2012 Tuesday: The response, not the allegations, got the worst of Cain
Welcome to the big time, Herman Cain.
One of the ugly sides of politics is that people perceived as threats tend to have mud thrown their way. And the definition of mud is a thinly — and anonymously — sourced story that just happens to land on the evening before a fast-rising candidate is due to get some positive “earned” media (meaning news coverage they get for talking about their ideas, as Cain did yesterday in Washington).
It’s clear that someone, somewhere, considers Cain’s spike in the opinion polls something more than a temporary blip.
I will issue a caveat here that there could well be more details and facts to come out about the sexual harassment allegations leveled against Cain while he was head of the National Restaurant Association in the late 1990s. Without such details and facts, I’m not very troubled by these allegations alone: They’re just allegations that, from what we know so far, seem not to have had much merit. But if they do come out, and they are bad for Cain, he will have a serious problem on his hands.
Absent such revelations, the biggest problem for Cain is one of his own creation — and undoubtedly the precise problem hoped for by whoever brought the allegations to the Politico reporters’ attention. I’m talking about his response.
Cain’s biggest asset as a candidate is not so much his 9-9-9 plan, because all such plans are subject to change. It’s his credibility: as an “outsider,” as a genuine man and authentic conservative, as a trustworthy and respectable human being.
If you’re Herman Cain, that credibility has taken almost 67 years to build, and you are the person best capable of throwing it all away.
Had Cain immediately acknowledged the two settlements, noted that they were small and based on unproven charges, and explained his side of the story, I and others probably wouldn’t be writing about them today. But for whatever reason — because his advisers gave him bad advice, because he thought he could put a lid on the story with a less-complete explanation, because he’s so convinced of his innocence in the cases — he didn’t do an adequate job. (This kind of thing is one reason I’ve had my doubts that, in the year 2011, the presidency could be the first elected office a candidate had ever won.)
Instead, his story has, to put it charitably, evolved over the past 36 hours. And he’s fallen back on a tactic we’ve seen on stories such as his stances on abortion and on swapping prisoners at Guantanamo Bay for captured American troops: chalking it up to not hearing the question properly or his choice of words being misinterpreted.
On its own, a story based on innuendo from second-hand sources probably wouldn’t have been enough to drag Cain down. Cain’s response may ultimately hurt him more with GOP primary voters.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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241 comments Add your comment
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
12:21 pm
I am biased, an early Cain supporter. I believe the kerfuffle will not matter to thinkers – much ado about nothing – and I forecast that Herman will still run even with Romney in next week’s polls. How can anyone care about “you are about the same height as my wife” with a non-sexual gesture?
Will
November 1st, 2011
12:31 pm
Republican newspaper writters and radio/tv entertainers are a hoot!
Let’s see, these folks DEMANDED that President Obama submit proof for their reivew in order to determine if he is an American citizen. Had to have this proof or else the lack of proof would prove he is not an American citizen.
Herman Cain says he will not ask the NRA to release any details about the allegations and pay off related to inappropriate behavior. So what do these same republican radio/tv entertainers now say? That’s good enough for them. If Herman says it did not happen, it did not happen. No proof needed here. Don’t confuse me with the facts because I know Herman is being truthful because he says he is being truthful.
He may be telling the truth but let’s take a look at the NRA investigation that he says he will not ask to be released. Let’s look at the “proof” or is “proof” only needed when it relates to the President of the United States?
It seems that “character counts” only if applied to democrats, not republicans.
This will all be a moot point when real republicans show up and vote for Mitt Romney, a businessman who can appeal to the swing voters and is the only republican who can win the White House next November.
CJ
November 1st, 2011
12:32 pm
Kyle: “On its own, a story based on innuendo from second-hand sources probably wouldn’t have been enough to drag Cain down.”
The story is not based on “innuendo”. Those “second-hand sources” provided facts.
Below is an excerpt from the original reporting from Politico, the outlet that broke this story (an outlet that liberals despise, incidentally). After several denials and after blaming the “liberal media”, Cain has finally admitted that the story is entirely accurate.
From the Politico piece–
“During Herman Cain’s tenure as the head of the National Restaurant Association in the 1990s, at least two female employees complained to colleagues and senior association officials about inappropriate behavior by Cain, ultimately leaving their jobs at the trade group, multiple sources confirm to POLITICO.
The women complained of sexually suggestive behavior by Cain that made them angry and uncomfortable, the sources said, and they signed agreements with the restaurant group that gave them financial payouts to leave the association. The agreements also included language that bars the women from talking about their departures.”
Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1011/67194.html#ixzz1cTJ7jV9L
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
12:46 pm
Kyle, I could agree with you that “they’re just allegations that, from what we know so far, seem not to have had much merit.” I am not sure why you think the allegations do not seem to have much merit, but that is a minor point.
What is not a minor point is you allegation that “ undoubtedly the precise problem hoped for by whoever brought the allegations to the Politico reporters’ attention.” Undoubtedly? What is your evidence of that?
DawgDad
November 1st, 2011
12:46 pm
“Cain’s response may ultimately hurt him more with GOP primary voters.”
I’m starting to wonder if this story wasn’t put out by the CAIN campaign, based on the response of his supporters (money pouring into his coffers).
As long as this story remains nothing more than political hit-piece innuendo Cain will profit from it. Most of his supporters and much of the GOP base has seen this kind of thing before, and it’s as sleazy as journalism can get.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
12:48 pm
Will, you don’t think your little narrative couldn’t be turned around on you? Where WAS all that Democrat curiosity about Obozo’s relationship with domestic terrorists? Was Obozo’s denial good enough fou you?
Hypocrite.
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
12:50 pm
“How can anyone care about “you are about the same height as my wife” with a non-sexual gesture?”
How can anyone ignore that the above was the only thing Cain “remembered.” How can anyone think that the above allegation was the only reason for a settlement with two women?
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
12:50 pm
Cain could have put it out there just to have it over and done with sooner rather than later.
the
November 1st, 2011
12:50 pm
The response to Cain’s responses get big ratings. Cain matters. We can’t help talking about him. He’s black, so he’s today. He’s black so he’s teflon. He’s black so he’s got legs.
I would vote for Cain but only if I’m sure he really did schtoop those interns. I want want my prez 2B a real man, not a wisp of smoke like W was.
Nobody would have believed that W came on to anyone, at anytime during the ridiculously thin paper-trail that makes up his idiotic life.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
12:52 pm
@Ragnar – You argued pretty forcefully yesterday on Bookman’s blog that Cain’s early story about having no clue about any settlement was reasonable. Here’s a quote from you yesterday morning “I find Cain’s story completely reasonable, that he recused himself from further participation in the matter.”
A few hours later he not only was aware of the settlements but was able to detail how many women, what he may have said that was offensive, approximately how much each woman was paid in salary and seemed to have a decent idea as to how much the settlements actually were. Not only that but he could not say for sure whether or not he may have signed settlement documents.
I get that you are a Cain fan but after defending him so vigorously yesterday are you truly not concerned at all to now find out that his original story, which you believed to the point of publicly defending it, was false?
Yesterdays defense was “he’s telling the truth”. Today, after finding out he wasn’t, you fall back to “much ado about nothing”????? Come on man.
ByteMe
November 1st, 2011
12:56 pm
You’d think politicians would get it: the cover-up is almost always worse than the original issue.
Oh, that’s right: Cain’s not a politician. He’s using his campaign to sell books. Not sure this is helping that goal either.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
12:57 pm
Looks like someone forgot to change their sockpuppet.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
12:58 pm
@LBB – President Obama’s relationship with Ayers was all over the news for weeks and was brought up at every possible opportunity by every talking head. Everyone in the country knows about it, knows the details and still he was elected.
I fail to see the relevance to bringing it up here other than, as usual, to continue your ability to objectively comment about the topic at hand.
I guess Kyle is now part of the “liberal media” since he is writing about Cain’s problem.
Darwin
November 1st, 2011
1:02 pm
Right wingers concerned about sexual harrassment charges? That’s like not voting for a right wing candidate because he belongs to an all white country club.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
1:04 pm
That’s right Blue, and the story generally ended with Obozo denying the relationship and the reporter doing his/her Emily Litella impersonation…”oh…OK…never mind!”
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
1:04 pm
Will, if you’re referring to me with that “Republican newspaper writers” line and relating it to the birthers, you’re barking up the wrong tree. The only times I ever wrote about the president’s birth certificate were to criticize the birthers.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
1:05 pm
MarkV: “Undoubtedly” means I have no doubt in my mind. But I could have written that more clearly.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
1:06 pm
And I said they don’t seem to have much merit based on what we know now — but that’s why I included the caveat.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
1:07 pm
Darwin: Not concerned based on the available evidence. As I wrote in the OP, that could change if more facts come out.
AT
November 1st, 2011
1:08 pm
I’m a bit biased too, but it doesn’t worry me that Herman Cain doesn’t play perfectly with “Gotcha” media tactics. The abortion comment incident illustrates it better. He’ s been strictly pro-life forever, but the media jumps on one comment, makes a story out of nothing and runs with it.
A severance package for a dissatisfied employee is nothing out of the ordinary. You have to ask better questions: if it was also sexual harassment, why settle for something so small, why are there no sources named, what exactly did HC do? CEOs have much deeper pockets. There should be some smoke to a fire such as this. The “Gotcha” media tactic doesn’t care however, and the truth isn’t the point anyway.
There’s something pleasing to his behavior towards the media games. It seems he isn’t so focused on stupid games. But again, probably just my bias…
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
1:13 pm
OK so here’s Cain on the radio a couple of hours ago explaining why on Monday morning he had no clue at all about anything and on Monday evening he had details.
“As I thought about it and thought about it, I did recall an agreement with the lady who left who made the false accusations. When I was initially hit with this and trying to stay focused on my day, I didn’t recall that. So yes, there was an agreement that I later added to my explanation.”
When asked about him and his campaign knowing about the story for more than a week he said he made a “conscious decision not to respond until it came out.”
According to Cain, he knew about the story for more than a week, chose not only to not respond but chose to not even think about the issue until he was being questioned about it a full 12 hours after the story was published. Only after being questioned did he remember the details, even though he knew for more than a week it was going to be published.
Ok Cain supporters, serious question, does this pass the reality test for you?
