Is Congress really going to take on a congressional perk?
Prediction: The following bill would have near-universal public support. From The Hill:
While vast numbers of the private-sector workforce have seen their pensions vanish over recent decades and find themselves with precarious, market-based 401(k) plans, members of Congress receive both a pension and a quality employer-match plan.
According to at least two lawmakers, it’s time for elected officials to join the real world.
“If you compare the private sector to what the folks in the federal government get, in the federal government you not only get healthcare benefits, you get a 401(k) that has a higher match than most private-sector companies,” Rep. Tim Griffin (R-Ark.) told The Hill.
“Then on top of that you get the pension,” Griffin said. “Most private-sector folks don’t get a pension.”
In an effort both to identify cost savings amid the nation’s growing debt crisis and to give federal lawmakers more credibility in addressing related financial issues, Griffin and Rep. Mike Coffman (R-Colo.) have recently introduced separate proposals for the elimination of pension benefits for members of Congress.
In mid-November, Griffin put forward legislation terminating congressional pensions for future elected officials. Two months earlier, Coffman introduced stricter legislation to eliminate lawmakers’ pensions.
I’ll believe this is more than political posturing when I see a bill actually become law — especially if said law applies to current members going forward, not just future ones. That said, I guess it’s a good sign of sorts that some pols believe there’s value in posturing this way. And a more solid reason for hope that this is part of a serious effort to fix the nation’s finances, not just score political points, comes later in the story:
Cutting member pensions and relying instead on the Thrift Savings Plan represents a savings of hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars. But, Griffin pointed out, that amount is just a drop in the bucket compared with the hundreds of billions that could be saved by eliminating pension benefits across the federal government.
“This for me is less about the money you save and it’s more about being credible when we take on the bigger issue of civil service pensions, because that is where the real money is,” Griffin explained.
More broadly, these kinds of efforts — again, if they are actually successful — represent perhaps a better option than term limits to curb political careerism. Make their retirement benefits more like those in the real world. Subject them to the same kind of insider trading laws imposed on people in the real world. Keep going in that vein, and maybe staying in Washington for decades won’t be so much more appealing than returning to the real world.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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195 comments Add your comment
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:25 pm
**Dont you realize that all comes out of the same bucket?? ESPECIALLY for small businesses and medium businesses**
That’s the myth that you have bought into – hook, line, and sinker
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:26 pm
Sailfish…..Your income my “Zoom” upwards but that doesnt mean that your profits do. You have made no clear distinction.
Jefferson
November 30th, 2011
2:28 pm
Many remarks show the lack of compassion for the majority of the workers in this country, futher showing how out of touch with reality many are. Kiss your dollars if you love them.
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:29 pm
uga
What more info do you need? The more you make, the more they take – you’re still making more money, stop moaning about paying more taxes on it.
Hillbilly D
November 30th, 2011
2:29 pm
401K’s weren’t originally devised as a pension plan for the masses. They were devised as a way for CEO’s to avoid taxes. Didn’t take them long to figure out, though, that they could use it as an instrument to do away with defined benefit pensions.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/retirement/world/401k.html
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:31 pm
sailfish…that is one of the most ignorant comments I have ever seen on this blog. I thoujght you were better than that. If you make “more” money you DO pay “more” taxes. Now are you referring to percentages?
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:34 pm
hillbilly d
One of the lessons of the great depression was that there were so many elderly left poor and impoverished. There was a movement toward pensions being a reequired benefit, that ideal worked fine. Nowadays, its every man for himself and the problem with that is there is no money left over for retirement. The last thing left standing is social security and many want to get rid of that. It’s like shooting yourself in the foot and saying that there’s no pain.
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:37 pm
**If you make “more” money you DO pay “more” taxes.**
Not necessarily, ask warren buffet, and yes I’m talking about percentages. The wealthy can afford 4 or 5 more points in taxation without barely a scratch to their bottom line.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:38 pm
Sailfish….SO you are saying that someone who makes $30k per year pays more in taxes that Warren Buffett??? HAHAHAHA. That is grand!
