How much of a president do Dems think they’ll have left?
So, the House Democratic caucus — you know, the group that’s about to become the House minority party — approves a (non-binding) resolution not to even hold a vote on the tax deal President Obama struck with Republicans. Which leads me to ask Democrats, and their sympathizers on this blog, a few questions.
1. If this is mere posturing — and Massachusetts Rep. Barney Frank suggests that, while he won’t support it, the deal still has the votes to pass if it’s brought up — does your base think more or less of you for standing up to the (Democratic) president, only to cave in the end?
2. If this isn’t mere posturing, and the paychecks of those lower- and middle-income workers — the ones whose interests you claim to be guarding — are suddenly a great deal lighter come January because no tax deal is struck, do you think those workers will appreciate the gesture? (Hint: That gesture is going to look an awful lot like a middle finger.)
3. If Republicans in the House are tasked with crafting a retroactive tax-rates extension when they take over the majority in January, do you think it will look more or less attractive to you?
4. Finally, and maybe most important: If you cut out the legs of your (again, Democratic) president now, right after your (and his) party’s disastrous showing in the midterm elections, how much juice do you expect him (and you) to have after the GOP takes over the House and strengthens its position in the Senate? How well do you think he’ll be able to push your interests then?
Bonus question: When does the widespread derision of Democrats as “obstructionists” and the “Party of No” begin?
– By Kyle Wingfield
Find me on Facebook
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
203 comments Add your comment
Guy Incognito
December 9th, 2010
1:47 pm
Kyle,
If they don’t give Obobo what he wants, aren’t they racists?
Kyle Wingfield
December 9th, 2010
1:49 pm
Absolutely, Guy. One can only guess, too, that they want to see the country fail.
Guy Incognito
December 9th, 2010
1:57 pm
….and did you catch the anger that the Messiah displayed at HIS presser. That whole room just full of Fox news reporters asking him tough q’s……………….oh no wait, they only have 1 chair
Matti
December 9th, 2010
1:57 pm
It’s a ruse. There aren’t really two opposing sides in Washington. The same people who owned Bush now own Obama. The assault on the middle-class continues, and these little squabbles in D.C.serve two purposes: the pretense that they actually DO something up there to earn their pay, and to keep us divided and at each others throats — hence distracted and blaming each other — so we don’t notice what they’re really doing with the economy. Do you think the people who run the world’s money supply really care whether gay soldiers get kicked out of the army, senior citizens can pay their heat bills, or whether you can go see a doctor when you’re sick? Please. It’s ridiculous. Your Republican “heroes” aren’t fighting for you any more than Obama is fighting for the “little guy.” All this chaos is exactly AS INTENDED. We’ve all been duped.
fergie
December 9th, 2010
2:01 pm
The democrates are posturing. The President had not choice. He doesn’t have the votes to win this. Plus the republicans were threating to disapprove unemployment. This is the biggest mess I have ever seen. But this is what the peoples wanted – so lets sit back and see what happens.
Dave R.
December 9th, 2010
2:01 pm
Uh, Matti? I don’t think you can say “owned” and “Obama” in the same sentence, lest you be accused of something really nasty.
SPSU
December 9th, 2010
2:08 pm
Hopefully Obozo will tell to them to get to the back of the bus with the republicans.
Charles Thomas
December 9th, 2010
2:14 pm
It’s most likely posturing, but it may be a ploy to see if Repulicans will go along with adding more goodies for both sides. Afterall, this is how a lot of things get passed in Comgress. However, if the Republican leadership changes as much as one comma, it will blow up in their face. Many tea party type Republicans don’t like the deal anyway.
Intown
December 9th, 2010
2:15 pm
The Dems need to fall in line behind their president. The sand in the hourglass of their power in the House has just about run out.
Guy Incognito
December 9th, 2010
2:16 pm
Matti……….they call it CONgress for a reason
Kevin
December 9th, 2010
2:16 pm
Well, since Obama has referred to his opponents as “enemies” and “hostage takers” (you know– terms that some might apply to terrorists), my guess is he knows his back is against the wall.
My taxes would have increased under Mr. Obama’s original plan. But I am by no means wealthy. I’m not a millionaire, and I’m certainly no billionaire. I’m an evil, capitalistic, money-hungry, baby-hating (oh, yea, I’m also a job creator) that is tired of it being politically convenient to demonize me and steal what I have earned.
But I digress . . .
