pot is already in place, ie drug stores and liquor stores.
Lib in Cobb
March 9th, 2012
5:32 am
I would vote for Robertson on this one issue because it makes a great deal of sense. What would keep me from voting for him is that, he is a right wing religious nut cake on all other issues, such as why a devastating earthquake occurred in Hati.
Amanda Hugandkiss
March 9th, 2012
5:53 am
Legalization won’t happen until the people riot in the streets. The government makes too much money off of the failed drug war. Fines, court costs, bogus sheriff fees, probation fees! And now that they have privatized prisons the prisons have financial incentives to violate the inmates and keep them longer. Way too much money involved and they can’t see the taxes they could reap because rhe money they are getting blinds them.
GT
March 9th, 2012
8:00 am
Kyle are you saying that you are glad marijuana will be legal or not? I can promise you one thing it will be here one way or another just like it is now. No law or army can stop the stuff, apparently. The money we have spent for this failure is the well kept secret tragedy of this generation. The lives we, not the drug, have taken or ruined is sinful. The families we have separated as father, son and now mother and daughter go to jail for lifetime sentences to satisfy the hot air of a desperate politician whose only concern in life is to be reelected is appalling. The money we have allowed into the hands of violate people and our enemies have punished this nation. If we had legalized drugs or never illegalized them the history of this country would have been dramatically different.
When you make law that shows the world you can follow through or does not have the emotion of the majority you weaken this country. It is like fighting these foreign wars we never win decisively and in many cases we declare victory when we have not even moved the furniture around that deteriorate the fear and the respect of the country. Believe me if the majority of this country wanted to stop drugs it would happen. When you have junk television, dropout schools, and a vacuum of leadership and imagination in this country you aid and abide what you do not stand for. If you want a better America tend to your own cooking, don’t try to legislate what you can’t or won’t educate.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
March 9th, 2012
8:05 am
MF Global set to pay bonuses
————-
Where are the government regulators?
Oops, forgot, MF Global is run by Democrats.
a reader
March 9th, 2012
8:07 am
how long before i can grow it next to my tomatoes and how much can i grow? can i get plants from home depot? what’s the best fertilizer?
man behind the curtain
March 9th, 2012
8:25 am
One of mny favorite commnentaries on the subject. And relevant to the discussion.
http://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/2002/01/27
man behind the curtain
March 9th, 2012
8:27 am
Not my best traipse over the keys.
GT
March 9th, 2012
8:29 am
captguitarman some good points, but you come at the problem as if that is not what we have now. I don’t endorse drunk driving or child abandonment either, but this not wanted “big government” for one thing but is spades wanting it in another and to add injury to insult that other is so expensive and wasteful and a failure is puzzling to me.
Don Abernethy
March 9th, 2012
8:49 am
As the morals of our country continues to decline look for more and more changes to help the decline. Drugs will be legalized,homosexuality will be legalized,sexual intercourse will be on TV and in movies,nudity will be legalized. As our congress and judges get younger they will not be tied to our old traditions.We will be like the Israelites in the book of Judges:”All the people did whatever seemed right in their own eyes.”
1961_Xer
March 9th, 2012
9:00 am
captguitarman wrote: But the big fallacy is that marijauana is not “like’ alcohol. In most cases it ultimately leads to either a useless and dependent on others (typically parents until they die) “stoner” lifestyle, or on to harder drugs.
This is pure unsubstantiated opinion. If this is what you believe, you are naive AND ignorant. In this short comment section alone, we have seen university (research) professors, airmen, and Presidents of the US that used pot. How hard does reality have to slap you in the face before you get a clue?
Try it, you might like it....
March 9th, 2012
9:04 am
I’ve said for years the country would be much better off if more people occasionally did a bong hit or two. It’s relaxing and does not, contrary to popular belief, lead to more dangerous drugs. What it leads to is the ability to empathize with your fellow man, something this country sorely needs.
Here we go!
