Virginia keeps tax rates steady, Maryland raises them. Guess which one’s in surplus first?
Jim Geraghty at National Review Online brings us an interesting contrast between the two states that border Washington, D.C.:
Just days after Virginia Gov. Bob McDonnell announced a $544 million surplus, Maryland Gov. Martin O’Malley told county leaders Saturday that Maryland may need to increase taxes to solve a $1 billion budget gap next year.
What makes the contrast even more striking is the fact that McDonnell previously balanced an inherited $4.2 billion budget deficit that then Gov. Tim Kaine said could only be closed with a $2 billion tax increase while O’Malley has already signed the largest tax increase in Maryland history during his first term.
Both states benefit from the hiring spree and rare layoffs in the federal government, but the unemployment rate in Virginia is 6.1 percent while the unemployment rate in Maryland is 7.2 percent. (links original)
O’Malley made a direct comparison between his approach and that of the “obstructionist, economic saboteurs in Congress.” Given the results of his tax-hikes-begetting-tax-hikes approach to budget deficits — which yielded a flood of millionaires leaving the state — I don’t think he’s going to win that contest.
Btw, Politifact Georgia today rated “true” a statement that the proposed transportation sales tax, created by Georgia’s Republican-controlled Legislature and endorsed by its Republican governor, could be the largest tax hike in our state’s history.
– By Kyle Wingfield
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108 comments Add your comment
UIC
August 22nd, 2011
5:13 pm
resno2
“Their bracket is 35%. I’m sure they’d love to pay the same percentage that we are.”
WOW. I guess if there is a person in the top tax bracket, making over $379K that is paying 35%, he’d be a person that has the same understanding of the tax code that you do. Also, don’t confuse millionaires with those in the top income bracket. Millionaires are those with net worth above $1MM. That, I’d guess, is a much bigger % of the population than those in the top tax bracket
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
5:23 pm
Each state is doing what it deems its citizens want or will tolerate in order to balance their budgets in these hard times, Kyle. I do think there is much more to the story than you try to present though. It’s not all about the level of taxes in one year for two states, now is it. Otherwise, why not talk about all the states over a range of years and include tabulated data on a broad variety of matters such as education and healthcare and unemployment and per capita gdp and income distribution and poverty level and employment by industry, etc. Add a breadth and depth to your posts. Make them more interesting. Please.
Henry Grady
August 22nd, 2011
5:24 pm
Kyle-
I’m curious how you came to the conclusion that tax rates were the reason millionaires fled, when the WSJ article you cite clearly disagrees?
“No doubt the majority of that loss in millionaire filings results from the recession.”
Oh wait…I forgot, you both did the same thing by claiming a cause/effect relationship b/w the two when there is no statistically significant data showing correlation (at least put forth as of yet).
At least the WSJ is ‘honest’ enough to bury the actual cause deep in their opinion piece. You offer no such caveat when declaring the tax increases are the reason the millionaires ‘fled the state’. Hmmm…how did you and the WSJ come to such different conclusions?
I Report (-: You Whine )-: Thee Magnificent!!! mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
August 22nd, 2011
5:28 pm
Further proof that the dummycrats couldn’t spell cat even if you spotted them the C and the A.
Dave R.
August 22nd, 2011
5:30 pm
“And Dave, just what were those principles…keep our already high taxes high until the economy improves?”
JDW, the principle is that when you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.
Once the deficit is under control, as is your spending, THEN you can cut taxes.
You fix the PROBLEM (which is your debt) FIRST.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
August 22nd, 2011
5:32 pm
Jefferson: This does not prove a single thing.
————————–
Of course not. Libtards are to be judged by their good intentions, not by results.
New normal 9% unemployment and annual $1.5 trillion deficits, for example.
Dave
August 22nd, 2011
5:33 pm
No. JDW is wrong. Maryland imposes a 4.75% income tax. The counties also impose an income, or “piggy-back,” tax on all incomes of between 2 and 3.2%. The lowest amount of income tax imposed in Maryland on the typical income is therefore 6.75%, greated than the income tax imposed in Virginia.