Bob Portman
December 9th, 2010
2:18 pm
Here’s what Bob Hope thought of Democrats…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAIpI8IxgFs
Tychus Findlay
December 9th, 2010
2:19 pm
Are we defining millionaires at people worth a million dollars or making a million dollars?
Logical Dude
December 9th, 2010
2:22 pm
So Kyle,
No mention of the Republicans who want to sit in the corner and whine unless tax cuts are extended?
They sit there and cry “No, I don’t wanna do ANYTHING!” until they get their way. . . I mean, they get the way of those who line their pockets.
I mean, come ON. They’re willing to let the country go down the drain by playing politics?????
Plus, I saw you on TV the other day, and you dodged another question that asked your own feelings. You answered by saying “some Republicans” think such and such. I’ve noticed you do this on the blog also, especially regarding the run up to the election regarding Deal. You never voiced your own opinion that I could tell. Did you support Deal or not? You only mentioned “the Republican base” thinks such and such.
And yes, I agree that the Democrats are being whiny in not supporting the current compromise.
get out much?
December 9th, 2010
2:26 pm
well, since the republicans were able to get what they wanted using scorched earth tactics, maybe the democrats will adopt the same strategy.
carlosgvv
December 9th, 2010
2:29 pm
While you’re pondering the answers to those questions I have one for you. Do Republicans really think most Americans won’t notice or care how openly they are the party of the rich and powerful?
Intown
December 9th, 2010
2:29 pm
get out much?: Hopefully. Just so I can see Fox News contradict itself for the 5,654,893th time.
Intown
December 9th, 2010
2:30 pm
I’m sorry ..5,654,893RD time.
The Anti-Wooten
December 9th, 2010
2:33 pm
I strongly disagree with the so-called compromise and as such think that the House Democrat’s are taking the correct path here. Let it all expire. Tax cuts, Unemployment benefits and payroll tax cuts should remain on the cutting room floor. The Teabaglicans got everything they wanted and gave nothing in return, that’s not compromise. Let’s just sit back and wait until the new crew is sworn in then we can see what/if they have any actual plans other than NO.
The Anti-Wooten
December 9th, 2010
2:35 pm
@Carlosgvv….they’re counting on it as they’ve counted on it for the last 40 years or so.
Dave R.
December 9th, 2010
2:38 pm
“Do Republicans really think most Americans won’t notice or care how openly they are the party of the rich and powerful?”
Only you libs care, and we don’t care what you think anyway . . .
Kyle Wingfield
December 9th, 2010
2:39 pm
Logical: “No mention of the Republicans who want to sit in the corner and whine unless tax cuts are extended?”
The GOP struck a deal with the president, and despite some grousing from some of their members there’s no sign they’re going to back out on it. So, which party is sitting in the corner and whining?
Linda
December 9th, 2010
2:39 pm
It appears that the Dems. are balking at the death tax portion of the bill. If the Dems. don’t participate in passing this bill now, the Reps. will extend the tax-rate extension in Jan. possibly without extending unemployment benefits for another 13 months at a cost of $200 B. Cut nose. Spite face.
Stupid
December 9th, 2010
2:41 pm
The tax bracket has been in place for 9 years so this bull about it adding to the deficit is just that, BULL. What add to the deficit is SPENDING and the HIGH unemployment rate. Put more people to work, more people pay taxes,(adds to revenue) they go off government supported unemployment. (savings n cost)and QUIT spending on government projects and only SPEND WHAT YOU HAVE.
A a matter of fact, lower taxes more, more people will have more to spend and the revenue will go up. So basically the lame ducks especially in the House are going to make the taxes go up for everyone, then in January the very bill, and maybe not as good since the House will hold the overwhelming cards, and the Senate will be less of 5 democrats, the taxes will fall again.
Richard
December 9th, 2010
2:41 pm
They’re all just playing politics with real people/families as the pieces. It’s like we’re all pieces in Stratego. They send us into battle against the #1’s unaware of the butt kicking we’re about to take.
Stupid
December 9th, 2010
2:42 pm
The DEATH tax is a scam and one in which people should fight. Taxes were already paid on everything someone leaves in their estate and to the heirs, family, etc. Then they are taxed AGAIN? Where is the uproar? Where is the ACLU on this one?
The Anti-Wooten
December 9th, 2010
2:43 pm
That’ll be a great idea Linda. We can only hope that the new Teabaglican House will do just that. Cut taxes for the richest percentile of non-job-creators and leave the unemployed in the dirt. That’s going to leave a lovely taste in the mouths of a lot of Americans.
