Europe shows the result of total insistence on tolerance
The American people, having been put through endless sensitivity training over the past few decades, know offensiveness when they see it. And they see it in the mosque proposed for lower Manhattan.
So, yes, the American people are a bit stunned to find the fingers pointed at themselves when controversy erupts over a $100 million Islamic project just two blocks from where 10 terrorists brought down two 110-story towers in the name of Islam. They don’t find this turning of the sensitivity tables ironic, but outrageous.
They are more than irked to hear the speaker of the House of Representatives suggest that those Americans speaking out against the mosque should be investigated to see who’s bankrolling them, not least since the identities of the mosque’s donors are still being withheld.
They hear lofty talk about tolerance and upholding the First Amendment — or at least part of it — and they think, “The freedom to practice Islam in this country does not hinge on the specific placement of one mosque in downtown New York. That’s not what this is about.”
They find it hard to believe that reputedly moderate Muslims dedicated to “improving Muslim-West relations,” as the Cordoba Initiative group behind this project says it is, would be surprised to learn that Americans’ wound hasn’t scabbed over in nine divisive years. Or think that they can demonstrate good faith by tacking on a 9/11 memorial at the last minute.
In fact, if the Cordoba planners and their supporters understand anything about America in 2010, they will see a country that can’t seem to snap out of an economic downturn, that is underemployed and overextended, where an entire coastline stands to be covered in oil (until it isn’t), where the states are suing the feds over a health care law and the feds are suing a state over an immigration law and everyone is suing everyone else over gay marriage laws, where anti-war protesters are throwing pies in the faces of Democratic senators and flight attendants are cussing out their passengers and taking the emergency chute.
And they will think, maybe this is not the very best moment to gauge the national reserves of tolerance and patience.
The wiser heads among us will think about the ground zero mosque and that immigration law, and their thoughts will turn once again to that place that so often lately has been showing us the future consequences of our present actions: Europe.
They will recall that the political class’ general prescription for everyday Europeans’ misgivings about their substantial Muslim influx has been more insistence on tolerance, more multiculturalism and the dismissal of any concerns to the contrary from polite political conversation.
They will observe that the result in formerly tolerant places like Holland, where a filmmaker and a politician critical of Islam and immigrants were assassinated, and Belgium, where certain immigrant-heavy areas of the capital Brussels and the port city Antwerp are virtual no-go zones for people who look European, has been a spike in the popularity and electoral success of openly anti-immigrant, anti-Islam political parties.
They will note that the failure of political leaders in these countries, and in places like Denmark, Switzerland and even Britain, to deal seriously with popular complaints about the other has not ended the complaints but made them louder and uglier.
And they will conclude that even in America, with a prouder history of assimilation and inclusiveness than Europe has, it would be prudent to meet this outrage with something other than finger-wagging.
Tell us what you think about the site
Customer Care »
Vacation stops, manage subscriptions and more
AJC Services
Sections
Other Editions
Visitor Agreement | Privacy Statement
© 2013 The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
508 comments Add your comment
LilBushieJr
August 19th, 2010
2:10 pm
Draft dodger? Present and accounted for.
Dusty
August 19th, 2010
2:12 pm
There’s a CREATONIST MUSEUM in Kentucky? I do believe there must be a museum for every “word” in the world. And AmVet knows all of them if they reflect badly on someone. Who cares about the Creationist or the Atheist or the SpacedOUt Museum? Maybe an AMVET FUNNY HOUSE?
Ugly Americans, my foot!! While people are knocking down doors, crossing deserts, sneaking on boats and planes to get here with us and you want to talk about “ugly Americans”?
Sorry, AmVet but your almost constant negatism reaches rant quality. And ol’ hooter Boschie is right behind you. Why don’t you kids get a hobby?
Bosch
August 19th, 2010
2:13 pm
Hey Dusty! How’s your day? I have a hobby: blogging!!!
stands for decibels
August 19th, 2010
2:17 pm
More Democrats like this, please.