I Report (-: You Whine )-: Thee Magnificent!!! mmm, mmmm, mmmmm! Just sayin...
August 22nd, 2011
5:34 pm
Going back to 1890, reports the National Bureau of Economic Research, the only U.S. president with a worse record than Obama in job creation in his first two-and-a-half years in office, measured in terms of percentage change, was Herbert Hoover, presiding over the emergence of the Great Depression.
Yep, Dhimmi Karter has moved up to the 3rd worst president in history.
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
5:38 pm
a number of states – such as California and Maryland – are allowing temporary tax increases to expire, thereby giving individuals and corporations reductions in their tax liability at a time when families and communities are facing large budget cuts.
I don’t think Kyle mentioned that.
By the way, Kyle, what happened to those millionaires. You got some proof that they all just packed their bags and left.
Outsider
August 22nd, 2011
5:38 pm
What if Virginia and maryland each cut their income tax rates in half — then they would see even greater revenue increases!!!! Yes, don’t you see, you always have to lower tax rates to increase revenue! Just drink the trickle down voodoo economics Kool-Aid and you’ll see!
Kyle Wingfield
August 22nd, 2011
5:41 pm
Henry @ 5:24: Sorry, meant to link to this more recent one instead: http://on.wsj.com/cHWthH
From that more recent editorial: “A Bank of America Merrill Lynch analysis of federal tax return data on people who migrated from one state to another found that Maryland lost $1 billion of its net tax base in 2008 by residents moving to other states.”
I don’t know about you, but losing $1 billion of the net tax base sounds like a flood to me. At an effective tax rate of 6.2% (see my 3:46) those people would have covered 6.2% of a $1 billion shortfall — even before any other measures were considered — if only they hadn’t been driven away.
Outsider
August 22nd, 2011
5:41 pm
I’ll bet if Georgia lowered its sales tax by one cent, instead of raised it by one cent, then we would raise WAY MORE money for transportation in Georgia!! Don’t you see, you have to lower taxes to raise revenue!!
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
5:43 pm
At least 23 states have enacted identifiable, deep cuts in pre-kindergarten and/or K-12 spending. Mississippi will fail for the fourth year in a row to meet statutory spending requirements enacted to ensure adequate funding in all school districts. (The three previous years of underfunding have cost over 2,000 school employees their jobs.)
TrishaDishaWarEagle
August 22nd, 2011
6:00 pm
FLAT TAX is the only FAIR tax. Being more successful does not mean you OWE more in any moral system I would ever embrace. Thats like rewarding failure. “Hey, you are a failure, you get to pay less”
cash rules everything around me c.r.e.a.m, get the money, dolla dolla bills yall.
Rich
August 22nd, 2011
6:21 pm
Kyle,
If you make proposed solutions partisan, you hurt this country. I wish you would stop it. There is a lot of work to be done, and creating a bad atmosphere between the major parties is NOT helping.
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
6:27 pm
So, I see Kyle has posted a correction to his claim that millionaires fled the state as a result of increased taxation. Really, Kyle. Your assumptions precede you.
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
6:48 pm
Critics of Maryland’s 2008 tax increase on income over $1 million point to the sharp decline that year in the number of filers in the state with taxable incomes exceeding $1 million as evidence that wealthy residents were fleeing the state. But an examination of actual tax return data shows that the vast majority of this decline occurred not because people moved out of the state, but because their incomes fell below the $1 million mark due to the recession and stock market crash; they remained on the tax rolls, but in a lower tax bracket.
Truth
August 22nd, 2011
7:07 pm
Great example of a real situation and not someone’s economic theory. You have to take into account human behavior which Maryland did not. Hopefully the country will continue to learn from real examples of how to raise revenue. Raising taxes is not the answer.