Logical Dude
December 9th, 2010
2:45 pm
Kyle,
Previous to the current compromise, Republicans (many? most?) signed a letter saying they won’t do ANYTHING until tax cuts are extended.
Yes, they sat in the corner whining that they won’t do anything until they got their way. Can you agree with that?
The Anti-Wooten
December 9th, 2010
2:45 pm
@Stupid,
Arguably, a great deal of the unemployment is caused by the misdeeds and financial chicanery of the very high income people that the tax cuts for the richest American’s are addressed to.
Johns Creek Dem
December 9th, 2010
2:48 pm
Obama needs to get a clue. Every time he tries to work with the Republicans, this is how they treat him…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ_Sqj7JUn8
European
December 9th, 2010
2:51 pm
I wondered why the US is 12th in education.But this tax debate answered my question.They believe they can cut taxes fight two wars and maintain social security medicare and etc.And have money come from nowhere to pay for it.May they should go back to basic may to get clarity.Like if Johnny had 3 apples and gave away 2 apples how many will he have left.Don’t answer now make this your assignment.
Kyle Wingfield
December 9th, 2010
2:52 pm
So now we’re going to criticize the GOP for not doing something before it *did* do something? Not very logical, dude.
The Anti-Wooten
December 9th, 2010
2:55 pm
Why not Kyle? You’ve taken special delight in criticizing Democrat’s and the Obama administration for EVERY SINGLE THING they have or have not done. Your newly elected House Teabaglican majority should already have all the answers and solutions to all the problems even though not sworn yet.
marlan
December 9th, 2010
2:57 pm
I call myself a demrocrat I am middle to low class income wise this would affect me negatively but so what, how many low or no income people that could of voted did not vote or voted for the party thata blocked this all year? Maybe this will not pass and when the harsh fact hits them in the wallet they hopefully will realize that not voting hurts you and voting uneducatedly hurts you even more one can hope
Logical Dude
December 9th, 2010
2:57 pm
Kyle,
So, you have no criticism at the time when they did it? It was Obama who lead the compromise, not the Republicans.
Thanks for letting me know that you can’t criticize the Republicans publicly for doing that.
If you actually DID criticize the Republicans at the time for sitting in the corner and whining, then you can prove me wrong by providing a link. I’ll apologize and think better of you.
Stupid
December 9th, 2010
2:58 pm
Anti, No the unemployment is caused by a government that spends too much, cares too little and thinks they know better how to spend everyone else’s money than we know how ourselves. If you want to give a hard time to those who DO employ, those who HAVE worked hard and made sacrifices to get where they are (quit grouping a few with all) and if those who don’t do anything but depend on the government for everything, maybe we wouldn’t have a deficit at all.
JF McNamara
December 9th, 2010
3:01 pm
Obama will be fine. He’s got enough juice. He got healthcare passed. Really…
I’m happy it failed. I hope they hold real negotiations now. How about half the tax cuts for the rich for two years and extended unemployment for 7 months.
Logical Dude
December 9th, 2010
3:02 pm
Stupid Says: lower taxes more, more people will have more to spend and the revenue will go up.
You see, you’re backwards there. people who arent’ working already don’t pay taxes and they are spending all they have just to survive. a tax cut will not help them.
Companies are rich in cash, and they aren’t spending it. cutting their taxes any more won’t change that.
A combination of tax hikes and spending cuts are needed for this country. Yes, there will be pain for a long time, but it is needed to correct the course this country is on.
WhyAreWeBroke?
December 9th, 2010
3:03 pm
If you want to see a good link, watch Barney Frank say he saw nothing wrong with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac while the Republicans were calling for an all out regulation all the way back to 2001. 2004 Frank said they aren’t in crisis. Listen to the report:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=63siCHvuGFg
Now listen to what is wrong with this country.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P36×8rTb3jI&feature=related
The Anti-Wooten
December 9th, 2010
3:03 pm
@Stupid,
I’m just betting that you’re one of the people that says “Gubmint don’t create no jobs”. The horrible fiscal mechanisms that were allowed to be created through deregulations are a huge cause of the current fiscal situation. All of our Federal politicians shate some blame for that. Republic’s for pushing the deregulation, Democrat’s for allowing it to go forward.
Kyle Wingfield
December 9th, 2010
3:04 pm
At the time they did WHAT, Logical?