“I don’t know how many of you have been to New York, but if a building is two blocks away from anything, you can’t see it. It’s a community center. They’re going to have a gym. They’re going to have point guards. Muslim point guards,” Franken said, to laughter and applause.
“They (Republicans) do this every two years. They try to find a wedge issue, and they try to work it.”
The Great and Powerful Community Organizer
August 19th, 2010
2:18 pm
BEHOLD! Jimmy Carter has been redeemed. I AM the Worst President of all time.
Jefferson
August 19th, 2010
2:18 pm
Fear and greed controls the right.
Rafe Hollister
August 19th, 2010
2:19 pm
Liberals who are not Democrats: Ralph Nadar, Susan Collins, Olympia Snow, Lindsay Graham (for Cap and Tax, Amnesty, etc), formerly Arlen Spector, Lincoln Chaffey, George Voiniovich (sp), and others.
Rafe Hollister
August 19th, 2010
2:24 pm
Community center my rear end. If it was a CC, then anyone in the community would be welcome to come in a fellowship and plays some hoops. How welcome will women in miniskirts and halter tops be to come in?
You Libs are like the wimpish kids in school, that were afraid to fight back against the bully, so you got behind him and mouthed support, as he bashed the poor kid with some self respect, who stood up to him. You always hoped that your support and capitulation would insure your safety.
Rafe Hollister
August 19th, 2010
2:26 pm
“welcome to come in and fellowship there, while playing hoops”.
Dusty
August 19th, 2010
2:32 pm
OOOOh just read PROBLEM SOLVED last posts. One of the last die hard anti-war Bush-did-it & hate Cheney protestors. Still stirring the old hate machine and churning out the mindless muck. Can’t you dinosauers of precivilization ever learn anything?? You are so outdated and blind to what is happening now that you are beyond antique. The world moves on, in case you haven’t noticed.
Deal with the current problems. Get alive. This country does not need bitter old duffers sqawking about the past. We need to work on the PRESENT. YOu do know what PRESENT means, don’t you?
Bosch is a goob
August 19th, 2010
2:35 pm
The U.S. Supreme Court has consistently deferred to the right of states to make their own determinations of public use, although the reason why the constitutional term “public use” should not be subject to judicial interpretation, the same as other constitutional terms, has not been explained.
The Supreme Court’s decision in Kelo v. City of New London, 545 U.S. 469 (2005) affirmed the authority of New London, Connecticut, to take non-blighted private property by eminent domain, and then transfer it for a dollar a year to a private developer solely for the purpose of increasing municipal revenues.
Public use? To quell the dissent.
Dusty
August 19th, 2010
2:43 pm
Boschie,
Your work is cut out for you. THE BOSCH BLOGGING MUSEUM. See all the stuffed old timers who will repeat “Bush did it!” if you push the right buttons. Buy a Cheney mask for your youngster. See Carter’s wild rabbit. And above all, admire the mounted three inch trout caught by Bookman on his escape from THE BLOG. Also the framed receipts from Hooters run up by Bosch patrons.
I knew you could do it. Send me a free ticket.
candide
August 19th, 2010
2:46 pm
If Muslims are not stopped Europe will becoime another Egypt.
Bosch
August 19th, 2010
2:50 pm
Dusty,
Well, as long as you and i have been bloggin together, I will have a special “Dusty” exhibit (right next to the lady in the orange shorts special viewing area).
And you would have lifetime free admission.
Dusty
August 19th, 2010
2:50 pm
What’s a goob?
Bosch
August 19th, 2010
2:54 pm
Dusty,
I think it’s a peanut. ????
Sundawg
August 19th, 2010
2:56 pm
How can someone be a Muslim when Mohammed was a pedophile? Yea Im sure that they dont believe that he actually consummated his marriage with his 9 year old wife, but there are timeframes that say he most certainly did.
Dusty
August 19th, 2010
3:00 pm
Ah Boschie,
You bribe me with lifetime admission. But but but…if you are going to put my exhibit next to the lady in orange shorts, I might as well be in a closet. There would be nothing but a push of goggle eyed males rushing past my georgous attributes to see the OSL(orange shorts lady)..