ByteMe
November 1st, 2011
1:15 pm
Ok Cain supporters, serious question, does this pass the reality test for you?
Doesn’t matter. Your favorite team can suck, but it’s still your team. Think “Cubs fans”. It’s not about who is the best candidate for President… it’s about identifying with a team/tribe.
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
1:16 pm
“I’m a bit biased too, but it doesn’t worry me that Herman Cain doesn’t play perfectly with “Gotcha” media tactics. The abortion comment incident illustrates it better. He’ s been strictly pro-life forever, but the media jumps on one comment, makes a story out of nothing and runs with it.”
That is a complete distortion of the facts. One comment? Cain repeatedly stated that the government should not intervene in the abortion decision, and that the decision should be left to the person involved and her family, before he switched to the final position against legal abortion.
DawgDad
November 1st, 2011
1:16 pm
“You’d think politicians would get it: the cover-up is almost always worse than the original issue.”
I’ve read the Politico pieces and some other sources and heard the Cain soundbites. Nowhere have I seen ANY sign of a “cover-up” nor have I heard ANY backtracking by Cain. I have heard some [minimal] clarification and update on what he knows/remembers/has been informed of from Cain in the sound bites.
I sense a lot of political commentators and journalists are hearing what they want to hear, not what is being said. The published innuendo plays to people’s ignorance of how business operates when employees levy these types of charges, especially in termination proceedings. Having myslef been falsely accused by employees being terminated for cause does frame my view that it is wholly irresponsible journalism to throw out this innuendo without substantiating the underlying claims. Allegations prove NOTHING. Have all of you married men stopped beating your wives yet?
TaxIssuesAlso?
November 1st, 2011
1:17 pm
Next will be business tax liens discovered on the public record for Cain as corporate officer of Little Caesars. They are out there. For sales tax and employee withholding tax. Do a little more digging Kyle.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
1:19 pm
@LBB – Not true that Obama denied the relationship. Obama said he knew him two times in this one quote. Here is what he said in an interview on ABC:
“This is a guy who lives in my neighborhood, who’s a professor of English in Chicago who I know and who I have not received some official endorsement from. He’s not somebody who I exchange ideas from on a regular basis. And the notion that somehow as a consequence of me knowing somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when I was eight years old, somehow reflects on me and my values doesn’t make much sense, George.”
ByteMe
November 1st, 2011
1:19 pm
DawgDad, you’re really not hearing everything that he’s been saying. This is the timeline as of this morning for his responses:
1. Politico allegations are false. Story is crap.
2. Yes, there were allegations. But they were false.
3. Yes there were allegations that were false and I don’t know what money was paid.
4. I don’t know whether money was paid. And it would be wrong for me to find out whether money was paid because it’s confidential.
5. There was a in-depth investigation. And I was cleared. But I don’t know anything about it.
6. Here’s the gesture that led to my getting accused of harassment.
7. Okay, I remember some discussion of a settlement number.
And I think the latest is that he thinks the person was paid 3-6 months salary to drop the allegations.
If he would just get honest already and talk about it and not change his story with every interview, this would go away so much faster and we could get back to our regularly scheduled discussion of whether he’s really just selling books or running a Presidential campaign.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
1:23 pm
@ DawgDad – “Nowhere have I seen ANY sign of a “cover-up” nor have I heard ANY backtracking by Cain. I have heard some [minimal] clarification and update on what he knows/remembers/has been informed of from Cain in the sound bites.”
You haven’t seen ANY backtracking? In the space of 8 hours he said “I am unaware of any settlement” to “I was aware an agreement was reached”.
Also this morning he admitted he knew about the story for a week. I assume I can mark you down as one that thinks it is believable that Cain knew this story was coming for a week but did not even think about it until 12 hours after it was posted and he was being questioned about it?
I remember when...
November 1st, 2011
1:24 pm
I believe Ragnar has in the past insisted he was a lawyer. A lawyer would know that a single, innocuous comment about height wouldn’t even be a blip on the radar in a sexual harrassment claim. If that’s what Cain supporters are hanging their hat on, they are as delusional as…well, Ragnar.
DawgDad
November 1st, 2011
1:26 pm
Byte: So, where in that is he changing his story? You’re assuming nothing happens between each of those statements, like him following up to expand his recollection, or him speaking with other people who may have informed him of some things he didn’t know or forgot. I was involved in terminating a female employee many years ago, for cause, and she levied [completely false] charges of sexual harrassment. I don’t even remember her name.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
1:28 pm
@DawgDad – Cain said on Laura Ingram this morning he knew the story was coming for a week and made a “conscious decision not to respond until it was published”. IN that week he didn’t try to get all the facts together so that he could respond truthfully???? Come on man!
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
1:28 pm
See, Blue, you just did it too. Where’s your incredulity? Where’s your curiosity?
Blue: “oh…OK…never mind!”
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
1:30 pm
CJ: Don’t just take my word for it. Here’s a similar take from an outlet liberals don’t despise.
(For the record, more than a few conservatives “despise” Politico, too. I’m not one of them, but the pattern seems to be: Write something critical of liberals, liberals don’t like it; write something critical of conservatives, conservatives don’t like it. Go figure.)
Seanus Romney
November 1st, 2011
1:33 pm
Ok, I’ll admit it. I released the story to Politico.
Even though he strapped my cage to the roof of the car and hosed me off after I soiled the car, he still fed me, took me to the Vet when I was sick, kept me inside during the cold Massachusetts winters. And gave me a dog biscuit every once in a while.
Please forgive me, I was only serving my master.
AT
November 1st, 2011
1:33 pm
Mark V,
Repeatedly? One interview “caused” a news cycle where he was asked the same question over and over again. Not one reporter/interviewer asked him if his position had changed from his stance over the past 30+ years. Why? Because they didn’t bother or care to find out. They ran with the sound byte and tried to make news out of it. The appearance of him being pro-choice in the face of so many years to the contrary makes my point. It only makes a difference if you are playing the “Gotcha” games.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
1:33 pm
@LBB – When the Ayers story came out in 2008 I was very interested in it and read quite a bit about it. In the end, I decided I believed what Obama said. Of course, that was more than 3 years ago so this morning I am not curious at all about it.
Where is your curiosity on Herman since you have not commented at all on the actual topic of this blog? No incredulity or curiosity at all? No comment on Cain?
carlosgvv
November 1st, 2011
1:34 pm
I don’t think this will drag Cain down. After all, Perry was charged with going to a club where the N word was displayed. That was news for a few weeks and then just went away. Short term memory loss?
The Truth
November 1st, 2011
1:37 pm
Herman Cain: “Do you want to come up to my hotel room for some 9,9,9?” When asked about this allegation, Herman Cain says, “That, I do not recollect, I have no recollection of this…”
Wow… Talk about a bonafied liar.
mike
November 1st, 2011
1:39 pm
There is nothing to these allegatuions. Just typical routine republican activities. There was the congress man who signed himself into a mental hospital after it was found out he was running after the senate pages. About ole player Newt, he has done so much we don’t even raise an eyebrow anymore. And the repub governor who vanished to see his girlfriend in South America. This is just what the conservatives do on a daily basis.
BullDawg Rick
November 1st, 2011
1:39 pm
No matter how you “spin” it –
Cain Can (& will) in 2011
Junior Samples
November 1st, 2011
1:43 pm
The election is in 2012.
Jefferson
November 1st, 2011
1:45 pm
Is that who you really want ?
TBone
November 1st, 2011
1:45 pm
The stigma of a sexual harassment allegation is gradual losing its lustre for feminists. At one time a sexual harassment claim had its place but I now know many men including myself who have been wrongly accused. It’s not about groping and grabbing and telling off color jokes but about “creating a hostile work environment” and other such nonsense. Once a colleague alleges the behavior; you might as well start looking for other work. There are more than a few folks out there looking for a pay day one way or the other. Go Herman!
Gman
November 1st, 2011
1:46 pm
ByteMe, your comment of… “Doesn’t matter. Your favorite team can suck, but it’s still your team. Think “Cubs fans”. It’s not about who is the best candidate for President… it’s about identifying with a team/tribe.” sums up politics in the state of Geogia to a “T”!
the
November 1st, 2011
1:50 pm
bwa
Filter
November 1st, 2011
1:51 pm
If there was a settlement then it almost certainly contained a clause in the settlement that prohibited the recipient of the settlement from making any public statement on it. It’s a sad fact that these clauses offer a form of cover to the accused, allowing them to decry the use of “anonymous sources”.
For a recent example look at the events surrounding Eddie Long. Charges levied, denials made, settlement reached containing confidentiality clause, subsequently the victims decide they cannot, in fact, stay silent so they talk, attorney’s for Long come calling looking for the money back.
I have no idea if Cain harassed these women or not. But if I recall correctly we spent months and months and untold millions to uncover every sordid detail of the Lewinsky affair. At that point the GOP decided that these things matter and need to be fully investigated and spewed into the public consciousness. If seems suspiciously disingenuous for that same group to now dismiss this matter out of hand after two days. We need to get Ken Starr back in the saddle.
the
November 1st, 2011
1:52 pm
Cain has legs. He’s the one who should be worried about sexual harrasment from superiors, like say, Bachman, Palin, or you-know-who…..
Filter
November 1st, 2011
1:53 pm
My post disappeared? Why?
Filter
November 1st, 2011
1:53 pm
Actually it never appeared.
Charles
November 1st, 2011
1:56 pm
Karl Rove (the kingmaker) made it perfectly clear last week that Cain would NOT be the nominee. Went so far as to hold up a list of reason as he read them off. This story sounds like his handiwork if you ask me. Why would it be far-fectched to believe that he would send this kind of information to Politico or Huffington Post for that matter. His objective would be to get the word out regardless of the outlet used. While Politico isn’t really liberal (they endorsed Bush and McCain), people who support Cain will say that it is.
The fact is, Cain started the day acting like thre was nothing to the story. He had very few facts. By the end of the day, instead of sticking with his story, he told more than was in the story. He’s not a politican, but that’s only because he hasn’t been elected to a political office. He won’t this time either. Nor do I believe he really had a chance before this. The Repubs aren’t ready for two black men being President back to back.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
1:57 pm
@Kyle – Since no others will comment, do you find it troubling that Cain admitted knowing about this story for more than a week and then, for his excuse as to why his story changed so much from morning to evening, said he remembered specifics as the DAY went on?