Mark in mid-town
August 22nd, 2011
7:14 pm
For work, I’ve been spending a lot of time up in DC area. It’s generally understood that with rare exception, equivalently situated people will pay more in total taxes in Maryland than in Virginia. That said, both of these states are heavily dependent on the federal government. But without a doubt, the business climate in Virginia is massively superior to that of Maryland. Maryland is a heavily Democratic Party controlled state that is largely in the grips of public sector unions. Virginia is much more of a right-to-work state and is doing a far better job at attracting good high tech private sector companies to locate there. What that means is that Virginia will ultimately do a lot better than Maryland if and when federal government spending is greatly curtailed. From my vantage point, it seems that young professional people in DC area (who don’t live within DC city limits) are locating to the Virginia parts of the DC metro area at a much higher rate than they are locating to the Maryland parts of the DC metro area. In a nutshell, Virginia is out-competing Maryland and I don’t see that changing any time soon. In Maryland, the view from government is that the private sector exists to largely serve the government sector. In Virginia, the view from government is that the public sector exists to serve those in the private sector.
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
7:24 pm
Tax Flight Is a Myth
Higher State Taxes Bring More Revenue, Not More Migration
I see Maryland’s tax hike is covered in this report, Kyle. How does it compare with your claims.
Suits2aTea
August 22nd, 2011
7:37 pm
If our good friend, the right honorable Kyle Wingfield, is indeed hacking and invading the computers of his merry band of commenters and then puposefully deleting and worming their hard drives, when, in real time, his “contractors” perceive that a career-destroying point is being made, well, then, may Obama have mercy on his soul.
brad
August 22nd, 2011
7:38 pm
Tell us, Trisha, what moral system have you embraced?
TrishaDishaWarEagle
August 22nd, 2011
7:42 pm
Rational self interest
“My philosophy, in essence, is the concept of woman as a heroic being, with her own happiness as the moral purpose of her life, with productive achievement as her noblest activity, and reason as her only absolute.” Ayn Rand, my mentor.
itsmeagain
August 22nd, 2011
7:47 pm
And where does Georgia, one of the most right-wing states stand on this scale? You can cherry pick your answers as much as you want, but manipulating the answer doesn’t change the facts
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
7:51 pm
May social security and medicare treat all followers of Ayn Rand as well as they treated her.
Rafe Hollister
August 22nd, 2011
7:52 pm
The 26 Percent group is out in force today defending their big government agenda. 26% that approve of Obamas handling of the economy.
Suits2aTea
August 22nd, 2011
7:53 pm
Now to the point of today’s issue: the war between the classes, which are defined by income alone.
So what if millionaires flee the state? The rich are going to flee the country. Why would they? Because we are sick of being con’d by patriotic flourishes of the $7.65 GOP-bribed job-providers. We are sick to the gills of the obsolete trickle-down theory spin-meisters who justify slave-wages and then, like the Libyan monster Quadafi, just beg for the g(u)ill(otine)s.
Our economy only works when there is slavery, war, and classism, and elitism, and the “I’m better than you because I went to college” horse sheet that has wedged Americans against each other since the rebellion.
Kyle is a puppet for the right, and anything he writes is stolen from other, more lunatic-fringe blogs. He hates Obama so much that he would destroy his readers to prevent his second term.
And you all know this 2B true. Welcome to America, circa 2012.
Don’t worry, you can vote for Christine O’donnell, the USA’s 1st HOCUS POTUS.
Bwa. The citizens of this country deserve to run it. Kyle doesn’t have anything to offer but racism, elitism, classism, and of course, the dead, buried, and mouldering conservative herd-think, which has brought us all to the edge of this latest abyss.
Thank you Kyle, I’m sure your mum is proud. (In truth, she’d probably shiv’im if she knew what he’s contributing to.)
Insert Lizzy Bordan hatchet-job-of-her-son emoticon here.
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
7:53 pm
What of the 14 percent group. Or is it still that high.
Rafe Hollister
August 22nd, 2011
8:03 pm
Suits2aTea
Hey there are plenty of countries that have economic systems just like you want. Maybe you can move to Cuba or Venezuela. Would you look good in a little gray coolie suit riding a worn out bicycle from your filing cabinet apartment to your wage controlled job?