Jefferson
August 19th, 2010
3:02 pm
Would a Pepsi center be welcome on N. Ave?
Bosch
August 19th, 2010
3:04 pm
Dusty,
Aww….I doubt that.
I’ll make sure to incorporate the wonderful ATL Braves in your exhibit too!
Disgusted
August 19th, 2010
3:12 pm
goob–short for goober
1. A lout, esp. an unsophisticated, barely civil person.
2. A female person who feasts on fast-food products, esp. hamburgers.
@@
August 19th, 2010
3:15 pm
So why did the mosque’s developer turn down Gov. Paterson’s invitation? Then the jihadists in the ME could have claimed a mosque had taken over government property in the U.S.. That would’ve been a real coup.
————————————————————
Dusty:
My daughter found the people in London to be rushed, rude, and impersonal. Said she received some disparaging remarks about Americans. Could have been because she wasn’t a big spender. On a tight budget.
My former minister (The Brit) has a son, who holds the same opinion about America and Americans. He seems to think we’re all barbarians….what, with wanting to own guns and all. His daughter, on the other hand, is adorable. LOVES America…comes for a month-long visit every two years. Just left, as a matter of fact. The girls and I always treat her out to a night on the town. She lives in Hong Kong…prefers it to the U.K..
HDB
August 19th, 2010
3:21 pm
@@ August 19th, 2010
3:15 pm
“So why did the mosque’s developer turn down Gov. Paterson’s invitation? Then the jihadists in the ME could have claimed a mosque had taken over government property in the U.S.. That would’ve been a real coup.”
Methinks that when one is backed into a corner…compromise is the LAST thing you think of! You come out fighting!! Think about it: the Muslims have been cornered, disparaged, belittled by a virtual preponderance of American opinion! They won’t back down! Can’t say that I blame them…..
@@
August 19th, 2010
3:24 pm
What’s a goob? In urban slang it’s:
1) a silly, r-i-d-i-c-u-l-o-u-s person; a peanut-head
2) A flem of sorts projecting from the body
3) someone who acts immature, stupid, or idiotic usually making a fool out of themself.
hmmmmmm…
Dusty
August 19th, 2010
3:27 pm
Boschie,
Thank you thank you for remembering our wonderful Braves. I was just going over to give them a little help with the Nationals. But they will catch up in their wondrous ways. YOU BETCHA!!
That “you betacha” is just to aggrevate folks like Disgusted and other infamous you-know-whos who are ignorant of the joy of hamburgers & peanuts. Ah so, a sad loss of the finer things of life.
But I depart this delightful time of fun & games. Duty calls. Besides, Kyle likes serious conversation and earth moving opinions. I ,of course, am full of ‘em but sit in quiet concern for the ignoramuses of this world. Well, sometimes. You know how it is!! Au revoir! .
Rafe Hollister
August 19th, 2010
3:29 pm
Remember the Marine Barracks in Lebanon. Wonder if we could build a church near there? Or maybe just a memorial to our brave Marines.
HDB
August 19th, 2010
3:30 pm
For those who keep crying about dhimmitude….methinks they’re already suffering:
dhimmitude: a behavior dictated by fear (terrorism)
FDR said: The only “The only thing we have to fear…is FEAR itself!!
problem solved
August 19th, 2010
3:32 pm
Rafe Hollister
August 19th, 2010
2:19 pm
Liberals who are not Democrats: Ralph Nadar, Susan Collins, Olympia Snow, Lindsay Graham (for Cap and Tax, Amnesty, etc), formerly Arlen Spector, Lincoln Chaffey, George Voiniovich (sp), and others.
Rafe, and what office do Ralph Nader, and Lincoln Chaffee hold? Voinovich has voted on the republican side 70.9%, Graham 92.6%, Snowe 67.3%, Collins 67%! And I do believe Arlen Spector is listed as a democrat, and votes with the democrats.