Filter
November 1st, 2011
2:01 pm
What do you do when you spend time on writing a post, click submit, the page refreshes but the post is no where in sight?
I mean they aren’t the musings of Aristotle by any means but I have the right to say them.
Any way to find out what happened to them?
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
2:03 pm
Nuisance lawsuits are par for the course when you’re the guy in charge. I have no basis for condemning or defending Cain. I guess I could take the Blue Man approach and discount the story simply because my guy said so.
Uncle Jed
November 1st, 2011
2:05 pm
Lil’ Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
12:50 pm
Cain could have put it out there just to have it over and done with sooner rather than later.
+++++++++++++++++++++++
I had similar thoughts. He knew it was a certainty, or highly probable that this news would enter the media at some point. The fact that it is garnering more then deserved attention is working to his benefit. He gets several advantages from the weakness of the chrage and the easily explained resolution to the relative baseless accusation. His supporters will be energized and some will come to his side based on their own sympathetic understanding of the plight of a successful “black” man, especially those who themselves have experienced the “suspicious eye” of bigots.
He could have done a better job in the initial responses, but at the end of the day he will move past this in better shape. If his folks did not get this started so be it and in that case the person(s) or campaign behind this will realize the error of their calculations.
markie mark
November 1st, 2011
2:07 pm
@charles….The Repubs aren’t ready for two black men being President back to back.
There you go again….you (liberals in general) dont care how many times we say its the policies we disagree with, you cant seem to accept that for what it is and how far this country has come. I will vote for Cain in a heartbeat if he gets the nomination. I dont give a damn about his color….
And Jamee Dupree had an interesting take on this story on WSB this morning….he said the buzz in Washington is that a Republican is the source of the story….a Democrat woulda kept it in his back pocket for when it was more damaging…like if Cain got the nomination…..makes a lot of sense to me….
Uncle Jed
November 1st, 2011
2:08 pm
@Filter-
Several times, including just moments ago, my “clean” and thoughtful posts have not appeared here on Kyle’s blog. It is very disappointing as I don’t write from scripts and the thoughts flow best the first time written.
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
2:11 pm
Dear Blue @ 12:52, good afternoon, “I get that you are a Cain fan but after defending him so vigorously yesterday are you truly not concerned at all to now find out that his original story, which you believed to the point of publicly defending it, was false?”
You are correct, that I believe Mr. Cain is the best of the republican candidates, and I acknowledge that I would vote for any of them rather than the current occupant of the office. I simply disagree with your affirmation that the “original” story was false. On those rare occasions that I have been compelled to remember some trivial event from 15 years earlier, I find some details come to me after I think on it awhile. Usually not instantly, often not even in the same month, but memory returns. That does not make my first recollections false. FRE 612 is codified, as “valid,” in the industry. Whereas Herman remembered nothing of a trivial event on first questioning, he remembers pieces of what he knew serially. Nothing unusual there, unless you are playing a game of “gotcha.”
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
2:12 pm
@LBB – You did take the “Blue Man approach”. Unless you were at meetings between Obama and Ayers, you decided the story was true because your guy said it was.
Today’s topic is not about nuisance lawsuits, it’s about Cain’s story changing throughout the day yesterday. Any comment on that?
#occupy my desk
November 1st, 2011
2:13 pm
I think we should stick with Obama! He is doing a bang up job and he doesn’t even need Bush to add another 35% to the national debt in 3 years, increase unemployment by 15%, double gas prices or drive my healthcare up 9% YOY – but he is still big enough to give Bush all the credit!
My lefty friends defend Obama like he is their own child – when we criticize him, we are racists. When they tear into Herman Cain, we don’t play that card – because we recognize that it doesn’t matter. The reason the left is going after Cain so hard is because Dems have the strangle-hold on the black and hispanic vote – that is the Dem ace-in-the-hole. They know what is best for minorities in this country and nobody else – the cadre of multi-millionaires like Obama, Clinton, Kerry, Pelosi, Reid – they know the plight! I mean, they don’t know it personally, but they have seen a few movies… I firmly believe that Cain is shedding light into the fact that the Dems in these heavily minority areas are playing their constituency for their own benefit, not that of the people. Look at these strongholds in Chicago, Detriot, Philly, Oakland – and life is getting worse. every. single. generation. They will keep the pittance coming if you keep voting Dem! You won’t starve, but your life will never improve. Schools get worse, factories close, crime worse than ever – but that must be change we can believe in.
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
2:18 pm
Dear Blue @ various times, to follow up my 2:11 note, compare the Cain failure – to remember discussion of his wife’s chin or height or whatever it was that inflamed the plaintiff at NRA – with Bill Clinton’s failure to remember the name “Juanita Broaderick.” I suspect Slick Willie truly did not remember every woman he molested, and it would not be fair to call him a liar over his initial statements about a 20 year old rape. Mr. Cain’s failure to remember idle conversation is not so remarkable.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
2:19 pm
@Ragnar – You are ignoring the facts. Cain admitted this morning that he was told about the story 10 days before it was published. Am I to believe that a man running for President, after being told about this story (trivial?) by Politico 10 days earlier, took no action to get facts together so he could be prepared when the story came out?
Is that how you would handle the situation?
Put the actual lawsuits aside, is this how President Cain would handle the tough issues? Ignore them until they explode and only then look for a solution. His handling of this speaks to his judgement more than anything.
Quagmire
November 1st, 2011
2:20 pm
Sooooooooo 9 9 9 is not Cain’s hotel room number? It doesn’t matter what Cain says or will say, or do. He will not win. I’m an Independent voter. Like always, the republicans are self-destructing as usual and the republican party will not be elected in the White House, you have the T**party members to Thank..
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
2:21 pm
Filter: They got hung up in moderation because one of the words contained a word that is disallowed. But I’ve published it now.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
2:22 pm
@@ – You are kidding yourself if you think “liberals” released this story. Is that why noted liberal Karl Rove is on that liberal media outlet Fox News demanding a yes or no answer from Cain? Come on man!
yuzeyurbrane
November 1st, 2011
2:23 pm
I basically agree with your analysis although I think the Politico story was better sourced than most at even your best newspapers. Essentially, by the end of the day, Cain admitted its accuracy.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
2:26 pm
StevenF: If you can substantiate what you’re saying about Block, contact an AJC reporter and go on the record. Otherwise, I don’t allow accusations like that against specific people.
redneckbluedog
November 1st, 2011
2:27 pm
This is NOT a campaign killer for Cain…The man is VERY personable….I’m scared to death of his policies…!!! But if the man was misinterpreted or misinterpreted a woman’s conversation, I think he deserves a chance….On the other hand, there’s Bill Clinton…..And the re-hashing of the whole Clarence Thomas “pubic hair on a Coke can” is just disgusting…!!!!! Absolutely disgusting this man could be appointed to the high court..!!!!!
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
2:27 pm
Uncle Jed: See my 2:21 to Filter. Same answer. It’s up now.
Down in Albany
November 1st, 2011
2:27 pm
I’ve not settled on which ABO (anyone but Obama) candidate I’ll support, however, Cain is a very interesting candidate. As I watched his interview with Greta on Fox last night, I commented to my 18 yo son, “…we may be witnessing the implosion of the Cain candidacy…” His campaign did not prepare him…it was painful to watch.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
2:30 pm
Blue Man @ 2:22: That was not the real @@, but an imposter. Fwiw.
redneckbluedog
November 1st, 2011
2:31 pm
It wasn’t the liberals who moved from “Whitewater” to “Monica”….It wasn’t the liberals who released “Willie Horton”, or “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth”….And let’s not forget Trump and Orly Taitz and the THOUSANDS of “let’s see the birth certificate”…….Don’t impugn liberals for leaking this story…..AT LEAST a 50/50 chance it was Rich Parry or Drudge…..
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
2:35 pm
yuze: The sourcing is one thing. But the haziness of some of the details is disturbing. Take the “five-figure settlement” bit: There’s a huge difference — especially in these kinds of cases — between $10,000 and $99,999. The former suggests the charges were nuisances; the latter suggests something serious may have happened. Either way, if these were good sources about these incidents, why couldn’t they have been more specific?
Fast and Furious Spending
November 1st, 2011
2:37 pm
So, Washington, Eisenhower, Grant and Hoover, because they can’t play the caddy Washington game of the media piling on conservatives, would make bad presidential candidates in 2011?
Come on, Kyle. Get real!!!
Somehow Obama’s ability to just ignore all allegations against him and his cabinet is just as smooth as we need for liberals.
Give Herman a break. You’re right, the allegations are more ridiculous than even you have said. This is character assassination, pure and simple without a shred of any proof at all.
He did nothing at all to merit this, and your queasyness about Cain leads me to believe that you fear the liberal media yourself, or at least the secondary, poorly run branch of it you work for.
