Obama tries to (cap and) trade on the oil spill
After eight weeks, President Obama has decided he needs to stop letting our crisis in the Gulf of Mexico go unexploited. In an Oval Office address tonight, he’ll explain why, as he recently told Politico’s Roger Simon, the spill should “shape how we think about the environment and energy for many years to come” — just as our perspective on foreign affairs was “profoundly … indelibly” changed by 9/11.
Oh, so within eight years our government will be studiously avoiding the word “oil” and referring to “pipeline-caused disasters”? Maybe a future president will make speeches about how oil barons helped pave the way for the European Renaissance.
Nah, probably not.
Obama reportedly hopes the spill will reinvigorate efforts in Congress to pass a cap-and-tax bill. The Gulf oil spill is a tragedy, but it doesn’t change the basic calculus about cap-and-tax — namely that, among other things, it:
1. reduces, not increases, employment by giving companies an incentive to move production to countries without caps on carbon dioxide emissions;
2. represents an enormous opportunity for politicians to game the system by favoring certain industries over others (and certain firms over their competitors — would Toyota really get the same terms as Government, er, General Motors?) in the allowances granted and the initial prices charged for those allowances; and
3. has worked poorly where it’s been tried (for carbon dioxide) so far, most notably in Europe.
Those things were true last summer, when the cap-and-tax bill passed by the House was considered dead on arrival in the Senate. They’re still true now.
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183 comments Add your comment
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
3:17 pm
“To the guy that said California was bankrupt, isn’t California Republican.”
Controlled by Nancy Pelosi, Henry Waxman, Babera Boxer, Maxine Waters……… Yep, totally controlled by Republicans.
“And also, don’t convicted felons lose the right to vote”
Not according to democrats. Ask Hillary.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
3:17 pm
“You should support someone who hangs black people wouldn’t ya?”
No, I’m not into killing people like you are.
A CONSERVATIVE
June 15th, 2010
3:20 pm
HDB—–AFFIRMITIVE ACTION Isssssss racial profiling…U liberal moron…racial quotas isssssssss racial profiling…u idiot.
A CONSERVATIVE
June 15th, 2010
3:21 pm
LIBERALISM issssssssss a MENTAL DISORDER..YES…YRS..YES….
joe
June 15th, 2010
3:25 pm
HDB, the reason there is so much crime in Phoenix and Tuscon is due to illegal aliens and drug cartels kidnapping US citizens for ransom. So your argument that this “white” area has it own high crime rate is not due to troubled “white” youth, but to ILLEGALS from Mexico. Nice try.
CJ
June 15th, 2010
3:27 pm
Kyle: “…a liberal quoting a liberal quoting a liberal about the greatness of liberalism with its “aversion to dogma” and complete neutrality about “whether the government increases or shrinks in the process” of solving problems, except that — gosh darn it! — increasing government always happens to be the answer. Just a coincidence.”
Always? How Kyle-ish.
You conveniently ignore that I, for example, continually advocate (on this blog) against agricultural subsides, bloated military spending (e.g., spending money on obsolete cold war weaponry), subsides/guarantees for nuclear energy, … — all spending items that so-called conservatives tend to support. In such instances, which side of the political spectrum is for less government and which is for more government?
Contrary to your false projections, liberals are not the mirror image of conservatives view of themselves. Since so-called conservatives claim to be ideologues for smaller government (despite supporting the unprecedented growth of government under Bush/Cheney/Republican rule), then you project that liberals must be ideologues for larger government. It’s your fantasy, but isn’t rooted in fact.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
3:28 pm
“It’s your fantasy, but isn’t rooted in fact.”
Sums you up pretty well.
Some People are stupid
June 15th, 2010
3:34 pm
Last time I checked, Pelosi, Boxer, Waxman were all in the US Congress. They have no say in budgetary issues.
Someone needs to brush up on state and federal legislatures.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
3:37 pm
“Someone needs to brush up on state and federal legislatures.”
Yeah, you.
Kyle Wingfield
June 15th, 2010
3:51 pm
Some People @ 3:34: You’re kidding, right?
Kyle Wingfield
June 15th, 2010
3:55 pm
CJ: Bush certainly was a big-government Republican, to his great discredit (and that of his party). But unprecedented growth of government? Ever heard of FDR or LBJ?