TrishaDishaWarEagle
August 22nd, 2011
8:03 pm
@Phil, and I hope SS and Medicare die quick deaths because I am in my 20’s and I would rather not be raped any further to pay off an illiquid ponzi scheme. Barring that, there is tax evasion. I will NOT work as a slave to pay off the promises made to the boomers and x’ers by government. They believed in the governments promises…need I expand on why that was stupid? Why reward stupidity or blind need.
My (generations) Judgement Cometh.. and That Right Soon.
Me, Myself and I (The Holy Trinity)
buck@gon
August 22nd, 2011
8:10 pm
Jefferson @ 511,
Oooh, impressive argument! You got me there.
Is this like Obama “debating” the healthcare issue and saying to Sen McCain, “John, I won!”?
Sounds like it to me.
Keep ignoring truth. I’m looking forward to a better version of hope and change.
buck@gon
August 22nd, 2011
8:13 pm
Luckovich’s “space alien” cartoon is evidence that when liberals don’t have anything relevant or pertinent to say for the times that is worth anything at all, they go back to what they were taught when they were drones in public schools.
Luckovich is just a scribbling drone now.
Here’s hoping that as much of him as we see of Cynthia Tucker these days.
buck@gon
August 22nd, 2011
8:39 pm
Jefferson (& Kyle),
If you want evidence for the preponderance of left-wing lunacy, witness Suits @ 7:53. Despite him scolding someone for being a puppet, I’ve not read something so nutty on K Wingfeld’s blog yet, left or right.
The idea is (and he probably hasn’t figured this out yet), that those who “are sick to the gills of the obsolete trickle-down theory spin-meisters who justify slave-wages and then, like the Libyan monster Quadafi, just beg for the g(u)ill(otine)s” also desperately (one would think) want to work for more money, can not get it by themselves or their own efforts, so they are going to elect someone (Democrats mainly) who will promise to get it for them.
Herein lies a cunundrum or a series of dilemmas for them (which they pretend not to notice and feign to explain). Either those who want more are being stolen from, which justifies essentially re-thieving it, which in turn is an extremely negative outlook from which to base a society–this is a society based on envy, pull, muscle and mistrust; OR those who are not getting as much money as they want, are too dumb or unable to get what they want. Here we must make the very unreasonable assumption that those who can not do for themselves, are somehow smart enough to ELECT someone who can give them what they need–even though they may not know exactly what that will be. This is the Marxist utopia, I suppose, the vanguard that does for all, just like the guillotine brought decades of misery to France and Europe. Would you trust Suits to offer you that utopia when he’s talking about guillotines? Honestly?
Please understand that if class warfare is taken seriously, then the ends justify the means. The guillotine, indeed. I remind you that the French Revolution, romantic as it was, ended VERY badly, with great tyranny, wars and loss of life.
Ironically, what he also seems to be saying is that he can see clearly everything that is going on, while we are apparently too hypnotized to notice that we are either thieving (if we have money) or being ripped off (if we don’t)–and again, this is all PURELY based on income (if you even pretend to take him seriously).
It’s an amazing circle of contradictions for these liberals. Sometimes, I don’t know how they do it with a straight face.
It does explain much about their witless writings, clueless understandings to pertinent questions and their seemingly humorless lives.
Not much fun, are they?
You should take conservatives more seriously. We’re more fund and in our writings we don’t focus much on Nazis, racists or guillotines. I think it’s one thing to theorize that someone you’re debating against might be a puppet of some kind. It’s entirely another to follow the rantings of a lunatic as reasonable discourse and trust him. That is to say that your problems are your problems. You own them. For someone to come along (whether Obama or Suits) and tell you that your problem is some nefarious group of (rich, white, bankers, men, plutocrats, puppets(or whatever tripe he comes up with) doesn’t make you smarter or wiser. It makes you the follower of an idiot, or the fool of a fool.
The silly liberals & Marxists do provide interesting exhibits, however, for daily discussion on the lower depths and bad characters possible in human nature.
buck@gon
August 22nd, 2011
8:44 pm
The other thing about Suits is that he assumes openly that most people who don’t believe as he does can’t know the truth. What’s pathetic is that he doesn’t even TRY to notice it, much less express it.