Quagmire
November 1st, 2011
2:38 pm
Funny how the right come after President Obama when for 8 years, Bush destroyed this country. Thousands of young men and women died because of a war based on lies. Gave tax breaks(8+years) to the rich and did nothing to support the middle class. Started 2 wars that ended with NOTHING and NOTHING to show for it….that’s right, the war will be paid for by the oil!!!!!…………$1Billion a day base on 2 wars that never should have happen. Did nothing after Katrina. Dick Cheney worked for an Oil company, and you wonder why oil prices is up. De-regulations(that’s what U republicans wanted) Republicans got rid of deregulations and look at what Wall Street did. President Obama decided to finally spend money on Americans, now he’s a wasteful spender, please. Cry me a river with the crap. Oh, that’s right, Foxnews owner like to spy on people too. Dick Cheney ownes companies that’s feeding the military overseas in War areas. That’s war profiteeing, 50% of $40Billions went to private contractor(no bid contracts). Don’t hate President Obama, hate your boy Bush……………….he messed up the republican party for a long time………………………all Obama has to do is to make a commerical to remind America what it was like when Bush was in Office for 8 stupid years
GT
November 1st, 2011
2:49 pm
This is very much like the Wiener deal. What he did was not good but how he handled it later with the lies makes it worse. People particularly news people, were concerned about Wiener breaking the law ,with a lot of supposing, like if a fictionalized child might have seen his pictures. In the Cain case there is no supposing this stuff it is on record and this guy claims to have the proof. Sexual harassment is illegal like in jail time. Big bucks being paid does not cover a crime up.or make it nonpunishable by the law. I am sure these things have pass the stature of limitation but you have another Republican that thinks or thought he was above the law. That is the smell in the room not some hot shot on the rise that was shot down falsely. The wonder here is how these guys get this far up the food chain? Suppose someone outside of these bush league egomaniacs decided they want to run for president. If these nuts can sunder in and not be contested how about an enemy of the state with resource and organization and a evil purpose. Nutball are fun to talk about, particular in the rural south where Deliverance is a reality. But when you get too many nuts one may not be harmless, and that one could end all of us.
the red herring
November 1st, 2011
2:49 pm
it is ridiculous for the mainstream media to cause a stir over this while they let ted kennedy get away with murder and bill clinton get away with 10 times worse than what was alleged on herman cain. there is no comparison and i believe this will benefit herman cain in the long run as more people pitch in to support him due to what they perceive is unfair politics. all GOP candidates can get ready for that type election however as the democrats can not run on their records and their only hope is attack their opponents. it is frightening to see how the majority of the media, the unions, teachers, and college professors are left wing and use their positions to further their and a socialist type agenda. my only hope is that independents and the GOP can field enough quality candidates to take control of both houses of congress and the presidency. that is the only way we can undo some of the damage done in the last 6 years (3 of bush+democrats and 3 of obama+democrats). barney frank, charlie rangel, geitner and any other crooks should be run out of washington on a rail…..
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
2:51 pm
Dear Blueman @ 2:10, “You are ignoring the facts. Cain admitted this morning that he was told about the story 10 days before it was published. Am I to believe that a man running for President, after being told about this story (trivial?) by Politico 10 days earlier, took no action to get facts together so he could be prepared when the story came out?”
With all due respect, you have a assumptions here – that Cain “took no action to get facts together.” I don’t know about your attorneys, but I probably do not have detailed files over legal matters resolved 15 years ago. I suspect “remembrance” is all that was readily available. Even banks, with all of their detailed materials and systems, rarely keep account details beyond six years. I respectfully believe that I am the one focused on the facts – the actual nature of the alleged misdeed. Nobody seems to want to talk about how trivial the alleged conversation must have been.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
2:51 pm
Let’s imagine that as part of the settlement, the two victims were not allowed to ever the discuss the specific details and if they did, repay the settlement. Think Eddie Long.
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
2:56 pm
Dear Joke @ 2:51, I disagree. “Let’s imagine that as part of the settlement, the two victims were not allowed to ever the discuss the specific details and if they did, repay the settlement. ” I don’t think the left’s attack machine would have much trouble coming up with $10,000, to cover the potential breach of contract. I suspect the “victim” does not wish to look like a greedy, grasping fool.
Toe Maine
November 1st, 2011
2:59 pm
What is much worse about Cain is that he is so ignorant that he thinks he can repeal Roe v. Wade by signing a bill that crosses his desk.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
3:01 pm
Fast and Furious: Campaigns are a different animal today than they were in 1952, when Ike first ran. I’m not at all sure he could win in today’s environment, having never won an election before.
JF McNamara
November 1st, 2011
3:01 pm
First he lied and said it never happened, then he lied and said he wasn’t a part of the settlements and it was part of the business, then he remembered the “wife” quote, and now he’s spinning it.
Candidates are what they are. Nathan Deal had shady business deals and he’s bought that to office via tax cuts and private investment vehicles. Cain did wrong, lied at the outset and is now covering up. That’s what he’ll do as President, if elected.
JDW
November 1st, 2011
3:02 pm
OK it is getting very cold in places down under today…
LBB is correct when he says…”Nuisance lawsuits are par for the course when you’re the guy in charge.” Having seen this time and again I have to say that a settlement is in no way an admission of wrongdoing. In fact in the vast majority of cases it is simply a way of making the “issue” go away as cheaply and quickly as possible.
Kyle, I have to agree with you as well…the real issue here is Cain’s response.
It will be interesting to watch the feeding frenzy.
GT
November 1st, 2011
3:04 pm
the red herring the media didn’t let Kennedy or Clinton get away with anything. Their little moments were out there the moment it happened, or very shortly after, this guy is the one that has had this thing quiet for 21 years. And he still can’t get his story straight. Also this looks like an attack from within your party not from without. Yall are so good at this stuff we don’t want to get in your way. This looks like Bachman from head to toe. And by qualified candidates what exactly do you mean? You are setting a high bar that a lot of those nutballs yall support might not qualify so be careful.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
3:04 pm
Why can’t it be 99,999.00 ??? Dam, there I go with 99999999999999999999…….
Oh, I heard Herman favorite number is 45, thus 4+5=9……what a joke !!
I remember when...
November 1st, 2011
3:04 pm
Red, you kow for a fact that a Democratic source leaked this information?
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
3:04 pm
@Ragnar – Cain didn’t say his lawyers gave him the facts. He said, “”As I thought about it and thought about it, I did recall an agreement with the lady who left who made the false accusations. When I was initially hit with this and trying to stay focused on my day, I didn’t recall that. So yes, there was an agreement that I later added to my explanation.”
If you believe his own words, he is saying he did not think about the accusations in the story until sometime Monday after the initial questions. In this same interview he said he was told about the story 10 days before it was published. Had he first learned about the story on Monday morning, your “remembrance” argument would be plausible. As that is not what happened, you are ignoring the facts at hand.
The topic is on the Cain campaign response by the way, not the allegations.
John
November 1st, 2011
3:05 pm
“It’s his credibility: as an “outsider,” as a genuine man and authentic conservative, as a trustworthy and respectable human being.”
Really Kyle…authentic conservative? How many times is Cain going to change his story and say he’s really trying to clarify his position. Not just on this issue. Didn’t he do the same on abortion…saying a woman should be allowed to choose and the government should stay out of it (being a smaller government conservative) until conservatives went after him and he changed his position from a smaller government conservative to a big (let’s get involved in everyone’s personal life) government social conservative by saying the government should stop all abortions including cases of rape, incest and when the woman’s life is in jeopardy. There are other issues as well…how many free passes do you think he should have.
Why don’t conservatives go after Herman Cain with the same passion and in the same manner as they did with Anthony Weiner?
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
3:08 pm
Dear Blue @ 3:04, agree, Herman probably did not get anything from his attorneys, doubt there was any documentation available to help. Thus my second paragraph @ 2:11. While we agree that the issue is the “campaign’s response” rather than the actual allegation, the latter should inform one’s judgment on the former. An error on a big issue is a big deal; an error on a trivial issue is irrelevant. This is a trivial issue.
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
3:10 pm
Dear John @ 3:05, “Why don’t conservatives go after Herman Cain with the same passion and in the same manner as they did with Anthony Weiner?” I don’t think conservatives really cared about the Weiner fiasco. We were all laughing about it, but I don’t remember any conservative ever demanding an investigation, or calling for his resignation. That was strictly an intra-party issue for the national socialists.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
3:11 pm
“Why don’t conservatives go after Herman Cain with the same passion and in the same manner as they did with Anthony Weiner?”
Um, maybe because there’s not a trail of photos, texts and women willing to talk on the record, the way there was with Weiner?
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
3:16 pm
@Ragnar – With all due respect, the coverage alone on this issue proves it’s not trivial. Mr. Cain is not a politician with a long record we can use to determine his character. His actions are all we have.
This is not one woman who accused him. By his own statement there were two separate instances of accusations by two different women.
I am not naive as to frivolous charges, but two? I need to hear from the candidate and so far all I have heard is conflicting information and spin blaming the “liberal media” and the accusers.
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
3:19 pm
Dear Blue @ 3:16, you must not hve any experience with workplace litigation. It is a contagion; if one disgruntled person extorts a settlement, others will try. Trivial settlements tell me about the quality of the allegations; the ferocity of the lame-stream media hyperbole is not a good barometer.
John
November 1st, 2011
3:20 pm
“We were all laughing about it, but I don’t remember any conservative ever demanding an investigation, or calling for his resignation. ”
What? Get out from under your rock…every GOP politician called for his resignation along with the drugster Rush, everyone on Fox and Rance Priebus calling him a creep. Of course, Rance and others would become very silent during the same interviews when questioned if the same should be said about David Vitter.
John
November 1st, 2011
3:21 pm
“Um, maybe because there’s not a trail of photos, texts and women willing to talk on the record, the way there was with Weiner?”
Can the same be said about David Vitter?
John
November 1st, 2011
3:22 pm
Sending nude photos is not illegal…David Vitter was involved in prostitution which is illegal.
Blue Man on a Red Island
November 1st, 2011
3:22 pm
@Ragnar – “Lame stream media”? My apologies, I thought I was debating with someone informed on issues. I didn’t realize I was talking to Sarah Palin.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
3:23 pm
Did anyone see the speech Perry gave this past weekend in Vermont?? I think it was Vermont because they gave him a bootle of golden maple syrup. It seems like the guy was on crack.
I forgot, it didn’t happen because I saw it on the socialist network, msnbc.
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
3:29 pm
Dear Blue, while I appreciate being compared to Magna Sarah, I think the “lame-stream” appellation is appropriately attributed to Bernie Goldberg.
Dear John @ 3::20, I think almost nobody monitors the hard core right wing media so closely as I. Rush had a great time with the Weiner jokes (transcript May 31, 2011 at rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2011/05/31/weinergate_too_small_to_matter) but did not exactly offer a clarion call for investigation. Bill O”Reilly did not even cover the story until after Weiner resigned,probably because Weiner was a regular on the show. Did Kyle call for investigation of Weiner?
Aquagirl
November 1st, 2011
3:32 pm
I need to hear from the candidate and so far all I have heard is conflicting information and spin blaming the “liberal media” and the accusers.
Somebody needs to inform Cain the “lamestream” media and 15 year old allegations are comparatively mild. Does he really think guys like Vladmir Putin play nice in private?
Also, this isn’t Cain’s radio show. We’re not his devoted listeners, ducking questions and lapsing into hysterics is not acceptable. And he doesn’t get to pick the topic.
Yeah Right
November 1st, 2011
3:35 pm
This is much ado about nothing.