March 9th, 2012
9:05 am
First and probably only time I will agree with Pat Robertson. What he says makes sense and forcces personal responsibility. In raising my three children, I have used countless examples in the news or whereever I saw them to point out life is about choice. If you choose to do this, look what happens. That choice can be negative or positive. It forces them to make those choices (hopefully wisely) but also makes them know it is their responsibility. My children will always be my children, but not my responsibility. It is only my responsibility to raise them to be responsible adults. After that, its all up to them. I say make it legal, and tax it like crazy!
killerj
March 9th, 2012
9:26 am
Freedom of Choice Brother,s,Pay More Attention To Your Right,s And You Would See How You Are A Bunch Of Cow,s Being Led For Money.
Chip
March 9th, 2012
9:35 am
Awwww, coooool, mannnnnn… let’s legalize it, mannnnnnn…. hey, look at me…. I’m 50, I’ve been smoking weed (and inhaling, ha ha!) since I was 15, and nothing ever happened to me, mannnnnn… so really– wait a second — WHAT? Oh, gotta go… Mom says dinner’s ready….
>sarcasm off now< I work in a business in which front offices are professional and back areas are considered "rock and roll" environments. So, in my 25 years of professional life, I have worked side by side with straight-up healthy people and also stoners, some individuals of each for the entire time. The healthy, happy, well-adjusted people with full lives are the healthy people. The stoners are all wretched miserable losers who wasted everything they could have been.
So having watched both sides of this debate for a quarter of a centurey, I can assure everyone that anyone who thinks weed is harmless is a delusional fool.
roughrider
March 9th, 2012
9:36 am
Pat must have read Genesis, chapter 1 , verses 11-12 and found out what God thinks of all herbs.
Rick
March 9th, 2012
9:48 am
Chip,
Smoking weed is just another activity that one may partake in. It completely depends on the individual if it affects other areas of their life. A person could just as well use all of their time playing video games, watching tv, surfing the internet, eating, etc etc to a point where it affects their life negatively. I like to have a beer or two with dinner on most nights after work, but it doesn’t affect my life or productivity in any way. Marijuana just as well can be used responsibly, it is up to the individual.
Joe the Prophet
March 9th, 2012
9:48 am
I think this is more of a commentary on Pat Robertson and the “religious right” than it is on marijuana….WHAT IS GOING ON HERE…? You have Frank Graham AND Pat Roberson endorsing a polygamist polytheist for President…..Now Pat Robertson wants us to have multiple wives and worship multiple “Gods”………ON WEED….!!!!!
God save the United States of America from it’s own “religious leaders”…..!!!!!!!
Joe the Prophet
March 9th, 2012
9:50 am
Don Abernethy
March 9th, 2012
8:49 am
As the morals of our country continues to decline look for more and more changes to help the decline. Drugs will be legalized,homosexuality will be legalized,sexual intercourse will be on TV and in movies,nudity will be legalized. As our congress and judges get younger they will not be tied to our old traditions.We will be like the Israelites in the book of Judges:”All the people did whatever seemed right in their own eyes.”
——————————————-
You got it, dude…!!!!! Pat Robertson and Franklin Graham want us to support polygamy AND multiple Gods……THE DECLINE HAS BEGUN…..!!!!!!!
Progressive Humanist
March 9th, 2012
9:52 am
Chip,
You work in a cubicle and don’t imbibe. I am a professor and do. I’m not impressed with where your “healthy” lifestyle has gotten you. And I still run a couple miles a twice a week and lift weights twice a week. Yes, it appears imbibing has really hampered my mind and body. What is it that limited your intellect?
Morning Reads for 3+9=12 — Peach Pundit
March 9th, 2012
10:20 am
[...] stuff: Pat Robertson says the “war on drugs” is “baloney,” and that marijuana should be legalized. He’s right, and that may explain a lot of [...]
Bill
March 9th, 2012
10:24 am
It is time to treat drug abuse as the health problem that it is. It should not be a legal issue. More Americans abuse legal drugs than illegal ones.
Morning Reads for 3+9=12
March 9th, 2012
1:41 pm
[...] stuff: Pat Robertson says the “war on drugs” is “baloney,” and that marijuana should be legalized. He’s right, and that may explain a lot of other [...]
Rick
March 12th, 2012
10:30 pm
Roll another one !