Publius
August 22nd, 2011
8:54 pm
The extreme accumulation of resources within a small number of rich can be dangerous. Has anyone seen the relatives of the Russian Czars lately?
buck@gon
August 22nd, 2011
8:57 pm
Phil’s @ 7:24,
Revenues? Migration?
How about “small business” Phil?
Liberal um…studies…pretend that the conflation between revenue and taxes is important, as if the state itself were the highest and best, and most necessary recipient of money. Bad assumption.
One might turn your posted study in on itself and consider that states (say, California or New York) with a very highly paid government workforce and many many people on government assistance and housing assistance will have higher housing prices than say, Georgia or Florida where the government workforce is smaller and less well-paid.
The success of a state ain’t how much dough its government rakes in off its citizens–I know this is the current liberal understanding. A state does well if its citizens do well. Look at Texas, Florida, other states where small businesses thrive. How can they thrive? No or little harassment from unions, government regulators, EPA bureaucratese, lower taxes, workforce willing and able to work.
Again, this is an example of you talking right past all the most obvious evidence.
buck@gon
August 22nd, 2011
9:05 pm
Pubus,
Were I a descendent of one of them, I’d consider that an open threat. As it is, we have the guillotine already mentioned on this thread. Do you like that sort of talk? Is this your thing to encourage people NOT to make money because it’s (prima facie) dangerous? I suppose that Marie Antionette’s money was as dangerous as a nice car is to its driver when the carjacker shoots him and steals it.
Theft is theft. So the first guy who sat down and farmed and stored stuff or mined gold was creating danger then? The thief/murderer is just doing what, …producing?
You seem to have a very irrational understanding of human nature based on animal unreason. Given your statement, I comprehend how you could be so entirely daft, but I haven’t lost nearly as much faith in the non-animal part of the human race as you have.
Money doesn’t kill anyone Pubis. Why don’t you tell us how the money is dangerous when people with guns, pitchforks and real weapons are doing the killing?
TrishaDishaWarEagle
August 22nd, 2011
9:06 pm
Publius, true but if one can take a few thousand moochers with then as they go, and leave a scortched earth burn everything on the way out, landscape to greet the mooching masses when they storm the kremlin, leaving the moochers to sift thru and eat hot ashes, it’s a moral victory.
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
9:13 pm
One might do many things, buck. For example, one might try posting studies based on real data, as I have done for your reading entertainment.
Phil's Tel-A-Gramm
August 22nd, 2011
9:16 pm
Trisha,
Is that world of warcraft talk from you. It does not seem to be of this world.
TrishaDishaWarEagle
August 22nd, 2011
9:22 pm
No, it is simply the first thing that always pops into my head when people use the old “you better give people something they demand or they will just take it from you”, line of thinking on me.
As an example, when I was little, my friend was over for a play date. She wanted to play with my favorite doll, which was not going to happen. My mom of course told me I had to share it with my cousin..I felt betrayed in many ways, so I broke the dolls head off and handed her both pieces of the doll and said fine, play with it. If something is mine, and any authority..be it parents, or government, makes me share it, the intended recipient will not be happy with what they actually get out of me..I’ll always see to that.
TrishaDishaWarEagle
August 22nd, 2011
9:26 pm
I would also at this point say, Viva Joe Stack! You may remember him as the man who flew his private plane into the IRS building. The IRS were about to seize both the plane, and his home, which he set fire to before flying to the IRS building. THEY GOT NOTHING!
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
August 22nd, 2011
9:38 pm
Anybody bought anything made in Greece lately? Of course not. They don’t make anything. Their population has an extremely high concentration of maggots who either “work” for the government or are dependent on it for handouts. A liberal’s dream. A failed state.
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
August 22nd, 2011
9:42 pm
And speaking of maggots…
——————-
Social Security disability on verge of insolvency
“It’s primarily economic desperation,” Social Security Commissioner Michael Astrue said in an interview. “People on the margins who get bad news in terms of a layoff and have no other place to go and they take a shot at disability,”
Also, people who qualify for Social Security disability automatically get Medicare after two years, even if they are younger than 65, the age when other retirees qualify for the government-run health insurance program.