It doesn’t matter Cain is black. Dems are viscious in their attack on him, but if he were a Rep the Dems would be all about supporting Herman Cain. Double standard party=Democrats…everyone knows this.
The Dem party is the party of ignorance. Poll the Dem voters and ask them for a clear answer on on any issue and you will get complete gobblygook. They are just too ignorant to answer a question directly, or just don’t know enough to answer at all. If you ask them where Topeka, KS is, they won’t know….so how can you expect them to understand the rhetoric and misinformation they are spoon fed and willingly eat and totally beleive by the party of ignorants? It boggles the mind the emptiness in their brains! Oh, but they THINK they know something…and have complete righteous indignation when proven they don’t….or they will change the subject…they like to change the subject….gets them out of a jam alot. “You said what about the deficit? Well, what about those lies the Republicans told?” Ahem, what lies would those be? “You know, the lies; everyone knows about the lies!”
Yeah right.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
3:35 pm
Clearly there is a “Get Herman Cain” attitude among the liberal elite, as well as at the national GOP level. He’s not playing their game, and they can’t stand it.
Now, here’s the reality of the situation (and some of what likely happened).
First, his campaign advisers didn’t do him any favors by having this story for 10 days and not having a crisp response to it. He needs a crisis manager to be brought on board for the NEXT attacks to come with responsibility just below his campaign manager.
Next, I believe that his answers “evolved” as much as they did due to his ability to recollect more things as the day wore on. It is similar to having been asked about one thing or another from your childhood and the more people end up talking about it, the more details you remember. I have no issue regarding this evolution.
Next, the women allegedly signed non-disclosures. These go both ways. Herman should make that very clear to the media when they ask about them being released. They are to protect both the company that issued them and the people involved and no amount of campaigning for any position should be able to violate that trust.
Finally, this was about the worst example of reporting that Politico could have ever come out with. No specifics, anonymous sources and a whole lot of speculation. That they published it at all is a testament to the above mentioned folks wanting to “Get Herman Cain” at all costs.
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
3:36 pm
Dear Aquagirl @ 3:32, good afternoon, long time no chat. Perhaps we can agree that Russian dictators are more honest and less aggressive than America’s seven sisters?
Yeah Right
November 1st, 2011
3:36 pm
I meant “if he were a Dem the Dems would be all about supporting”….doit!
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
3:36 pm
You think Cain know who is Putin or yet can pronounce his name???
Yeah Right
November 1st, 2011
3:38 pm
Yes, yes he does.
John
November 1st, 2011
3:40 pm
ragnar danneskjold @3:29, From ABC News…
“Republican National Committee Chairman Reince Priebus became the first official to call on Weiner to resign after Weiner’s mea culpa press conference on Monday.
“Congressman Weiner’s actions and deception are unacceptable and he should resign. We do not need an investigation to know he lied and acted inappropriately, we need a resignation,” Priebus said in a written statement. ”
Noticed how the Republican National Committee Chairman Reince Priebus said an investigation is not needed to know he lied and needs to resign. Well, we know Cain has lied, just as Weiner did so I assume Reince Priebus will be calling on Cain to drop out of the race.
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
3:41 pm
I thought the sharpest analysis on the topic came from Juan Williams, on Bret Baier’s show last night, cannot find a transcript, so I paraphrase. On the subject of “who leaked,” Juan agreed that while Romney and Perry had lots of money for opposition research, the “liberals are terrified of Cain.”
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
3:41 pm
He said that he might not know all the leaders of the world or how to pronounce their names. IJS
John
November 1st, 2011
3:42 pm
agnar danneskjold @3:29, From the Wall Street Journal…
“On Tuesday, Republican National Committee Chairman Reince Priebus called for Mr. Weiner to resign and challenged House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D., Calif.) and Democratic National Committee Chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz to explain whether they “believe members of Congress are held to a different set of standards.”
Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R., Va.) on Tuesday said Mr. Weiner should resign. “The last thing we need is to be immersed in discussion about Congressman Weiner and his Twitter activities,” Mr. Cantor said.”
Jack
November 1st, 2011
3:42 pm
A lot of damage is done to an employer by disgruntled female employees under the guise of sexual harrassment. Some are legitimate, but claiming harrassment against Cain at this particular time smells like dirty politics.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
3:45 pm
“Well, we know Cain has lied”
No, we don’t John. YOU believe he has lied, however, you have no proof whatsoever that he deliberately said something he KNEW wasn’t true at the time.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
3:45 pm
Its only dirty if he didn’t do it.
Jefferson
November 1st, 2011
3:46 pm
Deep down, you know he’s not your choice, you are just settleing.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
3:49 pm
For all the Cain supporters, why did Cain go to Morehouse and was this his first choice?
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
3:50 pm
Dear John @ 3:40, so you agree that no Republican called on Weiner to resign until after a humiliating public confession? Not exactly a raging torrent attributable o conservatives.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
3:51 pm
“For all the Cain supporters, why did Cain go to Morehouse and was this his first choice?”
Why does it matter to you, whatajoke?
I remember when...
November 1st, 2011
3:51 pm
The best Weiner headline I saw was on the Huffington Post: “Weiner Out”. Short, concise, tells us what he did and why he had to do it. Great writing.
John
November 1st, 2011
3:55 pm
“No, we don’t John. YOU believe he has lied, however, you have no proof whatsoever that he deliberately said something he KNEW wasn’t true at the time.”
Grasping for straws I see. He denied it completely (first lie), then said it was true that a couple employees filed complaints but there was no merit to their complaint (second lie) until his memory was jogged and he remembers a incident about commenting on a woman’s height (in detail). He also said there was no payout to his knowledge (third lie) but then changed the story to there was a payout.
Same as the Weiner incident, let’s see if Reince Priebus willl take the same position….no investigation needed, Cain just needs to drop out of the race.
GT
November 1st, 2011
3:56 pm
Conservative never admit to anything. Dead body on the floor, smoking gun in the frozen hand, blood all over the clothes and the right winger and his politics are the only reason for this little misunderstanding. Bush was the greatest at this. If he had accidentally hit the nuke bottom on Saturday night he would have blamed it on liberal mice that have a run of the White House from the Clinton days. Any for some that is all he needed to say case closed.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
3:59 pm
Tiberius, Cain would be proud of your response.
GT
November 1st, 2011
4:04 pm
We don’t back Wiener, I say the same thing I said then now. How do these nuts get past the gate? Who votes for these local yocals and don’t know they are what they are. Wiener is sick. If I got a friend of mine flashing the world in his underwear I would be shocked. This is like a closet gay thing, someone running with this guy knew he had this problem yet let the world elect him to the US Congress and maybe let this lady marry him not knowing how sick he was.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
4:04 pm
“He denied it completely (first lie),”
No, what he said at first was that he never sexually harassed anyone (which remains true unless shown otherwise), not that any complaints were filed against him.
“then said it was true that a couple employees filed complaints but there was no merit to their complaint (second lie)”
Which simply answered a following question asked of him (were complaints filed against you?)
“until his memory was jogged and he remembers a incident about commenting on a woman’s height (in detail).”
Which I commented on.
“He also said there was no payout to his knowledge (third lie) but then changed the story to there was a payout.”
Which he remembered later on.
Of course, these are the facts as presented, and not your creation of what actually didn’t happen, John, so maybe you wouldn’t recognize them.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
4:05 pm
whatajoke, you haven’t answered my question. Why is where Herman Cain attended college an issue for you?
Aquagirl
November 1st, 2011
4:09 pm
First, his campaign advisers didn’t do him any favors by having this story for 10 days and not having a crisp response to it.
When criticized about his lack of knowledge, Cain says that’s no biggie because he knows how to hire good staff. He doesn’t need to know jack about Uzbekistan (including pronunciation) he can rely on the hired help for those bothersome details.
So if you’re blaming his advisers you may want to climb down from the Cain bandwagon.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
4:12 pm
Aquagirl, there is a difference between hiring campaign advisers and policy advisers.
And I do not look for perfection from my political hopefuls; just consistency of their core beliefs and a healthy disdain for government intrusion into private businesses and lives.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
4:14 pm
Its not where he attended college but WHY he had to attend and not his college of choice.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
4:16 pm
And why is that of importance to you, whatajoke?
And do you even know why he attended Morehouse?
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
4:17 pm
Aquagirl: That’s not a bad point, although I strongly suspect a President Cain would be selecting from a different pool than candidate Cain has. Candidate Cain has never held elected office (no holdovers to hire for the campaign) and, until a month ago, had little name ID, mediocre polling numbers and not a whole lot of money to spend on staff.
Put it this way: I doubt Block would be his secretary of state or even his chief of staff.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
4:20 pm
Haven’t seen any Obozo bootlickers crediting him with the stock market results the last two days. No wonder–down more than 500.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
4:22 pm
Let me see Tiberius……I heard it from the liberal media. Wait, that was wsb radio and from Cain himself. Anything else???
John
November 1st, 2011
4:23 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @ 4:04,
I’m sorry, you’re right…Cain didn’t lie or change his story in any way, shape or form. There really wasn’t a “settlement” but there was an “agreement”. So he was accurate when he said there was not a settlement.
From the AP…’He later acknowledged he was aware of an “agreement” but not a settlement.
“It was an agreement. So it looked like I had changed my story. I didn’t change my story,” Cain told CNN’s Headline News. “The difference between settlement and agreement, it makes a difference to me.” ‘
Aquagirl
November 1st, 2011
4:24 pm
good afternoon, long time no chat. Perhaps we can agree that Russian dictators are more honest and less aggressive than America’s seven sisters?
Howdy rag, nice to see you haven’t changed.
Nah, I really can’t compare Kyle to Vladimir Putin. When the press releases yet another photo of Putin flexing his abs in some remote section of Russia, I always believe he’s enjoying a little side trip while disposing of a corpse.
marc
November 1st, 2011
4:29 pm
Cain and staff had 10 days…10 DAYS…to put together a response…..What? they thought Politico was going to shelve the story….what happened way back when is not the issue…Cain and staff can’t handle this??…..This is like death by 1000 cuts for the GOP…..what are they doing?
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
4:30 pm
“Let me see Tiberius……I heard it from the liberal media. Wait, that was wsb radio and from Cain himself. Anything else???”