Anymore examples you wanna throw out there RAFE?
HDB
August 19th, 2010
3:35 pm
Rafe Hollister August 19th, 2010
3:29 pm
“Remember the Marine Barracks in Lebanon. Wonder if we could build a church near there? Or maybe just a memorial to our brave Marines.”
Churches already exist in Lebanon; it’s both a Muslim and Christian nation. Christian faiths in Lebanon: Maronites, Greek Orthodox, Armenian Apostolic, Melkite Greek Catholics, Assyrian Church of the East, Syriac Orthodox, Chaldean Catholic.
Southern Baptists aren’t in the mix, though……
@@
August 19th, 2010
3:37 pm
HDB:
Methinks that when one is backed into a corner…compromise is the LAST thing you think of! You come out fighting!!
That’s a shame, because compromise is EXACTLY what’s needed here. This mosque thing is not high on my list of priorities, but then I don’t live in NY. I suffered no loss of family or friend there. I experienced the loss from a distance.
The people of New York, Connecticut, New Jersey have offered compromise. It’s now time for the developer to reciprocate.
I was listening to a broadcast today. Some professor of theology from Wesleyan College, a Muslim cleric (?), along with a Muslim woman (in opposition), who lost her mother in the Twin Towers. The Muslim cleric (?) said that to give in now would, in essence, be admitting to a link between Islam and radical islam.
My opinion? No it wouldn’t…it would be placing themselves above radical islam. Radical islam is doing this to Muslims, not Americans. The guy from Wesleyan College claimed that when Americans say “They attacked us” Americans are excluding Muslims from the “us”. I found that rather presumptuous.
Dusty
August 19th, 2010
3:38 pm
@@
Sorry about your daughter’s visit to London. I was strictly budget myself, one of those British Airways packages. Old hotel but close to the British Museum where I could have hung out for days. Rode the tube. Didnt’ care much for the Wax Museum. Who needs wax dummies when it is so easy to find real ones? (And no lady in orange shorts.!..)..
The green parks along the river were nice. Loved old English Straford on Avon. I hope your daughter goes again and has a better time. It can be a grand place to visit.
Now I’m really gone. Bye…..
HDB
August 19th, 2010
3:45 pm
@@ August 19th, 2010
3:37 pm
It owuld have been nice if compromise were possible…but I don’t see that it is now! Think about this: the volume of vitriol that has come forth from people won’t allow compromise. There is no way that the Muslims will be able to save face!! American Muslims now feel disenfranchised from the American spirit…through no design of their own. Many are lumping American Muslims in with the radicals…..even though there were people of ALL faiths that were lost in the Towers.
FEAR is driving this…on both sides….and as a nation, we have to get past the fear….
Hillbilly Deluxe
August 19th, 2010
3:46 pm
Arlen Specter was a Democrat and then he wasn’t and now he is again.
The truth
August 19th, 2010
3:47 pm
“Think about it: the Muslims have been cornered, disparaged, belittled by a virtual preponderance of American opinion! They won’t back down! Can’t say that I blame them…..”
HDB,
That’s very odd. As disparaged and harassed and beaten down and cornered as Muslims are in this country they just keep on a coming. Odd isn’t it? They also apparently have no fear of us as they speak their mind on American campuses and its all anti-American crap. So much for Muslims being in any real fear of everyday, ordinary Americans.
Farrakhan and his band of Muslims? Think they are scared of anyone? Or are they the ones that actually do the intimidating and use blatant racist and hate speech in open public?
HDB always pulls out his Democratic strategy of debating which goes like this
1. Blame Bush
2. Scream Racism
3. Bash Palin
HDB is best at strategy #2 and employed it in this nonsense about Muslims being cornered. Too bad people don’t buy that crap anymore.
Rafe Hollister
August 19th, 2010
3:49 pm
HDB: There maybe churches there now, but when Hamas finishes its reign of terror on what used to be Lebanon, no guarantee. How comfortable would you be in visiting Lebanon, how about going to a church there?