4 or 5 more points!?!?!?!?! Are you serious!?!?! HAHA did you ever take an economics class. BUSINESS IN AMERICA WOULD CRUMBLE nearly over night! So much for adding jobs!
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 30th, 2011
2:39 pm
sailfish, the millionaires and billionaires are already paying their “fair share” and most of yours, so quit your whining. Your greed is ugly.
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:40 pm
uga
What about the job destroyers sending jobs overseas? Great patriots, the lot of them, money is their god.
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:42 pm
lbb
My greed? Not seeing it, I do fine on my 80k, I would imagine that if I was making 800k, I’d be living even finer and would not whine about paying higher taxes – you guys are the sycophants for the rich – pathetic.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:43 pm
Sailfish….the job destoyers? You mean like Obama?
Question….why do you think companies are sending jobs overseas?
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:44 pm
Sailfish….by making $80k some people would consider you to be “rich”. What if we raised your taxes 4 or 5 points?
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:45 pm
**Question….why do you think companies are sending jobs overseas?
Let me guess? Unions
The fact is during bush millions of jobs went overseas and millions of illgal immigrants waltzed in, the gates were flung open by an administration that regulated just about nothing,
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:46 pm
**What if we raised your taxes 4 or 5 points?**
No problem, maybe we could then start paying off unfunded wars.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:48 pm
Sailfish….Actually, not it is not ALL because of unions. That is just a small percentage of the problem. They are sending jobs overseas because of cheap labor and cheap material costs. SO, if you know that companies are sending jobs overseas because of high costs here in America. Do you really think it is smart business sense to raise taxes?
Here is a better idea. Place a heavy tax on any good made outside of this country. Force the companies to bring their products and services back to America. Provide them with TAX BREAKS to give them an incentive to bring the jobs back home.
Also you do realize that since Obama has taken office over 2.5MILLION private sector jobs have disappeared. Great job Obmaa. You can try to spin it on Bush all you want but facts are facts.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:50 pm
Sailfish….”no problem”….you can send your check to the IRS at anytime. Unfunded wars…..are you referring to Libya, Iraq or Afganistan? Get ready because Iran is on the radar.
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:50 pm
**Here is a better idea. Place a heavy tax on any good made outside of this country. Force the companies to bring their products and services back to America. Provide them with TAX BREAKS to give them an incentive to bring the jobs back home.**
Excellent suggestion
Let’s not forget who to blame also – congress, they make the laws, the president executes them.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:50 pm
SailFish….you also realize that CLINTON signed NAFTA?? Talk about unregulation!
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:52 pm
uga
Actually, obama put the wars on the books, we are all responsible to pay for it and put away the china visa card.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:53 pm
sailfish…”blame congress” OK GREAT IDEA, LETS DO THAT. Being that Obama had the supermajority in the Congress for the first two years of his presidency and ran up more debt in that amount of time than any other president in history. Thanks for pointing that out.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:54 pm
Sailfish…….”Put away the China Vias Card” AMEN TO THAT! That is the EXACT message we are going to send to Obama in November of 2012.
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:54 pm
uga
Good debate, thanks…I get the feeling that we’ll never agree on much but I do respect your passion and beliefs. We are all americans just trying to get over this miserable stretch of economics.
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
2:57 pm
**ran up more debt in that amount of time than any other president in history**
Please don’t tell me you believe that myth, it is a bold faced lie, you have to be smarter than that?
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:58 pm
sailfish…agreed…I do appreciate your opinions.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
2:59 pm
Sailfish…..”myth”….would you like to see the proof? It is posted everywhere. It is true. I thought you would have known that. He cannot hid behind his numbers. I just wonder what he is going to run on in 2012.
Honestly, my wife has a client that is a secret service agent for Hillary Clinton. She says that Obama is considering not running in 2012. WOuldnt that be interesting?