Again, whatajoke, you’re not making yourself clear. First, do you know why he went to Morehouse, and why does it matter to you?
jconservative
November 1st, 2011
4:38 pm
Cain and his staff knew about the story for 10 days, yet had no clue how to respond to the story once it was published. What did they do for 10 days? Obviously nothing.
Kyle is correct on this one. The problem is not the allegations but the incompetence of the response.
Cain can’t explain his 999 plan except for thin references to apples and oranges. He can’t explain his position on pro life/pro choice. He can’t explain his position on swapping prisoners with terrorists.
I trust Republicans are not going to hand Obama the election by nominating Cain.
Cain will not carry the Independent Vote in any of the 50 states.
Story is a joke
November 1st, 2011
4:38 pm
1) Liberals are gonna hate him anyway regardless of the whether or not this is true.
2) Will anyone that supports Cain be less likely to vote him for now? Doubt it very seriously. If so, the damage will be minimal
3) All this proves is he is a genune threat to win the Office of President.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
4:40 pm
“Cain can’t explain his 999 plan except for thin references to apples and oranges.”
Actually, he can if given more than :30 seconds in a tightly controlled debate.
Aquagirl
November 1st, 2011
4:43 pm
Candidate Cain has never held elected office (no holdovers to hire for the campaign) and, until a month ago, had little name ID, mediocre polling numbers and not a whole lot of money to spend on staff.
Wait, I thought being an outsider was a plus for some folks? And that the answer to a problem is not “throw more money at it?”And if Cain didn’t accumulate enough friends with his previous political experience (including running for office and working as an adviser himself) then doesn’t that say something about the man?
Regardless of his staff’s failures, responding to accusations with a persecution complex does not speak well of him. And I realize this is pretty much Teh Menz Show here, but sexual harassment is a real problem. I doubt there is a woman in corporate America who hasn’t run across some form of shenanigans, it’s incredibly tone deaf for Cain and his staff to foam at the mouth and proclaim their victimhood.
Jefferson
November 1st, 2011
4:44 pm
I think anyone who can imagine Cain as president has very bad judgement. Romney, maybe so — Cain, no use telling everyone about yourself. Toss up for him for VP, he may do what she did to Mac.
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
4:46 pm
“It is similar to having been asked about one thing or another from your childhood and the more people end up talking about it, the more details you remember.”
Anybody who believes that a man does not remember exactly the details of being accused of sexual harassment will believe anything.
“Finally, this was about the worst example of reporting that Politico could have ever come out with.”
For all we know Politico’s journalistic handling of the situation cannot be faulted. They received a tip, they investigated it, informed the Cain camp, did not receive a reply, investigated some more, published what they learned. Naturally, there are some people who believe that disclosure is appropriate only in some cases and not others. What would have been the reason for Politico for not going public with it?
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
4:47 pm
Aquagirl, you’re grasping at straws here. This has been (thus far) a non-story story. No facts, simply allegations without a shred of detail (and therefore no proof) provided.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
4:53 pm
You can serve on the supreme court for twenty years and not utter a word; don’t think that model will work for TPOUS.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
4:54 pm
“For all we know Politico’s journalistic handling of the situation cannot be faulted.”
Really? Publish a story with anonymous sources ONLY, and you can’t find any fault with Politico, MarkV?
“They received a tip, they investigated it, informed the Cain camp, did not receive a reply, investigated some more, published what they learned.”
Or more accurately, what the DIDN’T learn, which was basically nothing.
“What would have been the reason for Politico for not going public with it?”
Because it contained no facts and no sources, MarkV.
“Anybody who believes that a man does not remember exactly the details of being accused of sexual harassment will believe anything.”
Really? Ever been accused of sexual harassment, MarkV? Do you remember every detail of everything you did running a large organization over a dozen years ago? More importantly, did you manage every little detail in a large organization over a dozen years ago?
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
4:57 pm
“No facts, simply allegations without a shred of detail (and therefore no proof) provided.”
Information provided:
Two women accused Herman Cain of sexual misconduct.
True or False? True.
There was a financial settlement with the two women.
True or False? True
Worth reporting for a candidate to the office of the President? Yes.
whatajoke
November 1st, 2011
4:59 pm
I remembered the girl I tried to kiss in the fourth grade and she told the teacher. That was 1967!!
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
4:59 pm
Tiberius @4:54 pm
Perhaps you would not remember details of being excused of sexual harassment. I would have, if I were.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:01 pm
Yeah, MarkV, those sure are “details” and “proof”.
Maybe you forgot the basics of good journalism: Who, What, When, Where, and Why.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:03 pm
If they were as baseless and as inconsequential as they seem to be, I sure wouldn’t MarkV.
John
November 1st, 2011
5:04 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @4:54,
Do you say the same with reporting by Rush, Fox, Andrew Brietbart, etc. which stories such as Shirley Sherrod, Obama’s trip to India, The Muslim cultural center near Ground Zero, Obama being a Muslim, birtherish…the list does go on.
ragnar danneskjold
November 1st, 2011
5:04 pm
I think our leftist friends are being too hard on Bill Clinton here, holding his more egregious predatory behavior to a such a harsher standard than Herman’s idle conversation.
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
5:05 pm
Tiberius @ 5:01 pm: “Yeah, MarkV, those sure are “details” and “proof”.”
Yeah, Tiberius, those ARE details. And what proof do you need in addition to Cain’s admission?
John
November 1st, 2011
5:06 pm
whatajoke,
You too…I remember the same except I was in the 3rd grade.
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
5:12 pm
Aquagirl: It might still be a plus for some folks. But it doesn’t mean, in a year when you have a former speaker and three former governors (five if you count T-Paw and Gary Johnson) running, that you’re going to pull top-drawer staff. He’s run for office once, and didn’t make it out of the primary. Being someone else’s adviser doesn’t necessarily make you a magnet for other advisers.
And I never said sexual harassment wasn’t a real problem. But so are nuisance claims of harassment. We need more facts to know which kind of problem we’re dealing with here.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:12 pm
“Do you say the same with reporting by Rush, Fox, Andrew Brietbart, etc. which stories such as Shirley Sherrod, Obama’s trip to India, The Muslim cultural center near Ground Zero, Obama being a Muslim, birtherish…the list does go on.”
I treat all with a healthy skepticism and assign them appropriate weight and credibility until facts are presented. Why do you ask?
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:15 pm
MarkV, please detail the Who, What, When Where and Why of this story as presented by Politico, including the precise figure (in the 5-figure settlement), and then we can talk about proof and details.
John
November 1st, 2011
5:17 pm
“I treat all with a healthy skepticism and assign them appropriate weight and credibility until facts are presented.”
Not a single one of the right wing stories I mentioned had any facts presented.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:21 pm
“Not a single one of the right wing stories I mentioned had any facts presented.”
Not true. You simply refuse to accept the facts you don’t want to accept. Yet since you have no idea what my views are on all of these (and they are irrelevant now, btw) I still have to ask, Why do you care?
Hillbilly D
November 1st, 2011
5:24 pm
It’s nearly a year ’til the election. By then, whether this is true or not, this will be forgotten (Cain may be too,or he may not but that’s another story). We’ve got many more of these episodes to go through between now and next November. Who knows what somebody is waiting to drag up on somebody that they see as a threat to their own success. Wake me up towards the end of September.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
5:28 pm
I don’t care about this story because I don’t care about sexual harrassment. It’s a bogus, made-up offense manufactured by the same weenies who claim to be “offended” by the sight of a crucifix or six-pointed star. Grow up.
John
November 1st, 2011
5:28 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @5:21,
“Not true. You simply refuse to accept the facts you don’t want to accept. ”
As you asked MarkV, state the facts you claim I don’t want to accept.
Shriley Sherrod…edited video first posted by Andrew Brietbart and picked up by Fox, etc. to make it look like she’s a racist.
Obama’s trip to India…not a single fact presented, story picked up from an Indian news source…the number of troops accompanying the president, the number of hotel rooms booked and the cost changed constantly from one report to the next.
The Muslim cultural center near Ground Zero…reported as the Mosque AT Ground Zero. Again made up reporting.
Birtherism…again no facts. The same as the stories of Obama being Muslim…not a single fact.
ByteMe
November 1st, 2011
5:29 pm
We need more facts to know which kind of problem we’re dealing with here.
WaPo is reporting that one of the women wants to come forward, but the confidentiality clause in the settlement is preventing her from doing it even as Cain goes around saying whatever he wants about it. Lawyers are reviewing to see if the contract has already been broken or if the NRA will release her from the confidentiality clause so that she can defend herself.
The story’s got legs….
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:29 pm
“It’s nearly a year ’til the election.”
Which lends credence to the earlier poster that believes that this is a GOP-based primary attack, rather than one designed to derail Herman in the general election.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:31 pm
And again, John, what does this have to do with Herman Cain and his fitness for office?
ByteMe
November 1st, 2011
5:32 pm
Which lends credence to the earlier poster that believes that this is a GOP-based primary attack
It’s screams “Karl Rove”, not “Mitt Romney”.
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
5:32 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @5:15 pm: “MarkV, please detail the Who, What, When Where and Why of this story as presented by Politico, including the precise figure (in the 5-figure settlement), and then we can talk about proof and details.”
Tiberius’ “theory of journalism”: If a newspaper reported something like the following: “The government has learned that an unknown organization is planning to attack a US nuclear reactor,” they would have been wrong to publish it, because while there was What, but there was no When, Where and Why.
The above comment by Tiberius is so ridiculous, it is hard even to take it seriously. When Politico learned that the settlement was in 5-figures, they should not have reported the story, because they did not know the precise figure?
mum
November 1st, 2011
5:33 pm
Anyone who watched the Greta Van Susteran interview last night saw his response when she asked him if he was a flirtatious person. The response, something about liking flowers, and the smirk said it all. He obviously didn’t realize that his response and body language was way off…he corrected both when she asked him the question again.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:34 pm
ByteMe, what does she have to defend herself against? There have been no names involved, therefore she hasn’t been “attacked” in order to need defending. There have been no details of the alleged act, which means there is no defense needed. In short, there has been a whole lot of nothing with this non-story.
Somebody’s looking for their 15 minutes of fame here, and it ain’t Herman Cain.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
November 1st, 2011
5:34 pm
“The same as the stories of Obama being Muslim…not a single fact.”