He may, however, have already been surpassed.
Some People are stupid
June 15th, 2010
3:58 pm
Kyle-
Nope. When was the last time Pelosi sat in on the California Budget and cast a vote…same for Waxman and Boxer. Maybe I should have put State budget.
Kyle Wingfield
June 15th, 2010
4:03 pm
Ah, state budget. OK.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
4:07 pm
“Maybe I should have put State budget.”
Your name sums you up just right!
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
4:08 pm
stupid
California is run by Democrats. They may have a Republican governor but he’s no conservative. He married a Kennedy don’t cha know….
Scooter (the Original)
June 15th, 2010
4:09 pm
Kyle, we have already been misled into a future filled with the politics of medicine, why not the politics of energy usage. Control and manipulation is the name of the game.
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
4:09 pm
“Ever heard of FDR or LBJ?”
Uh…..ever heard of Woodrow Wilson?
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
4:12 pm
Al Gore Cheats with Larry David’s Ex
Al Gore’s split from wife Tipper after 40 years of marriage was a shock to everyone who thought theirs was the ideal marriage. Now Star can exclusively reveal that the former Vice President was having an affair with Larry David’s ex-wife — for the past two years!
MSNBC=low ratings
June 15th, 2010
4:15 pm
Uh oh, democrats don’t fair too well according to this “unbiased” NPR poll…
NPR Poll: Congressional Battleground
https://preview.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=127834800&live=1
dan
June 15th, 2010
4:21 pm
We need to stop the blame game. Regardless of liberal or conservative position our government has been failing ALL of us for decades (even longer). In order to stay elected both parties have to choose policies on far ends of the spectrum. They are not in the business of governing but the business of getting elected. The problems facing this country are becoming more complex and we are not equipped to handle even a small percentage. All I know is that we have to stop borrowing money to fuel our appetite for everything (personally and nationally). Just think what a great example our own government sets for each one of us. I don’t have any great suggestions on how to solve our dependence on foreign energy. All I can do is fix my own problems and TRY to elect officials that put the future of our country first instead of thinking about how the decision will reflect on their re-election. Just my two sense. Work hard everyone.
Experience matters
June 15th, 2010
4:36 pm
Drop a low-yield nuke and push the button. Problem solved…Russia has done it numerous times and it works!
Kyle Wingfield
June 15th, 2010
4:44 pm
Linda: I presume your 4:33 wasn’t your own original reporting…please repost with a source, a link and a shorter synopsis. Thanks.
Dave
June 15th, 2010
5:02 pm
I’m not sure what you’re trying to say here Kyle. I’ve been reading you for some time and you usually avoid the cheap shots. “Cap and tax” may be a valid description of your view of the cap and trade proposals. You sound like your show biz conservative cousins, Boortz, Beck, Hannity and Limbaugh. Just what does it have to do with your prediction that the President is going to “exploit” the spill tonight in his speech apparently base on the quote “the spill should ’shape how we think about the environment and energy for many years to come….’” Shouldn’t it? Is there a difference between his “exploitation” of the spill to promote his environmental/energy proposals and GWB’s use of 9/11 to facilitate invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq? There was a real natural disaster this year. There were no WMD’s or Iraqi aid of al Qaida (I never remember how to spell that and I’m lazy) at the start of this decade.
You may have a point here; but, I missed it.
Dave
June 15th, 2010
5:07 pm
Sorry about the typos.
Marc
June 15th, 2010
5:12 pm
Well, no one wants to explain why conservatives are so eager to burn now, pay later, so I’ll move on. Kyle, your first point, that it wrecks the economy is too facile. Carbon tariffs can be implemented to take care of the incentive to export jobs and there may well be a ton more jobs in rebuilding a sustainable energy infrastructure that at the same time stems the flood of dollars overseas to pay for oil. Your 2nd point is no more than an objection to the way democracy works. Ironically, the problem is exacerbated by corporate influence in election politics. And your 3rd point, that cap-and-trade doesn’t work isn’t true either. We mitigated acid rain and the ozone hole with cap-and-trade and Europe has actually achieved modest C02 reductions and is on target to reach its Kyoto obligations. Not saying its enough, but its sure better than what we’ve managed to achieve with the screw our kids, drill, baby, drill till the party’s over that conservatives have inexplicably embraced.