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:02 pm
Sailfish….HERE is another fact for you. For the first time in history out debt has exceeded our GDP. Now, you do know what is happening in Greece right?
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
3:03 pm
uga
It is not true and I’m willing to bet Mr. wingfield would even back me up on that – how about it kyle?
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:04 pm
Kyle? Waiting on ya brother.
Sailfish….it is even easier to compare his spending versus the GDP that is the true picture as well.
sailfish
November 30th, 2011
3:05 pm
uga
We are not greece in any way, shape, or form. We can print our own currency and as bad as that would be in inflationary terms, it is still an option not available to the greeks.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:05 pm
I have a graph I want to post but I cannot attach a picture to this blog.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:07 pm
Sailfish….PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE dont tell me that you just said “we can print our own money”. Please tell me you do not believe that!
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:14 pm
Bueller?
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 30th, 2011
3:17 pm
Bushdebt: $4.9 trillion on eight years.
Obozodebt: $4.6 trillion in 2+ years.
Yeah, your known prince is doing great!
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 30th, 2011
3:18 pm
Heh heh…should read “klown prince”
ab
November 30th, 2011
3:20 pm
The secret service comment is cracking me up! You have used that one before and it made me laugh then too.
Hillbilly D
November 30th, 2011
3:21 pm
Place a heavy tax on any good made outside of this country. Force the companies to bring their products and services back to America
That part I agree with. The Founding Fathers must have thought tariffs were important, since they explicitly mentioned them in the Constitution. They weren’t exactly “Globalist Free Traders”.
I’d disagree on the tax breaks part, though. I don’t believe in tax breaks for anything. It automatically gives somebody who gets the break a leg up on somebody who doesn’t. We all know whoever had the most effective lobbyists would win the “tax break lottery”.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:23 pm
ab…nope sorry. Just because you do not like it does not mean it is not a fact.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:24 pm
Hillbilly….we will just have to agree to disagree then.
ab
November 30th, 2011
3:24 pm
Who says I didn’t like it? Don’t be so defensive! It was hilarious.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:26 pm
ab…oh ok, it was not meant to be a joke…
Hillbilly D
November 30th, 2011
3:29 pm
we will just have to agree to disagree then.
Fair enough. If we agreed on everything, there wouldn’t be any need for both of us.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:30 pm
Hillbilly…..nice point. WOW this blog is really civil today.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 30th, 2011
3:33 pm
“Place a heavy tax on any good made outside of this country.”
——-
That would likely be a violation of our WTO treaties. Are we to act unilaterally like cowboys now? Seems like that was a bad thing when the subject was defending the homeland.
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:35 pm
Lil Barry…I think you and I actually agree on most things. That is not being a unilaterist. It is being fair. Do you really think China is not doing the EXACT same thing?
Also we should make our exports and imports a 1 to 1 ratio.
Hillbilly D
November 30th, 2011
3:37 pm
WOW this blog is really civil today
Be nice if was that way everyday. (And there are offenders on both sides, so not pointing fingers.)
UGA1999
November 30th, 2011
3:41 pm
Hillbilly….agreed.
Dusty
November 30th, 2011
3:49 pm
This sounds like good news to me. Congress or a few congressmen are actually taking steps to prove that they mean business about cutting expenses in government.
I think we should encourage them greatly. That way they will know if they don’t follow up on this we Americans will be very unhappy.
They know we want to lower the debt. They know they better set an example. They also know that it will take cuts almost everywhere to even make a start. We should be prepared too.
Maybe we could even convince the president to stop throwing money into the air (stimulus) and act like he knows we have a debt. Now that’s a worthy goal also..
Bart Abel
November 30th, 2011
3:49 pm
Great interview with Elizabeth Warren about the history of pensions and the 401(k): http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/retirement/interviews/warren.html
(Thanks to Hillbilly D above)
As I said before, to the extent that government compensation is better than private “real world” compensation, an assertion that’s in dispute, then we should encourage private industry to raise their standards.