————————–
Obozo talked about “my Muslim faith” on Stephanopoulos’s show. Fact.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:38 pm
MarkV, I’m not sure if you are being deliberately dense, or if this is your nature.
You’ve been tasked with treating this story with the credo of good journalism; Who, What, When, Where, and Why. Please do so, or your comments will be treated with the little regard they deserve. If you think Politico’s reporting on this is so stellar, prove it with journalistic integrity.
ByteMe
November 1st, 2011
5:38 pm
Tiberius: they’re reporting that she’s gone to stay with family because reporters are camped on her lawn. She’s not so anonymous it seems. As for whether she’s been “attacked”… Cain’s saying her claim was false and spurious. If it’s not false, then he’s attacking her credibility. And if there are reporters already outside her house, she’s not going to be unnamed for very long.
Hillbilly D
November 1st, 2011
5:41 pm
Tiberius @ 5:29
That’s the only thing that makes sense. If it was the Obama camp, they’d save it until later.
Aquagirl
November 1st, 2011
5:42 pm
I never said sexual harassment wasn’t a real problem. But so are nuisance claims of harassment
True—but I find it interesting how many leap to Mr. Cain’s defense, even when he clearly lied, saying he didn’t know about the claims in the first place. Somehow this leads to the logical conclusion that the women are lying gold diggers , and the guy who has already lied is a martyr.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:43 pm
“Tiberius: they’re reporting that she’s gone to stay with family because reporters are camped on her lawn.”
And yet, not a single news story with her name. Sorry, that doesn’t wash, ByteMe.
clem
November 1st, 2011
5:45 pm
being charitable, he is either brain addled or incompetent(& his team)
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:45 pm
“even when he clearly lied, saying he didn’t know about the claims in the first place.”
Yet, he did not lie, Aqualgirl, as the original question was not “Have you had sexual harassment claims against you?”, but rather, “Have you ever sexually harassed anyone?”, which he answered truthfully.
clem
November 1st, 2011
5:48 pm
the man clearly lied to in his speech at the National Press Club….then changed his story for fox only an hour or so later…….did it all come back to his memory in the span of an hour or so…..
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:50 pm
“the man clearly lied to in his speech at the National Press Club”
And yet, clem, he actually didn’t. But please feel free to prove your point.
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
5:52 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @5:38 pm
Tiberius, one more time, because you appear to be dense for whatever reason:
Politico did not accuse Cain of sexually harassing anybody. They reported facts they learned and which have been confirmed: That Cain had been accused of sexual misconduct by two women, and that there had been a 5-figure financial settlement by the National Restaurant Association with these women with confidentiality agreement about the accusations.
You may want this to have been suppressed by Politico, but that is your private opinion for which you have your own reasons. But Politico did what any respectable journalists would have done.
John
November 1st, 2011
5:54 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @ 5:45,
“Yet, he did not lie”
He also said there was no settlement, that he was aware of. Then said there was a “agreement”. But since you don’t believe he lied, that must mean you buy into his “there was no settlement but there was an agreement and they are totally different” and that he was just trying to use the correct verbiage.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:55 pm
MarkV, you’re the one who has been crowing about Politico’s reporting. I’ve asked you to prove it with journalistic integrity, which you have failed to do.
“Nuff said.
clem
November 1st, 2011
5:55 pm
he said he knew nothing of the settlements(he later in another interview nitpicked on settlement vs agreement)……i saw the npc live or tape delayed…..
he then related on sustern some discussion of settlements that revealed he knew something of them
now i know you are going to nitpick here, but this man is memory challenged
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
5:56 pm
“But since you don’t believe he lied, that must mean you buy into his “there was no settlement but there was an agreement and they are totally different” and that he was just trying to use the correct verbiage.”
Correct. Unless you can prove otherwise. Unlike you, I do not buy into anything unless I have proof, not mere accusations.
clem
November 1st, 2011
5:58 pm
need i add to the list that rove went over to prove this man may be a good guy and we all agree govt needs to be better, but i don’t want him leading this country…..
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
6:05 pm
And all of a sudden, Karl Rove is supposed to be the be all and end all on who should lead this country? As if his opinion was accurate with Bush?
I Report (-: You Whine )-: Thee Magnificent!!! mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
November 1st, 2011
6:09 pm
So he’s not slick and evasive like Romney or Clinton.
Some find that to be a virtue.
Aquagirl
November 1st, 2011
6:09 pm
Tiberius, if you think Kyle is lying about Cain’s changing story, take up your mansplaining with him. You have a lamestream media representative making that claim right here, and if you don’t have the cojones to ask him why, it’s not my problem.
John
November 1st, 2011
6:10 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @5:55,
Why are you so hung up on Politico’s reporting? Even Herman Cain is not denying the story…he just keeps changing it. Politico reported about sexual harassment complaints made against Herman Cain. As you pointed out, Cain never lied because he didn’t deny a complaint or two was made but he would he say it was true either. What he did deny is the having sexually harassed anyone. Whether you want to call it lying or not, he has not been forthcoming with the truth and his story has been changing.
Before you defend him and say he didn’t lie, let’s look at Webster’s definition of the word…
: to make an untrue statement with intent to deceive
: to create a false or misleading impression
Would you agree that Cain, at the very least, created a false or misleading impression.
clem
November 1st, 2011
6:11 pm
nice of you to avoid the main point that cain either lied or was brain addled (i provided the proof)…. i merely reminded you that one on your side (i presume you are conservative) had listed 5 or so issues where cain was flopping worse than romney
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
6:16 pm
“Would you agree that Cain, at the very least, created a false or misleading impression.”
No. I would maintain that his explanation is evolving as his recollection of the matter increases.
And Aquagirl, my use of the word evolving (I believe) is more accurate than Kyle’s “changing”. The fact remains that unless you were in the room with Herman Cain, his HR people, the women allegedly involved or the legal counsel, you may believe he was lying all you want, but you have no proof that he did so.
And clem, I do not avoid anything. I just assign points for relevance, and your comment came up a it short in that regard.
clem
November 1st, 2011
6:17 pm
i can’t help that you are slow
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
6:22 pm
Nor can I help it that you’re points are irrelevant.
John
November 1st, 2011
6:24 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @6:16,
You must believe no one ever lies…all someone has to say is I haven’t lied and say their just trying to get the verbiage right and you believe them.
clem
November 1st, 2011
6:24 pm
time to recharge your rod then
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
6:26 pm
“You must believe no one ever lies”
No, John, I actually know that some people lie. However, I do not presume to know everything about every person’s activities, so I am less likely to accuse them of something I haven’t witnessed.
It is called objectivity. You should try it sometime.
Woody
November 1st, 2011
6:30 pm
Regardless of the man’s politics, with which I do not agree, he is entering onto a very different playing field than he’s been used to. Kid me not, did he really think no one would find out? He had no contingency plan whatsoever? This man deserves not to be in the international arena.
Aquagirl
November 1st, 2011
6:32 pm
And Aquagirl, my use of the word evolving (I believe) is more accurate than Kyle’s “changing”.
BWAHAHAHAHA!!!! Just when I think I’ve seen every lame dodge in history, you really came through with that gut-buster.
Again, why are you addressing me about Kyle’s inaccurate/untrue words? Afraid he’ll hurt your tender fee-fees? He’s a freakin’ journalist, paid to express concepts in writing. Effing that up doesn’t concern you more than anonymous posters?
I question him all the time, if you are too much limp noodle to do so, quit now and spare yourself further embarrassment. Let me know if you need any hand-holding.
John
November 1st, 2011
6:34 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @ 6:26,
Just turn on the news or read online news stories and you’ll witness it. Do you believe Cain has been totally consistent with his response from the beginning and stuck with that response?
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
6:34 pm
“This man deserves not to be in the international arena.”
Really? For not having a “contingency plan” for something that he obviously didn’t think was relevant (as in baseless accusations) 12 years ago? And you can disqualify him solely on that regard?
Hope to hell you didn’t vote for the current disaster-in-chief, Woody. That would shoot your entire theory out the window.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
6:38 pm
Aquagirl, unlike you, I do not attack someone for a difference in wordsmithing.
And once again, John, do you not know what the meaning of the term “evolving” means? I am not looking for machine-like consistency, I am looking for the truth. Thus far, I have nothing upon which to base an opinion on either way, therefore, I merely point out inaccuracies of the reporting and of the conclusions being presented.
MarkV
November 1st, 2011
6:44 pm
I am not at all certain that Herman Cain was guilty of anything serious in this matter. What I am certain of is that Herman Cain has a difficulty with the truth and openness. His denials are unconvincing and his changes of stories and views make it difficult to take anything he says at a face value.
Woody
November 1st, 2011
6:47 pm
Let’s just hope that if he gets elected, Cain chooses a different bunch of ‘trusted advisors’.
clem
November 1st, 2011
6:48 pm
just watched his clips at press club and sustern again…..i suggest you do the same……if you do not believe he prevaricated i must say, sir, you are guilty of that offense yourself.
he was approached by politico on this story on oct 20th, several times afterward and had plenty of time to recall or assign staff to investigate so he could get his story straight. he seems to have chosen the prevarication path
John
November 1st, 2011
6:51 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! @6:38.
Evolving is a slow process that happens over time…not within minutes or hours. Within hours (after being given 10 days notification for a response) he went from not remembering to remembering (in detail) what he supposedly said and the exact hand gestures he used. He said there was no settlement then said there was a agreement and maintains there was not a settlement…that settlement and agreement are 2 different things. There is a word to describe you believing he is not lying when he keeps changing his story and calling it “evolving”…that word is gullible.
Aquagirl
November 1st, 2011
6:56 pm
I do not attack someone for a difference in wordsmithing.
Yep, complete spinal collapse. The d00d calling these women liars won’t disagree with Kyle who is right here, right now. The swagger and the claim to be a lightning rod of hate have dissolved into backpedaling and excuses. Have a good evening, Sir Robin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4SJ0xR2_bQ
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
6:56 pm
John, someone can ask me about an event that happened to me about 10 years ago, and I might not remember even the barest outline of it. Then, when prodded with certain details about it, more details become clearer from my own mind. It’s called human memory, and it isn’t even remotely perfect.