Am I going to criticize Republicans for refusing, on the heels of a big midterm election win and with Democrats hoping to pass a raft of legislation they wanted but were too chicken to pass before said election, to do anything before the tax issue was resolved? No, I’m not. You can call that “sitting in a corner and whining,” but you’d be ignoring the fact that time and the momentum of the election — and thus leverage — were on the GOP’s side.
In the end, they reached a deal with the president — a deal that their constituents feel is far from perfect, but good enough. They gave on some things, and they got him to give on some things. Regardless of what you or I think of the deal itself, I don’t see how you can criticize them for “sitting in the corner and whining” when they did make a deal in the end.
Linda
December 9th, 2010
3:05 pm
Anti @ 2:43, That’s what the Dems are risking. The Reps. agreed to extend unemployment benefits for 13 mts. if the Dems. would extend all the current tax rates. If the Dems. balk in Dec., the Reps. can balk in Jan.
We have all known since ‘01 & ‘03 that these tax rates would expire 12/10. The Dems. could have passed any tax rates they wanted to while they had total control. They failed to even bring up a vote & are, as of today, still holding the unemployed & every single federal tax payer hostage over a stupid death tax.
Kyle Wingfield
December 9th, 2010
3:09 pm
JF: What “real negotiations”? That was my point: Scuttling this deal does not help move this in the Democrats’ direction one single bit. I’ve done my fair share of criticizing President Obama, but he seems to be just about the only person in his party who realizes, even somewhat, that they aren’t going to be stronger in January than they are now.
Pelosi & Co. can decide to dig in their heels and try to blame Republicans when taxes go up Jan. 1. I don’t think the voting public, which just punished the heck out of the Democrats just last month, is going to buy it. Not when the GOP and the president were very publicly prepared to make a deal, a deal that everyone considered done until today. Maybe it will still go through. But if it doesn’t, everyone is going to know exactly why, and who’s at fault.
So, I ask again: What “real negotiations,” unless you mean negotiations that lead to a deal even more in Republicans’ favor?
Linda
December 9th, 2010
3:11 pm
Anti @ 2:45, The economic meltdown was started by the Dems. & was predicted by the New York Times in 1999.
The Anti-Wooten
December 9th, 2010
3:11 pm
@Linda,
Not sure which Teabaglican pundit is pushing the Death Tax meme today but it’s pure bullhockey. The tax cuts for the top percentile is, was and will continue to be the sticking point.
WhyAreWeBroke?
December 9th, 2010
3:12 pm
Logical,
Maybe small business will hire more people and they WILL pay taxes. All unemployment does is cost, while employment RAISES revenue. You only need a 6th grade education to understand that. So, you are a small business owner, you make $200K, your taxes just went up 4%, that’s an additional $8k on top of the already 35% rate or $70,000, plus your own 4.5% (under Dems they want it to be 6.2%) SS/Medicare or $9000 (there is a cap), then you pay 6.5% State Tax or $13000. Without taking into consideration workman’s comp, and property taxes you now have paid over $100K, (without property taxes, taxes you pay on food and everything else you buy). So, you have less than $100k left, you have all the risks of the business on top of you. Out of that remaining $100k, you are supposed to invest in your business, pay your bills, etc..There will be no investment in the business or employees.
Logical Dude
December 9th, 2010
3:12 pm
Kyle says: the fact that time and the momentum of the election — and thus leverage — were on the GOP’s side.
So, yes, you agree that the GOP put PARTY politics ahead of keeping the country safe. (by not even agreeing to look at the much needed START treaty)
Thought so.
“I don’t see how you can criticize them for “sitting in the corner and whining” when they did make a deal in the end”
I can definitely criticize them for , at the time, delaying common sense items that keep the country safe.
I’m glad the deal is made now, and let’s get on to other important stuff! Well, if the other Democrats can quit their own whining and sign the dang thing.
Jefferson
December 9th, 2010
3:12 pm
Let’s all suffer together or prosper together. The GOP is helpless without the white house.
jerry
December 9th, 2010
3:13 pm
I would like to congratulate the Republicans for their ability to fool these southern hillbillies and Bible pounders into thinking that the Republicans own the moral high ground, all the while representing the rich and powerful. But what the hell, their ancestors convinced the hillbillies to fight and die for slavery so they could get rich on someone else’s misery. So the hillbillies are not too hard to fool.
The Anti-Wooten
December 9th, 2010
3:14 pm
Kyle,
You’re correct that this doesn’t move in the Democrat’s favor now. But when the Teabaglican’s have the House in January and beyond I’m in favor of letting the American people decide who is in the corner of MOST of them and it sure is not the Republic’s.