Kyle Wingfield
June 15th, 2010
5:46 pm
Marc: Carbon tariffs are a sure-fire way to provoke a trade war and kill whatever recovery is under way. The Europeans, particularly the French, talk tough about this but always back down because they understand the consequences.
“The way democracy works”? I’m pretty cynical, but even I don’t believe that we might as well implement a system that’s rigged from the start because they all end up being rigged. That’s more what I’d call corporatism than democracy.
The comparisons to the SOx cap and trade scheme comes up often, but regulating SOx doesn’t involve a third of the economy. And Europe — whose emissions trading I used to write about — alternates between off track and barely on track. But to the degree that it’s close, it’s mostly because Germany cleaned up the formerly communist East; to a lesser degree, the U.K. deserves credit. Most of the other countries have been on pace to miss their obligations, some by a very wide margin.
DawgDad
June 15th, 2010
6:00 pm
“We mitigated acid rain and the ozone hole with cap-and-trade and Europe has actually achieved modest C02 reductions and is on target to reach its Kyoto obligations.”
Mitigated? Geez, if I stop breathing for 30 seconds I “mitigated” C02 releases. And, what exactly is Kyoto doing for me and my family and my country? Nothing positive, I surmise.
If the Dems cram cap and trade down our throats on top of “health care deform” I predict the backlash will get very very very very ugly. We are already a pseudo-fascist statist country; I don’t think the productive people will put up with much more. If they do cap and trade you’ll see a run on retirement funds (401Ks, etc.), because those will eventually be devalued to worthless or outright absconded by the politicians.
Jay
June 15th, 2010
9:08 pm
Obama was born in America but grew up in a broken home out in Kenya. He never was given love so he has no love. His time in America has been mostly spent with liberal elitists so he has no love for Mr. and Mrs. American (Democrat or Republican). Barry is destroying our country!
mark
June 16th, 2010
3:18 am
i can’ believe how stupid you tree hugging morons are. “OIL is GOOD”
say it loud, say it often you stupid slugs. stop living in your utopia
and come up for air. if we did away with petroleum products. cars, coal burning electric plants, nuclear etc. and you had to cut down your trees to keep the fire going just to stay warm, and harvest hay to feed your horse so you could get to work, you would all be crying “drill baby drill” AND THATS WHAT WE SHOULD BE DOING. but not in the outer shelf, up close to the beach where it’s not so deep, where we can see the rig, here the rig, and smell the rig. thats what im talking about. THERES PLENTY OF TIME TO HARVEST THE OIL IN THE OUTER SHELF LATER. DRILL BABY DRILL. and lets build nuclear, wind power, solar, im for everything, “ALL” kinds of energy. but to those of you that think oil is bad, PLEASE go now buy your horse, the sooner the better,cut down your favorite tree winters coming, we’ll see you in a couple months when you wake up. And believe me you will WAKE UP…..
alison huskie
June 16th, 2010
5:09 am
Did Obama mention geothermal energy in his talk last night?? When is he going to back alternative energy 100%????!!!! I am tired of these politicians backing “oil!!” We all know the power the oil industry has, but until someone “STANDS UP” and endorses alternative energy – we are stuck in an archaic system!
Marc
June 16th, 2010
9:23 am
Kyle, it’s too easy to point to potential problems and make absolute pronouncements that a cap-and-trade scheme can’t work. The European system may not be perfect, but they’re learning from their mistakes and getting results. We can’t do that too? Point out the pitfalls by all means, but unless you suggest solutions, you’re just providing entertainment. Nothing wrong with a little entertainment, but it doesn’t solve anything. Do you have anything to offer besides the status quo?
emenot
June 21st, 2010
8:16 pm
Bam Bam purposefully held off in the name of letting BP fix the spill. What Bam Bam is really doing is theoretically a win win conundrum for his purpose, if he jumped in at the beginning it would not serve him because if BP happens to be able to fix it, BP would take all the credit, whereas if he let it dragged on Bam Bam could come in for photo op as he had been doing and do his usually lip service with no resolved as he really don’t have any hope to fix the leak anyways and blame BP for failure to mend their evil deeds! However if by his luck the leak was fix after it had been 8 weeks, he can take full credit because of his timely interdiction.
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