But, I’m sure that if you are truly looking for perfection in your Presidential candidates, you have refrained from voting since you became of age, haven’t you?
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
6:57 pm
“The d00d calling these women liars won’t disagree with Kyle who is right here, right now.”
Oh, is someone calling these women liars, Aquagirl? I hadn’t noticed. Please provide any and all quotes to back up that statement of yours.
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
7:00 pm
“he was approached by politico on this story on oct 20th, several times afterward and had plenty of time to recall or assign staff to investigate so he could get his story straight. he seems to have chosen the prevarication path”
Or he merely has an incompetent staff.
clem
November 1st, 2011
7:01 pm
and cain is incompetent at selecting staff then…..
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
7:04 pm
He could be, or he merely has the best available to him, given his earlier status.
sheepdawg
November 1st, 2011
7:12 pm
did cain attend uga? wasn’t he with crowell and his peeps over the weekend?
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
7:16 pm
Cain attended Morehouse.
John
November 1st, 2011
7:20 pm
Tiberius – Your lightning rod of hate! 6:56 pm,
Politico approached him several days before they ran with it…they gave him time to respond. He choose to ignore it. He had several days to gather his thoughts and figure out how to handle it…that was several days to “evolve”. Kyle’s article was about how the campaign has handled the entire issue. What you are calling “evolving” Republicans used to refer to it as flip flopping and we are seeing it with both Republican front runners on a host of issues.
Oduma & Dumber Company
November 1st, 2011
7:38 pm
Hmm… Republicans flip flopping? After three years of Oduma’s change and what Republicans used to call FLIP FLOPPING, it all amounts to what most of us used to call, PEAS IN A POD!
Louis Nardozi
November 1st, 2011
8:09 pm
Cain has broken confidentiality, giving those women free reign to come forward. Further, they’ve almost certainly been contacted and given very sweet offers from the Democrats to hold off on coming forward until (if) Cain gets the nomination. Then, they’ll hammer him like a ton of wet cement, crushing the life out of his campaign. He has the sword of Damocles hanging over him now. We’d have to be imbeciles to nominate him.
clem
November 1st, 2011
8:12 pm
“recolate” sayeth the hermanator…..loofah-falafel man throwing softball questions…holy moly…..
I Report (-: You Whine )-: Thee Magnificent!!! mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
November 1st, 2011
8:23 pm
Clinton raped, assaulted and plundered while Cain appears to have made a harmless gesture about his wife’s height.
Notice which one the dummycrats attack?
I Report (-: You Whine )-: Thee Magnificent!!! mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
November 1st, 2011
8:26 pm
dummycrats pound their puds in the park, rape fellow protestors, run off the homeless from their free food, crap on cop cars, trash public spaces, smell horrible and babble against free and unfettered commerce, again, tell me which side you are on?
clem
November 1st, 2011
8:27 pm
did not know clinton running dumb arse
I Report (-: You Whine )-: Thee Magnificent!!! mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
November 1st, 2011
8:34 pm
obozo hung out with murderous bomb throwing terrorists, went to a church with a pastor that thinks America deserved 9/11, said that ragheads yelling allah akbar is one of the most beautiful sounds on the Earth, gave a major automobile company to the union, created the fewest jobs since Herbert Hoover while Cain appears to have made a harmless gesture about his wife’s height.
Notice which one the dummycrats attack?
@@
November 1st, 2011
8:50 pm
I watched Greta (the lawyer) question Cain last night. I got the impression he was mildly annoyed by the distraction. He doesn’t strike me as the kinda guy who would cross the line.
There’s been many a time whern I experienced unwanted advances in the workplace…an off-color remark. I looked at the guy(s) and asked…”I wonder if this would qualify as sexual harassment?”
That’s all it took. Never did I file a complaint.
To me, sexual demands in exchange for job security are the only claims with merit.
I feel bad for guys, these days. Always having to walk on egg shells.
@@
November 1st, 2011
8:58 pm
“whern”???????
IHB
tar and feathers party
November 1st, 2011
9:00 pm
Cain is now damaged goods, I can see the cartoons – “Where the white women, where the white women?” – He has no chance of being elected with this hanging over his head.
Welcome to the Occupation
November 1st, 2011
9:00 pm
This thing has Karl Rove’s fingerprints all over it.
clem
November 1st, 2011
9:22 pm
herm’s crack team has screwed up on election financial reports too….
godless heathen
November 1st, 2011
9:45 pm
Is the Hermacane guilty of sexual harassment. Depends on what the definition of “is” is?
godless heathen
November 1st, 2011
9:54 pm
First, I am not a Cain supporter. I do not think he should even be taken as a serious candidate. Unelectable being the operative word here. That said, I find it so hilarious that so many that would excuse Bill Clinton’s actions with “It’s his personal life.”, “He can compartmentalize.”, “Republicans are on a witch hunt.” can take such umbrage about allegations of Cain making the workplace uncomfortable for 2 employees. Blood in the water and the hypocrite sharks are circling.
Uncle Jed
November 1st, 2011
11:13 pm
Kyle Wingfield
November 1st, 2011
2:27 pm
Uncle Jed: See my 2:21 to Filter. Same answer. It’s up now.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Going forward…just what word was considered “offensive” to your filter? I have no problem with comments being moderated when they are patently offensive or inflammatory, but…
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
11:16 pm
“Cain has broken confidentiality, giving those women free reign to come forward.”
Really, Louis? In what way?
"I did NOT inhale"
November 1st, 2011
11:21 pm
Cain only is/was accused of “harassment”… Some one “GOT AWAY” WITH “SEX” in our WHITE HOUSE and “tons of LIES”!!!!
Tiberius - Your lightning rod of hate!
November 1st, 2011
11:22 pm
Uncle Jed, some larger words contain smaller words within them that are considered inappropriate and the filter catches the subset and holds the post.
BEST of Cain for donations to his campaign!!!
November 1st, 2011
11:32 pm
To Kyle Wingfield: Editorial subject… “The response, not the allegations, got the worst of Cain”
WRONG… WRONG!!! Cain received the LARGEST $$$$’s for his campaign the day this “scheme”
broke to the news!! TRY again, Kyle Wingfield!!! heeheeheehee
captguitarman
November 2nd, 2011
1:41 am
Once upon a time, powerful male executives could do just about anything they wanted to do with female subordinates, and these gals had no recourse but to quit and go elsewhere. Then the world changed for the better, and the pendulum swung in the other direction — but unfortunately, it swung 180 degrees. Did that finally create a much needed balance of power for the opposite sexes striving to make a living in the work place? No, it absolutely and positively did not. And today, women know that in the “He said -she said” dynamic or work place relationships, only what “she said” actually really matters. It wasn’t fair way back then, and it is isn’t fair now. Why Cain or his staff did not know this, or was not ready for this, and not prepared for the inevitable may be a mystery, but it also appears to be a fact that could totally derail him. Cain should have been readay with Johnny on the spot facts and figures the second it came up. This is what happened. These were the allegations. This was the results of the investigation. They were baseless. Because this was an embarrassment to me, my company, and the women making these false charges, this exact amount of money was paid to them to make them go away quickly and quietly. Settlements like this without any, or thin evidence happen every day because of their nuisance value. But, Cain blew it. It speaks directly to this competence and that of his staff that they were not ready with the facts and figures (exact figures) to repel this attack, if it was actually baseless. Now enought questions have arisen to put it all into play. And one of the “victims” is asking that the confidentiality agreement be set aside so she can tell “her side of the story.” Gosh, Herman, who’s version do you think will get the most press if that happens? Your and your guys blew it. It may really cost you in the end. The American public loves nothing more than it loves a sex scandal. You can claim race, etc. but that is just playing the race card. Don’t lower yourself to that. Fight this with the facts, and the facts only. And if they are not enough to save you, then so be it. Perhaps your can be a good lesson for the next guy, although I am not optimistic about that, since in this area, the same mistakes have been made by politicians over and over again. Remember this lesson, your remember if nothing else you budding male politicians. It is only what “she said” that matters . . . only what she said.
Morning Reads for Wednesday, November 2nd — Peach Pundit
November 2nd, 2011
7:02 am
[...] system off probation. – Four of America’s most broke cities are in Georgia. – Kyle Wingfield offers his two cents on Herman Cain’s bad week. – Occupy Atlanta will be back at Woodruff Park this weekend. In [...]
Ad $$
November 2nd, 2011
7:09 am
Cain needs another cool ad with that dude smoking cigarettes to get the attention off this sex stuff.
sircharles19
November 2nd, 2011
8:03 am
Here we have an ordained minister running for the highest office of these United States of America. Completely lied and lied again, then appearing on news network opening his mouth forgetting what he said before, during and after changing his story once he figure out he said the wrong things. What is right for Democrats is right for Republicians and anyone else. The facts remains are; he was involved with this case, he know it, the women know it and his 1990 documents will confirm it! Minister Cain, don’t keep putting yourself up for failure when you know you fail the public when this story first broke. You were involved from your own account based on what you have said!
LeeH1
November 2nd, 2011
9:00 am
When asked about this allegation, Herman Cain says, “That, I do not recollect, I have no recollection of this…”
Cain changed his story. He had to, someone on his staff suddenly realized that if he didn’t remember the incident, he also couldn’t remember that he was also innocent. Catch 22, dude!
MarkV
November 2nd, 2011
9:50 am
The facts remain:
Politico properly handled the tip they received;
What has been revealed so far confirms what Politico has reported.
Cain has been changing his responses and making ridiculous explanations for those changes.
mum
November 2nd, 2011
10:50 am
When asked if the “tip” came from another campaign, Politico side-stepped the question pointing to the story as being a valid one. How many of you executives would forget that you were accused of sexual harassment, however many years ago that was? Which CEO today would laugh off or treat this kind of accusation lightly? That’s beyond stupid, and you can’t blame is staff if he chose not to address it. Horribly judgement on his part.
MarkV
November 2nd, 2011
10:54 am
“There are factions that are trying to destroy me personally as well as this campaign,” Cain said Wednesday morning before the Consumer Electronics Association. ”
Cain misspoke. It should have been “There are facts that are trying to destroy me personally as well as this campaign,”
Ann Coulter
November 2nd, 2011
10:01 pm
Herman Cain and Clarence Thomas can sexually harrass me anytime they want. Just blame the commie Democrats.