Rhino’s are not conservatives, how could anyone in favor of Amnesty and Cap and Tax call themselves constitutional conservatives. Not to mention social “justice”.
@@
August 19th, 2010
3:50 pm
HDB:
That is the silliest thing I’ve ever heard. It’s never too late for compromise. New Yorkers have done their part…live with the memory of their sacrifices everyday. It’s time for the developer to sacrifice.
The truth
August 19th, 2010
3:51 pm
HDB,
Muslims feel ‘disenfranchised’ -through no fault of their own? Must be America’s fault yet again. HDB is definitely part of the blame America first crowd.
Where did you come up with that overused Liberal left wing line? Disenfranchised my butt. Most of them are living the American dream. That’s why the keep coming dude. The only reason they may feel “disenfranchised” is because we in America refuse to live under “sharia” law.
The truth
August 19th, 2010
3:53 pm
Does HDB want to talk about all the churches in Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Iran, and many other parts of the Arab world? Oh, that’s right! The churches in those countries don’t exist because they are illegal. How stupid of me!
AmVet
August 19th, 2010
3:54 pm
Mohammed was a pedophile?
Dang! He’d have made a good modern day Republican!
911review.org/Alex/Republican_Pedophiles.html
Don’t look, Ethel!
@@
August 19th, 2010
3:56 pm
AmVet:
Did you intend to drop off a link?
You failed.
Alive in GA
August 19th, 2010
3:59 pm
If the current mayor of New York is not opposed to the mosque being built. Who am I to stand in the way in a free society. Michael Bloomberg got it right for once.
AmVet
August 19th, 2010
3:59 pm
Jeez, hopeless Luddites…
Wesleyan Called
August 19th, 2010
4:00 pm
There is no Muslim cleric here.
The truth
August 19th, 2010
4:01 pm
AmVet,
It is common knowledge that Mohammed had child brides and if memory serves me correctly he had relations with young boys which in case you didn’t know is commonplace in Arabic and Muslim culture. Its in their culture-their poetry, literary works, song, and is part of everyday culture, etc.
josef nix
August 19th, 2010
4:01 pm
It has been my experience in my trips to Europe (as elsewhere) that once you get away from the cities, the locals are quite nice and more than willing to show you around to the local sites and tell you all about their lives, thoughts, ideas, dreams and aspirations. Marauder a few words of the language and doors swing open. It’s like so many of them who visit us. They go to New York, LA, San Francisco or Disneyland and go back home with the idea that this is what Americans are. Talk to those who have gone to our Romes, Viennas, Paris, Athens, Berlins or who have seen Rock City and Ruby Falls, and you’ll get a completely different opinion of who we are…
When the German filmmakers Percy and Eleanore Adlon and Marianne Sägebrecht were in the US filming “Baghdad Cafe,” on a whim while touring the country they went to Stuttgart, Arkansas to see what the place named for their hometown was like. They were so impressed by the way they were treated by the locals that they came back and did the film “Rosalie Goes Shopping.” Stuttgart is “the Rice and Duck Capital of the World” and every year hosts “The International Duck Calling Contest.” That’s the real America…
Grand Forks
August 19th, 2010
4:02 pm
“Hey did someone call for a draft dodger?”
Is that you, Bill Clinton?
The truth
August 19th, 2010
4:03 pm
Compromise. let the Muslims build the mosque and allow us to build a church in downtown Iraq, Saudi Arabia, or Kuwait since we liberated 2 of those countries and saved a 3rd from being invaded.
Grand Forks
August 19th, 2010
4:03 pm
“Mohammed was a pedophile?
Dang! He’d have made a good modern day Republican!”
Or maybe a democrat ex-president who molested interns.
Grand Forks
August 19th, 2010
4:04 pm
“Did you intend to drop off a link?
You failed.”
ScamVet fails at everything. Like the time she said that LA was not a state but a city and then had to retract her idiotic statement.
The truth
August 19th, 2010
4:05 pm
Nevermind. I forgot how intolerant the Muslims are of us building churches in their countries. How foolish of me!