TrishaDishaWarEagle
August 22nd, 2011
9:59 pm
@Lil’ barry bailout
Modern Greeks are all the moral descendents of the ancient thebans, who sided with Xerxes I (another self important ass with historically documented large ears) against their fellow Greeks freedom, for a little persian welfare. Of Course, at Plataea, the thebans were mutilated after death for kicks by the spartans.
TrishaDishaWarEagle
August 22nd, 2011
10:01 pm
Come to think of it, Spartans=spartan=austerity..History repeats:)
Lil' Barry Bailout (Revised Downward)
August 22nd, 2011
10:05 pm
We could use a whole lot of sparseness here in the U.S. When you’re paying for free cell phones for non-working losers and subsidizing airfares to small airports to the tune of thousands of dollars a ticket, there is PLENTY that can be cut.
buck@gon
August 23rd, 2011
12:58 am
JDW,
Sorry I missed the SS reference. Geez! I didn’t even SEE the nazi reference, and I referred to it in a post to someone else about how humorless liberals communicate and can’t stop being so witless, repetitive, monotonous, uncreative, etc.
Damn, I’m good!
Far as your investing your OWN money….OK, where’s your account balance? Where are the withdrawal slips? And while we’re at it JDW, you didn’t invest. You had no choice. The fed took it from you without your permission, spent it immediately on other people and other programs and “theorized” that somehow they could keep the program running forever, continuing to pay future retirees with future dollars that would materialize just when the government needed to pay them as they always had before.
Well, guess what? The dollars aren’t there anymore. In ten years (or sooner) we’ll be borrowing money just to pay entitlement programs, period. Forget defense, parks, salaries, Canadian busses, trips to Martha’s vineyard, etc. Money’s just not there.
Maybe you think… no, maybe you FEEL you’re still entitled to the money that was taken from you by force?
My generation (40’s), grew up knowing that someday social security would be bankrupt and unable to pay us anything. So it is.
One day, JDW, the sunny days are going to go away. You won’t want it to rain, but that’s life. What are you going to do then; blame the rain? curse your fate?
buck@gon
August 23rd, 2011
1:14 am
Phil @ 9:13
I wouldn’t dream of wasting my time investigating a study on jobs in Texas, when you’re just going to (again) conflate government revenue and taxes, and re-present your own half-baked study funded and designed to make the political point you half-heartedly attempted to make.
Sorry Phil. If you have a specific question, you can ask. I’ll produce whatever evidence I need to prove (again) that you are wrong.
As for your request for Kyle to produce data on education, poverty, income distribution..etc….etc., etc. You must be joking! Why add to your confusion by talking past everything?
Income distribution is a leftists statistic pure and simple. Example: a guy starts out his career at 20 years old. Statistically he is poor, lowest quintile, government must intervene and save this fellow. Five years later, (but not in this crappy economy) he’s making more money, got a raise, got married, bought a house and is doing well. Though his statistic is gone for Democrat politics, he’s got a younger sister who is just starting out too. Endless parade of “victims” to lobby for.
This is why liberals can’t communicate, and why all your fellow liberals on this blog, use blatantly Marxist and nazist references in their posts. You guys would rather prove someone wrong than address problems head-on. You would rather conflate issues than acknowledge them–our current President is the worst in the world at doing this, and therefore, he is the worst president this country has ever had.
buck@gon
August 23rd, 2011
1:23 am
“Kyle,
If you make proposed solutions partisan, you hurt this country. I wish you would stop it. There is a lot of work to be done, and creating a bad atmosphere between the major parties is NOT helping.”
Rich:
“Lighten up, Francis”
–Sgt Hulka, from STRIPES
So, it’s not really a solution unless its non-partisan, eh? We all know what that means. Obama has to like it for it to be nonpartisan. I guess that means every solution is partisan if the Tea Party likes it.
So, what about our feelings, Francis?—er, I mean Rich?